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Stapleton Article on the Defensive Line

Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/5/2019 8:21 am
Quote:
With Lawrence's arrival, Tomlinson and Lawrence are getting the chance to show they can trade spots - ultimately that could be within series, play-to-play or dependent on game plans week to week.

"Me, Dex and B.J. are learning and playing all three positions, just in case, and we can all play both end spots, the nose or the shade or the 3-tech, depending on what defense we're in, it's going pretty well right now," Tomlinson said. "I like the freedom to line up everywhere."



College loyalties aside, Dalvin Tomlinson and Dexter Lawrence ready to dominate - ( New Window )
It’s exciting to have three young potential studs  
Ben in Tampa : 6/5/2019 8:31 am : link
on the d-line. It’s reminds me a little bit of Osi/Tuck/Kiwi, albeit not pass rushers. Let’s hope they deliver.
McIntosh is a guy who seems to get lost in the convo  
Rjanyg : 6/5/2019 9:06 am : link
He may have the best pass rush potential of them all.
RE: McIntosh is a guy who seems to get lost in the convo  
BigBlueDownTheShore : 6/5/2019 9:13 am : link
In comment 14463428 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
He may have the best pass rush potential of them all.


The DT and DE spots in 3-4 do the dirty work of making fits happen to free up LBs. Pass rushing is an added benefit. Any sacks from them would be a bonus to me.
Stapleton flies under the radar as a good beat writer.  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/5/2019 9:13 am : link
.
I think you have  
HoustonGiant : 6/5/2019 9:13 am : link
3 guys that can handle 5. This is essential in a 3-4. The pass rush comes from the LB's.
RE: Stapleton flies under the radar as a good beat writer.  
Ira : 6/5/2019 9:16 am : link
In comment 14463436 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
.


I agree. I enjoy his columns.
D Line  
Archer : 6/5/2019 9:35 am : link
What makes the Giants' line different this year, are the sizes of the players.
I have never seen a defensive line with so many players over 300#.

Tomlinson is 317
Hill is 311
Lawrence is 342
Jenkins is 327
McIntosh is 297

These are large athletic players who are strong and can move.
They are the "hog mollies" of the defense.
Even the backups are large.

Opposing teams will have a difficult time controlling the line of scrimmage. This should protect the linebackers and safeties giving them space to excel.
With a stronger dl to occupy blockers and a better secondary  
Ira : 6/5/2019 9:40 am : link
with players who can cover man to man, we're going to see a lot more blitzing - for better or worse. I think for better. I think that our defense takes a big step forward.
The middle of the defense still lacks speed  
arniefez : 6/5/2019 9:43 am : link
Especially Ogletree who still seems to be propped up by the Giants and the media as a positive player. He is one of the very worst LBs in the NFL and was with the Rams too. It's complete incompetence that the Giants took on that contract.
RE: The middle of the defense still lacks speed  
Klaatu : 6/5/2019 9:52 am : link
In comment 14463480 arniefez said:
Quote:
Especially Ogletree who still seems to be propped up by the Giants and the media as a positive player. He is one of the very worst LBs in the NFL and was with the Rams too.


Yeah!

Well...except for 2016, when he was 2nd Team All-Pro.
i've never seen anything special when it comes to tomlinson  
GiantsFan84 : 6/5/2019 9:53 am : link
seems like a good guy and he tries but he just seems very average to me

i would not bring him back after his initial contract ends
RE: McIntosh is a guy who seems to get lost in the convo  
Klaatu : 6/5/2019 9:59 am : link
In comment 14463428 Rjanyg said:
Quote:
He may have the best pass rush potential of them all.


