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NFT: Mets talk: P & Cs

ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 6:55 pm
Pitchers and Catchers report tomorrow. Brodie interviewed tonight. Divulging info.

On McNeil:

Matt Ehalt
& #10004;
@MattEhalt
Brodie on McNeil/outfield: His focus in spring training is going to be a transition to the outfield because we think we can be a lethal lineup with a McNeil, Conforto, Nimmo outfield against right-handed pitching. "


.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 6:57 pm : link
Matt Ehalt

Verified account

@MattEhalt
9m9 minutes ago

Interesting quote by Brodie on the deGrom talks: "Whether or not we can ultimately agree on something or whether the timing is now or down the road, there will be no mistaking the fact he is a franchise player for us we hope can be that for years to come.
.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 6:59 pm : link
Rich Coutinho


@coutinho9

I totally agree with @GMBVW --this Met roster is a playoff team caliber group--To me it is 3rd best roster in whole NL and tops in NL East-I respect him so much for raising the bar on expectations--shows that is not afraid of lofty goals--A life lesson for us all--Aim High ALWAYS
.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:00 pm : link
More
Brodie on potential moves: "Right now, we're looking to be more opportunistic."
.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:02 pm : link
Michael Mayer


@mikemayerMMO
29m29 minutes ago
More
Michael Mayer Retweeted Matt Ehalt
Nimmo
Lowrie
Cano
Ramos
Conforto
Frazier/Davis/Alonso
McNeil
Pitcher
Rosario

That is pretty solid.

Recap..  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:07 pm : link
NorthJersey
Link - ( New Window )
3rd best in the NL? Best in the NLE?  
speedywheels : 2/11/2019 7:15 pm : link
That guy needs to dial it back some...
here's what I took as interesting from BVW's interview  
Eric on Li : 2/11/2019 7:27 pm : link
He expects Cano to move over to 1B at the end of games on occasion defensively. That's kind of new and noteworthy, previously it seem like they'd move him around this year.

Mcneil is basically converting to be a full time OF'er. Unlike previous nym position switches this one is reasonable, though not ideal, and I think he'll be fine out there defensively because he's infinitely more athletic than Murphy/Duda. Still not sure any of the lefties are good enough defensively in center to do it every day but they protected themselves there with Broxton.

They look at the IF as 5 guys for 4 spots shuffling around all getting around 130 games - Cano, Rosario, Lowrie, Frazier, and whichever young 1B earns starts (he mentioned all 3 of Davis, Alonso, and Dom competing). I think even Brodie would take the under on Frazier big time. I like that they're going to make all the young guys earn the 1B playing time - just hope there's enough of it available, but better to have too many options than too few.

Some bizarre posturing with JDG extension talks. Still assume it happens sooner rather than later but certainly bizarre to have the guy who authored the "sign him or trade him" press release now assert that his arbitration award some how changes things.

I think he's a little overly optimistic on the pitching staff depth, but hopefully we get lucky with health for once. He says playoff team and they aren't worrying about the other teams in the division. That seems a drop myopic with the posture they took in the offseason.
Im excited.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:40 pm : link
People will probably roll their eyes and say "what else is knew" but this is a solid roster.

We could probably still add a backend starter to sure up the depth further there but Im pretty fine with the 1-5. There are still good players out there so maybe these guys prices start falling or a few even take a ST invite. Ervin Santana would be a pretty sweet add. Seems like BVW is already thinking along the same lines if he made a one year offer to Gio.

The lineup is deep and versatile even if there isn't that true star in the middle until Cespedes comes back. Unlike most years where if a key player or two went down in the lineup and we were f"d, I think we can withstand some injuries there this year.

The pen looks great on paper and has a multitude of upside options that should battle it out in Syracuse this year. I'd be surprised if one or two didn't emerge there.

Let's get this season started. BVW is going to stay enthusiastic IMO and will adjust and add as we go along. This is a team that should compete for the playoffs, in one form or another.
Couldn't agree more.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:42 pm : link
Rich Coutinho


@coutinho9
Following Following @coutinho9

To me @JeffMcNeil805 is a player who is up for EVERY challenge he has ever faced--If he needs to play OF I have no doubts he will because my impression is he's a team-first guy. Getting that bat in Met lineup will create wins in a multitude of ways
"new"  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 7:54 pm : link
Geez...
Woah woah woaaahhhh  
Shecky : 2/11/2019 8:11 pm : link
I thought so many teams were fighting for Gio that the Mets immediately folded and offered two years? That was about two weeks ago wasnt it?

Lol
People freaking out..  
moze1021 : 2/11/2019 8:13 pm : link
About a lineup with Wilson Ramos hitting cleanup. LOL

Cmon man.
RE: Woah woah woaaahhhh  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:14 pm : link
In comment 14293825 Shecky said:
Quote:
I thought so many teams were fighting for Gio that the Mets immediately folded and offered two years? That was about two weeks ago wasnt it?

Lol


Yup. Clear smoke from Boras. I feel like over the years, Ive gotten better adept at spotting these things but I still fall for it lol.

Would be pretty sweet if the one year offer was still standing and Gio accepts.
I'm still pessimistic on the pitching re depth  
speedywheels : 2/11/2019 8:16 pm : link
Matz will surely take his annual trip (or two) to the DL. And though Wheeler had a great year, I'm still not sure he has put his annual DL trip(s) behind him. If one/both of those guys miss extended time, I'm not confident in any of the replacement candidates.

Same thing for the 'pen - if every one stays healthy, they should be OK.

Offense should be OK.
I'd have Ramos 5th  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:17 pm : link
Nimmo
Lowrie
Cano
Conforto
Ramos
McNeil
Alonso/Frazier/Davis
Rosario

But this is a lineup that should look drastically different in the second half than in the first. Sneaky suspicion they are being overly cautious with Cespedes to temper expectations and he's back around the all star break. I also feel Alonso, McNeil and others will move up in the lineup once they are more proven later in the year.
heard alot of noise over  
Rory : 2/11/2019 8:23 pm : link
the offseason about a universal DH being instituted into the game as soon as this year.

I think BVW built this roster in anticipation for that but it appears its going to be next.



Perfect hypothetical situation for me is McNeil gets a lot of playing  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:23 pm : link
time over the first half and picks up where he left off in 2018. When Cespedes returns, organization feels like they HAVE to keep the younger McNeil in the lineup over Lowrie and Lowrie then has to become the super sup with McNeil moving from the OF to 3B second half as a starter.

Second half:

Nimmo CF
McNeil 3B
Cano 2B
Cespedes LF
Conforto RF
Alonso 1B
Ramos C
Rosario SS

Lowrie Super Sub.

Of course nothing ever goes as planned so....
RE: I'd have Ramos 5th  
speedywheels : 2/11/2019 8:23 pm : link
In comment 14293830 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
Nimmo
Lowrie
Cano
Conforto
Ramos
McNeil
Alonso/Frazier/Davis
Rosario

But this is a lineup that should look drastically different in the second half than in the first. Sneaky suspicion they are being overly cautious with Cespedes to temper expectations and he's back around the all star break. I also feel Alonso, McNeil and others will move up in the lineup once they are more proven later in the year.


I think Cepedes is out for 2019; the guy has only shown he comes back LATER than planned, not earlier. But if he does come back and can produce even a little bit, that's gravy...
RE: heard alot of noise over  
Jay on the Island : 2/11/2019 8:32 pm : link
In comment 14293837 Rory said:
Quote:
the offseason about a universal DH being instituted into the game as soon as this year.

I think BVW built this roster in anticipation for that but it appears its going to be next.



