Has the Giants taking Haskins at #6, Murray almost falling out of the 1st round, and Josh Jacobs going in the top 5...among other surprises. Mock Draft - ( New Window )
same with Devin White. If either could be had at 12, I'd love to see them trade down with Green Bay. Swap picks with them, plus get their other #1 from New Orleans and a 3rd rounder as well. Giants have a ton of holes to fill, and the more picks in the earlier rounds of the draft the better.
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
Mine. I have us taking Devin White :D
Starting to warm to the idea of White. If we can't get Allen this guy seems like a play maker. We need to add top talent at all the LB positions. Could still get an EDGE guy in round 2.
I'm fine with White if he can cover. I have no issue with that. I just want to say that the one position in football that never seems to last in the draft is edge guys. They go quick and often. I don't think it is as simple as saying we can get an edge guy in the second. I'm not saying we force it early either but rather we may not have legit options at the rest of our picks especially with all the teams in frint of us needing edge help as well.
Getting a lot of hype lately, there's probably something to it.
If I am not mistaken, Hockenson is a surprise for most to this draft. Fant and a few others seemed like the cream of the crop. But Hickenson seems to have catapulted to the top. This is actually a good TE draft imo.
Getting a lot of hype lately, there's probably something to it.
If I am not mistaken, Hockenson is a surprise for most to this draft. Fant and a few others seemed like the cream of the crop. But Hickenson seems to have catapulted to the top. This is actually a good TE draft imo.
I'm kind of amazed that a school like Iowa can consistently crank out elite tight ends. Dallas Clark back in the day. Now George Kittle into both Fant and Hock.
And I respect it. As I respect Dan more than any guy put there now that Mayock is out.
Some picks that aren't "normal" but wouldn't you rather see some creativity and independent thinking? Rather than a bunch of dudes that literally just copy each other?
When was the last time two TEs from the same team were selected in the first? ;)
I hope it’s to the Giants at 6. He can just do it all.
I would put money on him not being a top 25 pick if I was able to. Lots of it.
If you're the guy who picks him, and he busts, you look like an idiot. You never live it down, and you spent an early pick on him, you probably lose your job and have trouble getting another. I think you're right that the risk is less later in the round. He's a huge gamble, despite his obvious skills and talent, but less so later in the first.
more than the other “draft gurus”. I agree with Sy that he thinks independently. In fact, I was waiting for a running back to crack the top 10. It has been the trend for the past few years. I would say this. If Dave Gettleman and Pat Shurmur take Haskins, I’m feeling good about the pick. They are not going to take Haskins, just because they need to find Eli’s successor. My preference is to get one of these edge rushers at #6, although Devin White would be an intriguing selection that the Giants have not experienced in a long time at the LB position.
that Gettleman is a little nervous about taking a QB. If it’s this draft or the next odds are he will have to spend a lot to move up and get the next QB. It can absolutely be the death of a GM if he gets it wrong. The alternative is signing a Foles/Bridgwater type this year or next, which may alleviate some pressure but probably won’t improve the QB spot all that much. Hopefully I am way off base and he makes a move at some point, I don’t know where the QBs will actually fall but being at 6 they really need to think about going up to get Haskins if he grades out. If we pick at 12 next year it is gonna cost an absolute fortune to move up. The draft order is usually very tight, how much would we have dropped if we beat the Cowboys?
I tend to agree. Outside of one play in the National Championship where Ferrell bull rushed Jonah Williams and knocked him flat on his behind, I think Williams got the best of him in that game. And I've read that Williams is better suited at OG than OT in the pros.
I'm fine with White if he can cover. I have no issue with that. I just want to say that the one position in football that never seems to last in the draft is edge guys. They go quick and often. I don't think it is as simple as saying we can get an edge guy in the second. I'm not saying we force it early either but rather we may not have legit options at the rest of our picks especially with all the teams in frint of us needing edge help as well.
