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Pat Traina with a very interesting roster analysis.........

GiantBlue : 5/15/2019 8:46 am
I always find her work very comprehensive and interesting.


Link - ( New Window )
Pat....  
Moose and Fury : 5/15/2019 8:55 am : link
Is that you?
That was a nice  
section125 : 5/15/2019 9:04 am : link
write up.
eli:  
V.I.G. : 5/15/2019 9:05 am : link
"As for Manning, a recent video of him posted by the teamís website show heís slimmed down"

i didnt see the video but sure hope he gets some pep back in those feet
Nice comprehensive review  
Jay in Toronto : 5/15/2019 9:06 am : link
Interesting there is no mention of Perkins.

It will be an interesting season -- a bit too much relying on the young new guys for my taste -- but hopeful it will work out.

The front 7 could be feast or famine. Hope everything falls into 'line'.
We were shut out by the Colts in week 16?  
PetesHereNow : 5/15/2019 9:11 am : link
Probably not Pattiís fault, but you would think Forbes had someone proofread it?
Defense is scary bad on paper  
larryflower37 : 5/15/2019 9:17 am : link
Especially the front 7.
I still don't get the 35 yr old safety.
All rookie cbs.
Best hope at edge is coming off a Achilles injury.
Offense will need to put up 50 points a game.
Listened to her podcast this morning.  
Brown Recluse : 5/15/2019 9:20 am : link
I wish people would stop saying "the offensive line rebuild is complete." Its not. Remmers is not guaranteed to start over Chad Wheeler and there's no guarantee he will even make it through 16 games. He's more of an insurance signing than anything.

People are WAY over-hyping this signing.
I don't really understand the offseason rules...  
Dan in the Springs : 5/15/2019 9:21 am : link
I get that players are allowed to work out at the facilities, and they can even use the practice fields to work out with them. I thought though that the coaches were not allowed to take the field with them and work with them other than the officially designated camps and practices. I didn't think there had been any official days of practice with the vets and coaches yet. Isn't that supposed to start next week?

Based on that understanding this quote about Eli raised an eyebrow:
Quote:
They just need him to continue that work heís done so far in practice in the regular season.


What work has he been doing in practice so far that Coach Shula would have been able to observe?
Great  
PhilD : 5/15/2019 9:21 am : link
write up.
Remmers..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 5/15/2019 9:22 am : link
is as close to be a guaranteed starter as anyone on the line. While it has been a couple of years since he played T, that's his best position and he's far better than wheeler.

There's a higher liklihood Wheeler gets cut than him being the starter based on play.
RE: Defense is scary bad on paper  
section125 : 5/15/2019 9:24 am : link
In comment 14444437 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
Especially the front 7.
I still don't get the 35 yr old safety.
All rookie cbs.
Best hope at edge is coming off a Achilles injury.
Offense will need to put up 50 points a game.


Not scarier than last year. Not even close, rookies or not.

As far as Bethea, I thought Pat explained that well - guy knows the defense and is reliable to make the right call as opposed to Riley and he can tackle, as opposed to Riley.

You don't need miracle improvements to make the defense better. Upgrades at several positions have a compound effect. Stopping 1 or 2 more series per game vastly improves chances for a win. They improved at 3 out of 4 DB positions.
Wondering about this quote...  
Dan in the Springs : 5/15/2019 9:28 am : link
sent me to Google to find an answer:

Quote:
Last year, Ellison, who is also a sneaky good receiver, caught 25 balls, a career high, for 272 yards and one touchdown. However, his yards per reception dipped from 5.6 in 2017 to 5.2, and he had a couple of drops, the first time in his career heís had multiple dropped passes in a season.


By my reckoning 25 balls for 272 yards is almost 11 yards per reception. What do the stats say? yds/reception = 10.9.

Next, I was guessing the 5.2 yd/reception was actually 5.2 yd/target? According to PFR his yds/target was actually 8.0.

Not sure what Pat's getting at here, must just have the numbers wrong.
Kudos to Patricia  
George from PA : 5/15/2019 9:29 am : link
Did not fall into trap almost every other beat writer has.....with DG has no plan, D.Jones was a major reach, clueless, etc.

She went behind the fog of media stupidity to dig into the meat of the roster....

It was fair and balance and nit much to disagree with other than

I am not a fan of Goodson, do not think it would be great if he starts....and hope someone replaces him.

