At #6:
Haskins
-Both DG and PS as opposed to last year have spoke openly about WANTING to add a young Qb to learn under Eli for a year. Giants generally don't do the smokescreen stuff.
-The visible excitement/ 'love-fest' at the pro-day.
-Multiple meeting with Haskins between combine and now and coming away with comments of very impressed with mannerisms and his football IQ.
-Fits personality profile of what Giants generally like in QB. Size, strong arm for Meadowland weather/winds, lunch pail work hard kind of guy not overly-outspoken.
Rashan Gary
-JonC and others have reported on this
-Of all DL he fits the Rush End prototype the best. Big bodied, long reach, strong, good measurables
-However lack of production is certainly concerning
Montez Sweat
-Alot of interest shown at Senior Bowl where he was arguably defensive MVP ragdolling OL in drills and winning matchups with one of the best in Dillard.
-Blew up Combine: 4.4 40 almost unheard of of a guy that size
-Closely fits their prototype for size/build (but not as well as Gary) . Height and arm length excellent but a touch on the light side. NYG usually like 270 and above. But he is extremely strong and it shows up on tape.
At #17:
Cody Ford
-Multiple reports on our interest and thorough scouting done on him
-Fits DGs Hog Molly prototype almost to a T. Huge Lower half and above average footwork for a man that size
Jaylon Ferguson
- Fits the size/build prototype they love (6'5 ,270) and could be available at 17
-Multiple reports of being interviewed by scouts and others in the NYG organization
-NCAA all time sack leader
-Triangle numbers not good but wins with amazing handwork, momentum based leverage, and great motor.
Greedy Williams
-Almost nothing on him. He is only listed since cover CB is such a great need in Bettcher's system that calls for pressure from all levels. Would be tremendous value here at 17 if he drops that far.
Other ER/OT:
Burns-could be there at 17
Dillard-doubtful at 17
Risner- likely there at 17 possible at 37
Good point though JT did say Gaints really like him but not at #6.
Right now, my tentative conclusions are:
#6: Haskins.
#17: Ferguson.
I would pass on Haskins at #6, probably for Sweat, but as you note, he has a somewhat lanky body type that may not fit what the Giants are seeking for their DL. Ferguson has a thicker frame. Sweat's heart condition may also be disqualifying. I would also explore a trade down to get extra picks in 2020. I assume that Allen, Bosa, and Q. Williams are gone.
Right now, my tentative conclusions are:
#6: Haskins.
#17: Ferguson.
I would pass on Haskins at #6, probably for Sweat, but as you note, he has a somewhat lanky body type that may not fit what the Giants are seeking for their DL. Ferguson has a thicker frame. Sweat's heart condition may also be disqualifying. I would also explore a trade down to get extra picks in 2020. I assume that Allen, Bosa, and Q. Williams are gone.
Absolutely. This assumes Allen,Bosa and Q.Will are gone.
I totally agree with your guesstimate, though I do think if Burns reaches #17 he may be a consideration as well.
The fascinating thing and we see this almost EVERY year is a surprise Qb sneaking up in the top 5. Murray almost a given to go #1 at this point, but imagine if some of the reports about Lock are true (Oakland loves him or some other team wants to trade up for him). What that causes is one of Q.Will,Bosa, Allen OR Haskins having to make our pick at 6.
If all 3 Qbs go in the top 5 (crazy scenario but Qbs are always overdrafted) then we get a blue-chip pass-rusher.
Value at 17 would be very high and the need on the team is extremely high. Like the year we took Prince Amukamara, surprised he made it to our pick.
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When the Giants have shown zero interest?
Value at 17 would be very high and the need on the team is extremely high. Like the year we took Prince Amukamara, surprised he made it to our pick.
Ok, but he doesn’t fit the criteria of your thread. You wanting Greedy doesn’t mean the Giants have interest in Greedy.
...faced by Ferguson?
If all goes well we end up with:
Gary, Haskins, and OL at 37
...faced by Ferguson?
