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Post mini camp, how are you feeling about the 2019 Giants?

Sean : 6/8/2019 9:12 am
Itís been quite the offseason coming off a 5-11 season. I like what the Giants have done & you can argue it has been the most significant offseason since 2004. Franchise impacting decisions:

-Let Landon Collins walk for a comp pick
-Trade Beckham
-Draft Daniel Jones

OL has been solidified further & culture has been a priority. What Iíve found the most refreshing is the lack of noise/drama with the team thus far.

Beckham has gotten into twitter wars with the media, Snacks Harrison blew off Lions mandatory mini camp, Landon Collins canít stop talking about the Giants.

Iím excited because I feel hope with this franchise. Iím hoping for growth this season with a bunch of cap flexibility in 2020 and beyond.

How are we all feeling?
Exactly how I was pre mini camp  
Mike from Ohio : 6/8/2019 9:16 am : link
Didnít learn anything new because it was just mini camp.
Optimistic.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/8/2019 9:18 am : link
Can't dwell on past decisions. I gotta hope DG knows what he's doing & Jones is the real deal. Time will tell. But at least we have a QB of the future & we'll see if he's The Man.
this is the  
Jolly Blue Giant : 6/8/2019 9:18 am : link
40th year in a row that I've been overly optimistic after mini camp.....but THIS year is the one!
Nothing has changed  
The_Boss : 6/8/2019 9:20 am : link
Still thinking weíre running 4th in the East.
The locker room drama didnít bother me that much ¬†
djm : 6/8/2019 9:20 am : link
But it wasnít a good thing thatís for sure. The only player I was sad to see moved was Collins, to an extent. But heís replaceable and with peppers in the fold it made even more sense to move on.

The giants have done well when they zeroed in on the draft like they have here the last two years. Not only did they draft with smart intentions they are giving these picks every opportunity to succeed.

I like where they sit right now as a franchise. Iím not crazy about shurmur but I donít think heís bad either. What I do love is shurmurís qb development skills.

Weíre in a good spot. The team is better and younger than last year and miles ahead of where it was mid 2017 when it was rock bottom.

Thoughts of Barkley make me happy. Thoughts of Jones being the goods make me giddy. Letís be honest itís going to be fun to remind the millions of morons that went ape shit on draft night. Almost seems that the angrier the draft backlash is the more likely that player laughs last. Jones will too.
Nothing has changed  
Giantz_comeback : 6/8/2019 9:25 am : link
But confirmed.

Very little concern for the offense. Shurmur knows O and has plenty of weapons at his disposal (despite the loss of OBJ) and finally the semblance of an offensive line.

The year we lost Tiki who arguably was right at the same impact level for the offense that OBJ was between his running and receiving ability. Guess what we won the Super Bowl. The next year after losing Shockey? Same thing. Not saying Super Bowl win or anything like that but just not to overestimate the loss of one player if you still have built a good overall unit without him
Yawn  
Gman11 : 6/8/2019 9:30 am : link
I'll let you know when they play real football, you know, with blocking and tackling and stuff.
Mini camp means little  
djm : 6/8/2019 9:34 am : link
But the buzz on jones is encouraging. If he was struggling it would be slightly concerning but more just really annoying. Heís got a lot of talent and we are now hearing about it. This is a good thing.

As crazy as it sounds I think people really are sleeping on Barkley and the impact heís going to have on wins and losses. Last year it was just about his talents and skills but the team wasnít ready to win yet, especially early on in the year. 2019 should be different. Barkley is going be a winning player soon. Heís too good not to be.

Too many question marks.  
Jim in Forest Hills : 6/8/2019 9:37 am : link
Lots of young people have to really step up for meaningful football.

Hoping the OL is good so that Eli and Saquon can do some magic.

I think the WRs will be a problem this year and that we will have real issues converting on 3rd and long.

I think Eli will have a down year on stats but more wins.
RE: Nothing has changed  
Johnny5 : 6/8/2019 9:38 am : link
In comment 14466660 The_Boss said:
Quote:
Still thinking weíre running 4th in the East.

Nothing has changed?? The Giants may or may not run 4th again in the division, but nothing has changed? Seriously?
RE: Yawn  
Klaatu : 6/8/2019 9:38 am : link
In comment 14466665 Gman11 said:
Quote:
I'll let you know when they play real football, you know, with blocking and tackling and stuff.


Agreed. You can't really tell anything one way or another until the pads come on and the hitting starts.

