Do you think the Giants have a surprise 9-7 season in them?

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So many new pieces on defense. Hard to even know how that side of the ball is going to come together. If they are as good as we hope (better) I'd say 9-7 is possible.

traded away too much of the limited high-end talent that they previously had.

There's some real hope for 2020 though IMO, if Giants can finally move on from Eli and 2019 draft, 2020 draft and next year's free agency with cap room goes well.

There's always a surprise team or 2 every year. I don't think it's likely but a bounce here or there and some decent protection for Manning and who knows?

3 things need to happen for a winning season.
1. The oline needs to gel early and keep manning clean
2. Golden and Carter need to emerge as quality pass rushers
3. Our rookie corners need to contribute in a meaningful way

All those happen and we might have a chance.

A) What NFL are we watching to think they can't

and

B) this feels like the year before a window is opening. 2020 - with Eli off the books, Jones taking over and a ton of cap room - will be a very interesting team.

I like the smell of this one so far. I think we could surprise this year.

Seems like a favorable schedule on paper. I wouldn’t be surprised to see Eli put one last quality season together. I’ve seen a lot of vets do that.

with a high ceiling. They're raw. If they do go 9-7, wouldn't be surprised its with a long winning streak to end the season with the D starting to turn it on.

I still think they need another playmaker on offense and some veterans signed for the D-Line to be competitive against the Cowboys and Eagles. They're building and getting close, but I think they need another offseason with a massive cap space to be a playoff team. Once they do, I wouldn't be surprised if they're dominant for 3+ years.

Yes, I think they could be a surprise team

but I think 2020 is a better target.

that the Giants could make the playoffs this year based on the expectation that they would draft an elite pass rusher and an RT. They did neither.

If Golden and Carter on the edges and Lawrence in the middle can generate a pass rush and Remmers is signed and performs at even a mediocre level, I think they can be relevant again.

if you look at last season after the bye (8 games), we went 4-4 and three of the four losses were very close (3 points and two 1-pointers).

If the second half of last season was a better indicator of this year than the first half of last season, which is not irrational given new coaches etc., being slightly over .500 this year at 9-7 doesn't seem so farfetched. Plus, I think the D backfield is going to be greatly improved.

In comment 14437904 mittenedman said:

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A) What NFL are we watching to think they can't

This. Any team in the league can go 9-7 in a given year. The Bills went 9-7 two years ago with Tavaris Jackson.

Do I expect it? No, but won't be surprised if it happens.The big thing is don't get carried away if they do. They are not close to being a year-in year-out contender yet.

6-10, 10-6, and everything in between wouldn’t shock me

A lot has to break right, but this team isn’t far off. The 2020 resurrection in upon us

nor enough time to learn to win. i think it highly unlike we win close games, so 9-7 unlikely, not impossible.

I have high hopes for this team this year. If they stay healthy they can win it all. No team is without holes.

But it will be fun watching the young players grow. I think they will be one of those teams that teams in the hunt dont want to play. 5-7 wins, with Jones taking the job late

They play the AFC East, so 3-1 there is far from impossible.

I don't think the rest of the NFC East is that far ahead of them and think 4-2 is at least possible there.

Do those 2 things and they just need 2 wins from: Bucs, Vikes, Cards, Lions, Bears, and Pack. Heading into the season they should be favored in at least 2 of those (Bucs, Cards) and possibly 3 (Lions).

Giants SOS is .473...one of the easiest in the NFL. They won 6 games last year. 3 more is definitely doable.

9-7 baby...let's go.

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QB: 4
RB: 10
WR: 5
TE: 4
OT: 5 if Remmers is signed and healthy
OG: 8
C: 3

DT: 7
DE: 5
Edge: 5
ILB: 4
S: 6 with upside
CB: 6 with upside but some growing pains

That all equates to a 6-10 team (estimate).

Yes for several reasons:

1. The schedule
2. Eli knows this is it and that clutch gene just might show up
3. I know in my heart of hearts OBJ will prove to be additional by subtraction. With Engram especially.
4. The NFL is extremely unpredictable.
5. I think the team is better overall than the past few years.

No for one big reason:

1. Pat Shumur

RT and Pass rusher being in limbo right now is also obviously an issue until hopefully it isn't.

Gun to my head, I think we are in contention for a playoff spot once the Holidays roll around but ultimately fall short and finish 7-9 or 8-8.

A 10 win season would be a surprise

I think the 1984 comparison is a good one. 9-7 and a wildcard. Make it so!

It s possible.

Talent around the league is close. Intangibles often separate winners from losers. I get the feeling from afar, Giants are a more motivated come together type of team this year, we ll see.

The line was pitiful last year, the team started 1-7 largely as a result of the dreadful line.

Don't forget that last year's line was historically bad. One of the worst OLs in NFL modern history. It was an abomination and a disgrace to the NY Giants franchise.

I think C is still a problem. I'm assuming Remmers will be the starting RT. Zeitler at RG is an unbelievable upgrade.

I think this is a 8-8 club, unless Shurmur is a bust. We shall see.

anything is possible

I think this year is a developmental year for Jones, so I think it’s crucial he gets snaps.

It is interesting on BBI, there is a group that thinks this is a 2-4 win team which I think is overly doom & gloom. Looking at the schedule & year 2 in these systems, is this really a sub 5 win team?

4 and 2 in the last 6 games ( upside is jelling vs the need for quality depth shows up).

That tells me more about where we are.

Also, unlike close but losses to good teams I'd like to see some solid wins against solid teams. maybe 3 of them across the year.

Victories where its the opponents 2nd qb versus our rookie secondary can give equally false indications of 2020.

Solid late season wins against solid teams.

dont care about any individual performance...so bad record and flashes from Jones dont do it for me

That this team wins more than 7 games. They were poor last year and got rid of some of their best players.

I see 10-6 or 11-5.

Dont underestimate the culture shift and mindset.

There is talent on this team but a lot of youth on D. If it comes together quick they could easily win double digits.

QB: same
RB: probably the same or even better
WR: significant decline
TE: same
OT: better assuming Remmers is adequate, same if Wheeler is the guy
OG: significant improvement
C: same

all def positions with marginal or significant improvement

Huge fan of the Zeitler trade but RT and depth is still an issue at OL and I don't think Eli or the WRs are good enough to make up for that deficiency.

Defensively, like the new pieces we added in the draft but they're all young and will need time to develop. Expecting all those players to pan out in 2019 is a tough bet.

2020 will be the interesting year as a) those young players will have time to develop and b) the Giants will have a lot of cap space and money to patch up holes and add star power.

Pass rush? Where?

OL still question til proven

Qb position?


Wr? Who is threat?

Turnover and players trying to grasp system will hold win total down..plus "learning to win" a factor

Gettleman's been doing his job, now it's time to see Shurmur do his job.

