they could have franchised him and sought to trade him or paid him 11.5 million to play out the year and traded him in the season etc, etc. Instead, they let him go for nothing and he got richly rewarded by another team. I am just a tad befuddled and disappointed that he sees to create a situation once he left when he has nothing other than to be happy by his good fortune. I dunno, I usually don't get bothered by this stuff, but this bothered me. The giants did him right.
was any good, and Collins was probably right that he was a problem, but Landon did go on radio and on record and call him a cancer to the team. So yeah, he was vocal.
Too vocal, I don't know. His play and effort at least backed it up most of the time. But if we do get a 3rd round comp pick, I think the $ wasn't worth keeping him. And talk about bitter, yeesh.
It's easier for him to come to the conclusion that the Giants Â
who every time he speaks, it makes you scratch your head. Is definitely not leadership material in terms of speaking. Remember when he said he wouldn't want Saban to coach the team, that was the moment I realized he wasn't very bright.
I also think that's more of a reason that he's not playing in a NYG uniform than his inability to play.
The Skins may have overpaid - but I think they did b/c:
A.) teams wanted LC
AND
B.) LC wanted to stay in the NFC East so he could play the Giants twice a year
He was a very physical player and seemed to always play hard.
The problem was his limitations. A safety needs to be able to cover and more importantly have great footwork and take good angles. Too often Collins was out of position and then it was over. He was a good tackler and should have considered a move to ILB.
He is not worth the money Washington paid him. He was not worth investing $11 Million for us.
He was a very physical player and seemed to always play hard.
The problem was his limitations. A safety needs to be able to cover and more importantly have great footwork and take good angles. Too often Collins was out of position and then it was over. He was a good tackler and should have considered a move to ILB.
He is not worth the money Washington paid him. He was not worth investing $11 Million for us.
This is exactly how most realistic Giants fans feel.
Guys who feels since they are gifted athletes and the best player ion their team/unit, that that makes them the leader. In reality, he and Kyrie have no idea how to lead men. This is the first time Collins' act failed and he does not know how to deal with it.
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
happened when the GM was battling and recovering from cancer. (I don't know if it was. Just wonder if it may have factored in him being less available.)
And he seems a bit surface-skimming with his assessment of his former teammates, which I get. It's them in the trenches, so that bond will be tightest. But there was certainly a hell of a lot more to navigate with Beckham than him making teammates smile and just going out and playing football.
I take his comments for what they are. Personal, and not at all an accurate overview.
and if memory serves, at least one of the articles that came out after the OBJ trade had Dorsey admitting that he tried to offer other players to DG, but we held out and insisted on Peppers.
It’s clear finding a versatile strong safety type for Bettcher’s defense was a priority, and they didn’t think Lando was that guy...probably regardless of price tag.
I appreciate how Lando played hard and played through injuries when he could even during losing seasons, but also look forward to seeing Saquon and Engram run by him, as posted above.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
I also think that's more of a reason that he's not playing in a NYG uniform than his inability to play.
The Skins may have overpaid - but I think they did b/c:
A.) teams wanted LC
AND
B.) LC wanted to stay in the NFC East so he could play the Giants twice a year
Wouldn't him wanting to stay in the NFC East cause the skins to have to pay less than other teams?
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Who is Josina Anderson and why is she in the locker room? Why would those two leaving mean she won't be now?
It's not that the Giants thought he was a bad football player or a bad guy in the locker room (although he might not be great), it's just that he's not worth the contract he received.
Had he been cheap to keep they probably would have.
Add in the fact that they'll get a third rounder or something for him and it made it an easy decision.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
RE: RE: RE: The hurt was and is about the money. Â
Seriously? The fact that the Giants didn’t even care enough about him to at least tag him while they negotiated a contract is very telling to me.
Well he told them he didn't want to be tagged, they didn't tag him, then he acts insulted that he didn't get tagged. Maybe he was menstruating that week.
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Who is Josina Anderson and why is she in the locker room? Why would those two leaving mean she won't be now?
She’s the ESPN reporter who regularly quoted “anonymous” sources in the Giants locker room, usually revealing internal gripes.
Don’t know if any of us know for sure, but it’s seemed likely her sources were OBJ and/or Collins.
Someone noted last week that she recently quoted an “anonymous” source in the Browns locker room. Wonder who that was...
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Who is Josina Anderson and why is she in the locker room? Why would those two leaving mean she won't be now?
She’s the ESPN reporter who regularly quoted “anonymous” sources in the Giants locker room, usually revealing internal gripes.
Don’t know if any of us know for sure, but it’s seemed likely her sources were OBJ and/or Collins.
Someone noted last week that she recently quoted an “anonymous” source in the Browns locker room. Wonder who that was...
Ah, thanks. I haven't watched or paid attention to ESPN in over a decade, so I didn't recognize the name. Odd because I do hear from other ESPN reporters even still. She must be particularly useless then.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
he is offering here... what BBI is saying... but BBI has made it dramatic. hes just defining what the Giants are referring to on the culture side which is well liked players who are quite vocal on a losing team. they wanted quiet yes men who were cool with their pathetic leadership and management from above
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
he is offering here... what BBI is saying... but BBI has made it dramatic. hes just defining what the Giants are referring to on the culture side which is well liked players who are quite vocal on a losing team. they wanted quiet yes men who were cool with their pathetic leadership and management from above
It's not that they want quiet yes men. They want people who don't bitch to the media when things went south. It's not that these guys were upset, it's that they whined to reporters about it and in some cases openly talked about other players - as in when LC complained about Apple being a cancer.
Oh please... you know what the cancer was? Bad coaching and bad players brought on by bad drafting. Collins wasn’t the problem here but he wanted big bucks and he wasn’t drafted by DG and part of the future plan. That’s it. Why does everyone need to label these guys?
because Giant personnel management did not see him in the defensive scheme they envision. His skill set is that of a old style MLB like Harry Carson. He cannot cover but is tremendous pursuing the ball making tackles and moving forward. An old time 3/4 guy. Great team guy wish it was otherwise. Wish him well but STFU already. You are well paid.
while he was here. He was good but never reached his potential and certainly wasn't worth what the Redskins paid him. Sorry to see him go, but it would have been unwise for the Giants to use so much of the salary cap on him based on his past performance.
addressed this in Carolina when Steve Smith was let go.
