Take this for whatever it's worth.
1) Remmers has agreed to terms with the Giants. He cannot pass a physical. Once he can he's signing a 2 yr deal with the Giants. They anticipate he'll be healthy by early May.
2) The giants are interested in Rosen but will not part with one of their top 3 picks. I was told they would offer this years 3 and a future conditional 3. The biggest fear with the Giants is acquiring Rosen is an immediate QB controversy. It would start in OTA's both in the media and locker room. Conversely, a guy like Jones or lock the fans and media will understand needs time to sit.
3) The Giants are going defense with their first pick. Williams will be the pick if he falls (same with allen or bosa) If he's gone the Giants like, in order, White, Burns, Gary.
4) The Giants love Greedy Williams and will take him at 17 if he's on the board.
5) Some free agents they're in contract with. Shane Ray, Mohammad Wilkerson and Danny Shelton. Nothing will happen before the draft.
6) If the giants go offense in the first two rounds it will be a big body WR or a QB. With remmers in the fold the giants will wait til rounds 3 and 4 to bolster their depth.
Flame away
"We like Fromm a lot but he's only 6'2 and we have a requirement where our QB's must be at least 6'3."
2-- I provided you a quote in which he said it. WHy swear at me and get your panties all riled up? You misquoted him. Big deal. Get over it. There's many posts - you just missed that one.
He said the GMEn would be concerned that there may be a controversy-- or implied it-- didn't he?
I'm OK with signing Remmers, as long as the numbers are good. Then use #95 and a day three pick on the line. I like Bobby Evans.
As others have said, not trading for Rosen because it would create a controversy is just silly. But the proof that the Giants don't really like Rosen and won't therefore trade for him is that they are only will to trade #95 and a conditional three next year instead of #37. If they thought he was their next franchise QB they would trade #37 right now.
Management has probably overrated how much Eli has left based on the last few games of season. Eli's arm is still very good, but he is completely immobile, and is clearly shell shocked from all the beatings he's taken behind subpar OL. He pretty much needs a perfect environment in which to thrive. His ability to extend plays when the pocket collapses is gone.
Burns at #6 is a massive overreach. He's likely to be available at #17. I also don't want White or Gary at #6, or Williams at #17.
+1
silly. Why play football at all then?
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as a Physician Assistant and treating Post Concussion Syndrome, I get the concern. I have already made it clear to my son that he is not to play high school football. Everyone is different though, I have can't 100% his father will tell him to quit. On top of that, Rosen comes from a wealthy family and money would not be a major motivating factor. I get why the Giants would not burn a 1st or 2nd rounder on him. It's risk management. You have to ask why he went lower than expected last year in the draft, given the talent he is.
silly. Why play football at all then?
Silly? Take one more hit and see if it is silly. I deal with these folks every day. How would you like to feel photophobia, lack of concentration and focus, chronic headaches, depression, and convergence insufficiency (can't track well with eyes, causing you to see double and experiencing vertigo) on a daily basis? He and the team that invest in him are taking a risk. No one knows, if his father has influence in his decision to stop playing, but his influence maybe present if the opportunity presents.
I actually find it refreshing how all over the place it is (and like you hopeful), and also hilarious how many dummies just keep bashing the FO over stupid speculation... lol. It really is comical how many fans think they know exactly what's going on and that they somehow know more what is the "correct plan". LOL
A little surprised that Sweat is not in the mix at 6. Freakish athlete who looks like he could have a big upside.
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In comment 14366314 Dnew15 said:
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In comment 14366310 Zeke's Alibi said:
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and the offensive line was the worst run blocking unit in the league so when there offense would put up points they couldn't protect a lead.
AND their QB play sucked.
It sucked in the first half of the season and got much better starting when Jameis came back in against us. They is more attributable to Jameis getting suspended and the bullshit that when on with that than what is being alluded to, competition at the QB position.
Yeah and then they went back to Ryan Fitz after Jameis wasn't sucking and the players wanted Fitz. Then they went back to Jameis when Fitz sucked also. It was a mess.
Jameis wasn't sucking? He was terrible when he came back from suspension and Fitz was playing decent so they went back with him. I don't know if you are misremembering or intentionally making it up. I'm very familiar with the Bucs I live in the market.
