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El vs Rivers Hall of Fame

rlc2113 : 1/13/2019 3:52 pm
Why is there so much consensus that Rivers is a lock for the Hall of Fame and Eli isn't. Their numbers are virtually equal and Eli has two rings. If you watched today's game against the Patriots , you see the results of a lack of protection.Rivers looked far worse than Eli did at any time this year.
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Stat-wise Rivers gets in..  
Big Blue '56 : 1/13/2019 3:55 pm : link
They’re both getting in, for different reasons
There's..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/13/2019 3:55 pm : link
no consensus. They will both get in
Their numbers aren't equal...  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:06 pm : link
No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.
I see your point  
ZogZerg : 1/13/2019 4:06 pm : link
More folks act like Rivers is a better choice than Eli, which is complete nonsense.
RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:07 pm : link
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:
Quote:
No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.


Rivers has had a better career in what sense?
RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
cjac : 1/13/2019 4:08 pm : link
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:
Quote:
No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.


You need to elaborate on this. What’s borderline
Could you provide a link on this consensus you speak of?  
MetsAreBack : 1/13/2019 4:09 pm : link

Because I think you're talking out your ass
RE: Stat-wise Rivers gets in..  
Bluesbreaker : 1/13/2019 4:09 pm : link
In comment 14261188 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
They’re both getting in, for different reasons


This and why do we have to keep comparing the two ...
RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
adamg : 1/13/2019 4:09 pm : link
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:
Quote:
No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.


Are you even a Giants fan?
He's trolling...  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:10 pm : link
but I can't wait to hear how Eli and his two Superbowl MVP's had an inferior career to Phillip Rivers.
They are both going to be first ballot  
cjac : 1/13/2019 4:10 pm : link
Rivers has better TD to Int ratio

Eli has better post season stats.

Aside from that all numbers are similar
Again, you must understand this:  
Big Blue '56 : 1/13/2019 4:11 pm : link
After the First and then again after the second SB win under TC, bw told me many times that he wasn’t a big fan of TC and Eli..

Just for some perspective..

Ok, bw, please continue..:)
RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
Ssanders9816 : 1/13/2019 4:16 pm : link
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:
Quote:
No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.


Yep that 5-6 career playoff record with no rings is quite an accomplishment.
RE: RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:19 pm : link
In comment 14261213 cjac said:
Quote:
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:


Quote:


No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.



You need to elaborate on this. What’s borderline


Sure. Borderline to me is that it's not clear cut. It's going to take some real convincing in that debate room. Both Manning and Eli have pluses and minuses.

Rivers had had, IMV, HoF regular season career. But not enough playoff accomplishments.

Eli gets a positive bump for the two SB runs. But his regular seasons are more quantity than quality.
RE: RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:19 pm : link
In comment 14261218 adamg said:
Quote:
In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:


Quote:


No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.



Are you even a Giants fan?


I am.

Next inane question.
RE: They are both going to be first ballot  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:21 pm : link
In comment 14261220 cjac said:
Quote:
Rivers has better TD to Int ratio

Eli has better post season stats.

Aside from that all numbers are similar


All key regular season metric numbers are not similar - QBR, TD/INT ratio, standard QB rating, completion %, etc are all in favor of Rivers.
There are no two-time SB MVP's not in the HOF.  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:21 pm : link
.
Great  
Toth029 : 1/13/2019 4:23 pm : link
Regular season numbers.

Too bad it didn't come to translate in the playoffs. Where the big boys play.
And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:23 pm : link
Brady
Montana
Starr
Bradshaw
Manning (Eli).
RE: RE: RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
adamg : 1/13/2019 4:24 pm : link
In comment 14261228 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14261218 adamg said:


Quote:


In comment 14261206 bw in dc said:


Quote:


No idea what numbers you are looking at...

They are both borderline. Rivers is less borderline, and has had a better career.



Are you even a Giants fan?



I am.

Next inane question.


Just checking. You wouldn't rooting against the Cowboys yesterday. Today you're saying you'd take Rivers over Eli...
Thats a tough call.  
TMS : 1/13/2019 4:25 pm : link
Both or neither may go. Think ELI gets a lot of votes because of his longevity and showing up for every game. Thats a huge factor in this game these days IMO. Check out games missed by QBS in ELI's era and you will see what I mean.
Rivers has an iron man streak going to....  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:26 pm : link
and will probably pass Manning thanks to McAdoo.
RE: RE: RE: RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:28 pm : link
In comment 14261238 adamg said:
Quote:



Just checking. You wouldn't rooting against the Cowboys yesterday. Today you're saying you'd take Rivers over Eli...


