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NGT: Russell Wilson New Deal

Mike from SI : 4/16/2019 4:29 am
Per Shefter:
Quote:
Russell Wilson and the Seahawks reached agreement on a 4-year, $140 million in new money extension that includes a $65 million signing bonus, per source.

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I don't get the criticism  
UConn4523 : 4/16/2019 10:15 am : link
when isn't it about the money? I have no doubt that he would also love to play in NY so can't it be both?
RE: RE: I am glad he is not coming to NY.  
islander1 : 4/16/2019 10:31 am : link
In comment 14388233 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 14388216 GiantsUA said:


Quote:


Too small



lol

He's been outstanding since the day he entered the league. He's been the only thing keeping that franchise afloat since their defense broke down. Enough with the too small nonsense.


Seriously. I've never seen a guy get so grossly underrated. I'd have been fine with him coming here for 4 years at that term. Main issue would've been what to do with Eli.

He's a top 5 quarterback. He's a winner. Teams go years trying to get a QB like that. This moneyball concept is great until you realize QB's are more likely to bust then succeed.
Can you imagine if Eli had thrown an interception in the last seconds  
arniefez : 4/16/2019 10:36 am : link
at the goal line to lose the Super Bowl? It would be discussed everyday by every national and local and fan outlet. But Wilson gets a free pass. Eli would have either seen the guy jump the play or changed the play and won the game. You can keep Russell Wilson especially on that contract. The Seahawks won with great defense and rookie contract QB. Hopefully the Giants build an excellent OL and DL and draft a rookie QB who they can win with this year or next year.
Eli  
djstat : 4/16/2019 10:55 am : link
Looks like a bargain
Eli a bargain compared to this?  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:05 am : link
I'd rather have Russell at 35 million than Eli at 23. Russell is an elite QB that can make up for roster deficiencies. Eli isn't that guy. What does 12 mill a year get you? Nate Solder. Russell can make up for having a subpar offensive line and has the last few years. The reason they ran the ball a billion times last year was because their offensive line was horrific at pass blocking and at least okay at run blocking. I don't think I would have traded for him though unless the price was 2 firsts or less. If you are going to pay your QB that type of money you are going to need some cheap talent around him.
Can you explain what roster  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:09 am : link
Deficiencies the Seahawks have?
Poor Russell  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:13 am : link
Heís had one of the best run games in the NFL since he came into the league, at WORST... an above average defense. A pro bowl WR and one of the best coaches in the game.

Such adversity.
Well deserved, great QB.  
Dave in Hoboken : 4/16/2019 11:15 am : link
But it's time to find our guy in the draft. Not that 30 is super old, but we need to hit the reset button and start over.
The last 3-4 years it has been Russell on that offense  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:24 am : link
and nothing else. Their offensive line has been atrocious. They lack at the skill positions. The talent on the Giants offense has been better. There is one key difference and that is at the QB position. Russell can make things happen on his own. What's the common complaint about those guys? Oh they miss games. Well Russell doesn't miss games. Accounting for Russell on offense opens up everybody else.

I know the NFL sucks now and nobody watches games, but I watch about 50 percent of all NFL games at home with the set up I have. I make a significant amount of money every year on football. I love Eli, but comparing him to an actual year in year out top 5 QB is asinine when Eli has had 2-3 years like that and those are in the rearview mirror.
And the defense started to fall apart a couple years ago,  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:26 am : link
it is young and ascending right now though. They have a great defense though because they don't need to invest too heavily in the offense because they can let Russell take it over. A huge part of having one of the better run games in the league is him and last year pretty much proved it. Mediocre run blocking line with mediocre running backs and they had one of the better run games in the league.
RE: The last 3-4 years it has been Russell on that offense  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:28 am : link
In comment 14388446 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
and nothing else. Their offensive line has been atrocious. They lack at the skill positions. The talent on the Giants offense has been better. There is one key difference and that is at the QB position. Russell can make things happen on his own. What's the common complaint about those guys? Oh they miss games. Well Russell doesn't miss games. Accounting for Russell on offense opens up everybody else.