He said that he's not the GM to be personal messengers delivering news. When he deals with agents supposedly looking out for the best interests of their players and delivers a message - he expects it to be passed along. He made the comment "What GM plays the role of "The Turk". None"
Steve Smith and DeAngelo Williams both are mentioned in an article when Gettleman was hired in Carolina as appreciating his no nonsense demeanor. Then when they were both released, Williams called him a snake and Smith bitched that he found pout he was released over the radio (which actually wasn't true. He and his agent were told and appealed to Richardson for him to stay).
addressed this in Carolina when Steve Smith was let go.
He said that he's not the GM to be personal messengers delivering news. When he deals with agents supposedly looking out for the best interests of their players and delivers a message - he expects it to be passed along. He made the comment "What GM plays the role of "The Turk". None"
Steve Smith and DeAngelo Williams both are mentioned in an article when Gettleman was hired in Carolina as appreciating his no nonsense demeanor. Then when they were both released, Williams called him a snake and Smith bitched that he found pout he was released over the radio (which actually wasn't true. He and his agent were told and appealed to Richardson for him to stay).
It’s not at the time of release that is worrisome. It’s while the players are here.
Quote:
"I wish he'd say something. Try to," Collins said. "I mean, he had come around, shake your hand, say 'Good job, big fella,' or something like that. But honestly, talking to him, or saying anything, having a full conversation or anything with him, nothing.
"I mean, he basically ... I don't know him, he don't know me, that's kind of how it just kind of was."
Gettleman goes up and says "Stop the TE from beating you like a drum", how's that going to go over??
Like I said, Smith and Williams didn't mind his no nonsense approach while they were Panthers. Had a lot of problems with it when they were ex-Panthers.
you think Jerry Reese was in the locker room high-fiving guys?
was so odd. Rarely do you see players even mention the GM, i guess only if they retire to say thank you, or when they are drafted, etc. Seemed like a classic case of those Panthers guys being very bitter. What other GM has this amazing relationship with players??
"culture change" thing with Collins. Beckham, sure, I get that. Everyone would.
But Collins wasn't brought back because of the $ and his limitations. How does that have anything to do with culture?
He was also a pretty quiet dude, didn't cause a lot of controversies or anything.
.
Collins was a pretty quiet dude? Calling a teammate
a 'cancer' is hardly a 'quiet dude'. It doesn't matter
if some agree with that comment, you don't do that
in the locker room!
That thought after the 2016 season, LC was going to be the next in the long line of great Giant defensive players. Like many have said, his play the last 2 seasons simply did not come close to touching that performance.
For all the talk about how LC was a great teammate and great leader, I felt that he handled many situations incorrectly. He was outspoken, but not in the same way that a Strahan or Pierce was. Every time an internal situation arose, it didn't seem that LC galvanized the team or handled the situation in the right way.
I think LC thought of himself as a leader and tried his best to be, but didn't exactly have "it" when it came down to being a true leader. He never was actually able to say or do the right thing at the right time.
Love all that he did during his tenure here and he sure as heck always played hard. I am not sad that Getty did not pay him that money he was looking for. Just like the Odell situation, I think this might end up being an addition by subtraction deal. Both players seem bitter about it as well.
was so odd. Rarely do you see players even mention the GM, i guess only if they retire to say thank you, or when they are drafted, etc. Seemed like a classic case of those Panthers guys being very bitter. What other GM has this amazing relationship with players??
A lot of the players loved Reese. Did that make him a good GM?
He was a good GM when he was drafting good players and make smart FA decisions. Then he wasn’t.
Some people here have a lot of trouble with grey areas Â
Many here want to act under the belief that somehow we assembled this horrendous collection of people with attitude problems and Reese and Ross were ENTIRELY to blame for this.
Here's the reality. Either many people still in the Giants building have trouble assessing who might have attitude problems or some of the attitude problems are created IN THE BUILDING by people who are still there. There isn't such a thing as two people in upper management but not at the top being the extent of a problem they are made out to be here.
There is also this definite problem that Gettleman doesn't seem to know how to communicate well, with the media, with his stars, with his prior owner. It doesn't seem to matter how many people complain about this, people on this site seem to be content to blame non-Gettleman people for each and every one of the people he clashes with. I can't believe there are this many people that don't seem to understand every conflict involves mistakes on both sides. And the more conflicts that one person seems to be involved in with multiple parties the higher the chance that that person might be perhaps a big part of all those conflicts.
Somehow Collins was valuable enough to not trade for a 3rd round pick but not valuable enough to treat with the respect that he feels he deserved to such an extent that he is saying this.
Collins isn't "proving he is an asshole" anymore than Gettleman is proving he is an asshole.
Yep. Gettleman is to blame for the attitudes of a lot of players who weren't here when he was around.
Isn't that what you're insinuating?
Maybe there's a way to assign analytics to the way a GM interacts with people??
I just want you to know i'm actually done responding to you completely. Maybe just save yourself time and stop responding to me. You are a terrible person who I have no time for so bye.
RE: Some people here have a lot of trouble with grey areas Â
Many here want to act under the belief that somehow we assembled this horrendous collection of people with attitude problems and Reese and Ross were ENTIRELY to blame for this.
Here's the reality. Either many people still in the Giants building have trouble assessing who might have attitude problems or some of the attitude problems are created IN THE BUILDING by people who are still there. There isn't such a thing as two people in upper management but not at the top being the extent of a problem they are made out to be here.
There is also this definite problem that Gettleman doesn't seem to know how to communicate well, with the media, with his stars, with his prior owner. It doesn't seem to matter how many people complain about this, people on this site seem to be content to blame non-Gettleman people for each and every one of the people he clashes with. I can't believe there are this many people that don't seem to understand every conflict involves mistakes on both sides. And the more conflicts that one person seems to be involved in with multiple parties the higher the chance that that person might be perhaps a big part of all those conflicts.
Somehow Collins was valuable enough to not trade for a 3rd round pick but not valuable enough to treat with the respect that he feels he deserved to such an extent that he is saying this.
Collins isn't "proving he is an asshole" anymore than Gettleman is proving he is an asshole.
