Rashan Gary Sophomore year Highlights...

The question about his production needs to be reconciled but if that checks out I love him at 6.

He was awesome in 2017 - and if we go defense @ 6, Gary is near the top of my wishlist.

That said - there's always a part of me that is wary of taking a player who's best college season was the year before the more recent one was one where he was injured and not the same guy / missed time.

If there's full confidence that Gary will be fully healed and be the same guy he was before he was hurt, I'm all aboard @ 6. But I'd definitely need to know that the brass isn't concerned about that going forward.

I don't see the big deal. At 20 something sure but at 6? No effing way.

In comment 14326144 Joey in VA said:

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I don't see the big deal. At 20 something sure but at 6? No effing way.

Agree. I dont see it either. Not @ 6

In comment 14326144 Joey in VA said:

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I don't see the big deal. At 20 something sure but at 6? No effing way.

I understand the hesitation of not wanting him...

One of the reasons I think he will be a serious contender is his run stopping ability. I think its that good.

Lowest I could see him going is Miami at 13. No chance Gary drops into the 20's.

Wasn't he also playing out of position @ Mich?

but even in this supposed breakout season, the production was petty pedestrian. 5.5 sacks, 11 TFL. Certainly a first round pick but I am really wary of taking a guy at #6 that really hasn't put it together entirely on the field. Plus, who's to say these injury issues are just going to go away?

own agency with his mom....

Oh, wow - I thought he had 11.5 sacks as a soph for some reason. That was TFL's.

Yeah - the production is a little suspect for a breakout year. No question the guy is a freak athlete. But again... I hate taking a player where his best college year isn't the one he just played. Coming off injury... egh.

But this isn’t a player who was stymied to often at the LOS. He would collapse pockets, take on double teams.

I think his best football is to come.

Here and I don't think that's his best spot or an impactful enough one for our pick. He looks more like 4-3 LDE who's a run stopper. That's not a bad thing, I just don't think it's a good idea here.

In comment 14326127 arcarsenal said:

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That said - there's always a part of me that is wary of taking a player who's best college season was the year before the more recent one was one where he was injured and not the same guy / missed time.

I immediately thought of William Joseph upon reading this.

that is a draw. But he hasn't put it all together and the injuries are worrisome.

I think his best landing spot is in a 43 DE. To justify him at 6 with the Giants they'd have to envision a JJ Watt type player. Physically when healthy he has that potential, but lots of risks.

The one plus on Gary is I think you can move him around. His build is so stout - almost bulky - but not really in a bad way (unless he gains extra weight and loses explosion) and he's strong enough to bang inside @ NT/DT.

He probably fits better on a 4-3 DL - but I could see him being versatile enough to handle being an end in a 3-4 and even coming off the edge as an OLB in some pass rushing situations.

In comment 14326195 Joey in VA said:

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Here and I don't think that's his best spot or an impactful enough one for our pick. He looks more like 4-3 LDE who's a run stopper. That's not a bad thing, I just don't think it's a good idea here.

Agreed.

then ER is in. I cannot see them going for a run stuffing 5 technique with the #6 pick. They desperately need someone to get to the QB, not hold the edge. You can get those later in the draft.

Dane Brugler on the Draft Show, saya Gary is a huge boom or bust pick.

In comment 14326257 section125 said:

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then ER is in. I cannot see them going for a run stuffing 5 technique with the #6 pick. They desperately need someone to get to the QB, not hold the edge. You can get those later in the draft.

Gary can play the edge and get after the QB. He is not a 5 whatsoever.

I blinded by his awesome hair or is Chase Winovich a legit sleeper to be a very good NFL player?

In comment 14326343 DanMetroMan said:

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I blinded by his awesome hair or is Chase Winovich a legit sleeper to be a very good NFL player?

His 4.6 40 times is going to help him tremendously. He is going to be labeled your class "high motor" white athlete.... but he is very relentless. I can see him having success at rushing the passer. Against the run, eh... not so much.

healthy one year, maybe that's a warning sign we should pay attention to

to that.

I'm a fan, you don't have convince me.

In comment 14326375 Bill in UT said:

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healthy one year, maybe that's a warning sign we should pay attention to

He was healthy his freshman year but was more of a rotational player.

In comment 14326347 dep026 said:

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In comment 14326343 DanMetroMan said: Quote: I blinded by his awesome hair or is Chase Winovich a legit sleeper to be a very good NFL player? His 4.6 40 times is going to help him tremendously. He is going to be labeled your class "high motor" white athlete.... but he is very relentless. I can see him having success at rushing the passer. Against the run, eh... not so much.

On film he really pops. You notice him NON-STOP. I mean the hair helps of course but in highlights.. fun to watch
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Wasn't there talk about Barkley being duck footed as well and that's why he was able to cut so well???

And Bosa and Willams go, as expected

and we have the choice of:

Gary
Oliver
Allen
Sweat

I'd be hard pressed to pick Gary

that's it, that's all.

9 and a half sacks in 3 years!!!

The production is truly lacking.

In comment 14326652 JohnB said:

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that's it, that's all. 9 and a half sacks in 3 years!!! The production is truly lacking.

In 26 games, JJ Watt had 11 sacks.
In 22 games (2 years of starting), Gary had 9 sacks.

In comment 14326652 JohnB said:

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that's it, that's all. 9 and a half sacks in 3 years!!! The production is truly lacking.

Production is a question that needs answering, certainly.

BUT...

His measurables are off the charts.
He is as scheme versatile as they come.
His effort, football character and off field character are unquestioned.

If his production was outstanding he would be in consideration for the #1 overall pick. It wasnt, so he isnt.

But if scouts can reconcile why his production wasnt great, he is worth #6.