It won't be installed this year. I read that if it does happen it won't happen until 2020 at the earliest.
RE: RE: I'd have Ramos 5th  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:33 pm : link
In comment 14293839 speedywheels said:
Quote:
In comment 14293830 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


Nimmo
Lowrie
Cano
Conforto
Ramos
McNeil
Alonso/Frazier/Davis
Rosario

But this is a lineup that should look drastically different in the second half than in the first. Sneaky suspicion they are being overly cautious with Cespedes to temper expectations and he's back around the all star break. I also feel Alonso, McNeil and others will move up in the lineup once they are more proven later in the year.



I think Cepedes is out for 2019; the guy has only shown he comes back LATER than planned, not earlier. But if he does come back and can produce even a little bit, that's gravy...


I don't know about that. Im not a huge Cespedes fan but he did seem to play through a multitude of injuries in the past... even if at at a detriment. All Ive heard about his most recent setback is that the surgeries were a success and they removed the calcium deposits... Recovery time is supposed to be 6-8 months. He had his second surgery on October 26th so even the long end of that has him returning around d the all star break. Of course he could have setbacks and we shouldn't be counting on it or anything but Im guessing he's in minor league games in late June.
Actually , Ive seen this surgery takes 6-8, 8-10  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:37 pm : link
July as the target, second half... lol. So there's a pretty wide range of opinions on it.
If you read something like this you'd  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 8:43 pm : link
think recovery is as easy as pie. I don't think we know how bad his heals were though.
Link - ( New Window )
Mets sign Travis Taijeron and  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:05 pm : link
Alfredo Ascalera to minor league deals.
RE: If you read something like this you'd  
Shecky : 2/11/2019 10:12 pm : link
In comment 14293862 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
think recovery is as easy as pie. I don't think we know how bad his heals were though. Link - ( New Window )


That's awesome Shecky...  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:39 pm : link
Thanks for sharing... :)
I will say this...  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:43 pm : link
If the Mets do have any inclination that Cespedes will be back sooner than expected and this is all just them being over conservative because Ces shot his mouth off and was acting like a bit of a pussy, it would make a TON of sense why they didn't go after Machado/Harper.
Sign Gio and add a healthy Cespedes back  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:46 pm : link
earlier than expected and this roster, and this team, probably is as talented as any in the NL. Granted... big "IFs" that nobody will account for, especially Ces.
.  
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 11:46 pm : link
Lennon: Familia turned down closer roles to return to Mets
love familia  
CMicks3110 : 2/11/2019 11:51 pm : link
.
Um  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:05 am : link
Jeff is on record saying 2nd half for Cespedes and potentially later. Where is this coming back sooner coming from? Omar said the same.
Sure sounds like sooner than expected lol  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:07 am : link
Tim Healey
@timbhealey

Jan 24
September: Mets have to plan for Cespedes not to play in 2019, Wilpon said.

December: Cespedes is "the ultimate trade deadline piece," BVW said.

January: Anything Cespedes does in 2019 is "gravy," Minaya said.

January:
Wilpon: "We do have a $29 million outfielder on the roster that we hope comes back sometime this year."
Am  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:08 am : link
I missing something? The Mets themselves have said 2nd half or later. WebMD is what people are going by? lol
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:08 am : link
Anthony DiComo
Anthony DiComo
@AnthonyDiComo

Dec 5
The Mets expect Yoenis Cespedes to return "realistically, the second half of the season," Jeff Wilpon said on
@WFAN660
. He added that the timetable could be longer.
We are taking the conversation Shecky had with a foot  
ZGiants98 : 2/12/2019 9:12 am : link
Doctor and hypothetically assuming the Mets might be acting conservative purposely. Not a siingle person here is arguing what some Mets officials have stated his timeline is.
Looks like a fun roster  
Metnut : 2/12/2019 9:12 am : link
and I'm looking forward to seeing how our guys do. Question mark guys who looked strong last year like Wheeler, Nimmo, McNeil are going to have to show last year was no fluke. Matz, Wheeler, Syndergaard have to avoid their usual trips to the DL. Let's hope Cano can get through a full year at age 36 without PEDs and be the 3 WAR player we expect him to be. Hoping that Conforto can be the all-star, fringe MVP type of 5+ WAR player that his upside has flashed.

Definitely concerned about the lack of depth in the rotation and worried that it could either keep us out of the playoffs or force us into the wild card game in a tough NL East. Still hoping that Philly or WSH don't get Harper or Machado.
Mets won't know when Cespedes returns until after season opener.  
Ira : 2/12/2019 9:12 am : link
Quote:
The Mets don't expect to have an idea until sometime during the season when Yoenis Cespedes will return from surgery on both heels.

While watching the team's equipment truck leave for spring training Monday, general manager Brodie Van Wagenen said, "I don't think we'll have an idea during spring training."

Van Wagenen, Cespedes' former agent, says the Mets want to make sure "we build him up in a smart fashion, that we're not taxing him too soon. and we want to make sure that he's 100 percent healthy when he comes back, whenever that day is."

Link - ( New Window )
Endy  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:12 am : link
Chavez retires and joins the BK Mets coaching staff, Marlon Anderson becomes roving bench running coach

Travis Taijeron back with the Mets, they needed OF depth if/when Davis/Liriano/Blanco opt out.

Alfredo Escalera minor league deal, likely assigned to AA. Royals liked him a few years ago, never developed.
Its a double edged beauty  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 9:13 am : link
Ces is the personality you cant TELLhim what to do. But hes got an ego.

Take your time, come back when your ready. We need you, but we will be fine without you

Real world. He dont play this year we save $20mm... he does, we have a cleanup hitter with Alonso behind him - thats a lot of RH power!!!! Best way to motivate him is to tell him you love him, while checking out the girl walking past you...
RE: Am  
GF1080 : 2/12/2019 9:14 am : link
In comment 14294197 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
I missing something? The Mets themselves have said 2nd half or later. WebMD is what people are going by? lol


You're not missing anything. They are being overly optimistic for no reason.
You  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:14 am : link
absolutely implied he will be back sooner c'mon

"I will say this...
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:43 pm : link : reply
If the Mets do have any inclination that Cespedes will be back sooner than expected and this is all just them being over conservative because Ces shot his mouth off and was acting like a bit of a pussy, it would make a TON of sense why they didn't go after Machado/Harper."
Thought of the day  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 9:15 am : link
If Davis didnt show up till tomorrow, would he be considered early or late? Good thing he didnt take any chances...
RE: Its a double edged beauty  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:16 am : link
In comment 14294208 Shecky said:
Quote:
Ces is the personality you cant TELLhim what to do. But hes got an ego.

Take your time, come back when your ready. We need you, but we will be fine without you

Real world. He dont play this year we save $20mm... he does, we have a cleanup hitter with Alonso behind him - thats a lot of RH power!!!! Best way to motivate him is to tell him you love him, while checking out the girl walking past you...


He gets paid the same money either way so if his love of the game is really a question I don't see how Juan Lagares/Broxton in CF motivate him more than acting like he doesn't exist. Instead Jeff mentioned him ad nauseum (with Cano) as to why they aren't going after Harper/Machado
RE: Thought of the day  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:17 am : link
In comment 14294214 Shecky said:
Quote:
If Davis didnt show up till tomorrow, would he be considered early or late? Good thing he didnt take any chances...


They have said Davis will not be pitching at all despite some buzz he might.
RE: You  
ZGiants98 : 2/12/2019 9:18 am : link
In comment 14294212 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
absolutely implied he will be back sooner c'mon

"I will say this...
ZGiants98 : 2/11/2019 10:43 pm : link : reply
If the Mets do have any inclination that Cespedes will be back sooner than expected and this is all just them being over conservative because Ces shot his mouth off and was acting like a bit of a pussy, it would make a TON of sense why they didn't go after Machado/Harper."


