A week before the draft......

but my GUESS is that we are getting Rosen and that the D and OL will be prioritized.

They would do just that.....

But an asshat said the Giants hope Qashington wins the Rosen lottery....as they would be one of the teams between 6 and 17 targeting a QB.

Denver Lock
Cincinnati Haskins
Washington Rosen

I’d offer 37 for Rosen easily OR 17 for Rosen and Haasan Ridick.

Gettleman listed offensive tackle, receiver, D-line and cornerback as the deepest positions in this draft.

It seems plausible to me if he likes one of these quarterbacks he d be inclined to take him early believing he could still get good quality at the other positions later.

To start.

So I sure hope the Remmers rumors are true

to the Giants? I don't see that happening before the draft.
I'm not sure I see that happening at all.

Scenario would be new OC/DC for a team that wants to implement a new Offense/Defense. Did San Fran change coordinators? If not, scratch them off your list.

Team trades up with the Giants for a player they want.
They send the Giants a player or pick or combo. I still think trade would be for picks and not players.

But we know they were willing to trade picks and players for OBJ.

Do they see a top WR available at 17?

In comment 14394640 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

but my GUESS is that we are getting Rosen and that the D and OL will be prioritized.

This is my guess as well.

two take-aways from Gettleman's press conference:

(1) Regardless of the first 5 picks, he said there will be a defensive player worthy of the #6 pick.

(2) He feels this is the deepest draft in rounds 1-4 that he has seen in seven years (he tenure as GM at two teams).


If the Giants trade away a 2nd, 3rd, and/or 4th round pick, Gettleman is going to lose a quality player.

within top four rounds.

So does that mean he should stand pat with all of our late round picks as this heavy volume of 3rd & 4th round value guys drop to later rounds?

OR

Use the extra late picks to move up into Rds 3 and 4 and scoop up what DG believes to be the highest quality middle round guys (albeit less of them)?

In comment 14394695 Eric from BBI said:

Quote:

two take-aways from Gettleman's press conference: (1) Regardless of the first 5 picks, he said there will be a defensive player worthy of the #6 pick. (2) He feels this is the deepest draft in rounds 1-4 that he has seen in seven years (he tenure as GM at two teams). If the Giants trade away a 2nd, 3rd, and/or 4th round pick, Gettleman is going to lose a quality player.

I’m expecting those extra 5th rounders to be used in a couple move ups (especially between picks 37-95, a lot of talent will be available)

In comment 14394699 Jimmy Googs said:

Quote:

within top four rounds. So does that mean he should stand pat with all of our late round picks as this heavy volume of 3rd & 4th round value guys drop to later rounds? OR Use the extra late picks to move up into Rds 3 and 4 and scoop up what DG believes to be the highest quality middle round guys (albeit less of them)?

He has shown throughout his entire career that he will aggressively pursue a targeted player via trade up. I expect a couple of these moves - highly doubt he ends up with 12 selects.

7th rounders are basically worthless in trade, so he’ll probably take some big freak OL/DL and try and coach them up. The extra 5th rounders should be the ammo needed to get an extra/higher 3rd or 4th

try to trade up ahead of the Redskins at #15 to get a QB, defense or OT at #37 ... and they've got ammo to try and move up in the 2nd/3rd rounds.

then I expect defense or OT.

moving up a few spots in Falcon spot in rd 1 from a friend of mine here in ATL. Have not heard its for a particular player as of yet...

depending on who's there, of course.

I'm not sure we are getting a picture of how things are going to happen. We've heard so many different things in the last few days.

Charles Robinson says Jones is QB1.

Peter Schrager said Lock is QB1.

Joey in VA says Jones is QB4 and we aren't taking a QB at 6.

JonC & JT have said Lock & Jones are their top 2 QBs, but they don't know which order.

Matt Miller says Haskins is QB1.
Both Miller & Rapoport say Haskins at 6 is a strong possibility.

Peppers has said he's heard more about Haskins then any other QB.

Stapleton & Ranaan have both said Lock is QB1.

We've heard it's going to be a Defender at 6 and a trade up for a QB is on the table.

Schefter said he believes we end up with Rosen.

So many different opinions/info. I know the Giants haven't been good at hiding their intentions in the past, but after looking at the past few months (Odell trade, Tate signing, Shep extension) and now all of this draft info. No disrespect to our asshats (I absolutely love reading their posts) it sure seems like the Giants are doing a good job at masking their intentions.

My worst case scenario is
Q Williams/Bosa/Allen/Oliver all off the board before 6.

I really like Sweat but with that heart condition I don’t think it’s great idea to draft him at 6. In this scenario, what defensive player you see as the pick?

In comment 14394710 JonC said:

Quote:

try to trade up ahead of the Redskins at #15 to get a QB, defense or OT at #37 ... and they've got ammo to try and move up in the 2nd/3rd rounds.

