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The Pats...

peteschweaty : 1/14/2019 9:42 am
Starting to believe all the conspiracy theories on them. They're too good and in all my years of watching sports no one is as good at 41 as they were when they were 28. Brady zipping it all day to wide open guys. Makes you wonder.
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I am Ninja : 1/14/2019 11:00 am : link
Discipline is the key word. Watch one of our games then watch New England. We (and, to be fair, most other teams) are a clown show comparatively. They just dont do stupid shit.
the wrong team won two weeks ago  
UConn4523 : 1/14/2019 11:00 am : link
Baltimore is someone the Pats absolutely didn't want to face. I still think they win that game and scheme against Jackson, but Baltimore defense can do what the Chargers couldn't.
Huh, what conspiracy theories?!  
Ssanders9816 : 1/14/2019 11:02 am : link
Have you ever read about Brady’s regimen? There’s a whole book on it!!
RE: the wrong team won two weeks ago  
UConn4523 : 1/14/2019 11:05 am : link
In comment 14262772 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
Baltimore is someone the Pats absolutely didn't want to face. I still think they win that game and scheme against Jackson, but Baltimore defense can do what the Chargers couldn't.


And to clarify, I didn't mean that the Chargers didn't deserve to win that game, they did. I just meant in terms of who can beat the Pats, I'd much prefer Baltimore playing them.
I think what we are seeing is the first elite  
bradshaw44 : 1/14/2019 11:13 am : link
QB to come out of the era of minimal QB hits. I know his career wasn’t in that league to start his career, but in his older age the league has been QB friendly. Accompany that with his incredible work ethic and diet and you have Tom Brady.
I attribute it to his sex life  
gtt350 : 1/14/2019 11:31 am : link
.
Great line  
JerseyCityJoe : 1/14/2019 12:16 pm : link
Quote:
They are the Roman imperial army of the NFL.

Now that is a wonderful way to describe the Pats.
It's a remarkable run  
Matt in SGS : 1/14/2019 12:40 pm : link
but if there ever was a poetic spot for a changing of the guard, it will happen in Kansas City this weekend. Nothing goes on forever, the Pats run will have to stop at some point.
Giselle has been whipping him  
spike : 1/14/2019 12:43 pm : link
Into shape.

Win or expect punishment at home!
RE: It's a remarkable run  
Ssanders9816 : 1/14/2019 12:43 pm : link
In comment 14262956 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
but if there ever was a poetic spot for a changing of the guard, it will happen in Kansas City this weekend. Nothing goes on forever, the Pats run will have to stop at some point.


Well not really, I mean they will continue to win their awful division for the foreseeable future. But they didn’t win the Super Bowl last year. They are not the juggernaut they once were but they will always be competitive with Brady and Belichick.
It's an incredible thing we are witnessing...  
bw in dc : 1/14/2019 12:44 pm : link
up at Pats Central. It really should be applauded.

They really hit the jackpot when the greatest mind in his history of the game, BB (with all due respect to Paul Brown & Don Shula), and a QB equally dedicated and disciplined, are magically fused together to create the greatest dynasty in modern sports.

Versatility and culture high football IQ  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 1/14/2019 1:24 pm : link
> basketball on cleets. Ugh.

Couple of principles that makes little Bill succesfull, he's zigging when everyone is zagging. And versatility is a huge weapon in a salary cap league where every team has a flaw.
Pats  
Thegratefulhead : 1/14/2019 1:32 pm : link
Have been so consistently good for so long because Bill B is a genius. He could have become a theoretical physicist and been a leader in the field. Brady is exceptional, the pairing is good but... Bill won NFL games with Matt Cassel.
I think they are going to get beat by the Chiefs  
montanagiant : 1/14/2019 1:37 pm : link
by 10 at least
To me, it seems so simple  
Oskie : 1/14/2019 1:42 pm : link
If you pressure Brady, and hit him (several times), you have a chance to beat them, if you don't, he will pick you apart.
The Pats have been caught cheating in a couple different ways...  
Leg of Theismann : 1/14/2019 2:11 pm : link
That DOES make me wonder what they are doing cheating-wise that we just don't know (and/or will never know). The fact they've been caught in 2 separate situations (spy-gate and deflate-gate) tells me there have to be other things they are doing that we don't know and will never know.

