Let me start by saying, I'm a huge Gettleman fan. I think he has a strong history of drafting and finding quality players in mid rounds in the draft and his pro personnel knowledge, according to Mara is "second to none" in the NFL. I also just love how open he is with the media, which is in complete contrast to what Reese was. And last, hes' just flat out hillarious....a real character and just entertaining to listen to. Yes, he's definitely made some mistakes...but no GM bats .1000. That being said.....
I've watched his press conferences in Carolina and went back and read about his moves there, so I have a good sense of the tough decisions that he made and what "could" equate to what he's going to do this off-season. Anything is possible, but if you read into his tendencies in Carolina and really listen to what he says...you can draw some conclusions to what he's going to do. If I were a betting man, I'm guessing he does the following in the offseason:
1) I think he cuts Jackrabbit. He rebuilt the CB's in Carolina after letting Josh Norman walk and he fully thinks you can draft CB's in mid rounds and develop them into starting CB's. In 2016 he drafted CB's in rounds 2, 3 and 4. Bradberry, Worley and Zack Sanchez. Sanchez proved to be a bust...but Worley and Bradberry have turned into good NFL CB's. He drafted another one in the 5th round in 2017. I like Jackrabbit, but he'll be 31 next year....and when it comes to it, he's not going to cut a pass rusher in Vernon....and its more of a need at this point. It saves the Giants alot of money against the cap, as Jenkins has been paid all of his guaranteed $$. And if he holds true to his belief that if you have a number of good pass rushers, then you can get by with average to above average CB's. I see him going with Beal, Grant Haley, a veteran FA CB, maybe BW Webb and I think he drafts 1-2 CB's.
2) He'll sign a pass rusher in Free Agency, keep Vernon and draft at least 1 pass rusher. This is a no brainer.
Maybe he can get Vernon to restructure....I doubt it and it probably isn't a good longer term move to do it...but I don't see him parting ways with him. I also think he drafts a 1 technique in mid rounds to be a solid backup and work into the rotation with Tomlinson. Neville Gallimore from Oklahoma comes to mind.
3) He signs Daryl Williams to play RT and Tyrann Matthieu to join the secondary. Many beat reporters have reported this and it makes too much sense. Betcher knows Honey Badger well, Matthieu knows the system. If there isn't a locker room/culture concern....this makes alot of sense. (if he doesn't cost too much) We need playmakers and Matthieu can play in the slot, and some safety....will be a nice compliment to Collins. And Williams was drafted by Gettleman in the 4th round in Carolina....it just makes too much sense at its arguably the biggest need on the team.
I also think signing UFA Devin Funchess WR, from Carolina is a possibility. Gettleman is a big Funchess fan (another draft pick), and as long as he doesn't command too much $$; he's that WR that can catch 40-50 balls. (Eric brought this up the other day about Latimer...can he catch 40-50 balls?) Funchess will cost more, so this is a factor.
4) He signs Landon Collins to a fair long term deal. Kid has limitations in coverage, but he's damn good player and plays the games the way its supposed to be played. He's only 24...it would be a mistake to move on him and it seems like its getting harder and harder to find quality safeties.
5) Eli - not sure what to think here. Part of me thinks he comes back, due to the endorsement from Shurmur....but not at a $23 cap hit. You can argue that he makes what QB's make....but he doesn't win games like he used to. Rivers, Big Ben, Nick Foles can demand the high salary as they're getting their teams to the playoffs...Manning just hasn't.
6) OBJ - very outside chance that he could get traded...but very unlikely. He would free up alot of $$ to put the Giants in better long term financial health. At this point, even though I've loved OBJ, I would prefer to build the team around Saquon. Will be interesting to see what happens here.
Thoughts?
In 2015 took LB Shaq Thompson in the 1st round even though he already had LB Luke Kuechley and LB Thomas Davis.
In 2016 he took DT Vernon Butler in the 1st round when he already had DT Star Lotulelei and DT Kawann Short.
So we should expect a RB at #6! :-)
2. He’s gonna role with Halapio at C. He likes him and thinks that it was just a lost season to injury.
3. Jamon Brown will get competition. I don’t think he’ll place much of a premium on who that competition will be though. Maybe a 3rd round G.
4. I agree that Jackrabbit is the odd man out. Getting older. Had some tough stretches this season. Corners regress suddenly. You’re better moving on early.
