After drinking on this, I've decided the media is full of crap. We will be much improved this year:
- Our OL will be much improved, giving Eli more time and Barkley more room to run
- Our defense will be much better. I really like Golden, Peppers, and Bethea. In addition our young players who looked good last season will be a year older, and we will add lots of good players vi the draft (and maybe another FA)
What needs to still be done:
- We need a #1 WR. We can't replace OBJ but we can get another good receiver via FA or draft. Tate, Shepard, EE, and a #1 is not a bad corp. I can make the case this will be better than we had most of the past two seasons during the 50% of the games OBJ missed. Plus as teams like the Pats show, have in superstar WR is not a mandatory part of winning. Getting capable guys, who run good routes and understand the game, are just as important.
- Our future QB. Either Rosen (my preference), or via draft. I've come to the conclusion that any of the top 4 or 5 in this draft have about the same opportunity for success (or bust). I can't really make a case that Haskins will turn out better than Lock or Jones (for example), or the midget can/can not be an NFL QB.
Fix these two easily fixable areas and we're much better. Sprinkle in our large amount of draft picks, stir in our improved cap space, and I'm a buyer.
What they don't know, or either refuse to accept or believe, is that that was the Giants plan all along. To stick with Eli until the contract runs out, improve the "team" in the meantime, rid the locker room of me first guys, rid the locker room of guys who don't want to commit to the Giant way, and then clear the cap for 2020 with hopefully a new QB on tap, with a shitload of money, and good picks in tow so that we won't have to completely tear the whole thing down and wait another 5 years to be good.
As long as they remain motivated to find a veteran RT they will find one. In addition to Remmers, Ryan Schraeder was cut after starting most of the last 4 years for Atlanta at RT. Jared Veldheer is out there too.
I would take the over on 7-9. I called Boomer and Gio on this yesterday morning. Gio admitted he could see this happening which would make the drafting of a QB more confusing in 2020 because of the draft position being lower. Boomer wasn't having anything of it. It's important for him for the Giants to do bad to fulfill his desire to be right at all costs.
The Giants know what they are doing, it just isn't going to be all rainbows and butterflies on our way to get there.
I would take the over on 7-9. I called Boomer and Gio on this yesterday morning. Gio admitted he could see this happening which would make the drafting of a QB more confusing in 2020 because of the draft position being lower. Boomer wasn't having anything of it. It's important for him for the Giants to do bad to fulfill his desire to be right at all costs.
If we dont draft a qb this year and go 7-9 or better, you are looking at resigning Eli and us being mediocre for 2 more years. I am a Giants fan, I want to win. I can never root for losses, ever. However, WE NEED A F*CKING FUTURE QB fans, period.
Giants can do the same in 2020.
If they draft Devin White and another game wrecking defensive guy with the #17 pick maybe 8-8
The Giants know what they are doing, it just isn't going to be all rainbows and butterflies on our way to get there.
What makes this hilarious, truly, is on the one hand, some here say it will be a few year(orlonger) rebuild and when DG takes steps to do just that(while still wanting to win obviously), we suddenly have zero direction. I know, I’m trying to figure out that line of (non) thinking as well
This was all sorely needed.
If they feel like they can bring some talent in to try and win also, I’m all for it. It’s obvious we need to find the QB replacement ASAP but we can still try to win in the meantime. It’s also obvious Eli is on his last legs but we all know if we can block in front of him, he’s at least serviceable, maybe more than that.
Hopefully we shore up RT. Use all those picks on continuing to rebuild the roster and maybe just maybe, find the QB of the future.
Move chains, control the clock, control field position, keep that defense rested.
Now we will have a great line, but will see loaded boxes to stop Saquon because we don't have an outside receiver at all.
Shep - Nice player nothing special slot guy
EE - Plays primarily in the slot
Tate - Another slot guy
We need an outside receiver and pretty badly because what we have now is just not going to cut it. I don't think we will be drafting a WR early either.
The defensive safeties are better. Markus Golden is a question mark and we need a proven CB and linebackers as well.
