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Giant conundrum: NYG top draft row may be gone by #6

Pan-handler : 3/21/2019 11:01 am
As the smoke is clearing and evaluations are solidifying it is becoming evident who the consensus top players of this draft are.

QBs: Murray and Haskins

Non QB: Q.Will, Allen and Bosa.

There is a more than a slight chance that many teams are aligned with this ranking, making it quite possible that those 2 QBs and those 3 non QB could go in the top 5.

If that is the case the Giants are in a bit of a pickle. For now it becomes , either you have to trade up and give up later draft picks to secure one in your top row or if not pick a guy from a lower tier. Remember the Ogden /Cedric Jones draft?


In the case we don't want to pay the price to trade up, the Giants better be confident they have a guy rated close enough to those top prospects. In other words, a guy perhaps a bit more unpolished, inconsistent and/or a tad higher bust potential but perhaps still has enough talent to have upside similar or equal to the top row of players.

The possible guys on the list:

1.Devin White (though jtgiants made it clear we like him alot but not at 6, which means he is on the second or third tier most likely) May not offer high pass rush potential and isnt overly instinctual which you want out of a LB you pick this high (Maybe have to hope Tampa picks him at 5 letting someone else drop to us)

2.Greedy Williams- some pretty good CBs in this draft but Greedy os the only one that has true shutdown cover corner potential. Man to man coverage that Bettcher loves so he can be creative with his blitz schemes.

3.Sweat- tested out of the gym and had a great Senior Bowl. But the pass rush moves still need development and is out of a smaller school. Though tremendous upside is obvious. Not as much a finished product like Q.Will, Bosa and Allen.

4. Lock- Smaller school QB with multiple OCs . Tremendous arm, tremendous. Better athlete than Haskins. But alot of rawness and inconsistency to his game despite that he started more years than Haskins did. Not as anticipatory and cerebral as Haskins. Upside though is there to be just as good as Haskins or even better (but he has much more to iron out).

5. Burns- excellent, bendy, explosive pass rusher. But smallish frame that he may have maxed out at 249 prior to Combine. Giants usually like these guys bigger in the top 10 if they are going to feature them in the pass rush.

Additional comments: I don't see any OTs with a value high enough demonstrating proven and consistent dominance both in run AND pass on tape to make a selection this high. At #17 sure (or even 10 or below) but not at 6.

Another option of course would be a trade down and pick up more picks (which I believe DG has bever done before).
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RE: RE: Oliver at 6  
giantstock : 3/22/2019 8:22 am : link
In comment 14352528 GFAN52 said:
Quote:
In comment 14352514 giantstock said:


Quote:


If you pass on the 2 QB's of Haskins and Murray. I can see Sweat. But Greedy Williams and Lock at 6? No way in hell.

The OP is a good guy -- good gentlemen and great poster on here but he's all wet on Greedy. And just as crazy - Lock.

Both guys shouldn't sniff a 6th pick. And Lock shouldn't be our 17th pick either.



I'd rather have Lock with the 17th pick than Daniel Jones.


Id rather have neither in rd 1. And frankly not a fan in rd 2 either. But rd 1 for either -- no way.
RE: ISavant  
giantstock : 3/22/2019 8:32 am : link
In comment 14352557 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
If we move up for Q without loosing 17 I'd be 'able' as a fan to wait and see if Oliver is still there at 17.

If not,
6-allen
17-bush
37- the big DT (Laurence?)


Might make +++ for a real football team.

All that having been said, I'm not looking at players this season so, if it's Ollie at 6 I trust they did homework.


This thread had started with that their are concerns of picks 1-5 -- all I was saying is that I think Oliver (or Sweat - I didn't include Farrell) are strong gets at 6.

I realize Oliver might be had later but if no QB taken or just Murray taken he might be had at 5. I'm just saying i think he is worth the 6th pick.

I sort of differ on your draft philosophy however if GMEN do NOT take a QB with 6th pick. I'd want them taking two OLINEMEN with their next 2 picks.
I meant to add  
giantstock : 3/22/2019 8:36 am : link
Ferrell would be ok at 6 too - in this case I'm trusting them.