There are a lot of ways to evaluate a coach beyond record, but in the end, wins are what it's all about. Pat really needs a winning season in the worst way. I was fine with him as the choice, but the first year put me on the fence. I'm afraid a dismal season this year will have me solidly hoping for a replacement.

9-7 would do wonders for him given the state of the transition. An excellent coach can get there, imo.

I would potentially upgrade that if we make another significant personnel move before going into training camp. We're still looking for a RT to upgrade Wheeler. I'll also feel better about the season if I know Pulley has won the starting center job over Halapio who I'm not a believer in.

I think it's very unlikely, but if we were to pull that off, I think it requires two main components.

1) A serviceable defense
2) The offensive line completely 180'ing.

I think the O-line is more important than anything. If we can control the LIR on running plays, pushing the defense back and exhausting them, and protect Manning, the offense has some guys that can make things happen. I still believe we haven't seen the best of Engram.

But the reason I'm saying it's unlikely is because I don't see #2 happening, and without Beckham, I don't think we have the guy who can steal a couple games with incredible 180+ yard games. We're not going to steal anything this year without Beckham, so we need to be dominant on a play to play basis... and it ain't happening, IMO.

In comment 14437949 Pep22 said:

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QB: same RB: probably the same or even better WR: significant decline TE: same OT: better assuming Remmers is adequate, same if Wheeler is the guy OG: significant improvement C: same all def positions with marginal or significant improvement

Bingo. And that's a team that went 4-4 in their last 8.

so yes, winning 3 more than that shouldn't be that hard if they get the defense fixed and maintain the momentum they developed over last year on offense.

The Giants are in the 7-9 win range this season and show the idiots that trading Beckham was a good football move.

Eli league MVP
Lombardi #5

You heard it here first.

NFC Champs 17-19 believe and it will happen.

Do better then that. But they needed to overhaul the entire roster, and they did. Now we will start to reap the benefits of that sometime this season.

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In comment 14437967 bradshaw44 said:

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Eli league MVP Lombardi #5 You heard it here first.

You beat me to the punch. With an extra win I might add. good work!!!

two years ago this team was 3-13; last year they started 1-7 before winning against teams playing 2nd and 3rd string caliber quarterbacks. the schedule is not difficult, there have been upgrades at right guard, defensive tackle and the secondary. at the same time, we said goodbye to a dynamic offensive threat in beckham; outside of barkley, there isn't anyone who truly scares defensive coordinators; and the pass rush is still a big question mark.

I think this team goes somewhere in the range of 4-12 and 6-10.

I think he'll be around long enough to show he's not a playoff game-winning coach, and they bring in someone else when it's time to win games.

they set:

Improved OL
Featured running game
Short effective passes to SS/GT/EE

Keep the games close....use the pass rush/CB's to keep the other team from winning those games at the end we lost last year.

I drew up scenarios that could go 12-4 or 8-8 so I settled on 10-6. It's only in small part because I believe the team will improve from last year. It's mostly due to strength of schedule. Take a good look at the up-coming schedule and you should see it's laid out better for the Giants than I've seen in a long time.

I think 9-7 is on the optimistic side, but achievable if we come out on the winning side of some close games. I think 8-8 or 7-9 is more realistic. I'd still be happy with 7-9, lose some close games, stay in the hunt, etc., big improvement over 3-13 two years ago.

The 3-13 debacle was the worst season I have seen as a Giant's fan. I was too young for the 1970's. My expectations for this franchise have been lowered.

we played defense with ten players last year as Riley refused to tackle

we could win 9+ with Jones more than Eli as the QB.

My displeasure with the Jones pick at #6 is well documented, but he has movement skills that apparently Shurmur prefers in his QB prototype. I'd like to think he is athletic enough to extend plays with his legs to make throws and/or run to convert crucial third downs. And handing it off to Barkley 400X and throwing it to him another 100X is something he can do just as well as Eli.

At the end of the day, I don't know what to expect from either QB. Eli is older and even less athletic. And Jones is young and athletic. So why not go for it?

tp 10-6 wouldn't shock me. They have a young Defense and a couple of missing pieces on O, but the offensive line geling and the defense generating a pass rush and stopping the run will be the big issues.

My one big question mark and fear is the coaching. Shurmur had some real clunker decisions at some crucial points in some close games last year. And while I am hopeful Bettcher has more talent to work with, I am not fully sold on his 'scheme'. Its a very wait and see year.....

generally BBI overestimates the talent level on this team. Everyone will go gaga over camp reports about how wonderful this guy or that guy looks forgetting that they are competing against some of the worst talent in the NFL. I expect we will hear a lot of gushing about the db's this preseason forgetting that the receiving corp they are going up against in practice may be one of the worst in the NFL.

The HC seems like a good guy but he's still searching for the magical .500 mark. I don't see it happening this year. This team is a RB injury away from being one of the worst in the NFL.

I love our corners..beal and baker have lockdown potential. we know what JJ can bring and love can he not only solid in man coverage but a stud in zone.. peppers and bethea should shine. I love our D line depth and potential pass rush. While we don't have one 15 sack guy we have like 5-6 guys that can get 7-8. Ximines, carter, Golden, Hill, Tomlinson and lawrence. Those guys along with a few others should do a great job against the run. Our linebackers are suspect but I do expect more in the 2nd year of bet's system from ogletree and i like connolly. Our o line will be much much better a healthy solder a 2nd year hernandez(they both were already pretty good in the second half) halipo all year with a solid backup in pulley, zeitler maybe best guard in all of football and remmers will be better than your young Rt was last year and wheeler may actually be better going into his 3rd year and 2nd as a starter,,that O line impormvement will give eli time to find tate, sheppard, engram, coleman, slayton and we have the best running back on the planet and quality depth in rod and wayne along with penney.

I don't see at all...at all why we can't go 8-8 or 9-7. We have gotten rid of the terrible locker room guys and even if ok in locker room me first or club house lawyer guys. I love the turnover in personnel, its been astounding actually and think we can be a team anywhere between 10-16 in the league.

I see 9-7

In comment 14437915 Del Shofner said:

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if you look at last season after the bye (8 games), we went 4-4 and three of the four losses were very close (3 points and two 1-pointers). If the second half of last season was a better indicator of this year than the first half of last season, which is not irrational given new coaches etc., being slightly over .500 this year at 9-7 doesn't seem so farfetched. Plus, I think the D backfield is going to be greatly improved.

The above, plus I think that team morale will higher in 2019 and higher still in 2020 (after a good 2019).
The Giants will surprise some over-confident teams
Yes, I'm an optimist. 9-11 wins in 2019 and 11-12 in 2020.

Likely? Not really.