I like the attitude shown, of course, the fact that everybody's there and the mood seems upbeat, but none of the questions surrounding this team will be answered in June.
Intrigued.  
Big Blue Blogger : 6/8/2019 9:39 am : link
I still don't expect the team to be good. But I think they will be interesting, which is a nice change from "Throw it to Beckham and hope for the best, then go get a sandwich while the defense is on the field."
I think year two of this regime will show real progress  
BillT : 6/8/2019 9:43 am : link
I think the the rebuilt OL will give us the kind of dominant running game that Dallas has shown almost an entire team can be built around. Defenses will have to overcommit to stop it and a better passing game will follow. Better offense means less time on the field for the defense that along with improved DL and DB will provide a tipping point for the teamís chances. Our ST are already very good. I know, cool story, right?
The questions don't lie with the offense  
Giantz_comeback : 6/8/2019 9:44 am : link
2nd year in system for many and a lot of veteran experience in the group.

The D on the other hand has been restocked with a TON of promising talent but much of it is still very young and unproven. You have the 'lead dogs' that DG spoke about in each unit but still a lot of youth that will need to grow up quick. However in theory the skillsets assembled better match what Bettcher is trying to do and that in itself will pay dividends. Just how quickly the youth matures will be key for just how good the D will be.

But if the offense performs like they did 2nd half where they averaged 27 points a game much without OBJ then the D will just need to be average for this team to be pretty good.
Hopeful and optimistic....  
KingBlue : 6/8/2019 9:47 am : link
Excited for training camp. Can't wait to see our new toys. It's not all about wins and losses.
A LOT has changed ....  
Manny in CA : 6/8/2019 9:53 am : link

OBJ, Vernon, Snacks, Apple - all gone; Eli on his last contract year; much younger team, with mix of vet players from other teams.

There's going to be a lot of growing pains, but it had to happen to get better.
We will know soon enough, in Dallas!  
George from PA : 6/8/2019 9:55 am : link
We have turned the corner and are heading in the right direction.

How much progress have we made against the NFC East rivals? Hard to say until the real bullets fly
BillT: My expectations for the offensive line are lower than yours.  
Big Blue Blogger : 6/8/2019 10:00 am : link
Even in the best of circumstances, units need time together to build trust and chemistry. Most of these guys have never played together. Both tackles are older and coming off surgery. There are multiple options at center, and none look particularly good. So it seems like a lot to ask for the line to excel, especially early in the season.

The guards should be excellent, which is a nice start. If Zeitler or Hernandez gets nicked, things could get ugly quickly.
Iím starting to get very optimistic about the 2020 Giants ¬†
mfsd : 6/8/2019 10:01 am : link
Another year of development by the young core weíre building, Jones ready to take over as our QB, Saquon in his prime.

Still could use upgrades at OT, FS and LB, but weíre OK at those positions, not terrible as in the past. Another offseason of draft and free agency and this team could be set up well for a 3-4 year run at least.

As for 2019, I think weíre more competitive than the last couple years, probably 9-7 or 8-8, in the running for wild card spot.

So much of the future depends on Jones...if heís the right guy, weíre set. If not, weíre fooked.
Shouldn't have said 'most' have never played together.  
Big Blue Blogger : 6/8/2019 10:03 am : link
Not technically true, since Halapio and Pulley both got some time with Solder and Hernandez last year. Still, we're a long way from knowing how they will coalesce as a unit.
I have three questions still. How is Eli going to be?  
Blue21 : 6/8/2019 10:04 am : link
Hopefully better than last year or at the least no worse. Because I don't think Jones plays until they are out of playoff contention and I don't know if he'd make a difference anyway in his rookie year. Is our OLine improved enough? It looks like they are on paper but as the Redskins know paper championships don't win Super Bowls. And is our defense improved? See my answer to OLine. So I'm cautiously optomistic.
For me, this time of year is always a wait and see time. I'm always  
Ira : 6/8/2019 10:12 am : link
skeptical about the glowing reports on late round draft picks and rookie free agents. I start to pay semi-serious attention during pre-season and serious attention in September.

I think we should see a better secondary and, because of that, Bettcher will blitz more. I like the way the offensive line is coming together which should help both the running and passing game. In short, I think we'll improve to some degree on both sides of the ball. The question is to what degree.
Sean  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/8/2019 10:38 am : link
Much better.