5. Eli either takes a pay cut or is no longer a Giant. Gettleman won’t let himself be hamstrung by Eli’s cap # at the current level of production.
Finally. I don’t think the door is at all closed on a Beckham trade. If Sam Fran were to offer something like the #2, a 2020 2nd, and QB Nick Mullens I’d take it.
Year 1:
'Setting the stage'.
Cut Vernon.
Hire the very best Center in free agency.
Use Manning as a fort holder, to enable taking advantage of this draft. Jackrabbit stays.
Role players on both sides stay for now, short contracts, no bank breakers.
Collins may go.
2019 Draft - almost all defense
Trades give you:
6
35
38
58
88
120
(Whatever the case is, loosing 5 net, adding second rounder, moving up in mid rounds)
6-DL/DT,
35-OLB/DE,
38-FS or ILB
68-ILB or FS
88 (OG/OT or ILB or FS two each),
120-OT/TE
_________
2020
By 2020 you know who among the lesser role players on O have thrived in this system. Add, through free agency, specific types WRs if needed, TE if needed, etc.
Trade all your picks, if needed, to move up in the 2020 draft for the QB.
If there are any left those are for O talent.
Mannings last season , transition year .
The club has not been happy with his work ethic or production.
I severely doubt Gettleman will look at a guy like that as a reclamation project
If you are looking at who Gettleman could bring in, I would include FS Tre Boston (drafted by Gettleman) as an option.
No team can have stars at every position, because in the cap era, no team can afford to pay that many stars. You need some elite players, some very good players, and some average players -- plus coaching that masks the shortcomings of the average players and puts everybody in a good position to excel. If the Giants had been able to field an average center, right guard and right tackle for the entire season, they probably would have had a much better record. If they'd had an average pass rush they would have had a much better defense.
A few teams are able to get really loaded with talent for a while, like Seattle at their peak, partly because they have a cheap young QB freeing up cap space, partly because they get lucky in the draft (Russell Wilson and Richard Sherman were steals.). But they can't keep those collections of talent together for a long time.
The OP Andy in Boston is probably right that DG thinks you can win with a great pass rush and average corners. But let's think through what "average" means. If there are 64 starting cornerbacks in the league. "Average" means guys probably in the 28-40 range. The 40th-best cornerback in the NFL is a helluva football player. I haven't done any kind of a ranking but I bet Prince Amukamara is at about that level these days. The Bears did just fine with him. He may have been overdrafted but that's not the Bears' problem.
So that's a perfectly reasonable plan: Choose areas where you want to shoot for elite players, like pass rush and line, and build those up. If you end up average at other positions, that's fine. Just don't end up BAD at other positions.
1-- The GM thought the Gmen were good enough to be a playoff team this past year. This idiocy has me concerned.
2-- The idiocy led to grossly overpaying for an older LT and trading for Ogeltree and signing Omameh. The real stupid thing was that he thought signing an older LT who was pretty good and one subpar G in omamaeh was better than getting two your OLinemen. Simple math. Two pretty good players is beter than oen good player and one who stinks.
3-- The comments he made about the qb. Analytics is important - I understand you can't be making 100% decisions wiht it-- but his comments were dumb.
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If they love a QB at 6 the decisions are easy. If not then I'm open to nearly anything. **If they love the QB at 6 you take him and you have Mitch Morse and one of the the top3 RT's -then after than you can have two year run of drafting a lot of defense from 2019 to 2020 with are pick here or there for OL, WR and TE.
and in 2020 for FA you can pick up a good defensive player or 2.
The OP Andy in Boston is probably right that DG thinks you can win with a great pass rush and average corners. But let's think through what "average" means. If there are 64 starting cornerbacks in the league. "Average" means guys probably in the 28-40 range. The 40th-best cornerback in the NFL is a helluva football player. I haven't done any kind of a ranking but I bet Prince Amukamara is at about that level these days. The Bears did just fine with him. He may have been overdrafted but that's not the Bears' problem.
So that's a perfectly reasonable plan: Choose areas where you want to shoot for elite players, like pass rush and line, and build those up. If you end up average at other positions, that's fine. Just don't end up BAD at other positions.
This isn't really theory. The giants won twice that way. Pass rush first, corners secondary to that. Prince Amukamara is a better player now than he was as a Giant, and he was good enough to win with as a starting CB in 2011.
