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Pat Shurmur - "You never know what is going to happen."

ZogZerg : 6/11/2019 11:53 am
When Asked if there is a scenario Jones could start Week 1.
Regarding the QBs. Let the fireworks begin!

I'm sure that will be a headline.


Quote:


Jordan Raanan
& #10004;
@JordanRaanan

Coach Pat Shurmur: Eli Manning is getting ready to have an outstanding year. Daniel Jones is getting ready to play Week 1.

Asked if there is a scenario Jones could start Week 1: "You never know what is going to happen."

Shurmur says he is "constantly" weighing Eli against Jones and deciding who gives team the best chance to win (which is the stated barometer for who starts).



Quote:


Paul Schwartz
& #10004;
@NYPost_Schwartz

Shurmur repeated his stance that Jones "is getting ready to play week 1.''
Also said Eli is the starter now.
Could this pecking order change?
"You never know,'' Shurmur said.


Quote:


Tom Rock
& #10004;
@TomRock_Newsday

As offseason program closes, Pat Shurmur seems to set the stage for a quarterback competition in training camp between Eli Manning and Daniel Jones.



Quote:


Tom Rock
& #10004;
@TomRock_Newsday
Replying to @TomRock_Newsday

"He's on track with the goal to be ready to play on Day 1," Shurmur said of Jones. "The QB stuff will be on the front burner for everybody. I get that. But he's on track."


If Jones..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/11/2019 11:55 am : link
is ready to be the Day 1 starter, Eli absolutely has to be cut.
Wow.....could this be misdirection to appease the bench  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 11:58 am : link
Eli at all costs crowd or are we having a real live QB competition? I can't think of any other circumstances where these comments make sense.
Yeh you can't have Eli on the bench if Jones is starting.  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 11:58 am : link
.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 11:59 am : link

Ryan Dunleavy
‏Verified account @rydunleavy
6m6 minutes ago

My interpretation of Pat Shurmur's comments: He wants Jones to be ready to play Week 1 just in case. Stay hungry. He would love him to be so good that he has a rethink his current path. But Eli Manning is the starter now and will be Week 1 barring some drastic change. #giants
Shurmur seems to be sending mixed signals  
ZogZerg : 6/11/2019 11:59 am : link
Quote:


Tom Rock

@TomRock_Newsday
Replying to @TomRock_Newsday

"I donít want to be cryptic... The players who give our team the best chance to win play. Period. Weíve seen Eli do that for a very long time, so weíll see what happens as we go down the road."



Quote:


Tom Rock

@TomRock_Newsday
Replying to @TomRock_Newsday

We feel good where Eli is, he's our starting quarterback, and we've got a young player that we think is going to be an outstanding player getting himself ready to play."



Training camp will be exciting.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 12:00 pm : link

Jordan Raanan
‏Verified account @JordanRaanan
19m19 minutes ago

Jordan Raanan Retweeted Jordan Raanan

My interpretation: Eli Manning is the starter. Heís the starter Week 1. Shurmur just wants Jones to get ready and prepare so that if something happened or heís needed, heís ready Week 1.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 12:00 pm : link

GiantsWFAN
‏ @giantswfan
31m31 minutes ago

#Giants #Shurmur - Jones "done a good job of getting up to speed with all of the things that go on at the line of scrimmage.".."Eli is our starting QB."...Coach says he's not interested with playing with sementics (from inquisitors trying to manufacture a QB competition).
I really respect Shurmur.  
yatqb : 6/11/2019 12:00 pm : link
Heís a straight shooter. And heís going to do whatever is best for the team. I really like the answer he gave there. Heís preparing everyone, Eli included, for the changing of the guard thatís coming at some point.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 12:01 pm : link

Art Stapleton
‏Verified account @art_stapleton
21s22 seconds ago

Pat Shurmur on a slippery slope when discussing QB situation. Eli Manning is starting QB, and my sense is that he believes the best way to get the best out of Daniel Jones is by not designating him as the backup. Plus, as he said today: "You never know what is going to happen."


Art Stapleton
‏Verified account @art_stapleton
20s21 seconds ago

Saying that publicly, of course, will lend credence to the idea that this will be an open competition between Manning and Jones to start Week 1.
I don't believe Shurmur and the Giants see it that way, at least not on June 11.
Wow. Not shying away from a QB controversy at all  
Heisenberg : 6/11/2019 12:01 pm : link
.
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 12:02 pm : link

Dan Duggan
‏Verified account @DDuggan21
11s12 seconds ago

There's no benefit to declaring Jones the backup today. But Eli took every first-team rep this spring. Until that changes, nothing to see here. There's ~25 training camp practices and 4 preseason games. I just don't see how Jones goes from where he is today to starting Week 1.
If Eli breaks both legs  
since1925 : 6/11/2019 12:02 pm : link
Jones could be in there game #1.
RE: If Jones..  
Jay on the Island : 6/11/2019 12:03 pm : link
In comment 14469240 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
is ready to be the Day 1 starter, Eli absolutely has to be cut.

How much cap room would the Giants save by cutting Eli before the season? I'm not suggesting they will but that's something to consider being that they can carry over cap room so if Jones is the best option it makes sense for next year to create more cap room on next years cap.
I agree with Art Stapleton's comments.....I think they are  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 12:04 pm : link
trying to lend credence this is going to be a competition. I just don't see Eli not starting week 1 unless he gets hurt.
I think they should have committed to Jones right away  
moespree : 6/11/2019 12:04 pm : link
I trust what people like Aikman, Favre, Young, Moon and others who played the position as Hall of Famers have said. They all said at one time or another, they learned next to nothing by sitting. It wasn't until being thrown out there did they learn about NFL defenses, the speed, and how to self correct their own mistakes. They are all open advocates for playing a young QB ASAP. I think even Eli himself has stated how playing the final few weeks of the 2004 season helped him immensely. They might as well just commit to Jones.
Jay its like 12 million I believe, but we would need to sign a vet  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 12:05 pm : link
backup. So you are looking 3-4 million there.
Wow  
BSIMatt : 6/11/2019 12:05 pm : link
Different times in Giantsland.
RE: Jay its like 12 million I believe, but we would need to sign a vet  
Jay on the Island : 6/11/2019 12:07 pm : link
In comment 14469269 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
backup. So you are looking 3-4 million there.