I know the NFL sucks now and nobody watches games, but I watch about 50 percent of all NFL games at home with the set up I have. I make a significant amount of money every year on football. I love Eli, but comparing him to an actual year in year out top 5 QB is asinine when Eli has had 2-3 years like that and those are in the rearview mirror.


So when Mike Davis, Rashad Penny, and Chris Carson all average 4.6 YPC and the team leads in the league in rushing - thats not helpful? The worst his defense was ever in his career was 13th. Thats not helpful? Doug Baldwin is a multiple pro bowler. So was graham with Seattle.

That seems like a lot of help to me, maybe I just dont watch a lot of football?
RE: RE: The last 3-4 years it has been Russell on that offense  
Harvest Blend : 4/16/2019 11:29 am : link
In comment 14388455 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 14388446 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


and nothing else. Their offensive line has been atrocious. They lack at the skill positions. The talent on the Giants offense has been better. There is one key difference and that is at the QB position. Russell can make things happen on his own. What's the common complaint about those guys? Oh they miss games. Well Russell doesn't miss games. Accounting for Russell on offense opens up everybody else.

I know the NFL sucks now and nobody watches games, but I watch about 50 percent of all NFL games at home with the set up I have. I make a significant amount of money every year on football. I love Eli, but comparing him to an actual year in year out top 5 QB is asinine when Eli has had 2-3 years like that and those are in the rearview mirror.



So when Mike Davis, Rashad Penny, and Chris Carson all average 4.6 YPC and the team leads in the league in rushing - thats not helpful? The worst his defense was ever in his career was 13th. Thats not helpful? Doug Baldwin is a multiple pro bowler. So was graham with Seattle.

That seems like a lot of help to me, maybe I just dont watch a lot of football?


Or make enough money watching it?
And for the record it pisses me off when people say Eli got  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:30 am : link
dragged to superbowls. Maybe 2007 you can make that argument, but 2011 he was the second best QB in the league that year after Rodgers who had a career year I believe. He dragged that team to the playoffs on his own. The defense and run game came around for the playoffs, but that team doesn't even make the dance if it isn't for Eli.
RE: And the defense started to fall apart a couple years ago,  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:31 am : link
In comment 14388450 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
it is young and ascending right now though. They have a great defense though because they don't need to invest too heavily in the offense because they can let Russell take it over. A huge part of having one of the better run games in the league is him and last year pretty much proved it. Mediocre run blocking line with mediocre running backs and they had one of the better run games in the league.


Last year Wilson averaged like 20 yards per game. And his defense has never been ranked worse than 13th in the NFL.

Like I said... poor Russell.

Take away Wilsons rushing yards....  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:34 am : link
Seattle was still 4th in the NFL in rushing. But Ill continue to hear their OL cant run block or they were just ok at it...haha
In 2017 and 2016, Seattle was  
SimpleMan : 4/16/2019 11:35 am : link
23rd and 25th in rushing offense. His other years they have had top rushing attacks.
RE: In 2017 and 2016, Seattle was  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 11:37 am : link
In comment 14388478 SimpleMan said:
Quote:
23rd and 25th in rushing offense. His other years they have had top rushing attacks.


Like I said Poor Russell. 2 years he had to deal with adveristy from his run game...lol
I just don't think you understand how much Russell opens things  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:38 am : link
on offense. The reason they averaged 4.6 YPC is because of the things he opens up. Carrol realized his line was average at run-blocking and horrific at pass blocking last year so he played the guys who that was their strength, our own DJ Fluker included. You can't just stuff run lanes when you have Russell making plays off boot. And his receivers? Guy makes a lot of those scrubs look better than they do outside of Baldwin who has a knack for tough catches.

