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Pat Shurmur’s take on Dwayne Haskins’ Pro Day: ‘Impressive …

GFAN52 : 3/20/2019 7:08 pm
Quote:
“It was excellent,’’ Shurmur said. “We obviously have spent a lot of time evaluating him, and this is one piece of it. We got the chance to work with him on the board and take him to dinner, and he certainly is an accomplished and impressive young man.’’

There is evidence of Haskins’ ability from his one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback at Ohio State. Shurmur, as a former quarterbacks coach and offensive coordinator, likes to get a sense of things by being in the building.

“Just watch him throw,’’ Shurmur said. “The important thing about Pro Days in general is you come to his school, you get to see how he interacts with his teammates, get to talk to the people that have worked with him.’’





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RE: If you compare  
Emil : 3/20/2019 10:28 pm : link
In comment 14350621 GoDeep13 said:
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Haskins to Warren Moon no one bats a fucking eye. Say Byron Leftwich and suddenly your the racist that only compares black QBs to black QBs 🙄.


Funny, Warren Moon is exactly the QB he reminds me of. I think it’s the release and arm strength.

He’s a pro style QB, so any RGIII comparisons are either ill informed or made for more nefarious reasons.



Haskins is very quick  
Angus : 3/20/2019 10:32 pm : link
In his decision a making and in his throwing motion. The time between start of decision to ball in hands of the receiver is very short. Maybe a little like Marino, but with better ball fakes. He is a good face of the franchise guy as well. He would be a good pick and may be worth trading up for, as painful as it would be to lose that extra pick.
RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
GoDeep13 : 3/20/2019 10:34 pm : link
In comment 14350570 bw in dc said:
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In comment 14350563 arcarsenal said:


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Just change it to "I really, really DON'T want Haskins... " and we can pencil you right in!

I think you're more anti-Haskins than I am pro-Haskins, honestly.

So, you can't really call me out like this, buddy.



The better way to characterize my view here is I'm really anti-Haskins at #6. Well, any QB.

This crop really bothers me because each has a hole in their game/profile that creates too much risk for a first round investment.

So when I start throwing Finley out there it's assuming the so called top three - Haskins, Murray, Lock - are off the board by the second round...
I’m not the least bit enamored with Haskins either. And don’t get me wrong, I love his story as a kid that grew up a Giants fan and I think it’d be cool and seen as a plus that he was. But I don’t like how slow everything is for him and how he has a really hard time operating under, and escaping, pressure.

The only two QBs I personally like is Murray and Jones. Jones proved that he could operate under constant duress and with WRs that had inconsistent hands and struggled to separate. I wouldn’t take Jones at #6 but I’d be ok with him at 17. I’d also be ok if we skipped QB all together.

It seems like the same people that were saying no to Barkely  
Mike in NJ : 3/20/2019 10:37 pm : link
are saying no to Haskins this year. Last year Gettleman was an idiot for passing on the quarterbacks, this year he is an idiot if he takes a quarterback.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
Giants38 : 3/20/2019 10:39 pm : link
In comment 14350651 GoDeep13 said:
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In comment 14350570 bw in dc said:


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In comment 14350563 arcarsenal said:


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Just change it to "I really, really DON'T want Haskins... " and we can pencil you right in!

I think you're more anti-Haskins than I am pro-Haskins, honestly.

So, you can't really call me out like this, buddy.



The better way to characterize my view here is I'm really anti-Haskins at #6. Well, any QB.

This crop really bothers me because each has a hole in their game/profile that creates too much risk for a first round investment.

So when I start throwing Finley out there it's assuming the so called top three - Haskins, Murray, Lock - are off the board by the second round...

I’m not the least bit enamored with Haskins either. And don’t get me wrong, I love his story as a kid that grew up a Giants fan and I think it’d be cool and seen as a plus that he was. But I don’t like how slow everything is for him and how he has a really hard time operating under, and escaping, pressure.

The only two QBs I personally like is Murray and Jones. Jones proved that he could operate under constant duress and with WRs that had inconsistent hands and struggled to separate. I wouldn’t take Jones at #6 but I’d be ok with him at 17. I’d also be ok if we skipped QB all together.