Right now the Big 3 are Hill, Tomlinson, and Lawrence. But McIntosh will undoubtedly be a part of the D-Line rotation, and Shurmur had some nice things to say about him yesterday.
McIntosh  
ColHowPepper : 6/5/2019 10:20 am : link
Do we know any more about the condition that sidelined him all last season? Hormonal, something that can be treated by medication? If that were the case, one would have thought that it could have been resolved in an earlier time frame.
Looks like that the + aspect if this  
idiotsavant : 6/5/2019 10:24 am : link
Group in this scheme is that you can create an open rush lane (or semi open) for any of the DTs (with an olb filling one gap for one play) and / or any of them can plug for one play at any spot, or create a lane for a lb on any given down.

So it's by definition 100x more variable than a classic 3/4 with regards to dl
RE: McIntosh  
Klaatu : 6/5/2019 10:30 am : link
In comment 14463548 ColHowPepper said:
Quote:
Do we know any more about the condition that sidelined him all last season? Hormonal, something that can be treated by medication? If that were the case, one would have thought that it could have been resolved in an earlier time frame.


It was a thyroid condition that caused him to lose weight. However else it might have affected him, I don't know, but even before it was discovered at the Combine, most analysts said he needed to get stronger (and most suggested he should have stayed in school for another year). But if you read what Shurmur said about him yesterday, it appears that he has gotten stronger, which should bode well for him.

As for his illness, he did get in a few games at the end of last season, so it looks like that problem had been resolved and hopefully it won't be a recurring thing.
RE: i've never seen anything special when it comes to tomlinson  
gmen9892 : 6/5/2019 10:31 am : link
In comment 14463502 GiantsFan84 said:
Quote:
seems like a good guy and he tries but he just seems very average to me

i would not bring him back after his initial contract ends


Going to be a very important Year 3 for him. I agree that I have not been impressed with his play so far, even though PFF keeps telling me he is playing well. Just don't see it. If he does not flash big time this year, I would move on from him after this rookie contract is done.
RE: RE: i've never seen anything special when it comes to tomlinson  
NephilimGiants : 6/5/2019 10:46 am : link
In comment 14463577 gmen9892 said:
Quote:
In comment 14463502 GiantsFan84 said:


Quote:


seems like a good guy and he tries but he just seems very average to me

i would not bring him back after his initial contract ends



Going to be a very important Year 3 for him. I agree that I have not been impressed with his play so far, even though PFF keeps telling me he is playing well. Just don't see it. If he does not flash big time this year, I would move on from him after this rookie contract is done.


Same, once Snacks left though they put a lot of pressure on him as nose tackle but with Dexter should help him out. Id still prefer to replace him for a playmaker like QWilliams/Aaron donald type that can bring pressure up the middle
RE: RE: McIntosh is a guy who seems to get lost in the convo  
NephilimGiants : 6/5/2019 10:51 am : link
In comment 14463435 BigBlueDownTheShore said:
Quote:
In comment 14463428 Rjanyg said:


Quote:


He may have the best pass rush potential of them all.



The DT and DE spots in 3-4 do the dirty work of making fits happen to free up LBs. Pass rushing is an added benefit. Any sacks from them would be a bonus to me.


Pressure up the middle makes qbs move out the tackle box which makes it easier for the pass/ edge rushers to get them
Or pressure from both edges forces QB up  
idiotsavant : 6/5/2019 11:21 am : link
Then if you have nifty or killer DTs they get him there.

Or the A gap blitz.

As far as I can see it's a set piece thing, so the entire front 7 is scripted on each play.

I can also see both playing at the same time  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 6/5/2019 11:22 am : link
In a 2-4 nickel look on 1st and 10s, 2nd and mediums - possible running downs.
3 (Hill, Tomlinson,Dex)  
idiotsavant : 6/5/2019 11:30 am : link
1 (Carter for speed contain backside runs )

7 (7dbs, blitz one)
RE: The middle of the defense still lacks speed  
NYFootballGiants : 6/5/2019 11:50 am : link
In comment 14463480 arniefez said:
Quote:
Especially Ogletree who still seems to be propped up by the Giants and the media as a positive player. He is one of the very worst LBs in the NFL and was with the Rams too. It's complete incompetence that the Giants took on that contract.