You arent reading the entire thing statement starting off with an IF?? I was responding to She my and that doctor basically calling Cespedes a pussy.
If Cespedes can start baseball  
Metnut : 2/12/2019 9:18 am : link
activity in July and return to the team in something resembling mid-season form by early August take it as a huge win and don't look back.
Sounds  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:19 am : link
like they hope for Davis to break camp with the club as the backup 3b/1b. I'm not so sure we see Alonso as quickly as people think. If Frazier and Lowrie are hitting and Davis does anything there doesn't seem like there would be a major rush. You don't bench a guy like Frazier if your winning and/or he's hitting.
RE: If Cespedes can start baseball  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:20 am : link
In comment 14294221 Metnut said:
Quote:
activity in July and return to the team in something resembling mid-season form by early August take it as a huge win and don't look back.


I'm sure this is their realistic hope. They he can provide a boost over the final 50ish games playing every once and a while with 2020 being a quasi regular.
Projected  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:23 am : link
starting OF in Syracuse is older than the big club lol

Taijeron is 30, Tebow 31, Kaczmarski is 27, Rajai Davis 38, Gregor Blanco 35, Liriano 28 in June. So whomever sticks...
RE: Projected  
Metnut : 2/12/2019 9:28 am : link
In comment 14294228 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
starting OF in Syracuse is older than the big club lol

Taijeron is 30, Tebow 31, Kaczmarski is 27, Rajai Davis 38, Gregor Blanco 35, Liriano 28 in June. So whomever sticks...


Gun to your head. Assume Mets are a "contender" (within 2 games of a playoff spot throughout) and Tebow has a 104 wRC in AAA with awful defense. Does he get an MLB AB in 2019?
RE: RE: Projected  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:32 am : link
In comment 14294243 Metnut said:
Quote:
In comment 14294228 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


starting OF in Syracuse is older than the big club lol

Taijeron is 30, Tebow 31, Kaczmarski is 27, Rajai Davis 38, Gregor Blanco 35, Liriano 28 in June. So whomever sticks...



Gun to your head. Assume Mets are a "contender" (within 2 games of a playoff spot throughout) and Tebow has a 104 wRC in AAA with awful defense. Does he get an MLB AB in 2019?


Probably. I mean they don't care about his options (he's 31) and no knock on him we know they want the gate more than viewing him as some legit prospect. That being said for him to post a 104 wRC+ in AAA would be pretty amazing. 2018 26 hitters in the entire IL posted 104 or higher so he'd be a top 25 hitter in the league.
Maybe I'm misunderstanding how wRC works?  
Metnut : 2/12/2019 9:44 am : link
How can it be that hard to post a 104 wRC? Isn't that only 4% better than average? Shouldn't a bunch of guys by definition by above average?
RE: Maybe I'm misunderstanding how wRC works?  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 9:47 am : link
In comment 14294280 Metnut said:
Quote:
How can it be that hard to post a 104 wRC? Isn't that only 4% better than average? Shouldn't a bunch of guys by definition by above average?


wRC+ normalizes for things such as ballpark factor. The complicated formula

"(((wRAA per PA + league runs per PA) + (league runs per PA - ballpark factor x league runs per PA) / league wRC per plate appearance, not including pitchers)) x 100."

Syracuse wasn't a Mets affiliate but using them as an example the Chiefs had 3 qualified hitters post a wRC+ of 100 or greater including ex-Met Matt Reynolds
Being optimistic re: Cespedes is just asking for a kick in the nuts  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 10:07 am : link
that's why even Jeff Wilpon isn't doing it. How many players have we seen have complications from major surgeries? Now add to the equation 2 major surgeries and a guy who has had all sorts of troubles staying healthy as he's aged the past few years.

On a scale of complicated procedures he's somewhere between TJ Rivera's supposedly standard TJS and David Wright's "can't even sit in the dugout" neck surgeries. That doesn't mean Cespedes can't come back sooner, but recent history tells us it'd be a fool's errand to try to predict his recovery even if he was only doing 1 simpler procedure, and not 2.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 10:44 am : link
Of course the Yankees are signing the #1 rated IFA prospect, shocker @fangraphs lol
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 10:53 am : link
Dan Szymborski: Im very optimistic about Rosario
RE: .  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 10:57 am : link
In comment 14294381 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Of course the Yankees are signing the #1 rated IFA prospect, shocker @fangraphs lol


Puason or Dominguez? Either way, nice move for Yanks
RE: RE: .  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:01 am : link
In comment 14294395 Shecky said:
Quote:
In comment 14294381 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


Of course the Yankees are signing the #1 rated IFA prospect, shocker @fangraphs lol



Puason or Dominguez? Either way, nice move for Yanks


Dominguez is expected to sign with the Yankees for about 5 million, Puason to Oakland. The Mets have been tied to Alexander Ramirez who is not considered one of the "top" names but may get 7 figures.
Uh oh  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:24 am : link
Martino: DeGrom won't discuss extension post opening day..may have self-imposed usage restrictions... I hope the second is Martino BS or here comes the circus..
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:24 am : link

Matt Ehalt
@MattEhalt

29s
Mets have yet to make offer to deGrom per a source. Degrom's side was told two months ago offer would come. Now, there's a deadline. There is some frustration building.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:33 am : link
Jeffrey Paternostro
@jeffpaternostro

45s
I suppose in hindsight it was foolish of anyone to think that this would be the one player they wouldnt jerk around in this stuff.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:35 am : link

Jeffrey Paternostro
@jeffpaternostro

41s
I still expect this to get done but the fact that it will take brinksmanship through the papers is extremely Mets.
My guess is BVW is needs to wait until he's done signing players  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 11:36 am : link
to figure out contract structure because of the way the Wilpons do the budget. If he ends up spending more on someone like Gio this year, or even going multi-year, they adjust the JDG year 1 & 2 salaries and punt money to the future - just like the Cano deal.

There is no human on earth who knows what is going through JDG's head more than BVW, so there's zero chance he's genuinely misreading the situation. He's also not talking tough or anything, so I think it's just a stall tactic as he knows JDG is probably getting antsy, but the deal will happen before ST ends.
RE: My guess is BVW is needs to wait until he's done signing players  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:37 am : link
In comment 14294440 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
to figure out contract structure because of the way the Wilpons do the budget. If he ends up spending more on someone like Gio this year, or even going multi-year, they adjust the JDG year 1 & 2 salaries and punt money to the future - just like the Cano deal.

There is no human on earth who knows what is going through JDG's head more than BVW, so there's zero chance he's genuinely misreading the situation. He's also not talking tough or anything, so I think it's just a stall tactic as he knows JDG is probably getting antsy, but the deal will happen before ST ends.


All due respect Eric but it sounds like DeGrom's camp is upset with the lack of movement. Why wouldn't Brodie be able to tell him exactly what you are saying if that's the case?
I'm  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:39 am : link
not buying it sorry. DeGrom would be upset if the Mets made him an offer but suggested year 1 might be structured X or Y depending on say Gio Gonzalez and this is why they are frustrated no offer has been made? Doesn't compute. If they were exchanging offers and the frustration was in said offer I'd agree.
This is an organizational hallmark for a reason  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 11:40 am : link
In comment 14294439 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:

Jeffrey Paternostro
@jeffpaternostro

41s
I still expect this to get done but the fact that it will take brinksmanship through the papers is extremely Mets.


They don't operate with the financial flexibility they try to convey so things get messy. Like trying to qualify for a mortgage that's at the max someone can afford. Truth be told they may not even have enough money to even operate at the level they're at right now. Which is among the thousands of reasons the league should have forced them to divest or take on partners when the Madoff stuff happened.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:42 am : link
-Berry met with team COO Jeff Wilpon at the Winter Meetings to discuss deGroms future, but contract negotiations never gained traction, according to sources.