Not to take away from the fact they are in fact a great team, great coach, great QB, etc. But there's no question there are other things going on to produce this kind of consistent success year in and year out. I mean seriously, 8 straight AFC Championship games?

I was any team playing at Foxboro, I wouldn't do any sort of planning or practicing anywhere near there. Hell, I wouldn't even use/drink the water in the visiting team's lockerroom... I'm only half-kidding. LOL!
If* I was any team playing agains them in Foxboro  
Leg of Theismann : 1/14/2019 2:14 pm : link
.
Best run in the modern era of football  
aka dbrny : 1/14/2019 2:49 pm : link
They have an excellent front office.
They don't worry too much about chasing superstars...seem to be more focused on serviceable depth across the lines.
They never seem to lose focus on the importance of the trenches (watch how much play space Tom B has snap after snap, year after year)
They have spent 14 years in one of the saddest, if not the saddest division in the NFL. Puts them in good position for a first round bye and home field advantage every year.

For the last point...since 2004, any team in their division not named the Patriots posted 12 winning records. 12 winning records among three teams over 14 years. I live in Rochester, and I get to watch that division trip over each other every year. It's a joke.

As a contrast, teams in the NFCE not named the Giants have posted 23 winning seasons over that same period. Much more competitive...and no one ever stays on top for long.
What is ironic about this year...  
bw in dc : 1/14/2019 3:09 pm : link
is the Pats essentially lost home field advantage because of the flukiest play of the year in Miami. And that may end up costing them another trip to the SB.

To think that team and that coach weren't prepared to stop the Miami Miracle is hard to believe...
Brady & Brees vs Eli & Rivers  
giantfan2000 : 1/14/2019 3:19 pm : link
one thing I notice yesterday about Brady and Brees they are really really trim
they look slimmer then they did a few years ago ..

manning and rivers look a bit bulkier than their early years. that is they look their age --
. this seems to translate in to slowness and inability to be agile at all.
If they make it to the Super Bowl,  
Go Terps : 1/14/2019 3:40 pm : link
that will be 9 Super Bowl appearances out of the last 18. The fact that Brady and Belichick have been in 15% of all the Super Bowls ever played is in itself incredible.
RE: BB is sharp  
clarkie02360 : 1/14/2019 3:44 pm : link
In comment 14262677 WillVAB said:
Quote:
The Chargers have been bad vs RBs and receiving backs in particular all year. What does he do? Pounds Michel and peppers White with targets all day.

Defensively, some of the Ravens looks gave Rivers fits the prior week. What do the Pats do? Incorporate some of those looks into their defense.

Logical, opponent specific game plan. Not sure why it’s so hard for other coaches to emulate.

That's what BB does.. On D they aren't a 4-3 or 3-4 team..they're everything. it all depends on the opponent. They look for bright versatile players who can carry out a different game plan and scheme each week. The same to a lesser degree on Offense. Some weeks they run the ball 30 plus times, other games a handful. Everything is predicated on their opponent.
It's a shame..BB should be here.
RE: To me, it seems so simple  
Ron Johnson : 1/14/2019 4:03 pm : link
In comment 14263077 Oskie said:
Quote:
If you pressure Brady, and hit him (several times), you have a chance to beat them, if you don't, he will pick you apart.




the pressure has to come up the middle. Not allow him to step up. Even if no one comes off the edge he's not going to scramble and beat you, you have to be right in his face.


