I will preface my remarks by saying I simply didn't watch Rosen play for the Cardinals last season.
But I find it absolutely stunning that someone who was considered one of the top prospects one year ago has fallen so far.
If reports are to be believed, the Cardinals may be having issues finding ANY team willing to give up a #1 pick for him.
A lot of fans say he looked bad last year because the Cards were so bad. I get that. But don't NFL teams understand that too?
What is going on here? There must be more to the story.
The owners had their dinners with him, etc.
They may well have liked him as a QB, but Barkley had the perfect grade.
He's already had his rookie growing pains behind a crap OL.
On the Giants, he'd sit a year and learn more behind Eli.
By the time he takes over, he should be significantly better than a rookie.
He's on a rookie contract, so he's still inexpensive.
There's a lot to like from that perspective.
If there's some horror show behind the scenes, wouldn't it have come out?
The concussion thing has been WAY overblown IMO. He got hit plenty last year.
Yet everyone is jumping to spend the #6 pick on any of them. But you wouldn't spend a #37 on Rosen?
Talk about BPA....
That's just it.
We really don't know what teams are thinking. This year as much or more than any in memory.
I think teams ARE interested in him, and I think the Giants are one of them. I think Gettleman wouldn't be doing his job if he didn't have at least as ONE of his possible scenarios, a run at Rosen if/when the time came. Things just have to fall a certain way. So many moving parts this year. Kinda crazy, really.
Fun!
New coaches often want "their guy"... Rosen isn't that for Kingsbury. He's a guy from a regime that lasted one year and got fired.
They're in a position where they can get Kingsbury the QB he's long-coveted, recoup as much value as possible for Rosen and move on.
I don't think that's far-fetched.
How many teams are legitimately interested in Rosen right now? 3 or 4? Maybe they're just content with the alternative QB options available to them if Arizona won't bite on their offer for Rosen.
Have to remember that the team making the offer is getting a QB who already has 1 year of his rookie contract burned - and that's half the appeal. The contract. He's also, like I said before, taken a bit of a beating.
So, you'd be paying sticker price on a car that has been taken off the lot for a few test drives already...
I wouldn't want to do that. Would you?
No disrespect intended for guys here sharing their opinions or wants, but all I care about is reading the words of the EXPERTS. if they say he can be a stud, I’m all in. If they say there are too many question marks, I’m all out.
Lastly, how does he compare with the top 5 QBs coming out this year? That is equally as important. What do the EXPERTS say about that?
The owners had their dinners with him, etc.
They may well have liked him as a QB, but Barkley had the perfect grade.
He's already had his rookie growing pains behind a crap OL.
On the Giants, he'd sit a year and learn more behind Eli.
By the time he takes over, he should be significantly better than a rookie.
He's on a rookie contract, so he's still inexpensive.
There's a lot to like from that perspective.
If there's some horror show behind the scenes, wouldn't it have come out?
The concussion thing has been WAY overblown IMO. He got hit plenty last year.
And yet have the Giants even offered their #17 pick for him? If they haven't, what does that say?
Sure, it drops the second they make that pick, BUT ... there might be something to the "in the moment" emotional perception of making that trade during the draft that makes the Arizona front office want to hold off on surprising no one with the Murray pick.
Hope that makes sense. At least as I intend it.
And yet have the Giants even offered their #17 pick for him? If they haven't, what does that say?
That they are waiting until they have selected Murray. It may also mean they just dont see him here.
I want Rosen here and have since the speculation began but I will admit that he doesnt seem like a DG type of QB. I trust JonC and jtgiants info.
and his rookie year was a booze filled shit show in which he only threw 4 passes
I can't think of a QB whose personality is a better fit for the NY market. The medical concerns in the family is something else. But that seems purely speculative
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got outsmarted, called out and now are being punished and made fools of.
That doesn't make sense to me either. Teams don't seem to want him.
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Favre was a second round draft pick.
and his rookie year was a booze filled shit show in which he only threw 4 passes
And Green Bay gave Atlanta the #19 pick for him a year later.
Terrible coaching. Their play calling was horrible.
