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DanMetroMan : 2/4/2019 9:11 am
- Cecchini cleared waivers (yikes to his value around the league).

-NYFS top 50
Rookie maximums for at-bats (130), games pitched (30) or innings (50) in the major leagues"

If the 2 leaders are within 5% of each other, or the leader has less than 30% there will be a run-off between the top 2. If a run-off results in a tie the tiebreaker will be vote total in the previous poll, we will continue to "go back" in the polls until there is a clear leader.

*Jeff McNeil is ineligible
*Chris Flexen is ineligible
*Drew Smith is ineligible
*Tyler Bashlor is ineligible

1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
4) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
5) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
6) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
7) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
8 ) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
9) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
10) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
11) Will Toffey (3B) 10/29-34%, run-off with Cecchini 15/27-56%
12) Gavin Cecchini (2b) 14/26-46%
13) Francisco Alvarez (C) 9/26-35%
14) Dez Lindsay (OF) 7/18-39%
15) Tony Dibrell (RHP) 9/23-39%
16) Jordan Humphreys (RHP) 7/21-33%, Run-off with Nido 18/24-75%
17) Junior Santos (RHP) 6/28-21%, Run-off with Nido 11/20-55%
18) Tomas Nido (C) 10/23-43%
19) Luis Guillorme (SS) 9/24-38%
20) Adrian Hernandez 6/26-23%, run-off with Wahl/Cortes 8/15-53%
21) Carlos Cortes (2b) 8/21-38%
22) Steven Villines (RHP) 4/16 25%, Run-off with Thompson/Wahl 9/23-39%
23) David Thompson (3b) 8/23-35%
24) Ali Sanchez (C) 9/17-53%
25) Eric Hanhold (RHP) 7/21-33%, run-off 7/20-35%
26) Luis Carpio (IF) 4/18-22%, runoff with Uriarte 9/14-64%
27) Stanley Consuegra (OF) 4/20-20%, runoff with Uriarte/Valdez 6/17-35%, advances due to more votes in previous poll
28) Juan Uriarte (C) 4/19-21%
29) Freddy Valdez (OF) 7/17-41%
30) Daniel Zamora (LHP) 3/17-18%, run-off with Montes De Oca 10/12-83%
31) Jaylen Palmer (??) 3/12-25%, run-off with Montes de Oca/Vilera 9/16-56%
32) Ryley Gilliam (RHP) 5/22-23%, run-off with Manea 8/16-50%, advances due to more votes in previous poll
33) Matt Winaker (OF) 4/22-18
34) Kyle Dowdy (RHP) 6/20-30%, run-off with Vilera 9/12-75%
35) Jaison Vilera (RHP) 6/17-35%
36) Jose Miguel Medina(OF) 6/17-24%
37) Jeremy Vasquez (1b) 3/18-17% run-off with MDO/Manea/Viall 3/7-43%
38) Patrick Mazeika (C) 4/13-31%
39) Walker Lockett (RHP) 5/13-38%
40) Sam Haggerty (UTIL) 7/11 64%
41) Chris Viall (RHP) 4/11 36%
42) Ryder Ryan (RHP) 8/13- 62%
43) Bryce Montes de Oca 6/19 32%
44) Christian James 6/17-35%
45) Joe Cavallaro 3/17-18%, run-off with Brodey 7/13-54%
46) Michael Paez (IF) 5/22-23%
47) David Marcano (RHP) 4/22-18%, run-off with Brody 7/12-58%
48) Quinn Brodey (OF) 5/23-22%, 9/13-69%
49) Jose Moreno (RHP) 4/23-17% run-off with Gonzalez 8/14-57%
50) Tim Tebow (OF) 8/33-24%, run-off with Gonzalez 17/27-63%

HM-
Yoel Romero (UTIL)
Gregory Guerrero (SS)
Raul Beracierta (OF)
Kevin Kaczmarski (OF)
Hansel Moreno (UTIL)
Edgardo Fermin (SS/2B)
Kevin Smith (LHP)
Daison Acosta (RHP)


The city signed an agreement Thursday that charts a path forward for development in Willets Point.

The de Blasio administration signed a letter of intent Thursday with a joint venture between the Related Cos. and Sterling Equities. The pact lays out a timeline for the development team to hash out the details on two potential scenarios drafted by a community task force for 17 acres to the east of Citi Field in Queens. One of the scenarios includes a hotel and soccer stadium, while the other is more traditional, presenting a mix focusing on housing and retail. In roughly a year, according to the letter, the city will decide which path to pursue and draft a final development agreement after soliciting public input.


