So this topic came up on the Giant Insider podcast that I was listening to this morning and I didn't give it much thought at the prior to it getting raised, but it makes sense to further discuss.
As we know, most teams carry 3 QBs (starter, backup, and emergency QB). For a number or years under Coughlin, knowing Eli's penchant/luck for not getting hurt and having a fairly capable backup (Carr comes to mind), Coughlin decided to carry only 2 QBs and use that extra roster spot for an additional player.
Let's look at this year. Eli is the starter and Jones is the backup. Yes, you have Tanney and Lauletta on the roster, but those guys will not see the field at all until disaster strikes. And if they are playing, the season has gone in the toilet anyway.
Considering the depth the Giants suddenly have at defensive back, and perhaps trying to keep an extra tight end, would it make more sense for the Giants to go with 2 QBs? The x-factor is Dungey. If the Giants truely see Dungey in the mold of a Hill in New Orleans, they will list him at a different position (TE or whatever) but he could see the field in different situations as a QB.
For me, I see no point of keeping Tanney. Again, for him to ever see the field, that means that Eli and Jones both got hurt. If we are in that situation, we start looking at a high 2020 pick so who cares. Tanney is another Jim Sorgi, Jim Miller, etc veteran journeyman type. Lauletta to me has more promise because if the Giants think they can develop him further, you need a backup in 2020 behind Jones (assuming Eli has moved on/retired).
Ultimately, that might be the end result. If Lauletta shows he can play and there is a "there there", maybe the Giants keep 3 QBs. If not, I'd assume save the slot to keep an extra defensive back.
I am convinced that Tanney will not be signed by another team if he is cut so the Giants could just tell him to stay in shape in case they need him later in the season.
Thats fine when you have a iron man like Eli in his prime and a very experienced backup like Carr but doesn't work well in our current situation
This all plays out when they actually start playing football--performance, injury, trade possibilities.
I don't think Lauletta is an automatic Drop. The negative talk around him may be helpful in allowing them to keep and develop him---if they thought he was not a development prospect, he would ALREADY be gone.
Conrad?...Dungey???? Can either be a Blocking TE...or lead blocker. Are they more than Cinderellas?
I'm excited to see the Giants... I'd like to see them show theyve turned the corner
If your offense is crap, or at best one-dimensional, like Giants' has been for several years, you can't gimmick with Taysom Hill.
If the Giants like Dungey as a player at any position, that's great. If they think he brings Hill-like versatility- I am skeptical.
If a team keeps three QBs instead of two they are in effect cutting their 53rd best player.
Look at a team’s final cuts and pick out the best player of the bunch. That’s the guy a team is cutting to keep the third QB. If they only keep two QBs and that 53rd best player makes the roster, chances are he doesn’t dress for most games and if and when he does see the field he likely won’t make that much of an impact anyway. He’s a very replaceable part.
Does anyone have an example of a “53rd best player” being cut by the Giants and making it big elsewhere? Other than some kickers that they wouldn’t have kept and McCaffrey (who they might not have kept anyway) I really can’t think of anyone.
Very badly. They better hope they got it right with Jones, because they've missed on every QB since Eli. None even became competent backups.
Thats fine when you have a iron man like Eli in his prime and a very experienced backup like Carr but doesn't work well in our current situation
IF they keep Dungey, can he run the scout team?
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is one of them have to run the scout team and can't be 100% dedicated to being the back up.
Thats fine when you have a iron man like Eli in his prime and a very experienced backup like Carr but doesn't work well in our current situation
IF they keep Dungey, can he run the scout team?
possibly, if he is not heavily involved in the game plan as a TE.
A PS player could do it as well but you want a certain level of capability and dependability that a PS player might not be able to guarantee
Just as badly as they missed on Lauletta when the drafted him. It was always a head scratcher of a pic. They made a mistake. It happens.
Why did anyone ever think Lauletta was going to more then just a backup?
They weren't thrilled with Webb (Webb had some upside, people thought he could be a 1st round level QB if they worked out some of the kinks in his mechanics) and that's why they took Lauletta, who has the things they were looking for in their QB.
I don't get the Lauletta was eventually going to be the next QB crowd at all.