Jon, I disagree with the fact we have to trade ahead of the Redskins to take a QB. One, Jay Gruden and company have already said they need an immediate impact player at 15. Two, Jay Gruden's job is probably on the line if they have a bad year. Then you have these rumors that they love a certain QB. That just sounds like they want teams to draft QBs in front of them so it pushes a better player down. Could they go QB? Absolutely they could but I think that could lead to Gruden getting fired and then having the same problem all these other teams have when the QB is in place prior to the HC being in place.

I think Devin White goes top 5 and Oliver would be there for us. I wouldn't take the risk on Sweat either, he's not good enough against the run and the heart thing bugs me.

In comment 14394727 JonC said:

Quote:

depending on who's there, of course.

Yeah surmise same or security if lose out on a Rosen trade. But maybe they have a hard-on for an OT or an ER that falls.

lets see...

I'm just relaying what appears to be how teams are reading the tea leaves. Word is Skins are looking QB at #15, we shall see.

In comment 14394730 jayg5 said:

Quote:

My worst case scenario is Q Williams/Bosa/Allen/Oliver all off the board before 6. I really like Sweat but with that heart condition I don’t think it’s great idea to draft him at 6. In this scenario, what defensive player you see as the pick?

I'm not an insider by any means. I've had info given to me from people that work for other teams. From what I've heard if the board falls like that an AFC team thinks our pick would be Devin White.

Since February I've been saying Josh Allen will be on the board at 6. The more I hear and the more I read the more confident I feel in that statement.

If a team trades into the top 5 for a QB I think the first 5 picks will be Murray, Bosa, QB2, Quinnen & White.

If that doesn't happen I think the first 5 will be Murray, Bosa, Oliver, Quinnen & White.

I like White but don’t want an off ball LB as our pick

I’d hate that scenario

Again, I really don’t want White In that scenario. Ugh

In comment 14394739 jayg5 said:

Quote:

I like White but don’t want an off ball LB as our pick I’d hate that scenario

Why? We need help all over the place. Look at what Kuechly & Bobby Wagner have done for their teams. Look at what Darius Leonard did last year for the Colts.

footwork and tackling techniques are legit. Hard to pick an unfinished player at that spot, especially an ILB.

In comment 14394640 Big Blue '56 said:

Quote:

but my GUESS is that we are getting Rosen and that the D and OL will be prioritized.

Please let this be true.

I am expecting a trade up somewhere in rounds 2-4.

because I've not heard it one single time.

It’s just not ideal to me.

I don’t want this to turn into huge debate or making it like I don’t like
The players but picking 2 and 6 back to back years and drafting a RB
and off ball linebacker isn’t something I’d want.

In comment 14394737 JonC said:

Quote:

I'm just relaying what appears to be how teams are reading the tea leaves. Word is Skins are looking QB at #15, we shall see.

I think if the right guy falls to them then I agree but like last year I dont want to say QB as in they'll be happy with any QB. I think a name has to go with it. If I had to guess they'd be happy with one of the guys that fits what Gruden likes. I also don't think they want to give up future picks or current picks so not sure if they'll move up at all.

On a side note I just asked my buddy who is a Jets fan if there is any news on the Jets trading out of three so it increases our chances at getting one of the top 3 defenders (assuming the team is trading up for a QB). Here is his response:

Quote:

We're almost assuredly trading out of three. More talk about the Broncos trading up because Elway has his annual QB boner. But also a lot of talk about teams moving up for Q (Raiders). I did read this morning that if we can't get a good pick package we might try to trade with a team who has a unsigned Franchise guy like Grady, Clark, or Clooney.

and for a QB to go at #3, please let it happen.

That is for sure.....

I know people at Penn St. and Ohio St....and the Ohio St guy feel strongly, Haskins stays in State and goes to Cincinnati.

Exactly.

Jets trading out would give us better chance of Allen falling into our lap
Assuming team trading to 3 spot is for a QB

In comment 14394747 JonC said:

Quote:

footwork and tackling techniques are legit. Hard to pick an unfinished player at that spot, especially an ILB.

Every player in the Draft has flaws. Especially every guy that's going to be available at 6.

In comment 14394728 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

I'm not sure we are getting a picture of how things are going to happen. We've heard so many different things in the last few days. So many different opinions/info. I know the Giants haven't been good at hiding their intentions in the past, but after looking at the past few months (Odell trade, Tate signing, Shep extension) and now all of this draft info. No disrespect to our asshats (I absolutely love reading their posts) it sure seems like the Giants are doing a good job at masking their intentions.