Quote:
While working out a more granular plan for the mixed-use development scenario would be fairly straightforward, vetting plans for a soccer stadium would be more involved. Building an arena would require the developers to secure a letter of intent from a franchise, according to Glen. The team would likely be newly created within the United Soccer League, an organization with nearly 40 squads that play in smaller stadiums than Major League Soccer, a league that counts New York City Football Club among its members. While the task force recommended a stadium of up to 25,000 seats, the developers envision a facility with up to 15,000 seats, according to the city.


One calls for a soccer stadium of up to 25,000 seats, according to the documents. Parking for the venue would be shared with Citi Field. In addition, the plan calls for retail, open space, a school, new police and fire stations and a residential building.

The second scenario follows a more typical mixed-use format that would produce six blocks of residential development, retail, open space, a high school and a fire station along with a health center.

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RE: RE: Gimenez  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:04 am : link
In comment 14290748 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 14290743 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


should be moved to CF. No word they plan on doing that but that's a move I would make.



What about Rosario to CF?

Who is the better defensive SS, Rosario or Gimenez?

Mets fans have been kind of spoiled with SS defense from Elster, Ordonez, Reyes, and now hopefully Rosario or Gimenez.


Problem with Rosario in CF is it would impact the 2019 team if he struggles and ST is about to begin. That would have been a move to make in October.
Vientos  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:06 am : link
has low odds of moving quickly. The bat could be very good but he's a rigid athlete that needs a lot of work at 3b. Part of the reason he's not more highly ranked is the concern he may end up at 1b. I'd guess odds of him sticking at 3b are 50/50. Lets hope.
Dan  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 11:09 am : link
Vientos was a high school SS, he's a big kid, and 3B seems like his destination. If he is a Flores/Murphy type athlete, I think he can certainly handle 3B assuming his bat supports that.

His bat seems very very intriguing. Some reports had his Exit Velos up amongst the best in the minors, as a teenager. I think he will skyrocket this year, just my opinion.
RE: another point on the bullpen  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:09 am : link
In comment 14290742 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
and stockpiling talent there, with pre-free agency players, is that the Mets have spent a lot of money on pen arms over under the Alderson era, and got almost no return on investment.

Swarzak
Bastardo
Salas
Ramos
Alex Torres
Francisco

That's a lot of resource allocation to a position that needs depth and quality, and they were getting nothing out of these players. Addison Reed is the only I can think of that added value. Blevins was decent.

Having that additional cash to spend elsewhere, hopefully to keep the rotation intact (I really really hope we can keep both Wheeler and deGrom) I think is pivotal to success over the next 2-4 years.


This is a list that shows you the Mets actually cheap out when it comes to the pen, not that they have spent a lot on the pen. 2nd and third tier arms. Kind of confused by some of your inclusions... Alex Torres? They traded Cory Mazzoni for him and paid him league minimum. Fernando Salas they acquired for Erik Salas and was paid 2.4 million in 2016, 3 million in 2017.
RE: Dan  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:12 am : link
In comment 14290796 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
Vientos was a high school SS, he's a big kid, and 3B seems like his destination. If he is a Flores/Murphy type athlete, I think he can certainly handle 3B assuming his bat supports that.

His bat seems very very intriguing. Some reports had his Exit Velos up amongst the best in the minors, as a teenager. I think he will skyrocket this year, just my opinion.


HS SS means almost nothing. It just means best player on the field in most cases. Mark Reynolds (whom some compare Vientos to) was also a HS SS and later had to move to 1b because he was rigid at 3b. "Certainly handle" is overstating things. There is a legit concern he has to move, hopefully it's not the case.