Shocking..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 5/15/2019 9:30 am : link
that there are factual errors. Getting shutout by the Colts. Must use sxcda's method of research!
I thought this bit on X-man pretty interesting...  
Dan in the Springs : 5/15/2019 9:45 am : link
Quote:
ďHeís a guy that loves the game," Dawson said. "You can tell just even a couple days with him here when we were out here training. Heís a guy that wants to get better, he wants to know what he did wrong. Even if it wasnít necessarily an incorrect or a bad rep, ĎHow can I make that rep a little bit better? Coach me on the film.í

ďSome guys, they just go, ĎHey coach, I did what Iím supposed to do. Letís move on to the next playí. Heís a guy that wants to know the ins-and-outs of it. Heís going to be a fun guy to be able to get your hands on, and get to help mold and shape, and watch him grow.Ē


... given that one of his strengths coming out was supposed to be a pretty good arsenal of tools - good hand usage etc. Sounds like he took well to coaching in college and is continuing to do the same.
Overall a good article...  
Dan in the Springs : 5/15/2019 9:53 am : link
I like how she mixes the quotes of the coaches about specific players into the unit analysis. It's clear she knows the team pretty well, much better than any of the national media anyway.

The number of factual and grammatical errors and typos is really a sad fact of life given the cutbacks I'm sure places like Forbes have to make to their editorial staff given their business model. Too bad someone didn't seem to proof-read this before publishing. We all know that writing something this lengthy will result in errors that the author's mind doesn't catch, so I don't pin that on Pat, but on the editor.
Didn't Pat used to pop in on BBI from time to time,  
Brown Recluse : 5/15/2019 9:55 am : link
forever ago?

Did she get run off like everyone else does? :)

I may be getting BBI and BBWC confused.
I find Pat to be very fair in both her articles and tweet responses  
GiantBlue : 5/15/2019 10:02 am : link
She isn't a Giants front office shill nor is she one to tout the sky is falling. She tells it like it is and in this age of click bait, fake news, hysteria and the like, I find her reads refreshing and objective.

When asked this morning about the lack of a #1 receiver, she responded that based on her assessment and talking to coaches....this offense is going to spread the ball around and have more of a varied look.

Patricia Traina @Patricia_Traina ∑ 37m .
Might not need a true No. 1 if the offense plays out like I think it will.
Dan..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 5/15/2019 10:02 am : link
if had only been Forbes that would be one thing.

I think Pat still posts here. She has been criticized in the past for getting basic facts wrong. Maybe an editor is asleep at the wheel, but somebody is sending in the original with those errors.
RE: Didn't Pat used to pop in on BBI from time to time,  
section125 : 5/15/2019 10:02 am : link
In comment 14444537 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
forever ago?

Did she get run off like everyone else does? :)

I may be getting BBI and BBWC confused.


Yes she used to post. Not sure she was run off or just didn't have time to kibitz anymore.
RE: RE: Didn't Pat used to pop in on BBI from time to time,  
section125 : 5/15/2019 10:03 am : link
In comment 14444548 section125 said:
Quote:
In comment 14444537 Brown Recluse said:


Quote:


forever ago?

Did she get run off like everyone else does? :)

I may be getting BBI and BBWC confused.



Yes she used to post. Not sure she was run off or just didn't have time to kibitz anymore.


Just checked and she is still registered.
The shutout was against the Titans  
cjac : 5/15/2019 10:05 am : link
not the Colts
RE: Listened to her podcast this morning.  
PatersonPlank : 5/15/2019 10:08 am : link
In comment 14444443 Brown Recluse said:
Quote:
I wish people would stop saying "the offensive line rebuild is complete." Its not. Remmers is not guaranteed to start over Chad Wheeler and there's no guarantee he will even make it through 16 games. He's more of an insurance signing than anything.

People are WAY over-hyping this signing.


I'll bet you $1 that Remmers starts right away. He is almost a lock IMO. However I agree the Giants need to keep building the OL. A top C (unless Halapio turns out to be really good) and atop T in the draft is necessary. Solder and Remmers are good for a year or two, but they are getting up there.
If Remmers somehow didn't win the job from Wheeler  
Ten Ton Hammer : 5/15/2019 10:09 am : link
I'd expect Wheeler would be soon getting suspended for PEDs.

