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Vacchiano: Everything you need to know about Giants & Rosen

twostepgiants : 4/9/2019 8:35 pm
Ralph V does claim “several NFL and team sources” in citing this. That is significant to me. Multiple sources and from in and out of Giants.

The gist:

According to the article the Giants are interested in Rosen but at the right price. They will not move a 1st. They may part with a 2nd. That 2nd could be an additional 2nd IF they trade down in rd 1 or it could be their own IF the Cards add something. Or it could be a future 2nd.

Ralph’s summary:

“The bottom line is this: The Giants will be interested, but only if the price is right. And it seems unlikely they'd be willing to out-bid the Redskins if they're really interested. If they're not, maybe the Giants could package their third-round pick with a future second-rounder or something like that to get a deal done.

But that will depend on the Cardinals, who still have to put Rosen on the trading block first.”

Ralph V also insinuates Giants could trade up in round 1 as well.

Full article with a lot of more details linked below
Article - ( New Window )
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Every other day  
Nine-Tails : 4/9/2019 8:44 pm : link
It feels like one of the local beat, Ralph, Schwartz, Raanaan, write an article about Rosen. But there's been like no new information in a month. The Giants will have interest at a low cost but not look to trade any of their top 3 picks.
I guess I am confused  
Rjanyg : 4/9/2019 8:55 pm : link
If Rosen is considered a 1st round talent by NYG and he has a year of experience and will cost a fraction of what say Haskins or Lock would in round 1, what is the hold up to send pick 37 and a 5th to Arizona?

We have 12 picks, no future QB worth speaking of on the roster and 2 first round picks to add to the defense. It just makes way too much sense to not happen if we have the best offer.
The Giants  
blueblood : 4/9/2019 9:09 pm : link
could use all three of the first two picks on defense and it could be a very smart move. They could easily add two pass rushers and bolster the LB or Secondary. That #2 pick has a LOT of value for the defensive side of the ball where there is a serious lack of talent and depth.
Ralph V  
Jim Bur(n)t : 4/9/2019 9:09 pm : link
Knows as much as my neighbor, and he is a postman... oh wait..
Here is everything you need to know about it  
jlukes : 4/9/2019 9:11 pm : link

Giants didn't view Rosen as a Franchise QB or they would have drafted him at 2 last year.

Gettleman has talked about QB hell and he will not acquire a QB who he doesn't view as a Franchise QB

The End
RE: I guess I am confused  
eric2425ny : 4/9/2019 9:11 pm : link
In comment 14379794 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
If Rosen is considered a 1st round talent by NYG and he has a year of experience and will cost a fraction of what say Haskins or Lock would in round 1, what is the hold up to send pick 37 and a 5th to Arizona?

We have 12 picks, no future QB worth speaking of on the roster and 2 first round picks to add to the defense. It just makes way too much sense to not happen if we have the best offer.


It tells me they aren’t that excited about him as a prospect which backs up what jtgiants and other “asshats” have said repeatedly on here. They must be concerned about one or more of the following: his concussion history (especially given the fact that he really doesn’t need football to survive and his Dad is a neurosurgeon), the political comments which frankly I have seen none since his college days, or this stuff about him not being a leader, etc.

At the end of the day I’ll trust DG and company to make the right call on Rosen. I like the low risk high reward aspect of it, or at least I did, until I saw the supposed offer from the Redskins which I think is too much to give up.
RE: Here is everything you need to know about it  
arcarsenal : 4/9/2019 9:11 pm : link
In comment 14379811 jlukes said:
Quote:

Giants didn't view Rosen as a Franchise QB or they would have drafted him at 2 last year.

Gettleman has talked about QB hell and he will not acquire a QB who he doesn't view as a Franchise QB

The End


.... or maybe they just had Barkley graded higher.
RE: Ralph V  
eric2425ny : 4/9/2019 9:15 pm : link
In comment 14379806 Jim Bur(n)t said:
Quote:
Knows as much as my neighbor, and he is a postman... oh wait..


