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Should some games be 58 minutes?

BestFeature : 3/24/2019 5:34 pm
Because that's what you get when you allow 3 kneel downs to end a game. I don't like radical changes to rules but there seems that an argument could be made against kneel downs to end a game. I feel like there could be a rule that still makes timeouts on defense critical but not a guaranteed loss if you have none with 2 minutes remaining. Something that promotes running on offense in that situation. So victory is all but certain but a fumble can still happen.

Thoughts?
You are thinking  
section125 : 3/24/2019 5:36 pm : link
too much.

No
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 3/24/2019 5:36 pm : link
No Giants fan who lived through 1978 would EVER make this proposal.
Someone kicked around the idea of a rule change  
81_Great_Dane : 3/24/2019 5:39 pm : link
so there's an automatic time out if the offense doesn't try to advance the ball.

I don't think it's the most pressing problem that needs to be solved. There's a much bigger problem with replay slowing down the game and sapping excitement from the fan/viewer experience -- often at what should be the most exciting, pivotal moments. Also: What's a catch? What's a legal hit, and what's an illegal hit? What's pass interference?

Kneel-downs aren't on the same level as those issues.

RE: ...  
BestFeature : 3/24/2019 5:49 pm : link
In comment 14355303 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
No Giants fan who lived through 1978 would EVER make this proposal.


Funny I saw a thing on the NFL Network on that play and that's why it got me thinking this. Look, I'm very conservative when it comes to rule changes and I cringe over the extra point moving and becoming more than a mere formality. But philosophically I think it was a sound decision and that's how I see this.

Now I don't know how to change the rule, maybe not allow a play of non-positive yardage in the final 2 minutes. But that would have the unintended consequences of legit negative plays in the last 2 minutes having a outsized impact on the game. Also what would the penalty be? Loss of yardage won't matter at that point. So it would be tough to implement.
what I have said forever  
giantfan2000 : 3/24/2019 5:49 pm : link
NFL should make victory formation ILLEGAL
NFL is only sport where a 1 point game with 2 minutes left
is over

it makes the game so boring



RE: what I have said forever  
mrvax : 3/24/2019 5:57 pm : link
In comment 14355315 giantfan2000 said:
Quote:
NFL should make victory formation ILLEGAL
NFL is only sport where a 1 point game with 2 minutes left
is over

it makes the game so boring




I dunno. Seems like a strategical offensive move to me. The winning team has played to get the game to that position of having a win assured.
I don’t think this is a big problem. Once the defense uses up its  
Ivan15 : 3/24/2019 5:59 pm : link
timeouts, there are no damn commercials to drag it out.
Opposing teams do their best work  
Jimmy Googs : 3/24/2019 6:01 pm : link
against NYG in the last 2 minutes...
Not your BestFeature  
MM_in_NYC : 3/24/2019 8:53 pm : link
We need to stop making rule changes to this game...
.  
arcarsenal : 3/24/2019 9:28 pm : link
You really can't implement something like this and have it work.

All the offense would do is hand the ball off and the RB would just fall down and give himself up. There's no way you could penalize an offense for losing yards at the end of a game like that.

Given the nature of the sport, etc. I feel like if you're in a position to go with the victory formation, you've earned it.
You would need a major rule change  
Eli Wilson : 3/24/2019 9:44 pm : link
Something like changing the play clock inside two minutes to 25-30 seconds with the penalty being loss of down. I think the CFL has something like that.

I don't see it happening though.
RE: .  
markky : 3/24/2019 9:44 pm : link
In comment 14355579 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
You really can't implement something like this and have it work.

All the offense would do is hand the ball off and the RB would just fall down and give himself up. There's no way you could penalize an offense for losing yards at the end of a game like that.

Given the nature of the sport, etc. I feel like if you're in a position to go with the victory formation, you've earned it.


I'm not proposing this, but it would be pretty radical if the clock automatically stopped within the 2 minute warning if the offense failed to advance the ball. so if it's a sack or any other TFL the clock would automatically stop. This would prevent the running back just giving himself up and you wouldn't have to outlaw the victory formation.

It would certainly make the end of games much more wild. The offense would be force to continue to play.
RE: RE: .  
arcarsenal : 3/24/2019 10:03 pm : link
In comment 14355594 markky said:
Quote:
In comment 14355579 arcarsenal said:


Quote:


You really can't implement something like this and have it work.

All the offense would do is hand the ball off and the RB would just fall down and give himself up. There's no way you could penalize an offense for losing yards at the end of a game like that.

Given the nature of the sport, etc. I feel like if you're in a position to go with the victory formation, you've earned it.



I'm not proposing this, but it would be pretty radical if the clock automatically stopped within the 2 minute warning if the offense failed to advance the ball. so if it's a sack or any other TFL the clock would automatically stop. This would prevent the running back just giving himself up and you wouldn't have to outlaw the victory formation.

It would certainly make the end of games much more wild. The offense would be force to continue to play.


I think the problem would lie within the player safety aspect of things.

Hypothetically, if they were to enforce something like this, the logical thing to do would be to have the QB just sneak the ball and advance it - even if it's a few inches just to keep the clock running.