EXACTLY. There are more stories on what the Giants are going to do at pick 6, then I can keep track of (nice job summarizing these BTW, this should be saved;))
The question is whether the Giants can keep this up next week or if folks zero in on their plans. They should leave the scouts at home until draft day;)

In comment 14394770 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

In comment 14394747 JonC said: Quote: footwork and tackling techniques are legit. Hard to pick an unfinished player at that spot, especially an ILB. Every player in the Draft has flaws. Especially every guy that's going to be available at 6.

That's a short-sighted approach.

In comment 14394765 George from PA said:

Quote:

That is for sure..... I know people at Penn St. and Ohio St....and the Ohio St guy feel strongly, Haskins stays in State and goes to Cincinnati.

A lot of people think they go QB. I read earlier this week that they only had one QB in for a private workout or visit. That was Ryan Finley.

Seems kinda hard to believe that they'd take their franchise QB in the top 11 without meeting with him or working him out. It's a possibility, but I'm a lot less sure now then I was.

Doesn't do Giants any good.

A nice summary of viewpoints on QB rankings from pundits and people in the know, but you left out the most recent bit of info in that Haskins is out.

In comment 14394777 ZogZerg said:

Quote:

Doesn't do Giants any good.

Nope.

In comment 14394773 JonC said:

Quote:

In comment 14394770 Big Rick in FL said: Quote: In comment 14394747 JonC said: Quote: footwork and tackling techniques are legit. Hard to pick an unfinished player at that spot, especially an ILB. Every player in the Draft has flaws. Especially every guy that's going to be available at 6. That's a short-sighted approach.

Not really. It's just the truth. Ed Oliver doesn't have major flaws? Rashan Gary? Montez Sweat? Josh Allen? All of them have flaws just like Devin White does. We get it. You don't like him, but at least be realistic. All of these guys have their own flaws.

In comment 14394778 Diver_Down said:

Quote:

A nice summary of viewpoints on QB rankings from pundits and people in the know, but you left out the most recent bit of info in that Haskins is out.

Gidie said something last night about not posting about the deleted thread so I left it out on purpose.

I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL.

In comment 14394728 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

I'm not sure we are getting a picture of how things are going to happen. We've heard so many different things in the last few days. Charles Robinson says Jones is QB1. Peter Schrager said Lock is QB1. Joey in VA says Jones is QB4 and we aren't taking a QB at 6. JonC & JT have said Lock & Jones are their top 2 QBs, but they don't know which order. Matt Miller says Haskins is QB1. Both Miller & Rapoport say Haskins at 6 is a strong possibility. Peppers has said he's heard more about Haskins then any other QB. Stapleton & Ranaan have both said Lock is QB1. We've heard it's going to be a Defender at 6 and a trade up for a QB is on the table. Schefter said he believes we end up with Rosen. So many different opinions/info. I know the Giants haven't been good at hiding their intentions in the past, but after looking at the past few months (Odell trade, Tate signing, Shep extension) and now all of this draft info. No disrespect to our asshats (I absolutely love reading their posts) it sure seems like the Giants are doing a good job at masking their intentions.

And out of all those guys , the ones with the best information /longest track record is Jtgiants and JonC.

Jones and Lock are very likely the top 2 and Jones is likely QB1 as the Giants love familiarity. Cutliffe connection, Manning connection etc. etc.

I think they really like Grier too but have no idea how close the grade is to Jones.

There could always be a last minute change of thinking but would still be very suprised if they went QB at 6.

Giants are a very big value and investment team. Itd be hard to play Eli in 2020 if they take a QB at 6. Don't know if they are ready to do that.

But if the big 3 defenders are gone. BPA gets alot more murky. What type of thought process will win out at that point?

I hope they somehow find a way to land Q.Williams. I think he is the #1 guy on their board.

If he or Josh Allen drop the value of the pass rush defender at 6 becomes super, super high.

In comment 14394738 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

In comment 14394730 jayg5 said: Quote: My worst case scenario is Q Williams/Bosa/Allen/Oliver all off the board before 6. I really like Sweat but with that heart condition I don’t think it’s great idea to draft him at 6. In this scenario, what defensive player you see as the pick? I'm not an insider by any means. I've had info given to me from people that work for other teams. From what I've heard if the board falls like that an AFC team thinks our pick would be Devin White. Since February I've been saying Josh Allen will be on the board at 6. The more I hear and the more I read the more confident I feel in that statement. If a team trades into the top 5 for a QB I think the first 5 picks will be Murray, Bosa, QB2, Quinnen & White. If that doesn't happen I think the first 5 will be Murray, Bosa, Oliver, Quinnen & White.

I’ll be pumped if the Giants get Allen at 6 — would be an awesome start.

In comment 14394788 JonC said:

Quote:

I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL.

Yeah obviously the idea is to build around the pass rush. If Allen, Bosa, Quinnen & Oliver are off the board then White has to be considered as he's probably the top player left on the board.

and I'd rather not find out.

In comment 14394763 JonC said:

Quote:

and for a QB to go at #3, please let it happen.