What exactly did Jones prove? They got crushed by a great Clemson team. The following week they got hammered at home by a horrendous Wake Forest team. Jones didn’t prove a thing to me.
RE: Haskins is very quick  
Emil : 3/20/2019 10:41 pm : link
In comment 14350650 Angus said:
Quote:
In his decision a making and in his throwing motion. The time between start of decision to ball in hands of the receiver is very short. Maybe a little like Marino, but with better ball fakes. He is a good face of the franchise guy as well. He would be a good pick and may be worth trading up for, as painful as it would be to lose that extra pick.


The Marino comparison is a good one as well. As they said on the broadcast, he’s an old style nfl QB, the kind we have seen have success in the league over the past 40 years. Don’t be shocked if Mr. Old School Dave Gettleman falls in love with that.

He’s also an ideal QB for the KC plan. He’s 21, not 22 or 23. Could benefit from a year of nfl weight training and conditioning. He honestly played in a system that did not always showcase his arm talent. My point is the kids got all the physical tools, some untapped potential, and has not hit his ceiling. Might I add he dreams of being a Giant. He wants to wear blue.

If Shurmur wants him I think Gettleman tries to get him. I still love the idea of an edge player in round one, so if there is anyway I can keep one of my first round picks I do it. The Giants have 12 picks. They aren’t bringing in 12 drafted players. Gettleman is going to make a trade somewhere.
Thanks Eric for the  
section125 : 3/20/2019 11:05 pm : link
insight into what is being said around the different places.

I like Haskins, feel the "he has trouble under pressure" thing is absolute crap - there was another thread that disproves that theory (despite the two plays sxdxa says he found which is then disputed by another poster). His completion percentage under pressure is very good according to the chart provided in that thread.

I am not sure they need to move up to get him and I do not want to move up to get him. But if DG and PS think he is the right guy, ok. I'd much rather save picks and fix the defense and oline.

The being out of shape thing is a put off(if true), but that is easily cured. But he is a bit slow, definitely not a mobile QB in the Aaron Rodgers or even Drew Brees style of drop back QBs.
RE: RE: Still looks fat and slow to me. This workout showed nothing.  
The 12th Man : 3/20/2019 11:20 pm : link
In comment 14350473 bw in dc said:
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In comment 14350418 TMS said:


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Why was he never made to move or show some ability to do that? He might be fine until he is flushed from the pocket and they start to get after him. Because an Ol blows a block or receiver does not finish a rout and he panics because he cannot get away. Thats when the really bad things happen. A big statue with a big arm but rattle him and he is in trouble. A nightmare in our league. Snurmur is all BS he complemetns every QB he sees as it should be. Lets see what they do on draft day .



I thought he looked better physically this time vs the Combine. He even admitted he's cut weight since then, and admitted he wasn't in top shape.

Today didn't solve the issue that is a big question mark throughout the season - how will Haskins deal with an NFL environment where you have less time to read the defense and less time to throw.


Okay here is my big issue with him with comments he made today. You know you are going to the combine the biggest thing for your career and he comes in by his own admission a little heavy he has had 2 and a half months to be ready. This is not that important to him to be in shape? What happens when you give the big money. I am not questioning his ability but I am questioning his attitude.
The part that bothers me the most  
montanagiant : 3/20/2019 11:29 pm : link
""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""
RE: The part that bothers me the most  
section125 : 3/20/2019 11:31 pm : link
In comment 14350686 montanagiant said:
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""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""


as opposed to Kyler Murray's one record breaking year?
RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
montanagiant : 3/20/2019 11:37 pm : link
In comment 14350690 section125 said:
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In comment 14350686 montanagiant said:


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""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""



as opposed to Kyler Murray's one record breaking year?

Not a fan of his either..
RE: If anything...  
BlueLou'sBack : 3/20/2019 11:40 pm : link
In comment 14350512 bw in dc said:
Quote:
Haskins reminds me of Leinert. Great numbers while surrounded by great talent with some solid physical skills.


Incredibly lazy analysis, because what did Leinert in at the NFL level was atrocious study habits and lack of discipline. In other words partying and drugs and drinking.

There is zero evidence to this point that Haskins has any of these traits - just the opposite.

That's why the most important asset any player has is in his head and heart.
RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
section125 : 3/20/2019 11:52 pm : link
In comment 14350694 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14350690 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14350686 montanagiant said:


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""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""



as opposed to Kyler Murray's one record breaking year?


Not a fan of his either..


If you are saying you are worried he(they) only started one year at QB, then that is a legit concern.