I was agreeing with your statement about edge rushers, but then it occurred to me that both Strahan and Osi were taken in the 2nd round, lower than where the Giants currently pick in RD 2.
I'm fine with White if he can cover. I have no issue with that. I just want to say that the one position in football that never seems to last in the draft is edge guys. They go quick and often. I don't think it is as simple as saying we can get an edge guy in the second. I'm not saying we force it early either but rather we may not have legit options at the rest of our picks especially with all the teams in frint of us needing edge help as well.
I was agreeing with your statement about edge rushers, but then it occurred to me that both Strahan and Osi were taken in the 2nd round, lower than where the Giants currently pick in RD 2.
The draft order is usually very tight, how much would we have dropped if we beat the Cowboys?
Per Tankathon, four spots to #10.
I have seen this several times on this board but it is incorrect. The Giants would have gone to 6-10 but you also have to modify their SOS because we have to consider that DAL picks up a loss instead of a win (and we play them twice).
The Giants opps were 135-121 with what actually occured (Giants loss). (.527)
If the Giants beat DAL their opps would have been 133-123. (.520)
The draft order is usually very tight, how much would we have dropped if we beat the Cowboys?
Per Tankathon, four spots to #10.
I have seen this several times on this board but it is incorrect. The Giants would have gone to 6-10 but you also have to modify their SOS because we have to consider that DAL picks up a loss instead of a win (and we play them twice).
The Giants opps were 135-121 with what actually occured (Giants loss). (.527)
If the Giants beat DAL their opps would have been 133-123. (.520)
BUF and DEN were 134-122. (.523)
So the Giants would have picked 8th.
Thanks ray. For some reason, I had it in my head that the SOS for NYG would go the other way.
Like you, I post things looking for corrections, so appreciate.
If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
I keep seeing this Watkins pick here. Wtf are you talking about?
I'm a big fan of Christian WILKINS, DT from Clemson, but have no idea who Watkins is.
Relax, it's just a typo.
I don't know if it was you or someone else bringing up Watkins in another thread and it honestly was driving me crazy as I thought I was missing this great prospect. Not bashing you, sorry I came off harsh.
Although I am a stickler for getting names right. Would always drive me crazy when posters would refer to Nicks as Hicks, Beckham as Beckum, and Shurmur as Schumer or Shermer or any of the other crazy spellings I've seen here.
By the way I really like Watkins. I think he'd be a great fit on this team as a 3-4 end, and I like him more than Ferrell.
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
I keep seeing this Watkins pick here. Wtf are you talking about?
I'm a big fan of Christian WILKINS, DT from Clemson, but have no idea who Watkins is.
Relax, it's just a typo.
I don't know if it was you or someone else bringing up Watkins in another thread and it honestly was driving me crazy as I thought I was missing this great prospect. Not bashing you, sorry I came off harsh.
Although I am a stickler for getting names right. Would always drive me crazy when posters would refer to Nicks as Hicks, Beckham as Beckum, and Shurmur as Schumer or Shermer or any of the other crazy spellings I've seen here.
By the way I really like Watkins. I think he'd be a great fit on this team as a 3-4 end, and I like him more than Ferrell.
WILKINS DAMMIT! Now you have me doing it, lmao. As soon as I go on a rant.
I hope it’s to the Giants at 6. He can just do it all.
I would put money on him not being a top 25 pick if I was able to. Lots of it.
The Murray fanatics are convinced he’s the best ever. You won’t sway them.
I still would take that bet. Some team is gonna love him, didn’t Tebow go in the top 25? He can definitely play, but I personally would rather the Giants not take that risk
RE: lol what kind of stupid team in need of a QB Â
The Bucs’ “need” at QB is much more ambiguous than the Giants’, since it’s anyone’s guess what they really plan to do with Winston. For the Giants, the only question is whether they see the need as urgent or eventual. There are plenty of possible arguments against a QB at #6 (other needs, faith in Eli, weak QB class, etc.) But if they have a QB on the top tier of their board when they go on the clock, it will be hard not to go for it. Would it be Haskins? Who knows? Was Baker Mayfield the top-rated QB on many boards last January?
RE: RE: lol what kind of stupid team in need of a QB Â
The Bucs’ “need” at QB is much more ambiguous than the Giants’, since it’s anyone’s guess what they really plan to do with Winston. For the Giants, the only question is whether they see the need as urgent or eventual. There are plenty of possible arguments against a QB at #6 (other needs, faith in Eli, weak QB class, etc.) But if they have a QB on the top tier of their board when they go on the clock, it will be hard not to go for it. Would it be Haskins? Who knows? Was Baker Mayfield the top-rated QB on many boards last January?
For all we know, Mayfield might have been their choice over Barkley if Cleveland took Darnold. I doubt it, but I have zero idea what Shurmur thought of Mayfield
Interesting to look at his first version from exactly a year ago to see the level of accuracy. He had Barkley coming to us, but had Darnold going #1. He switched to Mayfield as No. 1 in his last and final version.
If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
.
I think Haskins would have went in the second round in
last year's draft. I think Murray should go in the
2nd Rd. this year, but with all the hype, someone will
take him in the first round is my guess.
RE: RE: RE: Best keep your distance from Haskins Â
If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
.
I think Haskins would have went in the second round in
last year's draft. I think Murray should go in the
2nd Rd. this year, but with all the hype, someone will
take him in the first round is my guess.
I disagree I think Haskins would have gone before Lamar Jackson and that there is a very good chance that either NE or Pittsburgh would have taken him.
If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
Ok so what are the concerns? Didn't say he "never faced pressure". Never said I was scouting, was just giving my opinion, I watched highlights, personally I'm not impressed, but I also hate tacos in flour tortillas, doesn't mean I'm right lol
Reality is, a lot of times teams feel forced to draft a QB because they have to, see Bortles!! All I'm saying is I don't think he's worth the 6th overall pick (or first QB taken). He wouldn't've been last year and he wouldn't be next year. But, please tell me what some of your concerns are? I'd love to hear them.
An interesting question with Murray, similar to Lamar Jackson Â
If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
I don’t think he will play as a 2nd rounder, he’s make just as much guaranteed playing for the As. He’s going to either be taken in the first to almost double (or more) his guarantees compared to being a second rounder, or play baseball.
I could be wrong of course, none of us truly know which sport he prefers, but from a money standpoint it doesn’t make much sense if he isn’t a 1st rounder. And yes I’d trade up for him at the end of the first.
If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
Ok so what are the concerns? Didn't say he "never faced pressure". Never said I was scouting, was just giving my opinion, I watched highlights, personally I'm not impressed, but I also hate tacos in flour tortillas, doesn't mean I'm right lol
Reality is, a lot of times teams feel forced to draft a QB because they have to, see Bortles!! All I'm saying is I don't think he's worth the 6th overall pick (or first QB taken). He wouldn't've been last year and he wouldn't be next year. But, please tell me what some of your concerns are? I'd love to hear them.
I think your concerns about only playing 1 year if college is pretty well founded although it can be misleading. He’d be a fool to play another year given he is a guaranteed first rounder right now. If he doesn’t pass the eye test for you it’s pretty much the best way to judge him, you either like a QB or you don’t. I didn’t mean to come across smug when talking about his oline and pressure he has faced. Sorry if it came across that way. I don’t know what my opinion of Haskins is yet. I think he is worth the risk if you believe in him, his stats and level of play this year is pretty undeniable. I still like Jones a great deal, but I acknowledge a lot of the concerns on him. Haskins is a really good prospect that a GM will have to make a decision on with less than usual amount of film on.