RE: RE: Listened to her podcast this morning.  
gidiefor : Mod : 5/15/2019 10:11 am : link
In comment 14444564 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 14444443 Brown Recluse said:

Quote:

I wish people would stop saying "the offensive line rebuild is complete."


Hey Recluse - I think when she says that she means for this year
I have to disagree with Pat here  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 10:16 am : link
"Although Halapio ended up beating out Brett Jones for the starting job, he has yet to compete with Spender Pulley, the waiver wire pickup made by the Giants at the end of training camp last year who came in and manned the center position very well."

Pulley struggled at center. He was better than Greco but that's not saying much. Pulley struggled mightily versus the bull rush. He will have to get much stronger if he is going to ever be more than an average backup center. Too often last season he was pushed back into the pocket.
This is very interesting ...  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 10:17 am : link
ďWhile the expectation is not for Jones to start right away, head coach Pat Shurmur has still made it abundantly clear that Manning needs to win games to keep the rookie on the bench.

Meanwhile, offensive coordinator Mike Shula made it clear that Jonesí development is going to be put on a fast track to where if the situation is right, the world could get its first look at the future franchise quarterback in a regular season game as soon as this year.Ē

Shurmur putting pressure on Eli to win games ... OC fast tracking Jonesí development ... maybe iím Overthinking this, but this sounds like they will not be afraid to pull the plug on Eli if he isnít lighting it up and helping win games (as in, they could have a 4-3, 5-5 type record and still bench him)

Interesting times ... i expect some of the Jones pressure to mount as soon as preseason if he rips off a couple 2nd half runs while Eli throws an INT beforehand. *i expect Eli starting week 1 ... but DAL/BUF have legit defenses ... interesting times.
Time will tell and it may take another year but  
Spider56 : 5/15/2019 10:18 am : link
I really like what DG has done with the roster. Now, just win baby.
RE: RE: RE: Listened to her podcast this morning.  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 10:19 am : link
In comment 14444572 gidiefor said:
Quote:
In comment 14444564 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:


In comment 14444443 Brown Recluse said:

Quote:

I wish people would stop saying "the offensive line rebuild is complete."



Hey Recluse - I think when she says that she means for this year

Yes that's clearly what she means. Nobody is suggesting that Solder, Remmers, and Halapio are long term answers as they are all on the wrong side of 30. Gettleman will need to continue to bring in young players to eventually replace those three. Hopefully we have at least one starter out of Evan Brown, Asafo-Adjei, James O'Hagan, Nick Gates, Paul Adams, and Austin Droogsma.
RE: Nice comprehensive review  
djstat : 5/15/2019 10:19 am : link
In comment 14444420 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
Interesting there is no mention of Perkins.

It will be an interesting season -- a bit too much relying on the young new guys for my taste -- but hopeful it will work out.

The front 7 could be feast or famine. Hope everything falls into 'line'.
The old guys were losers. If we have to lose, lose with young up and comers
If this were any rosier, I could give it to my wife for Valentines day  
mikeinbloomfield : 5/15/2019 10:20 am : link
"How will they replace Beckham, a guy who only missed 1,000 yards once? Well, Golden Tate will be asked to contribute, if he's smart enough to pick up the offense." Ha ha, I guess that's solved!

This is not analysis. It's clickbait.
RE: This is very interesting ...  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 10:22 am : link
In comment 14444584 GothamGiants said:
Quote:
ďWhile the expectation is not for Jones to start right away, head coach Pat Shurmur has still made it abundantly clear that Manning needs to win games to keep the rookie on the bench.

Meanwhile, offensive coordinator Mike Shula made it clear that Jonesí development is going to be put on a fast track to where if the situation is right, the world could get its first look at the future franchise quarterback in a regular season game as soon as this year.Ē

Shurmur putting pressure on Eli to win games ... OC fast tracking Jonesí development ... maybe iím Overthinking this, but this sounds like they will not be afraid to pull the plug on Eli if he isnít lighting it up and helping win games (as in, they could have a 4-3, 5-5 type record and still bench him)

Interesting times ... i expect some of the Jones pressure to mount as soon as preseason if he rips off a couple 2nd half runs while Eli throws an INT beforehand. *i expect Eli starting week 1 ... but DAL/BUF have legit defenses ... interesting times.