Thanks, if they did make that move I don't think they would sign a veteran. I think Tanney would be the #2 QB. I don't think they would bring in a veteran this late unless there was an injury.
RE: Jay its like 12 million I believe, but we would need to sign a vet  
mfsd : 6/11/2019 12:08 pm : link
In comment 14469269 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
backup. So you are looking 3-4 million there.


Donít forget they seem to like Tanney as vet backup more than those of us on the outside do.

I donít think that plays out anyway, just spitballing
If he really is weighing who gives them the best chance to win  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 12:08 pm : link
and the thought is in his mind. We should really go with DJ and cut Eli.

I just don't think these comments are true and were manufactured. Shurmur knew he'd be getting this question a lot this offseason. These comments do a few things - put out there this is an open competition, that DJ is good enough to possibly supplant an established vet, and when Eli starts week 1 it will be because he was the best option to win them games. Until he can't and you bring in DJ with less pressure and expectation. Actually if you start him week 1 the expectations are going to be artificially high now.
RE: ...  
Ira : 6/11/2019 12:09 pm : link
In comment 14469260 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:

Dan Duggan
‏Verified account @DDuggan21
11s12 seconds ago

There's no benefit to declaring Jones the backup today. But Eli took every first-team rep this spring. Until that changes, nothing to see here. There's ~25 training camp practices and 4 preseason games. I just don't see how Jones goes from where he is today to starting Week 1.


This.
It does seem to indicate that Eli will not have a long rope  
Heisenberg : 6/11/2019 12:10 pm : link
this season. He better bring it, or he'll be finishing his run holding a clipboard. That's the message being sent, IMO.
Well, assuming Eli will be on a pitch count this summer  
The_Boss : 6/11/2019 12:11 pm : link
Jones certainly will have accumulated a good number of reps to feel OK about inserting him as QB1 should Eli indeed prove to be toast, as many feel throughout the league.
RE: If Eli breaks both legs  
Jay in Toronto : 6/11/2019 12:11 pm : link
In comment 14469261 since1925 said:
Quote:
Jones could be in there game #1.


You mean if he only breaks one leg he could still escape the rush with his good leg?
I wouldn't be surprised to see disagreement within the organization  
UberAlias : 6/11/2019 12:11 pm : link
Mara probably has a strong desire to see Eli off on a high note with Shurmur motivated simply to win football games.
Already latest Headline at Pro Football Talk...  
ZogZerg : 6/11/2019 12:12 pm : link
Quote:

......Itís easy to interpret that as the opening of a competition between the veteran who has led the Giants to two Super Bowls and the first-round pick, but Shurmur knows what leaving room for interpretation means.

ďIím not trying to be cryptic about it,Ē Shurmur said. ďIt is what I said it is. Eli is getting ready to have an outstanding year and Daniel is getting ready to play. Thatís really about it.Ē

When it was mentioned that both things canít be true at once, Shurmur replied: ďHave at it, I guess.Ē

Pat Shurmur says Giants will ďplay the very best playerĒ at QB - ( New Window )
RE: Already latest Headline at Pro Football Talk...  
Jay on the Island : 6/11/2019 12:16 pm : link
In comment 14469286 ZogZerg said:
Quote:


Quote:



......Itís easy to interpret that as the opening of a competition between the veteran who has led the Giants to two Super Bowls and the first-round pick, but Shurmur knows what leaving room for interpretation means.

ďIím not trying to be cryptic about it,Ē Shurmur said. ďIt is what I said it is. Eli is getting ready to have an outstanding year and Daniel is getting ready to play. Thatís really about it.Ē

When it was mentioned that both things canít be true at once, Shurmur replied: ďHave at it, I guess.Ē


Pat Shurmur says Giants will ďplay the very best playerĒ at QB - ( New Window )

It wasn't written by Florio so there were no shots taken at the Giants for a change.
interesting development  
ron mexico : 6/11/2019 12:26 pm : link
but until they start they start moving toward an even split of the first team reps, I don't buy that DJ will be in the running to start week 1
C'mon  
Thegratefulhead : 6/11/2019 12:33 pm : link
When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca. When you take a QB at 6, if he gives you any hint of promise(Jones has so far) the team that drafted him will look for any reason to possibly start him sooner rather than later. This would be good for the franchise but not so great for Eli. I expect Jones to improve. Going to say it now. Jones will be the day one starter. He is going to beat Eli out in this system if given a fair chance. If this was Gilbride's system, Eli wins hands down and it probably takes Jones a year or 2 to catch up. Shurmur's system needs someone athletic, that will make the correct first read and deliver the ball on time with accuracy and touch on short to intermediate routes. Jones will not be the better QB week 1 but he will be a better fit. I think this will become blatantly obvious over the next few months. Shurmur's comment is to prepare us all for what may come. The number 6 pick in the NFL draft gets to compete for a starting position. We know it and Eli's knows it.
I think Shurmur is gradually preparing  
Gap92 : 6/11/2019 12:34 pm : link
the media and fans for the post-Eli era with comments like this so that, when the inevitable happens and Jones supplants Eli, it won't be this huge emotional ordeal for the team and blow up in his face. He's laying the groundwork for it now with these now-regular comments, and he's also making it about football and performance rather than emotion and history. I think it's smart on his part. I also think, as others have pointed out, that he knows his ass is on the line and can't afford to take Ls with Eli if he feels they could be Ws with Jones.
This again??  
FatMan in Charlotte : 6/11/2019 12:35 pm : link
Quote:
When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca


Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.
Hereís the question, which the Giants may just not be ready to  
mfsd : 6/11/2019 12:35 pm : link
face/accept - itís reasonable Eli still gives them the best chance to win this year...but would getting Jones the experience this year give them the best chance to win in 2020?