I think 6 or 7 wins is probably more like it.

However, the schedule with the AFC East and some 4th place teams is not as hard as it was last season.

Eli wants to go out in a blaze of glory, a couple of lucky bounces, a big play here and there, and those 6 or 7 wins could turn into 9 and a playoff berth. If they'd had any kind of a defense they could have won 8 last season.

But they won't go very far if they are lucky enough to make it into the post-season.

But I am the eternally optimistic fan. I don't want for the season to be broken until it absolutely is.

Because they will win 9 games and I won't be surprised.

They’ve gotten rid of a lot of overpaid vets and this roster is now full of young guys out to prove themselves - especially on defense

I expect the Giants will “surprise” a lot of haters this year.

Of course, I say that every year.

8-8 win team.

They took a step back offensively, and we will be breaking in a bunch of rookies, and new players on defense.

If we get Remmers, I will feel better about the offensive output.

but division games will be huge for us. We need to go at least 3 and 3 in the division.

Any team can do that but to win or lose 12 or more takes a special season.

Sure. But a number of players have to play up to their potential to do so. Whether they will or not is not knowable. However, since you’re question was do they have a surprise 9-7. Absolutely.

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rebuilt secondary, D. Lawrence will improve run D, need Golden, Carter, X-Man to amp the pass rush. I think Bettcher will have more tools to run his game. Offense will have improved O-line, Saquan, Tate, Engram, and I just have a feeling Eli will have a good valedictory season.

I think the 2019 season will look alot like 2004.

Giants get off to a hot start with Eli and a weak schedule - they fall apart half way through - Daniel Jones mops up, doesn't win games, but gives the franchise hope for the future.

Eli won them 9 games last year...and they were terrible.

this year they will not lose those games and likely find at least 1 more.

10-6

Why not?

In comment 14437895 Bold Ruler said:

Quote:

So many new pieces on defense. Hard to even know how that side of the ball is going to come together. If they are as good as we hope (better) I'd say 9-7 is possible.

I agree it depends on the D.

The Giants did have a lot of turnover and 10 draft picks, most of whom will make the active roster and therefore our roster will be fairly young. Young means learning curve. Learning curve often means some tough early losses, at least.

I think Dallas is still a 10-6, division champ kind of team
The Eagles, assuming Wentz is healthy for 16, is equal to Dallas.
The Redskins defense looks good and the OL is among the league's best which will make Haskins life easier.

I figure the Giants will be 6-10 to 10-6 depending upon health, luck, Eli and such. So many factors but why not 9-7 or better? I say HELL YES!

7-9 at best.

I think Eli is way too slow and old. Moving the football wont be an issue but still failing to score will be.

My confidence in defense doesn't really say a whole lot either.

I did predict the 1-7 start last year. So, I hope that I am wrong. I don't think were living in an era where "the Giants could be surprisingly good" anymore. Bad football continues. Pat Shurmur is a fucking idiot too.

6-10 with Jones maybe playing the last 3 games?

The jury is still out on Shurmur as a head coach. That’s what this year is all about.

the question as if it is a straight question of can this team be 9-7 without considering any other aspects that may come into play here.

1) Some team always surprises and turns things around quickly, even if just for 1 season (see 2016 Giants).
2) The Giants as a whole, right now, are deeper than they were last year and are younger and faster.
3) The Giants have a better oline now (and can be even better if we get a vet RT) and an all world RB behind them.
4) Expectations are low so this team can come into the season under the radar.
5) We have no idea how the injury bug might change other teams (ours as well, yes, but injuries to other teams can open the door to wins)
6) I get am getting a 1997 feel with this team.
7) The Skins are have issues, Dallas is about to pay big bucks to an overrated QB and are a suspension heavy team on defense and Philadelphia is counting on Wentz to stay healthy, doesn't have Foles there anymore and I think is counting on areas (Oline and Dline) that may be vulnerable especially if an injury occurs there.
8) The schedule on paper is not as bad as we have seen in the past.
9) I think the Eli last ride might not be the ugly season some are counting on.
10) Too many people think OBJ loss will cripple the team and I think now it makes defenses unsure of who the main target is and over confident on stacking against Barkley.

I think 9-7 is very doable and I will go out on a limb and say we will be no worse than 8-8 this season!

Outside of the quarterback pick (I think Haskin's decision making is so much better than Jones', but what do I know), which is unlikely to affect play this year, the next four picks, plus Conway look like really smart picks to me. They got stronger on the defensive line, much stronger at cornerback and safety (great mix of veterans and youth), and have at least a possibility for improvement at linebacker. Lorenzo Carter can set the edge, drop into coverage, or rush the passer, what's not to like? Golden could be drop off on the other side, or could be welcome rebirth, either way, he is not a drop off from what Olivier Vernon delivered last year. So defense should be much better.

Signing Rod Smith is a really good move - to make up for the really bad veteran rb signing last year. The Offensive line is much further along this year than it was last year at this time - although it still can't be considered a strength and depth is a big issue, it is better. Losing ODB is a big loss in talent, but Eli was trying to force too much to him - it may be addition by subtraction (the Shockey effect). Often overlooked, but the system was new to Eli last year. He now has a year in the system. The offense should be subtly better at a minimum.

Too much is made of how they did after the break last year, given that a few of those games were against quarterbacks that were, in technical terms, shitty. However, the schedule this year is not, on paper, as difficult. If they get a few wins early, confidence will be better and there is no substitute for confidence. As Tom Coughlin would say: confident enough to perform, humble enough to prepare. The schedule is better

Injuries could be a concern. Remember when Michael Strahan had the Lis Franc his first year? I think he learned he had to wear shoes with more support - not as comfortable, but a hell of a lot better than injury. Dexter Lawrence should take heed. Wear steel shank cleats. Protect your feet. He could be really good.

I hope it is not just echo chamber, BBI optimism.

Eric - did I miss it the thread somewhere? What do you think?

happen that way.

Yes, actually - I could see it, but it would take a lot of things breaking right.

2020 is the realistic target for this team, in my opinion.

too many glaring holes were not addressed in this draft. DG needed to rebuild OL/DL to compete this year. He did not do that. When you are losing the battle at LOS everything else is window dressing. This is a 4-6 win team looking toward improving in 2020.

And this is directed to the people who know me as such, but if you really listen to my take before each and every season there’s truth in my posts and points. Last year I was hopeful that the so called offensive star power would carry the day and the giants “could” have a fun year. But we were all rightfully concerned with the D and OL. I figured if things broke right last year the team could sneak out 7-8-9 wins but things needed to break the right way.

In 2017 I was preaching that the giants defense would need to carry the team early (cautiously expected this) and that the broken offense would hopefully find its way by mid season thanks to the Engram/Ellison addition. But I was leery. I never once proclaimed that team was a lock for anything. I’m hopeful but not dumb. Turned out my caution was well founded. It took me 2 hours into the first game in 2017 to know we were dead team walking. I knew the D would quit and it did.