Kalil Mack, JPP...it happens all the time.
Has he shown traits that translate? He does. The biggest scare for me, is the stiffish hips. But he makes up for it with other stuff.
I also don't believe Sweat is a great bender, so even without the flag I would still have others higher than him at #6. Sweat is more of a consideration at #17 because he could legitimately drop.
Because KL is the only true data point we know that DG/PS like in a QB...
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When the Giants have shown zero interest?
Value at 17 would be very high and the need on the team is extremely high. Like the year we took Prince Amukamara, surprised he made it to our pick.
Would be very surprised with him being there pick at 17. He’s fallen since the post season began. Don’t think he’s the gamble we make at 17. CB is strong in 2/3.
The whole group went to his pro day, took him to dinner etc.
I am not 100% that Murray goes to Arizona.
Worse than taking Gary at 6 and Greedy or Ferguson at 17 is using a pick on a QB at 17 if it is't Murray or Haskins.
Not a fan of Gary either but he very much checks the top boxes on the Giants list. Think its going to be Haskins though with ER at 17 then OT at 37 (or with slight trade up).
I get he is a great potential 2 way at TE but With the list of needs we have, TE is pretty low on the list.
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Defense @ 6, Sweat or Gary then either QB or OL at 17 and 37
Worse than taking Gary at 6 and Greedy or Ferguson at 17 is using a pick on a QB at 17 if it is't Murray or Haskins.
I would agree with this of it is anyone outside of Haskins, Murray or Lock. Lock though inconsistent and slightly higher bust potential than Haskins or Murray, has tremendous upside.
Thanks for the clarification Jon. As you have probably surmised he fits our prototype pretty darn well. He checks alot of boxes that they tend to go for when it comes to DE. Nowhere near Chubb though IMO (whom they really liked last year and had the production to match.)
Carter was taken in round 3. When the Giants are selecting that high the criteria is a lot stricter. Which is why they arent likely to take White at 6 either.
Up that high its either a generational talent type, franchise level QB, total shutdown CB, Franchise level LT, or Amazing Edge rusher with double digit sack ability (with priority placed on size/speed and ability to play DE or DT at a premium).
I like Haskins, but he won't do half as well as Eli behind this line. Eli might be able to start for a couple more years so I am not in the camp that says we must absolutely bring in a younger QB immediately. I would like to get the best players we can regardless of position, for the most part. If we can draft a QB that we like who presents good value where we decide to draft him then we should pull the trigger IF we know that he has a shot to beat out our current #3 OR if our current #3 might be ready to be the #2QB.
Which leads me back to the O-line. I am hoping that we can move down tow the 10 through 14 range and acquire some more day two picks or even future picks. I then would like to draft some combination of our favorite Offensive Linemen. Even if some were looked at as future starters we need to bring in talent. Hopefully we'd at least be getting a day one starter at RT.
I would love to draft Jawaan Taylor and Cody Ford in the first and let them compete for RT. I would trade up from pick #37 to grab Garrett Bradbury at Center. I would also draft a good Left Tackle prospect, like Isaiah Prince or Martez Ivey, on day three; that could be groomed and he could compete with Wheeler to be the backup LT. Solder and Zeitler are good players, but their age & their contracts will force us to have other players available who can step in at some point.
Sweat is also bigger and more accomplished in the pass rush department accentuated by an amazing Senior Bowl vs top OL.
No problem with Sweat there but is he big enough for what they look for that high in the draft.
I like Haskins, but he won't do half as well as Eli behind this line. Eli might be able to start for a couple more years so I am not in the camp that says we must absolutely bring in a younger QB immediately. I would like to get the best players we can regardless of position, for the most part. If we can draft a QB that we like who presents good value where we decide to draft him then we should pull the trigger IF we know that he has a shot to beat out our current #3 OR if our current #3 might be ready to be the #2QB.