Steve Sypa in a positive piece about the bat

"Vientos is not unathletic, but he lacks explosive quick twitch muscle, resulting in a slow first step and below-average lateral quickness. His above-average arm and good instincts allow him to handle the routine play fine at third fine. There is worry that if he continues filling in, he will be forced to move to first base,"
fair critique  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 11:12 am : link
but adding diaz, familia, and wilson this off-season, plus upside MiL deals like Avilan and Caminero. It's not like they didn't do anything.
Scouting the SAL/JohN Calvagno  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:12 am : link
(again, a very positive piece on the bat)

"Vientos looks pretty well put together, I guessed 6’4″ 200 lbs on the field. Particularly strong in the lower half. Some projection remaining, I could see him carrying another 10-15 lbs of muscle, particularly up top. Anything more than that and he might outgrow the left side of the diamond."
Vientos  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 11:14 am : link
defensively, sounds a lot like Flores. If his bat is better, maybe like Moustakas, he could be a pretty solid player for us for a while.
Last one-  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:15 am : link
Kiley " If the makeup has turned a corner and the hitting continues to progress, the main issue will be defensive fit. Vientos is a well below average runner who one scout described as ‘athletic from the knees up,’ to the point where the lack of quickness will limit him to being average defensively, but he’s far from that right now. One Mets source drew a parallel to Nolan Arenado’s makeup and defensive concerns, which quickly evaporated in the upper minors as he turned into the best third baseman in baseball, but that seems unlikely at this point."

Hit Raw Power Game Power Run Fielding Throw
25/55 60/70 40/55 40/35 35/45 55/60

And I post all of this as a big Vientos fan and someone who has talked him up since we picked him. But he's not a strong candidate to move particularly quickly. Likely spends most of 2019 in the SAL, and most of 2020 in A+. If you're lucky and all goes well 2022 is likely his best case ETA
Did I read Mauricio  
pjcas18 : 2/8/2019 11:18 am : link
is going to be playing some OF this year?

He's obviously a long way away, and from what I believe a big kid who might grow off of SS anyway, but if he's got speed like Gimenez and Rosario and is athletic might be a good way to replace some OF upside lost with Kelenic.

especially with middle infield being the strength of the Mets minors.
Avilan  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:18 am : link
is a nice flier (though his velocity drop is a major red flag) and Caminero's velocity makes him intriguing until he's not but he had an awful season in Japan so we'll see what happens but EVERY team adds guys like this, soon to be 32 year old hard throwers coming off bad seasons in Japan aren't exactly "depth".
RE: Did I read Mauricio  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:19 am : link
In comment 14290811 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
is going to be playing some OF this year?

He's obviously a long way away, and from what I believe a big kid who might grow off of SS anyway, but if he's got speed like Gimenez and Rosario and is athletic might be a good way to replace some OF upside lost with Kelenic.

especially with middle infield being the strength of the Mets minors.


PJ,
I haven't seen that (not saying you are wrong) but where was this reported? I must have missed it.
I'm not sure  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 11:19 am : link
how you can ascertain how quickly he moves through the system. Especially based on his lower half quickness (or lackthereof).

I would be more concerned if he had a high K rate, bad plate discipline, a frame that projected to show power but that didn't show yet. But none of those are the case.

He has shown good raw and in game power, he has shown pretty good plate discipline. If Rosario could make it by age 21, I think Vientos can. And 3B should be his for the taking once Lowrie contract expires.

RE: RE: Did I read Mauricio  
pjcas18 : 2/8/2019 11:20 am : link
In comment 14290814 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14290811 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


is going to be playing some OF this year?

He's obviously a long way away, and from what I believe a big kid who might grow off of SS anyway, but if he's got speed like Gimenez and Rosario and is athletic might be a good way to replace some OF upside lost with Kelenic.

especially with middle infield being the strength of the Mets minors.



PJ,
I haven't seen that (not saying you are wrong) but where was this reported? I must have missed it.


I thought Shecky said it, but he might have said Mauricio should play OF this year, not that he will.

RE: I'm not sure  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:24 am : link
In comment 14290815 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
how you can ascertain how quickly he moves through the system. Especially based on his lower half quickness (or lackthereof).

I would be more concerned if he had a high K rate, bad plate discipline, a frame that projected to show power but that didn't show yet. But none of those are the case.

He has shown good raw and in game power, he has shown pretty good plate discipline. If Rosario could make it by age 21, I think Vientos can. And 3B should be his for the taking once Lowrie contract expires.


Not looking to get into a huge argument over something that can't be proven but skillset, 2018 numbers, 2019 placement and generally how fast a player moves are certainly things you can make educated guesses on. Vientos won't be 20 until after the 2019 season. Defensive concerns add to that. A plus fielder generally can be moved more quickly. For him to skip BK (which in itself is not fully guaranteed but likely) and then rocket through 4 levels in 2 seasons at 19-20 would be very, very unusual given all of that.
Giovanni Damico-  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:26 am : link
" He definitely isn’t Nolan Arenado when it comes to fielding, but he has an above-average arm. I could see him becoming a first baseman or a corner outfielder if his third base ability isn’t good enough. I think Vientos has a better bat than Newton and Mauricio but it may take him just as long to get to the Majors."
RE: RE: RE: Did I read Mauricio  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:28 am : link
In comment 14290817 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 14290814 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


In comment 14290811 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


is going to be playing some OF this year?