Patricia and Vrable knew it
Don’t play zone?  
trueblueinpw : 1/14/2019 4:40 pm : link
I’d probably start there. How many more D-cos are going to travel to Foxboro with a zone defense as the plan? Might as well forfeit the game and save the travel expense. But yeah, the Pats a amazing.
Little Bill also studies military history  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 1/14/2019 6:00 pm : link
He's the football embodiment of Sun Tzu's Art of War, which he often cites.
RE: Little Bill also studies military history  
Go Terps : 1/14/2019 6:07 pm : link
In comment 14263398 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
He's the football embodiment of Sun Tzu's Art of War, which he often cites.


I read recently that the only quote that's posted in the Patriots' facility is from Sun Tzu: "Every battle is won before it's ever fought."
RE: RE: BB is sharp  
WillVAB : 1/14/2019 6:20 pm : link
In comment 14263269 clarkie02360 said:
Quote:
In comment 14262677 WillVAB said:


Quote:


The Chargers have been bad vs RBs and receiving backs in particular all year. What does he do? Pounds Michel and peppers White with targets all day.

Defensively, some of the Ravens looks gave Rivers fits the prior week. What do the Pats do? Incorporate some of those looks into their defense.

Logical, opponent specific game plan. Not sure why it’s so hard for other coaches to emulate.


That's what BB does.. On D they aren't a 4-3 or 3-4 team..they're everything. it all depends on the opponent. They look for bright versatile players who can carry out a different game plan and scheme each week. The same to a lesser degree on Offense. Some weeks they run the ball 30 plus times, other games a handful. Everything is predicated on their opponent.
It's a shame..BB should be here.


Yep.

But it’s really not that hard to be similar. Instead teams try to “impose their will” or “make them stop us” or try to fit square pegs into round holes.

It’s not rocket science.
Interestingly,  
Go Terps : 1/14/2019 6:23 pm : link
I believe the Patriots also don't display their trophies or pictures referencing past teams. Apparently the Patriots take the Strahan quote very seriously: "The past is the fucking past."

I don't think teams should copy what the Patriots do; there's a difference between copying something and actually doing it (Matt Patricia may be learning this in Detroit). What I do think resonates is the need to have a singular philosophy that guides every aspect of the organization.

With the Pats some of the core concepts appear to be:

- No one is above the team
- Leave no stone unturned in looking for advantages over the opponent
- Ruthlessly assess your own personnel with zero sentimentality
- Attention to detail in all areas is critical

You'd think all this stuff would be obvious to every team, but it clearly isn't. Think about how good the Pats have been over the years on converting short yardage with QB sneaks. I think that's a great example of how they've turned something many would take for granted into a weapon.
If the Patriots story  
mrvax : 1/14/2019 6:52 pm : link
was a novel, it wouldn't sell. Everyone would laugh and say it could never happen in today's NFL.

If the Pats beat the Chiefs, the fans of 31 NFL teams will be pissed.
The Pats have cap integrity..  
Sean : 1/14/2019 6:52 pm : link
Look at these salaries on offense. They aren’t going to overpay, ever.
Link - ( New Window )
Sean  
Go Terps : 1/14/2019 7:08 pm : link
What's interesting is even the ones that could arguably been an overpay (like say Burkhead at $3.25M), it's still a blip. I recall how up in arms everyone was about what we were paying for Jonathan Stewart...yeah he wasn't worth $3M but that's not what hurts. Here are our big 2018 cap hits:

Eli: $22.2M
Vernon: $17M
Solder: $10M
Jenkins: $10M

IMO not one of those guys earned that money in 2018, and they all go up in 2019. Beckham jumps from $5.5M to $21M.

People act like Belichick is some sort of wizard. In some aspects he may be, but in others what he's doing to succeed is clear as day. Would he pay $21M in 2019 for any WR in the NFL? Zero chance.