The pick at 6  
Joey in VA : 4/9/2019 9:15 pm : link
Will NOT be a QB and if they trade up, it's for Q if he slides. Repeat, they are NOT taking a QB at 6.
Seems to contradict basically everything jtgiants has said for a month  
The_Boss : 4/9/2019 9:23 pm : link
-
RE: I guess I am confused  
JohnB : 4/9/2019 9:23 pm : link
In comment 14379794 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
If Rosen is considered a 1st round talent by NYG


That's a big "if". Maybe they never put a 1st round grade on him. Maybe they still don't. Should they then part with a 1st round pick? Nope.
RE: Seems to contradict basically everything jtgiants has said for a month  
eric2425ny : 4/9/2019 9:26 pm : link
In comment 14379859 The_Boss said:
Quote:
-


Disagree, it sounds like they will only trade for him if it’s a great deal. Which means they likely won’t beat many offers.
RE: Here is everything you need to know about it  
Nomad Crow on the Madison : 4/9/2019 9:35 pm : link
In comment 14379811 jlukes said:
Quote:

Giants didn't view Rosen as a Franchise QB or they would have drafted him at 2 last year.

Gettleman has talked about QB hell and he will not acquire a QB who he doesn't view as a Franchise QB

The End


Where doe it say that DG does not think Rosen is a potential Franchise QB? Because he picked Saquon? That means that neither Darnold nor Rosen is a franchise QB? Your comment does not make sense.
I've  
AcidTest : 4/9/2019 9:46 pm : link
made it clear that I would trade #37, and maybe #17, for Rosen, but even I'm sick of this discussion.

The Giants are interested, but for a price that is likely far less than what some other team, probably the Redskins, will pay.
RE: RE: Here is everything you need to know about it  
GFAN52 : 4/9/2019 9:48 pm : link
In comment 14379815 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14379811 jlukes said:


Quote:



Giants didn't view Rosen as a Franchise QB or they would have drafted him at 2 last year.

Gettleman has talked about QB hell and he will not acquire a QB who he doesn't view as a Franchise QB

The End



.... or maybe they just had Barkley graded higher.


This^^
RE: RE: I guess I am confused  
Rjanyg : 4/9/2019 9:48 pm : link
In comment 14379861 JohnB said:
Quote:
In comment 14379794 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


If Rosen is considered a 1st round talent by NYG



That's a big "if". Maybe they never put a 1st round grade on him. Maybe they still don't. Should they then part with a 1st round pick? Nope.


There is no confirmation on what the Giants thought of Rosen last year other than they Liked Barkley better than him and every other QB.

That said, IF they thought he was at the very least a 1st round grade, to get him for a 2nd round pick without having to pay his signing bonus alone has got to be reason to believe they would have serious interest. Again, having 2 1st round picks this year to invest in our horrible defense with the possibility of adding a quality young QB seems like the optimal situation.
I think the move up is with 17  
George from PA : 4/9/2019 9:53 pm : link
To move ahead of Denver to draft Lock
The pick last year was *all* about Barkley. 100% Barkley  
Bill L : 4/9/2019 9:54 pm : link
BuT there were reports that Chubb was next in line, so tHe relative QB grades were at play. Further, people have noted that their top QB choice was Allen and then Darnold. So, at best their opinion of Rosen was less than other QB’s and could signify that they don’t value him as much as some here do.
But 2 first round picks to boost the defense  
Bill L : 4/9/2019 9:56 pm : link
And a second round pick to boost the defense again (or, even the OLine) is even better.
I don't have  
Joey in VA : 4/9/2019 9:56 pm : link
The "insider" tag, but Rosen is in play for the Giants, exactly as Ralph said. I trust my source absolutely and I don't hint at things or try to pump myself up as anything, but I was told that we are 100% NOT going QB at 6 and Rosen IS on the table but for the right price.
RE: I don't have  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/9/2019 10:01 pm : link
In comment 14379948 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
The "insider" tag, but Rosen is in play for the Giants, exactly as Ralph said. I trust my source absolutely and I don't hint at things or try to pump myself up as anything, but I was told that we are 100% NOT going QB at 6 and Rosen IS on the table but for the right price.


Good. Go defense @ 6.
I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Go Terps : 4/9/2019 10:04 pm : link
He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.
The Giants should first understand why AZ is dumping their 1st RD  
SterlingArcher : 4/9/2019 10:06 pm : link
pick from last year. What is wrong with this guy?
RE: I don't have  
Rjanyg : 4/9/2019 10:06 pm : link
In comment 14379948 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
The "insider" tag, but Rosen is in play for the Giants, exactly as Ralph said. I trust my source absolutely and I don't hint at things or try to pump myself up as anything, but I was told that we are 100% NOT going QB at 6 and Rosen IS on the table but for the right price.