The defense is kind of a middle ground for me. Starting Safties have improved, pass rush is a giant question mark, and we have no depth at CB.
I just remember that NYG vs MINN game. The whole team had to concentrate on calming him down and the team could not focus on winning.
This team was missing leadership and I feel the Giants didn't need the drama. It was time to move on. Barkley lets his play on the field speak for itself. The team needed an overhaul. I like what they have done so far and hopefully it will get better.
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Gettleman's plan isn't really that hard to understand. But these folks in the media, twitter, all that shit, they just can't help themselves when a team "appears" to not know what they are doing.
The Giants know what they are doing, it just isn't going to be all rainbows and butterflies on our way to get there.
What makes this hilarious, truly, is on the one hand, some here say it will be a few year(orlonger) rebuild and when DG takes steps to do just that(while still wanting to win obviously), we suddenly have zero direction. I know, I’m trying to figure out that line of (non) thinking as well
There was not a single poster who was more wrong about the team last year than you were. You consistently told us that they were really a good team and were about to turn it around every single week, all evidence to the contrary.
So maybe don't criticize other posters as (non) thinkers for a bit until you get something right yourself.
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Are we happy with our linebackers? The good news is that Ogletree got a lot of practice reading the names on the backs of the jerseys on all the TEs in the league, so he should know who they all are now. We've got some promising second year guys. It's worth noting that the defense got worse after Snacks left. Who's his replacement?
Who's the FS, udfa Curtis Riley?
Golden may be an improvement from Vernon and Peppers is at least younger and cheaper than Collins, but the most likely result for both these moves is probably a wash.
Although the OL is improved, we are worse at the skill
positions.
We were a terrible team last year. Five wins, two of which came against teams with winning records. I don't see enough improvement to be optimistic.
Giants can do the same in 2020.
Agreed 100%
He is only 24 - ( New Window )
Now we will have a great line, but will see loaded boxes to stop Saquon because we don't have an outside receiver at all.
Shep - Nice player nothing special slot guy
EE - Plays primarily in the slot
Tate - Another slot guy
We need an outside receiver and pretty badly because what we have now is just not going to cut it. I don't think we will be drafting a WR early either.
The defensive safeties are better. Markus Golden is a question mark and we need a proven CB and linebackers as well.
The defense is kind of a middle ground for me. Starting Safties have improved, pass rush is a giant question mark, and we have no depth at CB.
Well according to some recent 'Hints' I wouldn't get to attached to Shep.
Coleman is only 24 and is on his fourth team. Why? Because he's a head case. Excuse me if I forget a guy who played in 8 games and caught 5 passes.
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In comment 14339375 ryanmkeane said:
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Gettleman's plan isn't really that hard to understand. But these folks in the media, twitter, all that shit, they just can't help themselves when a team "appears" to not know what they are doing.
The Giants know what they are doing, it just isn't going to be all rainbows and butterflies on our way to get there.
What makes this hilarious, truly, is on the one hand, some here say it will be a few year(orlonger) rebuild and when DG takes steps to do just that(while still wanting to win obviously), we suddenly have zero direction. I know, I’m trying to figure out that line of (non) thinking as well
There was not a single poster who was more wrong about the team last year than you were. You consistently told us that they were really a good team and were about to turn it around every single week, all evidence to the contrary.
So maybe don't criticize other posters as (non) thinkers for a bit until you get something right yourself.
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Oh bullshit. Go back to the posts from last year. Don’t misrepresent what my feelings were. I ALWAYS made it a point to say, that “if we get even average to good OL play and give Eli the requisite time AND SB is all that they say he is, the O would be lethal and we would strongly contend in tge NFC, even with an average D.” Obviously it didn’t happen as I had expected. Each week I expected the newbies on the OL to find that continuity and gel. They never did, at least not when it mattered. So do not mischaracterize what I said. I was very consistent with my OL DISCLAIMER.
