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Everybody inside Giants 'feels the heat, not just Eli'

gidiefor : Mod : 6/8/2019 8:50 pm
Quote:
“This is the biggest September the Giants have had in a long time,” said O’Hara, who was the center on the 2004 Giants and remains one of Manning’s closest friends.

“They need to win some football games early on. Not just for Eli, but for the coaching staff, too. If you are Coach Shurmur, you are not sitting there saying, ‘Oh, I’ve got three years.’ Everybody in that building feels the heat. It’s not just Eli.”


- more -
Everybody inside Giants ‘feels the heat, not just Eli’ Manning, says Shaun O’Hara - ( New Window )
Good.  
ELI THE GOAT : 6/8/2019 9:00 pm : link
Like they should. I'm sick of the Giants season being over by Week 6. I'm not expecting a Super Bowl this year, but AT LEAST give us meaningful games again.
Disagree  
trueblueinpw : 6/8/2019 9:03 pm : link
It’s a nice thought but...If the the Giants drop out of the playoffs before 8 games then Jones is in and then no one really is going to expect much. Shurmur has three years, at least.
Not to single out one innocuous line in the article  
djm : 6/8/2019 9:05 pm : link
But I’ve seen and heard this line a lot lately and it’s sort of revisionist to suggest that the 2004 giants, 5-4 under warner, were punting on a playoff shot by inserting the rookie Eli Manning. That team at 5-4 was done. Under warner the ol pass blocking issues were exasperated. At least Eli got rid of the ball quick. Eli did sink to some seriously low levels at times that rookie year but with warner it was Dead qb/team walking.

They will do the same this year if the record isn’t so bad but the vet qb and team are taking on water. 4–3 and mathematically alive won’t make a difference if Eli is showing signs of trouble.
RE: Disagree  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/8/2019 9:07 pm : link
In comment 14467173 trueblueinpw said:
Quote:
It’s a nice thought but...If the the Giants drop out of the playoffs before 8 games then Jones is in and then no one really is going to expect much. Shurmur has three years, at least.


I took O'Hara's comment differently. Like - Eli's leash is much shorter than it has been and if he doesn't win Jones might be replacing him forthwith.

Just my take.
Wow, huge revelation there Shaun.  
Big Blue '56 : 6/8/2019 9:15 pm : link
Even a casual fan would assume that..
Having a rookie QB  
uther99 : 6/8/2019 9:17 pm : link
deflects heat. Hey have at least 2019 and 2020. If Jones plays bad 2021, then it gets hot.
RE: Not to single out one innocuous line in the article  
Diversify yo bonds : 6/8/2019 9:19 pm : link
In comment 14467175 djm said:
Quote:
But I’ve seen and heard this line a lot lately and it’s sort of revisionist to suggest that the 2004 giants, 5-4 under warner, were punting on a playoff shot by inserting the rookie Eli Manning. That team at 5-4 was done. Under warner the ol pass blocking issues were exasperated. At least Eli got rid of the ball quick. Eli did sink to some seriously low levels at times that rookie year but with warner it was Dead qb/team walking.



Completely agree. I have also heard this revisionist talking point regurgitated in the media.

Warner was still shell shocked. He was holding the ball forever and taking lots of hits. There were legitimate football reasons to bench Kurt.

It was a few years before he regained form and lit it up with Arizona and Fitz/Boldin. Remember he was Leinarts caddy initially.
While Shurmur is the HC and the buck has to stop with him,  
Diver_Down : 6/8/2019 9:23 pm : link
he will earn a pass with Jones. Bettcher on the other hand must feel the immediate heat this season. FA and the draft catered to getting Bettcher his boys. Not expecting the 85 Bears, but there should be no tolerance for a bottom performing unit. Last year the excuse was that he had no talent to execute his defense. Well, these are all his guys. If he can't get them to perform, then a new DC needs to be brought in who can.
Good  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 6/8/2019 9:25 pm : link
Since winning the last two SBs the way we did, Giants have gotten a sense of entitlement, wasting roster spots on mascots, keeping around terrible FO choices, maybe even throttling back early on in a season. Like they are completely clueless and don't realize this is a brutally cut throat competitive league where you have to completely go nonstop balls out all the time and in every way to win.
I find it hard to believe that's true,  
81_Great_Dane : 6/8/2019 9:27 pm : link
given how young the team will be and how many new guys are on the roster. I think a slow start and a fast finish is likely. But if Eli's at QB and the team isn't better, that's bad. "Better" could be 7-8 wins. 5 or 6 is going to be a problem, even if Jones is the QB for most of the season.
I disagree .  
King Quis : 6/8/2019 9:30 pm : link
O’Hara is doing only doing what’s instinctual, protecting his quarterback. If we are honest here the team is in flux and it’s mainly due to the uncertainties surrounding our captain. It’s the elephant in the room and until that’s situated everything else takes a back seat.
House cleaning is what they've done ...  
Manny in CA : 6/8/2019 11:48 pm : link