This year I am all but convinced this team will play well or at least much better than 2018. The O will be above average from the jump and the team in general will be better prepared thx to continuity and an easier schedule.

So yes, I do think this team plays well this season. I’d bet on it.

In comment 14438067 averagejoe said:

Quote:

too many glaring holes were not addressed in this draft. DG needed to rebuild OL/DL to compete this year. He did not do that. When you are losing the battle at LOS everything else is window dressing. This is a 4-6 win team looking toward improving in 2020.

He traded for 1 of the best guards in the league and added a monster DT to pair with Tomlinson/Hill ... they might help

I want to see who is playing Right Tackle. I want to see how Golden and Carter look at setting the edge and rushing the passer.

those are my biggest concerns. Until then I think we are a 500 team at best.

runs for over 1500 and has over 800 receiving yards. That will keep the defense off the field.

We will be playing a lot of weak teams. So, yes, I think it's conceivable.

We got fucked last year by the schedule makers. Hardest first 7 weeks in NFL last year. If the team stays healthy, we sign Remmers and he returns to form at RT, I don't see why we can't win 9 football games. I think Eli is capable of giving you average QB play with a good line, which this should be if Remmers does return to form and if he doesn't its probably league average. The biggest struggle is going to be how the defense performs out the gate with all the youth.

Win the opener in Dallas and you have my attention. Doesn't matter if it's a 13-10 nail-biter or Eli throws 7 interceptions in the process but if they find a way to win, then OK.

If it's something in conformity with the last two, hard, lump of excrement, season road openers at Dallas, fucking forget it. Going to be a very long year.

Then they come on solid in the 2nd half. 2020 make the playoffs.

in this thread. Both Cowboys and Eagles are top 12 for projected win totals. Unfortunately, I think if Travis Frederick returns to form the Cowboys are legit superbowl contenders. That offense two years ago, with the defense last year is extremely formidable.

In comment 14438094 Route 9 said:

Quote:

Win the opener in Dallas and you have my attention. Doesn't matter if it's a 13-10 nail-biter or Eli throws 7 interceptions in the process but if they find a way to win, then OK. If it's something in conformity with the last two, hard, lump of excrement, season road openers at Dallas, fucking forget it. Going to be a very long year.

If Eli throws 7 picks in the opener in a win we'd still have people here saying he should start.

In comment 14437971 Go Terps said:

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.

Not sure why this is a sound position -- Shurmur took a mediocre QB (Chase Keenan, who has not been able to play well afterwards), an UDFA WR (Theilin) and a 5th rd draft pick (Diggs) and turned all 3 into stars with a RB (Cook 2nd Rd Rookie) who was IRed early in the season and RB Latvius Murray - and a patched together Oline in Minnesota to the playoffs

Now he has Eli Manning -- who is light years better than Keenan - two solid receivers (Shep and Tate) - a solid receiving TE (Engram), and improving WR in Corey Coleman - a lights out RB (Barkley) and 3 solid starters on Oline - and 1 midlin center and possibly his dude Remmers back at RT from his Minn playoff year

He has a really good D Coordinator who has a young fast group - with some budding and potential stars - much deep than last year and he plays an aggressive style

Shurmur kept them playing last year and they showed upswing over the course of a season -- they got rid of show boat Beckham, wounded warrior Vernon, box safety Collins and presumably got more team oriented and faster with their 10 draft picks and Peppers - who is an upgrade over Collins -- the starting backfield may now be a strength - they have a run stopping mammoth for the middle of the field solving their two major defensive problems from last year

I think maybe a little perspective is in order

BUT in todays NFL with such a high turnover rate, the lack of any sembelence of practice and training camp will hurt us. Practices are dummied down now and training camp is a joke, hard for a team to gel and get ready especially with so many new faces

I could see a contingent on BBI rooting against the Giants so that they don't entertain the thought of extending Eli.

In comment 14437971 Go Terps said:

Quote:

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Great! Terps has a new dog to kick.

apparent to the average fan. I think he unfairly gets skewered here. Even the one time he got it right, when to go for 2 people killed him because the offense couldn't execute. One time Eli missed a wide open guy in front of him and the other was when we were down 2 td's and scored and went for 2. The analytics are pretty clear on that second one.

Extremely bad and I don't think something like that is going to get better. Guy has tons of experience as a HC at this point.

with one year of experience or less going into this season.

Darnold
Rosen
Allen
Murray
Haskins twice

That doesn't happen very often. Win those games and not much more is needed for a respectable looking season.

Lose those games and the Jones' succession is accelerated.

If we get better Oline play and average defensive play

In comment 14438038 YorkAveGiant said:

Quote:

Eli won them 9 games last year...and they were terrible. this year they will not lose those games and likely find at least 1 more. 10-6

Eli won them 9 games last year?

It's a very young team with a lot of turnover. A lot of young guys getting their first NFL action. 2-5 wouldn't surprise me. BBI losing its collective mind, calling for Shurmur to be fired, Eli to be benched, etc.

But at that point I wouldn't be surprised to see them go 7-2 and finish 9-7. It's a helluva long season nowadays. Things can shift profoundly in a short time.

Team defense speed improved. Stout stopping the run. Lawrence in discussion for DROY and also shows ability to rush passer. Bettcher is able to scheme 40 sacks with his new toys.

Strong OL and creative offense maximizing weapons. Team rallies behind Eli who plays best in pressure situations (needs a new contract!)

The big issue and it is a big one is injuries. They still need another off-season and draft to become a deep team.

Philly feels the effect of aging OL and suspect secondary.
Dallas struggles in passing game. I would have been worried about Washington if they had Alex Smith.

MVP... Its almost like you forgot who he is and what he does best.

2007 - Eli is a Bust

2011 - Eli ain't elite

2019 - Eli is done

Sick of losing, I’m not getting any younger

Looks what the Colts did last year
And their Roster was bad before the draft.

On the bright side, if we suck we'll get to see Daniel Jones sooner😀

For any team in the NFL. Just depends on how everything shakes out on a week to week basis.

Lots of things have to go right but we have enough
talent to be 500 or better . A lot depends on the O-line
Jelling and the defense playing up to there capabilities
I would love to see Eli at least have one good last
season and even if its transitioning . Guy has been
Everything we could have wished for gonna miss Easy E

In comment 14438128 Zeke's Alibi said:

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apparent to the average fan. I think he unfairly gets skewered here. Even the one time he got it right, when to go for 2 people killed him because the offense couldn't execute. One time Eli missed a wide open guy in front of him and the other was when we were down 2 td's and scored and went for 2. The analytics are pretty clear on that second one.