Does your source include the compensation for Rosen?
RE: I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Joey in VA : 4/9/2019 10:08 pm : link
In comment 14379960 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.
Don't rule out Christian Wilkins at 6, he's a massive DL who can play at the 1, 3 or 5 and he'd run through a brick wall for any team he played for. Bradbury would be a home run at 17 for me personally, but IDK what DG is thinking.
RE: I think the move up is with 17  
twostepgiants : 4/9/2019 10:13 pm : link
In comment 14379940 George from PA said:
Quote:
To move ahead of Denver to draft Lock


An approx trade value to jump from 17 to 9 is the Giants 2nd round pick to move up. Look at this way its Josh Rosen (a trade with 37) & the 17 pick vs Drew Lock (the 17 pick + 37 pick to move up)
A perfect scenario  
Jay on the Island : 4/9/2019 10:16 pm : link
The Giants trade the 17th pick to NE for the 32nd pick and their 2nd and 3rd. The Giants then send the 37th pick and the 95th pick to Arizona for Rosen. The Giants would still have a 2nd and 3rd round pick to go along with the 6th and 32nd.
Sounds like he read all the other sources out there including BBI  
montanagiant : 4/9/2019 10:19 pm : link
And published their stuff
RE: The Giants should first understand why AZ is dumping their 1st RD  
GFAN52 : 4/9/2019 10:20 pm : link
In comment 14379963 SterlingArcher said:
Quote:
pick from last year. What is wrong with this guy?


You mean what is wrong with their GM who hired and fired his own choice as head coach after only one year.
RE: RE: I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Go Terps : 4/9/2019 10:21 pm : link
In comment 14379967 Joey in VA said:
Quote:
In comment 14379960 Go Terps said:


Quote:


He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.

Don't rule out Christian Wilkins at 6, he's a massive DL who can play at the 1, 3 or 5 and he'd run through a brick wall for any team he played for. Bradbury would be a home run at 17 for me personally, but IDK what DG is thinking.


I like Wilkins, and I'd be fine with that pick. I just really like Hockenson. The thought of him and Ellison in 12 personnel with Engram moved around...

I also think the opportunity might be there to cluster draft to the OL. I love the idea of using one draft to turn a weakness into a strength, like the Colts did last year with their OL.
Things that are clear  
twostepgiants : 4/9/2019 10:21 pm : link
Numerous "major" reporters like Schefter, Vacchiano, King have all said repeatedly that Arizona has "not yet made Rosen available" so the Giants can not yet make their plans clear or they are bidding against themselves

There is a ton of smoke out there from major outlets so its hard to imagine there is no truth

If the Giants wanted to be in the mix for when Rosen IS made available then they need to be considered in the mix by leaks

The Giants could easily destroy this smoke by making clear their lack of interest to a major reporter like they have done in the past with Paul Schwartz

The very fact that that they havent done so shows their interest
Rosen 2019 can't be compared with Rosen 2018.  
CT Charlie : 4/9/2019 10:39 pm : link
His play this year answered some questions that were huge last year, namely, his desire, mental toughness, and durability. Saying "we didn't see him as the answer last year so why should he be the answer this year" is silly. Also, he's a lot cheaper this year.
RE: Things that are clear  
eric2425ny : 4/9/2019 10:39 pm : link
In comment 14379987 twostepgiants said:
Quote:
Numerous "major" reporters like Schefter, Vacchiano, King have all said repeatedly that Arizona has "not yet made Rosen available" so the Giants can not yet make their plans clear or they are bidding against themselves

There is a ton of smoke out there from major outlets so its hard to imagine there is no truth

If the Giants wanted to be in the mix for when Rosen IS made available then they need to be considered in the mix by leaks

The Giants could easily destroy this smoke by making clear their lack of interest to a major reporter like they have done in the past with Paul Schwartz

The very fact that that they havent done so shows their interest


twostepgiants celebrating if the Giants trade for Rosen, two off seasons in the making...