The reality is, with jobs on the line plus the orgs desire to treat Eli right, they may not be willing to go there.

And Iíve been an Eli guy all along, but IMO this team is setting up well to be a contender in 2020 and beyond
*I don't think it will happen before Week 1  
Gap92 : 6/11/2019 12:36 pm : link
.
RE: Hereís the question, which the Giants may just not be ready to  
Thegratefulhead : 6/11/2019 12:38 pm : link
In comment 14469309 mfsd said:
Quote:
face/accept - itís reasonable Eli still gives them the best chance to win this year...but would getting Jones the experience this year give them the best chance to win in 2020?

The reality is, with jobs on the line plus the orgs desire to treat Eli right, they may not be willing to go there.

And Iíve been an Eli guy all along, but IMO this team is setting up well to be a contender in 2020 and beyond
Solid reasoning. Jones getting a year of experience in 2019 makes them better in 2020. Irrefutable.
It's no different than the President  
Bill in UT : 6/11/2019 12:41 pm : link
saying that all options are on the table. Doesn't mean anything
Shurmur is good at being non controversial in the media  
Heisenberg : 6/11/2019 12:42 pm : link
so the only conclusion is that he knew what he was doing with these comments and a message to both QBs is being sent intentionally.
Whether it is a true competition or not,  
smshmth8690 : 6/11/2019 12:42 pm : link
this is the first time Eli has ever had any competition for his spot. Comments may just be motivational.
If Jones starts,  
LS : 6/11/2019 12:45 pm : link
Eli is the veteran backup. The Giants aren't going to cut him to save money. A trade possibility may open up however.
RE: ...  
Klaatu : 6/11/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14469249 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:

Ryan Dunleavy
‏Verified account @rydunleavy
6m6 minutes ago

My interpretation of Pat Shurmur's comments: He wants Jones to be ready to play Week 1 just in case. Stay hungry. He would love him to be so good that he has a rethink his current path. But Eli Manning is the starter now and will be Week 1 barring some drastic change. #giants


I agree with Dunleavy's interpretation.
RE: This again??  
Thegratefulhead : 6/11/2019 12:46 pm : link
In comment 14469308 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca



Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.
It is meaningless filler and included speculation to the point I was making. I concede to any reservations you may have to that part of the post. Maybe my recollection is inaccurate on the minutia of the details, but I believe Eli is quoted as to being told they were going to draft a QB high in the draft, before the draft. This my reason for the inclusion, I accept it if that is not correct.
RE: RE: If Eli breaks both legs  
giants#1 : 6/11/2019 12:47 pm : link
In comment 14469284 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
In comment 14469261 since1925 said:


Quote:


Jones could be in there game #1.



You mean if he only breaks one leg he could still escape the rush with his good leg?


He probably wouldn't be much slower than he is with 2 good legs... :-D
It's fgoing to be interesting, because the last few years,  
barens : 6/11/2019 12:51 pm : link
Dallas' defense has been getting to Eli, if that trend continues, I wonder if Jones gets a shot.
I would be shocked if Jones doesn't start at some point in 2019  
Matt in SGS : 6/11/2019 1:03 pm : link
but I'd be more shocked if he is starting in Week 1.
Just to be clear (or at least as I see it)  
jvm52106 : 6/11/2019 1:05 pm : link
being ready to play week 1 could mean be ready to be the DRESSED back up QB. I would think Tanney is the guy who should really be reading the tea leaves here - for now.
RE: Just to be clear (or at least as I see it)  
jvm52106 : 6/11/2019 1:07 pm : link
In comment 14469358 jvm52106 said:
Quote:
being ready to play week 1 could mean be ready to be the DRESSED back up QB. I would think Tanney is the guy who should really be reading the tea leaves here - for now.


If Eli is the starter, Jones is the backup and Lauletta is given every chance to stick as the 3.
RE: If Jones..  
90.Cal : 6/11/2019 1:09 pm : link
In comment 14469240 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
is ready to be the Day 1 starter, Eli absolutely has to be cut.


Is there no value in DJ learning throughout the year with Eli right over his shoulder? I'll bet Eli would make a better QB coach than Shurmur ever could. Start him week 1 and have Eli assist him from the sidelines and on the practice field all year long. Study habits. Field vision. Play recognition. The list goes on as far as the things Eli could help DJ with.
RE: I wouldn't be surprised to see disagreement within the organization  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 1:12 pm : link
In comment 14469285 UberAlias said:
Quote:
Mara probably has a strong desire to see Eli off on a high note with Shurmur motivated simply to win football games.


If that's the case there is no way they would not end up in the same place.
RE: RE: If Eli breaks both legs  
Gatorade Dunk : 6/11/2019 1:13 pm : link
In comment 14469284 Jay in Toronto said:
Quote:
In comment 14469261 since1925 said:


Quote:


Jones could be in there game #1.



You mean if he only breaks one leg he could still escape the rush with his good leg?

He has a good leg?
RE: RE: This again??  
Gatorade Dunk : 6/11/2019 1:16 pm : link
In comment 14469332 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
In comment 14469308 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:




Quote:


When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca



Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.

It is meaningless filler and included speculation to the point I was making. I concede to any reservations you may have to that part of the post. Maybe my recollection is inaccurate on the minutia of the details, but I believe Eli is quoted as to being told they were going to draft a QB high in the draft, before the draft. This my reason for the inclusion, I accept it if that is not correct.

It sounds like your recollection of those events may include the probably fictional version told to us here by jt. I wouldn't consider that directional in any way.
I like it.  
Beezer : 6/11/2019 1:17 pm : link

As opposed to Eli being "officially" named the starting quarterback in early June, and a guy they think has very good potential being relegated as the #2.

