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NFT: Yankees thread

Dunedin81 : 1/15/2019 9:05 am
A month before Spring Training, the roster (whether we like it or not) is starting to come into focus. Also the questions that they'll take into ST are also starting to come into focus.

The obvious: Who plays 2B and who plays SS? Ideally for me, unless Tulowitzki flashes his 2015 form with the bat and/or with the leather, it's LeMahieu and Gleyber with Tulo in a backup role.

Secondary: What does the bullpen look like? Do they add or are they content with the personnel on the roster? My preference would be to hold what they've got, because perversely and counterintuitively it should keep the big arms fresher (because they won't have to handle garbage time)

Tertiary: What do they do with Adams, Acevedo and Abreu? Do they force the issue on starting vs. relieving because they're all 40 man guys?
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Torres wasn't great at 2B last year  
robbieballs2003 : 1/15/2019 9:16 am : link
So, with that in mind, I think they leave Torres alone at 2B and do not play him at SS. Didi is supposedly coming back at a decent time this year so I don't think they want to be switching Torres back and forth. I do think they will bounce Torres back amd forth in spring training but ultimately he'll be at 2B.

Then comes the question who plays short if and when Tulo gets hurt? I don't know.
Have they done enough to supplant Boston  
The_Boss : 1/15/2019 9:19 am : link
Honestly, I don’t think so.
An interesting thought around Kluber was discussed last night  
Matt in SGS : 1/15/2019 9:19 am : link
The Padres are in on trading for Kluber but would do so with the idea to flip him. Enter the Yankees and the Padres reported interest in Andujar and they have also looked at Sonny Gray.

So playing this out (and it does not include Machado, I think that ship has long sailed).

- Padres trade for Kluber
- Yankees and Padres reach deal for Kluber which will include Andujar and Gray as the headliners (and maybe other parts)
- LaMahieu takes over at 3rd base
- Give Tulo his shot at SS or if that's not working, then look to maybe shift Torres there. But ultimately it's holding down the fort until Didi is back.

So now you have a rotation of Kluber, Sevy, Tanaka, Paxton, Happ, and CC.

But we discussed in a thread last week how does Tulo fit in here, in this scenario, and with no Machado, Tulo would end up being needed until Didi is ready.
Matt, I saw that regarding the Padres  
robbieballs2003 : 1/15/2019 9:22 am : link
Interesting
RE: Have they done enough to supplant Boston  
Tuckrule : 1/15/2019 9:22 am : link
In comment 14263823 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Honestly, I don’t think so.


Vegas thinks so
I think Torres is going to wind up at 3B  
arniefez : 1/15/2019 9:25 am : link
not to start the season unless Andujar is traded. But if he's not he won't stay at 3B very long.
I was kinda pissed when I realized the Yankees weren't going to sign  
Jints in Carolina : 1/15/2019 9:27 am : link
Machado...but after thinking about it, I am ok with it. I think that dude could be cancer.
RE: Have they done enough to supplant Boston  
Beer Man : 1/15/2019 9:28 am : link
In comment 14263823 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Honestly, I don’t think so.
I don't get the warm and fuzzy. I think they still need:
1. Another front line SP
2. Another quality reliever
3. Someone to hit 3rd in the lineup (hopefully Manny)
I know everybody feels like the Yanks are out  
robbieballs2003 : 1/15/2019 9:30 am : link
of the running for Machado but everything from Machado's side seems to be pressuring the Yanks into making a better offer. When news comes out now it seems like it is either false or trying to bump up his price.

Here is my thinking (and this could be way off):

First, we heard that the Yanks have not make an offer to Machado so they were out. Well, at that point no team made an offer except for possibly Chicago.

Second, we hear that Chicago offered 8 years and could possibly go up from there. Well, not even a day later those reports were debunked and it is known that Chicago offered 7 and have not increased it.

Chicago made their offer. If Machado wanted that then he would have accepted it by now imo if he wanted to be there. The only way he plays in Chicago is if no other team comes close to what they offered.