Look, the 2019 offseason will be judged on how Daniel Jones performs. The early returns is he looks like he belongs. He doesn't seem overwhelmed at all (even the usually terse Shurmur has been singing his praises). He doesn't have a "weak" arm and has been firing the ball DOWN the field all offseason.

Also, the Giants had their pick of the litter with the corners and Deandre Baker appears to be the real deal.
a minor note  
YANKEE28 : 6/8/2019 10:43 am : link
but its probably time to list Evan Brown as a RG.

He is yet to take a single snap at Center this spring.

Look at the 2016 roster and starters for comparison  
Ivan15 : 6/8/2019 10:45 am : link
Except for the loss of Beckham, this offense is much improved on o-line and TE. Shepard, Tate and Engram should be more effective in Shurmurís offense than the receiver group in 2016. And now Barkley is in his second year.

It is hard to beat the 2016 defense, which had a very good d-line. LBs figure to be better in 2019. Jenkins, Cromartie and Collins were at the top of their game, but Apple and Adams were JAGs. 2019 DBs have the potential to be just as good.

Special teams and depth should be better in 2019.

8 to 10 wins for this optimist.
More confident with offense...  
x meadowlander : 6/8/2019 10:47 am : link
...than in any June since 12'.

Barring injury, Oline will be at least average, should result in a very good year for 26, less sacks.

My concern is the D. That's a LOT of new pieces. How will they gel? Pass rush will certainly suck, now look built to create and give up a lot of 3rd and longs.
RE: RE: Nothing has changed  
Reale01 : 6/8/2019 10:50 am : link
In comment 14466669 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
In comment 14466660 The_Boss said:


Quote:


Still thinking weíre running 4th in the East.


Nothing has changed?? The Giants may or may not run 4th again in the division, but nothing has changed? Seriously?


Right now it's all on paper, but how can you say we are worse than the Redskins? IMO We are better at RB, WR, OL, TE and equal at QB. We had better STs last year. We are better on the DL, worse at LB (but Skins have a key injury), and its a toss up at Safety. We have the better owner/organization and coaching is a wash IMO.


Hoping for the best, preparing for the worst  
RickInCharlotte : 6/8/2019 10:53 am : link
I think the team has begun Year 2 of the 3 year plan on point. Year 1 was about dispatching problems, both real and potential, trading high dollar contracts for low dollar ones, and creating future cap space for FA and extension flexibility.

Year 2 is about developing Eli's successor and building a roster foundation on additional rookie contracts and conservative FA signings. There are still missing pieces (deep threat WR, reliable RT, IDL depth, LB playmakers), but the offense in its second year under Shurmur should be able to score points and the defense, in particular the secondary, has the potential to be better. I like Bettcher and think once he gets a few more "custom" pieces, the defense is going to be special. Special Teams appears to be solid.

I think 2019 will be a struggle, but I like the foundational pieces that have been put in place. As others have stated, I think 2020 is when the team is in prime position to lift off.
RE: BillT: My expectations for the offensive line are lower than yours.  
BillT : 6/8/2019 10:54 am : link
In comment 14466689 Big Blue Blogger said:
Quote:
Even in the best of circumstances, units need time together to build trust and chemistry. Most of these guys have never played together. Both tackles are older and coming off surgery. There are multiple options at center, and none look particularly good. So it seems like a lot to ask for the line to excel, especially early in the season.

The guards should be excellent, which is a nice start. If Zeitler or Hernandez gets nicked, things could get ugly quickly.

That all fair enough BBB but I just donít have those reservations. Remember, Barkley was the #2 back in the league in rushing behind one of the three(?) worst OLs in the league last year. This line is probably a couple levels better than that at its worst. The improvements at DL and DB are real and I think weíll find that Golden and Cater are pretty darn good pass rushers as well.
OL + D are probably a year away but i'm drinking the koolaid  
Eric on Li : 6/8/2019 11:12 am : link
I think this is going to be a big step forward from last year and with the easy schedule one of those years that could be a surprise 10 win season.

I'm expecting about 8 wins and a transition to Jones sometime after midseason but there's a chance things click a little earlier than expected too.
Good thread, great and clear thread title.  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/8/2019 11:31 am : link
Rewatched some of the 2016 playoff matchup between Green Bay and Bettcher's Az Cardinals, and given Rogers' severly diminished WR/TE toolbox that game game, it was a surprisingly close battle. Of course, the refs negating a pick six by Patrick Peterson that would have put the Cards up 14 - 0 helped GB immensely. There must be a slush fund for NFL officials in some bank account in GB...