They're going to get a 3rd rounder anyway. The complaining that we didn't deal him during the year is moot, cost us nothing in the long-run, and Gettleman has explained his logic there several times already.
first time I've made that point in relation to this. Because there is new information about how Collins has specifically cited that DG is a bad communicator right here.
I mean it's like the first rule of a relationship with anyone. If you value them you show that in how you communicate.
If you look at his contract details it's for two years and 26 million. Highly unlikely he sees a penny more than that from Washington. Don't get me wrong good money for an NFL safety but nowhere near the bold headline 84 million it was made out to be as per usual of all NFL contracts.
"I know with myself, [Harrison], Odell, [Vernon], all we wanted to do was win, and we spoke up because we had to get them to listen to us," Collins said. "We had to get them to get us winning pieces to help us at least be contenders.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
In the little over a year Gettleman was his GM doesn’t mean he was a fan.
He said similar things as Collins
Quote:
“[Gettleman] doesn’t even have the cojones to tell us to our face [about the release],” Smith said. “We have to hear it from someone else. Then he calls and says it wasn’t personal. If the first thing that comes out is ‘well it wasn’t personal,’ then guess what? It was personal.”
"I know with myself, [Harrison], Odell, [Vernon], all we wanted to do was win, and we spoke up because we had to get them to listen to us," Collins said. "We had to get them to get us winning pieces to help us at least be contenders.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
if I can find the article when Smith said how it was nice to have Gettleman's non-nonsense approach.
The problem was, Smith saw himself retiring as a Panther and he's actually bitter to this day that Richardson stood up for Davis and Olsen but not him
Smith was released - but he was told it was coming. Gettleman met with them and told them that he was going to be released. They then went to Richardson to stop it from happening and he didn't.
Problem was - Smith was a regular on radio, so he could tell one side and have it be looked at as the truth.
It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
CC Brown was not a talented player, and not expected to be a cornerstone of the franchise. He didn't have the time and resources invested in him to do much damage to the organization...when it became clear that he couldn't play he was replaced. I can live with guys like that...playing in the NFL is hard.
But Collins, Beckham, Harrison, Vernon...these guys all have talent to play in the NFL and then some. Because of that, the Giants invested time and money in them to be the backbone of the team. They responded to that investment by being complete losers. Those guys did more damage to the Giants than CC Brown ever could.
It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
This is completely inaccurate.
Peppers is a far more versatile player than Collins is.
Collins is a one trick pony, a loudmouth and more expensive.
It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
You are right it isn't the GMs job but it should also be a concern when there are so many examples of him rubbing players in the wrong way in spite of this
I’m in the camp that Collins wasn’t worth his contract, but thinking Peppers is going to be better than Collins, especially in coverage I think you’re in for a rude awakening.
They are very similar players when it comes to weaknesses.
It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
You are right it isn't the GMs job but it should also be a concern when there are so many examples of him rubbing players in the wrong way in spite of this
Why? All the players he rubbed the wrong way are ostensibly gone. He's brought in players who he can meld with. Beyond, that, they're getting paid to play.
Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
??? How do they have similar flaws?
They don't. They're completely different players.
Peppers is better in coverage - can be deployed as a slot corner. Plays faster. Is more versatile. Can contribute on ST's and actually make plays with the football in his hands.
Collins is an in the box SS who needs to play near the LOS and be sheltered from being isolated in coverage because he's a major liability.
And again, Collins is costlier.
I'll gladly take Peppers. Bettcher is going to be able to do far more with him than he was with Collins.
I'm not a PFF fan, but this does align with what I've seen from Peppers - who actually improved quite a bit between rookie and soph campaigns.
Quote:
According to PFF, Peppers graded out as the leagues 19th ranked safety (77.6 grade), while Collins ranked 39th overall with a 70.4 grade. Peppers’ grades in coverage were far better than Collins’, finishing 2018 with a 77.3 coverage grade. That’s an increase of 15.6 from his rookie year – seeing a spike in efficiency should provide a reason for excitement as Peppers enters his third season as a professional.
I’m in the camp that Collins wasn’t worth his contract, but thinking Peppers is going to be better than Collins, especially in coverage I think you’re in for a rude awakening.
They are very similar players when it comes to weaknesses.
problems with players? How many other GMs seems to stir up so many controversies in the media? How many other GMs that are the star personnel guy he of all people reminds others he is get fired from a job so quickly? Well that was for personality reasons as much as anything with the owner.
The Jones thing was just another example of him creating a bigger shitstorm because of the way he chose to communicate.
Again, this is something that even 20 years ago people said hey, if you get your job done personality doesn't matter. This doesn't exist anymore. Amicable relationships with the people that work for you as well as open mindedness and talent are all viewed as key components of leadership in today's world.
Peppers is better in coverage - can be deployed as a slot corner.
Peppers was used as a slot corner several times in the past.
You never want Collins in that position.
Collins is the harder hitter, Peppers is more well-rounded, and given Collins injury to the shoulder he uses to hit with - that's a significant detriment
Just more made-up narratives. The list of GM's who have been trashed by former players is long. That isn't unique to Gettleman. You should be more concerned if the players he's letting go actually go on to star while he seemingly gets rid of them for spite.
But you don't want to delve into that area because you'll see his record on that (and his actual record too!) in Carolina is damn good in that regard.
RE: How many other GMs in the league seem to create so many Â
problems with players? How many other GMs seems to stir up so many controversies in the media? How many other GMs that are the star personnel guy he of all people reminds others he is get fired from a job so quickly? Well that was for personality reasons as much as anything with the owner.
The Jones thing was just another example of him creating a bigger shitstorm because of the way he chose to communicate.
Again, this is something that even 20 years ago people said hey, if you get your job done personality doesn't matter. This doesn't exist anymore. Amicable relationships with the people that work for you as well as open mindedness and talent are all viewed as key components of leadership in today's world.
I honestly don't thin kit matters...even in today's world...unless it's to the people directly in his employ. Even then, I would think that most players have a degree of separation to the GM where his personality (or the public perception of his personality) doesn't really impact their day to day.
And, I think most of his personality issues is media myth and now with the addition of disgruntled ex-employees.
