First of all happy Mother’s Day to all the mothers and hell even the mother f@& $?3?s on here.
Not making the same mistake like last week this will be the only place I’ll be online untill after it airs. Well maybe some golf clash. I’m sure leaks will be out there as the episode draws closer.
Battle of Mother’s Day the mother of dragons vs “pregnant “ Cersei. Don’t think more than half the episode will be battle but could be epic. I think the death toll will be high this episode since most everyone somehow survived the BoW. Maybe a little foreshadowing but the episode Tywin died was on Father’s Day could his daughter have the same fate tonight?
I don't think you're referring to me but for what it's worth I have diligently avoided r/freefolk and the social media spoilers; my one minor prediction was my own speculation.
Outside of those two, the only way to be king would be through support of a majority of the other houses. It certainly will not be the hated imp or the bastard blacksmith. It will be a Stark.
There are really just the three options: Dany, Jon, or Sansa. Anything outside of those three is a reach at best and silly.
Gendry has a claim stronger than Dany.
In Robert's rebellion Robert Baratheon won the throne with support of all houses (except of course the Targaryen's who were decimated - other than Jon Snow, only Viserys and Dany I believe remained).
The way the Lanisters got their grubby hands on the throne (Cersei) was due to Joffrey/Tommen being Robert's children (even though we know they were not) and upon their death Cersei remained queen sans the regent title.
now that he's a legitimized baratheon his claim is technically strongest without a war to claim the throne.
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Gendry has a claim stronger than Dany.
In Robert's rebellion Robert Baratheon won the throne with support of all houses (except of course the Targaryen's who were decimated - other than Jon Snow, only Viserys and Dany I believe remained).
The way the Lanisters got their grubby hands on the throne (Cersei) was due to Joffrey/Tommen being Robert's children (even though we know they were not) and upon their death Cersei remained queen sans the regent title.
now that he's a legitimized baratheon his claim is technically strongest without a war to claim the throne.
That's not quite right. The Tyrells and Tarlys, for example, fought against Robert. Robert had the best "claim" because a long-ago ancestor was a (bastard?) Targ. I think it's pretty safe to say that Dany is much more of a Targ than Gendry.
Well, those people are just miserable, butthurt, whiny complainers who can never be happy and who think they're smarter than everyone else.
So there!
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Gendry has a claim stronger than Dany.
In Robert's rebellion Robert Baratheon won the throne with support of all houses (except of course the Targaryen's who were decimated - other than Jon Snow, only Viserys and Dany I believe remained).
The way the Lanisters got their grubby hands on the throne (Cersei) was due to Joffrey/Tommen being Robert's children (even though we know they were not) and upon their death Cersei remained queen sans the regent title.
now that he's a legitimized baratheon his claim is technically strongest without a war to claim the throne.
That's not quite right. The Tyrells and Tarlys, for example, fought against Robert. Robert had the best "claim" because a long-ago ancestor was a (bastard?) Targ. I think it's pretty safe to say that Dany is much more of a Targ than Gendry.
Robert's Rebellion was a mostly unified attack on the Targaryen's provoked by Rhaegar Targaryen snubbing the Martell's and making advances on Lyanna Stark (who was betrothed to Robert Baratheon), whom Rhaegar then "kidnapped".
Aerys (Rhaegars's father) then brutally murdered Brandon and Rickard Stark who attempted to come to Lyanna's aid.
There were lords and houses that resisted, but by and large the majority of Westeros supported Robert and the Starks (an the Arryn's) and even the Lannisters.
Robert won the throne in battle, not because he was a distant Targaryen cousin (which is true).
House Baratheon is their own house just like House Targaryen is their own house.
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In comment 14443103 pjcas18 said:
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Gendry has a claim stronger than Dany.
In Robert's rebellion Robert Baratheon won the throne with support of all houses (except of course the Targaryen's who were decimated - other than Jon Snow, only Viserys and Dany I believe remained).
The way the Lanisters got their grubby hands on the throne (Cersei) was due to Joffrey/Tommen being Robert's children (even though we know they were not) and upon their death Cersei remained queen sans the regent title.
now that he's a legitimized baratheon his claim is technically strongest without a war to claim the throne.
That's not quite right. The Tyrells and Tarlys, for example, fought against Robert. Robert had the best "claim" because a long-ago ancestor was a (bastard?) Targ. I think it's pretty safe to say that Dany is much more of a Targ than Gendry.
Robert's Rebellion was a mostly unified attack on the Targaryen's provoked by Rhaegar Targaryen snubbing the Martell's and making advances on Lyanna Stark (who was betrothed to Robert Baratheon), whom Rhaegar then "kidnapped".