The 2016 model Carson Palmer was a pretty good facsimile of what I expect from the 2019 Eli Manning too - some brutal missed throws, standing in the pocket waiting for a receiver to uncover when a running lane my grandma could have gained 10 yards through stared him in the face...

What came off the most clearly to me was how important the whole group of DBs are in JB's defense. And since you can't really say shit about LOS play after 6, 10, or even 20 completely non-contact work outs, that's all I will comment on now.

So far 4/6 of our "new" DBs have had at least mildly glowing reports in these non-contact drill practices - Peppers, Beal, Baker, and finally Ballentine in his very first action coming off a gunshot wound in his tuchus have all had "moments", plays, or more. (In Baker's case, reports that he's more or less always glued to his opponent in off man coverage.) Haven't heard as much about Love or Bethea, but Bethea's job - far more than anything else - is to direct traffic among the DBs. He's like the first samurai recruited by the village rice farmers in Kurosawa's The Seven Samurai, the general-tactician.

Bettcher's D flows from his DBs. I think the Big 3 up front - DT, BJH, DL - are gonna be above competent, and there's a couple of decent back-ups to let them breathe on that DL.

But the key to the whole team - that we have any window into at this point - is the reworked D secondary and I am decidedly optimistic about them post mini-camp to this point.
...  
christian : 6/8/2019 11:59 am : link
Based on Solder's comments about his health and readiness for camp, Remmers' health, and the uncertainty at center, I'll be very patient when it comes to the offensive line.

As Giants fans we should be very aware continuity on the line is paramount -- and with essentially three new starters and the real possibility a few guys will be limited in camp, I don't expect that unit to be well-oiled game 1.
RE: Good thread, great and clear thread title.  
RickInCharlotte : 6/8/2019 11:59 am : link
In comment 14466748 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
Rewatched some of the 2016 playoff matchup between Green Bay and Bettcher's Az Cardinals, and given Rogers' severly diminished WR/TE toolbox that game game, it was a surprisingly close battle. Of course, the refs negating a pick six by Patrick Peterson that would have put the Cards up 14 - 0 helped GB immensely. There must be a slush fund for NFL officials in some bank account in GB...

The 2016 model Carson Palmer was a pretty good facsimile of what I expect from the 2019 Eli Manning too - some brutal missed throws, standing in the pocket waiting for a receiver to uncover when a running lane my grandma could have gained 10 yards through stared him in the face...

What came off the most clearly to me was how important the whole group of DBs are in JB's defense. And since you can't really say shit about LOS play after 6, 10, or even 20 completely non-contact work outs, that's all I will comment on now.

So far 4/6 of our "new" DBs have had at least mildly glowing reports in these non-contact drill practices - Peppers, Beal, Baker, and finally Ballentine in his very first action coming off a gunshot wound in his tuchus have all had "moments", plays, or more. (In Baker's case, reports that he's more or less always glued to his opponent in off man coverage.) Haven't heard as much about Love or Bethea, but Bethea's job - far more than anything else - is to direct traffic among the DBs. He's like the first samurai recruited by the village rice farmers in Kurosawa's The Seven Samurai, the general-tactician.

Bettcher's D flows from his DBs. I think the Big 3 up front - DT, BJH, DL - are gonna be above competent, and there's a couple of decent back-ups to let them breathe on that DL.

But the key to the whole team - that we have any window into at this point - is the reworked D secondary and I am decidedly optimistic about them post mini-camp to this point.


I watched the same game (it was actually the 2015 season) and agree wholeheartedly with your notes about the secondary. The AZ DBs were fast, hard-hitting and aggressive - the strength of that defense - and, like you, I saw the purpose to the NYG bolstering the secondary with Peppers, Baker, Love and Bethea. Very promising for the future.

Golden and Martin were okay in the same game, and if the entire front 7 can hold its own, the secondary can do the damage.
excited to see  
Dankbeerman : 6/8/2019 12:02 pm : link
the packages we use on D. still a lack of pass rush but there is a good 20 some players who could see snaps on D when everyone is healthy.

could go 4 CBs with love and beal in the slots

some how get Golden, Carter and Ximens rushing together

Sprinke some pepper on everything and we can confuse and abuse
RE: Exactly how I was pre mini camp  
UberAlias : 6/8/2019 12:03 pm : link
In comment 14466655 Mike from Ohio said:
Quote:
Didnít learn anything new because it was just mini camp.
. Exactly. Wait and see.
RickInCharlotte -  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/8/2019 12:32 pm : link
i kept looking for some great play by Golden, and honestly didn't see it. I admit I didn't watch the whole game and also was on the phone part of the time. But those DBs jumped off the screen. Peterson is a lock down guy obviously but how they 'covered up' for their weak points, and how well Bucannon tackled and just was all over the field...

