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Raiders don't trust their scouts

Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:27 pm
I don't remember ever seeing something like this.

Quote:
Tweet from @RapSheet: Sources: #Raiders coach Jon Gruden and GM Mike Mayock sent their scouts home for the weekend and they are not expected to return by draft time. The belief is they donít know who to trust and wanted to clear the room.
Hopefully there will be cameras in their war room  
figgy2989 : 4/19/2019 12:29 pm : link
Should be funny with just the two of them in there.

Wild  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 4/19/2019 12:31 pm : link
.

& thank God Gruden is no longer on MNF.
Gruden's replacements  
PEEJ : 4/19/2019 12:33 pm : link
were even worse
Gruden  
Jim Bur(n)t : 4/19/2019 12:33 pm : link
Is legit nuts... Mayock is prob ok with being the one source of eval too...

I'd love to be a fly on that draftroom wall!
For some reason  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:35 pm : link
I think they are gonna pick someone completely off the wall. Like Devin Bush or DK Metcalf. Just someone we don't expect at all.
Unfortunately they broght in Booger Mcfarland  
Chip : 4/19/2019 12:35 pm : link
and Jason Witten and was just as bad. I know Jason Witten is gone so that will help.
Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
BlueLou'sBack : 4/19/2019 12:35 pm : link
"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.
Well I have always had a problem  
pjcas18 : 4/19/2019 12:35 pm : link
when poor drafting teams fire the GM (like the Raiders did) and keep the scouts.

We have had the discussion on here many times, so I get the reasons, but this is 2019, it cannot be that hard to scout/review 250 football players from January to the end of April - and when you consider after the third round it's a massive crapshoot anyway, you really need to scout the top 110 or so heavily.

If anyone listens to Michael Lombardi  
Tuckrule : 4/19/2019 12:37 pm : link
He has a few interesting stories about gruden.
RE: Unfortunately they broght in Booger Mcfarland  
robbieballs2003 : 4/19/2019 12:38 pm : link
In comment 14393501 Chip said:
Quote:
and Jason Witten and was just as bad. I know Jason Witten is gone so that will help.


Just as bad? You are being kind. Those fuckers made Gruden look like John Madden.
Getts said he send the scouts home  
ron mexico : 4/19/2019 12:38 pm : link
And on a podcast I listened to, they said that the Giants leak must be gone as they usually know exactly who the Giants are targeting every year but not this year
RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:41 pm : link
In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.


Gettleman sent the scouts home for the Holidays. They'll be back. Completely different thing.
Gruden  
JonC : 4/19/2019 12:42 pm : link
is a shit show.
RE: RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
ron mexico : 4/19/2019 12:43 pm : link
In comment 14393523 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:


Quote:


"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.



Gettleman sent the scouts home for the Holidays. They'll be back. Completely different thing.


How do you know they'll be back?
Never understood why the tv-watching public was convinced  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/19/2019 12:43 pm : link
Gruden was some kind of slam dunk.
According to an "inside" poster last year  
shyster : 4/19/2019 12:43 pm : link
there were only three people in the NYG draft prep room.

Gettleman and the two Maras.
And for the record  
ron mexico : 4/19/2019 12:44 pm : link
I think extra secrecy protocols is a good thing
It is a holiday weekend  
PEEJ : 4/19/2019 12:44 pm : link
after all
RE: RE: RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:45 pm : link
In comment 14393528 ron mexico said:
Quote:
In comment 14393523 Big Rick in FL said:


Quote:


In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:


Quote:


"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.



Gettleman sent the scouts home for the Holidays. They'll be back. Completely different thing.



How do you know they'll be back?


Art Stapleton just tweeted that
---  
Peppers : 4/19/2019 12:45 pm : link
Actually from everything I've been told, very few teams allow more than a hand full of people in on the final discussion anymore. Once the information is gathered its down to the most important faces to sort it out.
In response to the Rapoport tweet ...  
sphinx : 4/19/2019 12:45 pm : link
Daniel Jeremiah
@MoveTheSticks
When I started scouting in 2003, most teams allowed scouts and coaches to see the draft board. By 2012, most teams only allowed 3-4 people (HC/GM/Personnel Director/College Director) to have access to the board. This isnít that unusual.
12:41pm ∑ 19 Apr 2019


RE: RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
AcesUp : 4/19/2019 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14393523 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:


Quote:


"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.