I'm not saying Jones is better than Eli or a better option. But ... what if between now and the end of camp, it's clear that he is?

Then what, if you've already made your declaration?

I like what Shurmur is doing/saying right now.
It's too bad that nobody asks about Tanney (or Lauletta)  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 1:19 pm : link
I would be surprised if PS didn't respond by saying it's Tanney's (Lauletta's) job to get ready to play on week 1.
I completely expect Eli to be starting game #1  
PatersonPlank : 6/11/2019 1:21 pm : link
However I have come around to the conclusion that Shurmur and DG are not going to mess around, and that Eli's leash is much shorter than I assumed.
Shurmur's been gushing about Jones since Rookie minicamp  
Poktown Pete : 6/11/2019 1:33 pm : link
It seems kinda obvious to me that he wants Jones to be the guy now. I think this worm turns sooner than later.

If Eli isn't released when this happens, I still think he asks for his release. Just a hunch. Don't forget Eli called the shots about not playing for the Chargers, and voluntarily took a seat during the Gino Smith fiasco when no one asked him to. My guess is he'd just walk away, then wait to see if a team that really needs him calls at some point this season or next.

If I'm wrong, then it's about the money.
Is this Fireworks  
Alex_Webster : 6/11/2019 1:37 pm : link
Under the sheets? asking for a friend.
The stuff we're hearing now  
mittenedman : 6/11/2019 1:42 pm : link
is why Jones was such a great QB prospect. Unlike most of these kids coming out he's got an NFL game and was groomed to play in the pros.

Unreal how nobody cared, or gave him any credit for it. He's as NFL ready as anybody since Andrew Luck IMO.
Hard knocks here we come  
eli4life : 6/11/2019 1:45 pm : link
😂
If Eli is benched at some point this season  
RobCarpenter : 6/11/2019 1:59 pm : link
Would any team actually trade for him?

Personally I'm glad that Shurmur is saying that it's a competition, even if the reality is that Eli will be the starter.

My biggest fear isn't Eli starting in 2019. It's the Giants extending him. Hopefully Jones shows them enough so that that doesn't happen.
RE: The stuff we're hearing now  
Matt in SGS : 6/11/2019 2:02 pm : link
In comment 14469419 mittenedman said:
Quote:
is why Jones was such a great QB prospect. Unlike most of these kids coming out he's got an NFL game and was groomed to play in the pros.

Unreal how nobody cared, or gave him any credit for it. He's as NFL ready as anybody since Andrew Luck IMO.


One point on this. I think that Cutcliffe got him NFL ready in that he's mechanics are sound, he's been well coached, he understands running a more pro style offense. I don't think the question on Jones ever was if he would be ready to step in and play. The question is/was how high is his ceiling? That's the main crux of the shock at taking him at 6. You pick a QB at 6, you expect them to turn into a Pro Bowl/ Franchise QB. The knock on Jones was that he might turn out to be more of a "game manager" type QB who can run and offense but won't necessarily bring you to a championship level. Gettleman clearly doesn't agree with that. We will find out.

But also we need to realize that we are talking about him initially stepping in and outplaying the 38 year old version of Eli, not the 26 year old version of Eli. For this year, it's if he's better than Eli in the waning days of his career, he's going to play. Go forward, the question is will he be good enough to get this team to a Super Bowl (or 2).
Simple Math  
SgtDog : 6/11/2019 2:18 pm : link
[% Chance to Start] = (# of Reps Played With 1st Team / Total # of 1st Team Reps) * 100
RE: Simple Math  
ron mexico : 6/11/2019 2:25 pm : link
In comment 14469479 SgtDog said:
Quote:
[% Chance to Start] = (# of Reps Played With 1st Team / Total # of 1st Team Reps) * 100


yup. Actions speak louder than words.

Their actions say Eli has a 100% of starting
...  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 2:31 pm : link
I thought this was largely BS, but watch Shurmur's presser. He's clearly leaving the door open here... He had a number of chances to elaborate and he kept using the same words.
Giants.com - ( New Window )
I really hope Eli has a career year this year  
rasbutant : 6/11/2019 2:36 pm : link
Wins, Stats, MVP's, Pro Bowl...all of it.

Come on Eli, break some records!!!
There is no bigger fan of Eli Manning than me  
arniefez : 6/11/2019 2:38 pm : link
I'm sure there are plenty of Giant fans who feel the exact same way. 15 years of being a guy you can be proud to root for while winning 2 Super Bowls. The only NYG QB in their long history to win 2 NFL Championships. Etc, etc etc.

But if Jones is ready to play, play him. These are not lifetime appointments. I don't like the GM. I like the Head Coach. But I want to see them both win and succeed. The GM will probably survive another bad season. The HC might not. If Jones is best chance to win he has to play. You can't fool the locker room. They'll know.
Eliís needs to get this team to the playoffs. If Shurmur and the FO  
Ivan15 : 6/11/2019 2:40 pm : link
conclude that isnít happening, the change will be made. That conclusion may be reached in pre season (unlikely), after Week 2 or 3 (possible), at the bye week (probable) or not this year (hopeful)
And what DJ shows in training camp, practices or games makes no  
Ivan15 : 6/11/2019 2:42 pm : link
Difference in that decision.
The reality is and continues to be, that DJones will only play  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 2:49 pm : link
if this team sucks.

Honestly, it might be the exuberance of seeing everything in a vacuum, but I truly don't think that this team will suck.
RE: It's no different than the President  
BlueLou'sBack : 6/11/2019 2:53 pm : link
In comment 14469321 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
saying that all options are on the table. Doesn't mean anything


Bingo, bottom line.
Jones was considered the most ready QB in the draft  
larryflower37 : 6/11/2019 3:03 pm : link
If he is ready, start him day one.
QBs go down all the time,when it happens and you trade Manning to a contender(hopefully) for a pick.
I love Manning but this is a business and he will be gone at the end of the year anyway.
People should actually read Shurmur's transcript.  
Diver_Down : 6/11/2019 3:05 pm : link
The tweets that have been quoted are not exactly what Shurmur said. They are taking different statements and combining them into one. The only statement that is clear and Pat repeated it three times because the beat reporters are unable to comprehend his statement was:
Quote:
Eli is getting ready to have a great year and Daniel is getting ready to play.