Shurmur isn't on the hot seat yet but it's definitely getting warmer. The Giants will likely give him this season and next to prove himself. If Eli is struggling then he will not hesitate to replace him with Jones. Jones getting experience next season will benefit him greatly in 2020.
people forget  
GiantsFan84 : 5/15/2019 10:24 am : link
this team sucked last year. this was the team that other teams don't get up to play and overlook. and the giants caught some good teams in weeks where they came out flat. this team was BAD last year. like 1-7 bad. yes they improved somewhat, but people on this site are really putting on the rose colored glasses. this is still not a good team.
Wasn't Golden's injury an ACL, not an Achilles?  
Big Blue Blogger : 5/15/2019 10:28 am : link
Patti refers to "the Achilles injury", and larryflowers37 repeated the reference in his earlier post, but I'm pretty sure Golden tore his ACL in 2017.

I don't know which injury is worse long-term for an edge rusher. In any case, in 2019, Golden's wheels should be as good as they're going to get. So we'll find out what he can or can't do pretty quickly. He's back in a familiar scheme, and fully rehabbed, playing on a prove-it deal.

I wouldn't look at Patti's article, as published, as a full roster analysis. For example, she only mentions two QBs. So the exclusion of Paul Perkins from her write-up may not indicate much. I assume Smith has a slight edge going into OTAs, simply because he fits the RB3 role better than Perkins.
RE: people forget  
GiantEgo : 5/15/2019 10:31 am : link
In comment 14444598 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
this team sucked last year. this was the team that other teams don't get up to play and overlook. and the giants caught some good teams in weeks where they came out flat. this team was BAD last year. like 1-7 bad. yes they improved somewhat, but people on this site are really putting on the rose colored glasses. this is still not a good team.


The capitalization of BAD really drove the point home for me.
Good Analysis  
Angus : 5/15/2019 10:37 am : link
Don't agree with the gushing over the OL though. Definitely hoping for much better play from the OL, but the jury is still out.
RE: This is very interesting ...  
ron mexico : 5/15/2019 10:38 am : link
In comment 14444584 GothamGiants said:
Quote:
ďWhile the expectation is not for Jones to start right away, head coach Pat Shurmur has still made it abundantly clear that Manning needs to win games to keep the rookie on the bench.

Meanwhile, offensive coordinator Mike Shula made it clear that Jonesí development is going to be put on a fast track to where if the situation is right, the world could get its first look at the future franchise quarterback in a regular season game as soon as this year.Ē



I listened to Shula presser and I did not get the impression that he will play this year. He didn't indicate that in any way.
RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 10:44 am : link
In comment 14444594 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 14444584 GothamGiants said:


Quote:


ďWhile the expectation is not for Jones to start right away, head coach Pat Shurmur has still made it abundantly clear that Manning needs to win games to keep the rookie on the bench.

Meanwhile, offensive coordinator Mike Shula made it clear that Jonesí development is going to be put on a fast track to where if the situation is right, the world could get its first look at the future franchise quarterback in a regular season game as soon as this year.Ē

Shurmur putting pressure on Eli to win games ... OC fast tracking Jonesí development ... maybe iím Overthinking this, but this sounds like they will not be afraid to pull the plug on Eli if he isnít lighting it up and helping win games (as in, they could have a 4-3, 5-5 type record and still bench him)

Interesting times ... i expect some of the Jones pressure to mount as soon as preseason if he rips off a couple 2nd half runs while Eli throws an INT beforehand. *i expect Eli starting week 1 ... but DAL/BUF have legit defenses ... interesting times.


Shurmur isn't on the hot seat yet but it's definitely getting warmer. The Giants will likely give him this season and next to prove himself. If Eli is struggling then he will not hesitate to replace him with Jones. Jones getting experience next season will benefit him greatly in 2020.


Agreed ... Iím just glad it seems they acknowledge there may be a point in time where Jonesí athleticism/skill set gives them a better chance to win than Eliís experience. Jones opens up Shurmurís entire bag of tricks and can just physically do things Eli canít as a duel threat.

I love Eli, but the end is near - and Iím glad it at least appears this team has come to terms with that. This season became about Jones and 2020 the second he was selected, whether theyíll admit it or not.