Aerys (Rhaegars's father) then brutally murdered Brandon and Rickard Stark who attempted to come to Lyanna's aid.
There were lords and houses that resisted, but by and large the majority of Westeros supported Robert and the Starks (an the Arryn's) and even the Lannisters.
Robert won the throne in battle, not because he was a distant Targaryen cousin (which is true).
House Baratheon is their own house just like House Targaryen is their own house.
You're basically then arguing that a Baratheon has a better claim than a Targ. Which, ok, but really that just comes down to power.
it's why when there is a "regime change" they hunt down and kill all the children, even known bastards.
I think it will come down to who the Starks, Greyjoys, Arryn's, etc. support.
Gendry had to keep his identity hidden, just like Edric Storm in the books, because otherwise they would have been killed.
As for Hands maybe Davos? Tyrion? Sansa? although I think she would be warden of the North. Maybe Gendry? Sam? Sam would be a good choice.
Dany (high odds)
and one of Jon Snow or Arya (but not both)
I think Tyrion is 50/50, maybe he goes out in a display of heroism.
Though, Martin has said before that 5 characters survive to the end: Tyrion, Dany, Bran, Arya, and Jon Snow
not sure the show writers stick to that, and sorry if that's a spoiler, it's been known for years.
true, I assumed he meant survived, but I guess not a safe assumption. No mention of Sansa though.
Sorry that article where Martin said that is over 3 years old and it's been discussed on here many times, I figured everyone knew it.
Maybe if the OP sees this he can delete the thread and start a new one to discuss the finale and I'll refrain from any "theories"
I don't want this thread to get deleted because of me! Lot of good (and otherwise) reading for me!
Peace out!
As for Hands maybe Davos? Tyrion? Sansa? although I think she would be warden of the North. Maybe Gendry? Sam? Sam would be a good choice.
Assuming they get into the details of his small council, I'd guess Davos is hand assuming who lives. Otherwise probably Tyrion. Sansa - Lady of Winterfell, Warden of the North. Sam's more fit to be his maester, than a hand, given his limited knowledge of ruling/battle field tactics. Maybe Arya is named to the Kingsguard.
Dany (high odds)
and one of Jon Snow or Arya (but not both)
I think Tyrion is 50/50, maybe he goes out in a display of heroism.
Though, Martin has said before that 5 characters survive to the end: Tyrion, Dany, Bran, Arya, and Jon Snow
not sure the show writers stick to that, and sorry if that's a spoiler, it's been known for years.
The surviving characters you listed were for his original book series pitch in which Jon and Tyrion were both trying to get it on with Arya, Sansa has Joffreys kid and betrays House Stark, and Cat dies north of the wall. It's probably safe to say that won't happen.
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for the finale I have:
Dany (high odds)
and one of Jon Snow or Arya (but not both)
I think Tyrion is 50/50, maybe he goes out in a display of heroism.
Though, Martin has said before that 5 characters survive to the end: Tyrion, Dany, Bran, Arya, and Jon Snow
not sure the show writers stick to that, and sorry if that's a spoiler, it's been known for years.
The surviving characters you listed were for his original book series pitch in which Jon and Tyrion were both trying to get it on with Arya, Sansa has Joffreys kid and betrays House Stark, and Cat dies north of the wall. It's probably safe to say that won't happen.
Not sure about any of the subplots, in the article it only talks about the original outline but Martin goes on to say as you build up plots and drop hints and foreshadow things (my paraphrasing) you can't easily change the plot.
So, while it's possible that his trilogy outline (not plot) changes, it's also very possible it doesn't.
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Jon Snow or Aegon Targaryen 6th of his name on the throne. This is the story of Fire and Ice... It is Jon's story. He didn't kill the NK so it has to finish up with him on the Iron Throne as the reluctant ruler. This isn't the story of the girl with no name or the whiny betrayer of family or the mad queen, etc.
As for Hands maybe Davos? Tyrion? Sansa? although I think she would be warden of the North. Maybe Gendry? Sam? Sam would be a good choice.
Assuming they get into the details of his small council, I'd guess Davos is hand assuming who lives. Otherwise probably Tyrion. Sansa - Lady of Winterfell, Warden of the North. Sam's more fit to be his maester, than a hand, given his limited knowledge of ruling/battle field tactics. Maybe Arya is named to the Kingsguard.
I don't think Sam would want to be maester any more since he is now lord of his house will probably want to marry Gilly and have more babies or at least practice at it. Hand doesn't necessarily run your battles. The king shits and the hand wipes.
He'd make an excellent hand of the king or head of the kings guard.
or he's just good for comedic relief.
He'd make an excellent hand of the king or head of the kings guard.
or he's just good for comedic relief.
Tormund and Sansa? Huh could be fun!