RE: RE: An interesting question with Murray, similar to Lamar Jackson Â
If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
I don’t think he will play as a 2nd rounder, he’s make just as much guaranteed playing for the As. He’s going to either be taken in the first to almost double (or more) his guarantees compared to being a second rounder, or play baseball.
I could be wrong of course, none of us truly know which sport he prefers, but from a money standpoint it doesn’t make much sense if he isn’t a 1st rounder. And yes I’d trade up for him at the end of the first.
I’ve read that he would still make more as a second round pick but it’s pretty close. He will make money quicker in the NFL than he would MLB. But I think you are right that if he doesn’t go 1st round he will pick the sport he wants to play more. That being said he can pretty much definitely play four years of football and if he busts go play baseball, he can’t do it the other way.
RE: An interesting question with Murray, similar to Lamar Jackson Â
If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
RE: RE: An interesting question with Murray, similar to Lamar Jackson Â
If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
I read somewhere the Giants have a total of 11 picks this year.
Including 3 in the 4th and 4 in the 5th and 2 in the 7th
RE: RE: RE: An interesting question with Murray, similar to Lamar Jackson Â
If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
I read somewhere the Giants have a total of 11 picks this year.
Including 3 in the 4th and 3 in the 5th and 2 in the 7th
Quote:
In comment 14267828 AcidTest said:
Quote:
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
Mine. I have us taking Devin White :D
Starting to warm to the idea of White. If we can't get Allen this guy seems like a play maker. We need to add top talent at all the LB positions. Could still get an EDGE guy in round 2.
I'm fine with White if he can cover. I have no issue with that. I just want to say that the one position in football that never seems to last in the draft is edge guys. They go quick and often. I don't think it is as simple as saying we can get an edge guy in the second. I'm not saying we force it early either but rather we may not have legit options at the rest of our picks especially with all the teams in frint of us needing edge help as well.
Quote:
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
I keep seeing this Watkins pick here. Wtf are you talking about?
I'm a big fan of Christian WILKINS, DT from Clemson, but have no idea who Watkins is.
Relax, it's just a typo.
If I am not mistaken, Hockenson is a surprise for most to this draft. Fant and a few others seemed like the cream of the crop. But Hickenson seems to have catapulted to the top. This is actually a good TE draft imo.
Quote:
Getting a lot of hype lately, there's probably something to it.
If I am not mistaken, Hockenson is a surprise for most to this draft. Fant and a few others seemed like the cream of the crop. But Hickenson seems to have catapulted to the top. This is actually a good TE draft imo.
I'm kind of amazed that a school like Iowa can consistently crank out elite tight ends. Dallas Clark back in the day. Now George Kittle into both Fant and Hock.
Some picks that aren't "normal" but wouldn't you rather see some creativity and independent thinking? Rather than a bunch of dudes that literally just copy each other?
When was the last time two TEs from the same team were selected in the first? ;)
Quote:
I hope it’s to the Giants at 6. He can just do it all.
I would put money on him not being a top 25 pick if I was able to. Lots of it.
I tend to agree. Outside of one play in the National Championship where Ferrell bull rushed Jonah Williams and knocked him flat on his behind, I think Williams got the best of him in that game. And I've read that Williams is better suited at OG than OT in the pros.
He a Kamara clone. He will go in the first just because how Kamara changed the Saints offense
Per Tankathon, four spots to #10.
Jags, Lions, Bills, Broncs would have jumped us. Jags and Broncs in the QB-need club.
tank you - ( New Window )
DE or OL could be the pick at 6 as one of them might be a better value, but it's hard to argue that there's a bigger need than QB.
Eli is 38. Fans need to think long-term not just for next year.
OL (specifically RT) can be found either in FA or in RD 2.
My guess is that with their premium picks in RDs 1 and 2 and thru FA, they address their three biggest needs... QB, edge rusher and RT.
After that, all the other picks should be BPA.
I was agreeing with your statement about edge rushers, but then it occurred to me that both Strahan and Osi were taken in the 2nd round, lower than where the Giants currently pick in RD 2.