RE: RE: Things that are clear  
twostepgiants : 4/9/2019 10:45 pm : link
In comment 14380011 eric2425ny said:
Quote:
In comment 14379987 twostepgiants said:


Quote:


Numerous "major" reporters like Schefter, Vacchiano, King have all said repeatedly that Arizona has "not yet made Rosen available" so the Giants can not yet make their plans clear or they are bidding against themselves

There is a ton of smoke out there from major outlets so its hard to imagine there is no truth

If the Giants wanted to be in the mix for when Rosen IS made available then they need to be considered in the mix by leaks

The Giants could easily destroy this smoke by making clear their lack of interest to a major reporter like they have done in the past with Paul Schwartz

The very fact that that they havent done so shows their interest



twostepgiants celebrating if the Giants trade for Rosen, two off seasons in the making...



I love this post
RE: RE: RE: Things that are clear  
eric2425ny : 4/9/2019 10:47 pm : link
In comment 14380026 twostepgiants said:
Quote:
In comment 14380011 eric2425ny said:


Quote:


In comment 14379987 twostepgiants said:


Quote:


Numerous "major" reporters like Schefter, Vacchiano, King have all said repeatedly that Arizona has "not yet made Rosen available" so the Giants can not yet make their plans clear or they are bidding against themselves

There is a ton of smoke out there from major outlets so its hard to imagine there is no truth

If the Giants wanted to be in the mix for when Rosen IS made available then they need to be considered in the mix by leaks

The Giants could easily destroy this smoke by making clear their lack of interest to a major reporter like they have done in the past with Paul Schwartz

The very fact that that they havent done so shows their interest



twostepgiants celebrating if the Giants trade for Rosen, two off seasons in the making...





I love this post


Lol, I’ll be dancing right next to you if we get him for the right price.
RE: Ralph V  
TommyWiseau : 4/9/2019 10:50 pm : link
In comment 14379806 Jim Bur(n)t said:
Quote:
Knows as much as my neighbor, and he is a postman... oh wait..


Ralph V always picks the Giants first round target before everyone else does each year so he has to know some things
RE: RE: Here is everything you need to know about it  
SHO'NUFF : 4/9/2019 10:53 pm : link
In comment 14379815 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
In comment 14379811 jlukes said:


Quote:



Giants didn't view Rosen as a Franchise QB or they would have drafted him at 2 last year.

Gettleman has talked about QB hell and he will not acquire a QB who he doesn't view as a Franchise QB

The End



.... or maybe they just had Barkley graded higher.


Fuck, is it that hard to grasp that Barkley was rated higher and it says nothing about how they felt about Rosen, Darnold or anybody else in any position?
The Cards May have more draft picks than they really need do  
Ivan15 : 4/9/2019 10:55 pm : link
It could be Rosen and a pick for 2 Giants picks.

I would like to see the Giants with the 1st pick in Round 4. Who has it?
No criticism of JTGiants, but unless he is getting info from DG or  
Ivan15 : 4/9/2019 11:02 pm : link
maybe Shurmur, it’s still speculation. Maybe it is insider speculation but still speculation. I don’t think even Shula knows how they will rank the QBs.
No criticism of JTGiants, but unless he is getting info from DG or  
Ivan15 : 4/9/2019 11:02 pm : link
maybe Shurmur, it’s still speculation. Maybe it is insider speculation but still speculation. I don’t think even Shula knows how they will rank the QBs.
Sorry about the double post.  
Ivan15 : 4/9/2019 11:03 pm : link
.
Go Terps  
Bill2 : 4/9/2019 11:08 pm : link
Id love that draft. And I would like Joey's suggested variation as well
RE: Rosen 2019 can't be compared with Rosen 2018.  
allstarjim : 4/9/2019 11:21 pm : link
In comment 14380009 CT Charlie said:
Quote:
His play this year answered some questions that were huge last year, namely, his desire, mental toughness, and durability. Saying "we didn't see him as the answer last year so why should he be the answer this year" is silly. Also, he's a lot cheaper this year.


Great, he didn't get hurt and didn't quit. He still sucked ass, which is fairly normal for a starting QB. But he didn't get better over the season, either.

It absolutely is fair to think he just isn't ever going to be a top tier starting QB in the NFL.

We're celebrating Rosen for playing terrible but staying on the field. That, to me, is what is silly.
RE: I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Nine-Tails : 4/9/2019 11:26 pm : link
In comment 14379960 Go Terps said:
Quote:
He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.


Don't be upset then when the defense can't even stop a nosebleed
RE: RE: I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Go Terps : 4/9/2019 11:38 pm : link
In comment 14380086 Nine-Tails said:
Quote:
In comment 14379960 Go Terps said:


Quote:


He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.