The Beats just want Pat to feed into their own preconceived narrative -
Quote:
Q: You said we are playing around the words. How would you describe the situation?
A: I just did. Right. Iíll say it, I guess, for the third time: Eli is getting ready to have an outstanding year and Daniel is getting ready to play. At least in my mind, that is very clear, but it doesnít appear that it is because I am getting a lot of follow-ups to it.


So Pat doesn't take their bait, but has to dumb it down for them -
Quote:
Q: ... when you say ĎGetting ready to playí, you mean?
A: In a game. In an NFL football game.




WCGW.  
HomerJones45 : 6/11/2019 3:09 pm : link
Watch an iffy HC with zip for credibility because he's never even had a .500 record work up a qb controversy.
RE: WCGW.  
Gatorade Dunk : 6/11/2019 3:12 pm : link
In comment 14469570 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
Watch an iffy HC with zip for credibility because he's never even had a .500 record work up a qb controversy.

Yeah, you're definitely someone who has room to question credibility.
Diver_Down  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 3:12 pm : link
Yes and no.

His wording was odd and he kept repeating it when he simply could have said what he said earlier in the offseason, (paraphrasing) "Eli is the starter. Period."

He kind of said that, but he worded it oddly.

Then he finished with this:

Quote:
Q: Pat, can you see any scenario in which Jones is your starter in Week 1?
A: Oh, you never know what is going to happen, but as I said, Eli is getting ready to play and so is Daniel.
Don't be Ray Handley, Pat  
Vanzetti : 6/11/2019 3:12 pm : link
If you are Shurmur you have to start Eli. If Giants go 0-2. then move to Jones.

If Jones does start right away, team better win or PS will go bye-bye

RE: WCGW.  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 3:16 pm : link
In comment 14469570 HomerJones45 said:
Quote:
Watch an iffy HC with zip for credibility because he's never even had a .500 record work up a qb controversy.


Credibility with respect to what you believe is dependent on his character and his past record and projected propensity for truth-telling. I am not at all sure how that is related to his W-L record in football games.

Are you saying that Bill Belichick is the most honest person to ever coach a game of football? And if Shurmer pulls his W-L record up over .500 then he will tell the truth more often next year?

The thesis makes no sense.
RE: Don't be Ray Handley, Pat  
Nine-Tails : 6/11/2019 3:21 pm : link
In comment 14469577 Vanzetti said:
Quote:
If you are Shurmur you have to start Eli. If Giants go 0-2. then move to Jones.

If Jones does start right away, team better win or PS will go bye-bye


Shurmur has to start the qb that gives him the best chance to win. It likely will be Eli for the beginning of the season. However if Jones lights it up and Eli continues his uninspiring play, then who knows.
RE: Diver_Down  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 3:22 pm : link
In comment 14469575 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Yes and no.

His wording was odd and he kept repeating it when he simply could have said what he said earlier in the offseason, (paraphrasing) "Eli is the starter. Period."

He kind of said that, but he worded it oddly.

Then he finished with this:



Quote:


Q: Pat, can you see any scenario in which Jones is your starter in Week 1?
A: Oh, you never know what is going to happen, but as I said, Eli is getting ready to play and so is Daniel.



I think that we should be able to tell pretty quickly once pre-season begins. If they use a similar approach to last year and rest Eli, then I think it will be more clear that he will start at least until they are reasonably out of playoff contention. I think you can read his words that Jones needs to be ready to go if Eli can't as much or more that Jones needs to be ready to go because he's better than Eli.

Personally, I think that, unless they are punting the season from the getgo and playing only for 2020, which I don't think they are (if they were, they likely would have waited for Fromm et al), they will want someone battle-scarred who can read NFL defenses, etc.
He could have diffused it if he wanted to. He chose not to.  
Heisenberg : 6/11/2019 3:26 pm : link
Ergo, it was a message aimed at both QBs
RE: Diver_Down  
Diver_Down : 6/11/2019 3:27 pm : link
In comment 14469575 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
Yes and no.

His wording was odd and he kept repeating it when he simply could have said what he said earlier in the offseason, (paraphrasing) "Eli is the starter. Period."

He kind of said that, but he worded it oddly.

Then he finished with this:



Quote:


Q: Pat, can you see any scenario in which Jones is your starter in Week 1?
A: Oh, you never know what is going to happen, but as I said, Eli is getting ready to play and so is Daniel.



Look I'm not trying to buy Pat cover, but Jordan and Schwartz are being disingenuous with their tweets. Schwartz attempts to lend credibility to his tweet by putting part of it in quotes. Copy and paste the content of the quote and then do a CTRL F on Pat's transcript. The phrase is no where in the transcript. But yet, Jordan and Schwartz repeated the same catchphrase. This thread has 2200+ views that is based on a faulty premise and the actual transcript has 200+ views. People should seek out the truth instead of relying on the trash beat reporters with an agenda.
Diver_Down  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 3:30 pm : link
I understand.

And I thought that is what was going on. But when you watch the presser (video), Pat was given a number of chances to re-word what he was saying. He seemed to deliberately remain vague with his wording.

Earlier this offseason, Pat used very strong language to insist that Manning was the starter. Today, the wording was far more vague.
This is not about BBI  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 3:37 pm : link
but it's kind of amazing to see how many people are on the DJones train when you look at what they thought about him a month or so ago.
RE: The stuff we're hearing now  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 6/11/2019 3:42 pm : link
In comment 14469419 mittenedman said:
Quote:
is why Jones was such a great QB prospect. Unlike most of these kids coming out he's got an NFL game and was groomed to play in the pros.