This team can return to legit playoff contention as soon as next year (2020) armed with a ton of cap and a full draft allotment (+3rd for Collins hopefully). Back to SB contention in 2021, just need to keep drafting as they have been.
RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 10:56 am : link
In comment 14444640 GothamGiants said:
Quote:


Agreed ... Iím just glad it seems they acknowledge there may be a point in time where Jonesí athleticism/skill set gives them a better chance to win than Eliís experience. Jones opens up Shurmurís entire bag of tricks and can just physically do things Eli canít as a duel threat.

I love Eli, but the end is near - and Iím glad it at least appears this team has come to terms with that. This season became about Jones and 2020 the second he was selected, whether theyíll admit it or not.

This team can return to legit playoff contention as soon as next year (2020) armed with a ton of cap and a full draft allotment (+3rd for Collins hopefully). Back to SB contention in 2021, just need to keep drafting as they have been.

We could see things playing out eerily similar to 2004 and 2005.

This year will start out with Eli as the starter but will likely finish with Jones getting some valuable experience during the second half. There will be flashes but a lot of struggles as Jones transitions to the pro's. Then in 2020 we will see Jones take a big step forward and the Giants will be competing for a playoff spot. The roster will be much stronger after another draft and FA period with the team flush with cap room.
RE: RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 11:01 am : link
In comment 14444678 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 14444640 GothamGiants said:


Quote:




Agreed ... Iím just glad it seems they acknowledge there may be a point in time where Jonesí athleticism/skill set gives them a better chance to win than Eliís experience. Jones opens up Shurmurís entire bag of tricks and can just physically do things Eli canít as a duel threat.

I love Eli, but the end is near - and Iím glad it at least appears this team has come to terms with that. This season became about Jones and 2020 the second he was selected, whether theyíll admit it or not.

This team can return to legit playoff contention as soon as next year (2020) armed with a ton of cap and a full draft allotment (+3rd for Collins hopefully). Back to SB contention in 2021, just need to keep drafting as they have been.


We could see things playing out eerily similar to 2004 and 2005.

This year will start out with Eli as the starter but will likely finish with Jones getting some valuable experience during the second half. There will be flashes but a lot of struggles as Jones transitions to the pro's. Then in 2020 we will see Jones take a big step forward and the Giants will be competing for a playoff spot. The roster will be much stronger after another draft and FA period with the team flush with cap room.


Yup, I want to get those inevitable Jones struggles out of the way this year. Itís so much more important long term that he gets some experience heading into 2020- when this team can seriously consider getting back to legit contention. I donít want to see a 2020 team flush with cap being held back by a rookie QBís inevitable melt downs ... letís get them out of the way in November/December. This team isnít going to the SB in 2019, 2020/2021 is the target.

(Not that he wonít struggle at times in 2020, but iíd Like to get those Darnold type 4 INT games and/or first pass picked off for a pick 6 out of the way asap ... because they will come.)
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 11:17 am : link
In comment 14444691 GothamGiants said:
Quote:


Yup, I want to get those inevitable Jones struggles out of the way this year. Itís so much more important long term that he gets some experience heading into 2020- when this team can seriously consider getting back to legit contention. I donít want to see a 2020 team flush with cap being held back by a rookie QBís inevitable melt downs ... letís get them out of the way in November/December. This team isnít going to the SB in 2019, 2020/2021 is the target.

(Not that he wonít struggle at times in 2020, but iíd Like to get those Darnold type 4 INT games and/or first pass picked off for a pick 6 out of the way asap ... because they will come.)

I hope we see Jones start at least 9 games this season. The biggest jump in progress from a QB usually occurs from year one to two. Let's see how the line performs the first few weeks because it might take some time for them to form a cohesive unit.
RE: Defense is scary bad on paper  
Toth029 : 5/15/2019 11:20 am : link
In comment 14444437 larryflower37 said:
Quote:
Especially the front 7.
I still don't get the 35 yr old safety.
All rookie cbs.
Best hope at edge is coming off a Achilles injury.
Offense will need to put up 50 points a game.


Front seven is improved off last year due to the addition of Lawrence. Vernon didn't play half the year.

Fair, but he's still miles better than Riley.

Youth is only had if it takes them the whole season to adjust.

I disagree. 'Zo Carter is.
How is this defense ďScary badĒ?  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 11:23 am : link
Baker, Beal, *Jenkins, Love, *Bethea, *Peppers, Haley

Golden Ogletree BJ Carter

Hill Lawrence Tomlinson

The DL is set, the LBs are questionable, and the secondary is loaded with a ton of young talent.