The counter is that it was an extremely good year for such a green player who also showed improvement virtually each week. I doubt he was just lucky.

I'm on the fence with this. I'd still prefer to go ER/DL/OL first 3 picks.
RE: RE: I’d take  
jestersdead : 3/20/2019 11:57 pm : link
In comment 14350452 MotownGIANTS said:
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In comment 14350338 Dan_Soprano said:


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Daniel Jones over him in a heartbeat. Haskins = another RGIII.



You do realize the only thing they have in common is their black .... nothing about their style of play is the same

Goes along with the same lazy logic of not wanting Jones because Jones is at duke and Dave Brown went there.

Im not advocating for Jones. Simply pointing out both groups use the similar logic when comparing QBs from the past to the present
RE: Imagine if we trade up for Haskins?  
Go Terps : 3/21/2019 12:09 am : link
In comment 14350568 Sean said:
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this place will go ballistic.


Bite your tongue.
RE: RE: If anything...  
bw in dc : 3/21/2019 12:19 am : link
In comment 14350696 BlueLou'sBack said:
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In comment 14350512 bw in dc said:


Quote:


Haskins reminds me of Leinert. Great numbers while surrounded by great talent with some solid physical skills.



Incredibly lazy analysis, because what did Leinert in at the NFL level was atrocious study habits and lack of discipline. In other words partying and drugs and drinking.

There is zero evidence to this point that Haskins has any of these traits - just the opposite.

That's why the most important asset any player has is in his head and heart.


Interesting rebuttal. Where did I suggest personality and character similarities?

I was focusing exclusively on their college teams and their similar physical skills.

And I'm lazy...
RE: RE: RE: Still looks fat and slow to me. This workout showed nothing.  
bw in dc : 3/21/2019 12:22 am : link
In comment 14350679 The 12th Man said:
Quote:

Okay here is my big issue with him with comments he made today. You know you are going to the combine the biggest thing for your career and he comes in by his own admission a little heavy he has had 2 and a half months to be ready. This is not that important to him to be in shape? What happens when you give the big money. I am not questioning his ability but I am questioning his attitude.


I hear you. I don't think that's unfair.

However, give him and his team credit for correcting the issue - because they essentially admitted as much - and getting Haskins ready for today.

RE: RE: RE: If anything...  
BlueLou'sBack : 3/21/2019 12:48 am : link
In comment 14350713 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14350696 BlueLou'sBack said:


Quote:
Incredibly lazy analysis, because what did Leinert in at the NFL level was atrocious study habits and lack of discipline. In other words partying and drugs and drinking.

There is zero evidence to this point that Haskins has any of these traits - just the opposite.

That's why the most important asset any player has is in his head and heart.



Interesting rebuttal. Where did I suggest personality and character similarities?

I was focusing exclusively on their college teams and their similar physical skills.

And I'm lazy...


Well your lazy words were already refuted by, you know, an actual USC fan who seems to know a bit more about the bs physical comparison you make. So I thought I'd add in another little difference between the two players, as reported about Matt and as known to this point about Haskins.

The real point is you often like to trumpet opinions, with very little factual basis to back it up.

Yeah it's 2019, I should be used to that by now since I've spent a lifetime in fields where no nothing "critics" wield undue influence.

You are welcome to your opinion, five years from now we'll see if it was valid. I'm out.
Know nothing critics...  
BlueLou'sBack : 3/21/2019 12:51 am : link
I don't know why I want to give you the benefit of a doubt about your gray cells, as Poirot would say, but I think you do better here than you often do.

Just a reminder...  
bw in dc : 3/21/2019 1:11 am : link
this is a forum where posters give their opinions, and usually some debate follows.

And for what it’s worth, what makes any analysis and comparison in football so complicated is the difficulty to boil it down to pure science. So art - opinion - plays a big part. Here and even in NFL front offices.
RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
montanagiant : 3/21/2019 1:32 am : link
In comment 14350702 section125 said:
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In comment 14350694 montanagiant said:


Quote:


In comment 14350690 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14350686 montanagiant said:


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""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""



as opposed to Kyler Murray's one record breaking year?


Not a fan of his either..



If you are saying you are worried he(they) only started one year at QB, then that is a legit concern.

The counter is that it was an extremely good year for such a green player who also showed improvement virtually each week. I doubt he was just lucky.