RW enables you to spend a significant amount of resources on your defense because you can cut spending on your offence. It is about what he enables you to do team construction wise. That is where we failed Eli, we should have been focusing on the line and RB's and gave him scrubs to throw to because Eli will make the receivers better if you give him time and a run game to work play action off of.
It isn't about the yards he accrues it is about having to  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:40 am : link
respect it. NFL is not baseball, it isn't a game of stats. You know how many times they stuff the box on 3rd and short and he just pulls it for an easy ten. A lot.
Compare that to our RB's who get stuffed for loss on 3rd and short.  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 11:41 am : link
It hurts their YPC at the end of the day.
RE: RE: Actually a pretty fair contract...  
bw in dc : 4/16/2019 12:19 pm : link
In comment 14388323 AcesUp said:
Quote:
he opposite actually, players and specifically QBs are starting to push for shorter term deals, as they should. Short of a game changing deal that would tie the QBs salary to a % of the cap, it's the only way to keep up with market inflation. I wouldn't be surprised if the sticking point was Seattle pushing for 5 years.


We disagree on this one. Seattle can start looking in the draft for next 2-3 years to find a QB replacement for Wilson. He now has an expiration date - when he is 36.
RE: Poor Russell  
UConn4523 : 4/16/2019 12:56 pm : link
In comment 14388427 dep026 said:
Quote:
Heís had one of the best run games in the NFL since he came into the league, at WORST... an above average defense. A pro bowl WR and one of the best coaches in the game.

Such adversity.


You realize he's part of why their run game is so good, don't you? You really think his RB talent over is that good? I certainly don't. You seem to have an unrational hate towards Wilson.
irrational  
UConn4523 : 4/16/2019 12:57 pm : link
*
RE: irrational  
bw in dc : 4/16/2019 1:04 pm : link
In comment 14388606 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
*


dep obviously hasn't watched a Seattle game in about three years. Their OL has been worse than ours. Wilson has single-handedly kept them relevant, winning, and a playoff team.
Glad he signed  
retiredmz : 4/16/2019 1:05 pm : link
because he was never, ever coming to the NY Giants
RE: RE: Poor Russell  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:06 pm : link
In comment 14388605 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
In comment 14388427 dep026 said:


Quote:


Heís had one of the best run games in the NFL since he came into the league, at WORST... an above average defense. A pro bowl WR and one of the best coaches in the game.

Such adversity.



You realize he's part of why their run game is so good, don't you? You really think his RB talent over is that good? I certainly don't. You seem to have an unrational hate towards Wilson.


I acknowledged he has been a part of it. But to say their OL wasnt good last year in the run game is being ignorant. The desgined runs by Wilson were a lot less than people realized last year and they were still 4th in the NFL in rushing yards without his totals.

Is it that wrong to say their strength in run blocking has helped the team?
RE: RE: irrational  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:07 pm : link
In comment 14388617 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14388606 UConn4523 said:


Quote:


*



dep obviously hasn't watched a Seattle game in about three years. Their OL has been worse than ours. Wilson has single-handedly kept them relevant, winning, and a playoff team.


Led the NFL in rushing yards last year. I guess that's a bad thing, right? No credit to the OL there.
it isn't  
UConn4523 : 4/16/2019 1:09 pm : link
but I never said otherwise. Your posts read like someone who isn't giving Wilson any credit, to which I responded.

Do you think the Pats RB's are as effective without Tom Brady under center? I certainly don't. Maybe Michel since he had a ton of talent coming out, but the rest go as Brady goes.
RE: it isn't  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:11 pm : link
In comment 14388628 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
but I never said otherwise. Your posts read like someone who isn't giving Wilson any credit, to which I responded.

Do you think the Pats RB's are as effective without Tom Brady under center? I certainly don't. Maybe Michel since he had a ton of talent coming out, but the rest go as Brady goes.


