Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

NFT: Any lawyers can help me?

BestFeature : 6/10/2019 8:13 pm
Hello BBI, I come to you in need of help. A family friend of mine that I know almost 30 years (I'm only 32, so that should tell you something) is in a pickle. She lived in a building for almost 30 years and had a dog for the last 9 or 10. The landlord doesn't allow dogs but she was a quiet dog that they hid from him. It's a tiny Pekingese that doesn't cause any trouble or even bark.

Unfortunately, he found out about the dog recently and is threatening to get a lawyer and evict her if she doesn't get rid of the dog. My neighbor is about 60, her husband, unfortunately, a few years suffered a heart attack which resulted in brain damage. She's taking care of him by herself mostly and lives alone with the dog. It's breaking my heart that he's forcing her to get rid of the dog.

Also, he's had other tenants have dogs (his son did, the super did) and he rationalized it as "it lived there a long time". As opposed to what, 9 or 10 years? Her idea is to go to a psychiatrist and get a note that it's a support dog that helps her heal from what happened to her husband. Could that work? Does anyone know if she has any legal recourse? Thank you so much for your help!
when in doubt  
RasputinPrime : 6/10/2019 8:30 pm : link
...
Ask Arnie - ( New Window )
Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
BillT : 6/10/2019 8:31 pm : link
With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.
Talk to the Godfather  
JerseyCityJoe : 6/10/2019 8:46 pm : link
she might even get a rent decrease.
RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
BestFeature : 6/10/2019 9:04 pm : link
In comment 14468619 BillT said:
Quote:
With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.


Thanks, considering how strict NYC is with airbnb, I wonder if the laws are favorable. Though maybe that's a big stretch.
RE: RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
BillT : 6/10/2019 10:28 pm : link
In comment 14468660 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 14468619 BillT said:


Quote:


With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.



Thanks, considering how strict NYC is with airbnb, I wonder if the laws are favorable. Though maybe that's a big stretch.

In general NYC courts are very tenant friendly but I donít know about pets.
RE: RE: RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
BestFeature : 6/10/2019 11:22 pm : link
In comment 14468745 BillT said:
Quote:
In comment 14468660 BestFeature said:


Quote:


In comment 14468619 BillT said:


Quote:


With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.



Thanks, considering how strict NYC is with airbnb, I wonder if the laws are favorable. Though maybe that's a big stretch.


In general NYC courts are very tenant friendly but I donít know about pets.


Thanks for the tip.
Tell her to fight  
pjcas18 : 6/10/2019 11:28 pm : link
it in court as long as she can.

If the dog is at least 9 or 10 years old it will probably die before it gets adjudicated.

I say this not to be flippant, but as a dog person, someone who would rather be around dogs than most people, but reality is most dogs aren't going to live much longer than that. Without knowing the breed, average life expectancy for dogs in general is 10 - 12 years.

She can try the emotional support dog thing, worst case to buy some time.
I prefer dogs to people too...  
Chris in Philly : 6/10/2019 11:30 pm : link
but why would you get a dog when you live in a place that doesnít allow dogs?
RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
madgiantscow009 : 6/10/2019 11:44 pm : link
In comment 14468619 BillT said:
Quote:
With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.


you can't discriminate against a person with a support animal. You can register it on-line and you can even get a doctors note for a plane or apartment.

Seems shady to do it that way but worth a shot.
RE: RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
BestFeature : 6/11/2019 12:21 am : link
In comment 14468863 madgiantscow009 said:
Quote:
In comment 14468619 BillT said:


Quote:


With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.



you can't discriminate against a person with a support animal. You can register it on-line and you can even get a doctors note for a plane or apartment.

Seems shady to do it that way but worth a shot.


Not sure if it's shady, the dog is an important part of her well-being.
.  
Padiwan15 : 6/11/2019 7:12 am : link
.
Link - ( New Window )
RE: .  
BestFeature : 6/11/2019 7:50 am : link
In comment 14468947 Padiwan15 said:
Quote:
. Link - ( New Window )


Thank you!
She should offer to pay extra for the dog  
Vanzetti : 6/11/2019 3:17 pm : link
She is in violation of her lease. The service dog angle might work if the judge is a nutty dog owner. But otherwise she is going to lose.
RE: RE: RE: Nowadays the support dog thing seems to have some pull  
Vanzetti : 6/11/2019 3:20 pm : link
In comment 14468879 BestFeature said:
Quote:
In comment 14468863 madgiantscow009 said:


Quote:


In comment 14468619 BillT said:


Quote:


With a try. Hard to know about the legal aspects without seeing the lease. The landlord tenant courts can be friendly to tenants depending on the state so you can always try and plead your case there.



you can't discriminate against a person with a support animal. You can register it on-line and you can even get a doctors note for a plane or apartment.

Seems shady to do it that way but worth a shot.



Not sure if it's shady, the dog is an important part of her well-being.


Then she should have rented an apt that allowed dogs. If you get a dog when you know it's against the lease, I have zero sympathy. Especially stupid when you have longterm apt where the landlord is probably dying to get you out so he can rerent at a much higher price.
Well isn't there precedence for other people  
Jim in Forest Hills : 6/11/2019 3:22 pm : link
having dogs there? How do they do it if it's against the rules? If its because they are related to the super that won't fly in court.
Edit  
Jim in Forest Hills : 6/11/2019 3:22 pm : link
related to the landlord.
Trying to reconcile your OP and the article that was linked  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 3:30 pm : link
you specifically said that she hid the dog. So, it doesn't seem like she would qualify. Also, he "hiding" part would seem (to me) contradictory to the service animal argument.
RE: Well isn't there precedence for other people  
Scyber : 6/12/2019 7:17 am : link
In comment 14469586 Jim in Forest Hills said:
Quote:
having dogs there? How do they do it if it's against the rules? If its because they are related to the super that won't fly in court.