I didn't care about the Cowboys game. They don't bother me actually.

Now the Eagles are a completely different story. There isn't an organization and fan base I dislike more than them.

But thanks for trying to keep me honest to whatever BBI doctrine that exists for "true fandom"...
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: Their numbers aren't equal...  
adamg : 1/13/2019 4:29 pm : link
In comment 14261250 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14261238 adamg said:


Quote:





Just checking. You wouldn't rooting against the Cowboys yesterday. Today you're saying you'd take Rivers over Eli...



I didn't care about the Cowboys game. They don't bother me actually.

Now the Eagles are a completely different story. There isn't an organization and fan base I dislike more than them.

But thanks for trying to keep me honest to whatever BBI doctrine that exists for "true fandom"...


No problem, brother.
RE: And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:29 pm : link
In comment 14261236 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
Brady
Montana
Starr
Bradshaw
Manning (Eli).


And Eli can't hold a candle to any of them.
RE: RE: And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:30 pm : link
In comment 14261254 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14261236 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Brady
Montana
Starr
Bradshaw
Manning (Eli).



And Eli can't hold a candle to any of them.


And Rivers isn't even in the conversation, so....
still waiting on that inferior career argument....  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:31 pm : link
.
RE: still waiting on that inferior career argument....  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:34 pm : link
In comment 14261258 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
.


Read my earlier post where I list the key regular season metrics. I suggest you familiarize yourself because I have.
RE: RE: And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
Section331 : 1/13/2019 4:34 pm : link
In comment 14261254 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14261236 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Brady
Montana
Starr
Bradshaw
Manning (Eli).



And Eli can't hold a candle to any of them.


Terry Bradshaw? Eli is better.
So they both finish in the top 10 in almost all passing categories....  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:35 pm : link
You're splitting hairs.

One has hardware, and one doesn't. That's what separates the wheat from the chaff, whether you refuse to acknowledge it or not.
RE: RE: RE: And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:37 pm : link
In comment 14261265 Section331 said:
Quote:


Terry Bradshaw? Eli is better.


Come on. Seriously? You just wrote that?

RE: RE: RE: And there are only five guys with more than one SB MVP  
Big Blue '56 : 1/13/2019 4:37 pm : link
In comment 14261265 Section331 said:
Quote:
In comment 14261254 bw in dc said:


Quote:


In comment 14261236 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


Brady
Montana
Starr
Bradshaw
Manning (Eli).



And Eli can't hold a candle to any of them.



Terry Bradshaw? Eli is better.


And it’s not even close...:)
maybe this helps?  
gmen4ever : 1/13/2019 4:38 pm : link
Eli:
Link - ( New Window )
And Rivers  
gmen4ever : 1/13/2019 4:39 pm : link
Rivers
Link - ( New Window )
RE: So they both finish in the top 10 in almost all passing categories....  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:39 pm : link
In comment 14261269 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
You're splitting hairs.

One has hardware, and one doesn't. That's what separates the wheat from the chaff, whether you refuse to acknowledge it or not.


I don't acknowledge that - correct. Eli has considerably more mistakes, less completion %, less QBR, etc.

I don't dwell on volume. That tells just a piece of a story.

Look, I said BOTH are borderline. So, see if you can digest that for a second.
RE: There are no two-time SB MVP's not in the HOF.  
SJGiant : 1/13/2019 4:40 pm : link
In comment 14261232 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
.


Just looked it up. Jim Plunkett not only is a two time winner in the Super Bowl, he was MVP in both games. I thought you had me,
You said both are borderline but Rivers LESS so....  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:41 pm : link
based on what?

All time completion percentage and QBR? You're nuts.

Look at the top ten QB rating all time. Kirk Cousins is in the top 10.
RE: RE: There are no two-time SB MVP's not in the HOF.  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:41 pm : link
In comment 14261282 SJGiant said:
Quote:
In comment 14261232 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


.