In comment 14326660 dep026 said:

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In comment 14326652 JohnB said: Quote: that's it, that's all. 9 and a half sacks in 3 years!!! The production is truly lacking. In 26 games, JJ Watt had 11 sacks. In 22 games (2 years of starting), Gary had 9 sacks.

True...

But going after "potential" over production is how the Giants got into this mess. There are times when the potential does work out (JJ Watt, JPP etc) but more often than not, the potential never lives up to the hype. I'm hoping DG goes for production over potential.

was a big mistake for him. Stunted his development.

In comment 14326682 Jon in NYC said:

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was a big mistake for him. Stunted his development.

How? He sat behind 2 guys who were a first and 3rd round pick his freshman year. Was all-American his sophomore year and was hurt last year and is a potential top 5 pick... lol

In comment 14326679 JohnB said:

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True... But going after "potential" over production is how the Giants got into this mess. There are times when the potential does work out (JJ Watt, JPP etc) but more often than not, the potential never lives up to the hype. I'm hoping DG goes for production over potential.

You are not wrong but that is why scouts really dig deep. WHY was this guy not productive when his effort and physical skills say he should dominate?

Scheme? Injury? Work ethic? Teammates/Role? Competition? Coaching?

And at the end of the day, if they can live with what they believe the reason is then he MORE than checks off every other consideration. You take him at #6

If you believe it is a fundamental flaw that will continue, you pass.

In comment 14326694 Capt. Don said:

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In comment 14326679 JohnB said: Quote: True... But going after "potential" over production is how the Giants got into this mess. There are times when the potential does work out (JJ Watt, JPP etc) but more often than not, the potential never lives up to the hype. I'm hoping DG goes for production over potential. You are not wrong but that is why scouts really dig deep. WHY was this guy not productive when his effort and physical skills say he should dominate? Scheme? Injury? Work ethic? Teammates/Role? Competition? Coaching? And at the end of the day, if they can live with what they believe the reason is then he MORE than checks off every other consideration. You take him at #6 If you believe it is a fundamental flaw that will continue, you pass.

The skills ARE there, no question about it.

We'll see.

In comment 14326690 dep026 said:

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In comment 14326682 Jon in NYC said: Quote: was a big mistake for him. Stunted his development. How? He sat behind 2 guys who were a first and 3rd round pick his freshman year. Was all-American his sophomore year and was hurt last year and is a potential top 5 pick... lol

Mostly just messing with you

My real concern is that he isn't a 3-4 OLB. If you're taking a 3-4 DE at 6 he'd better be JJ Watt or Aaron Donald.

In comment 14326710 Jon in NYC said:

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In comment 14326690 dep026 said: Quote: In comment 14326682 Jon in NYC said: Quote: was a big mistake for him. Stunted his development. How? He sat behind 2 guys who were a first and 3rd round pick his freshman year. Was all-American his sophomore year and was hurt last year and is a potential top 5 pick... lol Mostly just messing with you My real concern is that he isn't a 3-4 OLB. If you're taking a 3-4 DE at 6 he'd better be JJ Watt or Aaron Donald.

Fair points.

All-Big 10 once. OSU fan disclaimer, but I'm pretty confident saying that if he got coached by Larry Johnson at OSU, who wanted him desperately, the production would have been better. But he'll end up a top 10 pick so not much harm done. Still though, there's a ton of untapped potential and I'm just not exactly sure why we haven't seen it yet. Coaching could be a factor in addition to health
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In comment 14326739 Kyle in NY said:

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All-Big 10 once. OSU fan disclaimer, but I'm pretty confident saying that if he got coached by Larry Johnson at OSU, who wanted him desperately, the production would have been better. But he'll end up a top 10 pick so not much harm done. Still though, there's a ton of untapped potential and I'm just not exactly sure why we haven't seen it yet. Coaching could be a factor in addition to health Link - ( New Window )

I thought he was 2nd team his 2017 year. I’m probably wrong. His best game came against you guys in 2017. He was unblocksble.

And I think what he was asked of at Michigan will be different in the NFL. Dom Brown needed lanes for his LB blitzes and he did a grreat job for guys like McCray and Bush to get lanes. Hudson as well who was all big 10 in 2017 and was terrible last year when Gary wasn’t out.

gone before 6, it leaves Gary, Sweat, Oliver, White and Haskins.

Even if Gary is the next JJ Watt and Oliver the next A. Donald and White the next Patrick Willis, none of them have the POTENTIAL to replace Eli at a very high level - even better than Eli - that Haskins has. Unless you project Sweat as the next LT, you take Haskins. That's why the vast majority of pundits predict the Giants will take Haskins.

I go back and forth on this, and DG is doing a fine job so far keeping everyone guessing on what direction the Giants are even looking, but the obvious pick is Haskins if he's on the board at 6.

Say Haskins stayed in college and repeats, more or less, his 2018 season. Imagine he improves on it... He's right up there in the discussion with Tua and Fromm, probably above them if he actually improved on 70%, 50 TDS, and only 8 ints.

From lots of sources, you hear about his maturity and FB knowledge and field vision for a guy with 14 starts.

I am not studying tape this year like I have previously... but I watched much more college FB the past 2-3 years than I have in a long time, and Haskins jumped off the screen to me watching OSU live. Lots of aspects of his game, but mostly passing accuracy and vs Penn State and Maryland he put the team on his back for comeback victories. Like Eli once did.

around him, getting some sacks and tackles after plays break down due to the efforts of others, sometimes being the 2nd guy in on a play.

Good player, but not sure he'd be my pick if given the choice between him and several of the other defensive players expected there at 6; Ferrell, Sweat, White for example.