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In comment 14366534 DonnieD89 said:
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as a Physician Assistant and treating Post Concussion Syndrome, I get the concern. I have already made it clear to my son that he is not to play high school football. Everyone is different though, I have can't 100% his father will tell him to quit. On top of that, Rosen comes from a wealthy family and money would not be a major motivating factor. I get why the Giants would not burn a 1st or 2nd rounder on him. It's risk management. You have to ask why he went lower than expected last year in the draft, given the talent he is.
silly. Why play football at all then?
Silly? Take one more hit and see if it is silly. I deal with these folks every day. How would you like to feel photophobia, lack of concentration and focus, chronic headaches, depression, and convergence insufficiency (can't track well with eyes, causing you to see double and experiencing vertigo) on a daily basis? He and the team that invest in him are taking a risk. No one knows, if his father has influence in his decision to stop playing, but his influence maybe present if the opportunity presents.
wow-- talk about avoiding the question?
WHy bother to play if he has your concerns?
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In comment 14366544 giantstock said:
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In comment 14366534 DonnieD89 said:
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as a Physician Assistant and treating Post Concussion Syndrome, I get the concern. I have already made it clear to my son that he is not to play high school football. Everyone is different though, I have can't 100% his father will tell him to quit. On top of that, Rosen comes from a wealthy family and money would not be a major motivating factor. I get why the Giants would not burn a 1st or 2nd rounder on him. It's risk management. You have to ask why he went lower than expected last year in the draft, given the talent he is.
silly. Why play football at all then?
Silly? Take one more hit and see if it is silly. I deal with these folks every day. How would you like to feel photophobia, lack of concentration and focus, chronic headaches, depression, and convergence insufficiency (can't track well with eyes, causing you to see double and experiencing vertigo) on a daily basis? He and the team that invest in him are taking a risk. No one knows, if his father has influence in his decision to stop playing, but his influence maybe present if the opportunity presents.
wow-- talk about avoiding the question?
WHy bother to play if he has your concerns?
“I think it was a mix of both. He’s definitely talented and, from a quarterbacking standpoint, he can do everything you need him to. He was hindered by the lack of weapons around him, the lack of protection he had. But when he started to get hit, you’d question his overall toughness. He started to look at the rush, you could tell he didn’t want to be hit anymore. ... You definitely saw the good, in why they drafted him. No one questions the physical ability. It’s the mental part of it. He processes and learns it well, but people keep questioning toughness and leadership.”
Article - Ten Takeaways #8 - ( New Window )
If the Giants make any decisions that compromises the future for the short term belief that they can win now, that almost makes me resent Eli, and that has not happened up to now.
Three possibilities I me arned of today, here and on the radio.
1. Giants main concern with Rosen is that there could be a quarterback
Controversy
2. They like Lock but won’t consider moving up from 17 to get him if they
Go defense at 6, because the lost draft capital compromises a win
Now philosophy
3. Most likely quarterback scenerio is Jones at 17 because it eliminates
A lot of pressure of having a quarterback controversy, and also Eli
would be very comfortable with him. (Radio)
If there is a smidgen of truth in any of these, well that would stink
If the Giants make any decisions that compromises the future for the short term belief that they can win now, that almost makes me resent Eli, and that has not happened up to now.
Yeah, the org is not doing Eli's legacy any favors here.
But maybe it will all work out....who knows
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place: Haskins, Jones, now Lock. I'm hoping that other teams don't know what we want to do. It would be nice, for a change, if a team doesn't trade up in front of us for our target player.
I actually find it refreshing how all over the place it is (and like you hopeful), and also hilarious how many dummies just keep bashing the FO over stupid speculation... lol. It really is comical how many fans think they know exactly what's going on and that they somehow know more what is the "correct plan". LOL
Its fascinating because the Giants are going against the grain and trying to win by building around a tremendous RB.
A RB can have limited time or go on for 10 years. Are we destined to have a Barry Sanders that wins nothing? Or maybe we can be more like the Emmit SMith Cowboys?
DO you look ot build a prolific OLINE and see what SB can do with that? Or build a supreme defense and try to win lower scoring games?
If you get a "very good" your offense will always be dangerous. But if you get a mediocre or worse QB then it might be just as exciting if you build a supreme defense.
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Stupid. When his father had an actual say in what his son did, he was unable to stop him from playing football. Now that his is a professional and no longer needs the family money forget about his father's ability to control anything his son does.
