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NFT: Ranger Fans' guide to playoffs

Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 8:49 am
We still have rooting interests that affect our draft.

Next Round: Root for Carolina, Columbus and Colorado all to WIN. Our Winnipeg pick can go as 'high' as 18! (Now up from 22 to 21 because of Carolina's win last night).

Conference Finals: Root for Columbus to LOSE so as our 4th and 7th round picks from McQuaid trade don't drop.
The only reason to root for Carolina:  
The_Boss : 4/25/2019 8:50 am : link
They’re playing the Islanders.
RE: The only reason to root for Carolina:  
Jints in Carolina : 4/25/2019 8:52 am : link
In comment 14403477 The_Boss said:
Quote:
They’re playing the Islanders.


and obviously because of me.........
RE: The only reason to root for Carolina:  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 8:54 am : link
In comment 14403477 The_Boss said:
Quote:
They’re playing the Islanders.

Let's play nice and keep it positive, not schadenfreude.

Send out good juju that gave us the second pick.
Don't we also have to root for the Stars  
figgy2989 : 4/25/2019 8:55 am : link
to make the conference finals so we get their first?
Don't we want Dallas to win?  
rnargi : 4/25/2019 8:56 am : link
?
Sorry missed that one  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 9:01 am : link
yes -- Stars have to get to the finals and Zuk has to play at least one game this next series.

That one is burnt in on my forehead -- so obvious I forgot.

Lots of interests in the next round!

If the price of all this is COL going all the way, that's fine with me. Also, would that make Davidson moving to us more likely?
Sorry  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 9:02 am : link
again. I think of CBJ as COL -- forgot about the other COL.
Not exactly jay  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 9:04 am : link
at least I don’t think the pick has changed yet. I’m walking to the train station but I’ll check soon. Basically if BOS NYI SJS AND STL make the Conf finals then the pick stays as is. The only time your draft spot changes is if you make the Conf finals. So the rangers need a team who finished with a worse record than WIN to make the conference finals for that pick to move at all. I forget who those teams are but CAR series 1 win doesn’t change anything. Yet.

Anyway the closer to 1 the better for a draft pick obvio. But not s huge diff between 18 and 22

RE: Not exactly jay  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 9:13 am : link
In comment 14403544 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
at least I don’t think the pick has changed yet. I’m walking to the train station but I’ll check soon. Basically if BOS NYI SJS AND STL make the Conf finals then the pick stays as is. The only time your draft spot changes is if you make the Conf finals. So the rangers need a team who finished with a worse record than WIN to make the conference finals for that pick to move at all. I forget who those teams are but CAR series 1 win doesn’t change anything. Yet.

Anyway the closer to 1 the better for a draft pick obvio. But not s huge diff between 18 and 22


I think that CAR beating WSH moved us up one, but please correct if I am wrong.

Hmm, not sure about your last point. The Rangers gave up a Round 2 pick to move up from 26 to 22 to nab K'Andre Miller.
It didnt  
MetsAreBack : 4/25/2019 9:35 am : link
because Caps would have faced the Isles next round and both would pick behind Winnipeg anyway. We were always 21 (for now)

But honestly - is there something one could possible care less about? (21 vs 22 going into last night)
Stars  
PaulN : 4/25/2019 9:35 am : link
Have to win the next round, then we get a first round pick. The conference finals, not the Stanley Cup finals, the other piece was Zuccarello had to play at least in 50% of the games, he will do that.
Hopefully Dallas signs Zucc  
MetsAreBack : 4/25/2019 9:38 am : link
he looked good against NSH from the limited I saw... and that 2020 conditional turns into a 3rd!