I think you are misreading what I wrote. This topic stems from yesterday stating how Seattles 3 RBs who are average at best had a ton of success last year with averaging over 4.6 yard per carry for each of them.

And thats why I am giving credit to their OL's ability to run block. I know their pass blocking isnt good. But their run blocking was one of the best in football last year. To say their OL was as bad or worse than ours is just flat out false, like some posters are claiming.
They were a one dimensional offensive line that wasn't spectacular  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 1:15 pm : link
at what they did even. Against teams like that you just start to run-blitz which you just can't against Wilson it leaves way too much open. Wilson is as responsible for that 4.6 as much as that offensive line and in reality probably even more so.
RE: They were a one dimensional offensive line that wasn't spectacular  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:16 pm : link
In comment 14388639 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
at what they did even. Against teams like that you just start to run-blitz which you just can't against Wilson it leaves way too much open. Wilson is as responsible for that 4.6 as much as that offensive line and in reality probably even more so.


You are really overstating what Wilson did with his legs last year. They were a pound the ball, play action team. Their OL was very good at run blocking. Trust me, its ok to admit it.
The coaching staff  
AcesUp : 4/16/2019 1:19 pm : link
Deserves credit for playing to the OLs strengths the last couple of seasons but that line is nothing to write home about. We're talking about Germaine Ifedi, DJ Fluker and Mike Iupati on 1yr 3m dollar deal here. It's a mediocre to bad OL whose strength is run blocking that's been helped by a smart mobile QB with some of the best deep ball efficiency numbers in the league. That opens up your running game.


RE: If he gets hurt  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/16/2019 1:19 pm : link
In comment 14388142 Chip said:
Quote:
Seattle is screwed. The dead money makes him uncuttable.

That's pretty much the case for any superstar and even more so for QBs.
RE: The coaching staff  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:22 pm : link
In comment 14388648 AcesUp said:
Quote:
Deserves credit for playing to the OLs strengths the last couple of seasons but that line is nothing to write home about. We're talking about Germaine Ifedi, DJ Fluker and Mike Iupati on 1yr 3m dollar deal here. It's a mediocre to bad OL whose strength is run blocking that's been helped by a smart mobile QB with some of the best deep ball efficiency numbers in the league. That opens up your running game.



If the OL has a strength, why is it nothing to write home about? I usually find that if a unit is good at something - it usually helps the team. You're right..... Seattle has been coached very well by utilizing a strength of their team.

I hope one day we have a strength on offense and Shurmur sticks with it.
RE: RE: RE: irrational  
bw in dc : 4/16/2019 1:26 pm : link
In comment 14388624 dep026 said:
Quote:


Led the NFL in rushing yards last year. I guess that's a bad thing, right? No credit to the OL there.


The credit goes to Schottenheimer who replaced Bevell. Yes, the OL was better than 2017. But they only had one place to go and that was up. Because they were a complete sieve in '16 and '17. Bevell put an inordinate amount of pressure on Wilson to do EVERYTHING.

So Schottenheimer came in and he and Carroll decided to commit to the run. Otherwise, Wilson would have taken the organization to court for attempted manslaughter.

BTW, it's very, very funny that you claim Wilson has been fortunate to have a "pro bowl" receiver. I take it you mean Baldwin. Indeed, it's very easy to mix Balwdin up with OBJ or Julio or Green or Hopkins.
RE: RE: RE: I am glad he is not coming to NY.  
Gatorade Dunk : 4/16/2019 1:27 pm : link
In comment 14388269 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 14388233 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


In comment 14388216 GiantsUA said:


Quote:


Too small



lol

He's been outstanding since the day he entered the league. He's been the only thing keeping that franchise afloat since their defense broke down. Enough with the too small nonsense.



Their defense broke down? The last two year they were ranked 11 and 13 in points allowed. You know thatís above average right?