The issue with Shurmur last year was doing dumb shit like not getting the ball enough to Barkley in the second half in the Philly road game. That game was such a royal fuck up from a play calling and coaching standpoint.

Why the fuck would you cut down on touches on a guy who was killing Philly all day? And you're winning. I dont care it it is by way of screens or shotgun draws. Give him the ball.

That's why you picked him so high, right?

In comment 14438038 YorkAveGiant said:

Quote:

Eli won them 9 games last year...and they were terrible. this year they will not lose those games and likely find at least 1 more. 10-6

This is one of the odder posts I’ve read on BBI lately.

...approaching a winning season as a Head Coach.

We have focused our attention on the players. But a football Head Coach can make a real difference.

IMO, Pat Shurmur is as proven a commodity as our starting Center, Jon Halapio.

The jury is still out. Until they are back in the court room, no way this team accrues 9 wins!

the past years we have come out of the gate and sucked the season is pretty much over by week 6

this year we have a super easy schedule front loaded so by week 10 the bye week
we could be 4-6 or even 5-5 but after the bye we are not winning one more game

4- 12
or 5 -11 for this squad

the 3 burning questions this year

1. which game will Jones finally come into take over for Eli ?
2. will Gettlemen retire?
3 will Shurmur get fired for another lousy year

!

In comment 14438109 gidiefor said:

Quote:

In comment 14437971 Go Terps said: Quote: . Not sure why this is a sound position -- Shurmur took a mediocre QB (Chase Keenan, who has not been able to play well afterwards), an UDFA WR (Theilin) and a 5th rd draft pick (Diggs) and turned all 3 into stars with a RB (Cook 2nd Rd Rookie) who was IRed early in the season and RB Latvius Murray - and a patched together Oline in Minnesota to the playoffs Now he has Eli Manning -- who is light years better than Keenan - two solid receivers (Shep and Tate) - a solid receiving TE (Engram), and improving WR in Corey Coleman - a lights out RB (Barkley) and 3 solid starters on Oline - and 1 midlin center and possibly his dude Remmers back at RT from his Minn playoff year He has a really good D Coordinator who has a young fast group - with some budding and potential stars - much deep than last year and he plays an aggressive style Shurmur kept them playing last year and they showed upswing over the course of a season -- they got rid of show boat Beckham, wounded warrior Vernon, box safety Collins and presumably got more team oriented and faster with their 10 draft picks and Peppers - who is an upgrade over Collins -- the starting backfield may now be a strength - they have a run stopping mammoth for the middle of the field solving their two major defensive problems from last year I think maybe a little perspective is in order

Let's quit putting Jabril Peppers in the hall of fame. Fans keep talking about the guy like he's an all pro while at the same time marginalizing a player who's accomplished a lot more. It's weird to call for perspective and yet do this.

Expectations are WAY down.

4-12 or 5-11

Quote:

but after the bye we are not winning one more game

I hate when people say shut like this with authority. We have no idea what the Giants are, let alone the strength of their opponents 3 months into the season.

There are so many moving parts. There is so much turnover week to week. Teams that look good on paper will suck and vice versa. Teams will start strong and fade in November.

This shit happens every year, yet every May people look at games scheduled for December and go "yeah we can't win that".

But, it also wouldn't shock me.

In comment 14438038 YorkAveGiant said:

Quote:

Eli won them 9 games last year...and they were terrible. this year they will not lose those games and likely find at least 1 more. 10-6

So Eli won 9 games but the defense gave them away. Is that what you are saying?

He has never won. With a hard ass coach maybe 8-8:. Schumer appeased Beckham what’s he gonna do,when they start losing again?

Quote:

but after the bye we are not winning one more game I hate when people say shut like this with authority. We have no idea what the Giants are, let alone the strength of their opponents 3 months into the season. There are so many moving parts. There is so much turnover week to week. Teams that look good on paper will suck and vice versa. Teams will start strong and fade in November.

I am giving benefit of doubt early on in schedule .. Giants will most likely stumble out of gate like the past few years .. so they could have an even worse record going into bye

after bye

at Chicago Bears
Green Bay Packers
at Philadelphia Eagles
Miami Dolphins
at Washington Redskins
.Philadelphia Eagles

obviously the Dolphins are the easy game in this run... maybe Packers suck again
so yeah maybe we go 2-4 our last 6 games.. but maybe we go 3 -7 in our first 10 too

I am pessimist -- Gettleman got rid off all our playmakers on defense and all on offense except Barkley . His drafting a QB @ number 6 pretty much admits this is rebuilding year.

It becomes a dumpster fire and call for Eli's benching happens after they lose the next game to the Bills.

He gets yanked when they lose to the Bucs and go 0-3.

We see Jones vs. Haskins week 4.

1 year from now

on the tiebreakers

Reverse the record to 7 and 9. We still are a year away to being a contender on the NFC East. One more good draft in 2020 and smart FA signings.

Despite the chaotic loud media coverage and loud fan outbreak, very quietly (loudly) gettleman has reset this roster with young talent, including the coveted young cost controlled qb. It could be a lot worse from a roster building POV. This draft really is huge if DG hits on a few of these picks, that would be two big hit drafts in a row. As we know both good and bad these drafts start to add up...

Pretty much 5 picks in the top 100 if you count love (108 overall) 3 first rounders. From most observers this was supposed to be a deep draft. Jones is obviously the key.

we end up being 10-6.

In comment 14437933 joeinpa said:

Quote:

It s possible. Talent around the league is close. Intangibles often separate winners from losers. I get the feeling from afar, Giants are a more motivated come together type of team this year, we ll see.

I think this depends on 3 things:

1) Stay Healthy
2) Get off to at least a .500 start after the first 6 games.
3) The young defense comes together down the stretch , and the young players are producing.

In comment 14438124 widmerseyebrow said:

Quote:

I could see a contingent on BBI rooting against the Giants so that they don't entertain the thought of extending Eli.

Spot on, I can also see this happening. And I’m sure both of us can imagine who some of that contingent would be made up of.

In more manageable situations this year. Nearly Every week last year the game was close to or at an out of control level. Kinda hard to manage the clock when you’re getting your ass kicked. Easy to second guess. Plus I look at shurmur as a care-taker type coach anyway.

In comment 14438302 djm said:

Quote:

In more manageable situations this year. Nearly Every week last year the game was close to or at an out of control level. Kinda hard to manage the clock when you’re getting your ass kicked. Easy to second guess. Plus I look at shurmur as a care-taker type coach anyway.

No more WR reverses inside the 10 yard line.

But who rushes the QB? Who’s the CBs after Jenkins? Who covers TEs/RBs? Too many questions on D.