He's obviously a long way away, and from what I believe a big kid who might grow off of SS anyway, but if he's got speed like Gimenez and Rosario and is athletic might be a good way to replace some OF upside lost with Kelenic.

especially with middle infield being the strength of the Mets minors.



PJ,
I haven't seen that (not saying you are wrong) but where was this reported? I must have missed it.



I thought Shecky said it, but he might have said Mauricio should play OF this year, not that he will.



They probably should but I doubt they will. Has enough on his plate with his bat (especially being a switch hitter).
Buccholz  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:44 am : link
would be a very nice add/gamble.
dan  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 11:49 am : link
gun to your head. Do Mets sign Gio/Buchholz/Anderson?
RE: dan  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 11:54 am : link
In comment 14290844 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
gun to your head. Do Mets sign Gio/Buchholz/Anderson?


Gio.. doubtful. I think SOMEONE gives him 2 years or a bigger 1 year deal than the Mets will. I know they have spoken to Buccholz so I'll say yes and be optimistic. His cutter was money this year, worth a shot.
Just to play slight devils advocate  
bhill410 : 2/8/2019 12:58 pm : link
But organizations generally move elite bats if they are producing and hope that the better coaching and better field conditions in upper minors lead to increased defensive skills. I mean do you really think if vientos is crushing it they won’t promote him in late June? I certainly don’t, especially with Omar seemingly having an influence
RE: Just to play slight devils advocate  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:06 pm : link
In comment 14290941 bhill410 said:
Quote:
But organizations generally move elite bats if they are producing and hope that the better coaching and better field conditions in upper minors lead to increased defensive skills. I mean do you really think if vientos is crushing it they won’t promote him in late June? I certainly don’t, especially with Omar seemingly having an influence


Skip a level and then late June leave the SAL? No absolutely not.
I think if he rakes in A  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 1:12 pm : link
he can definitely move to A+ midway through the year Dan.
Rosario  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:14 pm : link
played 68 games in BK, 7 in Savannah, Gimenez 92 games in the SAL, Nimmo 69 in BK, 110 in Savannah. I can't think of any teem who skipped BK then played .5 in the SAL and then to A+, Wright 135 games in the SAL, Reyes 108
RE: I think if he rakes in A  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:15 pm : link
In comment 14290960 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
he can definitely move to A+ midway through the year Dan.


Please give examples of teen/young prospects who had 1/2 of A-ball ab's that the Mets did this with. Thanks.
Gomez  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:18 pm : link
120 games in the SAL

Cecchini 53 in Kingsport, 53 in BK, 57 in Savannah

I've legit yet to find a single teen/20 year old player that the Mets did this with over the past 10+ years so it if happens it would be extremely unusual. Not even under Omar
RE: Just to play slight devils advocate  
Eric on Li : 2/8/2019 1:21 pm : link
In comment 14290941 bhill410 said:
Quote:
But organizations generally move elite bats if they are producing and hope that the better coaching and better field conditions in upper minors lead to increased defensive skills. I mean do you really think if vientos is crushing it they won’t promote him in late June? I certainly don’t, especially with Omar seemingly having an influence


Omar is more on the international side, all the new guys they brought into the FO are more on the player development side so it remains to be seen how aggressive they are. But let's just guesstimate a best case scenario for Vientos:

Starts the year amazing in A ball. Gets promoted to A+. Absolute fastest that will happen is what, 6 weeks? 2 months? Now lets say he crushes A+ in June/July. From August 1st on there are only about 25 games left at AA, so even if he's amazing it's probably not enough of a sample to move up again.

