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CLEVELAND Cabot Cleveland Plain Dealer: The Browns’ Odell Beckham Jr. trade: A behind the scenes look “On Monday, the day legal tampering began, Dorsey called Gettleman and asked if he'd be willing to trade Beckham. The answer was yes, and negotiations that day were fast and furious. Dorsey had before him five different trade scenarios that the Browns had been working on since December, thanks to all their intel, and the report and rumors. All five scenarios included the Browns' No. 17 overall pick, and a variety of combinations. The names of Duke Johnson and Ogbah never came up, a source said. Meanwhile, the 49ers were also interested, according to Glazer, but the Giants wanted the No. 2 overall pick and the 49ers weren't budging...” “The day Dorsey called to ask for Beckham, Gettleman was in the midst of taking a ton of heat for letting safety Landon Collins walk in free agency, and needed a save. Browns' first-round safety Jabrill Peppers was the answer. Gettleman was adamant about acquiring Peppers in the deal to make up for the loss of the his three-time Pro Bowl safety, who agreed to a six-year, $84 million deal with the Redskins. The Browns didn't want to let Peppers go. They like his attitude, his work ethic and his infectious personality. But they certainly weren't going to let him stand in the way of acquiring Beckham, and the Giants felt he might fare better in their 3-4 defense.” |
So one has to consider if Collins did get franchised would Beckham still be a Giant today or would the Giants accepted even a lesser deal from another team?
That's the implication and that is ridiculous. Again, it's as if the writer is not even aware about Glazer's reports. And it also doesn't ring truthful at all given what we know about Gettleman. They are basically suggesting that trading Beckham was a panic move because they "lost" Collins.
So one has to consider if Collins did get franchised would Beckham still be a Giant today or would the Giants accepted even a lesser deal from another team?
No, the deal would have just netted another player or another draft pick - i.e., their #2 this year or their #1 next year.
Well I think it became two things meshed into one. He didnt trade OBJ to save face, but once he decided he was gone combined with Collins being gone and the safeties getting ridiculous $ he looked at Peppers as a great fit. Call it saving face or conveniently filling a need.
1. It seems Beckham was more available then many in the fans/media believed.
2. CLE was obviously interested in Beckham and had been for a while
3. Their 1st round pick wasn't enough.
4. Looking at their roster, especially the defensive side, Peppers was probably the most desirable guy (after Garrett who's probably untouchable). Huge improvement from his 1st to 2nd season which speaks to his work ethic and his extreme versatility was probably very appealing to Bettcher given how he deployed Mathieu and Buchanon with the Cards.
5. Seeing what (top) safeties are going for this year, I can easily see a team dealing a 2nd straight up for Peppers, which is roughly equivalent to trading a 2020 1st for him. So if you want to convert his value to draft picks, then the Giants basically traded Beckham for #17, 3rd rd pick, pick swap, 2020 1st.
Read that wrong!
Of course, Dorsey was gearing up by then to draft Baker Mayfield No. 1 overall, and there was no way he was parting with that pick or even flip-flopping with the Giants, who were right behind him at No. 2.
....
By that time, the Giants were already disillusioned with their star receiver, and the seed was planted for the trade that would ultimately go down almost a year later.
Resigning Beckham was really the only option after he got hurt. The comp pick wouldn’t have been enough value and franchising him could have been chaos (he may have pulled a Bell). We paid for picks and future players by eating a ton of dead cap in 2019, a year we aren’t competing in anyway.
I think this worked out as well as it possibly could have, very lucky IMO. This could have gone really bad in many ways which is something I don’t think some people consider when assessing the package we got for him.
I think this worked out as well as it possibly could have, very lucky IMO. This could have gone really bad in many ways which is something I don’t think some people consider when assessing the package we got for him.
What Uconn said.
If this part of the reportage is true, what does it say about the decision-making that went in to the signing of OBJ to the mega-$$ deal? Did DG and ownership assess that they had no choice but to ink Beckham? Or is that bold faced portion mere taking of editorial liberty by the writer?
Shurmur was convinced after talking with OBJ, that he would be able to keep him in check, according to several article. Remember the mantra, you don't give up on talent. The deal for OBJ was a decent price for what he could be and what he could do. Once it became obvious, OBJ did not want to keep things to himself, it was time to go...
What no #2 and this year's #33, plus next years #1?
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All offseason I said there was no way anyone would trade the second overall pick for Beckham. Didn't go over well here... Fans aren't realistic.
What no #2 and this year's #33, plus next years #1?
Lunacy. I've never seen a more overrated player by his own fans.
[PS in Portsmouth, NH this week, went to a 'Hempire' store and purchased some Charlotte's Web and other cbd products. Not yet convinced of effect after a couple days of 25mg a day by dropper, but the taste of the stuff has me on a nostalgic high (:. Where do you get your gummies from, and cost? I think all the Amazon products are hemp extract and not cbd oils. To avoid further millering, pls email: liacos237@gmail.com if you care to. Tnks)
This was a new team to them this time last year. They took a gamble on his personality and didn't like the result.
