Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
Tate is still very good/productive - I just feel like he and Shepard are a bit redundant.
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Which means they might not resign Shepard next year because hes gonna get a huge deal from someone
Very possible - and I'd be fine with that if we decide to have Tate man the slot the next 2-3-4 years (depending on where our out is in this deal/if we'll even need to use it) and then go bigger on the outside.
I'd like to get some bigger, more physical guys here.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
seems like nearly EVERY person that covers the league feels the same.
was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
WTF are you talking about. He just finished a 5 year 31 million dollar contract. He had 74 receptions last year and over 90 receptions each year for the previous 4 seasons. Your math sucks
And really not liking the amount of guaranteed money.
We are trying to repeat our dead money title crown! With all the contracts we just shed it's going to be tough. Don't count DG out though. He's no nonsense.
it really is. For two days everyone is shitting themselves complaining we will have the worst WR corp in the league. Now we sign a really nice player at market value, and you still hate it. This place is unreal sometimes.
to a 30 yr old receiver in today's NFL. End of story. How the hell did DG cut Steve Smith, a future hall of famer, but signs Golden Tate to play for the Giants for his 30s?
BTW- I had forgotten the DG quote about Analytics being "nonsense" was in response to a question about signing Jonathon Stewart. Players become washed up, end of story. NFL stands for Not For Long. Everyone knows that. Just because the guy shows a slight flash of speed in some random game the year before does not mean he has "plenty left in the tank" and you sign him to 3-4 year deal. Every player has their LAST great day at some point, the great ones are able to know when that is.
I'm guessing (read: hoping) that at least 1/3 is for injury only. We need to be able to get out of this in two years and have less than $5 million in dead money.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
it really is. For two days everyone is shitting themselves complaining we will have the worst WR corp in the league. Now we sign a really nice player at market value, and you still hate it. This place is unreal sometimes.
we are going to match our high powered rushing offense up with two of the smaller receivers in the league and one of the worst blocking tight ends. Not to mention this is a guy that lives on cutting it outside!
More consistent strategies here from our fearless leaders.
Tate is still very good/productive - I just feel like he and Shepard are a bit redundant.
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Yeah Arc...not the ideal complement to Shep but Ill take it. He is a consistent performer and big upgrade to anyone else on the roster at WR except Shepard.
guy is a YAC machine, and has been durable throughout his career. Now we have him, Shepherd, and presumably a taller receiver will be taken in the draft, possibly two more with all of the picks we have.
the worst WR core and they just added a solid veteran to a fair deal. Why are so many overreacting to this. They need help there they weren't going into the season with Bennie Fowler and Corey Coleman as their #2 and #3 WR's.
Should I dig up some of your commentary from the past and then dismiss what you say because you were wrong about a player. Get your head our of your ass.
However, he pretty much duplicates Shep, only for much more money. A 31 year old receiver that averages about 10 yards per catch on a team that already has an established slot receiver and completely lacks a downfield threat....yeah, that's an odd signing.
last year and he is a gamer. I'm guessing it's really a 2 year deal all things considered, and as others have said he is instantly our best WR. He was the best WR on Detroit for the past few years and he was productive. Pretty sure he's also a good blocker.
A little bit of an awkward fit but as others have said this could mean they are willing to trade Shepard. Or play him/Engram outside more. Or just plan to have a bunch of interchangeable pieces.
was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
That's inaccurate. He was good from 14-17. 4 straight seasons of 90 catches and over a thousand yards.
My fault... Didn't crack 1000 in 2015... But he's been solid since 2014. Last year he got traded mid-season and the Eagles didn't know how to use him. I firmly believe PS can get the most out of him.
who really gives a rats ass about the money.....JFC, it's not like they're giving him AB money...always liked him as a WR and he's definitely a positive move for the team.
Solid, certainly not spectacular receiver. I want to see the contract
I really just dont get what this Franchise is doing anymore?? Golden Tate is a good WR, but not for that type of money and if they are rebuilding?! Golden Tate is no spring chicken, he is nearing the end of his career?! It just doesnt make sense. Why invest in this player? I dont like this signing imo.
We're not finished @ WR - if we don't draft or sign any big bodies to play outside, I'll be very surprised.
But - I know we need to go one move, by knee-jerk move here and go nuts over each one as if this is the final piece for the offseason.
There simply doesn't seem to be much in the way of coherence or reason to these moves. It's not just BBI loose cannons saying that, it's most of the football world saying it.
However, he pretty much duplicates Shep, only for much more money. A 31 year old receiver that averages about 10 yards per catch on a team that already has an established slot receiver and completely lacks a downfield threat....yeah, that's an odd signing.
They might add that downfield threat in the draft. I think the Giants are going WR with either the 17th overall pick or their 2nd or 3rd rounder.
I agree with you that the signing is a curious move, but they absolutely do need receivers. Shep is a #3 and the rest of the WRs on the roster are nonentities.
is that he is 30 and he really tailed off end of last year.
First 4 games of the year - 7 catches per game, 97 yards per game.
Last 11 games of the year - 4 catches per game, 37 yards per game.
Now maybe part of that was going to a new system in Philly mid-year, but that's very concerning.
Its going to Philly and a new system. The Lions moved him due to salary cap issues, not because of his talent . Their passing game was not the same when he left.
This has been one of the most confusing offseasons I've ever seen
but it seems like a lot of people here know nothing about Golden Tate. Hes a very good player who was badly misused in Philly and never quite integrated into the offense. He was on pace for another big year with Detroit before the deal.
The confusion is because our two best receivers both play the slot. Shepard has shown he is not effective on the outside, and signing a 30 year old slot receiver to play a new position seems like an odd choice.
It's not a bad move so much as it is a confusing move.
I was worried for a second that he wasn't going to like this move.
LOL
Somebody's got to counter balance the negativity. This is Saquons team now with a revamped OL and a system that relies on PA. DG doesnt ascribe to the basketball on grass analogy of Marc Ross.
Tate isnt OBJ but he is a reliable performer and isnt some scrap heap guy (like a bunch of the guys we trotted out in the secondary last year).
Wow Tate and Beckham will be quite the dual threat
we don't know what the draft will bring. If the Giants draft say Metcalf at 17 it makes more sense. We really are short another WR.Tate is a good get but give it time to short out.
This is some fucked up mixture of rebuilding and competing. It's like we're competing to get the 10th pick in the Draft, or something.
im speechless. This team has no direction. They want to compete while rebuilding. SO throw $$$ at an aging declining slot WR when we already have one whos younger in Shep??
All to give it one more shot with Eli? This is insanity..3 straight years of this sh*t.
We can afford almost anyone we want. The path is still through the draft
+1.. Backup lineman get 9m a season lately, get over it. This is a good signing for a few years, has zero impact on Shepard (who is an excellent blocker, but his hands are not great, neither is his separation).
We need defensive players. We just dropped a big chunk that should be going to some young talent on defense. Not a limited 30+ year WR.
We don't need WR's? Shepard has proven that he isn't a #1 receive. Before this signing Corey Coleman and Jawill Davis were the #2 and #3 WR's. We had the worst WR core in football. How is that not a need?
Beckham and pursue this all slot receiver strategy sooner. We could have gotten Beasley and Crowder too.
Oh you see a shotgun 4WR formation with Barkley in the backfield. JUST KIDDING. He's going split out inside the inside receiver!! What will you do with all this slot?? WHAT???
offense has a semblance of a core (Barkley/Engram/Shepard/now decent OL) and is/was a few pieces away from being solid (like Tate, or Daryl Williams - who I'll bet had a similar sized contract offer in front of him yesterday).
Defense needs a core and you can't get core pieces in FA. Just doesn't work.
They'd do well to add at least 1 pass rusher through FA, but the defense will be fixed if they successfully add 2-3 core players in the draft.
We're not finished @ WR - if we don't draft or sign any big bodies to play outside, I'll be very surprised.
But - I know we need to go one move, by knee-jerk move here and go nuts over each one as if this is the final piece for the offseason.
There simply doesn't seem to be much in the way of coherence or reason to these moves. It's not just BBI loose cannons saying that, it's most of the football world saying it.
Most of the football world consists of ESPN talking heads and people with no clue.
Do we really care what fucking Field Yates thinks about what's going on here? I don't.
Maybe they're going to move Shepard. Who knows. It's just frustrating that every thread has to have 100 sarcastic comments about how no one in the org knows what they're doing.
People can hate the signing - I don't care - but the nonstop, over and over complaining over every single thing is just exhausting to sift through and actually converse over sometimes.
The Giants are just in a place right now where anything they do is going to be put under a microscope and be questioned.
I didn't want the "go for it with Eli" thing to happen again here this year, but this is what we're getting, so.. they better have more coming and knock this draft out of the fucking park.
not sure how people are shitting themselves. 23 mil is not a large guarantee over 4 years, nor is a 10 mil hit. He's a very productive player and never gets hurt.
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Reliable if not flashy, does the little things well. The 19 is actually kinda sharp, and it can surprise you sometimes at 203 hp. Not a bad car at all.
OBJ's replacement. Maybe they did not want that to fall on the shoulders of a younger player or a rookie? A veteran like Tate can deal with that better. Just saying.....
who really gives a rats ass about the money.....JFC, it's not like they're giving him AB money...always liked him as a WR and he's definitely a positive move for the team.
Some fans act like the money is coming out of their bank account.
mean anything until we see his signing bonus. Just most likely means he will be here for two years as they are both probably guaranteed. do the cut cost will be two forth of the signing bonus. Not a big deal and he was regarded as one of if not the best WR on the market. Nothing will make some of you happy.
This from PFF article in Feb on undervalued Fantasy Players
Much like Wilson, Tate is a lot better than most think, and for similar statistical reasons. Over the past six seasons, among all wide receivers with at least 50 targets, Tate has ranked fourth, third, second, 10th, fourth, and first in yards after the catch per reception. Over the past eight seasons, among all wide receivers with at least 50 targets, Tate has ranked second, third, third, second, fourth, first, first, and first in missed tackles forced per reception. In PPR points, Tate has finished 28th, 12th, 17th, 23rd, and 11th among wide receivers over the past five seasons. Im willing to chalk 2018 up as an outlier and bet Tates next team gets more out of him than Philadelphia did.
However, he pretty much duplicates Shep, only for much more money. A 31 year old receiver that averages about 10 yards per catch on a team that already has an established slot receiver and completely lacks a downfield threat....yeah, that's an odd signing.
+1
RE: Joking aside though, any of the pro signing people
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
OBJ's replacement. Maybe they did not want that to fall on the shoulders of a younger player or a rookie? A veteran like Tate can deal with that better. Just saying.....
Reliable if not flashy, does the little things well. The 19 is actually kinda sharp, and it can surprise you sometimes at 203 hp. Not a bad car at all.
But I ain't putting two of them in my driveway.
Thank you!!!
You guys aren't seeing the big picture - sure he's redundant
We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
RE: RE: Joking aside though, any of the pro signing people
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
So is Shepard - there's highlight reels of the guy flying down field and blowing people up. He was a catalyst on several big Barkley runs or a guy who provided a key block in the process.
NFL Network reports the Patriots are interested in free agent Golden Tate.
We are also hearing the sun is hot. The Patriots brought in Maurice Harris and Bruce Ellington for visits on Thursday, but Tate is simply on a different level than those two. With Tate seemingly encountering a colder than expected market, the Patriots could end up getting the 30-year-old at a bargain.
We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
A couple interesting stats on Golden Tate from 2017
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
Ok based on what? When we talk about linemen blocking it's all about size and arm length but let's not apply that same logic to receivers?
Also he might do better against slot corners yes but the point is one of SS or Tate is going to have to go on the outside now. They are our top 2 receivers to so conceivably they could both be outside to maximize our passing game.
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Huh? I'm not a huge fan of the move (for the redundancy, Tate is a decent receiver) but both of those guys are known as solid, high effort blockers.
isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
Ok based on what? When we talk about linemen blocking it's all about size and arm length but let's not apply that same logic to receivers?
Also he might do better against slot corners yes but the point is one of SS or Tate is going to have to go on the outside now. They are our top 2 receivers to so conceivably they could both be outside to maximize our passing game.
Hines Ward was one of the best blocking WR's ever and he is about the same size as Tate.
But I need to see the contract details to say for sure. If the guaranteed money is mostly the salaries for this year and next year I do not mind it as much as if it was due to large signing bonus that makes it difficult to cut.
DK Metcalf may well be on the board @ 17. Guy is 6'5", 230+ and a freak. His production isn't there @ the college level but most of it was cut short because of a neck injury. He has all pro ability.
The reaction, I have a feeling, would have been very different. It would be celebrated and envied if Tate went to the Pats. With the Giants, its WTH or Meh lol
76 between Detroit and Philly last year. He can play the outside or the inside and so could Shepard. You can use them in multiple formations. When the Pats had Amendola and Edelman did anyone say their roster construction was off? Not really seeing the critique of this deal. He catches balls, he lessens the OBJ loss. I think he will surprise a lot of people. I like the move.
We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
Yea, lets do that. Sign irresponsible contracts and blow our shot at a top QB in 2020 by putting bandaids on this mess. This team is a joke.
DK Metcalf may well be on the board @ 17. Guy is 6'5", 230+ and a freak. His production isn't there @ the college level but most of it was cut short because of a neck injury. He has all pro ability.
I don't want Metcalf. He wreaks of workout warrior but his teammate AJ Brown could be an option.
We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
Yea, lets do that. Sign irresponsible contracts and blow our shot at a top QB in 2020 by putting bandaids on this mess. This team is a joke.
Show me the irresponsible contract. If you think 4 years 40 mil for Tate is too much you just don't have a grasp on the market.
I don't believe that. Where do you see those numbers.
