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NFT: Knicks should still go out and sign Kevin Durant

ELI THE GOAT : 6/13/2019 9:57 pm
and let him rehab in NYC next year. Let KD's comeback story happen in New York...

Im 32. This team has been a joke for my entire life. Sign him and let him rehab. Keep a max spot open
for FA 2020. Draft RJ and let the young guys develop next year.

Whats your opinion?
Waiting for DanMetroMans response ..  
ELI THE GOAT : 6/13/2019 9:58 pm : link
..
he should definitely go to the Nets  
Osi Osi Osi OyOyOy : 6/13/2019 10:12 pm : link
.
Sign a 31 year old that blew  
section125 : 6/13/2019 10:13 pm : link
out his achilles so that you won't see him until the start of the 2020/2021 season? Been waiting for the Knicks to do something intelligent for the past 20 years.
100 percent agree  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 10:15 pm : link
There is no one else to sign unless you get Kawhi which isnt happening. The cap money has to be spent. I have no interest in butler, kemba, Harris or Kyrie. I dont want to trade for AD. Really hope he gets traded to Boston. Draft Barrett., sign 1 year dead with Mario, Deandre, Beverly and Danny green with remaining $32 mil. Next year go after AD otherwise mix in more vets that fit with Kd and the rest of the team. At that point you can package some young players/picks for Paul George or Beal.

Signing KD also keeps the knicks from wasting the money ona multi year contract for someone that is not worth it.
If you dont want to sign  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 10:16 pm : link
Him then what is your plan for the cap space?
Nah.  
81_Great_Dane : 6/13/2019 10:16 pm : link
Why use up all that cap space for a year of waiting-for-Durant and then probably getting a diminished version of the guy.

Draft Barrett, keep the picks, draft more good young players, use the cap space on guys who can actually, you know, play basketball. Or take back some bad expiring contracts to get yet more draft capital.
There is no one else worth giving a multi year  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 10:21 pm : link
Max unless you are getting Kawhi. No one is trying to get rid of expirings in the offseason. Teams may want to get rid of 2 year deals but I have no interest in that for a middle round 1st rounders. We have enough picks
RE: If you dont want to sign  
TyreeHelmet : 6/13/2019 10:21 pm : link
In comment 14471600 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
Him then what is your plan for the cap space?


Exactly. And please dont say sign Klay and Kawhi... good luck with that. Lets also stop with the young core and use the cap space for picks. The Knicks young players need to make leaps and bounds and any pick Received for a bad contract will be a late 1st.

Ill happily sign up for getting a top 15 player of all time ages 32-34- regardless of the injury. Knicks fans are nuts.
Why  
Jon in NYC : 6/13/2019 10:22 pm : link
can't they sign Durant and also develop their youth? This doesn't cost them any picks + he's gone for a whole year.
Still can't believe he blew the achilles in the finals  
Torrag : 6/13/2019 10:24 pm : link
Dolan really is a plague on the fans. Just as the Wilponsis are on Mets fans.

I'm in mourning. I have no clue what they should do.

It's a helluva lot of money for a 30something guy coming off a really difficult injury to predict the rehab.

KD should stick the Warriors with the bill by opting in on his player option year. Reboot the whole thing when he's healthy for the following season.

What the Knicks could/should do? /shrug
RE: If you dont want to sign  
The_Boss : 6/13/2019 10:32 pm : link
In comment 14471600 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
Him then what is your plan for the cap space?


Do what Evan Roberts has been suggesting: use it as a weapon. Take on bad contracts in return for unprotected draft picks. The worst thing to do is sign guys like Tobias Harris, Kemba, Middleton, Jimmy Butler to max deals.

The short term fix option should have gone up in flames the instant KD ruptured his Achilles.
RE: RE: If you dont want to sign  
Jay on the Island : 6/13/2019 10:38 pm : link
In comment 14471618 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14471600 GMEN46 said:


Quote:


Him then what is your plan for the cap space?



Do what Evan Roberts has been suggesting: use it as a weapon. Take on bad contracts in return for unprotected draft picks. The worst thing to do is sign guys like Tobias Harris, Kemba, Middleton, Jimmy Butler to max deals.

The short term fix option should have gone up in flames the instant KD ruptured his Achilles.

