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Rosen talk on NFL Radio this morning

eric2425ny : 3/12/2019 9:24 am
A Giants fan called in asking about the Giants trading for Rosen. Weis laughed and deferred the question to Papa. Papa raised concern over his work ethic and leadership ability as the Casserly report echoes what was being said about him coming out of UCLA and suggests this attitude may have followed him to Arizona. The discussion ended with a “hard pass” on Rosen...
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Personally  
superspynyg : 3/12/2019 9:25 am : link
I think Charlie Casserly is a moron.

But I doubt that we trade for Rosen.
RE: Personally  
jvm52106 : 3/12/2019 9:27 am : link
In comment 14325872 superspynyg said:
Quote:
I think Charlie Casserly is a moron.

But I doubt that we trade for Rosen.


Papa also said to Weis, Coach you said last year you would not draft Rosen and that the lack of confidence his college coach showed in him and his leadership was a huge red flag to you...

So not just Casserly report they were referencing.
RE: Personally  
Capt. Don : 3/12/2019 9:28 am : link
In comment 14325872 superspynyg said:
Quote:
I think Charlie Casserly is a moron.

But I doubt that we trade for Rosen.


I agree with both of these statements. People need to stop citing Casserly - he is a buffoon.

That said, I wish we would try to get him here. His skill set is worth the risk.
RE: RE: Personally  
eric2425ny : 3/12/2019 9:29 am : link
In comment 14325880 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
In comment 14325872 superspynyg said:


Quote:


I think Charlie Casserly is a moron.

But I doubt that we trade for Rosen.



Papa also said to Weis, Coach you said last year you would not draft Rosen and that the lack of confidence his college coach showed in him and his leadership was a huge red flag to you...

So not just Casserly report they were referencing.


Thanks JVM, I was typing this at a stop light and missed that part.
Yeah, bad work ethic -  
section125 : 3/12/2019 9:29 am : link
guy played all 16 games behind the worst offensive line in football, getting the snot knocked out of him weekly and said nothing....
Believe nothing what you hear this time of the year. Remember, supposedly someone in Giantsland told an ESPN reporter the Giants are not going QB this year...Maybe they won't. But you cannot show your cards beforehand.
I remember that last year when Mora  
eric2425ny : 3/12/2019 9:30 am : link
said he would take Darnold over Rosen. He then tried to backtrack but it was too late at that point.
I think we can  
ryanmkeane : 3/12/2019 9:38 am : link
say so long to the Rosen talk. Nothing we've heard seems to be going in that direction
I used to like Papa so much  
mattyblue : 3/12/2019 9:39 am : link
more than I do currently. He comes across really smug and speaks in non stop definitives. He obviously probably has better knowledge than a typical fan but he makes statements like he is all knowing nowadays. He does a great job during Giants games but I find him to be to much of a know it all on NFL radio. I don’t really like many of the radio hosts or even the radio shows that much, so I am just not a target market and it’s probably just me.
I don't blame..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/12/2019 9:44 am : link
Papa for coming off that way.

Look at the morons he has to deal with calling in.

Fans calling in to talk radio are basically the lowest common denominator of intelligence
Two key dates regarding the Giants QBs  
Ivan15 : 3/12/2019 9:45 am : link
March 17 and Draft Day 1.

Nothing else matters right now.
RE: I don't blame..  
crick n NC : 3/12/2019 9:46 am : link
In comment 14325929 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
Papa for coming off that way.

Look at the morons he has to deal with calling in.

Fans calling in to talk radio are basically the lowest common denominator of intelligence


I like to call in to sports talk shows, it makes me look half way educated!
RE: I think we can  
Capt. Don : 3/12/2019 9:46 am : link
In comment 14325915 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
say so long to the Rosen talk. Nothing we've heard seems to be going in that direction


Perhaps.

The 4 days between Kyler Murray's pro day on 3/13 and 3/17 (when Eli's roster bonus is due) will be very telling IMO.
RE: RE: I think we can  
RobCarpenter : 3/12/2019 9:48 am : link
In comment 14325936 Capt. Don said:
Quote:
In comment 14325915 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


say so long to the Rosen talk. Nothing we've heard seems to be going in that direction



Perhaps.

The 4 days between Kyler Murray's pro day on 3/13 and 3/17 (when Eli's roster bonus is due) will be very telling IMO.


I don't see any scenario in which the Giants don't pay Eli's roster bonus. I just really hope they don't extend him.
RE: Two key dates regarding the Giants QBs  
ron mexico : 3/12/2019 9:49 am : link
In comment 14325933 Ivan15 said:
Quote:
March 17 and Draft Day 1.

Nothing else matters right now.


There is no way Eli isn't getting that roster bonus.

So unless you have big St Paddy plans. 3/17 is not important.