How about you hold on to the pick against the Pats Â
The contracts are insane. College players are expected to produce right away. Most college players have no idea how to play in a pro offense so more and more coaches are implementing college offense concepts to reduce the learning curve. Hundreds of media outlets, social media, personal branding.
I will give Gettlemen credit. He does not give a shit what anybody thinks about his decisions. He has a job to do, he has a vision and it may not be a popular vision.
I don't know how it will play out but this team already looks completely different from December of 2017. Almost unrecognizable.
RE: How about you hold on to the pick against the Pats Â
yeah what an ass hole--- if only he worked on his craft after that first year and had a top 5 Defensive MVP type year and led the team defensively to the playoffs in 2016... --
"It was definitely hard because I don't do that," Collins said. "I killed myself when I went home, I just couldn't take it, but I'm just ready to get back on the field and just keep it going and prove myself."
"I got over it," he added, "but I mean just to feel that I let the team down is always in the back of your mind."
Collins should be thanking us for letting him go. Â
The Giants got a lot of heat for letting him go when we could have franchised him. Instead, we respected his wishes and did not tag him which allowed him to become the leagues highest paid safety (which is ABSURD!).
You are welcome Landon!
RE: Collins should be thanking us for letting him go. Â
The Giants got a lot of heat for letting him go when we could have franchised him. Instead, we respected his wishes and did not tag him which allowed him to become the leagues highest paid safety (which is ABSURD!).
of if the GM was there to talk up Landon after games or not, he needs to understand he's in a situation that many find themselves in today.
Players on losing teams are expendable. Add in the bump for 2nd contracts, and you really need to be in a great position to negotiate with your current team to be retained.
That doesn't have to do with the GM's demeanor. It has to do with the realities and salary constraints of the NFL. Kevin Abrahms could have lunch with Collins every day and still know that from a cap standpoint his production doesn't match his cost.
Collins had a great year in 2016...but i think you are overreacting a bit. Losing Collins isn't some massive blow the defense can't recover from.
Also, it was smart business for Gettleman not to pay him that amount. He's not a great all around safety.
never said it was a big loss. all ive done is defend the guy for being a good player and contributor, in particular to the one season that was actually enjoyable in recent memory. Also the guy is not a cancer- plays his ass off- and has a passion for the game and winning. lot of homers here who have no clue about the reality of the giants locker room professing bull shit
Collins opens his mouth it's about why Giants let him walk. He has a hard time accepting that he wasn't worth what he wanted. And he forgets he said he'd holdout if tagged. Too vocal means you talk too DAMN much, stfu.
Collins was on the Michael Kay show,and it was a little different.People described it as classy,and Collins as a "stand up guy".
Now you get this,and it seems like there's a few agendas.Collins has changed a few of his answers to fit ESPN,and perhaps make his new boss happy.And some of the fans have switched from Good Landon to Bad Landon.
"I know with myself, [Harrison], Odell, [Vernon], all we wanted to do was win, and we spoke up because we had to get them to listen to us," Collins said. "We had to get them to get us winning pieces to help us at least be contenders.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
Could not agree more. I’m most excited about this year to actually root for guys I want to actually root for.
Listening to these guys talk after being let go just shows how pathetic this team used to be. Glad Gettleman cleared house of all these “winning pieces”
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture. If anyone of us acted the way these players tend to we'd get fired
well known players that STILL haven't gotten over being released from the team (OBJ and Collins). I think that sends a strong message to the rest of the team. You are not the coach. You are supposed to play the game the way the coach draws it up.
Collins was not worth what he received. I like Peppers better as an overall player and that doesn't even include taking their contracts into account.
Gettleman shipped out the prima donnas. It's just that simple.
Didn't this guy have 3 women pregnant at the same time as a rookie? Â
Not that its at all relevant to this conversation or his time as a Giant but, ya know, hes a Skin now, so...might as well point out highly questional life decisions.
Landon Collins can't stop being asked about the Giants Â
they could have franchised him and sought to trade him or paid him 11.5 million to play out the year and traded him in the season etc, etc. Instead, they let him go for nothing and he got richly rewarded by another team. I am just a tad befuddled and disappointed that he sees to create a situation once he left when he has nothing other than to be happy by his good fortune. I dunno, I usually don't get bothered by this stuff, but this bothered me. The giants did him right.
Nail on the head. I feel for Collins & I'm always torn when this happens because I believe in re-signing good homegrown talent to 2nd contracts. It's good business and creates a team the fans can invest in. And to that end, Collins truly cared about being a Giant. He was invested in becoming the leader of the team & franchise player.
There's some delusion involved with LC - he's great with great players around him like Alabama and the 2016 Giants D. On bad teams he doesn't look like an elite S. That's 3 of 4 years on the Giants. I'll bet it goes beyond $$$ with Collins, his self-worth was rattled and he took business personal. So even becoming a rich man and reaching the pinnacle of his professional career from a compensation standpoint - the day he was working for his whole life - he's filled with bitterness.
Ever hear from players like this is the part they played. It's always someone done me wrong. Well as I posted before Collins himself said that he would hold out if they try to tag him.
Gettleman said in several instances that his job as GM is to ELIMINATE distractions. The kind of distractions that the holdout of a popular player would cause. He had to know this would happen. Maybe got bad advice who knows. With all the shit slinging hes done I'm not feeling sorry he's gone.
Did he forget he called a teammate who Mom was facing brain surgery a "cancer". Yeah Eli Apple's Mom was very sick 2017 so may be that was why he wasn't playing well? Anyway you got your $$$s now shutup.
really makes it clear that when DG said you don't quit on talent, he wasn't totally honest. There are other aspects that make players expendable. Like airing all the dirty laundry in the media like Collins does. You kind of have to just laugh at what Collins will say in the media. Laugh and not re-sign him. I'll take the third round comp pick.
and he did the right thing while he was here. He wishes that we are the team that paid him. He is just upset about that.
The guy was a positive influence and a vocal leader on the team that had very few of those.
Meanwhile, the funny thing is that the day we traded OBJ, most people here were really down on Peppers. Now... it seems like the consensus has changed. Not about trading away OBJ.. but the idea of having Peppers play safety for us
who every time he speaks, it makes you scratch your head. Is definitely not leadership material in terms of speaking. Remember when he said he wouldn't want Saban to coach the team, that was the moment I realized he wasn't very bright.