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the last of Tormund Giantsbane. One of my favorite characters.
He'd make an excellent hand of the king or head of the kings guard.
or he's just good for comedic relief.
Tormund and Sansa? Huh could be fun!
I think he winds up with Brienne somehow.
Considering how much this season has crammed in, a lot can happen in 80 minutes of run time.
What if nobody takes the iron throne and the 7 kingdoms go back to being 7 separate kingdoms again?
The heads of almost all of the major houses are gone with some completely destroyed.
King's Landing is leveled. There literally is no iron throne anymore.
That certainly could be seen as "breaking the wheel" in a sense.
What if nobody takes the iron throne and the 7 kingdoms go back to being 7 separate kingdoms again?
The heads of almost all of the major houses are gone with some completely destroyed.
King's Landing is leveled. There literally is no iron throne anymore.
That certainly could be seen as "breaking the wheel" in a sense.
I'd be surprised if the iron throne is destroyed. I imagine we'll see a shot of Dany in the throne room (or what's left of it) with the ashes falling.
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Not sure if that was directed at me, but I never read any of the spoilers. My theory was just based on setting up a similar situation to Robert rebellion.
Only way to get there is by Dany relinquishing her power - either she does it voluntarily or she is killed. I still think there's enough good in her to be swayed to do the right thing. And ultimately I still think that Jon Snow dies - just a feeling that his story comes to an end with some sort of sacrifice. Perhaps his death may be what sways her.
Only way to get there is by Dany relinquishing her power - either she does it voluntarily or she is killed. I still think there's enough good in her to be swayed to do the right thing. And ultimately I still think that Jon Snow dies - just a feeling that his story comes to an end with some sort of sacrifice. Perhaps his death may be what sways her.
All those leaders of 7 kingdoms were already in place with a king or queen on the iron throne. Only they all in theory bent the knee to King's Landing.
I also realize things are highly unlikely to end up this "neat" and would be somewhat disappointed if they did.
I think Tyrion would be a good hand to someone whose a little more sane or not looking to conquer anything. But after this if he survives he might be done with the whole thing and live out his life with wine in his belly and a whores mouth ...........
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The chick with the green hair posing the whole time for the camera is annoying as fuck
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The 7 kingdoms are ready to be divided up among those that are still alive: Sansa Stark gets the North/Winterfell. Gendry Baratheon(now no longer a bastard) keeps Storm's End. Yara Greyjoy is already in place at the Iron Islands. Tyrion Lannister takes over at Casterly Rock. Dorne has a new leader that was already mentioned in passing. Robin Arryn is still Lord of the Eyrie. That just leaves Highgarden - which was promised to Bronn by Tyrion (and a Lannister always pays his debts).
Only way to get there is by Dany relinquishing her power - either she does it voluntarily or she is killed. I still think there's enough good in her to be swayed to do the right thing. And ultimately I still think that Jon Snow dies - just a feeling that his story comes to an end with some sort of sacrifice. Perhaps his death may be what sways her.
All those leaders of 7 kingdoms were already in place with a king or queen on the iron throne. Only they all in theory bent the knee to King's Landing.
Not sure what you mean - none of those proposed leaders were in place prior to Cersei, and none of them have pledged any loyalty to Cersei.
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In comment 14443824 eclipz928 said:
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The 7 kingdoms are ready to be divided up among those that are still alive: Sansa Stark gets the North/Winterfell. Gendry Baratheon(now no longer a bastard) keeps Storm's End. Yara Greyjoy is already in place at the Iron Islands. Tyrion Lannister takes over at Casterly Rock. Dorne has a new leader that was already mentioned in passing. Robin Arryn is still Lord of the Eyrie. That just leaves Highgarden - which was promised to Bronn by Tyrion (and a Lannister always pays his debts).
Only way to get there is by Dany relinquishing her power - either she does it voluntarily or she is killed. I still think there's enough good in her to be swayed to do the right thing. And ultimately I still think that Jon Snow dies - just a feeling that his story comes to an end with some sort of sacrifice. Perhaps his death may be what sways her.
All those leaders of 7 kingdoms were already in place with a king or queen on the iron throne. Only they all in theory bent the knee to King's Landing.
Not sure what you mean - none of those proposed leaders were in place prior to Cersei, and none of them have pledged any loyalty to Cersei.
when the story started they all acknowledged Robert Baratheon as king of the realm. There were some squabbles, but for the most part that's been accepted.
it wasn't until Ned's beheading and Robb Stark's battle revenge, Stannis/Renly making claims over Joffrey the incestuous Lannister, etc. the red wedding, etc. that this turmoil began.
Prior to Robert's rebellion all the 7 kingdoms also had their own leadership, but also acknowledged Aerys Targaryen as the king of the 7 kingdoms.
it's how things are in times without turmoil.