Id bet it was more like 10%. hes a slot guy. only time hes playing outside is if injuries force him out there.
2016 76% of his snaps were outside.
The last two years 24% were on the outside.
He can play both and do it well. You can mix him up with Shep. Are they explosive? No, but I think with Engram, Shep, Tate, and Saquon (who is explosive) that is not a terrible skill position set. As I said, this is a good move.
DK Metcalf may well be on the board @ 17. Guy is 6'5", 230+ and a freak. His production isn't there @ the college level but most of it was cut short because of a neck injury. He has all pro ability.
David Boston Jr. As Fats has said, he's going to have a calf muscle explode in the middle of a game
is a free agent next year right? how much is he going to ask for? he might want more than $10M, this signing might be in anticipation of losing sheppard.
I think the people talking about moving Shepard may be right. It would be consistent with what Gettleman's been doing. He almost certainly is not crazy about re-signing him. And remember Shep was on the boat.
DK Metcalf may well be on the board @ 17. Guy is 6'5", 230+ and a freak. His production isn't there @ the college level but most of it was cut short because of a neck injury. He has all pro ability.
David Boston Jr. As Fats has said, he's going to have a calf muscle explode in the middle of a game
Boston was really fucking good before he roided himself out and became a hot air balloon.
Both Shepard and Tate are significantly more effective in the slot.
Nothing DG does makes much sense. What I suspect is going to happen is hes gonna band aid this thing enough to have us win 6 games next year instead of 2-4, which probably is needed to get at the top QBs in April of 2020.
But I need to see the contract details to say for sure. If the guaranteed money is mostly the salaries for this year and next year I do not mind it as much as if it was due to large signing bonus that makes it difficult to cut.
others have said it, but this is a bad fit. he is not a downfield burner. he is entirely redundant of SS and even EE. we have no outside receivers. he is not a bad player and it's not an awful contract, he is just a bad fit. i also worry about him getting really old really fast
this signing only makes sense if SS is gone after this year or if we have plans to trade SS. otherwise i just don't get it
The reaction, I have a feeling, would have been very different. It would be celebrated and envied if Tate went to the Pats. With the Giants, its WTH or Meh lol
Comparing the Pats to this dumpster fire is WTH, meh and LOL
You do realize this team has made the playoffs once since 2011 and the Pats have won 3 Super Bowls in that time, right????
Not a bad player but definitely on the decline. Receivers don't get better on the north side of 30.He's a slot guy and I believe we have one already,no? WTF is Gettleman doing? I understand rebuilding but signing 30+ year old receivers is not rebuilding IMO. Gettleman had one pretty good draft but every other move he has done makes me believe he has little idea of what he is doing. After we suck again next year, I hope he is gone!
can be used on end-arounds and has return value. The $ numbers always look higher to me than I expect, but he's not a day 1 signing, is a solid vet & there's versatility. Also probably a more old-school professional type in the locker room
I get the 2 slots question but have never understood why scheme & play design can't adjust to solid players. Doesn't it mean we have 2 tougher, short-yardage, shifty, interior WRs? Can they not be used on the same play at times, when not spelling each other? Not all coaches could, but you'd hope a good coach can use value. (I'd also ask if Diggs & Thielen were known as smaller, slot type WRs, if so Shurmur did ok with that)
In the fav BB comp, he gets 2 athletic TEs and not only makes the O heavy 2 TE sets but also decides to use one as an RB out the backfield. Or more applicable Edelman / Amendola as mentioned above. I don't think 2 slot WRs would be even that exotic or unusual
In 2017...
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
I know the Pats were interested, think that got the contract up a bit in GTD. money. They now have two
slot receivers now. Tate will need to play more on the
outside, SS is not as good on the outside.
In 2017...
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
LOL. The offense is going to be bundled together. We don't need no stinking outside receivers! Put everyone close together.
In 2017...
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
they make players better than they are. they fit their scheme to their players. they have the best coach and maybe QB in history. no offensive player leaves the pats and becomes a better player. please don't compare anything we do or could do with what the pats do
In 2017...
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
LOL. The offense is going to be bundled together. We don't need no stinking outside receivers! Put everyone close together.
He was on the famed boat trip, He and Beckum are tight plus he started acting out on the sideline last year ala OBJ. He also had several drops.
DG will continue to blow this thing up!
I think the people talking about moving Shepard may be right. It would be consistent with what Gettleman's been doing. He almost certainly is not crazy about re-signing him. And remember Shep was on the boat.
It would fit within his MO of moving out good players and replacing them with someone worse.
Both Shepard and Tate are significantly more effective in the slot.
Nothing DG does makes much sense. What I suspect is going to happen is hes gonna band aid this thing enough to have us win 6 games next year instead of 2-4, which probably is needed to get at the top QBs in April of 2020.
And that is why I call him DSG. Hes Dave Shitbag Gettleman, and hes ruining the franchise
BC weay be moving towards the batshit over the top all defense draft.
Specifically, two great, and different defensive linesmen, at least two very different types of linebackers', all top of draft, maybe still a free safety.
2016 Beckham - Yards after Catch: 5.2, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.6
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I agree - he is a better player than Shepard. I can't believe I am seeing the opposite in this thread.
Dan Duggan just tweeted that if Golden Tate is worth 9, "the price for Shepard will only be higher"; so its not only on here. I think it is absurd, Golden Tate is durable guy with great hands, he reminds me of Bolden. We are luck to have him and yes, I am quite sure that in this league where the short passing has become a staple that you can run an offense wit Shepard and Tate. I think Gettleman has been awful, but I really don't understand the criticism of this move.
Paying that much guaranteed money for a JAG at this stage age 30. Awesome plan-
In what fucking universe is he a JAG. Before the trade he was on pace for his third consecutive 90 catch 1k yard season. It's like I'm taking fucking crazy pills.
thanks for posting that. Did anyone notice on the catch & run TD vs. the Browns that it was Peppers who caught him at the goal line? Go back and see that Peppers was blitzing on the play and was closest to Stafford when the ball was released, then turned upfield and was the only defender who had pursued to the end. I liked seeing this.
I love how everyone goes on about how the best in the business (BB in NE) takes players who love the sport and make plays and designs a system to fit what they do well, then criticizes the Giants for a move for a guy who doesn't fit their "system" of NOT having two slot receivers on the field at the same time.
The Giants look to have done their homework on this. Obviously he's no OBJ, but the WR corps just got a lot better today.
Again, time will tell whether this is a winning move or not - not the mob on BBI.
the worst WR core and they just added a solid veteran to a fair deal. Why are so many overreacting to this. They need help there they weren't going into the season with Bennie Fowler and Corey Coleman as their #2 and #3 WR's.
Exactly Tate can be a 2 .... shep can go into the slot we draft WR this yr and next early. EE has 4.4 speed we can make it work for a season or 2.
2016 Beckham - Yards after Catch: 5.2, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.6
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I agree - he is a better player than Shepard. I can't believe I am seeing the opposite in this thread.
Dan Duggan just tweeted that if Golden Tate is worth 9, "the price for Shepard will only be higher"; so its not only on here. I think it is absurd, Golden Tate is durable guy with great hands, he reminds me of Bolden. We are luck to have him and yes, I am quite sure that in this league where the short passing has become a staple that you can run an offense wit Shepard and Tate. I think Gettleman has been awful, but I really don't understand the criticism of this move.
It's possible Duggan is right by way of Shepard being younger and likely still ascending a bit.
But right now, Tate is the better player of the two.
Maybe Shepard will be here with him, maybe he won't be.
I am quite sure we aren't going to stop here @ WR and go into the year with this exact group. I expect a bigger body to be added one way or another.
He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
and Shepard don't have nearly as much to do with each other as you're all making it seem. They will play at the same time.
Yeah, holy moly - some of these comments you'd think it's literally not possible to have both guys on the field together.
My first reaction was that the two are a bit redundant - but, that doesn't mean you can't deploy both guys or have it work.
Tate isn't Cole fucking Beasley.
Right. Pats were able to get Edelman and Amendola on the field together. This so called "problem" cab be solved.
What's next? You can't have two TEs on the field simultaneously?
exactly, I would rather have two talented guys that do the same thing than two not talented guys that do different things. Last season, the Eagles had three slot receivers when they went on their run (Tate, Matthews, and Agholor). If you think we can't work with Golden Tate then I don't know what to say. Maybe watch more NFL games?
He was on the famed boat trip, He and Beckum are tight plus he started acting out on the sideline last year ala OBJ. He also had several drops.
DG will continue to blow this thing up!
He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
Crabtree?
Prefer to go the draft route or maybe explore someone like Geronimo Allison since there's no pick attached to his tender level (UDFA)
Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
stopgap pick-up. I think they can make Shep and Tate work on the field at the same time. Hope they can get someone in the draft, they sure have enough picks.
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
Signing Golden Tate for 4 years means you're trying to compete, so we're getting another run with Eli.
There's no plan here, spin it however you want there's no plan. Odell was a locker room cancer, but Tate got exiled from Seattle because of the possibility he slept with the QB's ex wife.
If you were going to sign Tate, why not keep Odell and use Tate's money on a corner back?
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
all fair points and im not opposed to moving Shep either. But you could have pieced together a WR corps for a team that wont win anymore that 6 games and not effect Collins compensatory pick as well. Since we don't have any FA worth signing Tate most likely will cancel out Collins. So its almost like we are trading a 3rd round pick for the right to sign tate.
Just go with you guys because I think they are in denial and want to give this another shot with Eli...which is pure lunacy at this point.
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
all fair points and im not opposed to moving Shep either. But you could have pieced together a WR corps for a team that wont win anymore that 6 games and not effect Collins compensatory pick as well. Since we don't have any FA worth signing Tate most likely will cancel out Collins. So its almost like we are trading a 3rd round pick for the right to sign tate.
Just go with you guys because I think they are in denial and want to give this another shot with Eli...which is pure lunacy at this point.
Tates signing cancelled out the 5th we had for Brown getting signed
Yes I know he is great at getting downfield and lighting people
up that arent expecting it, Ive seen the highlights. Any evidence he is any better than a big bodied #1 blocking outside at the pint of attack which is what he is looking like on our roster as of now. No one out there right now in FA or the draft that I could see supplanting him as #1 this year. Unless you are talking about SS who I see as having a similar issue.
Tate is physical for sure but there are some more physical #1 CBS out there that Id rather have a receiver outmuscle say cutting it outside in the red zone.
Two things I dont like about this move #1 having either him or SS as our #1 and trying to field a competitive team with a nothing talent defense and a 38 year old QB.
Shurmurs offense in MIN featured 2+ slots (Diggs/Thielen/Rudolph)
so while Tate's skill set seems duplicative of Shepard's (and Engram's) Shurmur has run an offense moving guys around and getting big production from multiple players out of the slot.
Regardless of who plays QB it helps to have weapons. Tate for 2 years around 11.5m/per by guaranteed money seems like a fine move unless he literally goes over the hill quickly.
It's a deep WR draft, grab a deep threat with speed to compete with Coleman (and maybe Latimer) in camp. Let Engram, Shepard, Tate, Barkley work the middle of the field and keep the chains moving.
Prefer to go the draft route or maybe explore someone like Geronimo Allison since there's no pick attached to his tender level (UDFA)
Maybe Kelvin Harmon with the 37th pick?
Harmon has some things about him I don't love - but his physicality is evident. He will bully smaller corners and I like how he plays.
He's a little slow which is my worry. But he has a good shot to produce in the RZ. He was fantastic against Clemson.. so he didn't just eat up crappy opponents.
is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
Trade the vets for picks. Then sign Tate? This makes no sense
Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
The Giants look to have done their homework on this.
Where is an evidence of that?
or they did the right homework especially for a bottom of the league team?
Our talent level is at the bottom of the league with massive holes at critical spots. The move would have been to do the homework on younger NFL players and not overpay for this type of player/age/position.
$23 million guaranteed for a limited slot WR? I can't buy into that.
RE: Shurmurs offense in MIN featured 2+ slots (Diggs/Thielen/Rudolph)
so while Tate's skill set seems duplicative of Shepard's (and Engram's) Shurmur has run an offense moving guys around and getting big production from multiple players out of the slot.
Regardless of who plays QB it helps to have weapons. Tate for 2 years around 11.5m/per by guaranteed money seems like a fine move unless he literally goes over the hill quickly.
It's a deep WR draft, grab a deep threat with speed to compete with Coleman (and maybe Latimer) in camp. Let Engram, Shepard, Tate, Barkley work the middle of the field and keep the chains moving.
Good post. I was just asking above if Diggs & Thielen were considered 2 slots for the same reason. That aside from the Amendola / Edelman comp if not Gronk / AH at TE (tho agreed, it's tough to 'do what NE does' tho I always think it's best to use the ideal as reference if not strive for it anyway)
And as you said if it's a deep WR draft, I heard we have picks...
This move makes sense. Tate is still a good player and still has a few good years left in him. It is just odd that the first FA signing is a 30 year old WR.
I expect they will target an outside threat in rounds two or three in the draft.
is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
There's a middle ground between a blind following and not being an idiot.
We need bodies. Tate and Shep can play a little outside, and given our depth chart at receiver (or Hockenson) is going to get the call in round 1 or 2.
We are creating a smart, run heavy team. I like players like this. This will be a mentally tough team.
is this really true if it is it makes me a little happier. Berklry is a big play waiting to happen at running back and what you need big plays at running Packers receivers that enthusiastically block
RE: RE: Nobody can lose a defender like Beckham can
We need bodies. Tate and Shep can play a little outside, and given our depth chart at receiver (or Hockenson) is going to get the call in round 1 or 2.
is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
you're an idiot. Who knows how many games we win. We still have more Free Agents, the Draft, possible trades, etc. Who knows about injuries, lucky or unlucky games, etc. How could any predict our record when we don't even have our full roster yet?