Who’s also mobile. I agree with thisb
That said, Lauletta is going to have to show more than he has so far to stick around. I thought he was a wasted pick when they selected him, and I think the NYG team powers will agree when the Turk makes his rounds on Labor Day weekend.
It doesn't matter that Lauletta a cost controlled player. As a seasoned veteran clipboard holder, Tanney brings a lot more to the party as a scout team QB than KL does. And they can replace either of them with a cheap veteran in any off-season.
So cut Lauletta, put Dungey on the PS, and give Eli a rousing send-off with a winning season.
Eli is gone after this year. I assume they'll sign a cheap vet for next year or Possibly have Lauletta back up next year if he looks the part.
English Alaister : 11:21 am : link : reply
then you need to find a new backup next year when Eli is gone. KL is relatively cheap so I'd say keep him around unless he really stinks in the pre-season.
with eli in his prime, 2 QB's were OK. With him likely playing his last season, you need that 3rd guy around - even if just as a bridge backup.
Who?
Obviously the team may want to keep him for another 3 years as Jones' cheap back-up, and not take that risk. But I think they'd be even more hesitant to try to slip any of the young CBs for example to the PS, so there's 5 of them on the 53. 6 CBs with JJ.
They could always sign one.
If Lauletta makes adequate progress in 2019, he battles for Jones' backup in 2020 with a journeyman signing.
Obviously the team may want to keep him for another 3 years as Jones' cheap back-up, and not take that risk. But I think they'd be even more hesitant to try to slip any of the young CBs for example to the PS, so there's 5 of them on the 53. 6 CBs with JJ.
I really don't know if another team will poach him. However, teams have poached players just so they can do their own evaluation of him...
For that reason the Jets gave Webb a full salary if he would agree not to sign with another team. No reason we couldn't do a similar deal.
How has Lauletta bee looking in practice btw?
Hard to say. We seem to only be focusing on Jerry Reese's mishaps.
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badly did they miss on Lauletta if they don't keep him his second year?
Just as badly as they missed on Lauletta when the drafted him. It was always a head scratcher of a pic. They made a mistake. It happens.
This couldn't be more incorrect. Mid/late-round QBs get drafted to be depth. If you had visions of Tom Brady then that's your own fault, but the Lauletta pick was (and is) completely reasonable and justified.
I am convinced that Tanney will not be signed by another team if he is cut so the Giants could just tell him to stay in shape in case they need him later in the season.
I know I am repeating myself but here goes. Unless Lauletta looks better than Tanney in preseason, Lauletta will be cut loose and Tanney will run the scout team and mentor Jones. Tanney has cleared waivers before and can again. They like Tanney and he is a pretty good coach in training. They will pay more than the practice squad rate to keep him around. If Lauletta doesn’t clearly beat out Tanney, he has no value to the Giants
I understand taking a flyer on a fourth-round QB.
But how do you swing and miss on the dude's intelligence and work ethic?
It's less about how much they missed and more about how easily replaced he is by someone on the street.
His draft comp was Case Keenum and Case himself is now on his 7th team (counting 2 teams twice). And last year he got $25m guaranteed from Denver. So net-net the pick is projecting to be about as expected and while there's still hope for Lauletta it just most likely won't be here, so the sooner everyone gets over where he was drafted the better.
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badly did they miss on Lauletta if they don't keep him his second year?
Very badly. They better hope they got it right with Jones, because they've missed on every QB since Eli. None even became competent backups.
Every QB? This group has only drafted two QBs. You act like they have gone through 5 guys since Eli. Eli is still paying every snap the last time I looked.
maybe its just me but I can see an Alex Smith type out of him where he plays better a few years into his career
Thats fine when you have a iron man like Eli in his prime and a very experienced backup like Carr but doesn't work well in our current situation
Good point but a practice squad QB (or Dungey) can run the scout team.
Not sure why, but it kills me to use a valuable roster spot on a guy who doesn't really help your chances to win. Does anyone on here feel like Tunney at QB changes anything from Lauletta last year?
I don't.
But then I think who is that 53rd guy they pushed off the roster and most of the time that guy is out of the league, possibly on a PS somewhere.
Only guy I can think of from final cuts who didn't make it to the PS and played anywhere else is Matt McCants. and I don't think he did anything great with the Raiders, but he did start for them for a while - and he was let go to keep a 3rd QB - like Sorgi or someone shitty.