(I know... fat chance... but still more realistic than some of the Josh Rosen for a 3rd rounder fantasies going on here!)
2020 turns into a first I meant...  
MetsAreBack : 4/25/2019 9:38 am : link
.
We want Dallas  
Professor Falken : 4/25/2019 9:44 am : link
to win this next round, then lose in the Conference Finals. That gives us the highest first rounder possible from them in this draft. We then want Dallas to re-sign Zucc so we get another first rounder from them in 2020 draft.
with the mention of Miller  
ColHowPepper : 4/25/2019 10:27 am : link
this from The Athletic this morning (brief squib from an entire article devoted to him, to avoid ruffling Jay (: )
Quote:
Granato thinks Miller will be a top-pair for a long time.
“The comparables for me for the NHL, I think worst-case scenario – and this is no slam – is Jay Bouwmeester,” Granato said of the 16-year NHL veteran. “Bouwmeester’s been a really good player for a long time. Bouwmeester skates and recovers and I think Kee’s got some more to his game than Jay might (have). Jay’s really really good and he’s had a great career. I think (Miller) is going to be as good or better than Jay. Size, skating ability, recovery ability. The recovery ability and the athleticism on plays that – NHL players are going to make plays – but his ability to not bail out on himself and to be able to recover is different than any other player, young defenseman, that I’ve seen.
“I mean, he’s got a little bit of Rob Blake in him that way, because of his size....
good site  
Ross : 4/25/2019 10:32 am : link
explaining the draft position and possible outcomes.
link - ( New Window )
RE: with the mention of Miller  
Ross : 4/25/2019 10:34 am : link
In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
this from The Athletic this morning (brief squib from an entire article devoted to him, to avoid ruffling Jay (: )

Quote:


Granato thinks Miller will be a top-pair for a long time.
“The comparables for me for the NHL, I think worst-case scenario – and this is no slam – is Jay Bouwmeester,” Granato said of the 16-year NHL veteran. “Bouwmeester’s been a really good player for a long time. Bouwmeester skates and recovers and I think Kee’s got some more to his game than Jay might (have). Jay’s really really good and he’s had a great career. I think (Miller) is going to be as good or better than Jay. Size, skating ability, recovery ability. The recovery ability and the athleticism on plays that – NHL players are going to make plays – but his ability to not bail out on himself and to be able to recover is different than any other player, young defenseman, that I’ve seen.
“I mean, he’s got a little bit of Rob Blake in him that way, because of his size....



Miller looks like he's the real deal and may wind up being a top paring all star type of defense-man. Something this team really needs badly. In a few years, both him and Fox (assuming he get him) will be two tremendous pieces in this re-vamped young team.
Jay you are right but it has nothing to do with CAR win  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 10:35 am : link
the pick did move up to 21, but only because STL and DAL advanced and both finished worse than WIN, and now one of them is guaranteed to make the conference finals.

the way the NHL draft works is the 4 teams who make the conference finals pick in the last 4 spots, the rest of the teams no matter how far you get in the playoffs draft reverse order of regular season standings.

So even if teams like DAL or CAR lose this round they still pick ahead of WIN (NYR)
RE: with the mention of Miller  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 10:59 am : link
In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
this from The Athletic this morning (brief squib from an entire article devoted to him, to avoid ruffling Jay (: )

Quote:


Granato thinks Miller will be a top-pair for a long time.
“The comparables for me for the NHL, I think worst-case scenario – and this is no slam – is Jay Bouwmeester,” Granato said of the 16-year NHL veteran. “Bouwmeester’s been a really good player for a long time. Bouwmeester skates and recovers and I think Kee’s got some more to his game than Jay might (have). Jay’s really really good and he’s had a great career. I think (Miller) is going to be as good or better than Jay. Size, skating ability, recovery ability. The recovery ability and the athleticism on plays that – NHL players are going to make plays – but his ability to not bail out on himself and to be able to recover is different than any other player, young defenseman, that I’ve seen.
“I mean, he’s got a little bit of Rob Blake in him that way, because of his size....



Miller has an insane combination of size, speed, and skill. Think Kreider-like potential with that combination, but in a better program to develop under Granato.

I do think he needs to work on his D b/c as a converted forward he clearly excelled when I watched him at getting into the offensive play, but more than once I saw him lose his man defensively - this was in the U20 worlds in December, which will take time. I love the Bouwmeester comp.

Rangers fans should be so lucky, that's a 10+ year rock on the blue line if that's worst case like Granato says.

RE: with the mention of Miller  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 11:37 am : link
In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
this from The Athletic this morning (brief squib from an entire article devoted to him, to avoid ruffling Jay (: )

Quote:


Granato thinks Miller will be a top-pair for a long time.
“The comparables for me for the NHL, I think worst-case scenario – and this is no slam – is Jay Bouwmeester,” Granato said of the 16-year NHL veteran. “Bouwmeester’s been a really good player for a long time. Bouwmeester skates and recovers and I think Kee’s got some more to his game than Jay might (have). Jay’s really really good and he’s had a great career. I think (Miller) is going to be as good or better than Jay. Size, skating ability, recovery ability. The recovery ability and the athleticism on plays that – NHL players are going to make plays – but his ability to not bail out on himself and to be able to recover is different than any other player, young defenseman, that I’ve seen.
“I mean, he’s got a little bit of Rob Blake in him that way, because of his size....