We should be so lucky again ;>)
Quote:
I'm fine with White if he can cover. I have no issue with that. I just want to say that the one position in football that never seems to last in the draft is edge guys. They go quick and often. I don't think it is as simple as saying we can get an edge guy in the second. I'm not saying we force it early either but rather we may not have legit options at the rest of our picks especially with all the teams in frint of us needing edge help as well.
I was agreeing with your statement about edge rushers, but then it occurred to me that both Strahan and Osi were taken in the 2nd round, lower than where the Giants currently pick in RD 2.
We should be so lucky again ;>)
I'm talking more recently. Yes, we'd be so lucky.
Quote:
The draft order is usually very tight, how much would we have dropped if we beat the Cowboys?
Per Tankathon, four spots to #10.
I have seen this several times on this board but it is incorrect. The Giants would have gone to 6-10 but you also have to modify their SOS because we have to consider that DAL picks up a loss instead of a win (and we play them twice).
The Giants opps were 135-121 with what actually occured (Giants loss). (.527)
If the Giants beat DAL their opps would have been 133-123. (.520)
BUF and DEN were 134-122. (.523)
So the Giants would have picked 8th.
Quote:
In comment 14267966 mattyblue said:
Quote:
The draft order is usually very tight, how much would we have dropped if we beat the Cowboys?
Per Tankathon, four spots to #10.
I have seen this several times on this board but it is incorrect. The Giants would have gone to 6-10 but you also have to modify their SOS because we have to consider that DAL picks up a loss instead of a win (and we play them twice).
The Giants opps were 135-121 with what actually occured (Giants loss). (.527)
If the Giants beat DAL their opps would have been 133-123. (.520)
BUF and DEN were 134-122. (.523)
So the Giants would have picked 8th.
Thanks ray. For some reason, I had it in my head that the SOS for NYG would go the other way.
Like you, I post things looking for corrections, so appreciate.
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
Quote:
In comment 14267828 AcidTest said:
Quote:
there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
I keep seeing this Watkins pick here. Wtf are you talking about?
I'm a big fan of Christian WILKINS, DT from Clemson, but have no idea who Watkins is.
Relax, it's just a typo.
I don't know if it was you or someone else bringing up Watkins in another thread and it honestly was driving me crazy as I thought I was missing this great prospect. Not bashing you, sorry I came off harsh.
Although I am a stickler for getting names right. Would always drive me crazy when posters would refer to Nicks as Hicks, Beckham as Beckum, and Shurmur as Schumer or Shermer or any of the other crazy spellings I've seen here.
By the way I really like Watkins. I think he'd be a great fit on this team as a 3-4 end, and I like him more than Ferrell.
Quote:
In comment 14267853 allstarjim said:
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In comment 14267828 AcidTest said:
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there a mock draft that doesn't have us taking Haskins?
Right now, and it's verrrrrry early, I'd say Watkins.
I keep seeing this Watkins pick here. Wtf are you talking about?
I'm a big fan of Christian WILKINS, DT from Clemson, but have no idea who Watkins is.
Relax, it's just a typo.
I don't know if it was you or someone else bringing up Watkins in another thread and it honestly was driving me crazy as I thought I was missing this great prospect. Not bashing you, sorry I came off harsh.
Although I am a stickler for getting names right. Would always drive me crazy when posters would refer to Nicks as Hicks, Beckham as Beckum, and Shurmur as Schumer or Shermer or any of the other crazy spellings I've seen here.
By the way I really like Watkins. I think he'd be a great fit on this team as a 3-4 end, and I like him more than Ferrell.
WILKINS DAMMIT! Now you have me doing it, lmao. As soon as I go on a rant.
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I hope it’s to the Giants at 6. He can just do it all.
I would put money on him not being a top 25 pick if I was able to. Lots of it.
The Murray fanatics are convinced he’s the best ever. You won’t sway them.