I remember he was part of the super bowl coverage one year and he was the worst announcer I have ever seen. He didn't have one meaningful thing to say.
AMEN I am not even going to read WTF he had to say and
good riddance to Him OBJ Snacks Apple and Vernon ...
You can't build a winning team with a rotten Apple .
Imagine some of the things that went on that we know nothing about . I always stuck up for LC but he got a
shit pile of Money and he still just wants to run his mouth
I hope that we talk about them less and talk about the
current Giants .
the man is now the highest paid safety in the league and yet he can't let it go that the Giants did not see the same value. I get being initially stung, but at the end of the day, all these guys talk about it being a business. Sounds to me like someone who thought the grass was greener, but now that he has to mow it, not so much....
One interesting bit from the video that didnt make it into the article Â
and get nasty when they are let go. Guess that is a good thing for the organization. They should realize that when they are here, not after they leave. Loved Collins by the way. Sorry he did not work out.
RE: Seems EX some X- Giant players love this team Â
and get nasty when they are let go. Guess that is a good thing for the organization. They should realize that when they are here, not after they leave. Loved Collins by the way. Sorry he did not work out.
I never got the impression Collins ever felt any way other than he loved being a Giant.
It sounds like he had a problem with the team they assembled to compete, much like all of us felt.
RE: RE: Seems EX some X- Giant players love this team Â
Too vocal, I don't know. His play and effort at least backed it up most of the time. But if we do get a 3rd round comp pick, I think the $ wasn't worth keeping him. And talk about bitter, yeesh.
+1
I also think that's more of a reason that he's not playing in a NYG uniform than his inability to play.
The Skins may have overpaid - but I think they did b/c:
A.) teams wanted LC
AND
B.) LC wanted to stay in the NFC East so he could play the Giants twice a year
The problem was his limitations. A safety needs to be able to cover and more importantly have great footwork and take good angles. Too often Collins was out of position and then it was over. He was a good tackler and should have considered a move to ILB.
He is not worth the money Washington paid him. He was not worth investing $11 Million for us.
Buh bye.
The problem was his limitations. A safety needs to be able to cover and more importantly have great footwork and take good angles. Too often Collins was out of position and then it was over. He was a good tackler and should have considered a move to ILB.
He is not worth the money Washington paid him. He was not worth investing $11 Million for us.
This is exactly how most realistic Giants fans feel.
Maybe I missed it - but it didn't sound like the Giants were a player in any kind of contract talks with LC
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
And he seems a bit surface-skimming with his assessment of his former teammates, which I get. It's them in the trenches, so that bond will be tightest. But there was certainly a hell of a lot more to navigate with Beckham than him making teammates smile and just going out and playing football.
I take his comments for what they are. Personal, and not at all an accurate overview.
This makes no sense.
It will be interesting to see if Wash would match him up against Engram and/or SB since, everyone seems to know that's the weakest part of his game.
Just shut up.
Quote:
How dare they not at least try to tag me?
This makes no sense.
Seriously? The fact that the Giants didn’t even care enough about him to at least tag him while they negotiated a contract is very telling to me.
It’s clear finding a versatile strong safety type for Bettcher’s defense was a priority, and they didn’t think Lando was that guy...probably regardless of price tag.
I appreciate how Lando played hard and played through injuries when he could even during losing seasons, but also look forward to seeing Saquon and Engram run by him, as posted above.
Like you when we took Saquon over a QB?
That was more about Sherman, than the Giants per se
I think his communication skills were poor so I questioned how much leadership he provided.
You got your contract. Be happy.
I think his communication skills were poor so I questioned how much leadership he provided.
Like Urlacher when he was drafted?
You got your contract. Be happy.
Same with OB, there's a pattern here with the players they moved on from.
Pugh
Collins
Beckham
These were the locker room "leaders".
Culture change indeed.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Quote:
Exhausting and tiresome.
You got your contract. Be happy.
Same with OB, there's a pattern here with the players they moved on from.
Yes- they are actually good football players? and the year that the giants won, were 3 of the 5 best players on the team.
I also think that's more of a reason that he's not playing in a NYG uniform than his inability to play.
The Skins may have overpaid - but I think they did b/c:
A.) teams wanted LC
AND
B.) LC wanted to stay in the NFC East so he could play the Giants twice a year
Quote:
In comment 14450958 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Exhausting and tiresome.
You got your contract. Be happy.
Same with OB, there's a pattern here with the players they moved on from.
Yes- they are actually good football players? and the year that the giants won, were 3 of the 5 best players on the team.
They were also there and chirping non-stop when the team lost in historically bad fashion.
I've seen your posts on this, hitdog, bottom line is DG felt the talking and maintenance was having a negative effect on the team as a whole.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Had he been cheap to keep they probably would have.
Add in the fact that they'll get a third rounder or something for him and it made it an easy decision.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
Quote:
In comment 14450869 Big Blue '56 said:
Quote:
How dare they not at least try to tag me?
This makes no sense.
Seriously? The fact that the Giants didn’t even care enough about him to at least tag him while they negotiated a contract is very telling to me.
Quote:
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Who is Josina Anderson and why is she in the locker room? Why would those two leaving mean she won't be now?
She’s the ESPN reporter who regularly quoted “anonymous” sources in the Giants locker room, usually revealing internal gripes.
Don’t know if any of us know for sure, but it’s seemed likely her sources were OBJ and/or Collins.
Someone noted last week that she recently quoted an “anonymous” source in the Browns locker room. Wonder who that was...
Quote:
In comment 14450908 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
I thought Collins was going to end up being one of the best safeties the Giants have ever had. He was that much of a breakout star. But the past 2 years he didn't come close to that level of play. Now, the team decomposed around him, but he didn't help his cause. He was exposed in coverage, and to be fair, he probably was asked to do more because of the bad play around him and didn't help him.
But the bigger concern has to be that he has missed time the past 2 years due to injuries. And having a bad shoulder as a safety who makes his money as a guy who plays better in the box and as a run enforcer is not a great idea. Last year the safety market was very depressed. This year that changed and the costs jumped significantly. Peppers, all things considered, with cost and less wear and tear, not to mention versatility was a better fit for the Giants organization.