-DeGroms CAA agent, Jeff Berry, recently released a memo that outlined recourse for players who seek reform in free agency, following two historically slow markets. Among the ideas suggested by Berry was that pitchers could look to cap their workloads in a season to ensure their value remains at a higher level heading to free agency. And a source indicated deGrom could put such restrictions on himself if a new deal isnt reached with the Mets.

-Now, under new representation, deGrom is attempting to put heat on the Mets by issuing the March 28 deadline to have a new contract in place or risk leaving a storm cloud lingering over the star pitcher as he embarks on a new season.-Puma


Does not at all sound like it's just a matter of seeing if they add a Gio type. Again, this would be easily communicated to DeGrom
RE: I'm still pessimistic on the pitching re depth  
Vanzetti : 2/12/2019 11:42 am : link
In comment 14293829 speedywheels said:
Quote:
Matz will surely take his annual trip (or two) to the DL. And though Wheeler had a great year, I'm still not sure he has put his annual DL trip(s) behind him. If one/both of those guys miss extended time, I'm not confident in any of the replacement candidates.

Same thing for the 'pen - if every one stays healthy, they should be OK.

Offense should be OK.


Mets should expect 30+ missed starts. They definitely need a sixth starter unles they have faith Gagnon, Oswald etc

I like Lowrie as a player but more of a luxury signing with McNeil being pushed into a utility role. Sixth starter is a need imo not a luxury signing
This  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:43 am : link
will be a full-on circus all season if DeGrom doesn't get his deal and caps his own innings. The fans will turn on their best player because the TEAM didn't do what they said. Best way for the bullpen to be strong... MORE usage. Best way for the Mets to have a good season "will they trade DeGrom?" talk..
RE: RE: My guess is BVW is needs to wait until he's done signing players  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 11:45 am : link
In comment 14294442 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14294440 Eric on Li said:


Quote:


to figure out contract structure because of the way the Wilpons do the budget. If he ends up spending more on someone like Gio this year, or even going multi-year, they adjust the JDG year 1 & 2 salaries and punt money to the future - just like the Cano deal.

There is no human on earth who knows what is going through JDG's head more than BVW, so there's zero chance he's genuinely misreading the situation. He's also not talking tough or anything, so I think it's just a stall tactic as he knows JDG is probably getting antsy, but the deal will happen before ST ends.



All due respect Eric but it sounds like DeGrom's camp is upset with the lack of movement. Why wouldn't Brodie be able to tell him exactly what you are saying if that's the case?


a) we aren't even sure how much BVW is directly able to communicate with JDG because of the "recusal".
b) because the Wilpons are extremely tight lipped with all of their budgetary parameters and if the negotiations hit a snag at any point with JDG's camp or they wanted to play hard ball, it's something that could very easily find it's way into the press.

I'm all ears to other theories but I can't think of 1 where the Mets haven't even made an offer yet. The Wilpons tax refund coming out smaller than expected so they ran out of money? I mean, I just don't see how what was likely 1 of BVW's top goals from the outset could just completely go off track.
#1  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:48 am : link
Sherman said DeGrom flat out can talk to Brodie directly

#2 Why would that even matter? Jeff or Omar or whomever wouldn't be able to exchange basic outlines? or communicate "we got you, just figuring out 2019 payroll ramifications"? It's been 2 months (if you believe his camp) and nada. Brodie being able to talk to DeGrom directly (whether Sherman is right or not) is besides the point.
-  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 11:50 am : link
Berry and Matt Ricatto met in Las Vegas with Jeff Wilpon and John Ricco, then the Mets assistant GM. Van Wagenen, because he had been deGroms agent, was recused from negotiating the NL Cy Young winners one-year arbitration contract. The Players Association told The Post that there is no restriction on Van Wagenen negotiating a long-term deal for deGrom with his former partners at CAA.


So 1. He's allowed to if you believe the PA (and they would be the ones to say otherwise) 2. Jeff and Ricco could have communicated (and still could) "hey man, I know it's been slow but there is a scenario where year 1 is X and it goes up or year one is Y" not radio silence.
RE: RE: I'm still pessimistic on the pitching re depth  
speedywheels : 2/12/2019 11:53 am : link
In comment 14294454 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
In comment 14293829 speedywheels said:


Quote:


Matz will surely take his annual trip (or two) to the DL. And though Wheeler had a great year, I'm still not sure he has put his annual DL trip(s) behind him. If one/both of those guys miss extended time, I'm not confident in any of the replacement candidates.

Same thing for the 'pen - if every one stays healthy, they should be OK.

Offense should be OK.



Mets should expect 30+ missed starts. They definitely need a sixth starter unles they have faith Gagnon, Oswald etc

I like Lowrie as a player but more of a luxury signing with McNeil being pushed into a utility role. Sixth starter is a need imo not a luxury signing


I didn't even mention Thor and his annual trips to the DL, but yeah I can see the three of them missing 20+ starts (combined) pretty easily. Gio is no great shakes, but like him much more than Gagnon, etc.

Dan - the piece many are missing is this - JDG's mistrust isn't new  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 12:04 pm : link
the writers are acting surprised but it extends back several years with the organization and probably encompasses just about everyone in the org other than Brodie. He wanted an extension several years ago they said no. He (and BVW!) put out the press release 9 months ago ("sign me or trade me"). The Mets hire BVW, they express that resigning JDG is a top priority, and it seems like his prayers are answer.

It is completely understandable that his camp is antsy having not even received a contract offer.

The question is WHY haven't they even offered him a contract. That is the X in this equation. Unless BVW is completely FOS it's not for lack of desire. I don't think he's dumb enough to have made that a priority without having the financial means to do so. So what is the hold up on even extending an offer?
Its real simple  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 12:08 pm : link
Ton sides are concerned about the current market. Why overpay in an evolving market? And as a player, wouldnt you want an extension ASAP? Keuchel got them both wondering what to do, hence the frustration.
RE: Its real simple  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 12:11 pm : link
In comment 14294490 Shecky said:
Quote:
Ton sides are concerned about the current market. Why overpay in an evolving market? And as a player, wouldnt you want an extension ASAP? Keuchel got them both wondering what to do, hence the frustration.


Kershaw just received 3 years 93 million + incentives bumping the total over 100 million. Keuchel is nowhere near the pitcher DeGrom is and if you believe DeGrom nothing has been even discussed in 2 months. Communication skills continue to be terrible with this organization.
Like  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 12:15 pm : link
I said, if DeGrom is "lying" that's one thing but all reports say nothing has been discussed since a meeting on 12/2 in Las Vegas where he was told an offer would be forthcoming.

"LAS VEGAS Amid their scramble to find new players, the Mets found time Tuesday to begin discussions on securing their foundation.

According to an industry source, team officials convened with Jacob deGroms representatives at the winter meetings in the first step toward potentially locking up the ace right-hander to a long-term contract."

What is DeGrom supposed to do other than assume the worst?
JDG  
TyreeHelmet : 2/12/2019 12:16 pm : link
Im sure Jake feels betrayed by not only the Mets but Brodie too. And I wouldnt blame him one bit for capping his innings or being very cautious with any injury. Because the Mets sure as hell wont make him whole if he gets hurt heading into FA.

Only the Mets could screw up this situation. This guy is a model teammate coming off a hostoric season and they hired his agent as GM. Yet they still jerk this guy around?