Finally, there was a report that came out that Machado is going to the highest bidder and not team, not even the Yanks, will get a discount. Um, why is that public? Thay just screams to me, "Hey, Yanks! I want to play in NY so make me a better offer."

I am not saying he will end up with the Yanks but he is trying to squeeze every dime out of them before committing.

Oh, then we get into these mystery teams. Don't get me started on that. Machado was not heard from for weeks and then all of a sudden we start hearing thesd reports. When you put it all together it tells me he isn't happywith either the offers, the locations, or both. Imo, that favors the Yanks.
Tulowitzki  
Jay in Toronto : 1/15/2019 9:40 am : link
Based on recent reports, I think he will be more than adequate, possibly + with his glove. His bat is a real unknown.

As always, SP is still too much of a question mark. Even with Sevy regaining form and solving the mystery of last season.

Perhaps they will move even closer to SPs pitching less innings. This may be where our 'Triple AAAs' in the OP come in.
RE: RE: Have they done enough to supplant Boston  
The_Boss : 1/15/2019 9:51 am : link
In comment 14263830 Tuckrule said:
Quote:
In comment 14263823 The_Boss said:


Quote:


Honestly, I don’t think so.



Vegas thinks so


The Yanks had a better over/under last year too. How’d that work out?
Really good post Robbie  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 9:59 am : link
I also don’t believe the Yankees are completely out of it on Machado, but if they are does trading Andujar really make sense long term? If you lose Andujar to gain Kluber its probably a plus, but Andujar was very important to the team last year. Does that move really put us past the Sox?

It doesn’t sit well that the Yankees are gonna pass on both Harper and Machado at a time that they happen to be at a lower than usual payroll. Those guys are both 26 and as good as it gets. I admit to being a spoiled Yankees fan, but they still need to spend to surpass Boston and Houston. I just can’t think of a good reason that they wouldn’t make a solid effort to land them.
RE: Really good post Robbie  
robbieballs2003 : 1/15/2019 10:20 am : link
In comment 14263920 mattyblue said:
Quote:
I also don’t believe the Yankees are completely out of it on Machado, but if they are does trading Andujar really make sense long term? If you lose Andujar to gain Kluber its probably a plus, but Andujar was very important to the team last year. Does that move really put us past the Sox?

It doesn’t sit well that the Yankees are gonna pass on both Harper and Machado at a time that they happen to be at a lower than usual payroll. Those guys are both 26 and as good as it gets. I admit to being a spoiled Yankees fan, but they still need to spend to surpass Boston and Houston. I just can’t think of a good reason that they wouldn’t make a solid effort to land them.


But they aren't at a lower than usual payroll. If we do not get either player we will either be 2nd or 3rd in payroll in MLB.
I would rather they don't trade  
Beer Man : 1/15/2019 10:26 am : link
Andujar for Kluber. Kluber is on the wrong side of 30, and may have just a few good seasons left. If they are going to trade a young guy like Andujar for a SP, I would rather it be for someone younger.

My guess for not aggressively pursuing Manny or Harper is that they are looking at the guys on the team that will be getting big paydays in the next few years.
I just don't understand the whole Andujar was really important thing  
arniefez : 1/15/2019 10:27 am : link
he had a 126 OPS + which is good but certainly not great and he was the absolute worst fielding 3B in MLB since they started keeping defensive metrics. Andujar was farther from the 2nd worst 3B than the 2nd worst 3B was from the best. I'm not a fan of WAR as a reliable stat but for those who are he was 2.2. Only 1B had lower WAR for the Yankees last year. He wasn't and isn't a really important player.
RE: RE: Really good post Robbie  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 10:29 am : link
In comment 14263962 robbieballs2003 said:
Quote:
In comment 14263920 mattyblue said:


Quote:


I also don’t believe the Yankees are completely out of it on Machado, but if they are does trading Andujar really make sense long term? If you lose Andujar to gain Kluber its probably a plus, but Andujar was very important to the team last year. Does that move really put us past the Sox?

It doesn’t sit well that the Yankees are gonna pass on both Harper and Machado at a time that they happen to be at a lower than usual payroll. Those guys are both 26 and as good as it gets. I admit to being a spoiled Yankees fan, but they still need to spend to surpass Boston and Houston. I just can’t think of a good reason that they wouldn’t make a solid effort to land them.