Improved greatly on Def. I also think our Def cost us a ton of games. Our safeties are better, CBs are better, DL better, LBs could be better. On Offense I think our Off lives and dies by having a good OL. This will be the best OL we have had in 7-8 years. The key to Eli is if you don’t give him time he is very average but if you give him time he is very good. We upgrade RT and I think absolutely think we can get to 9-10 wins.

In comment 14438097 Zeke's Alibi said:

Quote:

In comment 14438094 Route 9 said: Quote: Win the opener in Dallas and you have my attention. Doesn't matter if it's a 13-10 nail-biter or Eli throws 7 interceptions in the process but if they find a way to win, then OK. If it's something in conformity with the last two, hard, lump of excrement, season road openers at Dallas, fucking forget it. Going to be a very long year. If Eli throws 7 picks in the opener in a win we'd still have people here saying he should start.

Name one.



Besides Dep.

In comment 14438345 BlueLou'sBack said:

Quote:

In comment 14438097 Zeke's Alibi said: Quote: In comment 14438094 Route 9 said: Quote: Win the opener in Dallas and you have my attention. Doesn't matter if it's a 13-10 nail-biter or Eli throws 7 interceptions in the process but if they find a way to win, then OK. If it's something in conformity with the last two, hard, lump of excrement, season road openers at Dallas, fucking forget it. Going to be a very long year. If Eli throws 7 picks in the opener in a win we'd still have people here saying he should start. Name one. Besides Dep.

If 5 of the 7 are drops by the WR’s would you still want him benched?

I don’t see it. But, you never know...

Anything is possible because of the massive amount of personnel turnover. We're in year two of these systems but some key players will be in it for year one. Zeitler, essentially Halapio, possibly Remmers, Golden Tate are all in year one. Lawrence, DeAndre Baker, Jabril Peppers, Julian Love, Sam Beal, Oshane Ximines, Ryan Connelly will all have a steep learning curve as well. If guys like Antoine Bethea, Markus Golden and the holdover OL guys help out enough we can hit our stride by mid season. There is far more back 7 speed and talent and versatility but it's all new to the team or the system save Janoris Jenkins, Lorenzo Carter and Alec Ogletree.

I think if Tate can pick up the system and Zeitler slides in well the offense can be good right away. The defense will take time but it has so many young talented parts, it should gel during the season. I think next year and the one after are the ones to really watch us.

.

so apparently I don't know shit.

If we win nine games with this roster Schumer should be voted coach of the year.

But there are 9 winnable games on there schedule (vs. buff, at tampa, vs. wash, vs. zona, @ det, vs. dal, @ Jets, vs. Miami, @ Wash). It's possible.

I don't know what you're all rambling bout. They're going to get better. Hopefully, by 2021, they'll be a playoff team. 2019 and 2020 are all about reloading. 2018 ws about reshuffling the deck with respect to the cancers on the team. The Giants have got to break in Jones at QB in 2020. 2019 is Eli's swan song. Have Jones watch and learn from Easy E. If Jones shows positive signs in 2020, then NYG will be in good shape going forward from 2021 onwards. It's nice to be optimistic, but curb your enthusiasm just a bit folks. IT's still a work in progress. Enjoy the process. The Ws will follow eventually if it's built right, but that time is certainly not now.

why can't it be big blue? Get a decent right tackle in, and the O can explpde with Saquon and play-action.

Especially if it meant missing the playoffs. I'm thinking 11-5 or 12-4 if they're not undone by injuries.

9-7 or 10-6 is possible they fixed a helluva lot of the teams problems zietler and tate are huge pickups the draft fixed the defences most glaring holes at NT and not only fixed the CB position but added depth too

i do think peppers will be better in coverage than collins was so i dont think thats putting the guy in the HoF saying that,bethea gives them the QB of the secondry to keep them lined up corrrectly that also an upgrade thats not being factored at this point by many

i think DG nailed his second draft in a row i think josh allen will bust im not so sure jones is the right guy yet but im open to the idea and will be happy to be proved wrong about him. i personally would have taken devin bush or ed oliver there over allen anyway and i would have taken grier later in the draft

i would also have taken big ben or rivers from that draft they ended up trading for eli in as well. jones this year is why they were so comfortable taking barkley last year so they have conviction the fans dont have about him,he is a much better runner than they had so he does have the legs to get first downs and touchdowns in the redzone they havent had since eli's early years which is a dimension they havent had for a while

they could just as easily be a 3-6 win team as well but i think the defence is better and if halapio comes back 100% and is as good as they think and they can add a RT i would lean to more of the 9-10 win year over the 9-10 loss year but we need to see them in preseason to gauge if we think they did get that much better overall or not

they need the OL to be much better to spring barkley and they needed tate to keep a sefety deep and not give barkley constant 8 man boxes to beat every play this is why DG signed him i was surprised the level of venom he got for signing him i thought it was a very good pickup but after trading beckham he knew he was going to be public enemy number 1 regardless

In comment 14438434 Milton said:

Quote:

Especially if it meant missing the playoffs. I'm thinking 11-5 or 12-4 if they're not undone by injuries.

I can’t imagine having expectations that high for this season. It’s a lovely thought, and I am always hopeful that we win double digit games... but there is no evidence yet to support that kind of optimism.

Heck, the 2018 Giants could easily have gone 9-7 with a few breaks, and without the early injuries to Vernon, Engram and Halapio. They still would have been a poorly-constructed, paper-thin team. The 2019 version is better - at least on paper. So yes, they could very well go 9-7. And after doing that, they would be equally likely to go 12-4 or 4-12 in 2020.

I’d say 9-7 is definitely possible. If we made the jump from 5 wins to 9 and keep building the roster, I think we can all agree Shurmur has righted the ship at least for the immediate future. I think 2020 is the serious contender year. If we make the playoffs this year, it’ll be a bonus.

here are saying that “Gettleman got rid of all of our talent on defense”

Sure, Vernon, JPP, Harrison were “talented” but outside of Snacks, those guys got us absolutely nowhere. They weren’t very productive.

regarding the defense. He’s talented, yes. But where exactly did he make an impact last season?

In comment 14438441 Giantology said:

Quote:

In comment 14438434 Milton said: Quote: Especially if it meant missing the playoffs. I'm thinking 11-5 or 12-4 if they're not undone by injuries. I can’t imagine having expectations that high for this season. It’s a lovely thought, and I am always hopeful that we win double digit games... but there is no evidence yet to support that kind of optimism.

I believe in the talent on the roster and I believe in Shurmur and Bettcher. I believe in Barkley. And I'm unimpressed by the rest of the division. The Giants will be a team in which the whole is greater than the sum of the parts. That will not be the case for the Cowboys and Eagles.

Ultimately it will come down to health. Injuries will rescramble the landscape starting with training camp and continuing throughout the season. Hopefully it won't be too bad for the Giants.