And how do fans make excuses for the Wilpons? Who are they saving this money for if they wont pay him?
RE: JDG  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 1:14 pm : link
In comment 14294500 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
Im sure Jake feels betrayed by not only the Mets but Brodie too. And I wouldnt blame him one bit for capping his innings or being very cautious with any injury. Because the Mets sure as hell wont make him whole if he gets hurt heading into FA.

Only the Mets could screw up this situation. This guy is a model teammate coming off a hostoric season and they hired his agent as GM. Yet they still jerk this guy around?


I think this is dead on - which again gets me to how or why this is happening. I don't doubt Shecky but the evolving market place seems like an odd excuse to me. Corbin signed 6/140m, and he's the better comp to JDG than Keuchel anyway. Carrasco may be an even better comp and he gave them an amazingly team friendly early extension comp.

I don't see why a slower market for Keuchel would stop progress entirely to the point of not making an offer. If they thought the market conditions were favorable, just make an offer more aggressively towards Carrasco vs. Corbin. Something in between those 2 ranges makes sense for both sides. Starting lower and disagreeing I get. Not even making an offer when it was 1 of your top priorities of the offseason is strange even by Met standards.
As much as things change, they still remain  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 1:22 pm : link
Black cloud follows the team on day one lol
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 1:35 pm : link
The Wilpons see Harper and Machado unlikely to get the money expected, they see Kimbrel unlikely to get the money expected etc so they are slowing down/not engaging because they are angling to hop on with DeGrom having to settle for less than anticipated. They know they don't "have to" speak to DeGrom at all. He's under contract. It's just a dirty way to handle your star player after telling him you would. You reportedly shop Thor and now this. What reason do the players have to trust them? Would you?
Dom  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 1:38 pm : link
looking good
Link - ( New Window )
RE: .  
TyreeHelmet : 2/12/2019 1:49 pm : link
In comment 14294571 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
The Wilpons see Harper and Machado unlikely to get the money expected, they see Kimbrel unlikely to get the money expected etc so they are slowing down/not engaging because they are angling to hop on with DeGrom having to settle for less than anticipated. They know they don't "have to" speak to DeGrom at all. He's under contract. It's just a dirty way to handle your star player after telling him you would. You reportedly shop Thor and now this. What reason do the players have to trust them? Would you?


And this takes a toll on these players. They are human beings and not robots. Of all people, you think Brodie would have understood the importance of getting this done. It's one thing to negotiate on a fair deal. It's another thing to lie to your star player and not even make an offer.
Brodies going to speak about it  
Shecky : 2/12/2019 1:51 pm : link
I think it just kinda b,ew up, since everyones looking for a story together tkday
BVW saying their timelines are in sync (deal before season)  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 1:56 pm : link
would seem to indicate they are just waiting on something to eventually make their offer. I guess it's just waiting to see how the rest of the FA class does? Good job by BVW coming out and not letting the drama continue to build.
Here's the bvw quote  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 2:00 pm : link
Quote:
Matt Ehalt
@MattEhalt
51s51 seconds ago
More
Brodie: this concept of an opening day deadline for contract discussions is a mutual understanding. There is no reason for a distraction to carry into the regular season and we will continue to have dialogue over the course of this spring and see where those discussions lead."
The  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 3:17 pm : link
writers are telling another story and even BVW now makes it sounds like it's not a lock they do a deal.

"Mike Puma
Mike Puma
@NYPost_Mets

1h
Van Wagenen: "From my standpoint, Jacob, we care about him and he knows we care about him. He knows how important he is to the organization and it will be my job to make sure there is no strained relationship no matter what takes place.""
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 3:20 pm : link
Matt Ehalt
@MattEhalt

1h
Should be noted Mets gave deGrom largest raise in arbitration history. That was a goodwill gesture. But, they told deGrom's side there would be an offer, and camp has started and there's nothing.

He also confirmed Joel Sherman's blurb, does not have to recuse himself from contract talks. Would be directly involved
I can't help remembering when Spano "owned" the islanders  
Eric on Li : 2/12/2019 3:49 pm : link
and kept telling creditors "the checks were coming" and then the checks arrived multiple multiple zeros off.
The  
mitch300 : 2/12/2019 3:51 pm : link
Mets have him locked up for two more years. Why not just wait. Your gonna give a long term contract to a pitcher who had TJ surgery before you have to. He will be 32 when he becomes a free agent.
RE: The  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 3:56 pm : link
In comment 14294699 mitch300 said:
Quote:
Mets have him locked up for two more years. Why not just wait. Your gonna give a long term contract to a pitcher who had TJ surgery before you have to. He will be 32 when he becomes a free agent.


Here is his agent in July-

"That being said.... July

We have discussed Jacobs future with the Mets at length. Jacob has expressed interest in exploring a long-term partnership that would keep him in a Mets uniform for years to come...

If the Mets dont share same interest, we believe their best course of action is to seriously consider trade opportunities now. The inertia of current situation could complicate Jacobs relationship with the club and creates an atmosphere of indecision.

Brodie is that egg scrambled or once over easy?... whoops his agent in July... Brodie
Jay Jaffe on fangraphs has  
Metnut : 2/12/2019 5:00 pm : link
Buckholz best fit as being our NY Mets:

Clay Buchholz: Mets
Limited to just two starts in 2017 due to a partially torn flexor pronator mass, the 34-year-old Buchholz is still without a 30-start campaign to his name despite spending the better part of 12 seasons in the majors. Last year, after opting out of a minor league deal with the Royals, Buchholz resurfaced with the D-backs and assembled a half-season performance not unlike his tantalizing 2013 and 15 ones: 16 starts, 98.1 innings, 15.0% K-BB%, with a 2.01 ERA and a 3.47 FIP. Alas, he suffered another flexor strain on September 13, and he was shut down for the year after receiving a platelet-rich plasma injection.



Obviously, Buchholz isnt going to provide anyone with 200 innings, but hes capable of being an average-or-better starter if healthy, and thus rates as being worth a flier. He was in contact with the Rangers earlier this winter, but no deal panned out. To these eyes, hed make more sense for a contender like the Mets and with 85 projected wins, its fair to call them that. On the strength of a front four of Jacob deGrom, Noah Syndergaard, Steven Matz, and Zack Wheeler, their rotation is projected to be the majors seventh-best, but while that group was healthy enough to combine for 116 starts last year, its worth remembering that in 2017, they were available for just 68. Whats more, their fifth starter right now remains Jason Vargas, who was torched for a 5.77 ERA and a 5.02 FIP in 20 starts last year. Even if he cant match last seasons performance, Buchholz should be able to outdo whatever Vargas and nominal sixth starter Hector Santiago can provide, without breaking the bank.


https://blogs.fangraphs.com/lets-find-homes-for-a-few-more-unsigned-free-agents/ - ( New Window )
I've  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 5:04 pm : link
been pushing for Buchholz
Dan, if we were to add Buchholz  
CMicks3110 : 2/12/2019 10:38 pm : link
do you see him as the 5th starter, or long man, or somewhere in between with Vargas.

Personally, and I've been thinking about this a decent amount, I might be more open to adding another reliever and moving Lugo into the rotation.

Lugo, in my opinion, has #3 starter upside and really lengthens out the rotation. Why not add someone like Warren or Madsen, move Lugo to rotation.

I wonder if there might be a trade target for a set-up man, I know it might be pricey, but would love to grab Leclerc from Texas. I know Brodie had talks back at the winter meetings with the Rangers. I wonder if we could package something for him.
RE: Dan, if we were to add Buchholz  
DanMetroMan : 2/12/2019 10:40 pm : link
In comment 14295017 CMicks3110 said:
Quote:
do you see him as the 5th starter, or long man, or somewhere in between with Vargas.

Personally, and I've been thinking about this a decent amount, I might be more open to adding another reliever and moving Lugo into the rotation.