DG has to have a much better FAcy year, than the last one...'nuff said on that....
Jenkins is a huge question mark....he is the only viable corner on the team....cutting him saves money, but creates another huge hole, on a team already full of them....But the one thing that bothers me about Jenkins is, his play seems to depend on the play of the whole team....when the whole defense is playing ok, so does he....but when it doesn't his game goes south as well...
As for OV, he is one of those tempting guys.....when healthy he is a playah.....unfortunately, he just seems to come up with an injury every year for us....and can Bettcher teach him to contain? Cutting him would create another hole....
Cutting OV or Jenkins, creates cap space that would be needed for their replacements....
As far as cap space goes, we may have enough, for one, possibly two top free agents, only....
And I don't think you can give Collins top money, with his limitations....
As for Manning, I think we are stuck with him, if DG/Shurm want to see a better record this season....because there is really no option out there.....think Foles would have had led us to a better season this year if we had him behind this OL? I don't.....and to get him this coming season will be costly....
I am in favor of cutting Eli before March, and using that money elsewhere, mainly because this team is not going anywhere next season.....and there is no reason to extend Eli.....yes we may have a worse record than this season, but having a cap hit of 23M, instead of 6M, just does not make sense if this team is not a real contender for next season....but I don't think the Giants have the gonads to do it....
If they are even remotely thinking of trading OBj, than DG should be immediately fired.....then they should have franchised him, instead....
DG did not come into a good situation......but I think he has tried to compromise too much.....I don't mind losing, if in the process we are getting building blocks for the future......but if you draft a RB, and you take two years or more to get an OL in front of him, and don't have a QB to play along side of him, why draft a RB? How is that any different than the approach we have had the previous 5 seasons where we had the mentality of "we are only one or two players away"?
We're there really people with the mentality that we were "only one or two players away" the last five years? At a minimum we needed five new oline men 4 of those years.
Quote:
DG needs to have a successful draft.....but even with that, drafted players do not usually have an immediate impact, unless the are high picks that are no brainers like Barkley, or guys who were thought to be good, but were better than expected, like OBj....guys like Hernandez, got better as the season progressed....others may be starters, but not impact players, that may take several years to reach their potential....or never reach it....
DG has to have a much better FAcy year, than the last one...'nuff said on that....
Jenkins is a huge question mark....he is the only viable corner on the team....cutting him saves money, but creates another huge hole, on a team already full of them....But the one thing that bothers me about Jenkins is, his play seems to depend on the play of the whole team....when the whole defense is playing ok, so does he....but when it doesn't his game goes south as well...
As for OV, he is one of those tempting guys.....when healthy he is a playah.....unfortunately, he just seems to come up with an injury every year for us....and can Bettcher teach him to contain? Cutting him would create another hole....
Cutting OV or Jenkins, creates cap space that would be needed for their replacements....
As far as cap space goes, we may have enough, for one, possibly two top free agents, only....
And I don't think you can give Collins top money, with his limitations....
As for Manning, I think we are stuck with him, if DG/Shurm want to see a better record this season....because there is really no option out there.....think Foles would have had led us to a better season this year if we had him behind this OL? I don't.....and to get him this coming season will be costly....
I am in favor of cutting Eli before March, and using that money elsewhere, mainly because this team is not going anywhere next season.....and there is no reason to extend Eli.....yes we may have a worse record than this season, but having a cap hit of 23M, instead of 6M, just does not make sense if this team is not a real contender for next season....but I don't think the Giants have the gonads to do it....
If they are even remotely thinking of trading OBj, than DG should be immediately fired.....then they should have franchised him, instead....
DG did not come into a good situation......but I think he has tried to compromise too much.....I don't mind losing, if in the process we are getting building blocks for the future......but if you draft a RB, and you take two years or more to get an OL in front of him, and don't have a QB to play along side of him, why draft a RB? How is that any different than the approach we have had the previous 5 seasons where we had the mentality of "we are only one or two players away"?
We're there really people with the mentality that we were "only one or two players away" the last five years? At a minimum we needed five new oline men 4 of those years.
Yes.
Gettleman.
I agree. Vernon isn't very effective even when healthy. I know we need pass rushers but Vernon doesn't produce nearly what he is getting paid. Draft an ER or look for a cheaper guy in F/A.