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In comment 14339406 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 14339375 ryanmkeane said:
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Oh bullshit. Go back to the posts from last year. Don’t misrepresent what my feelings were. I ALWAYS made it a point to say, that “if we get even average to good OL play and give Eli the requisite time AND SB is all that they say he is, the O would be lethal and we would strongly contend in tge NFC, even with an average D.” Obviously it didn’t happen as I had expected. Each week I expected the newbies on the OL to find that continuity and gel. They never did, at least not when it mattered. So do not mischaracterize what I said. I was very consistent with my OL DISCLAIMER.
LOL, believe what you want, but you're kidding yourself about how wrong you were about the team last year. Every single week you told us how you still believed in this team.
If they draft Devin White and another game wrecking defensive guy with the #17 pick maybe 8-8
OH yeah,give me Devin White and Dexter Lawrence
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In comment 14339459 Tesla said:
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In comment 14339406 Big Blue '56 said:
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In comment 14339375 ryanmkeane said:
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Oh bullshit. Go back to the posts from last year. Don’t misrepresent what my feelings were. I ALWAYS made it a point to say, that “if we get even average to good OL play and give Eli the requisite time AND SB is all that they say he is, the O would be lethal and we would strongly contend in tge NFC, even with an average D.” Obviously it didn’t happen as I had expected. Each week I expected the newbies on the OL to find that continuity and gel. They never did, at least not when it mattered. So do not mischaracterize what I said. I was very consistent with my OL DISCLAIMER.
LOL, believe what you want, but you're kidding yourself about how wrong you were about the team last year. Every single week you told us how you still believed in this team.
Believe what I want? Go back and re-read what I wrote most of that year. Relying on your faulty memory and presenting it as an “LOL” fact, is plain lazy and disingenous. AGAIN, take note of my consistent OL disclaimers which comprised most of my optimistic posts. “Believe what you want” without any basis in fact is an easy way out. How hard would it be for you to man up and check up on what I said week in and week out? Oh wait, now you’ll say, “I don’t have to go back, I recall exactly what you said. It’s hard to forget.” Please don’t respond back until and when you do the classy thing and either refute or confirm my claims IN WRITING. If you don’t, then I will not respond to you on this topic again, regardless of what your reply is
If we get a truly disruptive pass rusher, like Vernon was in his walk year at Miami, this defense becomes palatable. Rookies, if physically gifted, can do this.
Also have high hopes for the development of Lorenzo Carter.
Finally, (adequate FS should be available) with some of our later picks.
Also assuming that we lock down RT at #17.
The offense was able to put up points towards the end of last season even without Beckham, and I think we will be pleasantly surprised at the production we get from the receiving corps. Is Tate a Beckham replacement? Of course not, but he can probably give us 70-80% of the production which should be good enough.
I think from a talent standpoint we are pretty neutral compared to last year on defense, but wouldn't be surprised to see an improved unit due to guys being more comfortable with the scheme. I honestly think Peppers is an upgrade over Collins, but Vernon to Golden is a small downgrade. It will be interesting to see what direction we go in the draft. Adding a pass rusher and an inside linebacker to take Goodson's spot could really elevate the unit. Some of the young guys like Hill and Carter should be better, and hopefully Beal will be an improvement over Apple/Webb.
In all seriousness, I agree. I think it's probably a 6-7 win team but actually starting to build something with young players. What a lot of the posters in the "sky is falling" threads don't realize is that signing a few older vets (Tate, Bethea, Remmers etc.) is fine since we are going to have something like 15 rookies on this team depending on how many picks they keep + UDFA. That veteran leadership will be crucial to their growth.
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Gettleman's plan isn't really that hard to understand. But these folks in the media, twitter, all that shit, they just can't help themselves when a team "appears" to not know what they are doing.
The Giants know what they are doing, it just isn't going to be all rainbows and butterflies on our way to get there.