So in an absolute (non-Trout/Soto/Acuna) best case scenario, he's about where Gimenez is right now to start next season at age 20 - except with far fewer paths to the majors than Gimenez' due to defensive ability. And re: Gimenez, even with that defensive ability, nobody realistically thinks he's coming up this year. So that's why it's extremely hard to foresee Vientos getting up to the majors in the next 2 years unless he is literally the next Miguel Cabrera. Liked Dan I've loved him as a prospect since he was picked and argued all offseason that I'd rank him higher than Kelenic, but it's unfair to project any prospect below A ball to be Miguel Cabrera.
Dom Smith  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:22 pm : link
126 games in Savannah

Nido 38 in Kingsport, 91 in BK, 86 in Savannah

Legit only example I can find is Lastings Milledge 65 games in the SAL then St. Lucie

Still looking
Phil  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:27 pm : link
Evans got 2nd round money so I'll throw him in 73 in brooklyn, 103 in Savannah. Not being snarky here. If Vientos plays half a season in Columbia and heads to St. Lucie, I believe he'd be joining ONLY Lastings Milledge that would fit this scenario laid out. Can't think of anyone else to even look up that would fit this mold.
Ruben Tejada  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 1:27 pm : link
who was a much less heralded prospects made the majors at age 20. Cecchini and Nimmo made substantial jumps in the age 20 seasons (and I believe both had injury issues); Dom Smith was slow, level by level, but that was most likely because of his lack of power. Dilson Herrera went from A+ to MLB in the same season, half a season, with the Mets.
Dan  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 1:32 pm : link
also to your litmus test. I looked through the drafts of the last decade, and there were not even 10 teenage bats taken in the first 10 rounds of each draft. Mets focused almost solely on College Bats. So if your basing your argument solely on historical cases, its a very imperfect science that you have no basis to make, because the sample size is such that it makes it impossible to make that case. Further, this isa new front office with perhaps a more aggressive stance toward promotion.
RE: Ruben Tejada  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:34 pm : link
In comment 14290982 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
who was a much less heralded prospects made the majors at age 20. Cecchini and Nimmo made substantial jumps in the age 20 seasons (and I believe both had injury issues); Dom Smith was slow, level by level, but that was most likely because of his lack of power. Dilson Herrera went from A+ to MLB in the same season, half a season, with the Mets.


Ruben Tejada being a non-heralded GLOVE is the point. He wasn't expected to do much but play the field. Dilson Herrera again, played 116 games in the SAL, not really sure why he's an example?

Cecchini as I noted played a full-season in Kingsport (Vientos would be skipping Brooklyn) and then a full-season in Brooklyn and THEN a half season in the SAL. All due respect you aren't giving examples of players who skipped levels and then were also pushed half 1/2. Cecchini and Nimmo don't fit that, Smith doesn't fit that, Herrera doesn't fit that. Can players move quickly from A+ success to the bigs? Sure that happens sometimes but from Kingsport to St. Lucie in 1/2 a season, again you're looking at Lastings Milledge and I'll kick in Ruben Tejada though he was never considered a big prospect with future development ahead of him.
RE: Dan  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:37 pm : link
In comment 14290989 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
also to your litmus test. I looked through the drafts of the last decade, and there were not even 10 teenage bats taken in the first 10 rounds of each draft. Mets focused almost solely on College Bats. So if your basing your argument solely on historical cases, its a very imperfect science that you have no basis to make, because the sample size is such that it makes it impossible to make that case. Further, this isa new front office with perhaps a more aggressive stance toward promotion.


Huh? We can absolutely use their top HS players over recent years. You often like to do this. Throw out kind hypotheticals that don't really fit the realistic likely outcome. The Mets 100% have taken big HS players and signed big IFA players over the past decade plus so we can track how they develop them. They do not top young players skip levels and then get bumped after half a season. That is not their history. All due respect, you shit on me for calling BS on the Bryce Harper "meeting" and I don't recall your mea culpa? Or are we still going with "well Dan you don't know everything, maybe the meeting happened but fell apart!"
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:39 pm : link
providing mountains of evidence that suggest he's going to take time to develop and for whatever the reason you are choosing to ignore it?

"In his first full year as a third baseman down in the New York Mets minor league system, 18-year-old Mark Vientos struggled defensively. After playing mostly shortstop in 2017, the Mets wisely moved him to the hot corner for all of 2018.

Why is this wise? The Mets already have Amed Rosario in the major leagues cementing himself as one of the core members of the team. Ahead of Vientos on the prospect depth chart is yet another shortstop, the franchise’s number one minor leaguer, Andres Gimenez.

The results of this move were not promising on the defensive side of things. Vientos committed 13 errors in 133 opportunities. He finished the year with a poor .902 fielding percentage, showing early on in his professional career that perhaps a position changed is needed.