The dude is a player and he wont bring unnecessary drama to our team either. He caught 90 or more four straight years from 2014-2017 and his YAC exceeds Odell. He is not as effective in the red zone and thus has less tds than Odell, but hopefully EE will rise up to be our big red zone beast.
Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
in comparison to the rest of the WR market Tates contract seems solid
he and Humphries are pretty similar players and I'd rather have the guy 5 years younger, but Tate has been more productive. Tyrell Williams is also a nice upside play, but again Tate has been the more productive, consistent, player. Whoever the QB is, it's a pretty safe bet Golden Tate is on the receiving end of 150 balls the next couple years.
Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
The Giants look to have done their homework on this.
Where is an evidence of that?
or they did the right homework especially for a bottom of the league team?
Our talent level is at the bottom of the league with massive holes at critical spots. The move would have been to do the homework on younger NFL players and not overpay for this type of player/age/position.
$23 million guaranteed for a limited slot WR? I can't buy into that.
People are obsessed with "guaranteed" money... but the only thing that matters is the signing bonus. If most of the money is guaranteeing his first two years he wasn't going to be cut during his first two years anyways.
Tate isn't a number 1 WR.. he plays a position we already have (Slot WR) he is making too much money and isn't anything special.. where the fuck is the rebuilding.. save money.. this draft has better WR than Tate we can pick them up in the second/third round..
Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
I'm pretty sure that's not what they're trying to do... nor do I think this is the final group of WR's we're going into the season with.
Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
I'm pretty sure that's not what they're trying to do... nor do I think this is the final group of WR's we're going into the season with.
We are creating a smart, run heavy team. I like players like this. This will be a mentally tough team.
Dont think Shawn lee wants to see him again.
is this really true if it is it makes me a little happier. Berklry is a big play waiting to happen at running back and what you need big plays at running Packers receivers that enthusiastically block
Disagree there are better WR to be had in the third round of this draft. Dink and dunk doesn't help your running game. Vertical passes do! If this works DG is a genius. I wouldn't bet on it.
The dude is a player and he wont bring unnecessary drama to our team either. He caught 90 or more four straight years from 2014-2017 and his YAC exceeds Odell. He is not as effective in the red zone and thus has less tds than Odell, but hopefully EE will rise up to be our big red zone beast.
Tate
Shepherd
EE
Coleman
Fowler
Im down with these guys.
He fucked his QBs wife and broke Percy Harvins face before the super bowl. But yeah, definitely much better character guy than odell
Disagree there are better WR to be had in the third round of this draft. Dink and dunk doesn't help your running game. Vertical passes do! If this works DG is a genius. I wouldn't bet on it.
What about really good blocking WRs? Especially with a RB that busts open where one block can spring him. OBJ was not a blocker.
There are an awful lot of whining shit heads on this board
Its 3/14/19. Give it some time before you go full meltdown. We have 12 picks (4 premium) and over 4 months until training camp.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Its 3/14/19. Give it some time before you go full meltdown. We have 12 picks (4 premium) and over 4 months until training camp.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Excited to see what else we do.
Real workmanlike professional football players? Do you guys hear yourself talk sometimes?
if we didn't sign him, you guys would just bitch that Gettleman did nothing. Tate is a good player on a market value deal at WR, with the hopes he will be really productive for 2-3 years for us. What the hell is the problem with that?
Its 3/14/19. Give it some time before you go full meltdown. We have 12 picks (4 premium) and over 4 months until training camp.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Excited to see what else we do.
Real workmanlike professional football players? Do you guys hear yourself talk sometimes?
people freaking out. we have to be able to move the chains a little this season. he is a good player and we could prob use him for 2-3 years. he is also a vet guy who can lead some of the young guys we are going to have in that room...we will most likely draft an outside WR this year. i dont get why everyone is up in arms. we had to field a team this year....
Tate is now our best WR. We had barely one WR in Sheppard who is very average and now we got someone much better. Is he OBJ no, but he by far better than what we had and for the best WR on the market to come in cheaper than Williams, Crowder, Funchess, Humphries, etc is great.
Disagree there are better WR to be had in the third round of this draft. Dink and dunk doesn't help your running game. Vertical passes do! If this works DG is a genius. I wouldn't bet on it.
Actually this is a very deep draft of quality receivers.
If you are going by age 30 year Tate is young that 31 one year Antonio Brown who just got like guaranteed forever for like 20 mil a year. I mean if you are just going by age.
was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
Bingo
Bingo? That post was all kinds of wrong. Unless you think he was making 15 mil last year? Or that you think a 90+ catch 1000+ yard is shit? The only bingo that is, is when an old man yells bingo and then he realizes he didn't actually have it and every old people growns at him
RE: Giants are really breaking some new ground, though
In comment 14337410 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
Bingo
Dont get this at all. If you're of the opinion he's about to completely decline due to age fine. But how is a WR who had 74+ reception (1 yr removed from 4 straight 90s) and 795+ yds (w/ 3 seasons 1000+) in the last 5 years had "2 shit seasons?" And been as durable as you can be. How is that shit?
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
what the fucking are you guys talking about. Tate made 6M last year. He caught 74 balls. And was on pace for 90+ before he was dealt to the Eagles.
This place is a shitshow.
It is like idiot double down on more idiocy. Just throwing things out there. Golden Tate is 87 years old and didn't even play the last 100 years yet we are paying him 1 billion dollars. Next person... so right he was 90 years old and 2 billion is to much!
This seems to be a very good year to draft 2 solid WRs
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
we traded away a HOF caliber player for 50 cents on the dollar to overpay an aging slot receiver?
Nah, but see, Tate is a real player. A hard-nosed no nonsense bring your lunch pail to work professional and team mate.
Never mind he got thrown out of Seattle for fucking his QB's wife and breaking his teammates face.
I thought Harvin punched out Tate?
Facts don't matter anymore here.
I actually laughed at this post... because it's sadly true. It's like people just make shit up and run with it until someone lets them know it's completely wrong.
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I've seen plenty of him. He's not a strict slot guy. He's not going to be much of a deep threat outside, though. Right now I suppose that would be more Latimer's role, and then we see what we get from the draft. But he and Shep are great blocking WRs, so this is going to help Saquon break some long ones.
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
Well they aren't trading Golden Tate next year, so what does a 32 or 33 year old get you - since you want to be snide.
This team is going to surprise many pundits this year. They are going to run the ball, stop the run and hit some big plays on play action with solid specials. Defense is going to be hungry, aggressive and I think Betcher is going to love coaching them and the players are going to lay it out for them with growing pains.
I was a little down on Shurmer early in the season. He kept them together, they got better and he is growing and understands NFC East football and the what made the Giants the Giants when they were good. Let's hope for the best and nice to see the GM and HC with a shared vision. Be patient, we are making progress.
This signing continues to show they want tough football players.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: the Eagles gave up a 3rd round pick for him 6 months ago
depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
Well they aren't trading Golden Tate next year, so what does a 32 or 33 year old get you - since you want to be snide.
Who says they won't trade him this year? If they're willing to trade Beckham 6 months after signing him I'd imagine anyone is on the table if circumstances make sense.
If the team is as bad as everyone thinks I'd imagine all veterans will be available at the deadline just like this year. Both Goldens included. That's why I think there's value in spending money on veterans even if the team isn't going anywhere this year. You may be able to turn them into BJ Hill. Or Kevin Zeitler. Or a 3rd/4th/5th rd pick. Which was the point of the first post you snidely responded too.
to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
They have (correctly) chosen to rebuild since the deadline last year. Unless they surprisingly compete this season I don't expect them to turn down draft picks for veterans if the opportunity arrises. If there were younger guys available who actually had more upside than golden tate, you can bet they wouldn't be cheaper.
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
is very good for Shepard and hopefully Coleman. He's a football schoar, a real veteran leader of wr corps.
The best thing it does for Coleman (and Latimer if he comes back) is allows them to focus on downfield routes. Tate and Shepard can work the middle, Barkley too out of the backfield, Engram and Ellison down the seams.
Then let Coleman use his speed to take the top off the D. hopefully find an explosive rookie in the mid rounds too.
This is like joining a ESPN Fantasy Team league draft
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
This is all he does. He did the same thing last offseason when the Giants hurt his feelings and didnt draft a QB. He must have been emotionslly scarred because he bitched about it endlessly. Apparently those wounds run deep.
RE: RE: This is like joining a ESPN Fantasy Team league draft
to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
Okay, Ill play. Who?
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
This is all he does. He did the same thing last offseason when the Giants hurt his feelings and didnt draft a QB. He must have been emotionslly scarred because he bitched about it endlessly. Apparently those wounds run deep.
Oh please. I complimented most of last years draft picks and their performance last year. I complimented the Zeitler portion of the trade. Sorry this team is floating around with no discernible plan.
to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
Okay, Ill play. Who?
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
Neither are as good as Golden Tate and they both got about the same amount of money. As for the guarantee again that doesn't matter at all. The only thing that matters is the signing bonus which was 10 million for Humphries... meaning after two years it is a 5 million dollar cap hit to cut. So again until you know signing bonus guarantee means nothing. Crowder same thing who is getting 9.5 million a year!
"great veteran leadership for the position group" is one of the most cliche and overblown things football fans and front offices say. That's the same reason we wasted money on Stewart.
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
knocking 1 as a bad move and 1 as a good move is odd since they're extremely similar players and their 1 main difference (age) isn't much of a factor since they are short term deals.
I'd have been happy with either player, not sure which I'd prefer. I like Tate's leadership and I think he's been a more productive player. I like Crowder's special teams ability and that he's got a little more explosiveness.
"great veteran leadership for the position group" is one of the most cliche and overblown things football fans and front offices say. That's the same reason we wasted money on Stewart.
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
Well A) You don't think being better is important good to know. I mean if you think Golden Tate is over paid and they aren't as good they wouldn't that make them extremely over paid? B) They signed before we actually were able to trade OBJ soooo were they options?
There is no such thing as long term in the NFL now. Wake up.
Never ceases to amaze me how people constantly assume
when in three years, likely when this team has a shot at competing one will be 29 and the other 34. There's more potential upside to having Crowder in the final year of his deal in 2021, hopefully in year three of our new QB than Golden Tate who is probably cut after year two.
Golden Tate is a very good player. Golden Tate also probably should have taken the Patriots offer if the rumors of them wanting him was true. Golden Tate on the Giants is a short term move to try to be a competitive team next year. If Graziano's reports are true they're essentially running it back with the same plan as last year, just without Odell - and that's troubling.
I pay for season tickets, I don't want the Giants to suck. I don't want to watch the Cowboys and Eagles battle for the division while we struggle. Despite what it may seem like I'm not rooting against the Giants. I'm over taking the wait and see approach for a front office who hasn't given any reason to trust them the last two years or an ownership group who hasn't given a reason the last seven years to trust them.
"great veteran leadership for the position group" is one of the most cliche and overblown things football fans and front offices say. That's the same reason we wasted money on Stewart.
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
Well A) You don't think being better is important good to know. I mean if you think Golden Tate is over paid and they aren't as good they wouldn't that make them extremely over paid? B) They signed before we actually were able to trade OBJ soooo were they options?
There is no such thing as long term in the NFL now. Wake up.
If you wake up and connect the dots that Odell trade didn't just come out of nowhere. They probably had discussed it for a while and it likely led to them being ok with letting Collins walk with no tag.
Golden Tate isn't over paid for Golden Tate, he's just not a right fit for a rebuilding team - if we even are one.
Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
I am glad to see people have optimism and feel good about the moves, I sincerely wish I did. I dont think they are bad, Golden Tate is definitely an odd signing considering things, and Markus Golden is on a 1 year deal and while I havent really watched him much he isnt really some amazing get is he? I am not trying to be a pessimist, I am sincerely asking about Markus Golden. I dont think there is a free agent out there currently that would get me excited about this upcoming season. I am all for being wrong though, so sick of watching them lose so much
why did we add an aging receiver. these moves make no sense.
Barnwell is correct analyzing this signing:
"Do you remember "Memento," the movie in which Guy Pearce's short-term memory was destroyed and he lost the ability to remember anything in the recent past? Is it possible the Giants are struggling with the same condition? Days after trading Odell Beckham Jr. to signal that they were going to build around Saquon Barkley and the running game, the Giants reversed course and gave Tate a four-year deal with $23.5 million fully guaranteed at signing.
It's bizarre for many reasons. To start, while the franchise buried Beckham on his way out of town and called him a distraction, the Giants responded by signing a wideout who was cited while with the Seahawks for breaking into a doughnut store and who reportedly got into a fistfight with Percy Harvin the week before the Super Bowl. (To be clear, I don't think those are actual character concerns, but they're more meaningful than, say, getting into a fight with a kicking net or simulating urination during a touchdown celebration.)"
He has two years left easy, maybe 3. We are in rebuild mode. This leads me to think the Giants may trade Shepard on draft day if not sooner? A package to move up? For all we know the Giants want Bosa at #2. LOL
Tate can do it all and while he isnt a burner he can get behind a defense and make players from the X. He makes big plays and catches the ball in big spots and hes been YAC master. He stays on the field. Solid signing.
Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
I did. You obviously didnt.
Your argument remains dogshit.
You clearly didnt watch shit. And it isnt just last yr. Shepard is not the player you think he is. Are you friends with Jerry Reese or Marc Ross?!
drops than Tate on basically the same number of targets.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
drops than Tate on basically the same number of targets.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
Did you watch every Golden Tate target this year to give yourself a fair comparison.
Regarding your post after this, sure Tate is better now and it's Shep's last year but the likely hood is that Shepard ascends while Tate descends. Moving on from Shepard because of Tate is backwards
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
Crowder signed before the OBJ trade. So you would have been okay with his contract if we signed him not knowing the trade?
