The Numbers blatantly disagree. I just don't know where people are getting this from. I think people just make stuff up because they want to keep Eli. Haskins was a dominant passer at every level. He struggled to his deep left against pressure (1/8), but that is to be expected. He even completed 3/5 throws to his deep right against pressure.
I don't know if we have the resources available to move up for him Â
I basically watched parts of every single OSU game last year. Every single college and pro QB would kill for the protection Haskins got last year.
Look, Haskins is a solid prospect. But comparing him to Andrew Luck is just laughable. Luck compiled three years of work at Stanford. Guy made a ton plays outside the pocket and was a threat to run. And he ripped of a 4.67 forty at the Combine to Haskins 5+.
Luck would have thrown for 70 TDs behind the line and to those receivers.
Jets had to give up 3 2nd rounders to move from #6 to #3 last year Â
They are going to expect that same type of return on their end if we want to move up. I just can't see giving up that much draft capital/value to get this guy, especially considering how strong the QB class will be next year and therefore the likelihood a QB of Haskins's caliber will fall a bit in the draft. Think of the ratio of top-caliber QBs to teams looking for a QB in 2020, odds are someone very good will fall to mid-round-1 and we can grab him, or if we have to move up a *little* bit it doesn't cost as much to move up in the middle of the draft compared to the top of the draft.
That said, if Haskins is there at #6, I say take him. I think he is going to be a good pro, even if not a HOFer. His physical tools, work ethic, football IQ, and production in college all tell me he has a very high floor, which frankly is all we need with the weapons we have on this team (in other words we don't need the next Aaron Rodgers to have a very potent offense).
It's the same thing it is for every other QB. Stop with the BS. The analyst watches the tape, if there's pressure they note it. We all watch games, we know when our QB gets pressure. It's not rocket science. I watched most of Haskins snaps this season. He generally had good protection but it's still football and at times it broke down. Here's the interesting thing I saw. Early in the year he did struggle with it but he made consistent progress and by the end of the season he was making teams pay when they decided to test him with blitzes and his 'off platform' throws were better.
Let's remember this was his first and only starting season. What you want to see is development and his was noteworthy.
to move up in the middle of round 1 compared to moving up in the top of round 1. For instance, Arizona traded a 3rd and a 5th to move from #15 to #10 in 2018 to take Rosen. I think the QB(s) available at #10 will be very good next year. Everyone talks about how Tua, Fromm, and Herbert aren't "sure" things, a lot can happen in a year, etc. But they're forgetting that a year ago no one knew who Haskins or Murray was and we can't predict which OTHER QBs will have similar meteoric rises up the 2020 draft boards this coming college football season. I'm not exaggerating: I think there could be as many as 6 or 7 franchise QBs worthy of a 1st round grade in 2020. That's the year to get your next guy, regardless of how your team performs this year.
But again, if Haskins is there at #6 and they think he's next face of the franchise, take him, I just don't know if it's worth it to move heaven and earth to move 3 spots just to get him.
to move up in the middle of round 1 compared to moving up in the top of round 1. For instance, Arizona traded a 3rd and a 5th to move from #15 to #10 in 2018 to take Rosen. I think the QB(s) available at #10 will be very good next year. Everyone talks about how Tua, Fromm, and Herbert aren't "sure" things, a lot can happen in a year, etc. But they're forgetting that a year ago no one knew who Haskins or Murray was and we can't predict which OTHER QBs will have similar meteoric rises up the 2020 draft boards this coming college football season. I'm not exaggerating: I think there could be as many as 6 or 7 franchise QBs worthy of a 1st round grade in 2020. That's the year to get your next guy, regardless of how your team performs this year.
But again, if Haskins is there at #6 and they think he's next face of the franchise, take him, I just don't know if it's worth it to move heaven and earth to move 3 spots just to get him.
I think Haskins looks better than all but Tua. And Tua has gotten knocked around this past year
I'm not exaggerating: I think there could be as many as 6 or 7 franchise QBs worthy of a 1st round grade in 2020. That's the year to get your next guy, regardless of how your team performs this year.
No, you're exaggerating. There has never been a year when six or seven franchise QBs have been available.
BUT he does struggle when there is pressure. You rarely see him step up in the pocket. He keeps drifting back and he won’t move laterally it’s strivkty a vertical drop and he fades on his throws. His arm is strong enough which imo negates the necessity to get his feet under him. If he can throw an accurate ball under pressure fading back, which he does, I don’t see a reason to be bothered by the pressure issues. Sometimes his footwork is sloppy even wth a clean pocket. That’s stuff he can work on.