I'm on the fence with this. I'd still prefer to go ER/DL/OL first 3 picks.

Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both
RE: I’d take  
seyhey : 3/21/2019 2:44 am : link
Yeah, we are all happy you are not the GM. Why don't we let the GM do his job.
RE: As I’ve said, if Shurmur believes  
santacruzom : 3/21/2019 3:22 am : link
In comment 14350327 Big Blue '56 said:
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he’s the future, I’m all in as a fan..That said, lots of coachspeak in here, imv


Shurmur's coaching record is only 15-34. What's he done to earn an all-in?
Leg  
BigBlueCane : 3/21/2019 4:18 am : link
that one game meant more and revealed more then OSU beating the brakes off yet another overrated Michigan team that has a history of laying eggs against the Buckeyes. Ohio State knows they own Michigan and Michigan knows it as well.

Where as Purdue was absolutely a high pressure situation, on the road, the Boilermakers who didn't have half the talent of either Michigan or OSU, pummeled the latter into submission with nary a response from.

That should be setting off alarm bells about Haskins and the rest of his Buckeye teammates.
RE: It seems like the same people that were saying no to Barkely  
Bill L : 3/21/2019 5:29 am : link
In comment 14350657 Mike in NJ said:
Quote:
are saying no to Haskins this year. Last year Gettleman was an idiot for passing on the quarterbacks, this year he is an idiot if he takes a quarterback.


I wouldn’t say that. I was as high on Barkley as anyone last year and adamant that we take him from day 1. I never wavered once. And I’m almost equally entrenched in the 2020 QB strategy. I feel that’s where the best talent is and I feel they are eminently gettable.

But then again, I’ve got that “Chinese patience” thing going for me where was can wait thousands of years for our strategy to unfold.
RE: This is what happens to Haskins  
Tom from LI : 3/21/2019 5:34 am : link
In comment 14350566 sxdxca said:
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When he faces pressure...

Against Washington, he faced no pressure through 3 quarters, even the announcers were saying he had all day.

At the 7:45 mark in this 9 minute highlight video, you will see once pressure comes he folds like a cheap suit.

He threw two balls which should have been intercepted, balls were being thrown behind, in the ground, he took sack after sack.

He is a pure pocket passer, who has little to no mobility. Without a perfect O line in front of him, combined with the Giants O line, this can be a fatal mistake.

here is the video, watch from the 7:45 mark when Washington begins to bring pressure. I've provided the link
Haskins 7:45 - ( New Window )



I watched 1 minute of that and it just looks like what he will be like in the pro's. This is a mistake of monumental proportions...

He is slow, painfully slow, clock him with a calendar slow. Some of those throws were horrid and I am talking about the mechanics. Looks like he is pushing the ball.

I want absolutely no part of this guy.

mistake, mistake mistake.
Haskins is a winner  
KingBlue : 3/21/2019 7:30 am : link
Hope he falls to 6... doubt it. Therefore we will trade up to get him, regardless of how loud the amateur doubters on BBI scream, kick and cry.

He is the target, as he should be.
RE: Haskins is a winner  
GFAN52 : 3/21/2019 8:28 am : link
In comment 14350791 KingBlue said:
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Hope he falls to 6... doubt it. Therefore we will trade up to get him, regardless of how loud the amateur doubters on BBI scream, kick and cry.

He is the target, as he should be.


If the Giants decide not to draft I’m pretty sure some team will jump the Giants and that will push a defensive player down to them which might not have been there without Murray and Haskins going on the top 5.
RE: RE: RE: Point to consider....  
Festina Lente : 3/21/2019 9:17 am : link
In comment 14350440 Jim Bur(n)t said:
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In comment 14350428 Pan-handler said:


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In comment 14350412 Big_Pete said:
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Ohio State Coach Ryan Day (formerly their OC) worked directly with Pat Shurmur at the Eagles as their QB coach.



They gonna know this kid inside and out. If they pick him they will be thoroughly confident he can be our next QB.

Perhaps Im not remembering but I dont recall the talk being nearly as effusive for ANY of the QBs last year. All the praise seemed much more reserved.