Not by much. Compared with where they used to be through the first five seasons of Wilson's career (3rd in 2016, 1st in 2015, 1st in 2014, 1st in 2013, 1st in 2012), it's not unfair to say they broke down.
The point is  
AcesUp : 4/16/2019 1:28 pm : link
That Russel Wilson makes their running game better, complementing the strength of a mediocre unit. His ability to run and his efficiency in the deep passing game open things up in the running game. His ability to run also allows them to cut corners in how they approach personnel on the OL. They don't have to worry as much about guys like Fluker and Iupati in pass pro because of the things Wilson can do with his legs in the passing game.
Dep.... I'm not saying he ran the ball that much last year.  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 1:28 pm : link
He didn't have to. The tape is out on him, teams know what he can do. Russell is a mobile QB who beats you with his arm/brain now period. But he enables you to trot those guys out there that can't pass block at all. He makes plays happen.

As far as the run game it as about respecting what Russell can do. You don't he burns you around the corner for 10 and slides are gets out of bounds. It opens up so much in your run game. You can't pinch your dline when Russell is back there.
RE: The point is  
Zeke's Alibi : 4/16/2019 1:29 pm : link
In comment 14388667 AcesUp said:
Quote:
That Russel Wilson makes their running game better, complementing the strength of a mediocre unit. His ability to run and his efficiency in the deep passing game open things up in the running game. His ability to run also allows them to cut corners in how they approach personnel on the OL. They don't have to worry as much about guys like Fluker and Iupati in pass pro because of the things Wilson can do with his legs in the passing game.


Well said.
RE: RE: RE: RE: irrational  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:30 pm : link
In comment 14388662 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14388624 dep026 said:


Quote:




Led the NFL in rushing yards last year. I guess that's a bad thing, right? No credit to the OL there.



The credit goes to Schottenheimer who replaced Bevell. Yes, the OL was better than 2017. But they only had one place to go and that was up. Because they were a complete sieve in '16 and '17. Bevell put an inordinate amount of pressure on Wilson to do EVERYTHING.

So Schottenheimer came in and he and Carroll decided to commit to the run. Otherwise, Wilson would have taken the organization to court for attempted manslaughter.

BTW, it's very, very funny that you claim Wilson has been fortunate to have a "pro bowl" receiver. I take it you mean Baldwin. Indeed, it's very easy to mix Balwdin up with OBJ or Julio or Green or Hopkins.


See you're twisting it to fit a narrative. I have said their in other threads their OL was bad in 2016/2017. Never once denied it. (Go look at Wilsons stats in 2016 and compare them to Eli's in 2018... hmmm)

What I am saying is Seattles OL was a very good run blocking team. Thats it. They always have been outside those two years. It didnt matter the RB, because their have been a half of dozen who have had success.

Their strength has always been running the ball. Wilson gets credit for it. Their coaching staff gets credit for it. And so does their OL. To say their OL has sucked for the majority of his career is unfair due to their success in the run game.
RE: The point is  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:31 pm : link
In comment 14388667 AcesUp said:
Quote:
That Russel Wilson makes their running game better, complementing the strength of a mediocre unit. His ability to run and his efficiency in the deep passing game open things up in the running game. His ability to run also allows them to cut corners in how they approach personnel on the OL. They don't have to worry as much about guys like Fluker and Iupati in pass pro because of the things Wilson can do with his legs in the passing game.


You still need to block the man in front of you. Dont you? Its amazing how much you discredit their OL run blocking when they ranked FIRST IN THE NFL in rushing yards.... haha
They're a solid running team  
AcesUp : 4/16/2019 1:36 pm : link
That's how they're built. They're also #2 in the league in attempts. They run the ball a ton. What I am saying is that Russell Wilson is a HUGE part of that team's success in the run game.

Gassing up a patchwork OL is an odd approach in knocking down Wilson. If anything, the journeymen line is another example of Wilson making the players around him better.