Are overestimating the talent on this team.

It’s bad in places and very young in others. This team won’t sniff double digits, there’s going to be too many ups and downs.

Also, strength of schedule doesn’t factor in that other teams improved. The Giants could easily go 1-3 vs the AFC East as they could 3-1.

however it will be in 2020...

In comment 14438496 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

regarding the defense. He’s talented, yes. But where exactly did he make an impact last season?

This kind of comment seems like it forgets that 1 player on defense can be individually excellent and not be a savior. Darrelle Revis didn't win anything with the Jets. Did he not make an impact? He was still all-world at his job.


A great safety on a bad defense just isn't going to save the day. One player on any unit isn't going to save the day if he's surrounded with junk. The correct way to look at it is not to run down the player. It's the expectation that's wrong.

Particularly if SB goes down for an extended period, we would still win some games, but are no longer a legimate contender.

(and I assume other places like Rhode Island and maybe Jersey) where you can bet sports futures, the Giants win total is 6.

If you think there's a chance they can win 9 games that's a decent bet.

and a defense with a ton of young parts with little to no NFL experience. The defense in particular will need time to learn the system, and we need to see if the pass rush has more production than expected.

In comment 14437972 Alex_Webster said:

Quote:

In comment 14437967 bradshaw44 said: Quote: Eli league MVP Lombardi #5 You heard it here first. You beat me to the punch. With an extra win I might add. good work!!!

Standard deviation of +1/-1 and we picked exactly the same!

Have an unsurprising 4-12 season in them.

But 2020 could be better if they draft well.

instead of labeled as "underachieving". I'm not sure what that would mean for the win total but a softer schedule, some luck with injuries and a more consistent brand of football should equal a couple of more wins. I'll echo what others have said about next year being the target.

If they're not a playoff team, I don't care all that much if they win 5 or 10 games as long as they are able to form an identity and some of the younger talent continues to progress.

They have a favorable schedule. If the offensive line gels together, if the team doesn't get ravaged by injuries, if the team gets a little luck at the right times, then definitely 9-7 is possible.

ESPN simulated the 2019 season 40,000 times. Every team managed to win the Super Bowl. The article about the simulations said that even the Dolphins managed to win it once. I would assume the Giants won it at least twice.

There is too much parity in the league for a team to have no chance whatsoever of a winning season. Or at least in May.

we let 4 games slip away that should have been won. Carolina, Atlanta, Indy, and the last week against Dallas. Turn those into wins and we end up 9-7. We were so close to a decent season, but late game melt downs by the defense, and inability to protect Eli became our Achilles heel. Off season and draft acquisitions should put us, at the very least, 7-9 or 8-8. I'm cautiously optimistic.....and I'm especially rooting for Dungey to make the roster, he was so exciting to watch at SU (remember, they came VERY close to beating Clemson AT Clemson). We could get surprised with a 9-7, or 10-6 season.

In comment 14438671 clydeman1 said:

Quote:

we let 4 games slip away that should have been won. Carolina, Atlanta, Indy, and the last week against Dallas. Turn those into wins and we end up 9-7. We were so close to a decent season, but late game melt downs by the defense, and inability to protect Eli became our Achilles heel. Off season and draft acquisitions should put us, at the very least, 7-9 or 8-8. I'm cautiously optimistic.....and I'm especially rooting for Dungey to make the roster, he was so exciting to watch at SU (remember, they came VERY close to beating Clemson AT Clemson). We could get surprised with a 9-7, or 10-6 season.

What about the wins that could have gone the other way because other teams let them slip away?

defense is young and talented, OL investments moving in right direction, QB of future on the roster but not a sure thing day, dynamic running game, etc.

Differences
- Shurmur is in year 2 whereas '17 Bears were last year of John Fox and '18 Bears were year 1 of Nagy.
- Giants have Eli, who is obviously better than Glennon as a placeholder until Jones is ready
- '18 Bears had Khalil Mack

'17 Bears won 5 games
'18 Bears won 12 games
Median = 9 wins

But I do agree with others, this org is more setup to compete in 2020. The cap room should help add another defensive impact player as well as the 2020 draft capital.

Lots of young talented players that show this season that the arrow is pointing up.

Better than the Eagles/Cowboys as the sum of the parts? I will say Brandon Brooks injury is a massive blow to the Eagles, but they have Carson Wentz one year removed from his injury. Expect a big step up there. There is a reason Vegas has them as faves to win NFC East. The Cowboys defense is legit and if Travis Frederick returns to form watch out. The Giants have about 6 what ifs that need to happen. Injuries can change things on a dime in the NFL as we saw with the Redskins last year. They lost the majority of their Oline in one game and QB the next. They were probably on their way to 10 wins.

In 3 of the last 4 games. Remember we did that without OBJ. Now you add Tate and a further improved OL to that mix. Shurmur began to better understand how to use Engram late season too.

Then on the D side we have an influx of better fitting peices at Bettcher's disposal.

And lets not underrate the character/culture improvement.

Lastly easier schedule. 10-6 is not out of the question. Biggest wild card to me is how quickly Bettcher can get all these young new peices playing defense how he wants to play defense. If this D is just average we have enough firepower with Saquon who could already by the best overall offensive weapon in the NFL to win double digit games.

Jones's presence is going to inspire Eli into his best season in years. 4500 yds 69% 31 TDs 13 Int 9-7

But I'd argue for anywhere from 6 to 9 wins depending upon whether we develop a pass rush and whether our DBs can get up to speed quickly.

In comment 14438565 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

(and I assume other places like Rhode Island and maybe Jersey) where you can bet sports futures, the Giants win total is 6. If you think there's a chance they can win 9 games that's a decent bet.

I want in on their 16-1 odds to win the division.

.

It would be great if the coaching staff could provide a "schematic advantage" for the first couple of games with a game plan that provides a couple of easy TDs. If you give these young guys some confidence early I believe they could fly. If we are 0-2 and facing a must win in game 3, we could be in for a long season.

The Giants really need to stop losing Week 1 games.

If I'm going by memory, I am fairly certain that the 2016 opener in Dallas is the only Week 1 game the Giants have won since 2010.

Nearly an entire decade of losing our first game of the season.

Not how you want to start. I want to see that change this year. Teams are always vulnerable in Week 1 because they haven't fully identified what's going to work and what isn't.

We need to go into that building and get a win.

1-7 in our last 8 openers is inexcusable. We need to stop getting off on the wrong foot.