Unreal how nobody cared, or gave him any credit for it. He's as NFL ready as anybody since Andrew Luck IMO.

Troof. DG got Shurmur an NFL ready scheme fit QB, while the rest of the league and media were napping.
IMO, Shurmur Is Saying Jones Being Ready Day 1  
clatterbuck : 6/11/2019 3:48 pm : link
is a statement that, yes, he was worthy of #6 pick; the team believes Jones has already shown "he is who they think he is," and while he expects Eli will play well, Jones is/will be ready...if Eli stinks or gets hurt. Imagine fan/media reaction if Shurmur even hinted that Jones would have to sit and learn for a year and would likely be carrying the clipboard behind Eli and Tanney. Giants seem even more confident now they made the right decision and I think Shurmurs comments reflect just that.
So what happens if  
NikkiMac : 6/11/2019 3:53 pm : link
Eli starts the year off with a win but then loses his next three
When do the giants go to Jones ......would you take him out after the 4th game or do you wait for the proverbial wait to we are out of playoffs mode also in this hypothetical situation letís say the Oline is playing much better........
They're trying to have it both ways  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/11/2019 3:58 pm : link
Not have a QB controversy and also swear to the world they picked the right guy at 6.
RE: IMO, Shurmur Is Saying Jones Being Ready Day 1  
Diver_Down : 6/11/2019 4:00 pm : link
In comment 14469629 clatterbuck said:
Quote:
is a statement that, yes, he was worthy of #6 pick; the team believes Jones has already shown "he is who they think he is," and while he expects Eli will play well, Jones is/will be ready...if Eli stinks or gets hurt. Imagine fan/media reaction if Shurmur even hinted that Jones would have to sit and learn for a year and would likely be carrying the clipboard behind Eli and Tanney. Giants seem even more confident now they made the right decision and I think Shurmurs comments reflect just that.


I think you have the right read. Just a few weeks ago, there was speculation on the depth chart and how many QBs are kept. Some postulated that Eli was QB1 with Tanney as QB2 with Jones eventually supplanting Alex as the season progresses. Shurmur's statement is a message to Jones to be ready for Day 1 and to play an NFL game. Having Jones #3 on the depth chart is a failure on Jones' part for not progressing enough to beat out Alex for the #2 spot.
RE: They're trying to have it both ways  
Bill L : 6/11/2019 4:01 pm : link
In comment 14469643 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
Not have a QB controversy and also swear to the world they picked the right guy at 6.


That would be dumb and also contradictory to Gettleman's rep of not needing to justify himself to anyone.
RE: This is not about BBI  
JCin332 : 6/11/2019 4:01 pm : link
In comment 14469609 Bill L said:
Quote:
but it's kind of amazing to see how many people are on the DJones train when you look at what they thought about him a month or so ago.


Lol never has a truer word been spoken...
RE: RE: RE: This again??  
Thegratefulhead : 6/11/2019 4:24 pm : link
In comment 14469372 Gatorade Dunk said:
Quote:
In comment 14469332 Thegratefulhead said:


Quote:


In comment 14469308 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:




Quote:


When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca



Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.

It is meaningless filler and included speculation to the point I was making. I concede to any reservations you may have to that part of the post. Maybe my recollection is inaccurate on the minutia of the details, but I believe Eli is quoted as to being told they were going to draft a QB high in the draft, before the draft. This my reason for the inclusion, I accept it if that is not correct.


It sounds like your recollection of those events may include the probably fictional version told to us here by jt. I wouldn't consider that directional in any way.
Went back and looked. On April 15th Eli had a press conference and said he expected the Giants to take a QB early. My speculation is that they told him it was very likely. He deserved a warning, I expect he got one. I think the entire Manning family understands what happens when you have an older QB and draft one in the first round. Eli was the young QB once. Ignore the asshat, I think it is reasonable that is why Eli cancelled the show. If I were Eli, I would not want to do weekly show with first round QB in camp. He had to do this BEFORE the QB was drafted or the optics look bad. It is why people point to to the fact that he cancelled the show before he was drafted. This is not an important part of what I was trying to say.

When a team takes a QB high in the draft they want to start him sooner rather than later and Shurmur's press conference seems to back that up. He could have said ELI IS THE STARTER. He did not and chose NOT to clarify when back up questions were asked. i think the kid is going to start.
From the post 1st round presser with Shurmur and Gettleman  
BSIMatt : 6/11/2019 4:24 pm : link
Kim Jones: And is the goal for Eli to start 16 games and Jones to sit 16 games next year.

Gettleman: The goal is for Eli to be our quarterback, yes.

Shurmur: I told Eli, it's your job to win games and keep this kid off the field.

Shurmur was pretty blunt back then, and I don't think he's done anything to back off that stance. Whichever quarterback gives the Giants the best chance to win will play. Eli has a big advantage over Jones with Jones being a rookie, but the one facet that cannot be overlooked is the Jones brings a skillset which Eli simply does not have, the mobility factor, the ability to move and throw on the run, he has a chance to be a better passer in the screen game because of his mobility. Eli is being challenged, and that's a good thing.
Dave Gettleman and Pat Shurmur discuss Why they decided to Select Daniel Jones & More - ( New Window )
RE: RE: RE: RE: This again??  
Diver_Down : 6/11/2019 4:31 pm : link
In comment 14469694 Thegratefulhead said:
Quote:
In comment 14469372 Gatorade Dunk said:


Quote:


In comment 14469332 Thegratefulhead said:


Quote:


In comment 14469308 FatMan in Charlotte said:


Quote:




Quote:


When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca



Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.

It is meaningless filler and included speculation to the point I was making. I concede to any reservations you may have to that part of the post. Maybe my recollection is inaccurate on the minutia of the details, but I believe Eli is quoted as to being told they were going to draft a QB high in the draft, before the draft. This my reason for the inclusion, I accept it if that is not correct.


It sounds like your recollection of those events may include the probably fictional version told to us here by jt. I wouldn't consider that directional in any way.