But you'd have defensive lines doing what Schiano had the Bucs do to us in 2012 and have all of them diving at legs, trying to push the play backwards, etc.

It would probably only take one high-profile guy getting hurt in a situation like that for the players union to want that out of the game.

There have been way worse proposals - I just think it's too radical and would never happen.
It’s the last rule change  
Big Blue '56 : 3/25/2019 7:07 am : link
I would ever want to see. If you’re going to do something like that ELIMINATE spiking the ball to stop the clock. The NFL did quite well before implementation
give me kneel downs  
giants#1 : 3/25/2019 7:19 am : link
over the NBA's hackfest in the final 2 minutes. Watching pros shoot FTs isn't exactly exciting.

Kneel downs are the least of the NFL's concerns. I'd much rather try something radical with regards to the on-sides kick (e.g. the 4th and 12 scenario). And they can certainly speed up and improve the replay system. Why does the ref on the field need to be involved in the decision? That alone probably doubles the length of reviews.
What about...  
BamaBlue : 3/25/2019 7:46 am : link
after the 2:00 warning the clock stops after each play. The strategy then becomes ball control and not just running out the clock.
What's wrong with the kneel down?  
oghwga : 3/25/2019 8:16 am : link
It's not boring, it's the victorious end of the game. It's the "sit there and watch me sack your house and take your belongings while I have my foot on your neck" ending the winning team has earned.
Stupid to change it the winning team earned the chance to get to that spot.
Not a safety issue unless the other coach is that jagoff sciano
Look..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 3/25/2019 8:19 am : link
if it isn't a victory formation, then there will still be ways to run the clock out. Have the QB sneak for a 6" gain.

It is simple - you have 60 minutes to win the game. If you use your timeouts or can't stop the other team, then you deserve the ending the way it is.

What's next, forcing teams to shoot the ball with 5 on the shot clock because it gets too boring when they take up the entire thing?
No reason to change the rule ...  
Beer Man : 3/25/2019 8:28 am : link
It doesn't matter from a fan perspective. At kneel down time most fans are heading for the exits or changing the channel.
I hate when the game ends  
PEEJ : 3/25/2019 8:34 am : link
and players go on the field only to have to turn around and clear the field so that the offense can run one more play.
Teams trailing by two scores with less than 30 seconds on the clock should be allowed to "waive" the final 30 seconds and go to the locker room
Why?  
rsjem1979 : 3/25/2019 9:01 am : link
The team leading the game has forced their opponent to exhaust their allotment of timeouts and has EARNED possession of the ball with less than two minutes left - so let's change the rules to penalize them and force them to run plays they don't need to run?

No.
RE: what I have said forever  
Gatorade Dunk : 3/25/2019 10:56 am : link
In comment 14355315 giantfan2000 said:
Quote:
NFL should make victory formation ILLEGAL
NFL is only sport where a 1 point game with 2 minutes left
is over

it makes the game so boring



I don't have a problem with victory formation. Don't like it? Don't burn your timeouts earlier in the half (how many times do we see teams use a timeout when the delay of game penalty represents relatively low leverage?).

If we're going to talk about rule changes regarding clock management at the end of games, how about calling intentional grounding when a QB spikes the ball?
I have a better idea  
gidiefor : Mod : 3/25/2019 12:41 pm : link
end every game the moment the Giants pull ahead
RE: Look..  
giants#1 : 3/25/2019 12:44 pm : link
In comment 14355748 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
if it isn't a victory formation, then there will still be ways to run the clock out. Have the QB sneak for a 6" gain.

It is simple - you have 60 minutes to win the game. If you use your timeouts or can't stop the other team, then you deserve the ending the way it is.

What's next, forcing teams to shoot the ball with 5 on the shot clock because it gets too boring when they take up the entire thing?


That's the problem in a nutshell. If they did want to eliminate the kneel down for some dumb reason, it would just lead to more QB sneaks and with jacka$$es like Greg Williams still in the game, you'd be increasing the injury risk. And QBs, the most protected players, would face the brunt of that increased risk (guys diving over piles, etc).
RE: What about...  
BestFeature : 3/25/2019 12:48 pm : link
In comment 14355733 BamaBlue said:
Quote:
after the 2:00 warning the clock stops after each play. The strategy then becomes ball control and not just running out the clock.


Would it then stop if a team is driving to tie the game or go ahead?
RE: RE: What about...  
BamaBlue : 3/25/2019 1:08 pm : link
In comment 14356124 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 14355733 BamaBlue said:

Quote:
after the 2:00 warning the clock stops after each play. The strategy then becomes ball control and not just running out the clock.


Would it then stop if a team is driving to tie the game or go ahead?


The clock stoppage after each play would have the same results as an incomplete pass. The game clock stops and the play clock would time the start for the next play to be run. This would be great for close games... it would be horrible for blow-outs.
Does the defense really have  
Bubba : 3/25/2019 1:12 pm : link
to just sit there and take it? Schiano did not seem to think so.
With all due respect  
pjcas18 : 3/25/2019 1:14 pm : link
this is one of the worst ideas ever.
RE: With all due respect  
BamaBlue : 3/25/2019 1:36 pm : link
In comment 14356188 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
this is one of the worst ideas ever.


Some days you're the bug... some days you're the windshield.
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