It is possible those other tenants were allowed pets due to their leases (with a possibly higher security deposit or pef fee). I don't think it's uncommon to have customized leases for individual tenants. I know every lease I ever had was altered based on negotiations.
I understand..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/12/2019 8:50 am : link
the dilemma, but you see so often today where people feel the rules don't apply to them and when they get called on it, they want justification for not following the rules.

It isn't like this is a new rule - the woman knowingly has a dog and actively has hid it.

I'm not sure  
Pete in MD : 6/12/2019 9:37 am : link
if it's the "right" thing to do but the service animal angle would probably work (if she could get the declaration back-dated by the doctor that would be even better.) Then she could file a fair housing complaint. Denial of service animals even with a no-pet policy is a big no-no. The landlord would probably back-off at that point. No landlord wants to get involved in a fair housing issue.
RUDE.  
x meadowlander : 6/13/2019 9:27 am : link
If it's no Pets, it means NO FUCKING PETS.

I'm with the landlord on this.

I can see the angle or rules are rules  
BestFeature : 6/13/2019 9:44 am : link
And maybe I'm being blinded by my loyalty to her but I guess I'm more libertarian in my way of thinking. I always thought that "rules are rules" is a very authoritarian way of looking of things. Is the spirit of rules being violated? I mean, this isn't a Pitbull (sp?) here. It's a tiny dog that doesn't even friggin bark.

Also, yes other people might have had customized leases that allowed them to have dogs but if that's the case it was based on nepotism (son of the landlord, super). Furthermore that wasn't the landlord's response when asked why he allowed them to have dogs it was "they lived here a long time". And this dog has lived there a long time too!

I guess I just don't understand the way of thinking of not questioning rules ever. Not to go nuclear here but it's a variation from "it was my duty" argument that has caused a lot of evil in this world. Blindly following rules is what robots and animals do. Now as I said if it was a big dog causing problems it's a different story.
But..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/13/2019 9:47 am : link
this isn't a matter of questioning rules.

It is a matter of proactively disobeying the rules. It isn't like the woman challenged the rules before signing a lease. She bought a dog and hid it.

It isn't like we have some nefarious landlord - we actually have a deceitful tenant.

Not sure what a Libertarian take has to do with that, or the red herring of rules being too authoritative.
I should say "I was following orders" not "it was my duty"  
BestFeature : 6/13/2019 9:50 am : link
But that's kind of the same thing.
RE: But..  
BestFeature : 6/13/2019 9:52 am : link
In comment 14470981 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
this isn't a matter of questioning rules.

It is a matter of proactively disobeying the rules. It isn't like the woman challenged the rules before signing a lease. She bought a dog and hid it.

It isn't like we have some nefarious landlord - we actually have a deceitful tenant.

Not sure what a Libertarian take has to do with that, or the red herring of rules being too authoritative.


My point is it didn't violate the spirit of the rules. Literally, as far as I know the nothing material would have changed to the landlord if the dog didn't live there in the last 10 years. And as I said, others have broken the rules and "different lease" is just conjecture and NOT what the landlord sited when questioned. More likely nepotism.
If it..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/13/2019 9:58 am : link
didn't violate "the spirit of the rules", why hide the dog?

And I'm pretty sure a rule saying no dogs is broken "in spirit" of having a dog.

But yeah, this sounds like a situation that if followed could lead to widespread oppression and an authoritarian state....
RE: I can see the angle or rules are rules  
x meadowlander : 6/13/2019 10:25 am : link
In comment 14470978 BestFeature said:
Quote:
"...It's a tiny dog that doesn't even friggin bark..."
It isn't about 'barking' or it would be 'No Dogs', not 'No Pets'. Does 'tiny dog' piss? In my experience, those little mutts are high-strung, nervous and piss a little at the drop of a hat. I've been in CLEAN houses that STINK OF PISS from little dogs like that.

Dogs and Cats will pollute the house with allergens too - people with sensitivities may not notice when they move into their rental, but a couple of months later, they'll be venting the hell out of the place and deep-cleaning floorboards trying to get the dander out.
it's a 'No Pets' policy  
giants#1 : 6/13/2019 10:41 am : link
how does having a dog not violate the "spirit of the rule"? Seems the spirit of the rule is to prevent pets...

And like xmeadow stated, it's not just barking or the inherent danger to others that's at issue. Dogs can piss/shit and generally destroy the apts. That's why apts that allow dogs typically charge an extra pet fee which is likely used for a thorough cleaning of the place after the tenant leaves.

Plus, those allergic to dogs may choose that apt complex because of their No Pets policy, but because they lady knowingly ignored the rule they now have to put up with dog fur in any common areas the dog goes.
My brother bought a new house...  
x meadowlander : 6/13/2019 10:57 am : link
...beautiful place out in Cranford, NJ. Place was pristine first time we stayed over. My wife's pet allergies kicked up the first night there. Though the floors had been refinished and place repainted, it still had a minor smell of dog to it.

My wife's not overly allergic to dogs, so this was a surprise to us.

And it highlighted how that shit stays behind, buried deep in floorboards.
Firstly (or maybe ten or twentiethly),  
Bill L : 6/13/2019 11:15 am : link
Not following rules is not Libertarianism. Also, we are not talking about gov't here, we are talking about private property. Of course there are rules. And, I am not sure what to say about the leap from tiny dog to Nuremburg....
Back to the Corner