This is one of the key scenarios if we are hoping for one of the blue chip guys to make it to us.

Trading up to 4 with Oak could be another one.

In comment 14394788 JonC said:

Quote:

I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL.

I would actually prefer Bush to White, especially at 17 vs. 6. I think Bush would serve the “moneybacker” role beautifully ... White scares me. Outside of his measurables and “upside”, not a fan (at 6 anyway).

Yeah they definitely do, but nobody has really had any info this offseason. Nobody thought Odell was getting trade this year. Nobody knew about the Golden Tate signing. Nobody knew about the Shepard extension. Or if they did know nobody posted about it. So IMO the Giants have done a much better job hiding their intentions.

In comment 14394800 JonC said:

Quote:

and I'd rather not find out.

I 100% agree that White is going to Tampa. There's also a strong possibility they take Oliver/Quinnen if they are on the board.

at #5.

A pure lb with questionable instincts is worth a top ten pick? I get his upside is sky high, but I'm not taking a lb with questionable instincts there. I live in TB and was telling my buddy it would be the most Bucs pick ever because it seems they are locked in.

In comment 14394805 JonC said:

Quote:

at #5.

Jon have you heard anything with Oliver? Does the character stuff check out with them? We both know they want the super squeaky clean guy especially that high in the draft.

has a few more players in that top tier than the media does.

Gettleman has a relationship with the Bills GM, the Giants have plenty of picks & the Bills need to recoup some picks after trading up for Allen last year. This will allow the Giants to draft a defensive playmaker & secure a successor to Eli if any of the QB’s make the cut.

Who want to trade high picks for a coach killer literal trash QB in a deep draft. Some bbiers iq are as low as Rosen's qbr.

In comment 14394818 Sean said:

Quote:

Gettleman has a relationship with the Bills GM, the Giants have plenty of picks & the Bills need to recoup some picks after trading up for Allen last year. This will allow the Giants to draft a defensive playmaker & secure a successor to Eli if any of the QB’s make the cut.

They have 10 picks, 1-3 and 2 4’s ... 17 to 9 may be a bit pricey

That's the question, do you gamble on his upside and personality. Regarding Oliver, all I've heard is he's in the mix.

In comment 14394802 GothamGiants said:

Quote:

In comment 14394788 JonC said: Quote: I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL. I would actually prefer Bush to White, especially at 17 vs. 6. I think Bush would serve the “moneybacker” role beautifully ... White scares me. Outside of his measurables and “upside”, not a fan (at 6 anyway).

I think saying he's only got measurables and upside is absurd. He's got great burst to find the ball carrier. Very good at shooting gaps. Very good change of direction. Has shown to be good in man & zone coverage.

Yes he definitely has flaws. Technique being one of them, but everything I've read is that he's very coachable and a student of the game. That's something that's coachable. Remember he was a RB out of HS and just about every scouting report says he got much better at diagnosing plays from 2017-2018. As he becomes more comfortable with the position that's most likely going to improve.

In comment 14394803 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

Yeah they definitely do, but nobody has really had any info this offseason. Nobody thought Odell was getting trade this year. Nobody knew about the Golden Tate signing. Nobody knew about the Shepard extension. Or if they did know nobody posted about it. So IMO the Giants have done a much better job hiding their intentions.

If you saw how ridiculosuly aggressive DG has been trading away big names and then Odell AGAIN pissing management off after his big contract you would not be surprised.

I was telling all my buddies DGs MO has been culture improvement as priority 1. Hitdog said Gaints wanted to see commitment from him and then theyd give him another chance (i.e the huge contract) after he pulled the Lil Wayne stuff it left them quite disappointed that he was never going to be the team player and or mature.

At that point knowing how DG operates the trade was not a surprise in the least.

Shepherd aside getting mixed up a bit with Odell is an excellent character guy. Excellent.

While no one knew for sure beforehand perhaps these moves are totally in line with Daves M.O.

In comment 14394826 JonC said:

Quote:

That's the question, do you gamble on his upside and personality. Regarding Oliver, all I've heard is he's in the mix.

Is Sweat’s heart condition a concern for them? I like his upside, but understand the hesitation. I really hate this idea of trading up for a QB in this class - especially doing so in between 2018/2020 classes.

.

In comment 14394826 JonC said:

Quote:

That's the question, do you gamble on his upside and personality. Regarding Oliver, all I've heard is he's in the mix.

At #6 you cannot gamble on upside. They need a starter without questions(reasonable questions). DG has stated repeatedly that they need to pressure the QB. If you could say D White was an NFL starting ILB at minimum, but could be a perennial All Pro with technique changes, then I could see him being picked, especially if he could blitz.
But I think they go with the bigger body because at worst they still have Ogletree. An at #17 the have a decent chance at D Bush....