In comment 14439240 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

The Giants really need to stop losing Week 1 games. If I'm going by memory, I am fairly certain that the 2016 opener in Dallas is the only Week 1 game the Giants have won since 2010. Nearly an entire decade of losing our first game of the season. Not how you want to start. I want to see that change this year. Teams are always vulnerable in Week 1 because they haven't fully identified what's going to work and what isn't. We need to go into that building and get a win. 1-7 in our last 8 openers is inexcusable. We need to stop getting off on the wrong foot.

It is clear and plain that there is a bias against the Giants when involving the Cowboys. I get the Giants draw ratings vs the Cowboys but why does that ALWAYS have to be in Dallas? Huh?

I think there was once when the Giants opened at home vs Dallas and the Giants were defending champions. Surprised no one raised the proposal to have that game IN Dallas so the little bitch Cowboys and their fans got their way. Still a lot of Dallas fans in NJ who got their way thanks to David Wilson and I remember Victor Cruz not doing so well in that game.

Jaguars defense

I don't think the Giants schedule is overly difficult, especially because we aren't traveling all that much or all that far when we do. We have no back to back road games due to the bye week.

Beat Dallas in Dallas. That would make me begin to believe we are a playoff type team.

In comment 14438496 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

regarding the defense. He’s talented, yes. But where exactly did he make an impact last season?

Collins led the team in tackles for the 4th straight year. That probably had some impact don't you think?
Just because the overall team hasn't been good lately doesn't mean we didn't have good players. Bad coaching and lots of bad players were the problem and not Collins, Snacks, JPP, Vernon and certainly not OBJ.

In comment 14438721 Giantz_comeback said:

Quote:

In 3 of the last 4 games. Remember we did that without OBJ. Now you add Tate and a further improved OL to that mix. Shurmur began to better understand how to use Engram late season too. Then on the D side we have an influx of better fitting peices at Bettcher's disposal. And lets not underrate the character/culture improvement. Lastly easier schedule. 10-6 is not out of the question. Biggest wild card to me is how quickly Bettcher can get all these young new peices playing defense how he wants to play defense. If this D is just average we have enough firepower with Saquon who could already by the best overall offensive weapon in the NFL to win double digit games.

lol, funny how you left out getting shutout by a mediocre Titans team 17-0. Also the 40 points was against a Redskins team that was tanking. The 35 points was against a cowboys team that was resting everybody that was at all nicked up. The 27 points against the colts was legit though .... but we still lost.

.

In comment 14439524 RicosRoidedElbow said:

Quote:

.

hmm, I would say it's more of a cardinal statistic.

overrated Giant of all time

In comment 14439561 RicosRoidedElbow said:

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overrated Giant of all time

lol, you just lost all your credibility.

In comment 14439520 Giants_Rock said:

Quote:

In comment 14438721 Giantz_comeback said: Quote: In 3 of the last 4 games. Remember we did that without OBJ. Now you add Tate and a further improved OL to that mix. Shurmur began to better understand how to use Engram late season too. Then on the D side we have an influx of better fitting peices at Bettcher's disposal. And lets not underrate the character/culture improvement. Lastly easier schedule. 10-6 is not out of the question. Biggest wild card to me is how quickly Bettcher can get all these young new peices playing defense how he wants to play defense. If this D is just average we have enough firepower with Saquon who could already by the best overall offensive weapon in the NFL to win double digit games. lol, funny how you left out getting shutout by a mediocre Titans team 17-0. Also the 40 points was against a Redskins team that was tanking. The 35 points was against a cowboys team that was resting everybody that was at all nicked up. The 27 points against the colts was legit though .... but we still lost.

Defense is the bigger question mark but we have alot more talent and better fitting pieces for Bettcher's D. Question is how quickly can they get acclimated to the NFL.

There wasn't anywhere near the turnover between 1983 and 1984 as we've seen under DG the last two years. Five rookies started in 1984 but other than that every other starter in 1984 was on the team in 1983. The only players of note that were replaced were Van Pelt and Brian Kelly both of whom were late in their careers. I shutter to think what DG might have done to the '83 roster (LT as a Brown...yuck).

In comment 14440040 Giants_Rock said:

Quote:

In comment 14439561 RicosRoidedElbow said: Quote: overrated Giant of all time lol, you just lost all your credibility.

Care to dispute the validity of my words or are you just going to make an insult without any evidence like 97% of people these days?

If not, just run along and let the big boys talk football.

In comment 14440117 RicosRoidedElbow said:

Quote:

In comment 14440040 Giants_Rock said: Quote: In comment 14439561 RicosRoidedElbow said: Quote: overrated Giant of all time lol, you just lost all your credibility. Care to dispute the validity of my words or are you just going to make an insult without any evidence like 97% of people these days? If not, just run along and let the big boys talk football.

Hey new account. What's your previous handle?

but it's gonna take some masterful work to get the D to gel. And a big step up for Carter, and a huge return to form for Golden.

I'm excited to see Baker go to work, and Lawrence is already pro level. Of course he can get better, too.

They say OLs need time to gel too, but Zeitler and Remmers have had a few turns on the dance floor already. I think they'll mesh quicker than Solder and Hernandez did last year.

I see this team winning 11 games!

IF they consistently run the ball more than they pass, they'll win games. Look back over Eli's history. When they run the ball first, to set up the pass, they've managed to win games. When the game plan calls for passing first, the results have typically not been impressive.

They have the backfield, they've improved the O line. Now all they have to do is utilize them to keep the ball away from Eli and the other team.

I think the offense will struggle at times to move the ball, especially early in the season.

This defense will be on the field a lot, give up a lot of points, and will not let the offense establish itself.

This offense is not a come from behind type offense and the defense is not nearly close enough to compliment it the way it is currently structured.

We are 5-11 to 7-9 at best and that is more due to an easier schedule when compared to last year than improved roster. I think we need another draft and need to get Eli off the books and get some FA's here.

In comment 14440434 Mark from Jersey said:

Quote:

I think the offense will struggle at times to move the ball, especially early in the season. This defense will be on the field a lot, give up a lot of points, and will not let the offense establish itself. This offense is not a come from behind type offense and the defense is not nearly close enough to compliment it the way it is currently structured. We are 5-11 to 7-9 at best and that is more due to an easier schedule when compared to last year than improved roster. I think we need another draft and need to get Eli off the books and get some FA's here.

Then you must have thought the 2nd half of last year was a total aberration offensively. What has downgraded from that team? Coaching, talent, culture? OBJ didn't play most of those games and we've upgraded in many other spots and are now 2nd year in the system.

Giants were 7-9 in 2013, that team was trash because Reese couldn't figure out how to foster an offensive line.

Then genius Reese drafts OBJ in '14 and the Giants have an even worse record, 6-10. OK he was injured the first games of his career in 2014. OK. Then what gave in 2015? Still went 6-10.

He is not needed. I'd much rather have a decent offensive line, solid defense and running game. Give me Golden Tate any day over OBJ and Randle.