Went back and looked. On April 15th Eli had a press conference and said he expected the Giants to take a QB early. My speculation is that they told him it was very likely. He deserved a warning, I expect he got one. I think the entire Manning family understands what happens when you have an older QB and draft one in the first round. Eli was the young QB once. Ignore the asshat, I think it is reasonable that is why Eli cancelled the show. If I were Eli, I would not want to do weekly show with first round QB in camp. He had to do this BEFORE the QB was drafted or the optics look bad. It is why people point to to the fact that he cancelled the show before he was drafted. This is not an important part of what I was trying to say.

When a team takes a QB high in the draft they want to start him sooner rather than later and Shurmur's press conference seems to back that up. He could have said ELI IS THE STARTER. He did not and chose NOT to clarify when back up questions were asked. i think the kid is going to start.


Except your narrative isn't true. It really is simple. Read the transcript. It isn't any clearer.
Quote:
Q: So, Eli is the starter?
A: Eli is the starter and this guy is getting ready to play.
BSI....I think it is really telling that our old school GM pretty much  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 4:54 pm : link
telegraphed to the NFL that he believes mobility is very important in today's NFL.
RE: I wouldn't be surprised to see disagreement within the organization  
joeinpa : 6/11/2019 5:03 pm : link
In comment 14469285 UberAlias said:
Quote:
Mara probably has a strong desire to see Eli off on a high note with Shurmur motivated simply to win football games.


Yes of course. Mara would rather send Eli off on a high note than play the quarterback determined by the coach that gives them the best chance to win

Best thing about these scenarios is the people putting them forth actually believe them to be legitimate. Lol
RE: RE: The stuff we're hearing now  
RobCarpenter : 6/11/2019 5:05 pm : link
In comment 14469619 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
Quote:
In comment 14469419 mittenedman said:


Quote:


is why Jones was such a great QB prospect. Unlike most of these kids coming out he's got an NFL game and was groomed to play in the pros.

Unreal how nobody cared, or gave him any credit for it. He's as NFL ready as anybody since Andrew Luck IMO.


Troof. DG got Shurmur an NFL ready scheme fit QB, while the rest of the league and media were napping.


The media may have been napping, but the league wasn't. If you believe DG at least two other teams wanted Jones. I suspect it was Denver and Cincy. And the DC coaches probably wanted him too but Danny wanted Haskins.
RE: RE: Don't be Ray Handley, Pat  
Leg of Theismann : 6/11/2019 5:10 pm : link
In comment 14469585 Nine-Tails said:
Quote:
In comment 14469577 Vanzetti said:


Quote:


If you are Shurmur you have to start Eli. If Giants go 0-2. then move to Jones.

If Jones does start right away, team better win or PS will go bye-bye




Shurmur has to start the qb that gives him the best chance to win. It likely will be Eli for the beginning of the season. However if Jones lights it up and Eli continues his uninspiring play, then who knows.


I highly doubt DJ will give the Giants a better chance at winning than Eli Manning at any point during the 2019 season. DJ was a decent college QB. You don't go from decent college QB to NFL Great overnight. Giants picked him knowing they were probably in for the long haul and he would require development and adjusting to the speed of the game and sheer talent of the NFL compared to the ACC. Let's not fool ourselves into thinking suddenly that DJ is the 2nd coming of a young Dan Marino.
RE: If Jones..  
bw in dc : 6/11/2019 5:48 pm : link
In comment 14469240 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:
is ready to be the Day 1 starter, Eli absolutely has to be cut.


Congrats to the FatMan - he's spot on here.

If Jones accelerates to the point where he wins the starting job, keeping Eli will become nothing but an albatross on the organization.
Wow, I think everybody is reading way too much into what he is saying  
.McL. : 6/11/2019 5:48 pm : link
He is drawing a stark difference.

Eli is getting ready to have a great season
Jones is getting ready to play

Then he says every player on the has to get ready to play, You never know what might happen.

In other words, Jones is NOT ready to play yet, he is getting is learning and getting ready. If Eli goes down, Jones has to be ready to in there.

Eli, as the starting QB, is working towards a higher goal.

He kept saying what he said was clear and kept repeating it. Take his words exactly as he said them. I don't think he is being very vague at all.
Sorry typo  
.McL. : 6/11/2019 5:50 pm : link
He is NOT being very vague at all
RE: Wow, I think everybody is reading way too much into what he is saying  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 6/11/2019 6:13 pm : link
In comment 14469763 .McL. said:
Quote:
He is drawing a stark difference.

Eli is getting ready to have a great season
Jones is getting ready to play

Then he says every player on the has to get ready to play, You never know what might happen.

In other words, Jones is NOT ready to play yet, he is getting is learning and getting ready. If Eli goes down, Jones has to be ready to in there.

Eli, as the starting QB, is working towards a higher goal.

He kept saying what he said was clear and kept repeating it. Take his words exactly as he said them. I don't think he is being very vague at all.


Yes, except he wasn't that clear. And when asked 3-4 times to make his language precise, he didn't specifically say, "Jones will only play if Eli gets hurt."

He said, "Who knows?"
RE: RE: Wow, I think everybody is reading way too much into what he is saying  
Diver_Down : 6/11/2019 6:22 pm : link
In comment 14469778 Eric from BBI said:
Quote:
In comment 14469763 .McL. said:


Quote:


He is drawing a stark difference.

Eli is getting ready to have a great season
Jones is getting ready to play

Then he says every player on the has to get ready to play, You never know what might happen.

In other words, Jones is NOT ready to play yet, he is getting is learning and getting ready. If Eli goes down, Jones has to be ready to in there.

Eli, as the starting QB, is working towards a higher goal.

He kept saying what he said was clear and kept repeating it. Take his words exactly as he said them. I don't think he is being very vague at all.



Yes, except he wasn't that clear. And when asked 3-4 times to make his language precise, he didn't specifically say, "Jones will only play if Eli gets hurt."