Our corps now at DB looks very, very promising, if Bethea hasn't fallen off a cliff at his age.

Rogers looked confused for LOTS of that game.
Not feeling good. Especially since all reports now are about  
Jimmy Googs : 6/8/2019 12:39 pm : link
how Eli's arm has fallen off a cliff. And we already know Daniel Jones has a weak arm so not sure where Shurmur is going to turn to in order to pass the ball downfield...

Feeling like an 8 - 8 season. Let's see how they perform against the  
SterlingArcher : 6/8/2019 12:47 pm : link
cowturds.
interesting question  
GiantsFan84 : 6/8/2019 12:53 pm : link
I feel the same on the 2019 giants as I did before. I think they will be a 4-6 win team.

But long-term I feel better. Early returns on Jones are good and that's the most important. Baker seems to be the real deal and early returns on the WRs White and Slayton appear to be very positive
I expect more of the 2nd half 27 pts per game  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 6/8/2019 1:19 pm : link
I do not think our oline improved by replacing a bunch of bums with other street bums and the magical power of gelling, teams started playing more passive two gapping to prevent long SB runs. This should continue.
Sounds  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/8/2019 2:09 pm : link
like we have a bunch of beaten down Giants fans.

RE: Sounds  
Klaatu : 6/8/2019 2:16 pm : link
In comment 14466858 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
like we have a bunch of beaten down Giants fans.


Can you blame us? The team hasn't been competitive in a long time. I think they're moving in the right direction...finally...but they've still got a long way to go.

As I said earlier, I like the attitude, but that's about it.

I hope I can be more upbeat in September. We'll see.
Klaatu  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/8/2019 2:17 pm : link
Perhaps I'm being naive, but I have good feeling about this group. There will be growing pains, but I like the make-up of the squad.
Eric  
Klaatu : 6/8/2019 2:29 pm : link
I don't see a "team," yet. I see a collection of players who might make a decent team, but for me it's simply too early to tell. I put very little stock in what happens in OTA's and mini-camps. I just hope no one gets hurt.
Much has changed ! I feel for the better ..  
Bluesbreaker : 6/8/2019 2:51 pm : link
The roster has been overhauled we have a good mix of
youth and veterans . We rid the team of some perceived
malcontents . There is no reason to be pessimistic
there was plenty of holes in the roster .
I look forward to seeing Jones play and Barkley run
behind a revamped line .
Were watching the end of the Eli Manning era does he got
one more swan song ? You never know I am not sure
how this all plays out but I am excited to see this team progress and jell together .
Dallas likely the class of the division will be a great
test to open the season . Imagine
opening up with a victory .
I'm convinced this team will go as far as health and Eli takes them.  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/8/2019 2:58 pm : link
If the offensive line can stay healthy we have the pieces in place to be very good. The big question mark for me is the type of play we can get out of Eli at this point.

The defense will probably start out below average, but by season's end I think they will be a slightly above average unit as corners gain some experience. IMO the trade up for Deandre Baker was a great move. I don't think he ever gets to that lock down CB due to some limitations in athleticism, but he will be a number 1 CB for a long time in this league.

I think if Eli plays well and we stay healthy this team may surprise. I'm just not sure if Eli is the guy anymore though, so I'm thinking 8-8.
RE: Klaatu  
Giantz_comeback : 6/8/2019 3:06 pm : link
In comment 14466864 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Perhaps I'm being naive, but I have good feeling about this group. There will be growing pains, but I like the make-up of the squad.


Untied in attitude, mind and goal. Very encouraged. The growing pains will be much more on the D side where there is a lot more youth (albeit talented) in key spots.

This offense should hit the ground running,year 2 in Shurmurs system , lots more continuity, and a couple VETERAN upgrades in a key spots.
I also like the makeup of this group, from what I'm reading.  
81_Great_Dane : 6/8/2019 3:20 pm : link
I think they're a year away from really making some noise. I also think we fans should be prepared for a very rocky start to the season, especially if Jones is playing a lot. This is a young group, and the roster's going to have a lot of rookies. They will be learning on the job.