And offensively carried a team to the playoffs in 2016- with the shit defense
Overrated is the wrong term. He has put up legendary numbers on the field. And his injuries were from the typical Eli high throw over the middle and a illegal leg whip.
Concerns on staying on the field are overplayed.
The argument is it’s not worth paying a wr that much- period- not that he is overvalued
The term cancer is also a joke- his last healthy year they made the playoffs- without him they were worse-
He’s gone now- he was a pain at times but the narratives now are a bit of a joke
And offensively carried a team to the playoffs in 2016- with the shit defense
Overrated is the wrong term. He has put up legendary numbers on the field. And his injuries were from the typical Eli high throw over the middle and a illegal leg whip.
Concerns on staying on the field are overplayed.
The argument is it’s not worth paying a wr that much- period- not that he is overvalued
The term cancer is also a joke- his last healthy year they made the playoffs- without him they were worse-
He’s gone now- he was a pain at times but the narratives now are a bit of a joke
With the stud defense not shit defense
You don't "save face" by trading one of your most popular players.
Gettleman KNEW he would take crap for letting Collins walk. He didn't care.
Yup. He did it because he knew he could handle the loss of Collins by getting Peppers as a replacement. My ass a grown man who has no fear of cutting star vets was trying to save face over Collins.
And as for not being a cancer, tell Sterling Shepard that while he's packing his bags.
Cancer, loser, and overrated. All ended up bearing out.
2. There have been reports that Beckham wasn’t traded last off season because Shurmur lobbied to keep him - hence the huge contract.
The key now is doing really well with the two draft picks and Peppers continuing to grow possibly into a Pro Bowler. Then this becomes a win-win trade.
And offensively carried a team to the playoffs in 2016- with the shit defense
Overrated is the wrong term. He has put up legendary numbers on the field. And his injuries were from the typical Eli high throw over the middle and a illegal leg whip.
Concerns on staying on the field are overplayed.
The argument is it’s not worth paying a wr that much- period- not that he is overvalued
The term cancer is also a joke- his last healthy year they made the playoffs- without him they were worse-
He’s gone now- he was a pain at times but the narratives now are a bit of a joke
+1.
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If he has the best 50 games at wr to start a career ever.
And offensively carried a team to the playoffs in 2016- with the shit defense
Overrated is the wrong term. He has put up legendary numbers on the field. And his injuries were from the typical Eli high throw over the middle and a illegal leg whip.
Concerns on staying on the field are overplayed.
And the hamstring injury to start his 1st year AND the hamstring injury to start his 2nd year And.. seeing a trend?
Yet....look what happened. He wore out his welcome with his antics. We weren’t going anywhere with him as a franchise, and the style of play we want to have moving forward doesn’t bold well for a bonafide #1 receiver who needs target after target.
Most importantly, After the Giants made him an incredibly rich man, he basically said he didn’t want to play here.
Enough with the excuses, time to move on.
F that. Giants want to build a culture with guys that wanna win as Giants and want to play for this franchise and win as a team. At times it seemed like Beckham didn’t really care about the “Giants” winning, it was just him that wanted to win. He should speak to Eli Manning about winning and leadership, I’m sure he could learn something.
You don't "save face" by trading one of your most popular players.
Gettleman KNEW he would take crap for letting Collins walk. He didn't care.
Agreed. Gentleman doesn't care what anyone except ownership thinks, certainly not the media or the fans. But it's still a great article. I love this kind of inside information.
And if the best trade offer for Collins was a 4th or 5th round, then DG wins if we get a late 3rd comp pick.
And if the best trade offer for Collins was a 4th or 5th round, then DG wins if we get a late 3rd comp pick.
We've only been losing with Beckham.
And if the best trade offer for Collins was a 4th or 5th round, then DG wins if we get a late 3rd comp pick.
I'm sure the Giants are hardly the only team that would have made this decision given the circumstances.
The Steelers are held in fairly high-regard. Outside of NE, they've probably been the most consistent team in the AFC over the last ~15 years.
You could easily look at them and say "man, if they really liked what they saw in Smith-Schuster in 2017, they should have just moved Brown at that point... they should have seen a lot of this stuff coming"
JuJu very clearly showed WR1 stuff as a rookie, and PIT could have recouped more for Brown if they had looked to move him a year earlier. But, they didn't - and the situation hit a point beyond repair where Brown playing in PIT basically went off the table entirely and they lost a good chunk of their trade leverage.
Moving Brown earlier could have netted them a better return, and allowed them to better plan for the future.
They could even have decided to retain Bell - but Conner was good enough that they didn't really need to anyway.
I was holding out hope we'd get the SF 2 + a 2020 2 or 3 from them... the Browns package wasn't quite that, but it's a heck of a lot better than a 3 and a 5 without any player coming back.
I just didn't want to give Beckham away. A lot of the rumored packages before the deal went down were either too unrealistic or too underwhelming.
I don't fault NYG for not moving Beckham after 2016. That's the type of move that only hindsight really provides. We were an 11 win team in McAdoo's first season as the coach with a top 5 defense.
It made logical sense to say "let's see if we can maintain this defense, get the offense back to at least average and go from there..."