OBJ, Snacks, Vernon, Collins, Kennard and Flowers, Apple, Richburg,, Pugh, JPP, Okwara, - they're all just memories ...

Al lot of "what ifs" if things don't get better (especially if the vet re-treads, mostly from the Browns don't perform). Gettleman caught flack when he signed Omameh and Steward but nothing like the hell he will catch if this happens.

It's the BROWNS (traditional Siberia) that these guys came from !

I don't see Eli thinking of himself as some kind of 11th hour savior. Everybody knows the team is in rebuild mode. Pressure is one the brass .
RE: While Shurmur is the HC and the buck has to stop with him,  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/8/2019 11:57 pm : link
In comment 14467184 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
he will earn a pass with Jones. Bettcher on the other hand must feel the immediate heat this season. FA and the draft catered to getting Bettcher his boys. Not expecting the 85 Bears, but there should be no tolerance for a bottom performing unit. Last year the excuse was that he had no talent to execute his defense. Well, these are all his guys. If he can't get them to perform, then a new DC needs to be brought in who can.


They got him a second year safety, a 36 year old safety, a veteran pass rusher coming off a bum knee, and a bunch of rookies. Let's chill out.
Right on, Hammer ...  
Manny in CA : 6/9/2019 12:47 am : link

Remember "the future is now" George Allen, he went to the extreme trading all his draft picks for veterans (at least most of them).

He brought a lot of his old LA Rams with him. I recall the team was humorously called the Washington Rams !

This Giants team has a good selection of vets who may have "one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel". The rest are many guys who've never set foot on an NFL field.

It could get ugly this year. The hope is that the young guys shine.

all I want is for it to not be impossible  
Karl Hungus : 6/9/2019 4:47 am : link
For me to give my tickets away in December.
There is a difference between pressure and heat  
UberAlias : 6/9/2019 4:51 am : link
I would say they are under a lot of pressure but I don’t think they’re feeling heat. Another 3-5 win season, sure. But I don’t sense the heat just yet.
RE: House cleaning is what they've done ...  
Breaker : 6/9/2019 5:55 am : link
In comment 14467229 Manny in CA said:
Quote:

OBJ, Snacks, Vernon, Collins, Kennard and Flowers, Apple, Richburg,, Pugh, JPP, Okwara, - they're all just memories ...

Al lot of "what ifs" if things don't get better (especially if the vet re-treads, mostly from the Browns don't perform). Gettleman caught flack when he signed Omameh and Steward but nothing like the hell he will catch if this happens.

Totally agree. I'm more patient than media etc but we do need to see progress this year especially in first half of year. Get it that roster has turned over but if these draft picks last year and this year are what we think, team needs begin showing on field regardless of gelling period.

I think they need to be 9-7 or a competitive 8-8 to keep the heat off. I think they can be 9-7 if they stay healthy given one of softer schedules in the league.

It's the BROWNS (traditional Siberia) that these guys came from !

I don't see Eli thinking of himself as some kind of 11th hour savior. Everybody knows the team is in rebuild mode. Pressure is one the brass .
Of couse, Eli is feeling the heat...he does not want to go out  
George from PA : 6/9/2019 6:03 am : link
A loser. He has one last chance.

Team might not be ready on all sides, but the OL should be better...the wrs seperate and he had arguably the best RB in football.

The offense can and should do some.damage....if Eli steps up.

Beating Dallas, would be a great start
Yeah I have no idea what the pulse of the locker room is like  
ron mexico : 6/9/2019 6:37 am : link
But I can't see them not giving shurmur and DG at least the 2020 season to get a full run with jones.