I personally don't buy for one moment that Peppers suddenly showed up on the radar with the Giants discussions with Odell. There is so much going on behind the scenes that we will never know. But I do know that Gettleman doesn't make up his plan on the fly. Whether or not we agree with it, or it works, he doesn't wing it. He saw the negotiations with Collins, he saw the trade for Odell (and the dead cap hit coming) and Peppers helped fill a lot of needs and Collins had to go.
Now, there was likely the added bonus of less Josina Anderson in the Giants locker room. But that wasn't the main driver, however it was a happy biproduct of wishing Odell and Collins bon voyage.
Collins can have his pride hurt all he wants. I do know that putting him in coverage against Saquon or Engram are both horrible mismatches for Washington.
Who is Josina Anderson and why is she in the locker room? Why would those two leaving mean she won't be now?
She’s the ESPN reporter who regularly quoted “anonymous” sources in the Giants locker room, usually revealing internal gripes.
Don’t know if any of us know for sure, but it’s seemed likely her sources were OBJ and/or Collins.
Someone noted last week that she recently quoted an “anonymous” source in the Browns locker room. Wonder who that was...
Quote:
with what he said... at all.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
he is offering here... what BBI is saying... but BBI has made it dramatic. hes just defining what the Giants are referring to on the culture side which is well liked players who are quite vocal on a losing team. they wanted quiet yes men who were cool with their pathetic leadership and management from above
But Collins wasn't brought back because of the $ and his limitations. How does that have anything to do with culture?
He was also a pretty quiet dude, didn't cause a lot of controversies or anything.
Quote:
In comment 14450971 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
with what he said... at all.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture.
Follow the pattern. This is NOT in a vacuum, statement-wise. This has zero to do with culture. It would be if this was his ONLY tweet. They’re non-stop tweets of whining/complaining, with this being the latest he has to offer..
he is offering here... what BBI is saying... but BBI has made it dramatic. hes just defining what the Giants are referring to on the culture side which is well liked players who are quite vocal on a losing team. they wanted quiet yes men who were cool with their pathetic leadership and management from above
It's not that they want quiet yes men. They want people who don't bitch to the media when things went south. It's not that these guys were upset, it's that they whined to reporters about it and in some cases openly talked about other players - as in when LC complained about Apple being a cancer.
Oh please... you know what the cancer was? Bad coaching and bad players brought on by bad drafting. Collins wasn’t the problem here but he wanted big bucks and he wasn’t drafted by DG and part of the future plan. That’s it. Why does everyone need to label these guys?
Buh bye.
Agreed.
He said that he's not the GM to be personal messengers delivering news. When he deals with agents supposedly looking out for the best interests of their players and delivers a message - he expects it to be passed along. He made the comment "What GM plays the role of "The Turk". None"
Steve Smith and DeAngelo Williams both are mentioned in an article when Gettleman was hired in Carolina as appreciating his no nonsense demeanor. Then when they were both released, Williams called him a snake and Smith bitched that he found pout he was released over the radio (which actually wasn't true. He and his agent were told and appealed to Richardson for him to stay).
He said that he's not the GM to be personal messengers delivering news. When he deals with agents supposedly looking out for the best interests of their players and delivers a message - he expects it to be passed along. He made the comment "What GM plays the role of "The Turk". None"
Steve Smith and DeAngelo Williams both are mentioned in an article when Gettleman was hired in Carolina as appreciating his no nonsense demeanor. Then when they were both released, Williams called him a snake and Smith bitched that he found pout he was released over the radio (which actually wasn't true. He and his agent were told and appealed to Richardson for him to stay).
It’s not at the time of release that is worrisome. It’s while the players are here.
"I mean, he basically ... I don't know him, he don't know me, that's kind of how it just kind of was."
Like I said, Smith and Williams didn't mind his no nonsense approach while they were Panthers. Had a lot of problems with it when they were ex-Panthers.
you think Jerry Reese was in the locker room high-fiving guys?
But Collins wasn't brought back because of the $ and his limitations. How does that have anything to do with culture?
He was also a pretty quiet dude, didn't cause a lot of controversies or anything.
Collins was a pretty quiet dude? Calling a teammate
a 'cancer' is hardly a 'quiet dude'. It doesn't matter
if some agree with that comment, you don't do that
in the locker room!
For all the talk about how LC was a great teammate and great leader, I felt that he handled many situations incorrectly. He was outspoken, but not in the same way that a Strahan or Pierce was. Every time an internal situation arose, it didn't seem that LC galvanized the team or handled the situation in the right way.
I think LC thought of himself as a leader and tried his best to be, but didn't exactly have "it" when it came down to being a true leader. He never was actually able to say or do the right thing at the right time.
Love all that he did during his tenure here and he sure as heck always played hard. I am not sad that Getty did not pay him that money he was looking for. Just like the Odell situation, I think this might end up being an addition by subtraction deal. Both players seem bitter about it as well.
A lot of the players loved Reese. Did that make him a good GM?
He was a good GM when he was drafting good players and make smart FA decisions. Then he wasn’t.
Many here want to act under the belief that somehow we assembled this horrendous collection of people with attitude problems and Reese and Ross were ENTIRELY to blame for this.
Here's the reality. Either many people still in the Giants building have trouble assessing who might have attitude problems or some of the attitude problems are created IN THE BUILDING by people who are still there. There isn't such a thing as two people in upper management but not at the top being the extent of a problem they are made out to be here.
There is also this definite problem that Gettleman doesn't seem to know how to communicate well, with the media, with his stars, with his prior owner. It doesn't seem to matter how many people complain about this, people on this site seem to be content to blame non-Gettleman people for each and every one of the people he clashes with. I can't believe there are this many people that don't seem to understand every conflict involves mistakes on both sides. And the more conflicts that one person seems to be involved in with multiple parties the higher the chance that that person might be perhaps a big part of all those conflicts.
Somehow Collins was valuable enough to not trade for a 3rd round pick but not valuable enough to treat with the respect that he feels he deserved to such an extent that he is saying this.
Collins isn't "proving he is an asshole" anymore than Gettleman is proving he is an asshole.