But they aren't at a lower than usual payroll. If we do not get either player we will either be 2nd or 3rd in payroll in MLB.


That’s true. I’m still greedy just greedy I suppose lol. I hate that the Sox seem to have a better team than us. I just hate passing on Harper, I know he was never in their plans but I really enjoy watching him play and was hoping to see him on the Yanks. Signing Machado would have been a pretty great consolation. Rarely do you get a shot at signing a 26 year old star in free agency, hate passing on them. Maybe it’s the smart move though.
RE: I just don't understand the whole Andujar was really important thing  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 10:35 am : link
In comment 14263973 arniefez said:
Quote:
he had a 126 OPS + which is good but certainly not great and he was the absolute worst fielding 3B in MLB since they started keeping defensive metrics. Andujar was farther from the 2nd worst 3B than the 2nd worst 3B was from the best. I'm not a fan of WAR as a reliable stat but for those who are he was 2.2. Only 1B had lower WAR for the Yankees last year. He wasn't and isn't a really important player.


He’s 23? and should have been the rookie of the year. He had a lot of big hits for the Yankees last year. I’d rather not lose him.
RE: I just don't understand the whole Andujar was really important thing  
Dunedin81 : 1/15/2019 10:36 am : link
In comment 14263973 arniefez said:
Quote:
he had a 126 OPS + which is good but certainly not great and he was the absolute worst fielding 3B in MLB since they started keeping defensive metrics. Andujar was farther from the 2nd worst 3B than the 2nd worst 3B was from the best. I'm not a fan of WAR as a reliable stat but for those who are he was 2.2. Only 1B had lower WAR for the Yankees last year. He wasn't and isn't a really important player.


He was the most consistent offensive contributor on the team. OPS+ doesn't like him because he's not a big OBP guy, but they have other guys who walk. His offensive skill set was valuable; his lowest one-month OPS still saw him hit .287 and he was at his best in August. I like the new stats and I find them instructive, but let's acknowledge their limitations. A team needs different types of contributions and Andujar's were particularly valuable to a team battling slumps and injuries all year long.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/15/2019 10:36 am : link
I'd like to add another reliever - I'd still be looking at starters, too.

The more I think about it, the more I'm fine with passing on Machado unless the price comes down.

Like I said yesterday, the Yanks scored more runs last year than anyone in baseball outside of Boston - with our best hitter missing nearly 1/3 of the season. I don't know why Machado is really a major "need" here.

It's not that I'd be against signing him or be mad if we did - I just am not sure it's a necessary addition. It's like paying for an extravagant meal when you're not even that hungry. Is the ROI there?

NYY won 100 games in 2018 and can still improve as-is (I also expect another addition or two - smaller scale)

It's really not unique to us - Bryce Harper is a free agent right now and barely anyone seems interested. Think about that....

The FA landscape is in a spooky place right now. The teams just don't see the value in these megadeals and no one wants to give them out.
Trading Andujar now  
Mike from SI : 1/15/2019 10:44 am : link
is likely selling high so I'm all for it. Is there a chance he improves his defense and gets even better as a hitter? Of course. But I think there's a better chance his defense doesn't improve that much, meaning he's a 1B/DH.
.  
arcarsenal : 1/15/2019 10:51 am : link
The one scenario I've always been on board with is dealing Miggy+ for Kluber, and then turning around and inking Machado to play 3B and re-up'ing Didi for ~4 years (assuming he shows no ill effects from the injury)

But dealing Miggy is easier said than done and finding the right match could be a challenge with his positional future sort of in flux.

I also think with him busting his butt every day to work on his defense, etc... the Yanks probably aren't too eager to reward that by shipping him away. I know in a vacuum, that shouldn't matter or have any bearing on what they do - but I think there's an undeniable human element and the brass probably wants Andujar to succeed here knowing he's putting in so much time to improve.
RE: Trading Andujar now  
mattyblue : 1/15/2019 10:52 am : link
In comment 14263997 Mike from SI said:
Quote:
is likely selling high so I'm all for it. Is there a chance he improves his defense and gets even better as a hitter? Of course. But I think there's a better chance his defense doesn't improve that much, meaning he's a 1B/DH.