In comment 14394827 Big Rick in FL said:

Quote:

In comment 14394802 GothamGiants said: Quote: In comment 14394788 JonC said: Quote: I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL. I would actually prefer Bush to White, especially at 17 vs. 6. I think Bush would serve the “moneybacker” role beautifully ... White scares me. Outside of his measurables and “upside”, not a fan (at 6 anyway). I think saying he's only got measurables and upside is absurd. He's got great burst to find the ball carrier. Very good at shooting gaps. Very good change of direction. Has shown to be good in man & zone coverage. Yes he definitely has flaws. Technique being one of them, but everything I've read is that he's very coachable and a student of the game. That's something that's coachable. Remember he was a RB out of HS and just about every scouting report says he got much better at diagnosing plays from 2017-2018. As he becomes more comfortable with the position that's most likely going to improve.

So saying he’s only got measurables and upside is “absurd” ... but then you literally only list his positives that would be related to measurables and upside.

I am not taking a LB top 10 who can run fast and change direction but needs to learn how to play the position better and learn how to tackle properly.

Sounds a whole lot like a prospect with great measurables and “upside”, with potential flaws directly linked to playing the position itself. I don’t care if he can run fast when he’s out of position or can’t wrap up consistently when he gets there.

In comment 14394805 JonC said:

Quote:

at #5.

I think there is a lot higher possibility the Bucs take him then people think. The Bucs have one position set with Lavonte David. They just signed Deone Buchanon. It all depends on the health of Kendell Beckwith. He flashed big time in 2017. If they feel he will overcome his injury then I could see them passing on White.

Also McCoy is probably going to be cut so the Bucs will need someone who replaces him.

In comment 14394826 JonC said:

Quote:

That's the question, do you gamble on his upside and personality. Regarding Oliver, all I've heard is he's in the mix.

With Oak system,philosophy and current personnel Olivers grade may be closer to Quinnen's grade than our grades have them lined up. Quinnen is the best value for this team in my opinion and has the better character (its squeaky clean) over Oliver. Hes the perfect candidate for lead dog on the line that DG was referring to. He specifically mentioned Bethea a lead dog and Ogletree, yet no one on the DL.

Im not saying Oliver wouldnt be a good pick just that in terms of fit for what they are trying to do and establish here, Quinnen would be an amazing pick and in a tier all his own.

level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins.

made it clear that it's important that whoever they get at QB will always be in the spotlight and under presser in the media capital of the world. Bingo...doesn't sound like a Rosen fit to me. Can't imagine giants holding onto that possible time bomb.

In comment 14394847 Zeke's Alibi said:

Quote:

level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins.

There is only 1 remote thrower for me ... and that is Haskins at 6. Gettleman didn’t mince words about his intent to build up this defense ... the problem is this draft’s depth may actually incline them to go QB early and still feel like they can land a quality d prospect at 17 or 37

Daniel Jones, Dexter Lawrence, Jaylon Ferguson? Wouldn’t be shocked if they went this route. There’s no clear cut D “must have” once Williams and Bosa and Allen go.

.

In comment 14394841 GothamGiants said:

Quote:

In comment 14394827 Big Rick in FL said: Quote: In comment 14394802 GothamGiants said: Quote: In comment 14394788 JonC said: Quote: I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL. I would actually prefer Bush to White, especially at 17 vs. 6. I think Bush would serve the “moneybacker” role beautifully ... White scares me. Outside of his measurables and “upside”, not a fan (at 6 anyway). I think saying he's only got measurables and upside is absurd. He's got great burst to find the ball carrier. Very good at shooting gaps. Very good change of direction. Has shown to be good in man & zone coverage. Yes he definitely has flaws. Technique being one of them, but everything I've read is that he's very coachable and a student of the game. That's something that's coachable. Remember he was a RB out of HS and just about every scouting report says he got much better at diagnosing plays from 2017-2018. As he becomes more comfortable with the position that's most likely going to improve. So saying he’s only got measurables and upside is “absurd” ... but then you literally only list his positives that would be related to measurables and upside. I am not taking a LB top 10 who can run fast and change direction but needs to learn how to play the position better and learn how to tackle properly. Sounds a whole lot like a prospect with great measurables and “upside”, with potential flaws directly linked to playing the position itself. I don’t care if he can run fast when he’s out of position or can’t wrap up consistently when he gets there.

What? A LB that's good in coverage & good at shooting gaps isn't measurables or upside. Also being able to close on the ball carrier and change directions is very important for a LB.

It's not like he was some workout warrior. His production in the SEC was great. Especially since he's brand new at the position. The last 2 seasons he's played 26 games. He's got 256 tackles, 25.5 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 1 INT, 9 pass deflections, 5 forced fumbles and recoveries.

So he's got the measurables and upside while also being an extremely productive player in the best conference in college football.