The Numbers blatantly disagree. I just don't know where people are getting this from. I think people just make stuff up because they want to keep Eli.
I think the people that are against him here are not the Eli fans. More of the "we should have drafted a QB last year group". As an Eli fan, I think he would be the perfect candidate to backup and then replace Eli.
Started 14 games. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I'm not a huge fan and he's not the 6th bestbprospect in the draft. I hope they don't take him but if they do will support him. I wouldn't go that way though myself
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
I don’t either. In fact, I don’t think we take one period.
If BBI has taught us anything, there will be a meltdown if we take Haskins or don't take Haskins. The only difference will be which contingent of BBI will be melting down.
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
and Dolphins gearing up for 2020 QBs...I think we might be in the clear to stay pat at 6 and get him. Denver and Cincy would be the teams to possibly trade up, but they haven't been linked to Haskins
RE: RE: RE: RE: I can’t wait for the meltdown of BBI Â
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
I don’t either. In fact, I don’t think we take one period.
If BBI has taught us anything, there will be a meltdown if we take Haskins or don't take Haskins. The only difference will be which contingent of BBI will be melting down.
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
BBI is the only place grown men gather to analyze the thumbs of actresses and models. BBI is actually just a thumb fetish site masquerading as a football site so we can look at it at work.
If BBI has taught us anything, there will be a meltdown if we take Haskins or don't take Haskins. The only difference will be which contingent of BBI will be melting down.
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
WE DIDN'T TAKE HASKINS OR MURRAY!! FIRE GETTLEMAN NOW!!!
That said I think he’s the likely pick at 6. I don’t see how you can ignore what DG said about wanting to do what EA did and get out next franchise QB. And I think Haskins is a great prospect. The whole “wait until next year” thing is a pipe dream not a plan.
there will be 20% of this site that is convinced that the team just grabbed whatever QB was available since they screwed up last year and passed on the 3 future hall of famers to take a running back very similar to one we could have signed as a UFA.
If the Giants don't take Haskins, then the team believes Eli is still in his prime and they will ride him for the next 5 years trying desperately to "win one more with Eli."
This is factual and unavoidable.
RE: Jets had to give up 3 2nd rounders to move from #6 to #3 last year Â
They are going to expect that same type of return on their end if we want to move up. I just can't see giving up that much draft capital/value to get this guy, especially considering how strong the QB class will be next year and therefore the likelihood a QB of Haskins's caliber will fall a bit in the draft. Think of the ratio of top-caliber QBs to teams looking for a QB in 2020, odds are someone very good will fall to mid-round-1 and we can grab him, or if we have to move up a *little* bit it doesn't cost as much to move up in the middle of the draft compared to the top of the draft.
.
Dave Te highlighted 13 teams this year that could be looking for a QB. I tend to doubt your "odds are" scenario but ofc it depends on what the definition of "top caliber" means.
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
but I can the point of going for the future. The only thing I hope they DONT do is trade up to get him. We need all our draft picks and I am not sure the value is there.
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
I just read whathe said.
+1 to your post. It's okay to not want the QB - Haskins at 6. ButI think it awful to take the others if you pass on Haskins unless you think they are better.
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
We'd get an extra #2, #3, or both by trading down, so the risk of Lock or Jones is minimized. But as I said, even then I'd probably pass on both.
I basically watched parts of every single OSU game last year. Every single college and pro QB would kill for the protection Haskins got last year.
Look, Haskins is a solid prospect. But comparing him to Andrew Luck is just laughable. Luck compiled three years of work at Stanford. Guy made a ton plays outside the pocket and was a threat to run. And he ripped of a 4.67 forty at the Combine to Haskins 5+.
Luck would have thrown for 70 TDs behind the line and to those receivers.
This is correct. Its really hard to evaluate QB's from these dominant programs, you just can't go on stats because they get distorted. You get some really good QB's, but you also get some busts like Leinert. For QB's from these places the combine, personal workouts, etc. all matter more than the "raw" stats.
LOL, there's bw again with the 5 Mississippi's - can't even get creative at this point.
You'd think Haskins just threw against guys in shells for an entire season reading these ridiculous takes.
Well, I did lower it from the original 7. ;)
But be honest. You watch a lot of college football and you must admit was Haskins the recipient of the best protection in college football. And that just distorts his results.
Do you remember Goff's final year at Cal under Sonny Dykes? His protection that year was atrocious. Dykes's RPO should have been called Ridiculous Pass Offense for the lack protection. But it allowed you to see Goff under duress and how he handled that. And what you saw were some outstanding throws with small windows and little time. It was easy to see why Goff may have the goods to handle the next level...