The highest praise seemed to be about Rosens table manners Lol



Rosen never slurped his soup or called the server "Honey".. not once ;-P . Josh Allen, on the other hand, used a salad fork to eat his Chateaubriand.. Classless fuck


Lol this made me chuckle...
I heard he asked for A1 sauce for his steak and wore a napkin on his collar.
Haskin's upcoming visits  
GFAN52 : 3/21/2019 10:17 am : link
Adam Schefter

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In the coming days, Ohio State QB Dwayne Haskins is scheduled to work out for Raiders and Dolphins in Columbus, and then he’s also scheduled to visit the Redskins, Broncos and Giants, per league sources.
Montana Giants Point is Well taken  
Angus : 3/21/2019 11:39 am : link
Small sample size is a problem - only one year as a starter. I'm still in and would, reluctantly, accept the Jet's formula to move up - three 2's to get from the number 6 pick to the number 4 pick.

I like Rosen as well, but his confidence was clearly damaged by his year in Arizona.
RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/21/2019 12:23 pm : link
In comment 14350694 montanagiant said:
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In comment 14350690 section125 said:


Quote:


In comment 14350686 montanagiant said:


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""one record-breaking year as a starting quarterback""



as opposed to Kyler Murray's one record breaking year?


Not a fan of his either..

You'd prefer a guy who played for four years and broke no records at all?

It's great if the stars align and a prospect with the talent and pedigree of Trevor Lawrence (or Andrew Luck, or Peyton Manning, etc.) are available at the same time that you're in position to draft them. Sometimes the composition of your roster, including age of incumbents, forces you to consider prospects that aren't completely devoid of concerns. That's true at every position, but certainly more high profile when you're looking at QBs.

Would most people feel more comfortable if Haskins went back to school for another year and duplicated his performance? Of course. But do you genuinely believe that it's unlikely that he would? Because unless you honestly think that his 2018 season was a fluke, you're holding out on a concern that is far less significant (IMO) than one that might be related to the kid's actual talent level and potential.

We've been spoiled as Giants fans for the past 15 years. Chances are, whoever Eli's successor ends up being, it will require a leap of faith by the fans, who are likely to nitpick every prospect because that's what happens when you haven't needed to worry about the position in a decade and a half.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/21/2019 12:45 pm : link
In comment 14350730 montanagiant said:
Quote:
Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both

The fact that Haskins, as a freshman, couldn't beat out a senior who was a returning starter (who had started in 2014, part of 2015, and all of 2016) and was also the team's 2nd leading rusher in each of those three years prior in an offense in which his head coach has historically favored QBs who can run - that's your big red flag?

Look, you don't like Haskins. You're not sold that he's the guy for the Giants. Those are both fine - you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and I don't think most people would try to claim that Haskins is an airtight prospect. But please at least try to apply a little bit of context to your argument about what is supposedly a red flag for you.

Once upon a time, Aaron Rodgers couldn't beat out Kyle Boller, either.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
Amtoft : 3/21/2019 12:57 pm : link
In comment 14351468 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 14350730 montanagiant said:


Quote:


Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both


The fact that Haskins, as a freshman, couldn't beat out a senior who was a returning starter (who had started in 2014, part of 2015, and all of 2016) and was also the team's 2nd leading rusher in each of those three years prior in an offense in which his head coach has historically favored QBs who can run - that's your big red flag?

Look, you don't like Haskins. You're not sold that he's the guy for the Giants. Those are both fine - you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and I don't think most people would try to claim that Haskins is an airtight prospect. But please at least try to apply a little bit of context to your argument about what is supposedly a red flag for you.

Once upon a time, Aaron Rodgers couldn't beat out Kyle Boller, either.


Kyle Boller wasn't there when Aaron Rodgers was there. Reggie Robertson started games 1 and 2 of Aaron Rodgers first season, but Rodgers played in both as he eased in and became the full time starter in game 3.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/21/2019 12:59 pm : link
In comment 14351492 Amtoft said:
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In comment 14351468 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14350730 montanagiant said:


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Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both


The fact that Haskins, as a freshman, couldn't beat out a senior who was a returning starter (who had started in 2014, part of 2015, and all of 2016) and was also the team's 2nd leading rusher in each of those three years prior in an offense in which his head coach has historically favored QBs who can run - that's your big red flag?

Look, you don't like Haskins. You're not sold that he's the guy for the Giants. Those are both fine - you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and I don't think most people would try to claim that Haskins is an airtight prospect. But please at least try to apply a little bit of context to your argument about what is supposedly a red flag for you.