In comment 14394850 Blue21 said:

Quote:

made it clear that it's important that whoever they get at QB will always be in the spotlight and under presser in the media capital of the world. Bingo...doesn't sound like a Rosen fit to me. Can't imagine giants holding onto that possible time bomb.

Said a lot about “Adversity” too when it comes to evaluating players ... I don’t know his life story, but he seems more like a trust fund brat then someone who struggled to get to this point (he doesn’t exactly “need” football, similar to Manziel in that regard)

In comment 14394847 Zeke's Alibi said:

Quote:

level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins.

I haven't heard specifically other than they've got six top grades. My educated guess would be Oliver and White ... and they might have higher grades on Wilkins and Lawrence than expected.

In comment 14394847 Zeke's Alibi said:

Quote:

level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins.

That doesn't necessarily mean that a couple of the guys have a moderately higher grade than the other ones. Like Q.Williams at 92, Bosa and Allen at 87 but the other few at 83-84 or so. 83 is still a strong grade but not quite the stellar grade of Q.

In comment 14394856 Big Rick in FL said:

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In comment 14394841 GothamGiants said: Quote: In comment 14394827 Big Rick in FL said: Quote: In comment 14394802 GothamGiants said: Quote: In comment 14394788 JonC said: Quote: I like White, but we build around pass rush especially picking #6. An ILB with instinct and technique questions is risky. Those instincts tend to not suddenly show up in the NFL. I would actually prefer Bush to White, especially at 17 vs. 6. I think Bush would serve the “moneybacker” role beautifully ... White scares me. Outside of his measurables and “upside”, not a fan (at 6 anyway). I think saying he's only got measurables and upside is absurd. He's got great burst to find the ball carrier. Very good at shooting gaps. Very good change of direction. Has shown to be good in man & zone coverage. Yes he definitely has flaws. Technique being one of them, but everything I've read is that he's very coachable and a student of the game. That's something that's coachable. Remember he was a RB out of HS and just about every scouting report says he got much better at diagnosing plays from 2017-2018. As he becomes more comfortable with the position that's most likely going to improve. So saying he’s only got measurables and upside is “absurd” ... but then you literally only list his positives that would be related to measurables and upside. I am not taking a LB top 10 who can run fast and change direction but needs to learn how to play the position better and learn how to tackle properly. Sounds a whole lot like a prospect with great measurables and “upside”, with potential flaws directly linked to playing the position itself. I don’t care if he can run fast when he’s out of position or can’t wrap up consistently when he gets there. What? A LB that's good in coverage & good at shooting gaps isn't measurables or upside. Also being able to close on the ball carrier and change directions is very important for a LB. It's not like he was some workout warrior. His production in the SEC was great. Especially since he's brand new at the position. The last 2 seasons he's played 26 games. He's got 256 tackles, 25.5 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 1 INT, 9 pass deflections, 5 forced fumbles and recoveries. So he's got the measurables and upside while also being an extremely productive player in the best conference in college football.

Coverage and “shooting gaps” requires what exactly? Athleticism? Measurables? Changing direction? Not agility? Not included in measurables?

He can move, he’s very athletic, that’s what “measurables” are. When his flaws include instincts to play the position and tackling technique, I have a big problem taking that LB top 10. He’s a great athlete with great measurables and great upside.

His flaws just actually happen to be 2 of the most important aspects of playing the position. That is not a top 5 pick in my eyes. Agree to disagree.

In comment 14394859 JonC said:

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In comment 14394847 Zeke's Alibi said: Quote: level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins. I haven't heard specifically other than they've got six top grades. My educated guess would be Oliver and White ... and they might have higher grades on Wilkins and Lawrence than expected.

If they dont get a guy with some beef and has versatility to play the interior at 6, those guys would be very much in play for 17 I would think.

In comment 14394859 JonC said:

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In comment 14394847 Zeke's Alibi said: Quote: level D prospects as he didn't seem worried about landing a prospect in the same tier? I'm assuming Bosa, Q, Allen, but the other two? You said no Sweat so I'm thinking Oliver and Gary? Unless this truly is a smokescreen for Haskins. I haven't heard specifically other than they've got six top grades. My educated guess would be Oliver and White ... and they might have higher grades on Wilkins and Lawrence than expected.

Lawrence is exactly what this team needs, Snacks 2.0. I could see Wilkins versatility being the tie breaker v Lawrence ... I’d be happy with either Clemson DT though.

In comment 14394857 GothamGiants said:

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In comment 14394850 Blue21 said: Quote: made it clear that it's important that whoever they get at QB will always be in the spotlight and under presser in the media capital of the world. Bingo...doesn't sound like a Rosen fit to me. Can't imagine giants holding onto that possible time bomb. Said a lot about “Adversity” too when it comes to evaluating players ... I don’t know his life story, but he seems more like a trust fund brat then someone who struggled to get to this point (he doesn’t exactly “need” football, similar to Manziel in that regard)

Do Giants want Josh Rosen as face of the franchise? I can't see it regardless of how beautiful a football he throws.