Adam Humphries. Well, he stated to play fairly well but he had the benefit of Evans drawing the bulk of the coverage. Plus, there was Jackson, Howard, and Goodwin. So he caught a ton of underneath stuff...he barely averaged 10 per reception.
drops than Tate on basically the same number of targets.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
Did you watch every Golden Tate target this year to give yourself a fair comparison.
Regarding your post after this, sure Tate is better now and it's Shep's last year but the likely hood is that Shepard ascends while Tate descends. Moving on from Shepard because of Tate is backwards
Sure I can't discount the small probability that Shep will ascend this year. However, he's had 3 years to show us something including games with no OBJ last year and a subpar receiving corp., and I was rather unimpressed. Don't think he'll be resigned.
you should all go back and read the 10 pages of posts and just step back for a minute to realize how moronic some of you are.
1. Tate is not a replacement for OBJ
2. Tate should not be compared to Shep. This is not an either/or thing between the two of them. They are independent of each other. Comparing drop rates, age and money just shows how much some of you have no idea WTF you are talking about.
Adding Tate right now does a few things..
He is a veteran WR who is tough, a hard worker, a professional and is a solid team mate. He is also depth and a starter at the same time. Depth has been a problem with this team for a while.
Stop worrying about the money. Some people here cannot even balance their own checkbooks and are screaming about the Giants cap.
You can expect this team to still add a guy who can stretch the field. The over reaction and knee jerk comments are just out of control now.
This team is going to surprise many pundits this year. They are going to run the ball, stop the run and hit some big plays on play action with solid specials. Defense is going to be hungry, aggressive and I think Betcher is going to love coaching them and the players are going to lay it out for them with growing pains.
I was a little down on Shurmer early in the season. He kept them together, they got better and he is growing and understands NFC East football and the what made the Giants the Giants when they were good. Let's hope for the best and nice to see the GM and HC with a shared vision. Be patient, we are making progress.
This signing continues to show they want tough football players.
Like your optimism LOS . Hope you are right. Waiting to see the final moves to shore up the remaining weak spots.
Our receiving core is NOT weak now. People forget we have an RB that catches 70+ balls and has downfield capability. We have one of the better receiving TEs who is a 4.4 guy , and Shep who is a very good slot guy. And now Tate who has been a mutliple 1000+ yard reciever and is not that old.
Losing Beckham took us from possibly the best all around receivers in the entire NFL (or top 3 at worst) when you factor RB and TE to now a good to very good group depending on if Tate shows the same burst he had in previous stops.
you should all go back and read the 10 pages of posts and just step back for a minute to realize how moronic some of you are.
1. Tate is not a replacement for OBJ
2. Tate should not be compared to Shep. This is not an either/or thing between the two of them. They are independent of each other. Comparing drop rates, age and money just shows how much some of you have no idea WTF you are talking about.
Adding Tate right now does a few things..
He is a veteran WR who is tough, a hard worker, a professional and is a solid team mate. He is also depth and a starter at the same time. Depth has been a problem with this team for a while.
Stop worrying about the money. Some people here cannot even balance their own checkbooks and are screaming about the Giants cap.
You can expect this team to still add a guy who can stretch the field. The over reaction and knee jerk comments are just out of control now.
Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
he was with the seahawks 6 years ago. Tate is a solid player to have on the team for the reasons I mentioned.
There are other forums and hobbies that I recommend you look into. This is not going to be fun for you over the next couple of years. BBI and the Giants are likely to trigger you daily.
Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
he was with the seahawks 6 years ago. Tate is a solid player to have on the team for the reasons I mentioned.
There are other forums and hobbies that I recommend you look into. This is not going to be fun for you over the next couple of years. BBI and the Giants are likely to trigger you daily.
I'm just asking for some consistency. The Norman incident was 3 years ago and still gets brought up here like it happened yesterday.
Sorry I'm disappointed the Giants haven't put out a competitive product in 7 years and the streak looks like it is headed for 10 years at a minimum.
yeah I am not happy the team sucks either. I am paying a lot of money for tickets too so it really bothers me too.
Still.. we cannot look at these moves independently or in a vacuum. This is just the beginning of the off season. We need to see what team we are taking into training camp.
You cannot win a game of chess in one move. This week, we sacrificed the Queen to preserve the King.
Hate him for this team at that contract. This one foot in, one foot out strategy is making the rebuild much more difficult and complicated than it needs to be.
When they condemn a signing because that player, who is only 30 I might add, wont be around long enough as the team wont be ready to win for at least 3 more years. This is so out of touch from how real life nfl people think its just laughable. And untrue. Its complete trash.
Let me get this right This signing sucks because this team isnt good enough to appreciate his talents? Think about how laughably stupid that is. Sorry, it just is.
Because we all know this has to be the focal point of every football discussion, the giants are adding players via fa. They obviously have some room to do things as its happening right before our eyes. And next year a shit load of money comes off the books so why is everyone so worried about dead money? It happens. Dallas deals with tons of dead money nearly every off season and they have been doing just fine.
The money isnt a problem at all. The giants are plugging holes with fa and building through the draft. DG had a good draft last year. Hopefully he has another good one this year, hes got a ton of picks. This is good right? Cheer up.
The amount of overreaction on this thread is laughable
Tate is a good player, and they got him at a good price. Look at the market for wide receivers, Tate is right in line with other players of his caliber. Crowder and Humphries as were mentioned earlier got similar deals, Tate is a better player than both of them.
The age argument is absurd. This isnt a running back we are discussing, receivers often play into their mid 30s at a high level. Desean Jackson is a year older and just got a deal in the same ballpark as Tate. Antonio Brown is the same age as Tate, and nobody mentions his age as a reason Oakland shouldnt have made the move for him. Taken into the context of where his contract is and comparing it to other players around the league, we got ourselves a guy that consistently puts up 90 receptions, 1000 yards, and 5 TDs at about half the cost of what top receivers get paid.
When they condemn a signing because that player, who is only 30 I might add, wont be around long enough as the team wont be ready to win for at least 3 more years. This is so out of touch from how real life nfl people think its just laughable. And untrue. Its complete trash.
Let me get this right This signing sucks because this team isnt good enough to appreciate his talents? Think about how laughably stupid that is. Sorry, it just is.
I dont know how anybody can watch Tate play and not be impressed by him as a football player. He has the type of body, too, that I think will hold up well into his mid-30s. Ive always seen a lot of Hines Ward in him...
yeah I am not happy the team sucks either. I am paying a lot of money for tickets too so it really bothers me too.
Still.. we cannot look at these moves independently or in a vacuum. This is just the beginning of the off season. We need to see what team we are taking into training camp.
You cannot win a game of chess in one move. This week, we sacrificed the Queen to preserve the King.
Funny that you bring up chess and wanting us fans to look at the team like we are playing chess. Alpha Zero learned how to beat the best chess computer in the world before it in 3 hours.
There are people that can program these types of systems out there for us to hire, other teams have people of this ilk, no evidence that we do. We have people advocating for viewing our moves like chess with a leader that doesn't seem to understand how to apply the best ways to win at chess today. These same people advocate patience while we have become the laughing stock of the league. Great, really great.
anyone that thinks they have bw pigeon holed to a type of thinking is completely wrong.
Definitely has opinions on Giants management that frankly more people should have even if he is strong with them but definitely a wild card.
A few weeks ago told me that he didn't necessarily believe in team building with WRs but now seems in support of this move. I think it is very easy to like Tate as a player but not having problems with this move while advocating a rebuild is definitely a hot take.
I'm down on this move because it again seems overall inconsistent with any kind of plan or format that has worked. The closest comp I can think to a team that won with a plan resembling anything like this is the Broncos with Peyton Manning, maybe all the way back to Dilfer or Brad Johnson but you know what all those teams had in common? Fantastic defenses.
Hard to defend this approach with our defense and again if you had any inclination that this was your plan, I just can't comprehend how you move Snacks for a 4th rounder.
...about Golden Tate! He is a very fine receiver with a knack of taking short to intermediate passes and turning them into big gains.
And don't be fooled by his supposed drop in productivity... he was traded in mid-season and it takes awhile to learn a new system and be properly / optimally integrated into that system.
And last but not least, it is totally unfair to compare this player with OBJ. Golden Tate has to be judged in his own right. He is a very solid football player and ranked, for example, as the 27th best free agent by NFL.com.
Give you a little but more wiggle room in the draft.
The rest hopefully depends on value.
For myself, being biased towards D and with this particular draft being very, apparently very, strong on D fronts, I'm hoping that sort of value discipline lasts the entire draft.
Folks biased towards O seem less aware of their bias and more likely to apply hope or projections to offense prospects, and therefore to loose discipline a bit.
Give you a little but more wiggle room in the draft.
The rest hopefully depends on value.
For myself, being biased towards D and with this particular draft being very, apparently very, strong on D fronts, I'm hoping that sort of value discipline lasts the entire draft.
Folks biased towards O seem less aware of their bias and more likely to apply hope or projections to offense prospects, and therefore to loose discipline a bit.
I was just thinking that, by signing Golden Tate, the Giants won't feel forced to go WR at #17. I'd love to snag, for example, Devin White at #6 and maybe someone like Devin Bush at #17, or a nice two-way TE such as TJ Hockenson.
JRE: The amount of overreaction on this thread is laughable
Tate is a good player, and they got him at a good price. Look at the market for wide receivers, Tate is right in line with other players of his caliber. Crowder and Humphries as were mentioned earlier got similar deals, Tate is a better player than both of them.
The age argument is absurd. This isnt a running back we are discussing, receivers often play into their mid 30s at a high level. Desean Jackson is a year older and just got a deal in the same ballpark as Tate. Antonio Brown is the same age as Tate, and nobody mentions his age as a reason Oakland shouldnt have made the move for him. Taken into the context of where his contract is and comparing it to other players around the league, we got ourselves a guy that consistently puts up 90 receptions, 1000 yards, and 5 TDs at about half the cost of what top receivers get paid.
Excellent points, thanks. By the way, Julio Jones and AJ Green I believe are also both 30. Anyone want to diss these guys too. Tate has never missed any games and is in great shape. Playing till 34 is no big deal.
and he's not being paid like Julio Jones or AJ Green.
His AAV right now puts him as the 23rd highest paid WR in the NFL, 1 spot ahead of Desean Jackson and 1 spot behind Jamison Crowder.
I agree with you that he's a good player. He's at least on a FMV contract even if there are guys in that same range that would be preferable for whatever reason. His production consistency and durability stand out however IMO.
oof. pouring one out for you, partner.
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Lol this has been a hard week for all of us.
Oh fuck that's bad.
Let's see what the contract looks like.
Link - ( New Window )
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Which means they might not resign Shepard next year because hes gonna get a huge deal from someone
Ok, we get it. Want to change your handle now? :)
How many slots do we have for slot receivers on a given play?
I was happy when the Eagles got him because he sucks now.
Now he's here, great.
Also probably means we're not re-signing S.S.?
This just reeks of a desperation move after trading OBJ.
I mean... For real? I like him as a cheaper #2-3. Hmmmm...
I don't know how I feel about this yet.
I do know that PS got out of Diggs... But Tate and Shepard are definitely on the shorter side...
Just wait until you hear how he's better than Odell. I'm really not exaggerating... you know that's coming.
And the second pick in the 2020 Draft
I'm so glad we didn't trade Landon Collins for that 3rd round pick. That wouldn't be useful right now at all.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
Cmon Jim, we needed some talent there. The futures the draft. With 12 picks, we should be able to find a good one
Also probably means we're not re-signing S.S.?
This just reeks of a desperation move after trading OBJ.
Did you see the money given to Adam Humphries and Jamison Crowder? This was a very good signing for the Giants.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
I agree with that statement.
Quote:
Tate is still very good/productive - I just feel like he and Shepard are a bit redundant.
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Which means they might not resign Shepard next year because hes gonna get a huge deal from someone
Very possible - and I'd be fine with that if we decide to have Tate man the slot the next 2-3-4 years (depending on where our out is in this deal/if we'll even need to use it) and then go bigger on the outside.
I'd like to get some bigger, more physical guys here.
I also wouldn't mind DK Metcalf @ 17.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
seems like nearly EVERY person that covers the league feels the same.
Are we trying to sign quality players?
Each move we make just seems contradictory of the previous one
Don't worry... Tua will love him.
Its a bad move. This guy isn't worth these numbers.
He's an OK #3 but Id rather go with a young guy and cheap option as a #3.
WTF are you talking about. He just finished a 5 year 31 million dollar contract. He had 74 receptions last year and over 90 receptions each year for the previous 4 seasons. Your math sucks
We are trying to repeat our dead money title crown! With all the contracts we just shed it's going to be tough. Don't count DG out though. He's no nonsense.
My thought exactly
BTW- I had forgotten the DG quote about Analytics being "nonsense" was in response to a question about signing Jonathon Stewart. Players become washed up, end of story. NFL stands for Not For Long. Everyone knows that. Just because the guy shows a slight flash of speed in some random game the year before does not mean he has "plenty left in the tank" and you sign him to 3-4 year deal. Every player has their LAST great day at some point, the great ones are able to know when that is.
Way too early to analyze the loss of a pick. Depends on who we lose and sign in the future and their salaries.
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Ugh - wow thats bad
Cmon Jim, we needed some talent there. The futures the draft. With 12 picks, we should be able to find a good one
You're on board with signing 30 year old free agents now?
Does that mean that overpaying older, good but limited players is a good idea?
Who's playing on the outside?
(blink)
Golden Tate was making 15 million last year? Don't think so
I'm guessing (read: hoping) that at least 1/3 is for injury only. We need to be able to get out of this in two years and have less than $5 million in dead money.
IDK. I don't like it. Tate does most of his damage in the slot anyway, no? Shep should be in the slot.