Once upon a time, Aaron Rodgers couldn't beat out Kyle Boller, either.



Kyle Boller wasn't there when Aaron Rodgers was there. Reggie Robertson started games 1 and 2 of Aaron Rodgers first season, but Rodgers played in both as he eased in and became the full time starter in game 3.

I stand corrected - I had mistakenly assumed that Rodgers spent his freshman year caddying for Boller. In any case, I still don't think it's a massive indictment of Haskins that he couldn't beat out an incumbent senior three-year starter when he was just a freshman.
.  
arcarsenal : 3/21/2019 1:03 pm : link
I still don't understand the JT Barrett thing or why it matters.

Mitch Trubisky couldn't beat out Marquise Williams, either.

Who is Marquise Williams?

Exactly.

Here's what matters...

Dwayne Haskins is a legitimate NFL QB prospect. JT Barrett was not/is not/never will be. He's buried on the Saints depth chart somewhere, and given their decision to hang onto Teddy, I don't think they see him being anything more than a clipboard holder.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
Amtoft : 3/21/2019 1:05 pm : link
In comment 14351503 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 14351492 Amtoft said:


Quote:


In comment 14351468 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14350730 montanagiant said:


Quote:


Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both


The fact that Haskins, as a freshman, couldn't beat out a senior who was a returning starter (who had started in 2014, part of 2015, and all of 2016) and was also the team's 2nd leading rusher in each of those three years prior in an offense in which his head coach has historically favored QBs who can run - that's your big red flag?

Look, you don't like Haskins. You're not sold that he's the guy for the Giants. Those are both fine - you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and I don't think most people would try to claim that Haskins is an airtight prospect. But please at least try to apply a little bit of context to your argument about what is supposedly a red flag for you.

Once upon a time, Aaron Rodgers couldn't beat out Kyle Boller, either.



Kyle Boller wasn't there when Aaron Rodgers was there. Reggie Robertson started games 1 and 2 of Aaron Rodgers first season, but Rodgers played in both as he eased in and became the full time starter in game 3.


I stand corrected - I had mistakenly assumed that Rodgers spent his freshman year caddying for Boller. In any case, I still don't think it's a massive indictment of Haskins that he couldn't beat out an incumbent senior three-year starter when he was just a freshman.


Not a worry just a Cal fan and had season tickets and went to those Aaron Rodgers games... man the good days of college football for me... so long ago. To me look at Kurt Warner... didn't start until his SR year and won like the low league player of the year. He didn't start and couldn't beat out much lesser talent, but we good when he played and then ended up in the NFL and played great. That is who Haskins reminds me of if I had to pick someone.
RE: .  
Amtoft : 3/21/2019 1:09 pm : link
In comment 14351515 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
I still don't understand the JT Barrett thing or why it matters.

Mitch Trubisky couldn't beat out Marquise Williams, either.

Who is Marquise Williams?

Exactly.

Here's what matters...

Dwayne Haskins is a legitimate NFL QB prospect. JT Barrett was not/is not/never will be. He's buried on the Saints depth chart somewhere, and given their decision to hang onto Teddy, I don't think they see him being anything more than a clipboard holder.


Some people are designed for the college football game and that doesn't always translate to the NFL. JT Barrett is a perfect example of this. So is Tim Tebow for example. Who do you think could of beat out Tim Tebow in college football? Tom Brady didn't start until his JR year. He couldn't beat out Scott Dreisbach or Brian Griese.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: The part that bothers me the most  
montanagiant : 3/21/2019 8:16 pm : link
In comment 14351468 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14350730 montanagiant said:


Quote:


Well, I can understand Murray because of Mayfield but Haskins not being able to beat out J.T. Barrett is a red flag to me.

Bottom line you will need to use extra draft picks to get Murray which I don't want to and Haskins just doesn't have "It" IMO. i'd pass on both


The fact that Haskins, as a freshman, couldn't beat out a senior who was a returning starter (who had started in 2014, part of 2015, and all of 2016) and was also the team's 2nd leading rusher in each of those three years prior in an offense in which his head coach has historically favored QBs who can run - that's your big red flag?

Look, you don't like Haskins. You're not sold that he's the guy for the Giants. Those are both fine - you're absolutely entitled to your opinion, and I don't think most people would try to claim that Haskins is an airtight prospect. But please at least try to apply a little bit of context to your argument about what is supposedly a red flag for you.