So that's something I always look for. With Haskins, there is not enough there to give me the confidence he can do that at a high level. Thus, taking him at #6 is very, very risky...
LOL, there's bw again with the 5 Mississippi's - can't even get creative at this point.
You'd think Haskins just threw against guys in shells for an entire season reading these ridiculous takes.
Well, I did lower it from the original 7. ;)
But be honest. You watch a lot of college football and you must admit was Haskins the recipient of the best protection in college football. And that just distorts his results.
Do you remember Goff's final year at Cal under Sonny Dykes? His protection that year was atrocious. Dykes's RPO should have been called Ridiculous Pass Offense for the lack protection. But it allowed you to see Goff under duress and how he handled that. And what you saw were some outstanding throws with small windows and little time. It was easy to see why Goff may have the goods to handle the next level...
So that's something I always look for. With Haskins, there is not enough there to give me the confidence he can do that at a high level. Thus, taking him at #6 is very, very risky...
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
It's the same thing it is for every other QB. Stop with the BS. The analyst watches the tape, if there's pressure they note it. We all watch games, we know when our QB gets pressure. It's not rocket science. I watched most of Haskins snaps this season. He generally had good protection but it's still football and at times it broke down. Here's the interesting thing I saw. Early in the year he did struggle with it but he made consistent progress and by the end of the season he was making teams pay when they decided to test him with blitzes and his 'off platform' throws were better.
Let's remember this was his first and only starting season. What you want to see is development and his was noteworthy.
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
They actually picked Weeden during his time there. I feel like that merits an incomplete, since Weeden was already 29 when drafted and therefore probably had no room for development. Then again, PS could've had input on drafting that dud.
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
They actually picked Weeden during his time there. I feel like that merits an incomplete, since Weeden was already 29 when drafted and therefore probably had no room for development. Then again, PS could've had input on drafting that dud.
I stand corrected. Good catch.
I think Holmgren may have still been there. So it may have been his call.
2019 QBs vs. 2018 QBs - ( New Window )
I basically watched parts of every single OSU game last year. Every single college and pro QB would kill for the protection Haskins got last year.
Look, Haskins is a solid prospect. But comparing him to Andrew Luck is just laughable. Luck compiled three years of work at Stanford. Guy made a ton plays outside the pocket and was a threat to run. And he ripped of a 4.67 forty at the Combine to Haskins 5+.
Luck would have thrown for 70 TDs behind the line and to those receivers.
That said, if Haskins is there at #6, I say take him. I think he is going to be a good pro, even if not a HOFer. His physical tools, work ethic, football IQ, and production in college all tell me he has a very high floor, which frankly is all we need with the weapons we have on this team (in other words we don't need the next Aaron Rodgers to have a very potent offense).
Let's remember this was his first and only starting season. What you want to see is development and his was noteworthy.
But again, if Haskins is there at #6 and they think he's next face of the franchise, take him, I just don't know if it's worth it to move heaven and earth to move 3 spots just to get him.
But again, if Haskins is there at #6 and they think he's next face of the franchise, take him, I just don't know if it's worth it to move heaven and earth to move 3 spots just to get him.
I think Haskins looks better than all but Tua. And Tua has gotten knocked around this past year
No, you're exaggerating. There has never been a year when six or seven franchise QBs have been available.
Dwayne Haskins Ohio State 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
Year: 2018
Josh Allen Wyoming 62 (Left) 62 (Right)
Baker Mayfield Oklahoma 59 (Left) 60 (Right)
Josh Rosen UCLA 57 (Left) 59 (Right)
Kyle Lauletta Richmond 52 (Left) 52 (Right)
I think the people that are against him here are not the Eli fans. More of the "we should have drafted a QB last year group". As an Eli fan, I think he would be the perfect candidate to backup and then replace Eli.
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
Quote:
If we don’t take Haskins.
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
I don’t either. In fact, I don’t think we take one period.
Quote:
In comment 14325630 dep026 said:
Quote:
If we don’t take Haskins.
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
I don’t either. In fact, I don’t think we take one period.
If BBI has taught us anything, there will be a meltdown if we take Haskins or don't take Haskins. The only difference will be which contingent of BBI will be melting down.
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
Quote:
In comment 14325634 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 14325630 dep026 said:
Quote:
If we don’t take Haskins.
I don’t think we take any QB in round 1 if Eli isn’t cut.
I don’t either. In fact, I don’t think we take one period.
If BBI has taught us anything, there will be a meltdown if we take Haskins or don't take Haskins. The only difference will be which contingent of BBI will be melting down.