In comment 14394856 Big Rick in FL said:

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It's not like he was some workout warrior. His production in the SEC was great. Especially since he's brand new at the position. The last 2 seasons he's played 26 games. He's got 256 tackles, 25.5 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 1 INT, 9 pass deflections, 5 forced fumbles and recoveries. So he's got the measurables and upside while also being an extremely productive player in the best conference in college football.

So, I can see who you want in the draft. Sometimes a player is so obvious it is hard to understand how he was passed over. Other times he seems so obvious to the standard fan that they don't see the obvious faults. Remember Rolando McClain or Ryan Leaf?
Just speculation, as to why he isn't a can't miss top 5 player.

Defensive draft but wouldn’t the highest rated tackle be on par with the sixth rated defensive player? I can only imagine what Saquon can do behind a good o line. I mean he ran for 1300 last year behind our really bad line.
Can’t wait till Thursday so I can stop flip flopping. Change my mind daily it seems

In comment 14394869 section125 said:

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In comment 14394856 Big Rick in FL said: Quote: It's not like he was some workout warrior. His production in the SEC was great. Especially since he's brand new at the position. The last 2 seasons he's played 26 games. He's got 256 tackles, 25.5 TFL, 7.5 sacks, 1 INT, 9 pass deflections, 5 forced fumbles and recoveries. So he's got the measurables and upside while also being an extremely productive player in the best conference in college football. So, I can see who you want in the draft. Sometimes a player is so obvious it is hard to understand how he was passed over. Other times he seems so obvious to the standard fan that they don't see the obvious faults. Remember Rolando McClain or Ryan Leaf? Just speculation, as to why he isn't a can't miss top 5 player.

There are rarely any can't miss players. I'd be happy with Devin White. We haven't had a good LB in forever. He's definitely not my top choice though. I like Bosa, Allen, Quinnen & Oliver more. If those 4 are gone I definitely think he's a better option then Lawrence, Wilkins, Sweat and Gary.

we need defense at 6 & 17. Our 2nd rounder should be BPA but hoping for WR or an OL that slipped a bit. I hope we take a center at some point in the draft as well. I also believe we trade up a few times. No way we use all 12 picks.

In comment 14394887 Mark from Jersey said:

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we need defense at 6 & 17. Our 2nd rounder should be BPA but hoping for WR or an OL that slipped a bit. I hope we take a center at some point in the draft as well. I also believe we trade up a few times. No way we use all 12 picks.

Gettleman said something to the effect that 12 picks is a ridiculous amount of picks and we dont want to have to cut too many players. Given his propensity for trade ups regardless, expect quite a few jumps maybe even moving up from 6.

In comment 14394874 Fast Eddie said:

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Defensive draft but wouldn’t the highest rated tackle be on par with the sixth rated defensive player? I can only imagine what Saquon can do behind a good o line. I mean he ran for 1300 last year behind our really bad line. Can’t wait till Thursday so I can stop flip flopping. Change my mind daily it seems

Gettleman mentioned OT as “thick” (deep w/ prospects) in addition to DL ... I wouldn’t mind Jonah or Jawaan Taylor @ 6 if they chose to go D at 17.

I love Risner in round 2 (C/RT starter day 1). QB seems like a high probability round 1 these days ... I’d have a hard time going OL/QB with both picks in a draft so loaded on defense.

in what DG calls "the deepest draft he's seen as a GM", rounds 1-4.

Since the draft is deep, if we are at #6 and one of the "Big 3" QB's is there; HOWEVER, he isn't high on our draft board despite our need for a young QB to groom, does DG consider any trade down offers? I say "Why Not???" if its a deep draft, right?

I am still holding out hope we get Denver's #1 (10th pick) and #2 which we in turn convert to #10 - OL; and #17, hopefully a DL of merit who falls. We need both positions.

And, in the 2nd round, we get two chances to fix the defense more as the draft is defense heavy.

Thoughts? Hopes?? Dreams???

In comment 14394928 GothamGiants said:

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In comment 14394874 Fast Eddie said: Quote: Defensive draft but wouldn’t the highest rated tackle be on par with the sixth rated defensive player? I can only imagine what Saquon can do behind a good o line. I mean he ran for 1300 last year behind our really bad line. Can’t wait till Thursday so I can stop flip flopping. Change my mind daily it seems Gettleman mentioned OT as “thick” (deep w/ prospects) in addition to DL ... I wouldn’t mind Jonah or Jawaan Taylor @ 6 if they chose to go D at 17. I love Risner in round 2 (C/RT starter day 1). QB seems like a high probability round 1 these days ... I’d have a hard time going OL/QB with both picks in a draft so loaded on defense.