RE: They're a solid running team  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 1:43 pm : link
In comment 14388685 AcesUp said:
Quote:
That's how they're built. They're also #2 in the league in attempts. They run the ball a ton. What I am saying is that Russell Wilson is a HUGE part of that team's success in the run game.

Gassing up a patchwork OL is an odd approach in knocking down Wilson. If anything, the journeymen line is another example of Wilson making the players around him better.


I am not knocking Wilson, I am giving credit to a unit for doing something they are good at.
RE: RE: They're a solid running team  
FranchiseQB : 4/16/2019 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14388700 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 14388685 AcesUp said:


Quote:


That's how they're built. They're also #2 in the league in attempts. They run the ball a ton. What I am saying is that Russell Wilson is a HUGE part of that team's success in the run game.

Gassing up a patchwork OL is an odd approach in knocking down Wilson. If anything, the journeymen line is another example of Wilson making the players around him better.




I am not knocking Wilson, I am giving credit to a unit for doing something they are good at.


Did you ever consider that defenses focused on Wilson and pass rush/defense preferring to be beaten by Seattle's journeymen RBs, accounting for Seattle's OL being statistically terrible in pass protection and good at run game?
RE: RE: RE: They're a solid running team  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14388725 FranchiseQB said:
Quote:

Did you ever consider that defenses focused on Wilson and pass rush/defense preferring to be beaten by Seattle's journeymen RBs, accounting for Seattle's OL being statistically terrible in pass protection and good at run game?


Did it ever occur to you that their OL can be very good at one thing and very bad at the other? Because thats exactly the situation. If you think teams game plan around WIlson for his running ability, you are sadly mistaken.

Wilson can run, but he is still a pocket passer first who wants to make plays with his arm first, legs 2nd.
RE: RE: RE: RE: They're a solid running team  
FranchiseQB : 4/16/2019 2:20 pm : link
In comment 14388735 dep026 said:
Quote:
In comment 14388725 FranchiseQB said:


Quote:



Did you ever consider that defenses focused on Wilson and pass rush/defense preferring to be beaten by Seattle's journeymen RBs, accounting for Seattle's OL being statistically terrible in pass protection and good at run game?



Did it ever occur to you that their OL can be very good at one thing and very bad at the other? Because thats exactly the situation. If you think teams game plan around WIlson for his running ability, you are sadly mistaken.

Wilson can run, but he is still a pocket passer first who wants to make plays with his arm first, legs 2nd.

yea i didn't say they were planning against Wilson as a runner. Rather they were planning against his complete game, including his passing threat.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: They're a solid running team  
dep026 : 4/16/2019 2:21 pm : link
In comment 14388752 FranchiseQB said:
Quote:


yea i didn't say they were planning against Wilson as a runner. Rather they were planning against his complete game, including his passing threat.


I would think most defenses would plan against a QB and the threat of the pass, but thats just me.
It is why the y will never win another a SB.  
short lease : 4/16/2019 5:27 pm : link
How are they going to pay for surrounding talent now?

It is why the Patriots have a nice balance of talent and continue to win. Say what you want about him (and I am no fan myself) but, he doesn't take them to the bank.

Yes I know he is compensated in other ways but, he could demand to be the highest paid player in the league very easily.
RE: I don't get the criticism  
LauderdaleMatty : 4/16/2019 7:51 pm : link
In comment 14388327 UConn4523 said:
Quote:
when isn't it about the money? I have no doubt that he would also love to play in NY so can't it be both?


Sure it can. But many people were intimating he wanted out of Seattle to play here and money was secondary. Once in a blue moon it isnít primary but itís always part of the equation. Always.
RE: I tend to believe Seattle will not win another Super Bowl  
short lease : 4/17/2019 2:10 am : link
In comment 14388151 George from PA said:
Quote:
With that kind of anchor of a salary for one person


+1 ... bet on it. They will never win another SB as long as he is QB. They might even have a hard time making the playoffs.
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