Just looked it up. Jim Plunkett not only is a two time winner in the Super Bowl, he was MVP in both games. I thought you had me,


Jim Plunkett did not win the MVP 2x.
IMO  
gmen4ever : 1/13/2019 4:43 pm : link
They both get in, as does Ben. As BB56 said for slightly different reasons. Eli's 2 SBs certainly helps his chances. Question is will they go in at the same time?? Not sure.
RE: RE: RE: There are no two-time SB MVP's not in the HOF.  
SJGiant : 1/13/2019 4:43 pm : link
In comment 14261287 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14261282 SJGiant said:


Quote:


In comment 14261232 Britt in VA said:


Quote:


.



Just looked it up. Jim Plunkett not only is a two time winner in the Super Bowl, he was MVP in both games. I thought you had me,



Jim Plunkett did not win the MVP 2x.


Please check this link


Do I read this correctly - ( New Window )
Neither Qb belongs in the HOF  
GoBlue6599 : 1/13/2019 4:43 pm : link
.
RE: You said both are borderline but Rivers LESS so....  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:44 pm : link
In comment 14261284 Britt in VA said:
Quote:
based on what?

All time completion percentage and QBR? You're nuts.

Look at the top ten QB rating all time. Kirk Cousins is in the top 10.


I'm comparing Eli directly to Rivers and their key stats, and even volume, are in favor of Rivers. You seem to be a bright guy. Why you can't absorb that is odd.

Just go to pro-football reference and do a side by side. My guess is you will be able to discern the differences without my help. But I don't mind helping if you struggle.
Yes, you read it incorrectly:  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:45 pm : link
Quote:
2× Super Bowl champion (XV, XVIII)
Super Bowl MVP (XV)
RE: RE: They are both going to be first ballot  
Section331 : 1/13/2019 4:45 pm : link
In comment 14261231 bw in dc said:
Quote:

All key regular season metric numbers are not similar - QBR, TD/INT ratio, standard QB rating, completion %, etc are all in favor of Rivers.


QBR - Eli 84.1 Bradshaw 70.9
TD:INT - 360:236. 212:210
Comp %: 60.3%. 51.9%

Not to mention, Eli has nearly double the passing yards. Not arguing that TB, with 4 SB’s shouldn’t be in, but Eli is the better QB. It isn’t even arguable.
SJ  
adamg : 1/13/2019 4:47 pm : link
Looks like that article is wrong. On his wiki page, he's only listed as a one time super bowl MVP. That article is misleading.
RE: RE: RE: They are both going to be first ballot  
adamg : 1/13/2019 4:48 pm : link
In comment 14261306 Section331 said:
Quote:
In comment 14261231 bw in dc said:


Quote:



All key regular season metric numbers are not similar - QBR, TD/INT ratio, standard QB rating, completion %, etc are all in favor of Rivers.



QBR - Eli 84.1 Bradshaw 70.9
TD:INT - 360:236. 212:210
Comp %: 60.3%. 51.9%

Not to mention, Eli has nearly double the passing yards. Not arguing that TB, with 4 SB’s shouldn’t be in, but Eli is the better QB. It isn’t even arguable.


Come on. Apples and oranges. Those are two different eras.
RE: RE: RE: They are both going to be first ballot  
bw in dc : 1/13/2019 4:48 pm : link
In comment 14261306 Section331 said:
Quote:
In comment 14261231 bw in dc said:


Quote:



All key regular season metric numbers are not similar - QBR, TD/INT ratio, standard QB rating, completion %, etc are all in favor of Rivers.



QBR - Eli 84.1 Bradshaw 70.9
TD:INT - 360:236. 212:210
Comp %: 60.3%. 51.9%

Not to mention, Eli has nearly double the passing yards. Not arguing that TB, with 4 SB’s shouldn’t be in, but Eli is the better QB. It isn’t even arguable.


God bless you but you should be banned. ;)

Uh - you do realize Bradshaw played QB when you needed a wheelchair to get on the plane after every game?

They played completely different era. Bradshaw had a better arm, was more mobile, and tougher. He was a GREAT big game QB.
Ahh..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 1/13/2019 4:49 pm : link
the daily, "how many ways can we try to shit on Eli" thread.
RE: SJ  
SJGiant : 1/13/2019 4:49 pm : link
In comment 14261309 adamg said:
Quote:
Looks like that article is wrong. On his wiki page, he's only listed as a one time super bowl MVP. That article is misleading.


I stand corrected. I looked up Super Bowl MVPs and he was only listed once.
RE: Ahh..  
Britt in VA : 1/13/2019 4:50 pm : link
In comment 14261325 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
the daily, "how many ways can we try to shit on Eli" thread.


Absolutely baffling.
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