I think the pulse is  
mdthedream : 6/9/2019 7:01 am : link
we have Barkley and a very good O-line if we give him the ball we always have a chance to win. The Giants have a great weapon that wasn't used last year until like week 5 it was to late. He is the key to the team winning. Eli is fine but I do think it should be Jones but Eli can still win games. Hopefully they have fixed the secondary and this team could surprise teams this year.
RE: I think the pulse is  
Optimus-NY : 6/9/2019 7:56 am : link
In comment 14467259 mdthedream said:
Quote:
we have Barkley and a very good O-line if we give him the ball we always have a chance to win. The Giants have a great weapon that wasn't used last year until like week 5 it was to late. He is the key to the team winning. Eli is fine but I do think it should be Jones but Eli can still win games. Hopefully they have fixed the secondary and this team could surprise teams this year.


Very good O-Line? Based on what?
RE: RE: I think the pulse is  
Klaatu : 6/9/2019 8:06 am : link
In comment 14467267 Optimus-NY said:
Quote:
In comment 14467259 mdthedream said:


Quote:


we have Barkley and a very good O-line if we give him the ball we always have a chance to win. The Giants have a great weapon that wasn't used last year until like week 5 it was to late. He is the key to the team winning. Eli is fine but I do think it should be Jones but Eli can still win games. Hopefully they have fixed the secondary and this team could surprise teams this year.



Very good O-Line? Based on what?


Based on this.
RE: Good.  
joeinpa : 6/9/2019 8:33 am : link
In comment 14467171 ELI THE GOAT said:
Quote:
Like they should. I'm sick of the Giants season being over by Week 6. I'm not expecting a Super Bowl this year, but AT LEAST give us meaningful games again.


Absolutely. But my take is different. Because of the young quarterback all games will be meaningful.
Players who are not at the top of the depth chart always  
Marty in Albany : 6/9/2019 8:37 am : link
have to worry about being replaced. But this year is different.

When starters who are outstandingly talented like OBJ, Snacks, Vernon, Collins, etc., get replaced, then all the remaining starters on the team realize that they could be next.
it's not all about W's  
fkap : 6/9/2019 9:01 am : link
This regime has to show they are heading in the right direction. It can't be year after year of sucking and saying wait til next year.

If they lose, but the youngsters show promise, if the concepts are being grasped, then the coaches/team gets a pass. If they lose and everything looks a mess, folks are going to feel some heat.

The regime needs to show a foundation for the future. That includes while Eli is QB. The team is more than just a QB
RE: Not to single out one innocuous line in the article  
Jon C. in MD : 6/9/2019 9:08 am : link
In comment 14467175 djm said:
Quote:
But I’ve seen and heard this line a lot lately and it’s sort of revisionist to suggest that the 2004 giants, 5-4 under warner, were punting on a playoff shot by inserting the rookie Eli Manning. That team at 5-4 was done. Under warner the ol pass blocking issues were exasperated. At least Eli got rid of the ball quick. Eli did sink to some seriously low levels at times that rookie year but with warner it was Dead qb/team walking.

They will do the same this year if the record isn’t so bad but the vet qb and team are taking on water. 4–3 and mathematically alive won’t make a difference if Eli is showing signs of trouble.


I 100% agree. I was at Warner’s last game in Tempe to see the game against the Cardinals. I think that game was on in exactly one market - New York - since it did not sell out in Arizona and it was a crappy game that most of the country ignored. Warner was absolutely terrible and just stood in the pocket waiting to be sacked. The giants had gotten to 5-2 despite Warner’s mediocre play, and then lost 2 straight due to his really bad play in the next two games. They were going nowhere with Warner and were ready to get Manning some experience. I remember thinking that Eli looked much quicker and more decisive in the pocket. This revisionist/inaccurate history did not start this year; it was a false narrative during the 2004 season too.
RE: it's not all about W's  
Bobby Humphrey's Earpad : 6/9/2019 9:20 am : link
In comment 14467280 fkap said:
Quote:
This regime has to show they are heading in the right direction. It can't be year after year of sucking and saying wait til next year.

If they lose, but the youngsters show promise, if the concepts are being grasped, then the coaches/team gets a pass. If they lose and everything looks a mess, folks are going to feel some heat.

