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A close friend is a Skins fan, lives in the NY area. Played in a charity golf outing with Jay Gruden.
JG said that WAS heard that DJ's private workout for the Giants was an absolutely lights out dominant display. They believed it because DJ "did a pretty nice job with us too." However, once they heard it from multiple accounts, they strongly believed there was no way that DJ would make it past 17, if not 6.
[So this next part is clearly JG talking his book to a skins fan but could still be true]
JG claims Haskins was always their target. His arm and whiteboard smarts are fantastic. His one knock is that he is way way slow. The reported interest in Rosen was always a smokescreen so as not to create a bidding war to move up if necessary. The only team they worried about was CIN bc their sources suggested Elway also preferred DJ. They were somewhat relaxed on CIN bc there was no chatter on them trying to move up, presumably for a QB. Once DJ was taken they were not surprised DEN traded back from 10.
Asshat disclaimer: The views and opinions expressed are my drunk friend's hearsay of a rival's coach post draft spin and was rife with speculation. Any content provided are of their opinion, and are not intended to malign any religion, ethnic group, club, organization, company, individual, Eli, Gettlemen, Mara, or anyone or anything.
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The reports afterward to the contrary haven't carried the same weight to my eyes.
There was a post by an asshat who felt uncomfortable sharing the information so I won't repeat it that said Elway really wanted DJ. All their actions and these "reports" just confirm it to me.
Agreed.
There was a post by an asshat who felt uncomfortable sharing the information so I won't repeat it that said Elway really wanted DJ. All their actions and these "reports" just confirm it to me.
Elway’s modus operandi has been drafting big, strong armed QBs - Osweiler, Lynch, Kelly, Lock.
He values arm quality.
Jones does/did not fit that profile. So I’ve never bought those reports you refer to and believe reports from guys like King instead.
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There was a post by an asshat who felt uncomfortable sharing the information so I won't repeat it that said Elway really wanted DJ. All their actions and these "reports" just confirm it to me.
Elway’s modus operandi has been drafting big, strong armed QBs - Osweiler, Lynch, Kelly, Lock.
He values arm quality.
Jones does/did not fit that profile. So I’ve never bought those reports you refer to and believe reports from guys like King instead.
Him signing Case Keenum last year and passing on Rosen and Josh Allen contradicts your argument. Also Osweiler has solid arm strength but he doesn't have what you would consider a strong arm. Kelly was also a 7th round pick, IIRC he was Mr. Irrelevant that year.
Elway also used a 7th round picks on Zac Dysert and Trevor Siemian who have average to below average arm strength.
Case Keenum - 6'1
Chad Kelly - 6'2
Drew Lock - 6'4
Paxton Lynch - 6'7
Trevor Siemian - 6'4
Zac Dysert - 6'3
Brock Osweiler - 6'7
Case Keenum - 6'1
Chad Kelly - 6'2
Drew Lock - 6'4
Paxton Lynch - 6'7
Trevor Siemian - 6'4
Zac Dysert - 6'3
Brock Osweiler - 6'7
I agree Jones has the height, but his non-plus arm just doesn't fit the Elway prototype.
And they just added Flacco - another big, strong armed QB.
The move to acquire Keenum was a poor fit. And you are right, that he didn't fit Elway's prototype size-wise. But Keenum actually has a decent arm. And while he was drafted in the 7th round, Kelly has a terrific arm.
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Daniel Jones - 6'5
Case Keenum - 6'1
Chad Kelly - 6'2
Drew Lock - 6'4
Paxton Lynch - 6'7
Trevor Siemian - 6'4
Zac Dysert - 6'3
Brock Osweiler - 6'7
I agree Jones has the height, but his non-plus arm just doesn't fit the Elway prototype.
And they just added Flacco - another big, strong armed QB.
The move to acquire Keenum was a poor fit. And you are right, that he didn't fit Elway's prototype size-wise. But Keenum actually has a decent arm. And while he was drafted in the 7th round, Kelly has a terrific arm.
Keenum has an average at best arm. Jones' arm is much stronger than Keenum's. The reason Keenum finally played well in Minnesota was because he was protected in a dome. In the loss to the Eagles he was exposed and we saw how much he struggled outdoors in poor weather.
I guess the OTA and minicamp reports didn't put the arm strength concerns with Jones to rest.
I trust the few inside sources who claimed that Elway liked Jones at 10. Peter King has never shown to have connections inside NFL teams.
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There was a post by an asshat who felt uncomfortable sharing the information so I won't repeat it that said Elway really wanted DJ. All their actions and these "reports" just confirm it to me.
Elway’s modus operandi has been drafting big, strong armed QBs - Osweiler, Lynch, Kelly, Lock.
He values arm quality.
Jones does/did not fit that profile. So I’ve never bought those reports you refer to and believe reports from guys like King instead.
It was shocking to me too, but they did have a private workout and he probably impressed. All their actions during and post draft point to that he was their target. And King? Is that for real? I mean if you want to talk about his daughter's soccer teams chances this year sure, but NFL the guy has no connections anymore.
However...including Lock in a draft where Lock slid out of the first round entirely and Jones was drafted sixth isn't really relevant..it's not evidence he'd have selected Lock over Jones.
Including Chad Kelly, Mr. Irrelevant, as evidence of Elway preferring arm quality when he was literally the last selection of the entire draft is likely pointless.
So that leaves you down to Osweiler and Paxton Lynch and you might be overrating the arm talent here...
--The negatives on Paxton Lynch from his nfl.com scouting report. Just because a guy is 6-7 doesn't mean he has elite arm talent. Osweiler's calling card was a strong arm, I'm not sure it was heralded as an elite arm..and that's really the "knock" on Jones.
You are implying Daniel Jones lacks arm talent. Jones does not lack arm talent, however he does not have elite arm strength. Not having an elite "power arm" is not equivalent to lacking arm talent. I'd say most of the QBs drafted from year to year probably fall within the range of lacking elite arm strength...an attribute applied to guys like Mahomes, Josh Allen, Matthew Stafford, Jay Cutler etc. Most quarterbacks don't have that elite level arm strength..I don't think Lynch did(his arm strength is questioned right in his negatives on his scouting report)
, maybe Osweiler did.
Finally, the best quarterback that Elway ever had was Peyton, who never had elite arm strength, but checked just about every other box other than mobility. It is just as possible that of all the quarterbacks you mentioned in your post that Daniel Jones may have been the one who struck Elway has having some Manning like qualities that would translate well to the NFL level. A first round caliber quarterback with traits that were Manning-like, could also be very attractive to Elway.
I think the Elway-Manning link might be a bit understated here with regard to Denver and their possible interest in Jones.
Legendary Quarterback John Elway Can’t Figure Out Quarterbacks - ( New Window )
But using a sample size of two doesn't really tell you much what Elway does and does not prefer. I mean he signed Case Keenum to a significant contract.
Elway's QB decisions have been mediocre if you want to be respectful. We have no basis to go on that he's good at that aspect of running a team.
So for him to have this interest in Jones would go against the grain of his preferences. And I don't get caught up in the information from these camps. Jones is working with a clean pocket, doesn't have the threat of getting hit, and can get to his mechanics. BFD. That's essentially every NFL QB.
Look, lots of guys look great in the batting cage, too, under ideal conditions. Lots of guys look great off the practice tee. The real test is when the lights are on and NFL defenses make you uncomfortable. Can you still get to your mechanics? And if not, can you still deliver the ball under duress and discomfort? Those traits remain to be seen with Jones...