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In comment 14267895 Giant John said:
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I hope it’s to the Giants at 6. He can just do it all.
I would put money on him not being a top 25 pick if I was able to. Lots of it.
The Murray fanatics are convinced he’s the best ever. You won’t sway them.
I still would take that bet. Some team is gonna love him, didn’t Tebow go in the top 25? He can definitely play, but I personally would rather the Giants not take that risk
The Bucs’ “need” at QB is much more ambiguous than the Giants’, since it’s anyone’s guess what they really plan to do with Winston. For the Giants, the only question is whether they see the need as urgent or eventual. There are plenty of possible arguments against a QB at #6 (other needs, faith in Eli, weak QB class, etc.) But if they have a QB on the top tier of their board when they go on the clock, it will be hard not to go for it. Would it be Haskins? Who knows? Was Baker Mayfield the top-rated QB on many boards last January?
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would take a RB in the Top 5?
I see what you did there. Well played, Sir.
The Bucs’ “need” at QB is much more ambiguous than the Giants’, since it’s anyone’s guess what they really plan to do with Winston. For the Giants, the only question is whether they see the need as urgent or eventual. There are plenty of possible arguments against a QB at #6 (other needs, faith in Eli, weak QB class, etc.) But if they have a QB on the top tier of their board when they go on the clock, it will be hard not to go for it. Would it be Haskins? Who knows? Was Baker Mayfield the top-rated QB on many boards last January?
For all we know, Mayfield might have been their choice over Barkley if Cleveland took Darnold. I doubt it, but I have zero idea what Shurmur thought of Mayfield
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000908233/article/jeremiah-mock-draft-10-browns-jets-fins-redskins-take-qb
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
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If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
I think Haskins would have went in the second round in
last year's draft. I think Murray should go in the
2nd Rd. this year, but with all the hype, someone will
take him in the first round is my guess.
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In comment 14268110 fanofthejets said:
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If you group Haskins in with the 2018 QB class around draft day he would've probably gone after Mason Rudolph. Just because you're the best of a sketchy lot doesn't mean you're deserving of such a high value pick. Wait until 2020 and use 2019 to address other areas
I don't see that high an upside with Haskins. As of now you can see how raw he is all around. The processing speed in terms of progressions needs to get better (among other things) he also isn't the best QB when things get chaotic around him and the pressure comes
He wouldn't have gone after Rudolph that's absurd. It isn't a strong class but that doesn't mean that Haskins doesn't have a high upside. The 2017 class wasn't considered strong either.
.
I think Haskins would have went in the second round in
last year's draft. I think Murray should go in the
2nd Rd. this year, but with all the hype, someone will
take him in the first round is my guess.
I disagree I think Haskins would have gone before Lamar Jackson and that there is a very good chance that either NE or Pittsburgh would have taken him.
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
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If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
Ok so what are the concerns? Didn't say he "never faced pressure". Never said I was scouting, was just giving my opinion, I watched highlights, personally I'm not impressed, but I also hate tacos in flour tortillas, doesn't mean I'm right lol
Reality is, a lot of times teams feel forced to draft a QB because they have to, see Bortles!! All I'm saying is I don't think he's worth the 6th overall pick (or first QB taken). He wouldn't've been last year and he wouldn't be next year. But, please tell me what some of your concerns are? I'd love to hear them.
I don’t think he will play as a 2nd rounder, he’s make just as much guaranteed playing for the As. He’s going to either be taken in the first to almost double (or more) his guarantees compared to being a second rounder, or play baseball.
I could be wrong of course, none of us truly know which sport he prefers, but from a money standpoint it doesn’t make much sense if he isn’t a 1st rounder. And yes I’d trade up for him at the end of the first.
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In comment 14268381 HumbleGiant said:
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If Allen is gone, White would be the pick. If they are both gone, trade down if possible. I'm sure I'm in the minority that doesn't like Haskins, but there's just not enough there. Plus, he had a clean pocket almost every highlight. No one near him, ever! I just cant see us spending a 6th overall pick with only one season as a career. Not for a QB, no way!