Isn't that what you're insinuating?
Maybe there's a way to assign analytics to the way a GM interacts with people??
Isn't that what you're insinuating?
Maybe there's a way to assign analytics to the way a GM interacts with people??
I just want you to know i'm actually done responding to you completely. Maybe just save yourself time and stop responding to me. You are a terrible person who I have no time for so bye.
Many here want to act under the belief that somehow we assembled this horrendous collection of people with attitude problems and Reese and Ross were ENTIRELY to blame for this.
Here's the reality. Either many people still in the Giants building have trouble assessing who might have attitude problems or some of the attitude problems are created IN THE BUILDING by people who are still there. There isn't such a thing as two people in upper management but not at the top being the extent of a problem they are made out to be here.
There is also this definite problem that Gettleman doesn't seem to know how to communicate well, with the media, with his stars, with his prior owner. It doesn't seem to matter how many people complain about this, people on this site seem to be content to blame non-Gettleman people for each and every one of the people he clashes with. I can't believe there are this many people that don't seem to understand every conflict involves mistakes on both sides. And the more conflicts that one person seems to be involved in with multiple parties the higher the chance that that person might be perhaps a big part of all those conflicts.
Somehow Collins was valuable enough to not trade for a 3rd round pick but not valuable enough to treat with the respect that he feels he deserved to such an extent that he is saying this.
Collins isn't "proving he is an asshole" anymore than Gettleman is proving he is an asshole.
They're going to get a 3rd rounder anyway. The complaining that we didn't deal him during the year is moot, cost us nothing in the long-run, and Gettleman has explained his logic there several times already.
It's a dead horse. Stop beating it.
I mean it's like the first rule of a relationship with anyone. If you value them you show that in how you communicate.
Especially some guy who claims I'm a terrible person. Might be fun.
You faux self-righteous moron.
If you look at his contract details it's for two years and 26 million. Highly unlikely he sees a penny more than that from Washington. Don't get me wrong good money for an NFL safety but nowhere near the bold headline 84 million it was made out to be as per usual of all NFL contracts.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
He said similar things as Collins
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"I know with myself, [Harrison], Odell, [Vernon], all we wanted to do was win, and we spoke up because we had to get them to listen to us," Collins said. "We had to get them to get us winning pieces to help us at least be contenders.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
Cc Brown doesn’t make the cut?
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
The problem was, Smith saw himself retiring as a Panther and he's actually bitter to this day that Richardson stood up for Davis and Olsen but not him
Smith was released - but he was told it was coming. Gettleman met with them and told them that he was going to be released. They then went to Richardson to stop it from happening and he didn't.
Problem was - Smith was a regular on radio, so he could tell one side and have it be looked at as the truth.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
CC Brown was not a talented player, and not expected to be a cornerstone of the franchise. He didn't have the time and resources invested in him to do much damage to the organization...when it became clear that he couldn't play he was replaced. I can live with guys like that...playing in the NFL is hard.
But Collins, Beckham, Harrison, Vernon...these guys all have talent to play in the NFL and then some. Because of that, the Giants invested time and money in them to be the backbone of the team. They responded to that investment by being complete losers. Those guys did more damage to the Giants than CC Brown ever could.
Fuck each of them.
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It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
This is completely inaccurate.
Peppers is a far more versatile player than Collins is.
Collins is a one trick pony, a loudmouth and more expensive.
I'll take Peppers every day.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
You are right it isn't the GMs job but it should also be a concern when there are so many examples of him rubbing players in the wrong way in spite of this
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Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
??? How do they have similar flaws?
They are very similar players when it comes to weaknesses.
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It's not the GM's job to be a good communicator with the players. That's not what he's here for. That's for Shurmur and the position coaches.
Gettleman's job is to build the roster as effectively as possible and players feelings do not and should not factor into it.
Collins is "heartbroken" the Giants didn't offer him a contract? Tough shit. He didn't deserve his ask. The Redskins overspent on him and he'll be a disappointment there. It's not Gettleman's fault that he didn't overpay to retain him.
Watching him try to cover Barkley on a wheel route or shadow Engram down the field will be a treat because he's not going to be able to to handle either assignment.
We replaced him with a better player who is less costly and isn't going to air all of the Giants dirty laundry to Josina Anderson.
Good riddance.
You are right it isn't the GMs job but it should also be a concern when there are so many examples of him rubbing players in the wrong way in spite of this
Why? All the players he rubbed the wrong way are ostensibly gone. He's brought in players who he can meld with. Beyond, that, they're getting paid to play.
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In comment 14451108 arcarsenal said:
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Peppers and Collins have very similar flaws and in no way is Peppers a better player right now.
??? How do they have similar flaws?
They don't. They're completely different players.
Peppers is better in coverage - can be deployed as a slot corner. Plays faster. Is more versatile. Can contribute on ST's and actually make plays with the football in his hands.
Collins is an in the box SS who needs to play near the LOS and be sheltered from being isolated in coverage because he's a major liability.
And again, Collins is costlier.
I'll gladly take Peppers. Bettcher is going to be able to do far more with him than he was with Collins.
He's a better player. You'll see it this year.
They are very similar players when it comes to weaknesses.
He's much, much better in coverage.
The Jones thing was just another example of him creating a bigger shitstorm because of the way he chose to communicate.
Again, this is something that even 20 years ago people said hey, if you get your job done personality doesn't matter. This doesn't exist anymore. Amicable relationships with the people that work for you as well as open mindedness and talent are all viewed as key components of leadership in today's world.
Peppers was used as a slot corner several times in the past.
You never want Collins in that position.
Collins is the harder hitter, Peppers is more well-rounded, and given Collins injury to the shoulder he uses to hit with - that's a significant detriment
Just more made-up narratives. The list of GM's who have been trashed by former players is long. That isn't unique to Gettleman. You should be more concerned if the players he's letting go actually go on to star while he seemingly gets rid of them for spite.
But you don't want to delve into that area because you'll see his record on that (and his actual record too!) in Carolina is damn good in that regard.
The Jones thing was just another example of him creating a bigger shitstorm because of the way he chose to communicate.
Again, this is something that even 20 years ago people said hey, if you get your job done personality doesn't matter. This doesn't exist anymore. Amicable relationships with the people that work for you as well as open mindedness and talent are all viewed as key components of leadership in today's world.