Huh???????????? What does this have to do with my question? Or are you replying to the other guy?
The point - besides the one on top of your head - is that the new asshat said that the Giants were interested in Rosen, but only if the price was right (the two 3rd round picks). jtgiants has said repeatedly that the Giants aren't interested in him at any price for the reasons he gave.
In general I tend to take everything with a grain of salt even when I trust the source. And especially on April 1.
if our owners and GM and HC won't bring in a good young QB because they are afraid of controversy then this franchise is doomed due to inept management
Fans are already booing Eli because an unpicked QB isn't getting game time experience, and the season hasn't started yet.
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In comment 14365989 jtgiants said:
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Is lock. The problem is they won't take him at 6 and he probably won't be there at 17. They don't want to trade back up so making it work isn't easy. They want to use there picks to help them win now
This is just as pathetic as not trading for Rosen to avoid a QB controversy. If they think Lock is a franchise QB but won't take him at 6 because they are trying to squeeze one more playoff contending season out of Eli then as others have said, these guys should not be running the Giants.
my sentiments exactly...
what has anybody seen from Eli in the last few years that would indicate he can lead the team back to the playoffs, Eli has shot his wad, its over, move on..
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In comment 14366009 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14365989 jtgiants said:
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Is lock. The problem is they won't take him at 6 and he probably won't be there at 17. They don't want to trade back up so making it work isn't easy. They want to use there picks to help them win now
This is just as pathetic as not trading for Rosen to avoid a QB controversy. If they think Lock is a franchise QB but won't take him at 6 because they are trying to squeeze one more playoff contending season out of Eli then as others have said, these guys should not be running the Giants.
my sentiments exactly...
what has anybody seen from Eli in the last few years that would indicate he can lead the team back to the playoffs, Eli has shot his wad, its over, move on..
when he, like, played pretty darn well in the playoffs?
The Mara's are so out of touch with the fan pulse that they think the McAdoo decision had to do with our undying love for Eli Manning. Wrong. It had to due with Geno Smith starting over Webb. Simple.
I'm tired of being held hostage!!!! Let's move the fuck on.
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In comment 14366356 Jimmy Googs said:
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In comment 14366009 NYG07 said:
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In comment 14365989 jtgiants said:
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Is lock. The problem is they won't take him at 6 and he probably won't be there at 17. They don't want to trade back up so making it work isn't easy. They want to use there picks to help them win now
This is just as pathetic as not trading for Rosen to avoid a QB controversy. If they think Lock is a franchise QB but won't take him at 6 because they are trying to squeeze one more playoff contending season out of Eli then as others have said, these guys should not be running the Giants.
my sentiments exactly...
what has anybody seen from Eli in the last few years that would indicate he can lead the team back to the playoffs, Eli has shot his wad, its over, move on..
when he, like, played pretty darn well in the playoffs?
That was two years ago, and that team consisted of Eli leading a bottom 5 offense in football and being dragged to the playoffs by a great defense.
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In comment 14366544 giantstock said:
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In comment 14366534 DonnieD89 said:
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as a Physician Assistant and treating Post Concussion Syndrome, I get the concern. I have already made it clear to my son that he is not to play high school football. Everyone is different though, I have can't 100% his father will tell him to quit. On top of that, Rosen comes from a wealthy family and money would not be a major motivating factor. I get why the Giants would not burn a 1st or 2nd rounder on him. It's risk management. You have to ask why he went lower than expected last year in the draft, given the talent he is.
silly. Why play football at all then?
Silly? Take one more hit and see if it is silly. I deal with these folks every day. How would you like to feel photophobia, lack of concentration and focus, chronic headaches, depression, and convergence insufficiency (can't track well with eyes, causing you to see double and experiencing vertigo) on a daily basis? He and the team that invest in him are taking a risk. No one knows, if his father has influence in his decision to stop playing, but his influence maybe present if the opportunity presents.
wow-- talk about avoiding the question?
WHy bother to play if he has your concerns?