That’s a fair point, but Kluber will be 33 at the start of the season. Is that the right guy to get if you are selling high? He’s obviously a good pitcher but his age has to be a consideration.
For all the chatter about Andujar working on his defense  
Greg from LI : 1/15/2019 10:56 am : link
If you watched the clip of it, he looks exactly the same. It's admirable that he's putting in so much work, but ultimately I don't think it's going to make any difference.
The Yanks used to be about winning next season  
Kevin(formerly Tiki4Six) : 1/15/2019 11:04 am : link
and they will worry about the future when it comes. That obviously didn't work with them only winning in 2009 so they went back and revamped the Farm.

The kids who came up are now producing and the Farm is very young now.

They really need another Lefty in the lineup and to add another Reliever.

The IF defense without Didi is also very scary right now.

Are the Yanks playing opossum with one of Manny/Harper?





let's  
mitch300 : 1/15/2019 11:05 am : link
remember they won 100 games last year. The Redsox did nothing to strengthen their B.P.
There seems to be some natural ability  
Kyle in NY : 1/15/2019 11:06 am : link
at 3B that Andujar lacks. He just does not react well to the ball off the bat and his first step is pretty slow. I'm not sure how much is correctable. They could clean up his throwing motion, maybe improve his range a bit. But to go from bad to even above average defensively seems unlikely. I don't want to trade him, unless it's for a true top of the rotation starter. I think his type of hit tool is very unique and important to this lineup. But I can't see him sticking at 3B
I am of the mind  
bigbluehoya : 1/15/2019 11:08 am : link
that it's not unreasonable to believe that Andujar's value will never be higher than it is now.

That doesn't make it correct, only time will tell. But it's not a given to me that he improves defensively.
RE: let's  
Kevin(formerly Tiki4Six) : 1/15/2019 11:17 am : link
In comment 14264032 mitch300 said:
Quote:
remember they won 100 games last year. The Redsox did nothing to strengthen their B.P.



true, Didi also missed a ton of games. With that, Boston and Houston were still better, deeper in the rotation.
Boston is going to come back to Earth  
Matt in SGS : 1/15/2019 11:23 am : link
next year. They will not keep up another 108 win pace, just simply by human nature.

Beyond that, Sale is a good bet to spend time on the DL, and would it stun anyone if he's shut down at some point in 2019 with arm troubles? The same can be said for Price. With a weakened bullpen, Boston is going to drop back to the pack a bit. If the Yankees can get a full year of health out of Judge, get Sanchez back in shape, and Stanton with now familiarity of the AL, I think the Red Sox and Yankees are at the least even, with the Yankees probably a shade better. If they are able to somehow maneuver and get a trade for Kluber, by any measure, the Yankees should/would be favored over Boston.
I disagree about Andujar. I think he can be a middle of the lineup  
yatqb : 1/15/2019 11:33 am : link
Bat for us, and if he fixes his throwing motion he’ll be an adequate 3B. And he’s only 23.

As for who plays SS, it seems apparent that Torres will swing to SS when Tulo needs a day off, unless DJ can play SS, which would surprise me.

I’d prefer that we sign Machado or Harper, but Harper’s personality may not be a good fit.
I would not underestimate the  
section125 : 1/15/2019 11:35 am : link
Red Sox. If they can fall off, so can the Yanks. Sox may not win 108, but 98-100 is not unreasonable. Just like 95-98 is not unreasonable for the Yanks - nor is 102.
Yanks will really miss Didi. Yet the SPs should be better, ergo the BP should not but under the same stress and it is basically better than a year ago. A full year of Britton, should be as good if not better than DRob.