A few years ago I interviewed Michael Strahan. He talked about how it's a big jump in intensity from preseason to regular season, another jump to regular season in a playoff chase, another jump to the playoffs, and another jump to the Super Bowl. The rookies haven't experienced any of that. There's a learning curve at every stage. We need to be patient with the kids as they grow. We also need to remember that while some guys have an impact right away, as Beckham and LT did, other guys take a while to develop, as Strahan, Amani Toomer and Tiki Barber did. So we need to have some patience with that process, too.
81_Great_Dane  
Klaatu : 6/8/2019 3:31 pm : link
Unfortunately, patience isn't a virtue around here, and it certainly won't be for the media (particularly where Eli is concerned).
RE: 81_Great_Dane  
81_Great_Dane : 6/8/2019 3:40 pm : link
In comment 14466920 Klaatu said:
Quote:
Unfortunately, patience isn't a virtue around here, and it certainly won't be for the media (particularly where Eli is concerned).
This is a fan site, and people like to come on here to vent. And since that's what fan sites are for, I figure we just live with it. But I think it's good to remind everybody to take a deep breath before calling on this guy to be benches or that guy to be cut or some coach to be fired.

Bill Parcells turned out to be one of the great turnaround guys in NFL history, but he had a terrible first season as head coach and in his second season only went 9-7. And he inherited a better team than Shurmur did. It's not reasonable to think this 2019 team is going to jump to 11 wins. It could happen, but it's not reasonable to expect that. I think 9 wins would be a fantastic step forward.
RE: RE: 81_Great_Dane  
Klaatu : 6/8/2019 3:58 pm : link
In comment 14466926 81_Great_Dane said:
Quote:
In comment 14466920 Klaatu said:


Quote:


Unfortunately, patience isn't a virtue around here, and it certainly won't be for the media (particularly where Eli is concerned).

This is a fan site, and people like to come on here to vent. And since that's what fan sites are for, I figure we just live with it. But I think it's good to remind everybody to take a deep breath before calling on this guy to be benches or that guy to be cut or some coach to be fired.

Bill Parcells turned out to be one of the great turnaround guys in NFL history, but he had a terrible first season as head coach and in his second season only went 9-7. And he inherited a better team than Shurmur did. It's not reasonable to think this 2019 team is going to jump to 11 wins. It could happen, but it's not reasonable to expect that. I think 9 wins would be a fantastic step forward.


I hear you. Hell, even Little Bill had only one winning season out of four with the Browns.

But what worries me the most is if things go south fairly quickly, it's not the transition from Eli to DJ because I view that as inevitable, it's the overall effect on a pretty likable group of players. Will failure lead to infighting? Will they have to deal with another coaching change? How patient will John Mara be with Gettleman and Shurmur? Right now I figure the arrow is pointing up for the Giants, but where it's going to be pointing at the end of the season is anybody's guess.
I feel we are a 6-10 type team  
giantstock : 6/8/2019 4:05 pm : link
Because Barkley is so great we won't be in the bottom 4.

We have one star on the team and that's it.

Overall I get excited with wins not mini-camp reports. Or if there are some stars to watch. The overall excitement this year will be to watch Barkley.

The overall excitement begins when we show we are a contender.

IMO it just shows how fall we've fallen if anyone is "excited" (though "excited" has different meanings for different people.) about mini-camp unless they feel GMEN are a contender (if they did though you'd have to wonder what asylum they've been released from.).

So I can understand "excitement" some have but it's not a definition I would believe in that some use it for. For me -- The excitement imo is to threaten for SB Championships and/or being a consistent winning record team/about to become in the current year. This team is NOT that yet. The 2020 season is the year to possibly see a potential for being a contender.
First time in 8 years  
chiro56 : 6/8/2019 4:37 pm : link
It feels like the team is out of neutral. It was obvious with Reeseís solutions he was plugging holes and grasping for straws. Never had the stones to to clean the mess up. DG fighting cancer and the media has some conviction.
It's a good young roster......  
Simms11 : 6/8/2019 5:11 pm : link
First time in a while I could say that I see talent across the roster and reason for optimism. It feels good. Will it translate immediately to wins? That's questionable as it will probably take some time to solidify things and build chemistry, but definitely feel things are looking up.
RE: RE: RE: 81_Great_Dane  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/8/2019 5:58 pm : link
In comment 14466934 Klaatu said:
Quote:
In comment 14466926 81_Great_Dane said:


Quote:


In comment 14466920 Klaatu said:


Quote:


Unfortunately, patience isn't a virtue around here, and it certainly won't be for the media (particularly where Eli is concerned).