The sneak thing is so obvious too  
Zeke's Alibi : 1/14/2019 7:11 pm : link
It's a guaranteed half yard practically unless the defense sells out to stop it opening up big holes in the run game. Generally teams don't do it because in short yardage situations those holes usually go for big plays.
Not to be that guy...  
trueblueinpw : 1/14/2019 7:19 pm : link
But with everyone lining up to kiss Hoodies ring, and rightfully so, I think it bares some mention that Little Bill has always been more than happy to break the rules. Sppy-gate to deflate-gate to the very fishy TB12 foundation, to who knows what he hasn’t been caught doing, the Patriot way clearly includes cheating. The guy is he best ever, but one can also wonder how things may have been different if BB wasn’t so willing and able to break the rules.
RE: Not to be that guy...  
Go Terps : 1/14/2019 7:21 pm : link
In comment 14263450 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
But with everyone lining up to kiss Hoodies ring, and rightfully so, I think it bares some mention that Little Bill has always been more than happy to break the rules. Sppy-gate to deflate-gate to the very fishy TB12 foundation, to who knows what he hasn’t been caught doing, the Patriot way clearly includes cheating. The guy is he best ever, but one can also wonder how things may have been different if BB wasn’t so willing and able to break the rules.


I don't discount the possibility that he has broken rules and even continues to. But do we think he's the only one?
RE: Not to be that guy...  
Ssanders9816 : 1/14/2019 7:23 pm : link
In comment 14263450 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
But with everyone lining up to kiss Hoodies ring, and rightfully so, I think it bares some mention that Little Bill has always been more than happy to break the rules. Sppy-gate to deflate-gate to the very fishy TB12 foundation, to who knows what he hasn’t been caught doing, the Patriot way clearly includes cheating. The guy is he best ever, but one can also wonder how things may have been different if BB wasn’t so willing and able to break the rules.


It also makes me wonder how many other teams have done the same just don’t get caught. They’ve won in spite of all the cheating and suspensions and you know they are under a bigger microscope now. Yet keep winning....
their defense  
stoneman : 1/14/2019 7:35 pm : link
never straightened themselves out this year - every year they start out shaky but improve as the year goes on and look great going into the playoffs, this year it never happened. They looked awful the last 2 or 3 weeks.

They will have to score 50 next week.
Yeah, but, I don’t think we can assume *everyone* cheats...  
trueblueinpw : 1/14/2019 7:40 pm : link
But I’m admittedly idealistic, probably even naive. On the other hand, do I think Tony Dungy cheated? No, I don’t. Do I think Coughlin chested? No. Landry? Just can’t see it. Jimmy Johnson? (Second GOAT of my lifetime). Yeah, probably, maybe... Hoodie isn’t the only coach that cheats, and he’s the GOAT no matter what, but I also don’t think every NFL coach who’s been a winner was also a cheat.
it's like they know exactly what the other team is going to call  
Jints in Carolina : 1/14/2019 7:50 pm : link
before they call it.........
RE: Not to be that guy...  
bw in dc : 1/14/2019 8:14 pm : link
In comment 14263450 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
But with everyone lining up to kiss Hoodies ring, and rightfully so, I think it bares some mention that Little Bill has always been more than happy to break the rules. Sppy-gate to deflate-gate to the very fishy TB12 foundation, to who knows what he hasn’t been caught doing, the Patriot way clearly includes cheating. The guy is he best ever, but one can also wonder how things may have been different if BB wasn’t so willing and able to break the rules.


Cheating allegations are laughable.

Ask Jimmy Johnson about SpyGate. He said he did the same exact thing, and many others did, too. But Eric "The Rat" Mangini, because he was the Jets HC, sold BB out. And created an unnecessary mess.

DeflateGate? Please. What a canard. The Pats still lead the league in fewest turnovers despite efforts to tie turnovers to soft footballs. And after they were supposedly "caught" after the Colts playoff game in 2014, they destroyed the Colts in the second half. From there, they went on to beat Seattle in the SB.