Other than the 2 qb's, Oliver or Sweat or maybe Ferrell - and ofc Bosa,QWIll and Allen- if they pass on these guys at 6 --

or take Lock or Jones at 17 -- I think they blundered.
I will argue against myself  
idiotsavant : 3/22/2019 8:47 am : link
On the one hand:

Allen, Bush, + (Laurence or Tillery)

does seem like a much improved team for next season.

There is a possibility that both Q and Oliver are the rare blue goose types, the "barkely touched by the ..." types.

If so....that's a thing that sets your team apart, having both.
So  
idiotsavant : 3/22/2019 8:54 am : link
Hill, Tillery, Thomlinson

Allen,Bush,Ogletree,Carter



Or line up one LB on the TE:



Allen, Hill, Tillery, Tomlinson

Carter, Pepper's.. .....Bush

Gives you a ton of options regarding who covers whom who rushes

Or  
idiotsavant : 3/22/2019 9:08 am : link
(Wynn as olb rover),Oliver,QWill, Hill

.... Tre Lamar, Ogletree, Carter
RE: So  
giantstock : 3/22/2019 11:27 am : link
In comment 14352649 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
Hill, Tillery, Thomlinson

Allen,Bush,Ogletree,Carter



Or line up one LB on the TE:



Allen, Hill, Tillery, Tomlinson

Carter, Pepper's.. .....Bush

Gives you a ton of options regarding who covers whom who rushes


I prefer this--

6-- Oliver
17 and 37 then go offense take a RT and Center
96-- Take the linebacker Joe Giles Harris

Now I have a front 7 of
Hill, Tomlinson, and Oliver
Golden, Harris, Ogeltree, Carter

ANd in the same breath I got QUALITY OL for Barkley and at worst a OL ready and ABLE in 2020 for the rookie QB. Even if one or two OL fail you can get one in FA and live with 4 out of 5 pretty good OLINEMEN.
I like it BUT  
idiotsavant : 3/22/2019 11:31 am : link
Your value the way the market breaks down may be significantly greater at DT and LB at 17,37 than the OL value players present.

Just a hunch ;-)
Or reverse that  
idiotsavant : 3/22/2019 11:41 am : link
LB value at 17 DT value at 37 > than OL value at those same spots.

Whereas with 5,5,5,6,7 you can find excellent center prospects and maybe even a tackle. If you draft 5 and sort out the two during year 1, practice, pte season

Especially if you look for 3 center conversion prospects in the 310-330 lb range each
RE: Or reverse that  
giantstock : 3/22/2019 11:58 am : link
In comment 14352893 idiotsavant said:
Quote:
LB value at 17 DT value at 37 > than OL value at those same spots.

Whereas with 5,5,5,6,7 you can find excellent center prospects and maybe even a tackle. If you draft 5 and sort out the two during year 1, practice, pte season

Especially if you look for 3 center conversion prospects in the 310-330 lb range each


The price for OLINE got insane this year. That's why I pushed back the ILB in rd 3. But I do love Bush. He would be fine get.
RE: Oliver at 6  
Pan-handler : 3/22/2019 12:22 pm : link
In comment 14352514 giantstock said:
Quote:
If you pass on the 2 QB's of Haskins and Murray. I can see Sweat. But Greedy Williams and Lock at 6? No way in hell.

The OP is a good guy -- good gentlemen and great poster on here but he's all wet on Greedy. And just as crazy - Lock.

Both guys shouldn't sniff a 6th pick. And Lock shouldn't be our 17th pick either.


Hey buddy. Yes I do like Andraez. Think he has that shutdown corner ability few CBs have once every 5 years or so. And Bettchers D needs cover CBs to blitz like he wants to.

Lock though I like but bust potential is higher than Haskins or Murray who I like more. Lock at 6? Not if Haskins is on the board. At 17 it would be more palatable. The guy I dont want is Jones.
JonC and now Vacchiano  
Pan-handler : 3/22/2019 12:26 pm : link
Are bringing up Gary.

He fits their prototype for sure. They like the 270 pound plus guys who have some more size to them.

Man I hope if they pick him they are right about him because I'd take Sweat over him 10 times out of 10. So little production from a pass rush standpoint for a guy with that type of talent.

It does greatly seem to be either pass rush or QB at 6.
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