I also agree with others, you don't need a 3rd QB to run scout team. A PS QB should be able to handle that.
So, my preference is always 2 QB's, but I don't get as hung up on it as I used to b/c player 54 who doesn't make it ot the PS is likely not an NFL player.
I think they can only be claimed if they are added to the other team's 53-man right? You can't go PS to PS or can you?
All well and good, but McCants was cut in 2013, and the Giants only kept two QBs that year (Curtis Painter was the backup).
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Only guy I can think of from final cuts who didn't make it to the PS and played anywhere else is Matt McCants. and I don't think he did anything great with the Raiders, but he did start for them for a while - and he was let go to keep a 3rd QB - like Sorgi or someone shitty.
All well and good, but McCants was cut in 2013, and the Giants only kept two QBs that year (Curtis Painter was the
backup).
Yep, Painter not Sorgi. My mistake.
And Ryan Nassib was the 3rd QB.
So, your point about being well and good?
As for Lauletta in that scenario, the team might pull a Paul Perkins and keep him around on some reserve list or other. He did have surgery, so there's a plausible injury narrative if they aren't ready to give up on him completely.
He was inactive for every game in 2013.
Some veteran options include Chase Daniel, Case Keenum, Colt McCoy, Brian Hoyer, Blake Bortles, Kyle Sloter. I wouldn't offer more than $4-5 million for the 1 year. McCoy, Hoyer, and Sloter would be the cheapest as I doubt any would receive more than $1.5-2 million. I am not a big fan of Bortles but he would be a potential reclamation project for Shurmur.
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In comment 14470971 pjcas18 said:
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Only guy I can think of from final cuts who didn't make it to the PS and played anywhere else is Matt McCants. and I don't think he did anything great with the Raiders, but he did start for them for a while - and he was let go to keep a 3rd QB - like Sorgi or someone shitty.
All well and good, but McCants was cut in 2013, and the Giants only kept two QBs that year (Curtis Painter was the
backup).
Yep, Painter not Sorgi. My mistake.
And Ryan Nassib was the 3rd QB.
So, your point about being well and good?
I stand corrected. I mistakenly went off of the Pro Football Reference roster for 2013 which does not list Nassib (presumably because, as FMIC notes, he was inactive every single week).
Link - ( New Window )
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In comment 14471023 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 14470971 pjcas18 said:
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Only guy I can think of from final cuts who didn't make it to the PS and played anywhere else is Matt McCants. and I don't think he did anything great with the Raiders, but he did start for them for a while - and he was let go to keep a 3rd QB - like Sorgi or someone shitty.
All well and good, but McCants was cut in 2013, and the Giants only kept two QBs that year (Curtis Painter was the
backup).
Yep, Painter not Sorgi. My mistake.
And Ryan Nassib was the 3rd QB.
So, your point about being well and good?
I stand corrected. I mistakenly went off of the Pro Football Reference roster for 2013 which does not list Nassib (presumably because, as FMIC notes, he was inactive every single week). Link - ( New Window )
Fair but he was on the 53-man which is really what we're talking about.
And I agreed I don't get s hung about it anymore anyway.
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In comment 14471027 pjcas18 said:
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In comment 14471023 Gatorade Dunk said:
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In comment 14470971 pjcas18 said:
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Only guy I can think of from final cuts who didn't make it to the PS and played anywhere else is Matt McCants. and I don't think he did anything great with the Raiders, but he did start for them for a while - and he was let go to keep a 3rd QB - like Sorgi or someone shitty.
All well and good, but McCants was cut in 2013, and the Giants only kept two QBs that year (Curtis Painter was the
backup).
Yep, Painter not Sorgi. My mistake.
And Ryan Nassib was the 3rd QB.
So, your point about being well and good?
I stand corrected. I mistakenly went off of the Pro Football Reference roster for 2013 which does not list Nassib (presumably because, as FMIC notes, he was inactive every single week). Link - ( New Window )
Fair but he was on the 53-man which is really what we're talking about.
And I agreed I don't get s hung about it anymore anyway.
You're 100% right about the 53 - my mistake was in assuming that PFR would treat "roster" as the 53-man roster and not just the players who appeared on the active roster at some point during the season.