He said, "Who knows?"


Pat has nothing to gain to verbalize any specifics. In your example, if we are out of playoff contention and Eli is still healthy, then Jones won't see playing time because the specific case is only when Eli gets hurt. Fans and the media latch onto statements to use against them. DG is a liar to some because he said, "We didn't sign him to trade him" only to end up trading OBJ.
RE: Wow, I think everybody is reading way too much into what he is saying  
St. Jimmy : 6/11/2019 6:43 pm : link
In comment 14469763 .McL. said:
Quote:
He is drawing a stark difference.

Eli is getting ready to have a great season
Jones is getting ready to play

Then he says every player on the has to get ready to play, You never know what might happen.

In other words, Jones is NOT ready to play yet, he is getting is learning and getting ready. If Eli goes down, Jones has to be ready to in there.

Eli, as the starting QB, is working towards a higher goal.

He kept saying what he said was clear and kept repeating it. Take his words exactly as he said them. I don't think he is being very vague at all.
Starting Jones when he is ready is working towards a higher goal of developing the next quarterback of the Giants. Starting Eli is trying to win now at the expense of the future.
Could the these guys handle all this worse?  
exiled : 6/11/2019 6:55 pm : link
PS being coy just adds fuel to the QB controversy fire.

Seriously, if they were even hoping Jones would start this season, they should have cut ties with Eli during the off season.

RE: RE: RE: Wow, I think everybody is reading way too much into what he is saying  
.McL. : 6/11/2019 7:07 pm : link
In comment 14469783 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
In comment 14469778 Eric from BBI said:


Quote:


In comment 14469763 .McL. said:


Quote:


He is drawing a stark difference.

Eli is getting ready to have a great season
Jones is getting ready to play

Then he says every player on the has to get ready to play, You never know what might happen.

In other words, Jones is NOT ready to play yet, he is getting is learning and getting ready. If Eli goes down, Jones has to be ready to in there.

Eli, as the starting QB, is working towards a higher goal.

He kept saying what he said was clear and kept repeating it. Take his words exactly as he said them. I don't think he is being very vague at all.



Yes, except he wasn't that clear. And when asked 3-4 times to make his language precise, he didn't specifically say, "Jones will only play if Eli gets hurt."

He said, "Who knows?"



Pat has nothing to gain to verbalize any specifics. In your example, if we are out of playoff contention and Eli is still healthy, then Jones won't see playing time because the specific case is only when Eli gets hurt. Fans and the media latch onto statements to use against them. DG is a liar to some because he said, "We didn't sign him to trade him" only to end up trading OBJ.

Yeah agreed, he has nothing to gain by being more specific now.

If mid season and the Giants are all but out of contention, and the decision is made to let the kid play. Tjey don't want a McAdoo style meltdown. At that point, Eli is still more likely to produce wins, but the long term benefit to the franchise is to let the kid play. But they can never say that, without controversy.
RE: RE: They're trying to have it both ways  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/11/2019 8:23 pm : link
In comment 14469648 Bill L said:
Quote:
In comment 14469643 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


Not have a QB controversy and also swear to the world they picked the right guy at 6.



That would be dumb and also contradictory to Gettleman's rep of not needing to justify himself to anyone.


If they're trying to avoid the pitfall of 'When does Jones play?', they're doing an impressively bad job of it with comments such as those. How did we get from 'Jones could sit from 1-3 years' to this point?
I don't think they care about the "when will jones play". Maybe they  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/11/2019 8:51 pm : link
did before they got him on a field with NFL players,but they clearly like what they see so far. That question is only getting asked if Eli plays poorly, which at the point it aounds like they are confident he will be ready.
Interesting  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/11/2019 9:17 pm : link
comments by Shurmur. I'd still be shocked if Jones is starting Week 1.
Daniel Jones was drafted 6th..  
Sean : 6/11/2019 9:40 pm : link
we passed on Josh Allen for him. Anything other than him competing for the job would be foolish imo. This is a good thing & it is encouraging he appears to be learning quickly.
RE: If Eli is benched at some point this season  
FStubbs : 6/11/2019 10:15 pm : link
In comment 14469456 RobCarpenter said:
Quote:
Would any team actually trade for him?

Personally I'm glad that Shurmur is saying that it's a competition, even if the reality is that Eli will be the starter.

My biggest fear isn't Eli starting in 2019. It's the Giants extending him. Hopefully Jones shows them enough so that that doesn't happen.


The only way I think this happens is if God forbid Eli missed a few games due to injury but looked really good in those games and Jones looked awful.
Shurmur would not be doing his job..  
EricJ : 6/11/2019 10:58 pm : link
if he was not turning this into a competition and if he is not doing everything he can to develop Jones to the point where he can actually beat out Eli. That is good for the team.
Until we see these guys in preseason, nobody, including Shurmur,  
GeofromNJ : 6/12/2019 1:21 am : link
knows whether Eli is ready for one of his better years or whether Jones is ready to lead an NFL team to repeated victories. In prior years, I had little interest in preseason, even when it gave opportunities to Lorenzen, Nassib, Carr, Webb, or Lauletta. Not so this year. I am really anxious to see how well Jones performs.
If you ve ever coaches you understand  
joeinpa : 6/12/2019 6:12 am : link
That how you view your roster prior to the season can change quickly once you get your team together and have the opportunity to work with them.

Coaches want to win, the idea that Jones might start the season at #1 might be viewed with incredulity by some fans, but given some of the reports and innuendos we have had coming from camp in regard to Eli s arm, it might not be that far fetched to see Jones behind center week 1.
RE: This again??  
dpinzow : 6/12/2019 6:31 am : link
In comment 14469308 FatMan in Charlotte said:
Quote:


Quote:


When they took Jones at 6, this was part all part of it. It is why Eli cancelled his appearance on Francesca



Eli cancelled the regular appearance 4 days BEFORE the draft.


He could have known that gettleman was locked in on picking a QB at #6
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