Lugo, in my opinion, has #3 starter upside and really lengthens out the rotation. Why not add someone like Warren or Madsen, move Lugo to rotation.

I wonder if there might be a trade target for a set-up man, I know it might be pricey, but would love to grab Leclerc from Texas. I know Brodie had talks back at the winter meetings with the Rangers. I wonder if we could package something for him.


I'd be all about Lugo in the rotatiom but if not yeah i'd give Buchholtz first shot. His cutter was dominant last year.
I could care less about the deGrom negotiations  
ZGiants98 : 2/12/2019 10:48 pm : link
Mets are in the drivers seat. deGrom will be a 33 year old free agent and its not like he's in the last year of control even yet. The deGrom deal almost certainly ends up a bad one for the Mets anyway. I personally would wrap up Syndergaard long term before I worried about deGrom.

That said this is all posturing and the deGrom deal gets done this spring. 99% chance.

So this is going back to Cespedes  
bhill410 : 2/13/2019 6:45 am : link
I posted this last summer but essentially same as what Shecky posted. One of my best friends is an ortho surgeon who has done multiple surgeries on that level of athlete (will not get more specific than that), but essentially said removing the Achilles to remove the calcification is fairly serious especially if they are doing both but that 8-10 months is too long. Had it closer to 5-6.

That is why the notion that cespedes will be out all year is only accurate if cespedes wants it to be accurate. The other thing to consider is that insurance isnt going to pay if someone is medically cleared but trying to game the system. So there are factors at play for multiple parties.
And I take the same stance as Z and Shecky  
bhill410 : 2/13/2019 6:56 am : link
That unless there was some crazy abnormality in that surgery there is no medical reason why he couldnt be ready by April May. After Conforto last year + Cespedess unique personality you get the conservative timeline of all star break to the vagaries of all season. The Mets clearly dont know what to expect from him emotionally and want to maintain a consistent record for insurance purposes when/if his questionable work ethic arises. For purposes of discussing from a fans perspective it means nothing because there is an enormous gradient of outcomes, but know that a July or all season outcome is not supported by the medical community
I actually had the surgery done  
csb : 2/13/2019 8:55 am : link
I had these bone spurs from hockey skates; I had the surgery in early May and was able to play again in September for training camp. Granted, I was 18 years old and heal quicker than a 30 year old, but I was shocked to hear the 10-12 months. I get that the Achilles needs more time to heal for running than for skating, however 3-5 months would seem reasonable to me.
In matters of money and contracts  
Ten Ton Hammer : 2/13/2019 8:59 am : link
there's really no justifiable reason to give the Mets the benefit of the doubt.
RE: And I take the same stance as Z and Shecky  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:14 am : link
In comment 14295095 bhill410 said:
Quote:
That unless there was some crazy abnormality in that surgery there is no medical reason why he couldnt be ready by April May. After Conforto last year + Cespedess unique personality you get the conservative timeline of all star break to the vagaries of all season. The Mets clearly dont know what to expect from him emotionally and want to maintain a consistent record for insurance purposes when/if his questionable work ethic arises. For purposes of discussing from a fans perspective it means nothing because there is an enormous gradient of outcomes, but know that a July or all season outcome is not supported by the medical community


He's not going to be back in April or May. I'm so positive of this fact, I will not post on a single Mets thread all season of Yoenis Cespedes is playing for the Mets before June 1st. It's not happening.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:15 am : link
Do not expect any updates on Yoenis Cespedes.

The Mets slugger, who is entering the third year of a four-year deal, is not expected to return from double-heel surgery until at least July.

Mets GM Brodie Van Wagenen, who was Cespedes agent until October, however, would not answer questions about the 33-year olds rehab or what the Mets can hope to get from him this year.

We wont get into those, Van Wagenen said when asked about a timeline for Cespedes return. I think weve continued to be patient with him, were responsible not only his health, but also recognizing we need him and need him to be at his best when he comes back, so whenever that is we will be able to infuse him into our lineup.
Anyone  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:16 am : link
want to take me up on a Met? We can't do money or I would. I'm absolutely 100% positive there is no chance Cespedes is back in April/May, it's absurd.

"Privately, Mets officials have openly speculated if the Cuban-born slugger will ever be an everyday contributor again. Mets special advisor to the GM Omar Minaya came close to admitting that earlier this month when on MLB radio the said, If he gives us anything this year, that is great, we're happy for that.

Van Wagenen, who represented Cespedes when he signed the $110 million deal with the Mets, masterfully redirected questions about his ability to contribute this season.

Were just really excited and hopeful that hes going to be playing a big part of this team, While we havent put a timeline on it, we certainly expect him to be playing meaningful games and impacting this lineup, Van Wagenen said. As weve constructed it, weve got a really length to our lineup offensively as we have, now you insert Cespedes into that potentially at some point in the summer, youve got a really dominating and intimidating lineup we can go into the pennant race with.
From last week  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:22 am : link
"Not only is Van Wagenen adamant Cespedes will contribute to the 2019 Mets, he expects Cespedes will turn back the clock to 2015. Cespedes is expected to miss at least half of the season after undergoing surgeries on both of his heels.

"We expect him to be an MVP-caliber player when he comes back," Van Wagenen said Monday at Citi Field. "And I know he does as well."


Suddenly the Mets are super secretive in the face of critique of their spending.. and flat out lying but Cespedes will be ready to go in a month into the season? Does that really make sense?
A world class athlete that size  
Metnut : 2/13/2019 9:23 am : link
of Cespedes that has to put that kind of force on his lower body to run and to swing to generate the type of power that he does is likely very different than laymen or amateur athletes. Even most doctors havn't dealt with a world class athlete like Cespedes. Only the best of the best even get a chance to work on someone like that.

Besides, do we really think the Mets would say Cespedes is going to be out longer than he'll actually be when they are trying to sell tickets? If anything, they'd do the opposite and give an overly optimistic type of timeline (as they've done in the past).
RE: A world class athlete that size  
csb : 2/13/2019 9:32 am : link
In comment 14295167 Metnut said:
Quote:
of Cespedes that has to put that kind of force on his lower body to run and to swing to generate the type of power that he does is likely very different than laymen or amateur athletes. Even most doctors havn't dealt with a world class athlete like Cespedes. Only the best of the best even get a chance to work on someone like that.

Besides, do we really think the Mets would say Cespedes is going to be out longer than he'll actually be when they are trying to sell tickets? If anything, they'd do the opposite and give an overly optimistic type of timeline (as they've done in the past).


I'll counter that with guys like AP, Wes Welker, etc. who have come back from ACL injuries far quicker than normal people. The fact that he's an elite athlete should allow him to return quicker rather than slower.
I do wonder  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 9:34 am : link
If hes golfed yet
RE: I do wonder  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:36 am : link
In comment 14295178 Shecky said:
Quote:
If hes golfed yet


He's not even cleared to jog until next month the earliest pending clearance from the doctors so if he's playing golf they should look to void his contract
shecky is all about entrapment to save money these days  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 9:37 am : link
i'm still beyond impressed at the idea of slipping Cano some PED's in a couple years when he regresses to save some $.
Not  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:41 am : link
trying to make this political so I'll say this as neutral as I can... a family member of a member of the team is going on political rants and openly fighting with fans on twitter. Real smart move...
The top 50  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:42 am : link
Rookie maximums for at-bats (130), games pitched (30) or innings (50) in the major leagues"

If the 2 leaders are within 5% of each other, or the leader has less than 30% there will be a run-off between the top 2. If a run-off results in a tie the tiebreaker will be vote total in the previous poll, we will continue to "go back" in the polls until there is a clear leader.