Could someone please link the video of slimmed-down Manning  
FranknWeezer : 5/15/2019 11:26 am : link
from Giants.com? I can't seem to find it. Thanks!
RE: RE: RE: Listened to her podcast this morning.  
Brown Recluse : 5/15/2019 11:33 am : link
In comment 14444572 gidiefor said:
Quote:
In comment 14444564 PatersonPlank said:


Quote:


In comment 14444443 Brown Recluse said:

Quote:

I wish people would stop saying "the offensive line rebuild is complete."



Hey Recluse - I think when she says that she means for this year


Maybe. But I've seen this referenced in other places too and I just think its creating this false hope that our RT problems are solved.

Its just my opinion but I don't think Remmers is that good. I know he was better at RT than G but that was over two years ago and prior to his back issues. Also, if I remember correctly, the Vikings shuffled their RT a few times while he was there and no one was in a rush to put him back there.

I'm really not trying to shit all over this signing because I think it was necessary. I just think there's a perception of him being better than he is. Obviously I hope I'm wrong.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
jestersdead : 5/15/2019 11:35 am : link
In comment 14444716 Jay on the Island said:
Quote:
In comment 14444691 GothamGiants said:


Quote:




Yup, I want to get those inevitable Jones struggles out of the way this year. Itís so much more important long term that he gets some experience heading into 2020- when this team can seriously consider getting back to legit contention. I donít want to see a 2020 team flush with cap being held back by a rookie QBís inevitable melt downs ... letís get them out of the way in November/December. This team isnít going to the SB in 2019, 2020/2021 is the target.

(Not that he wonít struggle at times in 2020, but iíd Like to get those Darnold type 4 INT games and/or first pass picked off for a pick 6 out of the way asap ... because they will come.)


I hope we see Jones start at least 9 games this season. The biggest jump in progress from a QB usually occurs from year one to two. Let's see how the line performs the first few weeks because it might take some time for them to form a cohesive unit.


If Jones starts that many games it will not be a fun first half of football for us fans. Pretty much means Giants start 1-6/0-7
Reporters are not mathematicians or even scientists. Thatís why they  
Ivan15 : 5/15/2019 12:37 pm : link
Are reporters.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 1:17 pm : link
In comment 14444744 jestersdead said:
Quote:
In comment 14444716 Jay on the Island said:


Quote:


In comment 14444691 GothamGiants said:


Quote:




Yup, I want to get those inevitable Jones struggles out of the way this year. Itís so much more important long term that he gets some experience heading into 2020- when this team can seriously consider getting back to legit contention. I donít want to see a 2020 team flush with cap being held back by a rookie QBís inevitable melt downs ... letís get them out of the way in November/December. This team isnít going to the SB in 2019, 2020/2021 is the target.

(Not that he wonít struggle at times in 2020, but iíd Like to get those Darnold type 4 INT games and/or first pass picked off for a pick 6 out of the way asap ... because they will come.)


I hope we see Jones start at least 9 games this season. The biggest jump in progress from a QB usually occurs from year one to two. Let's see how the line performs the first few weeks because it might take some time for them to form a cohesive unit.



If Jones starts that many games it will not be a fun first half of football for us fans. Pretty much means Giants start 1-6/0-7


They could be .500 and bench Eli ... sounds more like Eli needs to play well to keep the job, wonít be tied directly to the record

Eli could start out like a trainwreck v DAL/BUF - they have legit defenses
Eli will have a lot of rope  
ron mexico : 5/15/2019 1:22 pm : link
they wont bench him with a 500 record
RE: Overall a good article...  
ColHowPepper : 5/15/2019 2:51 pm : link
In comment 14444529 Dan in the Springs said:
Quote:
The number of factual and grammatical errors and typos is really a sad fact of life given the cutbacks I'm sure places like Forbes have to make to their editorial staff given their business model. Too bad someone didn't seem to proof-read this before publishing.
She's been a fount of typos and factual errors ever since I started reading her stuff here, goes back way before Forbes.
Shurmur is going to get this year and next and that is  
Zeke's Alibi : 5/15/2019 4:35 pm : link
why there is a much better chance of Jones playing than people think. If the team is .500 and Eli isn't lighting it up, I doubt Shurmur goes into 2020 with a QB that didn't get some significant playing time in 2019.
RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: RE: This is very interesting ...  
Jay on the Island : 5/15/2019 5:36 pm : link
In comment 14444744 jestersdead said:
Quote:


If Jones starts that many games it will not be a fun first half of football for us fans. Pretty much means Giants start 1-6/0-7

Shurmur will not keep playing Eli that long if they're losing and he isn't playing well enough. If the Giants start off 0-3 or 1-4 I think we will see a change unless of course Eli is playing well but the defense is letting him down. Shurmur knows that if the Giants miss the playoffs in 2019 and they aren't at least in contention for a playoffs spot in 2020 he will be gone. He will need to get Jones as much time as possible to ensure that he is here past 2020.