And then he said thankfully secondary (as if for emphasis)
I dont expect a CB until pick 95 earliest (unless obvious BPA)

In comment 14394695 Eric from BBI said:

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two take-aways from Gettleman's press conference: (1) Regardless of the first 5 picks, he said there will be a defensive player worthy of the #6 pick. (2) He feels this is the deepest draft in rounds 1-4 that he has seen in seven years (he tenure as GM at two teams). If the Giants trade away a 2nd, 3rd, and/or 4th round pick, Gettleman is going to lose a quality player.

If the Giants really want a QB and don't want to give up a premium pick to get one, they will have to pick a QB at 6.

If all the information leaking out is true, I maintain the Giants have a huge, huge issue in their front office and need to get it fixed immediately.

In comment 14394945 Giantz_comeback said:

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In comment 14394928 GothamGiants said: Quote: In comment 14394874 Fast Eddie said: Quote: Defensive draft but wouldn’t the highest rated tackle be on par with the sixth rated defensive player? I can only imagine what Saquon can do behind a good o line. I mean he ran for 1300 last year behind our really bad line. Can’t wait till Thursday so I can stop flip flopping. Change my mind daily it seems Gettleman mentioned OT as “thick” (deep w/ prospects) in addition to DL ... I wouldn’t mind Jonah or Jawaan Taylor @ 6 if they chose to go D at 17. I love Risner in round 2 (C/RT starter day 1). QB seems like a high probability round 1 these days ... I’d have a hard time going OL/QB with both picks in a draft so loaded on defense. And then he said thankfully secondary (as if for emphasis) I dont expect a CB until pick 95 earliest (unless obvious BPA)

If they don’t trade up, i expect a “cluster” of DBs drafted 3-5th round

In comment 14394816 Giantz_comeback said:

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In comment 14394805 JonC said: Quote: at #5. Jon have you heard anything with Oliver? Does the character stuff check out with them? We both know they want the super squeaky clean guy especially that high in the draft.

Ed Oliver scares the shit out of me. He looks like a stud on film, but i was told he was "entitled and lazy" at Houston.

I disagree. I have no clue what they are doing.

In comment 14395027 Giants38 said:

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If all the information leaking out is true, I maintain the Giants have a huge, huge issue in their front office and need to get it fixed immediately.

What is leaking? They have been linked with 3 QBs, 2 DTs, 3 ER/DEs, 2 LBs...
Nothing leads to anything.

Only thing we have is JonC and jt think they want to go DL at #6 and even they aren't sure...

LOL yep. As I've iterated before I'd be leery if I was sitting with Gettelman at a Hold'em table. For all his purported 'honesty' he oozes sneaky to me. You gotta watch out for those guys when the stakes are high.

In comment 14394695 Eric from BBI said:

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two take-aways from Gettleman's press conference: (1) Regardless of the first 5 picks, he said there will be a defensive player worthy of the #6 pick. (2) He feels this is the deepest draft in rounds 1-4 that he has seen in seven years (he tenure as GM at two teams). If the Giants trade away a 2nd, 3rd, and/or 4th round pick, Gettleman is going to lose a quality player.

One solution to that problem is to trade down from #6. This is a deep defensive draft. Move down from six to maybe 10 or 11, and take Burns. Then you have the ammunition to trade back up from #37 without suffering a net loss of day two draft picks.

I don't want to trade up for Jones, even to say, #15. I wouldn't even take him at #17. But I think the issue is moot, because the Giants will have to trade up to at least #9 to guarantee they get him. And the cost to do that will be exorbitant unless they have extra capital from a prior trade down. The problem of course is that it is very unlikely the Giants will trade down from #6.

I do think the Giants will draft a QB early, and my guess is that it will be Grier. I also wouldn't be surprised if the Giants trade down from #17, and then trade up again into the third round using some of their day three picks.

In comment 14394750 JonC said:

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because I've not heard it one single time.

My ideal situation is Rosen for 37 and/or trading some of the extra picks to get another second round or early third round pick to go after more of that early round depth.

I'll never understand how the value of Rosen at 37 wouldn't exceed the value of any other player the Giants could get at 37.

In comment 14395324 Danny80 said:

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In comment 14394750 JonC said: Quote: because I've not heard it one single time. My ideal situation is Rosen for 37 and/or trading some of the extra picks to get another second round or early third round pick to go after more of that early round depth. I'll never understand how the value of Rosen at 37 wouldn't exceed the value of any other player the Giants could get at 37.

The reported issue with Rosen is based on personality.

I know you don’t want a QB this year, do you not like any? I just think if DG has a 1st round grade on any of these guys it would make sense.

I think waiting until next year is risky & a lot of teams will be in on QB next year.