But have to wait and see what transpires healthwise in ST.
Throwing really isn't Andujar's biggest problem  
Greg from LI : 1/15/2019 11:37 am : link
Kyle hit on it - it's that his reactions to the ball off the bat always seems a step or two too slow, and I'm not sure that's something you can improve on very much.
Andujar can hit  
Dankbeerman : 1/15/2019 11:53 am : link
and he didnt just have a fluky good year he progressed solidly throughout. He can learn to take more walks and can develop further defensively or move to another spot. he is far from a finished product and hasnt maxed out his value yet
RE: Trading Andujar now  
Beer Man : 1/15/2019 11:55 am : link
In comment 14263997 Mike from SI said:
Quote:
is likely selling high so I'm all for it. Is there a chance he improves his defense and gets even better as a hitter? Of course. But I think there's a better chance his defense doesn't improve that much, meaning he's a 1B/DH.
There is also talk that he could be moved to the OF. He has been very erratic with his throws, but the line on him coming up through the system was that he has a rocket of an arm; which may work well in the OF.
RE: Throwing really isn't Andujar's biggest problem  
section125 : 1/15/2019 11:56 am : link
In comment 14264108 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
Kyle hit on it - it's that his reactions to the ball off the bat always seems a step or two too slow, and I'm not sure that's something you can improve on very much.


Eh, he took too long to throw the ball. His footwork was poor and he had to rush the ball to 1st. The arm is strong, but he takes forever to throw it. It is what ARod was working with him on over the All Star break. Hopefully he kept working over the winter.
Even if he speeds up his throwing, he's still below avg at 3B  
Greg from LI : 1/15/2019 11:57 am : link
.
RE: Even if he speeds up his throwing, he's still below avg at 3B  
section125 : 1/15/2019 12:03 pm : link
In comment 14264142 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
.


His range is ok, but if you can't make the throw to 1st, you aren't good, true. But if he corrects the throws, he isn't below average.
Starting pitching is their biggest problem  
Ron from Ninerland : 1/15/2019 12:03 pm : link
For all the hot air about Andujar, Machado, Bird and whoever else, their starting pitching may be shakier than last year. Severino is very good but he's not a true ace to the extent Sale is. After that every one is a question mark. Even Tanaka is a question mark. He has an awful lot of pitches on that arm, he doesn't have a great four seamer, and he's in such poor condition that he pulled both hamstrings running 90 feet. And then there's the elbow. When he starts to decline, it won't be gradual. He's going to fall off a cliff. After that we've got Happ who's good but probably not as good as what we saw last season, Paxton who's a question mark, and CC who's running on fumes. We'd better hope that Gray, Cessa or German can step it up. Montgomery will help when he comes back, but he's coming off TJ.
.  
Kyle in NY : 1/15/2019 12:17 pm : link
The throwing is not why Andujar grades out so poorly. He does not get to enough balls. His range is very poor. The throwing is easier to evaluate just watching the game because a ground ball out of the reach of Andujar for a single does not seem so bad. But he grades out so poorly in defensive metrics because of the range.
Is our SP worse than Boston?  
yatqb : 1/15/2019 12:18 pm : link
I’d take Sale over Sevi, but Paxton is equal to Price, Tanaka is better than Eovaldi, Porcello and Happ seem about equal, and CC and Rodriguez are a wash.

It would be great to land another ace, but we won 100 games with Sanchez out about 5 weeks, Judge missing a month and a half, no offense from 1B or C, Hicks out a bunch, Frazier missing the season, and two rookies in the infield. It’s not like we suck.
When healthy  
Kyle in NY : 1/15/2019 12:27 pm : link
and pitching at full capability, particularly Severino, I like our rotation better. But Tanaka, Paxton, and CC are health risks and I'm not sure what to expect from Severino this season. Such a significant drop off from him in the second half last season.