This is a fan site, and people like to come on here to vent. And since that's what fan sites are for, I figure we just live with it. But I think it's good to remind everybody to take a deep breath before calling on this guy to be benches or that guy to be cut or some coach to be fired.

Bill Parcells turned out to be one of the great turnaround guys in NFL history, but he had a terrible first season as head coach and in his second season only went 9-7. And he inherited a better team than Shurmur did. It's not reasonable to think this 2019 team is going to jump to 11 wins. It could happen, but it's not reasonable to expect that. I think 9 wins would be a fantastic step forward.



I hear you. Hell, even Little Bill had only one winning season out of four with the Browns.

But what worries me the most is if things go south fairly quickly, it's not the transition from Eli to DJ because I view that as inevitable, it's the overall effect on a pretty likable group of players. Will failure lead to infighting? Will they have to deal with another coaching change? How patient will John Mara be with Gettleman and Shurmur? Right now I figure the arrow is pointing up for the Giants, but where it's going to be pointing at the end of the season is anybody's guess.


If things go south quickly I doubt you see any of that. You'll just see DJ start on a roster with a very young team. We have a lot of players on the roster in their first, second year, and third years and they are just trying to make their mark. The vets we have here are all mature professionals, outside of JJ maybe who's play seems to match wherever the teams is at, but he isn't really a malcontent.
And Shurmur and Getty are pretty much guranteed 2020.  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/8/2019 6:01 pm : link
I have my own issues with ownership, but one thing they do right is try to keep continuity when it warrants the situation. So unless this team straight up quits and we have a revolt in the locker room (we won't that was a big part of all the moves) I'm sure DG ensured Mara that this was a 3 year overhaul and 2020 is the payoff year.
RE: RE: RE: RE: 81_Great_Dane  
81_Great_Dane : 6/8/2019 6:08 pm : link
In comment 14467007 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
If things go south quickly I doubt you see any of that. You'll just see DJ start on a roster with a very young team. We have a lot of players on the roster in their first, second year, and third years and they are just trying to make their mark. The vets we have here are all mature professionals, outside of JJ maybe who's play seems to match wherever the teams is at, but he isn't really a malcontent.
Yeah, I agree. I think that there's so much transition going on, nobody's going to get fired if the team is bad early in the season. There'll be a lot of carping in the media and wailing and gnashing of teeth among fans, but I think this is a "trust the process" season for DG and the coaches.

The hot seat starts once Jones (or whoever) is established as the next QB and the team isn't loaded with rookies. Then it's gonna be time to win.
The OTAs/minicamps weren't really enlightening  
Milton : 6/8/2019 6:27 pm : link
There was nothing new to be encouraged about beyond the things I was already encouraged about. Hearing that Darius Slayton and CJ Conrad were making plays means zilch when there is no contact.

OTAs and minicamp are about learning the offense and defense, it's not a time for evaluating talent. The coaches may be able to tell who is smart and who isn't, who picks up things quickly and who needs to be told the same thing repeatedly, but as fans we can tell nothing from it. We can't even trust the coaches comments on who is smart and who isn't, because...well you can never trust what the coaches says publicly.

So bottomline is I considered the Giants to be the favorite to win the division before mini camp and I still do. Nothing has changed.
I'm quite pleased with the rebuild so far.  
yatqb : 6/8/2019 6:35 pm : link
We could sure use a top pass rusher (I'm hoping that Golden can be that) and we need good health (perhaps at OT more so than anywhere else).

But I think that we have a chance at a .500 season this year, and a 10 or 11 win team next year after one more draft and FA period.

OBJ is a special talent who can account for a few wins almost by himself, but only when healthy. Instead we hopefully have our QB of the future, as well as a partially rebuilt defense and OL.
8 and 8  
mpinmaine : 6/8/2019 7:01 pm : link
Maybe 9 wins
RE: Not feeling good. Especially since all reports now are about  
djm : 6/8/2019 7:13 pm : link
In comment 14466802 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
how Eli's arm has fallen off a cliff. And we already know Daniel Jones has a weak arm so not sure where Shurmur is going to turn to in order to pass the ball downfield...


Great take. Bravo.
Same difficult first half, much better second half.  
CJ in AZ : 6/8/2019 8:15 pm : link
We have so many new faces all across the team, so much new to integrate, that we shouldn't expect too much in the beginning. How many new starters on defense alone? On the back half, like last year, we will be much better unless we have injuries, as the depth is still a work in progress.