RE: I don't blame..  
mattyblue : 3/12/2019 9:50 am : link
In comment 14325929 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
Papa for coming off that way.

Look at the morons he has to deal with calling in.

Fans calling in to talk radio are basically the lowest common denominator of intelligence


Fair enough, but I don’t think Papa is any sort of genius either.
RE: RE: Two key dates regarding the Giants QBs  
Capt. Don : 3/12/2019 9:55 am : link
In comment 14325947 ron mexico said:
Quote:
In comment 14325933 Ivan15 said:


Quote:


March 17 and Draft Day 1.

Nothing else matters right now.



There is no way Eli isn't getting that roster bonus.

So unless you have big St Paddy plans. 3/17 is not important.


If they trade for Rosen and keep Eli it will be an enormous sentimental f%$# up. So if I am the Giants, I tell AZ, we are interested and have an offer in mind but that offer takes a hit after 3/17 bc it is a $17M hit.

that said - I highly doubt they bring in Rosen - so in the end, I think you are right.
RE: I think we can  
section125 : 3/12/2019 9:56 am : link
In comment 14325915 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
say so long to the Rosen talk. Nothing we've heard seems to be going in that direction


We have heard basically nothing, period. Except for DGs saying the defense needs big help and the oline needs to be fixed, they haven't indicated what direction they will go. I do think it will be ER or pass rush @ #6 and OL at #37.
He doesn't really..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/12/2019 9:58 am : link
have to be a genius:

Quote:
Fair enough, but I don’t think Papa is any sort of genius either.


If you listen to him and Banks on gameday, they really turn the screws on things they think are off. Both are pretty solid when it comes to evaluating the state of the team.

Then you have people calling in who sound like BBI'ers rambling about there not being any plan and that they need to trade their distraction of a WR and how do you think he should respond??
The original poster  
aimrocky : 3/12/2019 10:00 am : link
has some real issues with Rosen and has been pushing his agenda since the rumors of him being available broke. At this point, lets stop making up news around him. Nothing has happened and there is no indication that anything is going to happen. None of this info is new...
I think we're trading for Rosen, and then going all D in the draft  
PatersonPlank : 3/12/2019 10:01 am : link
We'll get the RT in FA, likely the guy from Carolina since he knows DG already.
RE: I think we're trading for Rosen, and then going all D in the draft  
The_Boss : 3/12/2019 10:07 am : link
In comment 14325998 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
We'll get the RT in FA, likely the guy from Carolina since he knows DG already.


There is zero evidence the NYG are in on Rosen.
I'm fine with passing on Rosen  
bceagle05 : 3/12/2019 10:08 am : link
but the Giants aren't in a position to laugh at any suggestion - we're the ones being laughed at.
RE: He doesn't really..  
mattyblue : 3/12/2019 10:09 am : link
In comment 14325986 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
have to be a genius:



Quote:


Fair enough, but I don’t think Papa is any sort of genius either.



If you listen to him and Banks on gameday, they really turn the screws on things they think are off. Both are pretty solid when it comes to evaluating the state of the team.

Then you have people calling in who sound like BBI'ers rambling about there not being any plan and that they need to trade their distraction of a WR and how do you think he should respond??


He took the job and clearly must have known what it would entail. If his opinion differs from a callers he still sounds like a dick when answering. Also, like Dottino he never has anything negative to say about anything the Giants ever do.
RE: I'm fine with passing on Rosen  
mattyblue : 3/12/2019 10:09 am : link
In comment 14326036 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
but the Giants aren't in a position to laugh at any suggestion - we're the ones being laughed at.


+1,000,000
RE: RE: I think we're trading for Rosen, and then going all D in the draft  
JonC : 3/12/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14326028 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14325998 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:


We'll get the RT in FA, likely the guy from Carolina since he knows DG already.



There is zero evidence the NYG are in on Rosen.


Correct.
We're going with Eli,  
The Dude : 3/12/2019 10:20 am : link
7-9 season, too far out for the 2020 QBs that will go in the top 4, QB hell for 1-8 years. book it!
See you  
crick n NC : 3/12/2019 10:22 am : link
On the ninth year then
Rosen  
Archer : 3/12/2019 10:24 am : link
For anything less than a first he is a steal.

I think that Rosen can sit behind Eli and learn how to be a professional.

He can see Eli's work ethic and attention to detail.

If you watch Rosen play last year, you can see that he has the potential to be a very good or even a great pro QB.

His stats belie his ability.I actually think more of him now then I did at the draft. He is one tough guy. He got the sh.t kicked out of him yet he kept coming back.
He never complained or placed blame on his teammates and he had every reason to complain. His line was awful and his receivers equally bad.