*Jeff McNeil is ineligible
*Chris Flexen is ineligible
*Drew Smith is ineligible
*Tyler Bashlor is ineligible

1) Andres Gimenez (SS) AA 19/37 votes- 51%
2) Peter Alonso (1B) AAA 24/36 votes- 67%
3) Ronny Mauricio (SS) Kingsport 12/33-36%
4) Mark Vientos (3b) Kingsport 16/31-52%
5) David Peterson (LHP) A+ 21/31- 68%
6) Franklyn Kilome (RHP) AA 20/33-61%
7) Thomas Szapucki (LHP) A 18/32-56%
8 ) Shervyen Newton (SS) Kingsport 12/30-40%, Run-off with Anthony Kay 17/33-52%
9) Anthony Kay (LHP) AA 18/26-69%
10) Simeon Woods-Richardson (RHP) Kingsport 12/30-40%
11) Will Toffey (3B) 10/29-34%, run-off with Cecchini 15/27-56%
12) Gavin Cecchini (2b) 14/26-46%
13) Francisco Alvarez (C) 9/26-35%
14) Dez Lindsay (OF) 7/18-39%
15) Tony Dibrell (RHP) 9/23-39%
16) Jordan Humphreys (RHP) 7/21-33%, Run-off with Nido 18/24-75%
17) Junior Santos (RHP) 6/28-21%, Run-off with Nido 11/20-55%
18) Tomas Nido (C) 10/23-43%
19) Luis Guillorme (SS) 9/24-38%
20) Adrian Hernandez 6/26-23%, run-off with Wahl/Cortes 8/15-53%
21) Carlos Cortes (2b) 8/21-38%
22) Steven Villines (RHP) 4/16 25%, Run-off with Thompson/Wahl 9/23-39%
23) David Thompson (3b) 8/23-35%
24) Ali Sanchez (C) 9/17-53%
25) Eric Hanhold (RHP) 7/21-33%, run-off 7/20-35%
26) Luis Carpio (IF) 4/18-22%, runoff with Uriarte 9/14-64%
27) Stanley Consuegra (OF) 4/20-20%, runoff with Uriarte/Valdez 6/17-35%, advances due to more votes in previous poll
28) Juan Uriarte (C) 4/19-21%
29) Freddy Valdez (OF) 7/17-41%
30) Daniel Zamora (LHP) 3/17-18%, run-off with Montes De Oca 10/12-83%
31) Jaylen Palmer (??) 3/12-25%, run-off with Montes de Oca/Vilera 9/16-56%
32) Ryley Gilliam (RHP) 5/22-23%, run-off with Manea 8/16-50%, advances due to more votes in previous poll
33) Matt Winaker (OF) 4/22-18
34) Kyle Dowdy (RHP) 6/20-30%, run-off with Vilera 9/12-75%
35) Jaison Vilera (RHP) 6/17-35%
36) Jose Miguel Medina(OF) 6/17-24%
37) Jeremy Vasquez (1b) 3/18-17% run-off with MDO/Manea/Viall 3/7-43%
38) Patrick Mazeika (C) 4/13-31%
39) Walker Lockett (RHP) 5/13-38%
40) Sam Haggerty (UTIL) 7/11 64%
41) Chris Viall (RHP) 4/11 36%
42) Ryder Ryan (RHP) 8/13- 62%
43) Bryce Montes de Oca 6/19 32%
44) Christian James 6/17-35%
45) Joe Cavallaro 3/17-18%, run-off with Brodey 7/13-54%
46) Michael Paez (IF) 5/22-23%
47) David Marcano (RHP) 4/22-18%, run-off with Brody 7/12-58%
48) Quinn Brodey (OF) 5/23-22%, 9/13-69%
49) Jose Moreno (RHP) 4/23-17% run-off with Gonzalez 8/14-57%
50) Tim Tebow (OF) 8/33-24%, run-off with Gonzalez 17/27-63%

HM-
Yoel Romero (UTIL)
Gregory Guerrero (SS)
Raul Beracierta (OF)
Kevin Kaczmarski (OF)
Hansel Moreno (UTIL)
Edgardo Fermin (SS/2B)
Kevin Smith (LHP)
Daison Acosta (RHP)
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 9:45 am : link
Michael Mayer
@mikemayerMMO

57m
Four Mets in FanGraphs Top 100 Prospects

Peter Alonso 48
Andres Gimenez 52
Ronny Mauricio 68
Mark Vientos 92
I consider myself a pretty big Met fan  
Metnut : 2/13/2019 10:00 am : link
and honestly hadn't heard of Ronny Mauricio until I read the list. Shame on me!
RE: I consider myself a pretty big Met fan  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 10:02 am : link
In comment 14295211 Metnut said:
Quote:
and honestly hadn't heard of Ronny Mauricio until I read the list. Shame on me!


Highest upside in the system. Newton might be higher but the swing and miss is so substantial that big bust factor is likely higher than most.
RE: I consider myself a pretty big Met fan  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 10:07 am : link
In comment 14295211 Metnut said:
Quote:
and honestly hadn't heard of Ronny Mauricio until I read the list. Shame on me!

Seriously? Shame on you is right ;)
Wonder what the story  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 10:08 am : link
With the ranch is?
RE: Wonder what the story  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14295228 Shecky said:
Quote:
With the ranch is?


Unless I'm missing a player I don't recall you ever disliking a player as much as Cespedes lol. I don't have any current Mets I feel that way about (Vargas blows but I just don't care about him enough). I used to feel that was about Luis Castillo.
Lets stick with the positives then ;)  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 10:29 am : link
And back to Mauricio...
Ive made my comp who he resembles to me, lets call that the pie in the sky dream. But I feel like weve got a futeture top ten prospect on our hands. Felt that way about Kelenic as well. Ive always loved Alonso, even though the odds were always stacked against him. And Gimenez is the rare prospect that will always outplays his skills. A bunch of the arms have been forgotten about, but some will be useful down the road. Several McNeil types without his ceiling. Its. A young farm, but maturing. For a shitty farm post trades, Im still very very optimistic it will be productive.
Hopefully  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 10:34 am : link
Szapucki bounces back and shows the stuff he had pre-TJ. Humphreys is overrated by Mets fans by virtue of being lumped in with Szapucki. Humphreys upside is a Dillon Gee type. That's not a knock, that's a great outcome.
Phillies buy out Nola's 3 arb years + 1 FA year for 4/44m total  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 10:47 am : link
Honestly, all of the comps seem very ideal for the Mets to get a good deal on JDG right now. They'd be buying out his final 2 arb years, which are obviously more expensive, but I don't think they'd have to go beyond 2 or 3 FA years. Pretty sure they'd be able to get him well under what Corbin got as a UFA this year (6/140m).

5/100m would seem like a great outcome for all involved. The only reason I can think of BVW saying what he said yesterday is supreme confidence that they know getting a deal done will be very easy.
Dillon Gee types  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 10:50 am : link
Are so underrated. Gee, Duda, Legares, Murphy, Nielse, Familia, Mejia. None are whats prospect follower would be considered good outcomes. Even Familia hit his floor, no where near his ceiling.

But

What does that afford a team? A 4th and 5th starter. A closer. Couple starting position players. Thats like $50m+ saved offf payroll. Think about what you can buy in free agency TODAY with $50mm for upper end talent? Obviously you want top Ten prospects. Obviously you want DeGroms to develop. But those role players being developed are extremely vital. And not very difficult to produce, its what made the Cardinals so good for so long.