Field Yates
Verified account @FieldYates
13s13 seconds ago
I love Golden Tate as a player and he deserves the money he is getting paid. But the Giants' roster construction plan right now makes zero sense to me.
My thoughts exactly.
Wave those pom-poms, baby!
92 catches, 1003 yards and 5 scores is "shit" ?
More consistent strategies here from our fearless leaders.
Let me see the terms here - but I like the player. Dude is a tough SOB
Yeah Arc...not the ideal complement to Shep but Ill take it. He is a consistent performer and big upgrade to anyone else on the roster at WR except Shepard.
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I saw an end zone celebration in the highlights. Me first player.
(blink)
I'm guessing it was sarcasm grounded in people's whining about Beckham. I think?
Cuts him.
Quote:
We can afford almost anyone we want. The path is still through the draft
Does that mean that overpaying older, good but limited players is a good idea?
It means, BFD..We still have the draft to improve the receiving moving forward
That's inaccurate. He was good from 14-17. 4 straight seasons of 90 catches and over a thousand yards.
First 4 games of the year - 7 catches per game, 97 yards per game.
Last 11 games of the year - 4 catches per game, 37 yards per game.
Now maybe part of that was going to a new system in Philly mid-year, but that's very concerning.
It does seem like Gettleman is bringing in gamer/culture players which we do need.
Who's playing on the outside?
Corey Coleman. Cody Lattimer. Corey Feldman.
Should I dig up some of your commentary from the past and then dismiss what you say because you were wrong about a player. Get your head our of your ass.
Quote:
In comment 14337440 mikeinbloomfield said:
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I saw an end zone celebration in the highlights. Me first player.
(blink)
I'm guessing it was sarcasm grounded in people's whining about Beckham. I think?
Oh, phew. You never know around here!
LOL
But - I know we need to go one move, by knee-jerk move here and go nuts over each one as if this is the final piece for the offseason.
A little bit of an awkward fit but as others have said this could mean they are willing to trade Shepard. Or play him/Engram outside more. Or just plan to have a bunch of interchangeable pieces.
Quote:
was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
That's inaccurate. He was good from 14-17. 4 straight seasons of 90 catches and over a thousand yards.
My fault... Didn't crack 1000 in 2015... But he's been solid since 2014. Last year he got traded mid-season and the Eagles didn't know how to use him. I firmly believe PS can get the most out of him.
But - I know we need to go one move, by knee-jerk move here and go nuts over each one as if this is the final piece for the offseason.
There simply doesn't seem to be much in the way of coherence or reason to these moves. It's not just BBI loose cannons saying that, it's most of the football world saying it.
They might add that downfield threat in the draft. I think the Giants are going WR with either the 17th overall pick or their 2nd or 3rd rounder.
Who the hell taught you math? He had 74 receptions last year and a salary of $7 million.
As to his stats:
2018 - 74/795
2017 - 92/1,003
I'd hardly call those (especially 2017) "shit"
First 4 games of the year - 7 catches per game, 97 yards per game.
Last 11 games of the year - 4 catches per game, 37 yards per game.
Now maybe part of that was going to a new system in Philly mid-year, but that's very concerning.
Its going to Philly and a new system. The Lions moved him due to salary cap issues, not because of his talent . Their passing game was not the same when he left.
It's not a bad move so much as it is a confusing move.
Quote:
I was worried for a second that he wasn't going to like this move.
LOL
Somebody's got to counter balance the negativity. This is Saquons team now with a revamped OL and a system that relies on PA. DG doesnt ascribe to the basketball on grass analogy of Marc Ross.
Tate isnt OBJ but he is a reliable performer and isnt some scrap heap guy (like a bunch of the guys we trotted out in the secondary last year).
They're both slot guys, though
im speechless. This team has no direction. They want to compete while rebuilding. SO throw $$$ at an aging declining slot WR when we already have one whos younger in Shep??
All to give it one more shot with Eli? This is insanity..3 straight years of this sh*t.
+1.. Backup lineman get 9m a season lately, get over it. This is a good signing for a few years, has zero impact on Shepard (who is an excellent blocker, but his hands are not great, neither is his separation).
We don't need WR's? Shepard has proven that he isn't a #1 receive. Before this signing Corey Coleman and Jawill Davis were the #2 and #3 WR's. We had the worst WR core in football. How is that not a need?
Oh you see a shotgun 4WR formation with Barkley in the backfield. JUST KIDDING. He's going split out inside the inside receiver!! What will you do with all this slot?? WHAT???
Defense needs a core and you can't get core pieces in FA. Just doesn't work.
They'd do well to add at least 1 pass rusher through FA, but the defense will be fixed if they successfully add 2-3 core players in the draft.
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than Shepard. They aren't the same player.
They're both slot guys, though
Come on buddy, let it play out. Much left in FA and most importantly 12 picks in the draft
Hahaha
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We're not finished @ WR - if we don't draft or sign any big bodies to play outside, I'll be very surprised.
But - I know we need to go one move, by knee-jerk move here and go nuts over each one as if this is the final piece for the offseason.
There simply doesn't seem to be much in the way of coherence or reason to these moves. It's not just BBI loose cannons saying that, it's most of the football world saying it.
Most of the football world consists of ESPN talking heads and people with no clue.
Do we really care what fucking Field Yates thinks about what's going on here? I don't.
Maybe they're going to move Shepard. Who knows. It's just frustrating that every thread has to have 100 sarcastic comments about how no one in the org knows what they're doing.
People can hate the signing - I don't care - but the nonstop, over and over complaining over every single thing is just exhausting to sift through and actually converse over sometimes.
The Giants are just in a place right now where anything they do is going to be put under a microscope and be questioned.
I didn't want the "go for it with Eli" thing to happen again here this year, but this is what we're getting, so.. they better have more coming and knock this draft out of the fucking park.
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In comment 14337510 ryanmkeane said:
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than Shepard. They aren't the same player.
They're both slot guys, though
Come on buddy, let it play out. Much left in FA and most importantly 12 picks in the draft
I understand, but I don't see the point of having two guys who excel in the slot. We need outside receivers.
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was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
Who the hell taught you math? He had 74 receptions last year and a salary of $7 million.
As to his stats:
2018 - 74/795
2017 - 92/1,003
I'd hardly call those (especially 2017) "shit"
Had a 1000 yd season and 92 receptions. Not the perfect complement to Shep but they can still work plenty well together in the right system.
Yup
But I ain't putting two of them in my driveway.
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In comment 14337524 Anakim said:
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In comment 14337510 ryanmkeane said:
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than Shepard. They aren't the same player.
They're both slot guys, though
Come on buddy, let it play out. Much left in FA and most importantly 12 picks in the draft
I understand, but I don't see the point of having two guys who excel in the slot. We need outside receivers.
Perhaps theyre looking to move SS before his contract ends? Too early to know at this point
Some fans act like the money is coming out of their bank account.
Link - ( New Window )
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
Good point
But I ain't putting two of them in my driveway.
Thank you!!!
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
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isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
So is Shepard - there's highlight reels of the guy flying down field and blowing people up. He was a catalyst on several big Barkley runs or a guy who provided a key block in the process.
But - the hysterics are more important.
We are also hearing the sun is hot. The Patriots brought in Maurice Harris and Bruce Ellington for visits on Thursday, but Tate is simply on a different level than those two. With Tate seemingly encountering a colder than expected market, the Patriots could end up getting the 30-year-old at a bargain.
Link - ( New Window )
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
#1 in catch rate.
60% of snaps in the slot. So he can play outside.
This team has been absolutely plagued with drops. Don't have that problem with Golden Tate.
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isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
Ok based on what? When we talk about linemen blocking it's all about size and arm length but let's not apply that same logic to receivers?
Also he might do better against slot corners yes but the point is one of SS or Tate is going to have to go on the outside now. They are our top 2 receivers to so conceivably they could both be outside to maximize our passing game.
more like the Browns
Huh? I'm not a huge fan of the move (for the redundancy, Tate is a decent receiver) but both of those guys are known as solid, high effort blockers.
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We are literally transforming into the New England Patriots.
more like the Browns
The Browns of 2 years ago?
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In comment 14337535 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 14337524 Anakim said:
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In comment 14337510 ryanmkeane said:
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than Shepard. They aren't the same player.
They're both slot guys, though
Come on buddy, let it play out. Much left in FA and most importantly 12 picks in the draft
I understand, but I don't see the point of having two guys who excel in the slot. We need outside receivers.
Perhaps theyre looking to move SS before his contract ends? Too early to know at this point
Could be. Gettleman seems to be scrubbing every single fingerprint of Jerry Reese's from this team.
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In comment 14337548 NoGainDayne said:
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isn't this a little confusing to you that we just spent all these resources upgrading the line but we could have one of the very worst receiver blocking teams? Harder to bust those runs if you have SS or Tate on the outside against a larger CB.
Tate is actually known for his good blocking.
Ok based on what? When we talk about linemen blocking it's all about size and arm length but let's not apply that same logic to receivers?
Also he might do better against slot corners yes but the point is one of SS or Tate is going to have to go on the outside now. They are our top 2 receivers to so conceivably they could both be outside to maximize our passing game.
Hines Ward was one of the best blocking WR's ever and he is about the same size as Tate.
Id bet it was more like 10%. hes a slot guy. only time hes playing outside is if injuries force him out there.
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We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
Yea, lets do that. Sign irresponsible contracts and blow our shot at a top QB in 2020 by putting bandaids on this mess. This team is a joke.
Id bet it was more like 10%. hes a slot guy. only time hes playing outside is if injuries force him out there.
KWALL - ( New Window )
I don't want Metcalf. He wreaks of workout warrior but his teammate AJ Brown could be an option.
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In comment 14337571 KWALL2 said:
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We need defensive players, pass rushers, and guys who can play in space.
We have Barkley and he will be the center of the offense. Improve the OL? We made a good move there. Still more to do. Get some young size/speed at WR and not a fading slot guy who won't help Barkley at all. He doens't make the team a tougher matchup.
We should have spent that money on bigger priorities especially defense. Our front 7 may be the worst in the NFL right now. Our pass rusher is the worst in the league and we're signing this guy? Terrible.
They can take an outside guy in the draft.
I expect Remmers to be next, then hopefully Golden, a CB and another Safety.
Yea, lets do that. Sign irresponsible contracts and blow our shot at a top QB in 2020 by putting bandaids on this mess. This team is a joke.
Show me the irresponsible contract. If you think 4 years 40 mil for Tate is too much you just don't have a grasp on the market.
Id bet it was more like 10%. hes a slot guy. only time hes playing outside is if injuries force him out there.
2016 76% of his snaps were outside.
The last two years 24% were on the outside.
He can play both and do it well. You can mix him up with Shep. Are they explosive? No, but I think with Engram, Shep, Tate, and Saquon (who is explosive) that is not a terrible skill position set. As I said, this is a good move.
And what exactly are you looking for here? Running this thing back with Eli? Until when exactly. Glad youre happy.
David Boston Jr. As Fats has said, he's going to have a calf muscle explode in the middle of a game
We should probably not have hired a 70 year old who doesnt believe in analytics, positional value or asset management.
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DK Metcalf may well be on the board @ 17. Guy is 6'5", 230+ and a freak. His production isn't there @ the college level but most of it was cut short because of a neck injury. He has all pro ability.
David Boston Jr. As Fats has said, he's going to have a calf muscle explode in the middle of a game
Boston was really fucking good before he roided himself out and became a hot air balloon.
This was it?? Jesus...
(not against you, jt)
Nothing DG does makes much sense. What I suspect is going to happen is hes gonna band aid this thing enough to have us win 6 games next year instead of 2-4, which probably is needed to get at the top QBs in April of 2020.
The Giants are in big shit with this clown as GM.
this signing only makes sense if SS is gone after this year or if we have plans to trade SS. otherwise i just don't get it
Pump up that completion %!
Comparing the Pats to this dumpster fire is WTH, meh and LOL
You do realize this team has made the playoffs once since 2011 and the Pats have won 3 Super Bowls in that time, right????
If there is any trade market for him I would be exploring that.
Its a bad move. This guy isn't worth these numbers.
He's an OK #3 but Id rather go with a young guy and cheap option as a #3.
Agreed. Way too much for an aging receiver, even though he is still productive.
Well, we had Peyton Hillis, so...
He will be productive too for at least a couple seasons.
I may not be. I saw 61% slot percentage. Made sense to me lol.
If there is any trade market for him I would be exploring that.
My guess? They are
I get the 2 slots question but have never understood why scheme & play design can't adjust to solid players. Doesn't it mean we have 2 tougher, short-yardage, shifty, interior WRs? Can they not be used on the same play at times, when not spelling each other? Not all coaches could, but you'd hope a good coach can use value. (I'd also ask if Diggs & Thielen were known as smaller, slot type WRs, if so Shurmur did ok with that)
In the fav BB comp, he gets 2 athletic TEs and not only makes the O heavy 2 TE sets but also decides to use one as an RB out the backfield. Or more applicable Edelman / Amendola as mentioned above. I don't think 2 slot WRs would be even that exotic or unusual
Some of these ridiculous negative posters are surely trolls.
Im convinced the plan is to win just enough games to guarantee we cant replace Eli with a top pick
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
In comment 14337482 Bill in UT said:
And I guess the Eagles will get a good pick from this. Barf.
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.
Some of these ridiculous negative posters are surely trolls.
And Im convinced some of these ridiculous homers enjoy terrible football and losing to the fucking Eagles every game
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
slot receivers now. Tate will need to play more on the
outside, SS is not as good on the outside.
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In comment 14337666 Jints in Carolina said:
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.
Some of these ridiculous negative posters are surely trolls.
And Im convinced some of these ridiculous homers enjoy terrible football and losing to the fucking Eagles every game
+1.