The major problem with DeflateGate was Kraft's capitulation. He's lucky they have won two SBs since because the fan base was livid about Kraft just giving away a first round pick as penalty. That was a conspiracy created by the other owners and carried out by Goodell.

TB12? What a mystery. Brady gets massages. How groundbreaking.

The jealousy around the league for the Pats success is embarrassing.
You want to know what makes Brady the greatest?  
Ssanders9816 : 1/14/2019 8:41 pm : link
Just check out his Instagram from today...
TB12 is a massage parlor?  
trueblueinpw : 1/14/2019 8:42 pm : link
Oh, ok. See, I thought it was a way to circumvent the league’s salary cap. But now that we’ve heard character witnesses for the defense (the uninpugnable Jimmy Johnson!) and established the truth about TB12, I recommend we drop all charges and you’re free to continue with the rimming of Belichick and the Patriot way. So much smoke, yet so little fire.
Oh and OBJ commented on it  
Ssanders9816 : 1/14/2019 8:43 pm : link
I’m sure haters will love that...
RE: Sean  
Sean : 1/14/2019 8:52 pm : link
In comment 14263443 Go Terps said:
Quote:
What's interesting is even the ones that could arguably been an overpay (like say Burkhead at $3.25M), it's still a blip. I recall how up in arms everyone was about what we were paying for Jonathan Stewart...yeah he wasn't worth $3M but that's not what hurts. Here are our big 2018 cap hits:

Eli: $22.2M
Vernon: $17M
Solder: $10M
Jenkins: $10M

IMO not one of those guys earned that money in 2018, and they all go up in 2019. Beckham jumps from $5.5M to $21M.

People act like Belichick is some sort of wizard. In some aspects he may be, but in others what he's doing to succeed is clear as day. Would he pay $21M in 2019 for any WR in the NFL? Zero chance.




No way. I’d also bet Sony Michel will never see a second contract with NE. They just stick with the process & no one is more important than their system/culture. Nate Solder was never going to get the amount of money we gave him from NE. Belichick is never going to be backed into a corner to make any player the highest paid in the sport. Hell, Belichick will not be shy to move on from Brady when he sees fit.

Look at the Pats and then look at how top heavy our roster is. So many high priced players with so little wins. People think I’m nuts for suggesting Beckham be traded, but truth is he was a very valuable asset which could have yielded a very valuable first round pick & cap flexibility. As Lombardi always mentions, it is hardest to be truthful about your own talent.
That's how we won in '07 and '11....  
Doomster : 1/14/2019 11:10 pm : link
I'm going with the theory
Beer Man : 10:12 am : link : reply
that Belichick and Brady both traded their souls to the Devil


But obviously Bill & Tom made a better deal than we did....
RE: RE: Sean  
SGMen : 1/14/2019 11:29 pm : link
In comment 14263534 Sean said:
Quote:
In comment 14263443 Go Terps said:


Quote:


What's interesting is even the ones that could arguably been an overpay (like say Burkhead at $3.25M), it's still a blip. I recall how up in arms everyone was about what we were paying for Jonathan Stewart...yeah he wasn't worth $3M but that's not what hurts. Here are our big 2018 cap hits:

Eli: $22.2M
Vernon: $17M
Solder: $10M
Jenkins: $10M

IMO not one of those guys earned that money in 2018, and they all go up in 2019. Beckham jumps from $5.5M to $21M.

People act like Belichick is some sort of wizard. In some aspects he may be, but in others what he's doing to succeed is clear as day. Would he pay $21M in 2019 for any WR in the NFL? Zero chance.






No way. I’d also bet Sony Michel will never see a second contract with NE. They just stick with the process & no one is more important than their system/culture. Nate Solder was never going to get the amount of money we gave him from NE. Belichick is never going to be backed into a corner to make any player the highest paid in the sport. Hell, Belichick will not be shy to move on from Brady when he sees fit.