Gettleman sent the scouts home for the Holidays. They'll be back. Completely different thing.


Meh, same thing, different spin. It's smart actually.
RE: In response to the Rapoport tweet ...  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14393539 sphinx said:
Quote:
Daniel Jeremiah
@MoveTheSticks
When I started scouting in 2003, most teams allowed scouts and coaches to see the draft board. By 2012, most teams only allowed 3-4 people (HC/GM/Personnel Director/College Director) to have access to the board. This isnít that unusual.
12:41pm ∑ 19 Apr 2019


So our leaks were coming from Coughlin, Reese, Ross or Chris Mara? I guess there is a reason nobody was upset when Ross got fired.
RE: RE: RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 12:48 pm : link
In comment 14393541 AcesUp said:
Quote:
In comment 14393523 Big Rick in FL said:


Quote:


In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:


Quote:


"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.



Gettleman sent the scouts home for the Holidays. They'll be back. Completely different thing.



Meh, same thing, different spin. It's smart actually.


No I don't think it is. Our personnel people will be with the team next week and for the draft. The Raiders won't.
Tim Mara is the  
Jim Bur(n)t : 4/19/2019 12:50 pm : link
Ugh  
Jim Bur(n)t : 4/19/2019 12:50 pm : link
Tim Mara is the "Fredo" of the NYG...
RE: Umm Gettleman sent the Giants scouting staff home too.  
Steve in ATL : 4/19/2019 12:51 pm : link
In comment 14393502 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
"Not trusting" their scouts prolly has nothing to do with what they think of their scouts' evaluations, and everything to do with a lack of trust in their ability to keep their draft board a secret.


I think he sent them home for the holiday and expects them back.
Mark Dominic on sirius  
Giantsfanincuse : 4/19/2019 12:59 pm : link
Just said he would send his scouts home for the weekend before the draft too.
I don't think the sending them home  
pjcas18 : 4/19/2019 1:06 pm : link
part is the story here, I believe it's the don't come back part.
RE: RE: In response to the Rapoport tweet ...  
Nine-Tails : 4/19/2019 1:08 pm : link
In comment 14393543 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14393539 sphinx said:


Quote:


Daniel Jeremiah
@MoveTheSticks
When I started scouting in 2003, most teams allowed scouts and coaches to see the draft board. By 2012, most teams only allowed 3-4 people (HC/GM/Personnel Director/College Director) to have access to the board. This isnít that unusual.
12:41pm ∑ 19 Apr 2019




So our leaks were coming from Coughlin, Reese, Ross or Chris Mara? I guess there is a reason nobody was upset when Ross got fired.


It was definitely Ross
RE: I don't think the sending them home  
Big Rick in FL : 4/19/2019 1:15 pm : link
In comment 14393569 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
part is the story here, I believe it's the don't come back part.


Yeah I think people are missing that part.

I'm sure most teams send their scouts home for the weekend. They've just worked a long ass year. The people aren't told hey don't come back.
Yup  
Dodge : 4/19/2019 1:20 pm : link
Definitely Ross being the jackass. That dude loves to brag and be smug and appear all-knowing.
Frankly, With The Leaks On The Giants  
Giants38 : 4/19/2019 1:47 pm : link
The Giants should probably implement a similar strategy. The fewer the people who know anything, the fewer the people who can give anything away. If you donít trust your scouts to stay quiet, donít let them in. Dorsey did the same thing last year. He didnít want anyone knowing anything about their plans - and they picked first.
What's in it for someone in the org to leak  
ron mexico : 4/19/2019 2:13 pm : link
Are they getting paid off? Just doing it to the cool guy on the inside?
Mayock..  
Ryan : 4/19/2019 2:14 pm : link
....just spent the last decade in the driver's seat of NFL draft media. I'm sure he's well aware of where leaks come from with certain teams (including our own....).

Plus it's not like..  
Ryan : 4/19/2019 2:15 pm : link
...they banished them to fucking Antarctica and have to communicate by carrier pigeon if they need something.
This is more common  
Sy'56 : 4/19/2019 2:15 pm : link
than you think
They completed their work  
steve in ky : 4/19/2019 2:20 pm : link
Why do they need to be there for anything beyond that?
RE: They completed their work  
Ten Ton Hammer : 4/19/2019 2:24 pm : link
In comment 14393656 steve in ky said:
Quote:
Why do they need to be there for anything beyond that?