Great article by Carp -- and more comps from their D coach. I think Miller is in a great place for development -- and with next year's influx of world talent, hopefully a fun season.
RE: RE: with the mention of Miller  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 11:43 am : link
In comment 14404057 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:


Quote:


this from The Athletic this morning (brief squib from an entire article devoted to him, to avoid ruffling Jay (: )

Quote:


Granato thinks Miller will be a top-pair for a long time.
“The comparables for me for the NHL, I think worst-case scenario – and this is no slam – is Jay Bouwmeester,” Granato said of the 16-year NHL veteran. “Bouwmeester’s been a really good player for a long time. Bouwmeester skates and recovers and I think Kee’s got some more to his game than Jay might (have). Jay’s really really good and he’s had a great career. I think (Miller) is going to be as good or better than Jay. Size, skating ability, recovery ability. The recovery ability and the athleticism on plays that – NHL players are going to make plays – but his ability to not bail out on himself and to be able to recover is different than any other player, young defenseman, that I’ve seen.
“I mean, he’s got a little bit of Rob Blake in him that way, because of his size....





Miller has an insane combination of size, speed, and skill. Think Kreider-like potential with that combination, but in a better program to develop under Granato.

I do think he needs to work on his D b/c as a converted forward he clearly excelled when I watched him at getting into the offensive play, but more than once I saw him lose his man defensively - this was in the U20 worlds in December, which will take time. I love the Bouwmeester comp.

Rangers fans should be so lucky, that's a 10+ year rock on the blue line if that's worst case like Granato says.


Thanks for the clarification re the position.

My original point re Miller is that four spots in Round 1 is not a trivial matter.

Granato mentioned that Miller's recovery (skating and reach) is exceptional. He will learn a lot under Mark Osiecki. Hate for the Badgers to lose him , but maybe he should replace Ruff.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 4/25/2019 12:10 pm : link
I forgot Bouwmeester was in the league until a few weeks ago. Feels like he's been around forever.
Stars make the Western Conference Finals ...  
Torrag : 4/25/2019 12:12 pm : link
...and we get a 1st Rounder.

Your 'Playoff Guide' is a mess lol.
let's go Zuuuuucc  
Davisian : 4/25/2019 12:14 pm : link
Or Av's.

RE: RE: with the mention of Miller  
ColHowPepper : 4/25/2019 12:36 pm : link
In comment 14404237 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:...///
Great article by Carp -- and more comps from their D coach. I think Miller is in a great place for development -- and with next year's influx of world talent, hopefully a fun season.
Not sure what you meant but iirc Carp believes K'A will stay at UW at least one more year.
Quote:
Where Miller wants to go is from Madison, Wisconsin to Madison Square Garden. But he is not in a rush to get there. He won’t say definitively, but Miller won’t turn pro now, instead planning and training for his sophomore season with the Badgers. Granato and the Rangers’ front office all believe he will play one more year of college hockey, at least.
“I think that would probably be the best decision for me,” Miller told The Athletic.
RE: ....  
Greg from LI : 4/25/2019 12:40 pm : link
In comment 14404415 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
I forgot Bouwmeester was in the league until a few weeks ago. Feels like he's been around forever.


Well, this is his 17th season so, yeah, he's been around forever.
RE: RE: ....  
BrettNYG10 : 4/25/2019 2:48 pm : link
In comment 14404554 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
In comment 14404415 BrettNYG10 said:


Quote:


I forgot Bouwmeester was in the league until a few weeks ago. Feels like he's been around forever.



Well, this is his 17th season so, yeah, he's been around forever.


Longer than I've been alive.
it's kind of crazy how long some hockey careers are  
Greg from LI : 4/25/2019 3:02 pm : link
Given how brutal the game can be. Bouwmeester is in his 17th season, yet isn't even among the top ten oldest players. Four guys played their 21st season this year - Matt Cullen, Chara, Marleau, and Thornton.
....  
BrettNYG10 : 4/25/2019 5:03 pm : link
It is. I think hockey has more ways around natural declines in athleticism than other sports. Thornton is slow as shit, for example, but makes it work.
RE: ....  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 5:12 pm : link
In comment 14405617 BrettNYG10 said:
Quote:
It is. I think hockey has more ways around natural declines in athleticism than other sports. Thornton is slow as shit, for example, but makes it work.