So to suggest each of the 7 kingdoms would have their own leadership, they already did was my point.
Yes, the people you named replace others, but not the fact they all bent the knee to king's Landing (for the most part - scheming not withstanding).
If you're suggesting a vacuum in king's landing, but 7 autonomous kingdoms without bending the knee to anyone, someone would be power hungry and that would never last, even if that's how it ends (IMO).
Without dragons, or something equivalent, there's no reason to expect any one of the newly autonomous realms to make an uprising and try to repeat history. Not to mention that none of these leaders have really shown that sort of want or ambition to be conquerors.
But the point is that a logical and dramatic conclusion to this story would actually be for the characters in this world to throw away the only thing that they've ever known (absolute monarchy) and progress towards something that could be potentially better.
Without dragons, or something equivalent, there's no reason to expect any one of the newly autonomous realms to make an uprising and try to repeat history. Not to mention that none of these leaders have really shown that sort of want or ambition to be conquerors.
But the point is that a logical and dramatic conclusion to this story would actually be for the characters in this world to throw away the only thing that they've ever known (absolute monarchy) and progress towards something that could be potentially better.
Makes sense, but I don't see Dany relinquishing power while she's alive.
And the dragons helped unify Westeros, but they last century or so of Targaryen rule (my guess) there were no dragons.
I'm not fully convinced that Dany survives and decides to give up the throne - it's mostly wishful thinking because i don't want to see that character go completely beyond redemption. There's other directions that this all can go and end up at the same place.
I'm not fully convinced that Dany survives and decides to give up the throne - it's mostly wishful thinking because i don't want to see that character go completely beyond redemption. There's other directions that this all can go and end up at the same place.
Definitely, but if you read at all about Aerys and Tywin's history there are some similarities between Dany and Aerys.
I think they were alluding to the madness for a while, not to Aerys level. I mean he was paranoid - without reason for the most part, Dany is probably paranoid too - but with good reason.
I just think Martin ties it up in a bow, a Targaryen goes mad to start this thing, and a Targaryen goes mad to end it.
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Pathetic. It's been happening on threads all season. The leaks from months ago on r/freefolk and other social media have proven 95% true. Posting them word for word and pretending it's a theory of yours is cringey. I won't name names so as not to ruin it for others.
Not sure if that was directed at me, but I never read any of the spoilers. My theory was just based on setting up a similar situation to Robert rebellion.
yo bonds is a horse's ass.
This series deserves a final season that makes sense.
Subvert my expectations and make it happen, HBO!
Remake Game of Thrones Season 8 with competent writers. - ( New Window )
He'd make an excellent hand of the king or head of the kings guard.
or he's just good for comedic relief.
I hope so too. Tormund is a great character that I hope we see in the finale. If you look closely you will see that Varys had already written 4 scrolls and was working on a 5th to alert allies that Jon is the true heir to the throne. One is obviously headed to Dorne, another to Gendry Baratheon, and I am assuming the rest are for houses in the North. Remember back to last season when Gendry introduced himself to Jon and said that their fathers were close and fought side by side. Even though Dany gave Gendry the land and title his loyalty will still be to Jon. I had a feeling that this decision would come back to hurt her and I think it will next week. I would love to see one final battle between Jon and Dany.
Basically, the Dany character took a huge turn from her resume and this has fans confused and hurt. I agree.
And please don’t tell me she toasted those two warriors who would not bend the knee. They had a choice and chose to be toasted. That is not all on Dany. And I don’t want to hear about the 163 she crucified either. They got what they deserved too. Again, it’s not like they were poor little innocents either. The thousands toasted in this last episode were nobodies and Dany just doesn’t toast them.
But just look at all the good she has done for countless number of slaves and downtrodden people. She freed them and gave them hope. And now GOT wants us to believe the Mad Gene rose up and made her become this monster. Sorry.....we loyal fans for 7 seasons ain’t buying that.
Dany out of character. - ( New Window )
Basically, the Dany character took a huge turn from her resume and this has fans confused and hurt. I agree.
And please don’t tell me she toasted those two warriors who would not bend the knee. They had a choice and chose to be toasted. That is not all on Dany. And I don’t want to hear about the 163 she crucified either. They got what they deserved too. Again, it’s not like they were poor little innocents either. The thousands toasted in this last episode were nobodies and Dany just doesn’t toast them.
But just look at all the good she has done for countless number of slaves and downtrodden people. She freed them and gave them hope. And now GOT wants us to believe the Mad Gene rose up and made her become this monster. Sorry.....we loyal fans for 7 seasons ain’t buying that. Dany out of character. - ( New Window )
fine Bowls, but this quote is just patently fucking absurd: