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The Daniel Jones Show: Seeing the Pick Through a Giant Lens

BSIMatt : 6/10/2019 10:29 am
Link to big blue banter podcast, 76 minutes devoted to breaking down Daniel Jones and how his traits fit Shurmur's offense going forward.
The Daniel Jones Show: Seeing the Pick Through a Giant Lens - ( New Window )
that was a good listen  
ron mexico : 6/10/2019 12:29 pm : link
really like those guys

I liked the first half where they were  
gidiefor : Mod : 6/10/2019 3:24 pm : link
evaluating Jones's traits --- the Q & A has a sleeper
I still don't see it...  
Jimmy Googs : 6/10/2019 3:26 pm : link
This was an excellent podcast.  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/10/2019 4:21 pm : link
.
Does that big lens  
Pete in MD : 6/10/2019 4:41 pm : link
have a bullet hole in it?
Thank you for posting.  
Daniel in Kentucky : 6/10/2019 5:47 pm : link
Just subscribed on YouTube on my Xbox One.
I wish ESPN would do this instead of the mindless opinionated banter.
Actual analysis with detail and rational perspective.

Thanks again.
Worth noting perhaps, that even with all the positive  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/10/2019 9:55 pm : link
notes on how Jones fits what Shurmur wants to do and have at QB, neither Turchyn nor Schnier felt Jones merited the #6 selection - both had him around 40-45 overall among all 2019 draft prospects. They both see significant weaknesses in Jones game.

Turchyn thinks Jones struggles processing when the #1 target indicated by the pre-snap read isn't open ie when the defense adjusts with the snap to something other than what was seen pre-snap.

Very detailed and informative listen, thanks for the link.
RE: Worth noting perhaps, that even with all the positive  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/10/2019 10:05 pm : link
In comment 14468710 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
notes on how Jones fits what Shurmur wants to do and have at QB, neither Turchyn nor Schnier felt Jones merited the #6 selection - both had him around 40-45 overall among all 2019 draft prospects. They both see significant weaknesses in Jones game.

Turchyn thinks Jones struggles processing when the #1 target indicated by the pre-snap read isn't open ie when the defense adjusts with the snap to something other than what was seen pre-snap.

Very detailed and informative listen, thanks for the link.


But Shurmur's offense is extremely predicated on pre snap reads and getting the ball to the number one option. Drafting for fit is just as important than drafting on the overall player. The pats draft board is rumored to look very different than other teams for this reason.
Zeke - yes Turchyn especially spoke  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/11/2019 1:30 am : link
about that system fit and how it made Jones' overall ranking irrelevant to his draft slot and value to the Giants and PS.
RE: Worth noting perhaps, that even with all the positive  
Leg of Theismann : 6/11/2019 3:25 am : link
In comment 14468710 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
notes on how Jones fits what Shurmur wants to do and have at QB, neither Turchyn nor Schnier felt Jones merited the #6 selection - both had him around 40-45 overall among all 2019 draft prospects. They both see significant weaknesses in Jones game.

Turchyn thinks Jones struggles processing when the #1 target indicated by the pre-snap read isn't open ie when the defense adjusts with the snap to something other than what was seen pre-snap.

Very detailed and informative listen, thanks for the link.


The thing that worries me is that Jones rarely had enough time to look to his 2nd option because his o-line was not good. So we don't have a great picture of his processing skills. This is the problem when you draft based on things like "oh he had poor stats but that's because the talent around him is poor, therefore we can extrapolate how good he will be if he does have talent around him". We honestly have no way of knowing how he would perform with talent around him. Everyone knocked Haskins for having all day to throw and NFL receivers running routes for him as a reason why he might be overrated. But at least we KNOW that if you put a team around him he can be very successful. Do we know that for a fact with Jones? Let me ask you this: if Jones played at Ohio St. would he have thrown 50 TDs last year? There have been a lot of great teams in the Big Ten over the years, but no one in the history of the conference has thrown 50 TDs in a season (not even Drew Brees) so I'm not so sure Jones would have accomplished that. IDK, post-snap processing is, IMO, the most important trait of an NFL QB and it often separates the good from the great. It's the player trait that makes the difference between a good college player and a good NFL player. And it's not something any wonderlic or interview can prove or show, it's something you can only see on tape in an actual game. If Jones doesn't have that I think we're screwed.
I donít think the team is drafting Jones or Haskins based on statistic  
BSIMatt : 6/11/2019 8:04 am : link
I think thatís something fans do, not the teams drafting. Statistics can be extremely deceiving with quarterbacks, they can throw screen passes to fantastic athletes that take it to the house. Or they can make a perfect throw for a surefire touchdown only to have it slide through the receivers hands. More importantly they have to watch the players in the context of their offenses, what were they being asked to do and how well they performed their jobs given their circumstances.
I actually like Haskins until all the red flags popped up  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 8:58 am : link
and it became clear he isn't really a fit for what Shurmur wants to do. That being said Haskins is never going to play with the talent differential he had at OSU.
I have no doubt that Jones  
section125 : 6/11/2019 9:12 am : link
was rated higher than 40-45 on every team's board. I have no doubt that he was not rated above 10 on any team's board(including the Giants). But there was no way Jones was making it out of the 1st round even if the Giants did not draft him. Somebody would have.
It will be intriguing to see how Jones plays with a better line than he had in college and with better receivers.
RE: I actually like Haskins until all the red flags popped up  
BSIMatt : 6/11/2019 9:57 am : link
In comment 14469034 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
and it became clear he isn't really a fit for what Shurmur wants to do. That being said Haskins is never going to play with the talent differential he had at OSU.


I was actually pretty high on Haskins as well, to the point of defending him against the talent advantage/mobility arguments a bit. I wanted it to be the case where there was a quarterback that fit the Giants needs and they didn't have to punt to 2020.

However, when I was all high on Haskins, I had yet to really dig in on Jones. When you look at how Jones is valued, and what he had to deal with it does paint Haskins(and guys like Tua) in a different light.

Everyone loves Tua, but when you see him getting Dak Presscott level pass protection, not getting a hand laid on him, and then throwing it to Jeudy who is open by a good 5 yards(and oh this is against LSU who could possibly have the best secondary in the NCAA) and Jeudy just takes it to the house....it does make comparing the quarterbacks more difficult but also more interesting. You have to account for the impact(or lack of impact) of the players surrounding the quarterback. Tua looked a hell of a lot more human versus Clemson, so when the talent gap isn't so large for these "top level" quarterbacks they get a glimpse into the world Jones lived in at Duke for 3 seasons.
The other point in that podcast was the point made  
BSIMatt : 6/11/2019 10:00 am : link
About what the Giants selection of Jones really was telling you, and that it was telling you the importance they were placing on mobility. Mobility was a trait that certainly separated Haskins and Jones, I don't doubt it was a big factor in their valuation of Jones.
Both Denver and the Skins drafted quarterbacks, so their never  
Ira : 6/11/2019 10:16 am : link
going to admit that they really wanted Jones.
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