I honestly don't thin kit matters...even in today's world...unless it's to the people directly in his employ. Even then, I would think that most players have a degree of separation to the GM where his personality (or the public perception of his personality) doesn't really impact their day to day.
And, I think most of his personality issues is media myth and now with the addition of disgruntled ex-employees.
I will give Gettlemen credit. He does not give a shit what anybody thinks about his decisions. He has a job to do, he has a vision and it may not be a popular vision.
I don't know how it will play out but this team already looks completely different from December of 2017. Almost unrecognizable.
yeah what an ass hole--- if only he worked on his craft after that first year and had a top 5 Defensive MVP type year and led the team defensively to the playoffs in 2016... --
"It was definitely hard because I don't do that," Collins said. "I killed myself when I went home, I just couldn't take it, but I'm just ready to get back on the field and just keep it going and prove myself."
"I got over it," he added, "but I mean just to feel that I let the team down is always in the back of your mind."
You are welcome Landon!
You are welcome Landon!
agree with that
mutually beneficial
Players on losing teams are expendable. Add in the bump for 2nd contracts, and you really need to be in a great position to negotiate with your current team to be retained.
That doesn't have to do with the GM's demeanor. It has to do with the realities and salary constraints of the NFL. Kevin Abrahms could have lunch with Collins every day and still know that from a cap standpoint his production doesn't match his cost.
Also, it was smart business for Gettleman not to pay him that amount. He's not a great all around safety.
Also, it was smart business for Gettleman not to pay him that amount. He's not a great all around safety.
never said it was a big loss. all ive done is defend the guy for being a good player and contributor, in particular to the one season that was actually enjoyable in recent memory. Also the guy is not a cancer- plays his ass off- and has a passion for the game and winning. lot of homers here who have no clue about the reality of the giants locker room professing bull shit
Now you get this,and it seems like there's a few agendas.Collins has changed a few of his answers to fit ESPN,and perhaps make his new boss happy.And some of the fans have switched from Good Landon to Bad Landon.
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"I know with myself, [Harrison], Odell, [Vernon], all we wanted to do was win, and we spoke up because we had to get them to listen to us," Collins said. "We had to get them to get us winning pieces to help us at least be contenders.
"I think we were too vocal, and that platform was bigger than the Giants, you know, and our words stood out more. And ... if it's not good media, they don't want that kind of media."
Get us winning pieces? You were supposed to be the winning pieces, dipshit.
Collins, Harrison, Beckham, Vernon...four of the worst Giants I've ever had the displeasure of rooting for in my 33 years as a fan.
Could not agree more. I’m most excited about this year to actually root for guys I want to actually root for.
Listening to these guys talk after being let go just shows how pathetic this team used to be. Glad Gettleman cleared house of all these “winning pieces”
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How dare they not at least try to tag me?
This makes no sense.
Makes perfect sense to me.
what quote are people offended by? this is standard bbi.
BBI says Giants got rid of people to change culture.... half the board falling over itself to slobber over that idea.... Landon Collins says he and other more vocal guys were not brought back due to culture.... BBI response... what a jerk glad we got rid of him.
he is just giving more insight and nuance to to the word culture. If anyone of us acted the way these players tend to we'd get fired
Collins was not worth what he received. I like Peppers better as an overall player and that doesn't even include taking their contracts into account.
Gettleman shipped out the prima donnas. It's just that simple.
Nail on the head. I feel for Collins & I'm always torn when this happens because I believe in re-signing good homegrown talent to 2nd contracts. It's good business and creates a team the fans can invest in. And to that end, Collins truly cared about being a Giant. He was invested in becoming the leader of the team & franchise player.
There's some delusion involved with LC - he's great with great players around him like Alabama and the 2016 Giants D. On bad teams he doesn't look like an elite S. That's 3 of 4 years on the Giants. I'll bet it goes beyond $$$ with Collins, his self-worth was rattled and he took business personal. So even becoming a rich man and reaching the pinnacle of his professional career from a compensation standpoint - the day he was working for his whole life - he's filled with bitterness.
Gettleman said in several instances that his job as GM is to ELIMINATE distractions. The kind of distractions that the holdout of a popular player would cause. He had to know this would happen. Maybe got bad advice who knows. With all the shit slinging hes done I'm not feeling sorry he's gone.
Did he forget he called a teammate who Mom was facing brain surgery a "cancer". Yeah Eli Apple's Mom was very sick 2017 so may be that was why he wasn't playing well? Anyway you got your $$$s now shutup.
Something tells me that he isnt beyond a cheap shot on our beloved RB,,, Just sayin.
Something tells me that he isnt beyond a cheap shot on our beloved RB,,, Just sayin.
If Landon throws his shoulder into Barkley's quads, Landon's shoulder will disintegrate.
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In comment 14450869 Big Blue '56 said:
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How dare they not at least try to tag me?
This makes no sense.
Seriously? The fact that the Giants didn’t even care enough about him to at least tag him while they negotiated a contract is very telling to me.
And he also promised a fight if the Giants did tag him.
The guy was a positive influence and a vocal leader on the team that had very few of those.
Meanwhile, the funny thing is that the day we traded OBJ, most people here were really down on Peppers. Now... it seems like the consensus has changed. Not about trading away OBJ.. but the idea of having Peppers play safety for us
Pretty sure Collins will stop talking at least during the game.
At this point I hope they get Collins on coverage and they make him start taking about something else like why he couldn't cover anyone.
AMEN I am not even going to read WTF he had to say and
good riddance to Him OBJ Snacks Apple and Vernon ...
You can't build a winning team with a rotten Apple .
Imagine some of the things that went on that we know nothing about . I always stuck up for LC but he got a
shit pile of Money and he still just wants to run his mouth
I hope that we talk about them less and talk about the
current Giants .
I think Peppers will fill in nicely for him, but I'll miss Collins tackling. That was something special.
I wonder what pieces they were asking for? Players? Coaching?
I never got the impression Collins ever felt any way other than he loved being a Giant.
It sounds like he had a problem with the team they assembled to compete, much like all of us felt.
It sounds like he had a problem with the team they assembled to compete.