The regime needs to show a foundation for the future. That includes while Eli is QB. The team is more than just a QB


I agree - it's about re-establishing the identity of the franchise: run the ball, toughness upfront and top defense.
Klaatu  
Angus : 6/9/2019 10:01 am : link
Cracking me up.
RE: Yeah I have no idea what the pulse of the locker room is like  
jcn56 : 6/9/2019 10:07 am : link
In comment 14467257 ron mexico said:
Quote:
But I can't see them not giving shurmur and DG at least the 2020 season to get a full run with jones.


Ditto. Which isn't to imply there isn't pressure to perform, but barring some sort of McAdoo type meltdown does anyone believe that Shumur would get the ax this year?

I'm in fkap's camp - improvement is what we need to see. Even if not a winning season, to at least see some semblance of a core of a winning team taking root in their play. That has been absent up until now.
"Started 0-2 in 5 of the last 6 seasons..."  
Jimmy Googs : 6/9/2019 10:35 am : link
Says it all right there...this team has not been ready to play its competition when the real bullets start flying.

And this is a function of everybody involved from front office to coaches and the players.

maybe preseason game strategies need to be re-thought...
RE: I disagree .  
Johnny5 : 6/9/2019 10:56 am : link
In comment 14467189 King Quis said:
Quote:
O’Hara is doing only doing what’s instinctual, protecting his quarterback. If we are honest here the team is in flux and it’s mainly due to the uncertainties surrounding our captain. It’s the elephant in the room and until that’s situated everything else takes a back seat.

Oh yes, absolutely right. I mean the team being in flux since 2012 has hardly nothing to with garbage OL and 10 years of shitty drafting. It's mostly about Eli.
RE:  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/9/2019 11:32 am : link
In comment 14467336 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
Says it all right there...this team has not been ready to play its competition when the real bullets start flying.

And this is a function of everybody involved from front office to coaches and the players.

maybe preseason game strategies need to be re-thought...


We have also opened with the Cowboys almost every year which have been a much better team than us. We just haven't been that good.
They damned well should feel the heat  
Greg from LI : 6/9/2019 1:07 pm : link
Virtually everything about this franchise after January 2012 has been disgraceful
RE: RE: I disagree .  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/9/2019 2:13 pm : link
In comment 14467350 Johnny5 said:
Quote:
In comment 14467189 King Quis said:


Quote:


O’Hara is doing only doing what’s instinctual, protecting his quarterback. If we are honest here the team is in flux and it’s mainly due to the uncertainties surrounding our captain. It’s the elephant in the room and until that’s situated everything else takes a back seat.


Oh yes, absolutely right. I mean the team being in flux since 2012 has hardly nothing to with garbage OL and 10 years of shitty drafting. It's mostly about Eli.


I can't speak for King Quis, but I don't think he said it's all or mostly Eli's fault for all that's transpired sine Jan 2012.

Just since Jan 2017, the entire starting OL and DL have been overturned. Every single one! The team's 5 biggest stars NOT counting Eli were discarded: OBJ, JPP, Snacks, OV, and Landon Collins.

So at this point in time, Eli is in fact "the elephant in the room." I can't disagree with that really.
WOW,  
MarkT : 6/9/2019 2:59 pm : link
"Since winning the last two SBs the way we did, Giants have gotten a sense of entitlement, wasting roster spots on mascots, keeping around terrible FO choices, maybe even throttling back early on in a season. Like they are completely clueless and don't realize this is a brutally cut throat competitive league where you have to completely go nonstop balls out all the time and in every way to win."

That's a lot of horse shit stacked up...
Week one  
rocco8112 : 6/9/2019 4:33 pm : link
is huge for this team. A loss and week two is the season. Drop to 0 - 2 and it will be all she wrote before Halloween again.
RE: Right on, Hammer ...  
OC2.0 : 6/10/2019 6:20 pm : link
In comment 14467236 Manny in CA said:
Quote:

Remember "the future is now" George Allen, he went to the extreme trading all his draft picks for veterans (at least most of them).

He brought a lot of his old LA Rams with him. I recall the team was humorously called the Washington Rams !

This Giants team has a good selection of vets who may have "one foot in the grave and the other on a banana peel". The rest are many guys who've never set foot on an NFL field.

It could get ugly this year. The hope is that the young guys shine.
AS opposed to all the stellar yrs we've had since the last SB?
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