He didn't always scan the field and he has a tendency to be REALLY late getting the ball out. I think that's the biggest issue. His process is slow and I think that gets solved by backing up a veteran for a season or two. He has all the tools besides that.
I like him over most of the QBs in this draft who are mostly projects that aren't Day 1 starters. IMO
Terrible coaching. Their play calling was horrible.
He didn't always scan the field and he has a tendency to be REALLY late getting the ball out. I think that's the biggest issue. His process is slow and I think that gets solved by backing up a veteran for a season or two. He has all the tools besides that.
I like him over most of the QBs in this draft who are mostly projects that aren't Day 1 starters. IMO
NFL teams know all of that.
Maturity? He has handled the Cardinal's flirtation with Murray with absolute class. How do you think Mayfield or Darnold would be handling this shit? Not any better, that is for sure. Durability, he got killed and kept trucking. Next year our high draft capital will build the team. It is a huge advantage if we can get this guy on the cheap. He will better than Jones. Bank on that.
the NFL doesnt love Josh Rosen as much as BBI does.
^^^^^^^^^
This.
Fans say that NYG didn't "pass" on Rosen because the Giants liked Barkley so much better. OK, maybe. But NYJ passed on him for Darnold and Buffalo passed on him for Allen, and if Ariz (who now wants to unload him after 1 yr) hadn't taken him at #10, he would have slid all the way to Balt at the end of the 1st round and maybe even out of it.
But I'm not reading anything persuasive here.
I've never seen a team give up on a top talent in less than a year, and I don't understand why some other team hasn't already traded for him.
I find the whole thing bizarre.
1. Murray is a superior prospect to Rosen and a potentially transformative player. Does not need to be more persuasive than that.
2a. They’ll find a buyer when the dust settles — many teams in the QB market might prefer to pursue the rookies before returning to Rosen
2b. As a top-10 pick, Rosen’s 5th year option would be ~$20M whereas a QB picked outside the top-10 would cost ~$13-14M
3. There’s obvious encouragement from the NFL to create theater with the 1st pick, hence the recent (false) reports that the Cards would keep Rosen
This is clearly the answer.
But I have a hunch the slow down here for any deal is, ironically, Kingsbury. From what I've seen and heard, Rosen has come to these voluntary activities in great shape; and he is moving and throwing better than ever. So I think Kingsbury is really torn...
He may have the QB he needs already on the roster after all. So perhaps they need to start building the team around Rosen...
Who knows if they have or haven't?
Maybe they HAVE and AZ hasn't bit yet?
If any of this Rosen stuff has legs, DG likes Rosen at a certain price, and AZ is trying to get the most they can. They wouldn't be finalizing it until the draft begins. Perhaps DG would come up to 17 but didn't start there. Or perhaps DG gave AZ a standing offer for Rosen, and AZ is waiting to see if anyone beats it. WHO KNOWS?
We didn't get details of Accorsi's side of the Eli trade until a few years later.
Living in the LA area, I read tons of stuff about him, including many inquiries into the national media's slam of his personality and the local LA refutation of those digs.
The one issue that seemed to have some real traction was how coachable he is/was, not because he's stupid or uncaring, but because he's "the smartest guy in the room". Heck under the coaches he had at UCLA, that might have been true both ways.
And it might have again been true last year in Arizona. I mean, clearly the FO didn't think much of their own coaching staff last year - they fired them after ONE SEASON!
But the attitude of a player thinking he's the smartest guy in the room doesn't sail in the NFL, unless you've got serious skins on the wall, like Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers.
Could that be it? It sure isn't the dude's ability to toss the rock.
Eric's question is a good one and this is the most sensible answer.
Living in the LA area, I read tons of stuff about him, including many inquiries into the national media's slam of his personality and the local LA refutation of those digs.
The one issue that seemed to have some real traction was how coachable he is/was, not because he's stupid or uncaring, but because he's "the smartest guy in the room". Heck under the coaches he had at UCLA, that might have been true both ways.
And it might have again been true last year in Arizona. I mean, clearly the FO didn't think much of their own coaching staff last year - they fired them after ONE SEASON!