The Giants can get him for the next (4) years with almost no guaranteed money. If he is not what they hoped they can release or trade him.
Looks like Casserly has been  
Jim in Forest Hills : 3/12/2019 10:28 am : link
compromised with his coaching the interview bias.
I'll say..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/12/2019 10:35 am : link
it again - but the only way a player is a steal, especially at the QB position, is if he's a franchise QB. Anything less than that and what you actually give up for him is only part of the equation. The other part is the time you wait for him to develop.

you think if the Dolphins could go back and do it all over again that they would invest many years in Ryan Tannehill? The Redskins got cousins as a lower draft pick and aren't any better off, and actually got worse at the position by overpaying for a guy whose leg was mangled.
Totally agree with Archer  
Gjfro : 3/12/2019 10:49 am : link
Giants could probably get him for next years (2020) 3 (which would be projected to be higher than most teams 3) plus a conditional pick...its totally a no brainer
RE: RE: I think we're trading for Rosen, and then going all D in the draft  
PatersonPlank : 3/12/2019 10:52 am : link
In comment 14326028 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14325998 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:


We'll get the RT in FA, likely the guy from Carolina since he knows DG already.



There is zero evidence the NYG are in on Rosen.


There is the same evidence that any other deal has had at this time, media rumors and leaks. Until a deal is finalized no one talks. There have been a few media comments that we are one of the teams very interested in Rosen if the Cardinals decide to go with Murray.
Dude clearly exhibits a self absorbed douchiness  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 3/12/2019 11:11 am : link
Every step of the way. Hard pass indeed, unless you want to argue SB's generational leadership abilities can keep his extreme douchiness from tearing apart the locker room.
RE: Dude clearly exhibits a self absorbed douchiness  
section125 : 3/12/2019 11:13 am : link
In comment 14326315 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Every step of the way. Hard pass indeed, unless you want to argue SB's generational leadership abilities can keep his extreme douchiness from tearing apart the locker room.


He does?
I guess it takes one, to know one.
RE: Rosen  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 3/12/2019 11:53 am : link
In comment 14326103 Archer said:
Quote:
For anything less than a first he is a steal.

I think that Rosen can sit behind Eli and learn how to be a professional.

He can see Eli's work ethic and attention to detail.

If you watch Rosen play last year, you can see that he has the potential to be a very good or even a great pro QB.



His stats belie his ability.I actually think more of him now then I did at the draft. He is one tough guy. He got the sh.t kicked out of him yet he kept coming back.
He never complained or placed blame on his teammates and he had every reason to complain. His line was awful and his receivers equally bad.

The Giants can get him for the next (4) years with almost no guaranteed money. If he is not what they hoped they can release or trade him.


100% agree. The kid can play and answered the questions about his toughness. With all the negative banter about him, don't you think he is smart enough to take a mature approach to his next opportunity? The kid has been thrown under the bus by talking heads/coaches who want someone who thinks only about football 24 hours a day. Rosen actually thinks about other things on occasion. What a crime.
RE: Dude clearly exhibits a self absorbed douchiness  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 3/12/2019 11:56 am : link
In comment 14326315 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
Every step of the way. Hard pass indeed, unless you want to argue SB's generational leadership abilities can keep his extreme douchiness from tearing apart the locker room.


So how long have you know the young man? When did you meet him? I happen to know the family. The kid is supremely confident, but he has reason to be. I would not want a QB who is anything but supremely confident. He is smart and dedicated. God forbid we find a QB (for a mid-round draft pick no less) who has skills, intelligence and the desire to be great.
RE: We're going with Eli,  
Bill L : 3/12/2019 11:59 am : link
In comment 14326087 The Dude said:
Quote:
7-9 season, too far out for the 2020 QBs that will go in the top 4, QB hell for 1-8 years. book it!

When was the last time 4 QB’s were drafted 1-4? This will be a very special class.
Rosen  
mdc1 : 3/12/2019 12:55 pm : link
pass. If the Cards are rolling the dice on Murray with all the measureable concerns what does that say about Rosen in addition to his attitude and privilege.
what does it say about Cards maangement?  
bc4life : 3/12/2019 12:57 pm : link
1st round draft pick and head coach gone after one year
RE: RE: Dude clearly exhibits a self absorbed douchiness  
eric2425ny : 3/12/2019 1:16 pm : link
In comment 14326472 Nomad Crow on the Madison said:
Quote:
In comment 14326315 Coach Red Beaulieu said:


Quote:


Every step of the way. Hard pass indeed, unless you want to argue SB's generational leadership abilities can keep his extreme douchiness from tearing apart the locker room.



So how long have you know the young man? When did you meet him? I happen to know the family. The kid is supremely confident, but he has reason to be. I would not want a QB who is anything but supremely confident. He is smart and dedicated. God forbid we find a QB (for a mid-round draft pick no less) who has skills, intelligence and the desire to be great.