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
Um, womens thumbs?
There is no topic on BBI that can't foster hysterical meltdowns from somebody.
WE DIDN'T TAKE HASKINS OR MURRAY!! FIRE GETTLEMAN NOW!!!
If the Giants don't take Haskins, then the team believes Eli is still in his prime and they will ride him for the next 5 years trying desperately to "win one more with Eli."
This is factual and unavoidable.
.
Dave Te highlighted 13 teams this year that could be looking for a QB. I tend to doubt your "odds are" scenario but ofc it depends on what the definition of "top caliber" means.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
You'd think Haskins just threw against guys in shells for an entire season reading these ridiculous takes.
Quote:
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
I just read whathe said.
+1 to your post. It's okay to not want the QB - Haskins at 6. ButI think it awful to take the others if you pass on Haskins unless you think they are better.
Quote:
don't want Haskins or any QB at #6. I'd be OK with Lock or Jones after a trade down into the middle of the first round. I'd prefer Lock, but might well still pass on both. I've also said that I would trade a mid first round pick for Rosen, but I understand that is quite unlikely. I don't think this is the year for a QB. Build the rest of the team and get a QB next year.
You don't want Hasking at 6, but you're okay with two project QBs at 15 to 18?
We'd get an extra #2, #3, or both by trading down, so the risk of Lock or Jones is minimized. But as I said, even then I'd probably pass on both.
I basically watched parts of every single OSU game last year. Every single college and pro QB would kill for the protection Haskins got last year.
Look, Haskins is a solid prospect. But comparing him to Andrew Luck is just laughable. Luck compiled three years of work at Stanford. Guy made a ton plays outside the pocket and was a threat to run. And he ripped of a 4.67 forty at the Combine to Haskins 5+.
Luck would have thrown for 70 TDs behind the line and to those receivers.
This is correct. Its really hard to evaluate QB's from these dominant programs, you just can't go on stats because they get distorted. You get some really good QB's, but you also get some busts like Leinert. For QB's from these places the combine, personal workouts, etc. all matter more than the "raw" stats.
You'd think Haskins just threw against guys in shells for an entire season reading these ridiculous takes.
Well, I did lower it from the original 7. ;)
But be honest. You watch a lot of college football and you must admit was Haskins the recipient of the best protection in college football. And that just distorts his results.
Do you remember Goff's final year at Cal under Sonny Dykes? His protection that year was atrocious. Dykes's RPO should have been called Ridiculous Pass Offense for the lack protection. But it allowed you to see Goff under duress and how he handled that. And what you saw were some outstanding throws with small windows and little time. It was easy to see why Goff may have the goods to handle the next level...
So that's something I always look for. With Haskins, there is not enough there to give me the confidence he can do that at a high level. Thus, taking him at #6 is very, very risky...
Quote:
LOL, there's bw again with the 5 Mississippi's - can't even get creative at this point.
You'd think Haskins just threw against guys in shells for an entire season reading these ridiculous takes.
Well, I did lower it from the original 7. ;)
But be honest. You watch a lot of college football and you must admit was Haskins the recipient of the best protection in college football. And that just distorts his results.
Do you remember Goff's final year at Cal under Sonny Dykes? His protection that year was atrocious. Dykes's RPO should have been called Ridiculous Pass Offense for the lack protection. But it allowed you to see Goff under duress and how he handled that. And what you saw were some outstanding throws with small windows and little time. It was easy to see why Goff may have the goods to handle the next level...
So that's something I always look for. With Haskins, there is not enough there to give me the confidence he can do that at a high level. Thus, taking him at #6 is very, very risky...
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
Let's remember this was his first and only starting season. What you want to see is development and his was noteworthy.
well said
Quote:
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
They actually picked Weeden during his time there. I feel like that merits an incomplete, since Weeden was already 29 when drafted and therefore probably had no room for development. Then again, PS could've had input on drafting that dud.
Quote:
In comment 14326421 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
QB evaluation: How would your evaluation skills compare to that of Shurmur’s?
The better question is why should we trust Shurmur when he doesn't have a track record of picking QBs? He was at Cleveland from 2011 to 2012 and they didn't chose a QB. He may have a decent track record working with existing NFL QBS but whether he can project a college prospect...who knows...
They actually picked Weeden during his time there. I feel like that merits an incomplete, since Weeden was already 29 when drafted and therefore probably had no room for development. Then again, PS could've had input on drafting that dud.
I stand corrected. Good catch.
I think Holmgren may have still been there. So it may have been his call.