Best LB we've had in 10 years. By far. A much needed upgrade and one of Gettleman's first moves.
RE: RE: The middle of the defense still lacks speed  
flycatcher : 6/5/2019 4:43 pm : link
In comment 14463711 NYFootballGiants said:
Quote:
In comment 14463480 arniefez said:


Quote:


Especially Ogletree who still seems to be propped up by the Giants and the media as a positive player. He is one of the very worst LBs in the NFL and was with the Rams too. It's complete incompetence that the Giants took on that contract.



Best LB we've had in 10 years. By far. A much needed upgrade and one of Gettleman's first moves.

10 years is a long time, so I doubted this post - til I went back and checked. The only NYG LB in the past 10 years that I'd rate equal to Ogletree is a healthy Devon Kennard. The LB position really has been sub-standard for a long time.
"never seen anything special when it coes to Tomlinson"  
bc4life : 6/5/2019 7:34 pm : link
yeah he's JAG
link and learn - ( New Window )
didn't see one OL player  
bc4life : 6/5/2019 8:02 pm : link
in those clips block him effectively when it was one on one. and those were decent OLines - Colts, Cowboys, Titans, Eagles, Redskins.

showed closing speed, ability to get off blocks, moved well laterally - yeah nothing spoecial

P.S. wtf?
We're very thin upfront  
Marty866b : 6/6/2019 12:00 am : link
McIntosh is an unknown and there is little behind him and in a good rotation, you need 6 good lineman. We have three.
RE: We're very thin upfront  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/6/2019 1:58 am : link
In comment 14464499 Marty866b said:
Quote:
McIntosh is an unknown and there is little behind him and in a good rotation, you need 6 good lineman. We have three.


You are forgetting Olsen Pierre and MacIntosh, who are both counted on, and they are praying Slayton or Jenkins is #6. The first 5 will eat up the large majority of snaps I guess.
BC4life thanks for that excellent Tomlinson highlights reel.  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/6/2019 2:35 am : link
Heck one on one, he defeated numerous double teams or partial double teams - not just stonewalling them, but peeling off to make tackles. He's a bull, and plays with both nice pad level and awareness. Good technique. He's very hard to move.
It's true that depth on the dl is important and that we don't have  
Ira : 6/6/2019 6:05 am : link
proven depth. But having a good starting three is - well it's a very good start.
RE: We're very thin upfront  
Klaatu : 6/6/2019 6:20 am : link
In comment 14464499 Marty866b said:
Quote:
McIntosh is an unknown and there is little behind him and in a good rotation, you need 6 good lineman. We have three.


Define "good." If you're talking about six guys who could all conceivably start, I'd say the Giants have five - Hill, Tomlinson, Lawrence, McIntosh, and Pierre. Then you have five more guys who will be vying for the remaining two spots (assuming the Giants keep seven, like they did last year).
RE: RE: We're very thin upfront  
SGMen : 6/6/2019 6:32 am : link
In comment 14464521 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 14464499 Marty866b said:


Quote:


McIntosh is an unknown and there is little behind him and in a good rotation, you need 6 good lineman. We have three.



Define "good." If you're talking about six guys who could all conceivably start, I'd say the Giants have five - Hill, Tomlinson, Lawrence, McIntosh, and Pierre. Then you have five more guys who will be vying for the remaining two spots (assuming the Giants keep seven, like they did last year).
I think we have six DL's that can play. McIntosh did play some late last year and he wasn't 100% yet. He has "potential" so he isn't a sure bet but Pierre is a veteran who knows the scheme.

I believe DL was be a strong spot for this defense.
Having 6 "good" defensive linemen seems like an unrealistic standard  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/6/2019 7:38 am : link
We didn't even have that in the prime years of a 4-3 line with Tuck, Umenyiora, et al.

You want 3 good linemen as starters and a sub you can trust to actually do a good job. defensive linemen that can play don't grow on trees.
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