What makes this hilarious, truly, is on the one hand, some here say it will be a few year(orlonger) rebuild and when DG takes steps to do just that(while still wanting to win obviously), we suddenly have zero direction. I know, I’m trying to figure out that line of (non) thinking as well
It’s the instant gratification society we live in now that has transcended into sports. It’s not exciting for the media to report on a three year rebuild so they unleash the stream of negativity while it is taking place which most true fans can see through. Giants will be fine, we had a poor GM who put us in a bad spot with years of poor drafting and tried to band aid it with splash free agents to save his job. Now Gettleman has the difficult task of burning the whole thing down and starting over, which is probably the only way to build a contender again.
To the OP: I think you’re crazy. To the rest of you: I look forward to this same stupid conversation next year when we find another excuse to run it back.
To the OP: I think you’re crazy. To the rest of you: I look forward to this same stupid conversation next year when we find another excuse to run it back.
My guess is you are a glass half empty person?
Still, I think the offense is going to fine. Better than fine, actually. Especially if they sign a halfway decent FA RT.
If it were me, I would go for two of the best available DL guys with #6 and #17, even if they were both ER. I would hope for constant pressure because both players were of quality. My first OL guy would be with the 2nd or possibly third round pick, depending on availability. If a top corner unexpectedly fell into the second round I would go with him. Otherwise, I would look to the top OL or WR (unless Fant TE) fell. Third round, I would pick OL, unless I did it in the second round. Interior or OT, doesm't matter too much to me. The remaining picks would have some degree of consolidation and/or exchanging for 2020 picks with anyone else I'm drafting coming from the defensive side of the ball. I suppose one exception would be that if Stidham was available in the 4th or (taking a chance) 5th round, I would draft him and swap him for Tanney.
My whole life is one of self-delusion. Otherwise, I would never be able to get up in the morning or, probably more to the point, go home at night.
That was certainly true about Beckham for a lot of people here. I've been as negative as anybody this offseason, but they got better by shipping him and Vernon out of here.
There are still fundamental problems. Eli should be replaced and Shurmur is a poor coach, but the last few days have been positive.
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That was certainly true about Beckham for a lot of people here. I've been as negative as anybody this offseason, but they got better by shipping him and Vernon out of here.
There are still fundamental problems. Eli should be replaced and Shurmur is a poor coach, but the last few days have been positive.
Well, I obviously have a different opinion on Eli as compared to you and most others. I think he needs to be replaced but for continuity and forward progress reasons as opposed to current ability. Unlike others, I don't think he holds the offense back and that with improved protection and, perhaps, specific game-planning, he can be quite successful, at least for one more season.
Second We lost Collins, but we are better at safety imo because Peppers/Bethea is better than Collins/Riley. Collins actually had a rough year and missed what 4 games.
Third we lost Vernon added Golden and Lost OBJ and added Golden. Vernon to Marcus isn't as huge of a drop clearly as OBJ is to Tate. However OBJ missed 4 games and Tate is very durable. This is a huge loss, so I can't sugar coat it and we will need to make more upgrades to be better.
Fourth we have the 6th, 17th, and 37th. This is a very good draft. Assuming we don't go QB at 6 we have a chance to really improve this time with these picks. If we end up with 2 Def studs and a good OL it will make our team drastically better. For example if we end up with Ed Oliver pass rushing 3-4 DE, Clelin Ferrell Edge pass rusher, and Dalton Risner RT/C with 37. All 3 could make a major impact this year. We also have so many picks that will help with depth and/or someone could really brake out.
Fifth and last... We aren't done in FA. Maybe we sign Justin Houston? Remmers? more depth and players are still out there. Let us finish our roster and then we will know if we have a chance to be better, good, bad, or worse.
We have tons of cap room the next two years and will have a roster full of young, drafted talent. Would be great if we're competitive this year, but if not, DG is arming us for the future.
He is Jonathon Stewart if Stewart was coming off a 1200+ yard season and played almost all the snaps. That is a stupid comment.
Yes, I'm that cynical and down on this team.
For the missing RT, we need to look hard into Remmers and Ryan Schraeder. Veldheer has missed games in his last 3 seasons. We could draft a RT if they can get 1st or 2nd round talent.
As for quarterback, yeah, they have to find Eli's replacement soon or extend him if he magically becomes the old Eli (2011) with a decent Oline.