On top of that. If your player development is revamped and you can develop these players to do all the little things well (ex Cardinals), those players become IMMENSELY more valuable. Slightly better defensively, slightly better base running, slightly better at moving runners over, etc. it is incredibly easy to develop a pipeline of players who add .1 war in five categories just by teaching them to be fundamentally superior. I think thats where we can be headed...
LOCK UP  
Shecky : 2/13/2019 10:51 am : link
THOR!!!!!!!!!
RE: LOCK UP  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 10:52 am : link
In comment 14295294 Shecky said:
Quote:
THOR!!!!!!!!!


Agreed - I mean, jeez, we couldn't ask for a better comp than that.
RE: Dillon Gee types  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 10:56 am : link
In comment 14295292 Shecky said:
Quote:
Are so underrated. Gee, Duda, Legares, Murphy, Nielse, Familia, Mejia. None are whats prospect follower would be considered good outcomes. Even Familia hit his floor, no where near his ceiling.

But

What does that afford a team? A 4th and 5th starter. A closer. Couple starting position players. Thats like $50m+ saved offf payroll. Think about what you can buy in free agency TODAY with $50mm for upper end talent? Obviously you want top Ten prospects. Obviously you want DeGroms to develop. But those role players being developed are extremely vital. And not very difficult to produce, its what made the Cardinals so good for so long.

On top of that. If your player development is revamped and you can develop these players to do all the little things well (ex Cardinals), those players become IMMENSELY more valuable. Slightly better defensively, slightly better base running, slightly better at moving runners over, etc. it is incredibly easy to develop a pipeline of players who add .1 war in five categories just by teaching them to be fundamentally superior. I think thats where we can be headed...


I just see a lot of people tossing around "Szapucki and Humphries" as if they are the same caliber of prospect. Humphries is a maxed out shortish RHP who throws strikes. He's 23 in June. The dream upside there is a Gee type who takes the ball every 5th day and keeps you in games. Gee, Trachsel etc. Szapucki has touched mid-90s from the left side and has missed bats. I still have major concerns with him and the odds of him being "the next" guy are low for various reasons but he certainly has a shot to be a the next top Mets pitching prospect. Humphries is not that.
Cespedes  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 10:59 am : link
arrives, walking pretty well, packed on the pounds however lol
I'm intrigued by Kay & Peterson this year  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 11:01 am : link
I've never been especially high on either one and Jon Niese is probably an optimistic outcome for either, but both were high picks who starting to show signs last year and were considered guys who could move quickly. Neither seems to be in the top 100 conversation right now but hopefully 1 of them can change that by midseason.
RE: Cespedes  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 11:02 am : link
In comment 14295314 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
arrives, walking pretty well, packed on the pounds however lol


That was my biggest worry - it would be tough for anyone over 30 to not put on bad weight getting surgery on both feet like that. If you tear and ACL you are back to rehab within a few months. I expect that wasn't the case with this type of foot surgery.
It's  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 11:09 am : link
a quick video but he looks very, very heavy. I'd say 30 pounds over playing weight. He's lost it before but yeah lol
Kay  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 11:10 am : link
just isn't the type to be a top 100 guy. He's a small lefty who is soon to be 24 who was mediocre in St. Lucie.
RE: Kay  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 11:18 am : link
In comment 14295341 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
just isn't the type to be a top 100 guy. He's a small lefty who is soon to be 24 who was mediocre in St. Lucie.


That's fair he's probably not a top 100 guy due to his age/lack of tools but if he or Peterson pitches well in the first half this year it's not impossible that they are options at the end of the season.
RE: Cespedes  
Dr. D : 2/13/2019 11:19 am : link
In comment 14295314 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
arrives, walking pretty well, packed on the pounds however lol

It's not like his job requires him to be in good physical condition or anything.
RE: RE: Kay  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 11:21 am : link
In comment 14295363 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
In comment 14295341 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


just isn't the type to be a top 100 guy. He's a small lefty who is soon to be 24 who was mediocre in St. Lucie.



That's fair he's probably not a top 100 guy due to his age/lack of tools but if he or Peterson pitches well in the first half this year it's not impossible that they are options at the end of the season.


Peterson is 6'6 and will be 23 for the entire season. If he pitches well he has an excellent shot. If he doesn't break out he'll then be a 24 year old "back end upside" type and those guys don't make top 100 lists. He certainly has a shot.
Frazier  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 11:22 am : link
also has come to camp looking chunky. twitter is letting him have it.
.  
DanMetroMan : 2/13/2019 11:23 am : link
What a deal for the Phillies

Jeff Passan
@JeffPassan
The breakdown of Aaron Nola's deal with the Phillies:

$2M signing bonus
2019: $4M
2020: $8M
2021: $11.75M
2022: $15M
2023: $16M club option with $4.25M buyout

The deal can cover two years of free agency for Nola if the Phillies exercise the option.
RE: .  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 11:25 am : link
In comment 14295380 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
What a deal for the Phillies

Jeff Passan
@JeffPassan
The breakdown of Aaron Nola's deal with the Phillies:

$2M signing bonus
2019: $4M
2020: $8M
2021: $11.75M
2022: $15M
2023: $16M club option with $4.25M buyout

The deal can cover two years of free agency for Nola if the Phillies exercise the option.


I'd offer Thor 1 literal dollar more right this second and pray he takes it. What a deal.
Not looking to start another war about it  
ZGiants98 : 2/13/2019 3:23 pm : link
But pretty clear to me still that McNeil-Nimmo-Conforto is your primary OF going forward with Lagares and Broxton playing against lefties and coming in late for defense. Think its fairly obvious listening to Mickey and BVW over the last couple of days even if they havent said It directly.
RE: Not looking to start another war about it  
Metnut : 2/13/2019 4:25 pm : link
In comment 14295829 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
But pretty clear to me still that McNeil-Nimmo-Conforto is your primary OF going forward with Lagares and Broxton playing against lefties and coming in late for defense. Think its fairly obvious listening to Mickey and BVW over the last couple of days even if they havent said It directly.


Not the best defense but.... versus right handed pitching... oh boy! It moved!
I'd imagine they'll play matchups  
Eric on Li : 2/13/2019 4:53 pm : link
and use Lagares/Broxton late in most games if they have leads. Over the last 3 years Broxton's OPS vs. lefties is almost .800 in about 200 AB.
Any new info on Gio Gonzalez?  
NYG27 : 2/13/2019 4:56 pm : link
How long will he hold out for a 2 year contract. Eventually he has to sign somewhere to a 1 year contract sooner or later, right?
RE: I'd imagine they'll play matchups  
ZGiants98 : 2/13/2019 10:13 pm : link
In comment 14295916 Eric on Li said:
Quote:
and use Lagares/Broxton late in most games if they have leads. Over the last 3 years Broxton's OPS vs. lefties is almost .800 in about 200 AB.


Really love the flexibility of this lineup above all else. We should shred righties but for once I think we might have a good shot against lefties too if we stay healthy. In the past, it felt like it was game over against a south paw, no matter who it was.
RE: RE: Not looking to start another war about it  
ZGiants98 : 2/13/2019 10:15 pm : link
In comment 14295892 Metnut said:
Quote:
In comment 14295829 ZGiants98 said:


Quote:


But pretty clear to me still that McNeil-Nimmo-Conforto is your primary OF going forward with Lagares and Broxton playing against lefties and coming in late for defense. Think its fairly obvious listening to Mickey and BVW over the last couple of days even if they havent said It directly.



Not the best defense but.... versus right handed pitching... oh boy! It moved!


Who knows? I think there's a chance McNeil is going to be decent in LF. Mickey has already said he's looked good out there (granted that doesnt mean much). I think Nimmo is passable in CF, Conforto is above average in a corner... if McNeil can be average-ish and you have close to two gold glove caliber players in reserve and coming in late for D, that doesn't really sound like a bad defensive OF to me. I guess we'll find out soon enough regarding McNeil.
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