The reason why I liked the Shurmur hire was because of his history with QB's. Case Keenum and Nick Foles played the best football of their careers under Shurmur. Neither of those two are as talented as Jones.
RE: people forget  
giantstock : 5/15/2019 6:05 pm : link
In comment 14444598 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
this team sucked last year. this was the team that other teams don't get up to play and overlook. and the giants caught some good teams in weeks where they came out flat. this team was BAD last year. like 1-7 bad. yes they improved somewhat, but people on this site are really putting on the rose colored glasses. this is still not a good team.


They beat four backup QB's for their wins. I cna remember arguing with one poster about the win for the Bears suggesting GMEN won because Bears didn;t start their no 1 QB. He replied that it didn't matter. Their number 1 QB could have made the awful plays too. SUre but . . .
Thanks Pat  
TMS : 5/15/2019 6:36 pm : link
Good analysis.
Think ELI pays till we are out of  
TMS : 5/15/2019 6:44 pm : link
playoff contention this year. Then how fast Jones fast comes along will determine the story. He may not beat ELI out for a few more years, don't put it out of possibility.
RE: Think ELI pays till we are out of  
GothamGiants : 5/15/2019 8:11 pm : link
In comment 14445399 TMS said:
Quote:
playoff contention this year. Then how fast Jones fast comes along will determine the story. He may not beat ELI out for a few more years, don't put it out of possibility.


If he canít beat out Eli Manning over a few years then he is not the answer
RE: Wasn't Golden's injury an ACL, not an Achilles?  
larryflower37 : 5/15/2019 8:25 pm : link
In comment 14444605 Big Blue Blogger said:
Quote:
Patti refers to "the Achilles injury", and larryflowers37 repeated the reference in his earlier post, but I'm pretty sure Golden tore his ACL in 2017.

I don't know which injury is worse long-term for an edge rusher. In any case, in 2019, Golden's wheels should be as good as they're going to get. So we'll find out what he can or can't do pretty quickly. He's back in a familiar scheme, and fully rehabbed, playing on a prove-it deal.

I wouldn't look at Patti's article, as published, as a full roster analysis. For example, she only mentions two QBs. So the exclusion of Paul Perkins from her write-up may not indicate much. I assume Smith has a slight edge going into OTAs, simply because he fits the RB3 role better than Perkins.


I quoted the article, it was a knee injury
Oct 1, 2017 NFL Knee ACL Tear Grade 3 Golden tore his right ACL in Week 4 and missed the rest of the season.
RE: eli:  
BlueLou'sBack : 5/16/2019 2:49 am : link
In comment 14444419 V.I.G. said:
Quote:
"As for Manning, a recent video of him posted by the teamís website show heís slimmed down"

i didnt see the video but sure hope he gets some pep back in those feet


Patti quotes some comment from Shurmur about Eli being in great shape, but I think that was a comment Shurmur made last year, even last pre-season. In the short video she mentioned, I think Eli looked more buffed up that slimmed down... He's been working out, for sure and maybe slimmer around the waist a bit, but he looked bigger and clearly more muscular in the chest and shoulders, at least that's what I noticed in that cut up video where he's slinging the rock with some serious rpms.
Golden is going to bounce back from that ACL, watch...year 2  
SGMen : 5/16/2019 8:11 am : link
Also, Eli is going to have a very good season. Watch.

But I am still holding out hope D. Jones comes on and shows he can start at some point. I also hope Lauletta has a strong camp and starts the season #2 before D. Jones moves up (and soon...). There is no better problem than having 3 QB's that can run your offense.

My gut tells me that if the Giants are winning with Eli and he is contributing, a positive, he stays QB until his skill set hurts the offense, meaning Jones ability to move opens more avenues for success.
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