I did answer the question. We don’t know what his fathers decision is whether to influence him or not; however, he is a big boy and is able to make his own decisions. You can’t dispute the fact and what the consequences maybe in the future. The Giants are not stupid and why invest in somebody who is a risk. It doesn’t matter what Rosen thinks if he chooses to play football. He is taking a risk. If he has another concussion, he may not be allowed to be back on the field for quite some time. The facts based on studies on concussions are out there. If he takes another hit, you do not know what’s going to happen? Hence, there comes a possible decision by the father after he suffers the symptoms which may be prolong after another hit. Mines do change after such incident. What part of my statement do you not understand? If you choose to ignore science-based evidence with concussions, then you might as well believe that the world is flat. Rosen is taking a chance being on the field with the possibility of another concussion. That’s his decision to take the risk. The Giants would be making a low risk decision if they only want to invest a third rounder. What is so silly about guarding against risk? It’s stupid to put out and burn the 1st to 2nd rounder given these risks.
And that will be 2 1/2 years in the past when he next takes the field.
Eli is an albatross around this franchise's neck at this point.
way of making football decisions?
But they are afraid of giving a 38 year old QB real
competition? Sounds great
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The point - besides the one on top of your head - is that the new asshat said that the Giants were interested in Rosen, but only if the price was right (the two 3rd round picks). jtgiants has said repeatedly that the Giants aren't interested in him at any price for the reasons he gave.
Agree on this point. You just have to remember with these things, many people discussing something with varying exchanges lends itself to interpretation. Things are not always explicit black/white and there is often more than one opinion within organization. A year ago word was there was no clear consensus about QBs. But this point about Eli starting as it relates to Rosen was referenced by both.
In general I tend to take everything with a grain of salt even when I trust the source. And especially on April 1.
The most important part there is that opinions will differ, even within the FO of an organization. At the end of the day there's only 1 person who is the ultimate decision maker. That's the reason why I appreciate the inside information, but also take it for what its worth.
way of making football decisions?
But they are afraid of giving a 38 year old QB real
competition? Sounds great
See Dawg’s Monday reading thread. He absolutely said so as early as 2000.
Last spring I said plenty of times I’d rather go 6-10 (or worse) with a rookie QB than doing so with Eli. I was a huge “pro QB” in the draft guy last year. We went 5-11 with Eli and no successor on the roster. It was a total waste of time. Unless they actually really like and select a QB among the dreck that is this QB crop, we’re probably looking at a similar experience in 2019. Another waste of time.
As far as GM's being stupid or not -- sure overall they can't be completely stupid but they are capable of making stupid decisions, right? Reese didn't address the OLINE and his draft picks over time didn;t pan out. He got fired. SO he made some "stupid decisions," right? Any GM can make stupid decisions, right? SO can DG.
SO in this case because they might pass on Rosen doesn't mean it exonerates them from making being capable of making stupid decisions.
I'd like to think I'm in Matt in SGS's "Eli realist" category, so from that POV I'd like to see them draft a fresh option in the first round and let that player start the year behind Eli and re-evaluate as they go through the season. All 4 seem more mobile than Rosen, which I view as the biggest negative against him, they also all have an extra year of control, and they all seem to have the right mentality. I like all of them over Herbert next year, in a similar general tier to Fromm, and behind Tua who will likely be out of reach anyway. Depending on how the draft board looks I'd most likely want to use the #6 pick on a blue chip defender and then package the #17 if necessary to move for the QB. Though, if 4 QB's go ahead of them in the top 16 there may be a 2nd blue chip player available and perhaps that changes the calculus re: Rosen if the price is reasonable.
Though I also think it's likely the Cards end up getting a first round pick from either the Pats or Chargers if their preferred targets from the draft don't reach them - and also probably what they're hoping for in holding him.
Rosen has a giant chip on his shoulder after he was the 4th QB taken. Can't believe all this talk about being replaced after one year is going to make that any better. He's definitely out to prove he can play. The question is can he?
Interesting stuff.....
Interesting stuff.....
Yup and that would mean less pressure to take a RT at #17.
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Love the Remmers info.....i wanted an experience RT....did not want to live through growing pains of a rookie to get up to speed with the NFL game.
Interesting stuff.....
Yup and that would mean less pressure to take a RT at #17.
Yes and free us to focus on starters for the D
There's no such thing as a "retirement deal".
Because the rational logical take does not fit into the agenda of the Anti-Eli crowd.
"Eli is to blame no matter what" and it's mind boggling to say the least
You're an idiot. IMO.
If Mara and Tisch cannot deal with personality, they should sell the team. Heck, they would probably have a problem with Aaron Rodgers! He has "personality."