Look at Chara, I think he should retire (or at least not be a top pair D), but he's still better than probably a third of the D in the league at least and he's 42. He's old enough to be your father.
RE: good site  
02/03/2008 : 4/25/2019 5:13 pm : link
In comment 14403939 Ross said:
Quote:
explaining the draft position and possible outcomes. link - ( New Window )


If I understand this correctly Rangers fans should root for Dallas,Carolina, Colorado, and Columbus in this round. If these teams succeed the Rangers benefit.
That would explain the kind of longevity you can see in the NHL  
Greg from LI : 4/25/2019 5:13 pm : link
Almost no one plays 20 years in the NFL or NBA, but many of the greatest hockey players play well over 20 years. Messier played 26 seasons between the WHA and NHL, Gordie Howe played 32 combined between them, Jagr played 24 seasons with four more in the KHL mixed in, Chelios played 26 years, Lemieux played 17 seasons despite missing four years due to cancer, Bobby Hull played 23 combined years, Johnny Bucyk 23 years, Alex Delvecchio 24 years....etc, etc.

Baseball sees the occasional 20 year career, but it's an apples and oranges comparison.
Hockey players can always play  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 5:25 pm : link
regardless of age - if you're just talking love of the game shit, there is a senior league at the complex where I play that has a 50+ league. There are some guys who play in that league with their fathers. There are 50 year old men, playing with 70+ year old men. They're obviously mostly slow and brittle boned, but it's cool to see them. Their night games are around 5pm, just after dinner.


But the NHL has maybe the shortest career duration after the NFL.

More than half of NHL players play less than 100 games.

Only 4% play more than 1,000 games (12 seasons), which makes them somewhere between 30 and 35.


RE: Hockey players can always play  
Rover : 4/25/2019 8:10 pm : link
In comment 14405701 pjcas18 said:
Quote:
regardless of age - if you're just talking love of the game shit, there is a senior league at the complex where I play that has a 50+ league. There are some guys who play in that league with their fathers. There are 50 year old men, playing with 70+ year old men. They're obviously mostly slow and brittle boned, but it's cool to see them. Their night games are around 5pm, just after dinner.


But the NHL has maybe the shortest career duration after the NFL.

More than half of NHL players play less than 100 games.

Only 4% play more than 1,000 games (12 seasons), which makes them somewhere between 30 and 35.


But they probably still play in Europe or elsewhere where in football aside from the CFL there are few options.
RE: RE: Hockey players can always play  
pjcas18 : 4/25/2019 8:14 pm : link
In comment 14406347 Rover said:
Quote:
In comment 14405701 pjcas18 said:


Quote:


regardless of age - if you're just talking love of the game shit, there is a senior league at the complex where I play that has a 50+ league. There are some guys who play in that league with their fathers. There are 50 year old men, playing with 70+ year old men. They're obviously mostly slow and brittle boned, but it's cool to see them. Their night games are around 5pm, just after dinner.


But the NHL has maybe the shortest career duration after the NFL.

More than half of NHL players play less than 100 games.

Only 4% play more than 1,000 games (12 seasons), which makes them somewhere between 30 and 35.




But they probably still play in Europe or elsewhere where in football aside from the CFL there are few options.


yes, that's my point, hockey players can play to any age. NHL though, like the other major sports, has a limited career duration. with some notable exceptions.
RE: RE: RE: with the mention of Miller  
Jay in Toronto : 4/25/2019 8:18 pm : link
In comment 14404540 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
In comment 14404237 Jay in Toronto said:


Quote:


In comment 14403920 ColHowPepper said:...///
Great article by Carp -- and more comps from their D coach. I think Miller is in a great place for development -- and with next year's influx of world talent, hopefully a fun season.

Not sure what you meant but iirc Carp believes K'A will stay at UW at least one more year.

Quote:


Where Miller wants to go is from Madison, Wisconsin to Madison Square Garden. But he is not in a rush to get there. He won’t say definitively, but Miller won’t turn pro now, instead planning and training for his sophomore season with the Badgers. Granato and the Rangers’ front office all believe he will play one more year of college hockey, at least.
“I think that would probably be the best decision for me,” Miller told The Athletic.



Yes, another year at UW should be perfect for him.
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