Not using the D word on here anymore, but I see why people aren’t fans of Rosen. The dedicated and strong desire to be great traits are exactly what has been questioned.
RE: I'll say..  
Go Terps : 3/12/2019 1:38 pm : link
In comment 14326147 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
it again - but the only way a player is a steal, especially at the QB position, is if he's a franchise QB. Anything less than that and what you actually give up for him is only part of the equation. The other part is the time you wait for him to develop.

you think if the Dolphins could go back and do it all over again that they would invest many years in Ryan Tannehill? The Redskins got cousins as a lower draft pick and aren't any better off, and actually got worse at the position by overpaying for a guy whose leg was mangled.


Again, this is flawed thinking. Ryan Tannehill-level production at $2M for 2019 is a good deal. And it doesn't stop the Giants from drafting a QB in 2020 if Rosen is a disaster in 2019.

Consider the alternative: paying Eli $23M to give you Ryan Tannehill production.

One option is cheap, has an easy out, and has massive potential upside. The other is expensive and has zero upside. It's a no brainer for an objective front office that isn't influenced by nostalgia and sentimentality.

Nostalgia and sentimentality are going to cost the Giants $23M against the salary cap in 2019, but lead to no additional wins.
You don’t figure the lost assets (assets given up)  
Bill L : 3/12/2019 1:49 pm : link
Into the equation?

Besides their intrinsic value, and the fact that their loss prevents us from building the team, management would never write a guy, who they’ve invested assets in, off after one season.

They’re not just putting him in their cart at the pic&save like you intitmate.
RE: what does it say about Cards maangement?  
GFAN52 : 3/12/2019 1:51 pm : link
In comment 14326626 bc4life said:
Quote:
1st round draft pick and head coach gone after one year


Exactly.
RE: You don’t figure the lost assets (assets given up)  
Go Terps : 3/12/2019 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14326744 Bill L said:
Quote:
Into the equation?

Besides their intrinsic value, and the fact that their loss prevents us from building the team, management would never write a guy, who they’ve invested assets in, off after one season.

They’re not just putting him in their cart at the pic&save like you intitmate.


The asset figures to be a second round pick.

A second round pick for a 22 year old guy with Rosen's passing ability, for the right to pay him $2M a year, is a huge value. If we drafted him straight up in this draft people would be head over heels with the pick.
Nope, it’s an asset lost to f he’s cut right away  
Bill L : 3/12/2019 1:59 pm : link
In your scenario.
And at a #2  
Bill L : 3/12/2019 2:01 pm : link
With no #3 and we’ve already given away one #4, it’s no trivial thing.
RE: Nope, it’s an asset lost to f he’s cut right away  
Go Terps : 3/12/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14326758 Bill L said:
Quote:
In your scenario.


That applies to any player we draft as well.

What about the assets spent to keep Eli on the roster? Does the $17M we would recoup count as an asset?

Cutting Rosen after 1 year is the worst case scenario. The best case scenario is we've got our QB at a cut rate and don't need to expend a draft pick (or picks to trade up to get one) next year.

The worst case scenario with Rosen is better than the scenario that's actually going to play out when we keep Eli, unless Eli leads the Giants to the playoffs.
Go Terps  
eric2425ny : 3/12/2019 2:10 pm : link
I see your point, but let’s say we make this trade and it costs us our high second round pick. And then we cut Eli and save the $17M or whatever it amounts to be.

The problem with this if Rosen ends up not working out is we just gave away a likely starter with that second round pick. And great, we pick up that extra cash from Eli, but we will have that cash next year as well if we don’t extend Eli’s contract.

Based on what we have seen the last 36 hours or so, prices for FA are insane. That cost controlled second round pick we would be giving up would be hard to stomach if Rosen busts. Because we’ll get the Eli money back next year, it’s not like he is signed to a long term deal.
RE: RE: Nope, it’s an asset lost to f he’s cut right away  
Bill L : 3/12/2019 2:11 pm : link
In comment 14326772 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14326758 Bill L said:


Quote:


In your scenario.



That applies to any player we draft as well.

What about the assets spent to keep Eli on the roster? Does the $17M we would recoup count as an asset?

Cutting Rosen after 1 year is the worst case scenario. The best case scenario is we've got our QB at a cut rate and don't need to expend a draft pick (or picks to trade up to get one) next year.

The worst case scenario with Rosen is better than the scenario that's actually going to play out when we keep Eli, unless Eli leads the Giants to the playoffs.

I would rather have the drafted player then what I would get for 17M. And, I think your worst case is the most likely and birders on guaranteed. Although I substitute bellrung retirement for cut.
But anyone we draft with the 2nd round pick could bust  
Go Terps : 3/12/2019 2:12 pm : link
If we draft a QB in 2020, that guy can bust.

For a guy with Rosen's arm talent it seems like a super low risk to me. I think he's a better QB prospect than anyone in this draft.
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