Expect the Mets to continue the Tim Tebow circus in 2019 and beyond
N
It’s certainly too soon to write Vientos off as a butcher with a glove. He has only played 68 games professionally at third base. In two years, he may be more than servicable.
Link - ( New Window )
I'd also add those were 2 moves along with Mejia were among Omar's  
Eric on Li : 2/8/2019 1:39 pm : link
signature developmental mishaps that the organization has been much better off for not repeating since he was fired.

The "skip a step" can happen when a guy crushes AA and goes straight to the bigs. Miguel Cabrera did. Conforto did it. Others have done it. But there are still 4 levels between where Vientos has played and AA. It's just a matter of time and math that would indicate how unlikely it is for him to move up 6 levels in 2 years, even if he skips a couple.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:42 pm : link
Kenneth Lavin says:

In his first full summer as a professional, Vientos demonstrated considerable offensive potential and quelled a lot of the concerns scouts had about his ultimately defensive home. Vientos hit an impressive .287/.389/.489 in 262 PAs for Kingsport, while cranking 11 homers and walking in 14.1% of his plate appearances. This is especially impressive given the fact that he was one of the youngest players in the 2017 draft class, and played the entire season as an 18-year-old. While 2018 was a mostly positive year for the youngster, some big questions in his skillset remain. His swing is very long and has a tendency to be kind of stiff, which wasn’t a problem against rookie ball pitching, as evidenced by his 16.4 K% in the Appalachian League this past season, but may prove to be a bigger issue against better arms down the road. Despite the long swing, or perhaps because of it, Vientos has already demonstrated considerable power that he can get to in games. He isn’t likely to be a great fielder at third, but I think a lot of the concerns about his body moving him to left field or first base are a bit overblown at present. This upcoming season should prove to be the first real test of Vientos’ young career, as I expect him to start 2019 in full-season ball with the Columbia Fireflies.

Dykstra

If Vientos can become adequate at third -- and he's got the above-average arm to make that happen -- that could be the next building block in a potential bid to become the next Mets player to be named one of MLB.com's Top 100 Prospects. Vientos is expected to be challenged with an assignment to Class A Columbia to begin 2019, and he's likely to be one of the South Atlantic League's youngest position players (19) come April. Given the way 2018 ended, Vientos thinks he's ready to prove he should be known for more than his youth.

Somehow  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:44 pm : link
this makes it sound like I don't like Vientos when in fact I argued on NYFS he had a shot to be the #1 prospect in the system at this time next year. That being said he's going to be insanely young for the SAL and has a long swing and defensive concerns. He's almost certainly going to be a slow burn type. If he moves fast the "fast" will begin in 2020 with movement between A+, AA etc
I guess my point is the mets have not had a teenager  
bhill410 : 2/8/2019 1:50 pm : link
light up the minors, hence no crazy jumps. I am rather high on Veintos, but even for those who dont think he will realize it, he is probably the highest ceiling teenage bat we have had via draft (Outside of Kelenic grrrrrrr) in the last 20 years.

Listen is he likely to crush it with no growing pains - no, but if he does they will push him forward at the end of June regardless of his defensive prowess. They simply dont hold back mature bats becuase of defensive concerns, teams hope they can get taht straightened out in the high minors while they salivate over the offensive potential.
Nightengale  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:51 pm : link
Devin Mesoraco will earn $1.75 million if he makes #Mets roster and can earn total of $2 million if he plays 100 games.


Why is this notable? Because... Mesoraco at 1.75 million + releasing TDA would save the Mets the Mets roughly 2 million dollars which might help bring in a Buchholz.


I'd certainly take Mesoraco + Buchholz (and say + 1-2 million) over just TDA.
Dan if he is batting 315/390/950  
bhill410 : 2/8/2019 1:52 pm : link
on June 15th but also leads the league in errors, do you really think they wouldnt push him forward?
So TDA has zero  
pjcas18 : 2/8/2019 1:56 pm : link
trade value?

With the dearth of caching in MLB, I wonder if maybe he'd be able to get a BP arm.

either way I agree, Mesoraco + Buchholz > TDA
RE: Dan if he is batting 315/390/950  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:57 pm : link
In comment 14291019 bhill410 said:
Quote:
on June 15th but also leads the league in errors, do you really think they wouldnt push him forward?