Once upon a time, Aaron Rodgers couldn't beat out Kyle Boller, either.

LOL..You're wrong, Rodgers transferred in 2003 to Cal and started the 5th game of the season replacing BollerCal ended up 7-3 that season.

But please if you're going to use a comparison apply a little bit of fact to it
RE: RE: .  
montanagiant : 3/21/2019 8:17 pm : link
In comment 14351527 Amtoft said:
Quote:
In comment 14351515 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I still don't understand the JT Barrett thing or why it matters.

Mitch Trubisky couldn't beat out Marquise Williams, either.

Who is Marquise Williams?

Exactly.

Here's what matters...

Dwayne Haskins is a legitimate NFL QB prospect. JT Barrett was not/is not/never will be. He's buried on the Saints depth chart somewhere, and given their decision to hang onto Teddy, I don't think they see him being anything more than a clipboard holder.



Some people are designed for the college football game and that doesn't always translate to the NFL. JT Barrett is a perfect example of this. So is Tim Tebow for example. Who do you think could of beat out Tim Tebow in college football? Tom Brady didn't start until his JR year. He couldn't beat out Scott Dreisbach or Brian Griese.

Tebow accomplished a helluva lot more than Barrett did
Also, Brady had 2 solid years as a starter  
montanagiant : 3/21/2019 8:19 pm : link
prior to entering the Draft
Think Haskins is a slow footed  
TMS : 3/21/2019 9:31 pm : link
fat QB with a good arm and very little or no game expierience who will panic in the NFL under pressure. A bust who will ruin the team that drafts him.
RE: Think Haskins is a slow footed  
GFAN52 : 3/21/2019 9:43 pm : link
In comment 14352393 TMS said:
Quote:
fat QB with a good arm and very little or no game expierience who will panic in the NFL under pressure. A bust who will ruin the team that drafts him.


I'd a great arm and very accurate. Don't see him ruining the team that drafts him.
Comment Video on Haskin  
DeepBlueJint : 3/22/2019 6:42 am : link
Viewing the video that was referenced in this thread, I perceive that:

When pressured, Haskins consistently throws behind the receivers, both in the flat and over the middle.

Though he may be "slow a foot" he seemed mobile enough on occasions to move around or scramble, though again, if he throws, the tendency is to throw behind receivers.

As for my view on Haskin, I am indifferent. I would prefer an edge rusher at #6. There are just too many good ones in this draft. BPA.
RE: Comment Video on Haskin  
TMS : 3/22/2019 12:31 pm : link
In comment 14352533 DeepBlueJint said:
Quote:
Viewing the video that was referenced in this thread, I perceive that:

When pressured, Haskins consistently throws behind the receivers, both in the flat and over the middle.

Though he may be "slow a foot" he seemed mobile enough on occasions to move around or scramble, though again, if he throws, the tendency is to throw behind receivers.
I am with you.
As for my view on Haskin, I am indifferent. I would prefer an edge rusher at #6. There are just too many good ones in this draft. BPA.
RE: RE: As I’ve said, if Shurmur believes  
HomerJones45 : 3/22/2019 12:36 pm : link
In comment 14350746 santacruzom said:
Quote:
In comment 14350327 Big Blue '56 said:


Quote:


he’s the future, I’m all in as a fan..That said, lots of coachspeak in here, imv



Shurmur's coaching record is only 15-34. What's he done to earn an all-in?
No one is listening to Shurmur. He will do as he is told and coach who is given. This will be a Dave and Jawn decision.
RE: Also, Brady had 2 solid years as a starter  
Amtoft : 3/22/2019 12:39 pm : link
In comment 14352315 montanagiant said:
Quote:
prior to entering the Draft


Because he wasn't going to be a first round top 10 QB. You really think Brady would have went back for his SR year if he was a top 10 QB.

Also the point being that what makes a good College QB Tim Tebow or JT Barrett doesn't mean they will be good NFL QBs. I don't know if you can name any top NFL QB that would have replaced Tim Tebow in College?
RE: RE: RE: .  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/22/2019 1:35 pm : link
In comment 14352312 montanagiant said:
Quote:
In comment 14351527 Amtoft said:


Quote:


In comment 14351515 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I still don't understand the JT Barrett thing or why it matters.

Mitch Trubisky couldn't beat out Marquise Williams, either.