No better than 7 wins unless the defense gets surprisingly good much sooner than I expect.

June is the time to be happy about our Giants' progress. If DJ proves to be the goods, and the rest of the recent draft proves out, DG will deserve more than a few apologies from BBI. It will take some time.
good enough  
uther99 : 6/8/2019 8:44 pm : link
to miss out on top draft picks, but not make playoffs
I don't know if we are going to be better or not, but  
Northerngiant : 6/8/2019 9:18 pm : link
I feel like I can like this team more than I have in the past. Everybody showed up for practice. There doesn't seem to be ugly contract things. Players and coaches are on the same page. I can root for a veteran quarterback trying to show that he has some 2x Super Bowl MVP magic left. I can root for the underdog new quarterback. That's a win-win for me as a fan. I expect our young secondary to make mistakes, but I would prefer that to giving up. I was in San Fran to watch our defence give up to the 0-9 49ers under McAdoo. Ugh. Only giants game I've ever been to. I like that I don't have to rationalize any players behaviour. I don't have to say things like "I know he did that, but he is an awesome talent ( that we couldn't have won those 3-5 games with) . I know that I have renewed optimism every offseason since 1985 when I started as a giants fan. But... This year feels different than the last few.
Optimistic, but we're going to lose a lot during the first six weeks  
CT Charlie : 6/8/2019 9:30 pm : link
until both units begin to gel.
Very positive...  
Brown_Hornet : 6/8/2019 10:32 pm : link
...
Ill add that we can feel very good about Jones. Regardless of what some suggest, looking good at practice is still looking good.
I'm not a pro coach, But I am a high school coach. What you see on the practice field can translate to the game field...good or bad.
Apparently hes picking up the play book and making the right reads. He played at Duke, we already know that he can withstand the bullets... He didn't have choice.
RE: Klaatu  
gidiefor : Mod : 6/8/2019 11:03 pm : link
In comment 14466864 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Perhaps I'm being naive, but I have good feeling about this group. There will be growing pains, but I like the make-up of the squad.


^ This
Last season I did not expect wins. What I wanted to see was progress  
idinkido : 6/9/2019 6:33 am : link
and I got what I wanted. Last season's draft was outstanding. The team played hard throughout the season and that's to Shurmur and Gentlemen's credit. This last draft was a good one, too, and will especially help the D. Our QB will finally have an O Line that potentially will protect him and help the running game. Last season we did not see Odell get any separation after the catch and I wondered why that was so. As a fan, I will miss Odell, and we will all see how this will affect our O. All I want is to see our team show cohesiveness, play smart and be competitive throughout this coming season. I do think the future will be much better and if we can produce a pass rush our team will definitely be better.
Great  
Lines of Scrimmage : 6/9/2019 8:17 am : link
When DG was hired I looked up his background as I only knew of his Giants and Carolina tenure.

Interestingly, he was a scout for those very good Bills teams in the late 80's and early 90's. He then was a scout for those great Denver teams in the late 90's.

Well the physical Giants to care of the Bill in 1990 and Denver and Elway finally got over the hump when they became a dominate run ball control team so I do believe Dave certainly sees what wins.

I expect a tough, spirited effort from our guys. Yes we are young but there is a nice blend of veterans. If Eli plays well then I expect they challenge for the division provided they have reasonable health. I also expect us to be strong on both lines for the first time in a long time.
Better than last year  
The Tempest : 6/9/2019 8:23 am : link
I believe it is a better group than last year and a combination of a weak schedule, good off-season & draft, and Shurmur's second season, Giants can sneak into the playoffs. Almost ridiculously optimistic.

I have a weird feeling  
kes722 : 6/9/2019 11:13 pm : link
That this is going to be a fun year.

Barkley is the beat back in the NFL since Sanders and now has a top tier RG and no matter what the RT should be better...Wheeler or Remmers.

The so called "cancer" is gone

They might have found a diamond in the rough with there CB heavy draft.

People seem to forget Bettcher D replies on DB more then pass rushers .

I expect the d to be much better.


I could see us winning 10 plus games


(Please ignore spelling and or grammar... JD is a friend of mine)
Two hand touch in gym shorts  
.McL. : 6/9/2019 11:58 pm : link
doesn't move me one way or the other.

It's interesting, but nothing more.
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