👍
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23 guaranteed
Oh fuck that's bad.
Lol. Im shocked.
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
LOL. The offense is going to be bundled together. We don't need no stinking outside receivers! Put everyone close together.
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
Wow, that's all, thought it was more than that.
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I agree - he is a better player than Shepard. I can't believe I am seeing the opposite in this thread.
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In 2017...
"Tate ran 79 percent of his routes from the slot and drew an average depth of target of 6.7 yards, which ranked 49th of 51 wide receivers to see at least 75 targets."
Everything in the slot.
Everything short.
Link - ( New Window )
LOL. The offense is going to be bundled together. We don't need no stinking outside receivers! Put everyone close together.
Bunch formation right. EE out to the left. Haha.
DG will continue to blow this thing up!
Eli is going to need a dependable, between the hashes safety blanket. Tate brings that and YAC. Very durable and a good, tough body.
I'm not saying this is the case, but it easily could be the case that the Giants offered significantly more money.
I doubt they were offering him 23 million guaranteed, considering they usually know what they're doing.
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
That's cool. He's also going to be 31 next season, so for how much longer will he be better than Shepard?
Even if we didn't sign Tate, Shepard was unlikely to be here past this season. There might be a chance he gets traded for a 4th rounder or something.
It would fit within his MO of moving out good players and replacing them with someone worse.
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Both Shepard and Tate are significantly more effective in the slot.
Nothing DG does makes much sense. What I suspect is going to happen is hes gonna band aid this thing enough to have us win 6 games next year instead of 2-4, which probably is needed to get at the top QBs in April of 2020.
And that is why I call him DSG. Hes Dave Shitbag Gettleman, and hes ruining the franchise
Specifically, two great, and different defensive linesmen, at least two very different types of linebackers', all top of draft, maybe still a free safety.
And...ok... If not in free agency, the center.
This is the year for this.
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I can see Shep successfully converting to X or Y - he's skilled enough at route running and his work ethic is outstanding.
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2016 Beckham - Yards after Catch: 5.2, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.6
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I agree - he is a better player than Shepard. I can't believe I am seeing the opposite in this thread.
Dan Duggan just tweeted that if Golden Tate is worth 9, "the price for Shepard will only be higher"; so its not only on here. I think it is absurd, Golden Tate is durable guy with great hands, he reminds me of Bolden. We are luck to have him and yes, I am quite sure that in this league where the short passing has become a staple that you can run an offense wit Shepard and Tate. I think Gettleman has been awful, but I really don't understand the criticism of this move.
In what fucking universe is he a JAG. Before the trade he was on pace for his third consecutive 90 catch 1k yard season. It's like I'm taking fucking crazy pills.
Yeah, holy moly - some of these comments you'd think it's literally not possible to have both guys on the field together.
My first reaction was that the two are a bit redundant - but, that doesn't mean you can't deploy both guys or have it work.
Tate isn't Cole fucking Beasley.
I love how everyone goes on about how the best in the business (BB in NE) takes players who love the sport and make plays and designs a system to fit what they do well, then criticizes the Giants for a move for a guy who doesn't fit their "system" of NOT having two slot receivers on the field at the same time.
The Giants look to have done their homework on this. Obviously he's no OBJ, but the WR corps just got a lot better today.
Again, time will tell whether this is a winning move or not - not the mob on BBI.
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Exactly Tate can be a 2 .... shep can go into the slot we draft WR this yr and next early. EE has 4.4 speed we can make it work for a season or 2.
Another guy over 30.
A GM with no plan at all.
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In comment 14337687 Go Terps said:
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2016 Beckham - Yards after Catch: 5.2, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.6
2018 Shepard - Yards after Catch: 5.1, Expected Yards after Catch: 4.7
2018 Tate - Yards after Catch: 5.8, Expected Yards after Catch: 5.0
Golden Tate was a running back in high school; he's very good with the ball in his hands. He's a better player than Shepard.
I wonder if they either change Shepard's role to the X receiver role, or trade him.
I agree - he is a better player than Shepard. I can't believe I am seeing the opposite in this thread.
Dan Duggan just tweeted that if Golden Tate is worth 9, "the price for Shepard will only be higher"; so its not only on here. I think it is absurd, Golden Tate is durable guy with great hands, he reminds me of Bolden. We are luck to have him and yes, I am quite sure that in this league where the short passing has become a staple that you can run an offense wit Shepard and Tate. I think Gettleman has been awful, but I really don't understand the criticism of this move.
It's possible Duggan is right by way of Shepard being younger and likely still ascending a bit.
But right now, Tate is the better player of the two.
Maybe Shepard will be here with him, maybe he won't be.
I am quite sure we aren't going to stop here @ WR and go into the year with this exact group. I expect a bigger body to be added one way or another.
Appreciate you weighing in, even if it is a bucket of cold water...you don't see much left in Tate's tank?
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Fuck! Fuck! Fuck! I absolutely loathe agreeing with you..
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
He has some of that Steve Smith Napoleon Complex in him - I love it.
Nobody ever said we were rebuilding.
-DG
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and Shepard don't have nearly as much to do with each other as you're all making it seem. They will play at the same time.
Yeah, holy moly - some of these comments you'd think it's literally not possible to have both guys on the field together.
My first reaction was that the two are a bit redundant - but, that doesn't mean you can't deploy both guys or have it work.
Tate isn't Cole fucking Beasley.
Right. Pats were able to get Edelman and Amendola on the field together. This so called "problem" cab be solved.
What's next? You can't have two TEs on the field simultaneously?
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Because you are an Eli apologist that doesnt want a rebuild either. This is just another terrible move in a sea of them.
Please, please, no more fun. This front offices idea of fun is not good.
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Watch Tate play. You just can't boil him down to a few numbers, and then make a conclusion.
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Because you are an Eli apologist that doesnt want a rebuild either. This is just another terrible move in a sea of them.
Please, please, no more fun. This front offices idea of fun is not good.
Gahahahahahaha
You think bw is an Eli APOLOGIST?!?!?
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In comment 14337748 Jon in NYC said:
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and Shepard don't have nearly as much to do with each other as you're all making it seem. They will play at the same time.
Yeah, holy moly - some of these comments you'd think it's literally not possible to have both guys on the field together.
My first reaction was that the two are a bit redundant - but, that doesn't mean you can't deploy both guys or have it work.
Tate isn't Cole fucking Beasley.
Right. Pats were able to get Edelman and Amendola on the field together. This so called "problem" cab be solved.
What's next? You can't have two TEs on the field simultaneously?
They have a QB named Brady and an innovative offensive mind. We do not. I know you love Eli, but stop it.
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Watch Tate play. You just can't boil him down to a few numbers, and then make a conclusion.
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Fuck! Fuck! Fuck! I absolutely loathe agreeing with you..
Wait a minute... didn't you ridicule Tate as nothing special when the Eagles signed him?
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
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In comment 14337748 Jon in NYC said:
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and Shepard don't have nearly as much to do with each other as you're all making it seem. They will play at the same time.
Yeah, holy moly - some of these comments you'd think it's literally not possible to have both guys on the field together.
My first reaction was that the two are a bit redundant - but, that doesn't mean you can't deploy both guys or have it work.
Tate isn't Cole fucking Beasley.
Right. Pats were able to get Edelman and Amendola on the field together. This so called "problem" cab be solved.
What's next? You can't have two TEs on the field simultaneously?
exactly, I would rather have two talented guys that do the same thing than two not talented guys that do different things. Last season, the Eagles had three slot receivers when they went on their run (Tate, Matthews, and Agholor). If you think we can't work with Golden Tate then I don't know what to say. Maybe watch more NFL games?
DG will continue to blow this thing up!
Haha Wasnt Shep also the holder of the leash?
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
baldwin
edelman
Tate is a little long in the tooth, but he is a tough SOB who will fit in well here.
that's fine if he is, but I don't think he has to be.
Because you are an Eli apologist
I think you're either thinking of another poster, or thinking of another Eli, or not thinking at all.
I don't get people. Y'all are dumb.
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He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
Crabtree?
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He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
Hello, Plaxico?
Noted Aim
yeah because thats just how the pats retool every year...but yeah who cares about those and that bad organization right?
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In comment 14337789 stretch234 said:
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He can still play and how ever you divide it up they will have a good 2 and 3. I don't know where people think players are going to sign these low end deals just because Fans want. How much should he have gotten
Now need someone who can run deep on the outside consistently.
Coleman can run flys and keep the top of the defense loose.
But we definitely still need some physicality out there. I want a guy who can bully some smaller DB's on the outside and be a RZ target.
Crabtree?
Prefer to go the draft route or maybe explore someone like Geronimo Allison since there's no pick attached to his tender level (UDFA)
makes sense but we are replacing all our players with older players...seems like an odd rebuilding plan
They should be looking to deal any guy at the end of his contract. Not in DGs nature to sign them to a second contract.
That would be something... DG is like Michael Corleone on the day of the baptism pitting hits on the Five Family Heads...
I don't, I think we go for a big WR in the draft with the 2nd rd pick
(1) They are in denial.
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
There's no plan here, spin it however you want there's no plan. Odell was a locker room cancer, but Tate got exiled from Seattle because of the possibility he slept with the QB's ex wife.
If you were going to sign Tate, why not keep Odell and use Tate's money on a corner back?
A 2nd, old, fairly expensive slot receiver? I like Tate but this makes little sense to me and reeks of desperation following the OBJ deal.
Mike Francesa.
Mike Francesa.
He loves him, thought the Jets should have grabbed him
Prefer to go the draft route or maybe explore someone like Geronimo Allison since there's no pick attached to his tender level (UDFA)
Maybe Kelvin Harmon with the 37th pick?
Mike Francesa.
Well, that's not something that increases my confidence on this signing.
(1) They are in denial.
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
all fair points and im not opposed to moving Shep either. But you could have pieced together a WR corps for a team that wont win anymore that 6 games and not effect Collins compensatory pick as well. Since we don't have any FA worth signing Tate most likely will cancel out Collins. So its almost like we are trading a 3rd round pick for the right to sign tate.
Just go with you guys because I think they are in denial and want to give this another shot with Eli...which is pure lunacy at this point.
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You can look at this two different ways.
(1) They are in denial.
(2) They realize a guy like Shepard won't be around here when they do turn this around. Better to accumulate picks now and draft guys who will be entering their prime in 3-4 years.
I'm not predicting he will be traded...I just wouldn't be shocked. How close was Sterling to Beckham? What's his mindset right now?
all fair points and im not opposed to moving Shep either. But you could have pieced together a WR corps for a team that wont win anymore that 6 games and not effect Collins compensatory pick as well. Since we don't have any FA worth signing Tate most likely will cancel out Collins. So its almost like we are trading a 3rd round pick for the right to sign tate.
Just go with you guys because I think they are in denial and want to give this another shot with Eli...which is pure lunacy at this point.
Tates signing cancelled out the 5th we had for Brown getting signed
Tate is physical for sure but there are some more physical #1 CBS out there that Id rather have a receiver outmuscle say cutting it outside in the red zone.
Two things I dont like about this move #1 having either him or SS as our #1 and trying to field a competitive team with a nothing talent defense and a 38 year old QB.
Regardless of who plays QB it helps to have weapons. Tate for 2 years around 11.5m/per by guaranteed money seems like a fine move unless he literally goes over the hill quickly.
It's a deep WR draft, grab a deep threat with speed to compete with Coleman (and maybe Latimer) in camp. Let Engram, Shepard, Tate, Barkley work the middle of the field and keep the chains moving.
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Prefer to go the draft route or maybe explore someone like Geronimo Allison since there's no pick attached to his tender level (UDFA)
Maybe Kelvin Harmon with the 37th pick?
Harmon has some things about him I don't love - but his physicality is evident. He will bully smaller corners and I like how he plays.
He's a little slow which is my worry. But he has a good shot to produce in the RZ. He was fantastic against Clemson.. so he didn't just eat up crappy opponents.
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and I speculated earlier today, we wouldn't be surprised if Shepard is on the market.
I don't, I think we go for a big WR in the draft with the 2nd rd pick
I would love Riley Ridley... 2nd may be too high, but maybe we can move up in the 3rd...
People like to bitch and moan and complain
Some of you guys need sedatives.
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
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is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
Where is an evidence of that?
or they did the right homework especially for a bottom of the league team?
Our talent level is at the bottom of the league with massive holes at critical spots. The move would have been to do the homework on younger NFL players and not overpay for this type of player/age/position.
$23 million guaranteed for a limited slot WR? I can't buy into that.
Regardless of who plays QB it helps to have weapons. Tate for 2 years around 11.5m/per by guaranteed money seems like a fine move unless he literally goes over the hill quickly.
It's a deep WR draft, grab a deep threat with speed to compete with Coleman (and maybe Latimer) in camp. Let Engram, Shepard, Tate, Barkley work the middle of the field and keep the chains moving.
Good post. I was just asking above if Diggs & Thielen were considered 2 slots for the same reason. That aside from the Amendola / Edelman comp if not Gronk / AH at TE (tho agreed, it's tough to 'do what NE does' tho I always think it's best to use the ideal as reference if not strive for it anyway)
And as you said if it's a deep WR draft, I heard we have picks...
A guy who catches the ball 90 times a year can lose plenty of defenders
I expect they will target an outside threat in rounds two or three in the draft.
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In comment 14337856 Amtoft said:
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is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
There's a middle ground between a blind following and not being an idiot.
No one was going to be a "Beckham replacement" in this FA group. It doesn't exist.
Dude.. an OBJ talent is generational... No replacements suggested.. We do need good football players & leaders. I think Tate is that.
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Tate is serviceable, but he's not a Beckham replacement.