Don't be upset then when the defense can't even stop a nosebleed


If you think a rookie or two is going to transform this defense in 2019, you're bound to be disappointed. They probably benefit more by having the offensive line (finally) become a strength. Complementary football.
RE: RE: Rosen 2019 can't be compared with Rosen 2018.  
Rjanyg : 4/9/2019 11:43 pm : link
In comment 14380078 allstarjim said:
Quote:
In comment 14380009 CT Charlie said:


Quote:


His play this year answered some questions that were huge last year, namely, his desire, mental toughness, and durability. Saying "we didn't see him as the answer last year so why should he be the answer this year" is silly. Also, he's a lot cheaper this year.



Great, he didn't get hurt and didn't quit. He still sucked ass, which is fairly normal for a starting QB. But he didn't get better over the season, either.

It absolutely is fair to think he just isn't ever going to be a top tier starting QB in the NFL.

We're celebrating Rosen for playing terrible but staying on the field. That, to me, is what is silly.


Eli’s rookie year wasn’t great. He turned it around and became a champion. Rosen showed he can play in the NFL. His team around him wasn’t good hence having the top pick in the draft
RE: RE: RE: I'd go TJ Hockenson  
Nine-Tails : 4/9/2019 11:44 pm : link
In comment 14380098 Go Terps said:
Quote:
In comment 14380086 Nine-Tails said:


Quote:


In comment 14379960 Go Terps said:


Quote:


He's the one blue chip that figures to still be on the board at 6. I'd draft him at 6, Garrett Bradbury at 17, and the Alabama State tackle at 37. Offensive line rebuild complete.



Don't be upset then when the defense can't even stop a nosebleed



If you think a rookie or two is going to transform this defense in 2019, you're bound to be disappointed. They probably benefit more by having the offensive line (finally) become a strength. Complementary football.


On the other hand it's no guarantee that those guys will be immediate contributors as well, not many olineman and tight ends come in year one and are great, it usually takes some time. And by using all those resources on offense, the defense will be void of talent and will be a huge need next year. The smart move would be to invest in both.
RE: RE: I guess I am confused  
kelsto811 : 4/9/2019 11:55 pm : link
Quote:
If Rosen is considered a 1st round talent by NYG and he has a year of experience and will cost
It tells me they aren’t that excited about him as a prospect which backs up what jtgiants and other “asshats” have said repeatedly on here. They must be concerned about one or more of the following: his concussion history (especially given the fact that he really doesn’t need football to survive and his Dad is a neurosurgeon), the political comments which frankly I have seen none since his college days, or this stuff about him not being a leader, etc.


I thought that their reluctance may have stemmed from one or some of those things too...but from everything I've seen where people were willing to put their name on it, he is not a bad teammate, poor leader, or a guy who seems to have dedication issues. I've never seen a political comment made by him either. I saw this today also:

Quote:
Ian Rapoport
✔
@RapSheet
· Apr 8, 2019
The #AZCardinals offseason conditioning program begins today, and not only is QB Josh Rosen in the building… he was the first guy in the building for new coach Kliff Kingsbury.


Markus Golden
✔
@markusgolden
He was the first in the building as a rookie to! Great Guy and player!

620
12:13 PM - Apr 8, 2019

Putting Rosen's capabilities or lack thereof aside  
kdog77 : 4/10/2019 12:40 am : link
This all seems like a giant game of chicken. No team wants to look like a sucker and so they are all playing cards (no pun intended) close to the vest. Cards gave up a lot to move up last year to get Rosen and trading him for less than first round value might seem insulting to current GM that traded for him. Giants passed over Rosen (no slight on religion intended) last year to pick Barkley and honestly might not want to rush to overpay by giving up #17 for him when they just traded OBJ to Cleveland. Maybe DG wants to squeeze Cards for lower round pick but my thought is that #37 is fair value now and on Day 2 of the draft. Neither side seems willing to admit that yet.
Everything that has been said by "legitimate" voices leads to  
PatersonPlank : 4/10/2019 12:52 am : link
1) The Giants are not going QB at #6, there are going D
2) QB is in play at #17, but it needs to be in-line with BPA.
3) Rosen for the #37 and something else is a viable probability. In which case they definitely don't go QB at #17.

From what I can tell the rest is all opinion, including which QB they would take at #17. All this leads to is they like Jones or Lock better than Haskins.
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