Boston seems content to bring back pretty much the same team next season. Not the worst idea considering the success they had. But I'm counting on some regression there.
Boston won 108 games last year...  
Dunedin81 : 1/15/2019 12:36 pm : link
their starters were better, their situational hitting was superb, their defense was much better on the whole, their BP was good enough and frankly they were better coached. But they were also healthier, in that outside of Pedroia virtually nobody lost significant time due to injury. As with 2013 they had career bests from some good but not great players, including JBJ finding his stroke for the postseason and Eovaldi and Price doing what they did. The odds that all of that will come together again and that their stars will stay healthy is pretty low. It was an 8 game gap last year, we've got a solid chance to win the division this time around.
Me too. And which Price do they get?  
yatqb : 1/15/2019 12:36 pm : link
Also, can we expect some growth from Loisiaga or German?
RE: Is our SP worse than Boston?  
Mike from SI : 1/15/2019 12:39 pm : link
In comment 14264175 yatqb said:
Quote:
I’d take Sale over Sevi, but Paxton is equal to Price, Tanaka is better than Eovaldi, Porcello and Happ seem about equal, and CC and Rodriguez are a wash.

It would be great to land another ace, but we won 100 games with Sanchez out about 5 weeks, Judge missing a month and a half, no offense from 1B or C, Hicks out a bunch, Frazier missing the season, and two rookies in the infield. It’s not like we suck.


CC and Rodriguez are not a wash. E Rod has tremendous potential; CC does not.
"Tremendous potential"?? Seriously?  
Greg from LI : 1/15/2019 12:43 pm : link
That's a mite strong, no? He's been in the league for four seasons and been roughly around league average to slightly above average.
section125  
arniefez : 1/15/2019 12:44 pm : link
I don't mean to single you out. Just making a point. Andujar's range is horrific. It's not poor it's historically bad. He's a good hitter. He's very good at covering the plate. I think he has a better chance of improving his OBP by being a little more selective than he does improving his fielding. I think he's as good as he's going to get at 3B. I don't think his trade value is very high because it's no secret he can't play defense at all. We'll see how it plays out.
RE:  
Mike from SI : 1/15/2019 12:51 pm : link
In comment 14264217 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
That's a mite strong, no? He's been in the league for four seasons and been roughly around league average to slightly above average.


Maybe a tad strong but he's a 25 year old lefty who had north of a 10 K/9 last year. He has the potential to make a leap to being a very good starter. We know what CC is.
Range factors as I understand them...  
Dunedin81 : 1/15/2019 12:59 pm : link
have to do with whether an out is recorded on a given ball, not whether the defender gets to them. So throws that are double-clutched or balls that are just eaten are treated as analogous to balls he never reaches. If his throwing improves his range factors should improve. Again, not going to be Adrian Beltre. But he doesn't have to be.
I want to keep Andujar...  
blue2 : 1/15/2019 1:23 pm : link
his bat is just to good to move as he hit .410 against curve balls last year.

Defensively I am curious with all the shifting the Yankees do how he would do playing second?
RE: Starting pitching is their biggest problem  
Deejboy : 1/15/2019 1:23 pm : link
In comment 14264152 Ron from Ninerland said:
Quote:
For all the hot air about Andujar, Machado, Bird and whoever else, their starting pitching may be shakier than last year. Severino is very good but he's not a true ace to the extent Sale is. After that every one is a question mark. Even Tanaka is a question mark. He has an awful lot of pitches on that arm, he doesn't have a great four seamer, and he's in such poor condition that he pulled both hamstrings running 90 feet. And then there's the elbow. When he starts to decline, it won't be gradual. He's going to fall off a cliff. After that we've got Happ who's good but probably not as good as what we saw last season, Paxton who's a question mark, and CC who's running on fumes. We'd better hope that Gray, Cessa or German can step it up. Montgomery will help when he comes back, but he's coming off TJ.

It's weird that you are concerned about Tanaka's health and consider him a question mark but say nothing about Sale's shoulder which wrecked his second half and is a massive concern for him going forward. And you are taking shots at Tanaka's "condition" cause of his baserunning? WTF? Happ was luckier with the Yankees. His peripherals between the Blue Jays and the Yankees were pretty similar and Happ has been one of the most consistent pitchers in baseball for a while. He is not going to come back to earth cause he is what he is. A very solid #3 starter. And how exactly is a LHP in his prime with a career 3.13 FIP in Paxson a question mark? For reference Patrick Corbin has a career 3.65 FIP and is getting 6 years based on 1 great year.

You couldn't be more negative about the Yankees starting pitching if you were the most biased and brain dead Red Sox fan ever. Congrats.
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