Dude.. an OBJ talent is generational... No replacements suggested.. We do need good football players & leaders. I think Tate is that.
He allegedly fucked his QB's ex wife.
"a" receiver (or Hockenson)
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In comment 14337856 Amtoft said:
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is a good WR. He was the best WR on the market and didn't go for crazy money. 4 years 37.5 is very good for a WR like him. You see Terrell Williams go for more, Humphries go for more, Crowder go for more, etc and he is better than them all. Why would anyone be upset with this?
People like to bitch and moan and complain
What's having Golden Tate get you to 7 wins if you're lucky?
Blindly be in line with every move this team makes, let us know when you want to say we w're right.
you're an idiot. Who knows how many games we win. We still have more Free Agents, the Draft, possible trades, etc. Who knows about injuries, lucky or unlucky games, etc. How could any predict our record when we don't even have our full roster yet?
Tate
Shepherd
EE
Coleman
Fowler
Im down with these guys.
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is Golden Tate?
Mike Francesa.
Well, that's not something that increases my confidence on this signing.
Mara forced this to appease Fracesca
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Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
We really need his 100+ ranked 6 yards per target average. Thats what a rebuilding team need because damn it "dude is a player"
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
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The Giants look to have done their homework on this.
Where is an evidence of that?
or they did the right homework especially for a bottom of the league team?
Our talent level is at the bottom of the league with massive holes at critical spots. The move would have been to do the homework on younger NFL players and not overpay for this type of player/age/position.
$23 million guaranteed for a limited slot WR? I can't buy into that.
People are obsessed with "guaranteed" money... but the only thing that matters is the signing bonus. If most of the money is guaranteeing his first two years he wasn't going to be cut during his first two years anyways.
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Watch Tate play. You just can't boil him down to a few numbers, and then make a conclusion.
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Because you are an Eli apologist that doesnt want a rebuild either. This is just another terrible move in a sea of them.
Please, please, no more fun. This front offices idea of fun is not good.
I'm called and accused of a lot of things around here. And some might be true.
But calling me an Eli apologist may be one of the all-time classics.
We really need his 100+ ranked 6 yards per target average. Thats what a rebuilding team need because damn it "dude is a player"
Ha yes
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Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
I'm pretty sure that's not what they're trying to do... nor do I think this is the final group of WR's we're going into the season with.
But, keep the hot takes comin!
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In comment 14337761 bw in dc said:
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Watch Tate play. You just can't boil him down to a few numbers, and then make a conclusion.
Guy takes hits in the middle and delivers blows back. This is a real football player.
But, again, that requires actually watching him play. And that doesn't appear to be a strength of BBI...
Because you are an Eli apologist that doesnt want a rebuild either. This is just another terrible move in a sea of them.
Please, please, no more fun. This front offices idea of fun is not good.
I'm called and accused of a lot of things around here. And some might be true.
But calling me an Eli apologist may be one of the all-time classics.
I had to re-read that post 10 times over before I responded to it!
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In comment 14337897 arcarsenal said:
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Really like Hockenson - I've seen a few people mention him. I want to build a tough football team from the inside out. More physicality, more willing blockers. Smash the shit out of lighter front 7's and let Barkley fly.
Giant's are trying to revolutionize offense by keeping everything shorter than 15 yards and in between the hash marks.
I'm pretty sure that's not what they're trying to do... nor do I think this is the final group of WR's we're going into the season with.
But, keep the hot takes comin!
Maybe they'll give Hogan 4 years too!
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We are creating a smart, run heavy team. I like players like this. This will be a mentally tough team.
Dont think Shawn lee wants to see him again.
is this really true if it is it makes me a little happier. Berklry is a big play waiting to happen at running back and what you need big plays at running Packers receivers that enthusiastically block
Link - ( New Window )
I'm called and accused of a lot of things around here. And some might be true.
But calling me an Eli apologist may be one of the all-time classics.
Even I laughed. But believe it or not - someone called me an Eli hater earlier in the year.
Tate
Shepherd
EE
Coleman
Fowler
Im down with these guys.
He fucked his QBs wife and broke Percy Harvins face before the super bowl. But yeah, definitely much better character guy than odell
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Shep had 1 or 2 balls go off his finger tips last year.
What about really good blocking WRs? Especially with a RB that busts open where one block can spring him. OBJ was not a blocker.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Excited to see what else we do.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Excited to see what else we do.
Real workmanlike professional football players? Do you guys hear yourself talk sometimes?
These past 2 offseasons will go down in infamy.
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Its 3/14/19. Give it some time before you go full meltdown. We have 12 picks (4 premium) and over 4 months until training camp.
Happy we are bringing in real workmanlike professional football players. Shep, SB, EE and now Golden Tate with a real offensive line will be very serviceable.
Excited to see what else we do.
Real workmanlike professional football players? Do you guys hear yourself talk sometimes?
How'd they get a hold of Gettleman's notes?
Actually this is a very deep draft of quality receivers.
Bingo
These past 2 offseasons will go down in infamy.
These hysterical reactions sure will!
A lot of these threads will be fun to look back at a few years from now.
These past 2 offseasons will go down in infamy.
If you are going by age 30 year Tate is young that 31 one year Antonio Brown who just got like guaranteed forever for like 20 mil a year. I mean if you are just going by age.
Yes, thats exactly why we traded Beckham - so that we could pay Golden Tate. That was the plan all along.
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was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
Bingo
Bingo? That post was all kinds of wrong. Unless you think he was making 15 mil last year? Or that you think a 90+ catch 1000+ yard is shit? The only bingo that is, is when an old man yells bingo and then he realizes he didn't actually have it and every old people growns at him
Lol, funny if it wasn't true.
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was paid 200k per reception last year, he has been shit the last two seasons.
Bingo
Dont get this at all. If you're of the opinion he's about to completely decline due to age fine. But how is a WR who had 74+ reception (1 yr removed from 4 straight 90s) and 795+ yds (w/ 3 seasons 1000+) in the last 5 years had "2 shit seasons?" And been as durable as you can be. How is that shit?
Nah, but see, Tate is a real player. A hard-nosed no nonsense bring your lunch pail to work professional and team mate.
Never mind he got thrown out of Seattle for fucking his QB's wife and breaking his teammates face.
This place is a shitshow.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
This place is a shitshow.
It is like idiot double down on more idiocy. Just throwing things out there. Golden Tate is 87 years old and didn't even play the last 100 years yet we are paying him 1 billion dollars. Next person... so right he was 90 years old and 2 billion is to much!
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we traded away a HOF caliber player for 50 cents on the dollar to overpay an aging slot receiver?
Nah, but see, Tate is a real player. A hard-nosed no nonsense bring your lunch pail to work professional and team mate.
Never mind he got thrown out of Seattle for fucking his QB's wife and breaking his teammates face.
I thought Harvin punched out Tate?
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In comment 14337999 adambear said:
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we traded away a HOF caliber player for 50 cents on the dollar to overpay an aging slot receiver?
Nah, but see, Tate is a real player. A hard-nosed no nonsense bring your lunch pail to work professional and team mate.
Never mind he got thrown out of Seattle for fucking his QB's wife and breaking his teammates face.
I thought Harvin punched out Tate?
Facts don't matter anymore here.
Would you think a 31 year old wr is the replacement for a guy heading for his second contract.
Really like this signing. Very productive and mentally tough.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
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In comment 14338008 madeinstars said:
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In comment 14337999 adambear said:
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we traded away a HOF caliber player for 50 cents on the dollar to overpay an aging slot receiver?
Nah, but see, Tate is a real player. A hard-nosed no nonsense bring your lunch pail to work professional and team mate.
Never mind he got thrown out of Seattle for fucking his QB's wife and breaking his teammates face.
I thought Harvin punched out Tate?
Facts don't matter anymore here.
I actually laughed at this post... because it's sadly true. It's like people just make shit up and run with it until someone lets them know it's completely wrong.
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depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
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In comment 14338010 Eric on Li said:
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depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
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In comment 14338064 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14338010 Eric on Li said:
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depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
He will be productive too for at least a couple seasons.
Spot on.
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In comment 14338103 Eric on Li said:
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In comment 14338064 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14338010 Eric on Li said:
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depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
Well they aren't trading Golden Tate next year, so what does a 32 or 33 year old get you - since you want to be snide.
For some reason I thought they had tendered him. I guess not. I'd like to see him back.
I was a little down on Shurmer early in the season. He kept them together, they got better and he is growing and understands NFC East football and the what made the Giants the Giants when they were good. Let's hope for the best and nice to see the GM and HC with a shared vision. Be patient, we are making progress.
This signing continues to show they want tough football players.
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In comment 14338111 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14338103 Eric on Li said:
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In comment 14338064 ajr2456 said:
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In comment 14338010 Eric on Li said:
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depending on how the contract is structured if we own all the guarantees he could be a very tradeable player over the next couple years. Or if he plays well, we could, you know, try to win football games while rebuilding the real way, through the draft.
or we can just not spend the money available under the cap and resign Bennie Fowler.
The Steelers got a 3 and a 5 for a much better player in Antonio Brown. Whats a 33 year old Golden Tate going to fetch?
He's aged quicker than I expected.
Hes 31 when the season starts, you said traceable over the next couple of years. Whats your point?
I suppose it's that 31 and 32 come before 33.
Either way I doubt Gettleman signed him just to trade him.
Well they aren't trading Golden Tate next year, so what does a 32 or 33 year old get you - since you want to be snide.
Who says they won't trade him this year? If they're willing to trade Beckham 6 months after signing him I'd imagine anyone is on the table if circumstances make sense.
If the team is as bad as everyone thinks I'd imagine all veterans will be available at the deadline just like this year. Both Goldens included. That's why I think there's value in spending money on veterans even if the team isn't going anywhere this year. You may be able to turn them into BJ Hill. Or Kevin Zeitler. Or a 3rd/4th/5th rd pick. Which was the point of the first post you snidely responded too.
what does it matter... you aren't invited.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
he won't be getting traded for two years so stop it.
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to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
he won't be getting traded for two years so stop it.
I wasn't the one who said that so...
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
They have (correctly) chosen to rebuild since the deadline last year. Unless they surprisingly compete this season I don't expect them to turn down draft picks for veterans if the opportunity arrises. If there were younger guys available who actually had more upside than golden tate, you can bet they wouldn't be cheaper.
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
Okay, Ill play. Who?
The best thing it does for Coleman (and Latimer if he comes back) is allows them to focus on downfield routes. Tate and Shepard can work the middle, Barkley too out of the backfield, Engram and Ellison down the seams.
Then let Coleman use his speed to take the top off the D. hopefully find an explosive rookie in the mid rounds too.
wait you can do that?
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Kool Aide drinking in East Rutherford
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
This is all he does. He did the same thing last offseason when the Giants hurt his feelings and didnt draft a QB. He must have been emotionslly scarred because he bitched about it endlessly. Apparently those wounds run deep.
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and wanting to start over after a few rounds...
wait you can do that?
Well, you just join the next league 5 minutes later and ignore that first team.
So in connection with the Giants, just start watching again in Sept 2020...
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Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Shep had 1 or 2 balls go off his finger tips last year.
The hardly makes him unreliable
He caught 66 balls, had 800+ yards and 4 TDs last year.
So, again, it was an asinine, dumbass fucking statement.
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to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
Okay, Ill play. Who?
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
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In comment 14338200 ajr2456 said:
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Kool Aide drinking in East Rutherford
Do posts like this make you feel like you're blowing off steam or something? I don't really get it. It's the same sarcastic, everything sucks post in 500 different ways.
We get it - you don't like what they're doing.
If you have nothing else to add, maybe go pollute other threads instead.
This is all he does. He did the same thing last offseason when the Giants hurt his feelings and didnt draft a QB. He must have been emotionslly scarred because he bitched about it endlessly. Apparently those wounds run deep.
Oh please. I complimented most of last years draft picks and their performance last year. I complimented the Zeitler portion of the trade. Sorry this team is floating around with no discernible plan.
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In comment 14338219 ajr2456 said:
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to $23 million guaranteed makes absolute zero sense if you would trade him mid way through the year.
So you're going to choose to further rebuild during the year? Why not just sign a young cheaper guy who at least as upside?
Okay, Ill play. Who?
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
Neither are as good as Golden Tate and they both got about the same amount of money. As for the guarantee again that doesn't matter at all. The only thing that matters is the signing bonus which was 10 million for Humphries... meaning after two years it is a 5 million dollar cap hit to cut. So again until you know signing bonus guarantee means nothing. Crowder same thing who is getting 9.5 million a year!
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
I'd have been happy with either player, not sure which I'd prefer. I like Tate's leadership and I think he's been a more productive player. I like Crowder's special teams ability and that he's got a little more explosiveness.
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
Well A) You don't think being better is important good to know. I mean if you think Golden Tate is over paid and they aren't as good they wouldn't that make them extremely over paid? B) They signed before we actually were able to trade OBJ soooo were they options?
There is no such thing as long term in the NFL now. Wake up.
1. Because a player you like is available to be signed, they will choose your team
2. Because a player you like chose to sign with another team, doesnt mean your team didnt inquire about them as well
Golden Tate is a very good player. Golden Tate also probably should have taken the Patriots offer if the rumors of them wanting him was true. Golden Tate on the Giants is a short term move to try to be a competitive team next year. If Graziano's reports are true they're essentially running it back with the same plan as last year, just without Odell - and that's troubling.
I pay for season tickets, I don't want the Giants to suck. I don't want to watch the Cowboys and Eagles battle for the division while we struggle. Despite what it may seem like I'm not rooting against the Giants. I'm over taking the wait and see approach for a front office who hasn't given any reason to trust them the last two years or an ownership group who hasn't given a reason the last seven years to trust them.