Sure, if the Giants had moved Beckham before 2017, we may have been better off in the long-run - but again, we have the benefit now of knowing that he got hurt in the 2017 preseason, and then by Week 4, his season was over.
It sounds like most of the things that led them to trade him were things that happened more recently.
Essentially, the Browns landed arguably the best receiver in the NFL for the No. 17 overall pick.
It's the flip side of what some people around here are doing.
I guess it is good to get some positive reinforcement but one the article talked about what Gettleman was thinking, that is when my BS detector started to go off.
No way Gettleman would tell someone from the Browns I am taking heat from the Collins trade and I need a save.
1. He's going to want a massive contract that he isn't worth
2. He's a pain on the ass
3. His trade value will likely never be higher than it is now, with 2 years left on his rookie deal
It was obvious if the team could look at the player objectively instead of being sweet up in the "generational" nonsense.
I guess it is good to get some positive reinforcement but one the article talked about what Gettleman was thinking, that is when my BS detector started to go off.
No way Gettleman would tell someone from the Browns I am taking heat from the Collins trade and I need a save.
The article doesn't say Gettleman said that - it's an interpretation of his unexpected (to the Browns) interest in Peppers. I take it that the Browns fed this story to the writer which is not a knock since probably 90% of stories you read are like that. I'd hope DG's interest in Peppers had more to do with needing a safety to replace Collins than with quelling any media/fan backlash but I am not as quick to dismiss it as some people. My confidence is at a low ebb right now.
1. He's going to want a massive contract that he isn't worth
2. He's a pain on the ass
3. His trade value will likely never be higher than it is now, with 2 years left on his rookie deal
It was obvious if the team could look at the player objectively instead of being sweet up in the "generational" nonsense.
Terps, I will give you credit for having better foresight than most on it - but, I think it was a much harder call at that point in time.
I mean, yeah - right now? If we're having this conversation today, it looks like a no-brainer in retrospect.
But, given where the team was at the time - coming off an 11-win season, having had a top 5 defense, and having a young coach, it's hard for me to fault them for looking at it in the light where they felt that the goal should be to improve the offense, maintain the defense, and go back at it.
Not that it matters what the opinions or reactions are from the talking heads, but a move like that would have been almost impossible to explain away at the time.
Forget the superlatives or any of that - legendary, not legendary... that stuff isn't that important to me.
For me, it was always just a matter of the talent outweighing what I perceived to be relatively minor negatives.
Boat trip, kicking net... even Josh Norman... none of that shit really bugged me. The celebrations, whatever... don't care about that stuff.
But, if there's any truth to him more electively not being out there at the end of the season than being told he wasn't healthy enough to play, or telling the coach to go fuck himself more than once, etc... those are things I won't turn the other cheek to as quickly and things that do bug me.
I don't hate the guy... but I'm also not mad about trading him away, don't marry myself to individual players over the team as a whole, and just want what's better for the team.
You did tell me he'd eventually let me down - and if the stuff coming out about him behind the scenes are true, it appears you'd have been right about that. So, kudos.
I'm not too stubborn to admit any of that.
I'm a Giants fan above anything else - I'm just tired of the losing.
I'm really hopefull that that has changed this offseason.
I was glad he stood up for himself against Norman, I was glad he stood up for himself against Goodell and Trump with the dog pissing dance, I never thought taking off his helmet or kicking a net was even an after thought.
But the IV thing was childish and directly not giving his best to the game. Same as taking off the end of the season. That's stealing money and chickenshit nonsense.
I'm glad they traded him. I certainly wish they'd not spent 23M on 12 games. But Gettleman made a mistake resigning him last year, when there were plenty of other options.
And offensively carried a team to the playoffs in 2016- with the shit defense
Overrated is the wrong term. He has put up legendary numbers on the field. And his injuries were from the typical Eli high throw over the middle and a illegal leg whip.
Concerns on staying on the field are overplayed.
The argument is it’s not worth paying a wr that much- period- not that he is overvalued
The term cancer is also a joke- his last healthy year they made the playoffs- without him they were worse-
He’s gone now- he was a pain at times but the narratives now are a bit of a joke
Some posters won’t give Beckham the credit he warrants because the team didn’t win. It’s nonsense. Blame the giants for not winning. Beckham wasn’t the problem. With that said, it was time to move on.
Exactly. I would have traded him for the first and 3rd and called it a day. Peppers was gravy.
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as an organization to get another bite at the apple to trade OBJ. And we are even more fortunate to get the compensation we received.
Exactly. I would have traded him for the first and 3rd and called it a day. Peppers was gravy.
Who else caught the bw reference to “an organization” when he’s in agreement and “Jints Central” when he’s not?
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In comment 14343383 bw in dc said:
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as an organization to get another bite at the apple to trade OBJ. And we are even more fortunate to get the compensation we received.
Exactly. I would have traded him for the first and 3rd and called it a day. Peppers was gravy.
Who else caught the bw reference to “an organization” when he’s in agreement and “Jints Central” when he’s not?
I did now! Love it.
Imagine drafting a great RT prospect and getting a good pass rusher also. And we have these players on the cheap.
In 2020, the Giants could have over $100M to spend!!!