That’s kind of not true. Watch the Penn St game that pocket collapsed a great deal, he made moves with his legs, and he brought his team back I believe. It just becomes a thing everyone says “he never faced pressure” “his receivers were always wide open”, etc.. none of that matter or is true. He played incredible football and you don’t scout a football player on what his line is doing. There have been way better o lines in college football and QBs still come no where near throwing 70% with 50 TDS. Those stats are insane and he has a great deal to offer as a prospect. There is reasons for concern with him it’s just not the ones you point out.
Ok so what are the concerns? Didn't say he "never faced pressure". Never said I was scouting, was just giving my opinion, I watched highlights, personally I'm not impressed, but I also hate tacos in flour tortillas, doesn't mean I'm right lol
Reality is, a lot of times teams feel forced to draft a QB because they have to, see Bortles!! All I'm saying is I don't think he's worth the 6th overall pick (or first QB taken). He wouldn't've been last year and he wouldn't be next year. But, please tell me what some of your concerns are? I'd love to hear them.
I think your concerns about only playing 1 year if college is pretty well founded although it can be misleading. He’d be a fool to play another year given he is a guaranteed first rounder right now. If he doesn’t pass the eye test for you it’s pretty much the best way to judge him, you either like a QB or you don’t. I didn’t mean to come across smug when talking about his oline and pressure he has faced. Sorry if it came across that way. I don’t know what my opinion of Haskins is yet. I think he is worth the risk if you believe in him, his stats and level of play this year is pretty undeniable. I still like Jones a great deal, but I acknowledge a lot of the concerns on him. Haskins is a really good prospect that a GM will have to make a decision on with less than usual amount of film on.
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If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
I don’t think he will play as a 2nd rounder, he’s make just as much guaranteed playing for the As. He’s going to either be taken in the first to almost double (or more) his guarantees compared to being a second rounder, or play baseball.
I could be wrong of course, none of us truly know which sport he prefers, but from a money standpoint it doesn’t make much sense if he isn’t a 1st rounder. And yes I’d trade up for him at the end of the first.
I’ve read that he would still make more as a second round pick but it’s pretty close. He will make money quicker in the NFL than he would MLB. But I think you are right that if he doesn’t go 1st round he will pick the sport he wants to play more. That being said he can pretty much definitely play four years of football and if he busts go play baseball, he can’t do it the other way.
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
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If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
I read somewhere the Giants have a total of 11 picks this year.
Including 3 in the 4th and 4 in the 5th and 2 in the 7th
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In comment 14268600 Go Terps said:
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If he drops to the bottom of the first/top of the second, do we consider a slight trade up? Do we pick him if he's there at our second round pick?
The answer to this question should be yes, assuming the Giants didn’t go QB at 6.
However, the drafting of Sam Beal puts a serious crimp in Giants trade up possibilities.
The Giants hold 3 extra picks in this draft but they are late. They are short of their 3rd and their 7th. They have extra picks in the 4th, 5th, and two in the 7th, they are expected to get a 4th in compensation.
If we use a trade value chart as a inexact guide to give us an idea-
A early 20s pick is worth as much as 850. The Giants second rounder is worth 520 pts, to make up approx- 330 pts of value they need a mid- 2nd rounder. They do not have an extra 2nd nor even a 3rd.
The Giants extra chips reside in the 4th and those carry say 70-80 pts or value. That is only good for a trade up to the 31 or 32 pick. Even putting 2 together only really gets you to 27.
So the Giants options are very limited unless they are willing to part with a 2020 2nd rounder or a 1st (which is very doubtful- if they thought he was worth that than when not take him at 6)
I read somewhere the Giants have a total of 11 picks this year.
Including 3 in the 4th and 3 in the 5th and 2 in the 7th