But the attitude of a player thinking he's the smartest guy in the room doesn't sail in the NFL, unless you've got serious skins on the wall, like Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers.
Could that be it? It sure isn't the dude's ability to toss the rock.
Good post. Totally agree.
And Rosen knows the sun rises in the east and sets in the west... ;)
What does that have to do with any of the questions I've raised?
...and no one is letting the cat out of the bag.
Why haven't you been banned yet?
...and no one is letting the cat out of the bag.
This, I bet he was traded to some team weeks ago with a stipulation that he has to be A.) healthy on the actual transaction day (likely tonight), and B.) the deal can’t be announced until after the start of round 1. The NFL wants as much excitement for the prime time round 1 as possible.
Patrick Mahome is now the prototype QB of the future a QB . that can cover up defects in your OL and that can make your team win much sooner than later all in his second year!
Now every losing teams wants their own Patrick Mahomes - Kyler Murray is this year's Patrick Mahomes
Patrick Mahome is now the prototype QB of the future a QB . that can cover up defects in your OL and that can make your team win much sooner than later all in his second year!
Now every losing teams wants their own Patrick Mahomes - Kyler Murray is this year's Patrick Mahomes
I'm sorry but your answer doesn't make any sense from the perspective on why other teams are not trying to trade for him and are considering drafting Haskins, Jones, and others.
Living in the LA area, I read tons of stuff about him, including many inquiries into the national media's slam of his personality and the local LA refutation of those digs.
The one issue that seemed to have some real traction was how coachable he is/was, not because he's stupid or uncaring, but because he's "the smartest guy in the room". Heck under the coaches he had at UCLA, that might have been true both ways.
And it might have again been true last year in Arizona. I mean, clearly the FO didn't think much of their own coaching staff last year - they fired them after ONE SEASON!
But the attitude of a player thinking he's the smartest guy in the room doesn't sail in the NFL, unless you've got serious skins on the wall, like Peyton Manning or Aaron Rodgers.
Could that be it? It sure isn't the dude's ability to toss the rock.
+1
I agree with everyone who says if we give Eli decent protection a running game and competent wide receivers he will have a good season.I think if you give the same thing to Rosen, he is capable of Tom Brady Aaron Rodgers Drew Brees numbers. Smart and talented people sometimes rub people the wrong way.
Anyway that's what I see. I guarantee that if he gets put into a situation where he has time to survey the field and throw the ball, Rosen will be a top 5 in the NFL QB. That's why I keep posting about him. If we get Rosen and Barkley, I am thinking super bowls. Rosen is smart and he will exploit Barkleys greatness in the passing game.Rosen throws with touch and anticipation that is the key to Shurmur's offense for yards after the catch. It is a dream matchup.
Oops, sorry wrong thread.
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It’s really nothing more than that.
This. Kingsbury gets fired from Texas Tech, but somehow will transition into being the next offensive guru who lights up the NFL?
Agree. They hire/fire Wilks, change out OCs, then make a head-scratching move of hiring a losing college coach in Kingsbury. Rosen played with the worst or among the few worst O-lines in the league. His stats aren't mucch different than golden-boy Darnold. Meanwhile, his teammates speak highly of him and his attitude and work ethic. Sounds like organizational malfeasance more than the player.
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The Giants did extensive homework on Rosen last year.
The owners had their dinners with him, etc.
They may well have liked him as a QB, but Barkley had the perfect grade.
He's already had his rookie growing pains behind a crap OL.
On the Giants, he'd sit a year and learn more behind Eli.
By the time he takes over, he should be significantly better than a rookie.
He's on a rookie contract, so he's still inexpensive.
There's a lot to like from that perspective.
If there's some horror show behind the scenes, wouldn't it have come out?
The concussion thing has been WAY overblown IMO. He got hit plenty last year.
And yet have the Giants even offered their #17 pick for him? If they haven't, what does that say?
Maybe it says the priority is to fix the defense with 6 and 17. They're OK with going with Eli this year. And maybe they think they can get Rosen for a second or maybe less (if they are inerested at all).
And it wouldn't shock me if the Pats jump in and make the trade with #32.