Which leads me back to the O-line. I am hoping that we can move down tow the 10 through 14 range and acquire some more day two picks or even future picks. I then would like to draft some combination of our favorite Offensive Linemen. Even if some were looked at as future starters we need to bring in talent. Hopefully we'd at least be getting a day one starter at RT.
I would love to draft Jawaan Taylor and Cody Ford in the first and let them compete for RT. I would trade up from pick #37 to grab Garrett Bradbury at Center. I would also draft a good Left Tackle prospect, like Isaiah Prince or Martez Ivey, on day three; that could be groomed and he could compete with Wheeler to be the backup LT. Solder and Zeitler are good players, but their age & their contracts will force us to have other players available who can step in at some point.
The OL is closer than you give it credit for with the addition of Zietler.
We arent going to have an above avg to great player at every position on the OL nor do we need to. But we have one at 3 of the 5 already. If we shore up OT (in this deep OT draft) at 17 or 37 we will be in very, very good shape.
You seem to be enamourd with greedy you mention him often. he just doesn't look that impressive to me. Another guy I'd focus on in Round 2.
I want to rebuild the offense first and since this is a decent draft for defense there should be good quality available on day three.
I believe that the defense will be better already as it stands going into this year as opposed to last for several reasons.
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Nor am I fan of 17th pick taking Ferguson or taking Greedy.
Not a fan of Gary either but he very much checks the top boxes on the Giants list. Think its going to be Haskins though with ER at 17 then OT at 37 (or with slight trade up).
What "boxes?" Have they come out and said "these are our priorities?"
We need more actual plans...
I like Haskins, but he won't do half as well as Eli behind this line. Eli might be able to start for a couple more years so I am not in the camp that says we must absolutely bring in a younger QB immediately. I would like to get the best players we can regardless of position, for the most part. If we can draft a QB that we like who presents good value where we decide to draft him then we should pull the trigger IF we know that he has a shot to beat out our current #3 OR if our current #3 might be ready to be the #2QB.
Which leads me back to the O-line. I am hoping that we can move down tow the 10 through 14 range and acquire some more day two picks or even future picks. I then would like to draft some combination of our favorite Offensive Linemen. Even if some were looked at as future starters we need to bring in talent. Hopefully we'd at least be getting a day one starter at RT.
I would love to draft Jawaan Taylor and Cody Ford in the first and let them compete for RT. I would trade up from pick #37 to grab Garrett Bradbury at Center. I would also draft a good Left Tackle prospect, like Isaiah Prince or Martez Ivey, on day three; that could be groomed and he could compete with Wheeler to be the backup LT. Solder and Zeitler are good players, but their age & their contracts will force us to have other players available who can step in at some point.
If no QB with 6th pick take either Risner or Ford with 17th pick and take best center available with 2nd rd pick.
With the 6th pick take best pass rusher or trade down and still get a pass rusher along with another pick at some point.
I do think OLINe needs to be addressed but not wiht more than 2 or 3picks through 1st 6 rounds.
We need more actual plans...
Find a competent Right Tackle. IF IF IF he can eventually go to LT at some point great but do NOT bypass a good rt with A more boom or bust Tackle because he has more "upside" to eventually move to LT.
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Jonah Williams, Jawaan Taylor, Cody Ford, Greg Little, Dalton Risner, Yodny Cajuste; but apparently not Andre Dillard. Washington State's Pro Day is on April 3rd.
Correction: Giantswire shows an "Informal Meeting" with Dillard. Not sure what that means. No tux? No jewlz?
burger king...
You seem to be enamourd with greedy you mention him often. he just doesn't look that impressive to me. Another guy I'd focus on in Round 2.
Yea I see that rare blanket coverage ability. Mirrors routes effortlessly and against guys that will be playing on Sunday's.
Really , really like him. Just dont know about the character stuff.
On Jaylon , Giants have been sniffing around him almost more than any other player. They have done a TON of work on him. I think they want a 270 lb plus rush player they can move around and right or worng I think they have zeroed in on him because they are going with the QB at 6.
Love Dillard but have a feeling DG wants a mauler for RT with Barkley.