.950 slugging? I mean you're asking a question that all due respect is absurd. The league leader in major league baseball slugged .640. So if you're point is he's out of this world amazing then sure. But if he did that he'd be the top prospect in all of baseball sight unseen. Joey Gallo has 80 power and highest he ever slugged was .660. The league leader in the SAL slugged .579.
Point  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 1:59 pm : link
is he can hit very well for 1/2 a season and they will almost certainly leave him in Savannah. Not to mention he's a Florida kid with some maturity concerns in the past. Highly doubt they want him in Florida before they have to. If he hits like a top 10 prospect in baseball that obviously changes time lines. That would be true of 100% of players in any system however.
Fully  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 2:01 pm : link
acknowledging he may be awful but the case for Clay-
Link - ( New Window )
Phillies  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 2:05 pm : link
may have to can Kapler, this is getting ugly
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Dan  
CMicks3110 : 2/8/2019 2:26 pm : link
I'm not saying you're wrong or that you dislike Vientos. And by the way, I don't recall the conversation about Harper that we might have had a while back, so if I said the meeting wasn't BS and it was BS, then I will gracefully offer my apologies. But we both probably don't know for sure. I'm guessing it was just a meeting with Boras that was spun such a way.

As for these hypotheticals I throw out there, I do so as a reminder that there are things we cannot know, and to contextualize when you're making your analysis. You do provide a lot of evidence in your posts that support your theory of the case. But you also ignore outliers.

The issue i have with your arguments sometimes, is that you speak with an authority, a degree of certainty, that you or anyone outside the Mets organization do not have the knowledge to possess.

So using your collection of players you identified, and inserting them into the following logic you developed:

1. Teenage Player is drafted in season X
2. Teenage Player in season X+1 skips Rookie Ball and Begins in low A
3. Teenage Player in season X+! is promoted from low A to High A in season x+1

You're saying there are only 2 instances you can think of. Lastings Milledge and Tejada. The problem with your analysis is that there have been so few high school bats drafted in the top 10 rounds in the last 10 years. Lets review:

Year Player Pos RD
2008 Javier Rodrqiuez OF 4 Non Prospect
2009 Darrell Cecliani OF 3 Non Prospect
2011 Brandon Nimmo OF 1 Prospect
2012 Gavin Cecchini IF 1 Prospect
2012 Brandon Kaupe 2B 4 Non Prospect
2012 Tomas Nido C 8 Non Prospect
2013 Dominic Smith 1B 1 Prospect
2013 Luis Guillmore SS 10 Non Prospect
2014 Milton Ramos SS 2 Non Prospect
2014 Dash Winningham 1B 8 Non Prospect
2015 Desmond Lindsay OF 2 Prospect
2017 Mark Vientos 3B 2 Prospect

That's 12 players. Most of who were non-prospects, or not elite prospects.

I'm not saying you're wrong. I'm just saying that you speak to - the maybe 10/20% chance of this achievement - as almost a certainty to not happen.

I think in your writing style, you leave little wiggle room for what could be possible. And data is so small that your theories aren't demonstrable truths.
Sorry meant that as OPS  
bhill410 : 2/8/2019 2:34 pm : link
Yea not saying anyone is slugging that anytime soon.
TDA has zero value bc he is never healthy & FA's are available cheaper  
Eric on Li : 2/8/2019 2:46 pm : link
like Mesoraco. At this point I think it's fairly obvious they traded Plawecki over TDA purely bc he had value and TDA didn't. They are bringing TDA to camp bc there's very little reason not to. Someone could get hurt, etc. Had his full salary been guaranteed he likely wouldn't have even been tendered.

Whether he makes it through camp or not, who knows, because Dan's math is 100% accurate and every team including the Mets would probably agree with it. Mesoraco (or similar player) + a few million to spend on one of the many pitchers still available is a much better use of resources than rehabbing TDA and having him occupy a spot on the 40 man.
I  
DanMetroMan : 2/8/2019 2:48 pm : link
was curious, the highest slugging% ever posted (that I can find) was that legendary 72 homer season by Joe Bauman

.400/.535/.916, at 32 years old lol

But also before my time I think I found the greatest minor league season I've ever seen 1978 Gary Redus .462/.559/.787, 17 homers 42/48 SB's, 62 walks 31 k's.. WTF
Mets sign Danny Espinosa  
ZGiants98 : 2/8/2019 2:51 pm : link
Minor league deal.
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