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"great veteran leadership for the position group" is one of the most cliche and overblown things football fans and front offices say. That's the same reason we wasted money on Stewart.
Second,
Humpries and Crowder being better than Tate now is irrelevant because the Giants aren't going to be good this year. All three players will likely be cuttable after 2 years, but there's a chance Humphries and Crowder are still good in 2 years and can be a bargain WR option when they are ready to compete.
Signing Golden Tate was a short term move, this team should be making long term moves.
Well A) You don't think being better is important good to know. I mean if you think Golden Tate is over paid and they aren't as good they wouldn't that make them extremely over paid? B) They signed before we actually were able to trade OBJ soooo were they options?
There is no such thing as long term in the NFL now. Wake up.
If you wake up and connect the dots that Odell trade didn't just come out of nowhere. They probably had discussed it for a while and it likely led to them being ok with letting Collins walk with no tag.
Golden Tate isn't over paid for Golden Tate, he's just not a right fit for a rebuilding team - if we even are one.
I understand this is the kind of guy they want on the team, but he is way on the downside of his career.
We need a RT and C, and soon.
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In comment 14337814 Four Aces said:
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Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
I did. You obviously didnt.
Your argument remains dogshit.
Barnwell is correct analyzing this signing:
"Do you remember "Memento," the movie in which Guy Pearce's short-term memory was destroyed and he lost the ability to remember anything in the recent past? Is it possible the Giants are struggling with the same condition? Days after trading Odell Beckham Jr. to signal that they were going to build around Saquon Barkley and the running game, the Giants reversed course and gave Tate a four-year deal with $23.5 million fully guaranteed at signing.
It's bizarre for many reasons. To start, while the franchise buried Beckham on his way out of town and called him a distraction, the Giants responded by signing a wideout who was cited while with the Seahawks for breaking into a doughnut store and who reportedly got into a fistfight with Percy Harvin the week before the Super Bowl. (To be clear, I don't think those are actual character concerns, but they're more meaningful than, say, getting into a fight with a kicking net or simulating urination during a touchdown celebration.)"
Sterling had 5 drops on 107 targets for a drop % of 4.67%.
It's what I'm seeing here. Like an episode of Bigbluekickoff. Woner if Giants brass hire people to post here. Not sure, ut just a thought.
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In comment 14337866 Hsilwek92 said:
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In comment 14337814 Four Aces said:
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Antonio Brown is 30, Julio Jones is 30, AJ Green is 30... etc. Who fucking cares.... And Tate is a better WR and FOOTBALL player than Shepard. Shepard isnt reliable. Tate is!!! This dude makes plays!
Shepard isnt reliable? JFC.
Guess we are at the point now where people will just post absolute bullshit nonsense to prove their dumbass fucking take.
Did you watch Shepard last year or did you check out on the season early? Dude dropped a number of balls on key downs and the end zone!
I did. You obviously didnt.
Your argument remains dogshit.
You clearly didnt watch shit. And it isnt just last yr. Shepard is not the player you think he is. Are you friends with Jerry Reese or Marc Ross?!
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
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drops than Tate on basically the same number of targets.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
Did you watch every Golden Tate target this year to give yourself a fair comparison.
Regarding your post after this, sure Tate is better now and it's Shep's last year but the likely hood is that Shepard ascends while Tate descends. Moving on from Shepard because of Tate is backwards
Okay, Ill play. Who?
This was in response to Eric saying if they suck they can trade Tate, but I'll play.
Jamison Crowder, 25 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Adam Humpries, 26 more upside long term than Golden Tate
Both got less money and less guarantees and there is at least a chance one of those players could contribute at what will be considered a bargain when the Giants are ready to compete. Golden Tate won't be here when they are ready to compete.
Crowder signed before the OBJ trade. So you would have been okay with his contract if we signed him not knowing the trade?
Adam Humphries. Well, he stated to play fairly well but he had the benefit of Evans drawing the bulk of the coverage. Plus, there was Jackson, Howard, and Goodwin. So he caught a ton of underneath stuff...he barely averaged 10 per reception.
So Im not sure those are the best answers.
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In comment 14338434 ajr2456 said:
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drops than Tate on basically the same number of targets.
Tate is the better player right now, but Shepard is a better piece for the Giants moving forward.
Obviously what those numbers dont tell you is the situations those drops occurred... 3rd down, endzone etc. In other words, all drops arent created equal. And secondly and perhaps more importantly, there were many 50/50 balls that are NOT considered drops but Shep did NOT come up with. So i respect the stats but we know stats dont tell the whole story. Shep is not who ppl think he is.... weve had 3 seasons to see that.
Did you watch every Golden Tate target this year to give yourself a fair comparison.
Regarding your post after this, sure Tate is better now and it's Shep's last year but the likely hood is that Shepard ascends while Tate descends. Moving on from Shepard because of Tate is backwards
Sure I can't discount the small probability that Shep will ascend this year. However, he's had 3 years to show us something including games with no OBJ last year and a subpar receiving corp., and I was rather unimpressed. Don't think he'll be resigned.
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Kool Aide drinking in East Rutherford
It's what I'm seeing here. Like an episode of Bigbluekickoff. Woner if Giants brass hire people to post here. Not sure, ut just a thought.
What was your last handle, dupe?
Can't believe we want to give up on another young, talented player.
Can't believe we want to give up on another young, talented player.
Listen, I'm a Giants fans I hope I'm wrong but last year I didn't see it. He didn't step up. We'll see.
1. Tate is not a replacement for OBJ
2. Tate should not be compared to Shep. This is not an either/or thing between the two of them. They are independent of each other. Comparing drop rates, age and money just shows how much some of you have no idea WTF you are talking about.
Adding Tate right now does a few things..
He is a veteran WR who is tough, a hard worker, a professional and is a solid team mate. He is also depth and a starter at the same time. Depth has been a problem with this team for a while.
Stop worrying about the money. Some people here cannot even balance their own checkbooks and are screaming about the Giants cap.
You can expect this team to still add a guy who can stretch the field. The over reaction and knee jerk comments are just out of control now.
I was a little down on Shurmer early in the season. He kept them together, they got better and he is growing and understands NFC East football and the what made the Giants the Giants when they were good. Let's hope for the best and nice to see the GM and HC with a shared vision. Be patient, we are making progress.
This signing continues to show they want tough football players.
Like your optimism LOS . Hope you are right. Waiting to see the final moves to shore up the remaining weak spots.
Our receiving core is NOT weak now. People forget we have an RB that catches 70+ balls and has downfield capability. We have one of the better receiving TEs who is a 4.4 guy , and Shep who is a very good slot guy. And now Tate who has been a mutliple 1000+ yard reciever and is not that old.
Losing Beckham took us from possibly the best all around receivers in the entire NFL (or top 3 at worst) when you factor RB and TE to now a good to very good group depending on if Tate shows the same burst he had in previous stops.
1. Tate is not a replacement for OBJ
2. Tate should not be compared to Shep. This is not an either/or thing between the two of them. They are independent of each other. Comparing drop rates, age and money just shows how much some of you have no idea WTF you are talking about.
Adding Tate right now does a few things..
He is a veteran WR who is tough, a hard worker, a professional and is a solid team mate. He is also depth and a starter at the same time. Depth has been a problem with this team for a while.
Stop worrying about the money. Some people here cannot even balance their own checkbooks and are screaming about the Giants cap.
You can expect this team to still add a guy who can stretch the field. The over reaction and knee jerk comments are just out of control now.
Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
he was with the seahawks 6 years ago. Tate is a solid player to have on the team for the reasons I mentioned.
There are other forums and hobbies that I recommend you look into. This is not going to be fun for you over the next couple of years. BBI and the Giants are likely to trigger you daily.
If this was still Reese, there would be a neck tie party at the stadium....
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Professional is interesting given people's takes on Odell.
- allegedly slept with his QB's wife
- locker room fights
- broke into a donut shop at 3 am
he was with the seahawks 6 years ago. Tate is a solid player to have on the team for the reasons I mentioned.
There are other forums and hobbies that I recommend you look into. This is not going to be fun for you over the next couple of years. BBI and the Giants are likely to trigger you daily.
I'm just asking for some consistency. The Norman incident was 3 years ago and still gets brought up here like it happened yesterday.
I'm just asking for some consistency. The Norman incident was 3 years ago and still gets brought up here like it happened yesterday.
I have not mentioned it since the week after that incident happened. So.. you have consistency from me.
In fact, when I think about all of the things that were considered to be a negative about OBJ... I never think about the Josh Norman thing.
yeah I am not happy the team sucks either. I am paying a lot of money for tickets too so it really bothers me too.
Still.. we cannot look at these moves independently or in a vacuum. This is just the beginning of the off season. We need to see what team we are taking into training camp.
You cannot win a game of chess in one move. This week, we sacrificed the Queen to preserve the King.
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Let me get this right This signing sucks because this team isnt good enough to appreciate his talents? Think about how laughably stupid that is. Sorry, it just is.
Maybe the O plays well in 2019. Why not? Theres talent here.
The money isnt a problem at all. The giants are plugging holes with fa and building through the draft. DG had a good draft last year. Hopefully he has another good one this year, hes got a ton of picks. This is good right? Cheer up.
The age argument is absurd. This isnt a running back we are discussing, receivers often play into their mid 30s at a high level. Desean Jackson is a year older and just got a deal in the same ballpark as Tate. Antonio Brown is the same age as Tate, and nobody mentions his age as a reason Oakland shouldnt have made the move for him. Taken into the context of where his contract is and comparing it to other players around the league, we got ourselves a guy that consistently puts up 90 receptions, 1000 yards, and 5 TDs at about half the cost of what top receivers get paid.
Let me get this right This signing sucks because this team isnt good enough to appreciate his talents? Think about how laughably stupid that is. Sorry, it just is.
I dont know how anybody can watch Tate play and not be impressed by him as a football player. He has the type of body, too, that I think will hold up well into his mid-30s. Ive always seen a lot of Hines Ward in him...
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yeah I am not happy the team sucks either. I am paying a lot of money for tickets too so it really bothers me too.
Still.. we cannot look at these moves independently or in a vacuum. This is just the beginning of the off season. We need to see what team we are taking into training camp.
You cannot win a game of chess in one move. This week, we sacrificed the Queen to preserve the King.
Funny that you bring up chess and wanting us fans to look at the team like we are playing chess. Alpha Zero learned how to beat the best chess computer in the world before it in 3 hours.
There are people that can program these types of systems out there for us to hire, other teams have people of this ilk, no evidence that we do. We have people advocating for viewing our moves like chess with a leader that doesn't seem to understand how to apply the best ways to win at chess today. These same people advocate patience while we have become the laughing stock of the league. Great, really great.
Definitely has opinions on Giants management that frankly more people should have even if he is strong with them but definitely a wild card.
A few weeks ago told me that he didn't necessarily believe in team building with WRs but now seems in support of this move. I think it is very easy to like Tate as a player but not having problems with this move while advocating a rebuild is definitely a hot take.
I'm down on this move because it again seems overall inconsistent with any kind of plan or format that has worked. The closest comp I can think to a team that won with a plan resembling anything like this is the Broncos with Peyton Manning, maybe all the way back to Dilfer or Brad Johnson but you know what all those teams had in common? Fantastic defenses.
Hard to defend this approach with our defense and again if you had any inclination that this was your plan, I just can't comprehend how you move Snacks for a 4th rounder.
...about Golden Tate! He is a very fine receiver with a knack of taking short to intermediate passes and turning them into big gains.
And don't be fooled by his supposed drop in productivity... he was traded in mid-season and it takes awhile to learn a new system and be properly / optimally integrated into that system.
And last but not least, it is totally unfair to compare this player with OBJ. Golden Tate has to be judged in his own right. He is a very solid football player and ranked, for example, as the 27th best free agent by NFL.com.
The rest hopefully depends on value.
For myself, being biased towards D and with this particular draft being very, apparently very, strong on D fronts, I'm hoping that sort of value discipline lasts the entire draft.
Folks biased towards O seem less aware of their bias and more likely to apply hope or projections to offense prospects, and therefore to loose discipline a bit.
The rest hopefully depends on value.
For myself, being biased towards D and with this particular draft being very, apparently very, strong on D fronts, I'm hoping that sort of value discipline lasts the entire draft.
Folks biased towards O seem less aware of their bias and more likely to apply hope or projections to offense prospects, and therefore to loose discipline a bit.
I was just thinking that, by signing Golden Tate, the Giants won't feel forced to go WR at #17. I'd love to snag, for example, Devin White at #6 and maybe someone like Devin Bush at #17, or a nice two-way TE such as TJ Hockenson.
The age argument is absurd. This isnt a running back we are discussing, receivers often play into their mid 30s at a high level. Desean Jackson is a year older and just got a deal in the same ballpark as Tate. Antonio Brown is the same age as Tate, and nobody mentions his age as a reason Oakland shouldnt have made the move for him. Taken into the context of where his contract is and comparing it to other players around the league, we got ourselves a guy that consistently puts up 90 receptions, 1000 yards, and 5 TDs at about half the cost of what top receivers get paid.
Excellent points, thanks. By the way, Julio Jones and AJ Green I believe are also both 30. Anyone want to diss these guys too. Tate has never missed any games and is in great shape. Playing till 34 is no big deal.
and he's not being paid like Julio Jones or AJ Green.
His AAV right now puts him as the 23rd highest paid WR in the NFL, 1 spot ahead of Desean Jackson and 1 spot behind Jamison Crowder.
I agree with you that he's a good player. He's at least on a FMV contract even if there are guys in that same range that would be preferable for whatever reason. His production consistency and durability stand out however IMO.
Missing the point again... of course.
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He's not Julio Jones or Aj Green
Missing the point again... of course.
5superbowls brought up Julio and Greens age and said nobody is dissing them.
So no I didnt miss the point.