Who is Marquise Williams?

Exactly.

Here's what matters...

Dwayne Haskins is a legitimate NFL QB prospect. JT Barrett was not/is not/never will be. He's buried on the Saints depth chart somewhere, and given their decision to hang onto Teddy, I don't think they see him being anything more than a clipboard holder.



Some people are designed for the college football game and that doesn't always translate to the NFL. JT Barrett is a perfect example of this. So is Tim Tebow for example. Who do you think could of beat out Tim Tebow in college football? Tom Brady didn't start until his JR year. He couldn't beat out Scott Dreisbach or Brian Griese.


Tebow accomplished a helluva lot more than Barrett did

I'm not sure by what basis you can say Tebow accomplished more than Barrett (let alone "a helluva lot more") other than winning the Heisman, which is subjective anyway.

Barrett threw for more yards and TDs, rushed for more yards (but fewer TDs), and accounted for more total yards (12,697 to 12,232) and TDs (147 to 145) than Tebow over the course of their respective careers. And while Tebow was behind Chris Leak in his freshman year (WHY COULDN'T HE BEAT OUT CHRIS LEAK???), Barrett had Cardale Jones taking playing time from him in his sophomore season.

So, aside from you just digging your heels in on what you feel is a fatal flaw for Haskins, can you please tell us what Tebow did that represents accomplishing "a helluva lot more than Barrett"? I think you probably just don't realize how good of a college QB JT Barrett was.
RE: RE: Also, Brady had 2 solid years as a starter  
montanagiant : 3/22/2019 4:04 pm : link
In comment 14353004 Amtoft said:
Quote:
In comment 14352315 montanagiant said:


Quote:


prior to entering the Draft



Because he wasn't going to be a first round top 10 QB. You really think Brady would have went back for his SR year if he was a top 10 QB.

Also the point being that what makes a good College QB Tim Tebow or JT Barrett doesn't mean they will be good NFL QBs. I don't know if you can name any top NFL QB that would have replaced Tim Tebow in College?

That's exactly the point, one year of starting is not enough to judge anyone and should be a cause of concern IMO.

Regarding Tebow, one of the biggest reasons why he was good in COllege was the system they had running in Florida built specifically to take advantage of his height, strength, and running ability. That Offense was built around Tebow and it was unique to Florida. Tebow also stayed his senior year because he needed to get his draft stock up. Still was picked way too high

With that said he still accomplished a heck of a lot more than Barrett ever will in the NFL

RE: RE: RE: RE: .  
montanagiant : 3/22/2019 4:05 pm : link
In comment 14353108 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14352312 montanagiant said:


Quote:


In comment 14351527 Amtoft said:


Quote:


In comment 14351515 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


I still don't understand the JT Barrett thing or why it matters.

Mitch Trubisky couldn't beat out Marquise Williams, either.

Who is Marquise Williams?

Exactly.

Here's what matters...

Dwayne Haskins is a legitimate NFL QB prospect. JT Barrett was not/is not/never will be. He's buried on the Saints depth chart somewhere, and given their decision to hang onto Teddy, I don't think they see him being anything more than a clipboard holder.



Some people are designed for the college football game and that doesn't always translate to the NFL. JT Barrett is a perfect example of this. So is Tim Tebow for example. Who do you think could of beat out Tim Tebow in college football? Tom Brady didn't start until his JR year. He couldn't beat out Scott Dreisbach or Brian Griese.


Tebow accomplished a helluva lot more than Barrett did


I'm not sure by what basis you can say Tebow accomplished more than Barrett (let alone "a helluva lot more") other than winning the Heisman, which is subjective anyway.

Barrett threw for more yards and TDs, rushed for more yards (but fewer TDs), and accounted for more total yards (12,697 to 12,232) and TDs (147 to 145) than Tebow over the course of their respective careers. And while Tebow was behind Chris Leak in his freshman year (WHY COULDN'T HE BEAT OUT CHRIS LEAK???), Barrett had Cardale Jones taking playing time from him in his sophomore season.

So, aside from you just digging your heels in on what you feel is a fatal flaw for Haskins, can you please tell us what Tebow did that represents accomplishing "a helluva lot more than Barrett"? I think you probably just don't realize how good of a college QB JT Barrett was.

Tebow won a playoff game in the NFL, Barrett is on a Practice squad..lol
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