There's a difference between parting ways with scouts because it's the end of the draft cycle and doing so because you don't have confidence that they're professional enough to not undermine the team by leaking secrets.
RE: Yup  
ColHowPepper : 4/19/2019 2:26 pm : link
In comment 14393582 Dodge said:
Quote:
Definitely Ross being the jackass. That dude loves to brag and be smug and appear all-knowing.
learned at the feet of a master
RE: Tim Mara is the  
bw in dc : 4/19/2019 2:26 pm : link
In comment 14393548 Jim Bur(n)t said:
Quote:


Very well done. And spot on.
Must be an Oakland thing  
jeff57 : 4/19/2019 2:48 pm : link
.
Chuckie wants to move on up,  
MOOPS : 4/19/2019 2:50 pm : link
and he ain't taking no for an answer.
RE: RE: Tim Mara is the  
Ivan15 : 4/19/2019 2:58 pm : link
In comment 14393665 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14393548 Jim Bur(n)t said:


Quote:

Do you mean Chris Mara? The Tim Mara I know has been dead for about 20 years. Or do you mean Kate or Rooney?




Very well done. And spot on.
RE: RE: Tim Mara is the  
Chris in Philly : 4/19/2019 3:05 pm : link
In comment 14393665 bw in dc said:
Quote:
In comment 14393548 Jim Bur(n)t said:


Quote:






Very well done. And spot on.


Tim Mara? Really?
The part I don't get  
jcn56 : 4/19/2019 3:18 pm : link
how much would sending the scouts home really reduce leaks?

I could see it as operational security meant to keep potential trades or draft day moves quiet, since that's going to develop while the draft is underway. But as a measure of limiting leaks related to teams interest and draft board? By this time, the players have all been scouted and graded. The scouts are familiar with the methodology. They already know more than enough to let someone outside the organization know who a team would have ranked higher or lower or players that wouldn't interest them.
RE: What's in it for someone in the org to leak  
sphinx : 4/19/2019 6:24 pm : link
In comment 14393646 ron mexico said:
Quote:
Are they getting paid off? Just doing it to the cool guy on the inside?

Art Stapleton
@art_stapleton
Honestly, I say good for Mayock to close ranks if he believes the integrity of his draft is being compromised by leaks from his own scouts, if that is the case here.
Leaks crushed the Giantsí draft a few years back.

If a scout has aspirations of being a GM one day, or director of college scouting, or higher personnel job, that scout could give information and build a relationship so that one day when he is getting interviews, the reviews with some in media are more favorable than others.

Donít know if that is the case here. Might be some personal stuff since a new GM will likely be restructuring the department, which could mean drastic changes and jobs lost, so new regime is protecting itself against being compromised.

All it takes is one whisper to kill a draft

The old..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 4/19/2019 6:47 pm : link
axiom that the guy you want to sit down and have a beer with is the guy you'll do well with doesn't work for Gruden!!

Great dude to hang out with - a complete wild Card otherwise
RE: Never understood why the tv-watching public was convinced  
LauderdaleMatty : 4/19/2019 8:12 pm : link
In comment 14393530 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
Gruden was some kind of slam dunk.


Guy was a good coach at one time. But he pretty much won at Tampa w a defense he didnít put together or coach. People thought Al Davis was senile at the end, whatís Mark Davisí fault
RE: RE: Never understood why the tv-watching public was convinced  
Jay on the Island : 4/19/2019 8:15 pm : link
In comment 14394288 LauderdaleMatty said:
Quote:
In comment 14393530 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


Gruden was some kind of slam dunk.



Guy was a good coach at one time. But he pretty much won at Tampa w a defense he didnít put together or coach. People thought Al Davis was senile at the end, whatís Mark Davisí fault

True but he did an incredible job while coaching the Raiders. Gruden also did a masterful job with the QB's he was given. Jeff Garcia had bounced around the league with the Browns and Lions before signing with Tampa. He ended making the pro bowl at age 37 under Gruden.
Riddle me this  
Simms : 4/20/2019 10:02 pm : link
What is the Giants had signed him as HC .... the press would be having a field day.
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