Look at the Pats and then look at how top heavy our roster is. So many high priced players with so little wins. People think I’m nuts for suggesting Beckham be traded, but truth is he was a very valuable asset which could have yielded a very valuable first round pick & cap flexibility. As Lombardi always mentions, it is hardest to be truthful about your own talent.
We overpaid for OBJ. We did because he sells jersey's and is in commercials. He is an "icon" and a talent but he is also a big mouth. I'm not saying he is a bad teammate cause I don't sense that he's an asshole but a prima donna, yeah.
He isn't a big guy and has been hurt all but one year!
We need him though because he draws double teams and without him teams can focus on Saquon more.
I have high hopes we get OL help and the offense is very good next year. I'm a fan...what can I say!

RE: RE: Sean  
bw in dc : 1/15/2019 12:56 am : link
In comment 14263534 Sean said:
Quote:

No way. I’d also bet Sony Michel will never see a second contract with NE. They just stick with the process & no one is more important than their system/culture. Nate Solder was never going to get the amount of money we gave him from NE. Belichick is never going to be backed into a corner to make any player the highest paid in the sport. Hell, Belichick will not be shy to move on from Brady when he sees fit.



All true but the Brady part. Kraft calls that shot. Belichick wanted to jettison Brady two years ago. But Kraft pulled rank and forced Belichick to trade JimG instead.

I couldn’t believe Belichick didn’t draft a QB in the early rounds last year. Settling for Danny Etling in the 7th round is not building for any future. And Hoyer isn’t the answer.

They have to grab someone more interesting this year. Otherwise it’s another big FU from Belichick to the Krafts.
They run the same style  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 1:54 am : link
of offense nearly every season. Brady is great but he is also the perfect fit for the system. If you can’t get to Brady they just don’t mess up enough to lose. The Chargers did nothing this weekend, they looked lost trying to play vs them.

KC also looks incredible this year, I hope KC wins but I wouldn’t want to bet against the Patriots. Belichek always always has a plan and sticks to it, even if it isn’t working at first. If it’s a heavy run team they are going to force them to pass and vice versa. The guy really is just always prepared, and he seems to have his team all on one page every game. I think the dynasty has more to do with Bill than it does Brady (not taking a thing away from Brady though). It definitely could just be the perfect partnership.
Has any of his coordinators  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 1:59 am : link
ever done anything really successful afterwards? OBrien has been good in Houston but off the top of my head I can only think of guys that didn’t pan out elsewhere.

Last year I probably would have chosen McDaniels over Shurmur but who knows. During the game the announcers were singing McDaniels praises but I still kinda think everything is run by Bill
RE: They run the same style  
Zeke's Alibi : 1/15/2019 2:28 am : link
In comment 14263731 mattyblue said:
Quote:
of offense nearly every season. Brady is great but he is also the perfect fit for the system. If you can’t get to Brady they just don’t mess up enough to lose. The Chargers did nothing this weekend, they looked lost trying to play vs them.

KC also looks incredible this year, I hope KC wins but I wouldn’t want to bet against the Patriots. Belichek always always has a plan and sticks to it, even if it isn’t working at first. If it’s a heavy run team they are going to force them to pass and vice versa. The guy really is just always prepared, and he seems to have his team all on one page every game. I think the dynasty has more to do with Bill than it does Brady (not taking a thing away from Brady though). It definitely could just be the perfect partnership.


What makes the patriots the patriots is that they run different schemes week to week depending on opponent, especially this year where they don't have the offensive talent to dictate. Not sure where you are getting they run the same offense year to year.
.  
Bill2 : 1/15/2019 7:37 am : link
With Moss they ran vertical. With 2 TE they ran that. Ran with Curtis Martin and Blount. won with 2 slots. won with a converted DB. won with all injured and undersized. won slow. won fast.

It may be one system. But it's a hell of a system
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