Agreed, go all out for Leonard which is highly unlikely. When he passes draft Barrett at 3 and then develop the kids while trying to acquire unprotected picks.
RE: Still can't believe he blew the achilles in the finals  
nygiants16 : 6/13/2019 10:38 pm : link
In comment 14471612 Torrag said:
Quote:
Dolan really is a plague on the fans. Just as the Wilponsis are on Mets fans.

I'm in mourning. I have no clue what they should do.

It's a helluva lot of money for a 30something guy coming off a really difficult injury to predict the rehab.

KD should stick the Warriors with the bill by opting in on his player option year. Reboot the whole thing when he's healthy for the following season.

What the Knicks could/should do? /shrug


Yes itnis dolans fault he blew out his achilles..

Durant opting in would be the dumbest thing he could ever do..
Also if you sign durant  
nygiants16 : 6/13/2019 10:40 pm : link
you let him recover for a year, the younfer players get another year of decelopment, you dont have to necassarily tank but younlet the young guys lead the team..

You go into next year with a healthy durant and another max slot, if you dont fill it this offseason
We don't need to use all of our cap space. We can draft Barrett  
yatqb : 6/13/2019 10:44 pm : link
and wait till next year for a try at Davis. I'm not sold on landing Durant in the latter stages of his career after a major injury. We already did that with Amare. And I'd rather not sign anyone than sign mid-level guys to max contracts.
RE: We don't need to use all of our cap space. We can draft Barrett  
adamg : 6/13/2019 11:08 pm : link
In comment 14471630 yatqb said:
Quote:
and wait till next year for a try at Davis. I'm not sold on landing Durant in the latter stages of his career after a major injury. We already did that with Amare. And I'd rather not sign anyone than sign mid-level guys to max contracts.


Durant's a mid-level guy now?
You have to use the cap space  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 11:12 pm : link
It is a requirement of the nba. You cant sign 6 guys to 1 year contracts averaging $10 million. Sign Durant and sign 3-4 guys in 1 year deals in the $8 million rnange. Mix young guys with vets.

The whole taking on contract thing isnt going to get you unprotected 1st rounders anymore and teams that are willing to trade 1st rounders are most likely making a run for it so those picks are in the 20s. Its just not worth taking on a 2 or 3 year bad contract.

Signing Durant is a no brainer. It leads to one more year of development and a probable lottery pick. You go into 2020 free agency with healthy Durant with 3 years left in the deal. Maybe its only 85 percent of the old Durant but that is still awesome. Year 3 of Knox and Mitch and year 2 of Barrett. Another lottery pick, $40 million in cap space because cap goes up. Also you have a shot at Anthony Davis. You will also have 2 first rounders in 2021 that could be used in a package at that point if you want to fill out the roster with another star.
adam, I was talking about the rest of the guys out there,  
yatqb : 6/13/2019 11:13 pm : link
like Harris or McCollum. Durant is a superstar...just coming with age and off an injury.
Well, the three guys I would have wanted in free agency  
81_Great_Dane : 6/13/2019 11:21 pm : link
(as in, take any two) would have been Leonard, Durant and Thompson.

The first guy ain't comin' and the other two seem to have fucked up their legs. Go figure. Not that Thompson was leaving the Warriors anyway.
Cousins  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 11:35 pm : link
Clearly isnt the same but that May be the combo of the quad and Achilles recovery. I wonder how cousins will be at the beginning of 2019 season.
RE: Cousins  
nygiants16 : 6/13/2019 11:46 pm : link
In comment 14471686 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
Clearly isnt the same but that May be the combo of the quad and Achilles recovery. I wonder how cousins will be at the beginning of 2019 season.


He is also clearly outnof shape
Anthony Davis  
GMEN46 : 6/13/2019 11:54 pm : link
The raptors Gm makes bold moves would Siakim, van fleet, onunoby and 2 first rounders be more attractive then lakers offer?
Francesa had one of the  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 12:00 am : link
leading surgeons from HSS on his show today.

Anyone who still wants to sign KD ought to listen. Its not good.

He basically said these injuries are a bad sign for Durant moving forward and any contract better be short term or have insurance, but then again, you cant really have a short term contract when you cant even play in year one.

He was also talking about how precise the surgeon needs to be. If the tendon is repaired too tight, it can tear again. Not tight enough and youll have no get off in that step. Very difficult to come back unchanged by this.

I love Durant but I would pass.
they should still sign him.  
madgiantscow009 : 6/14/2019 12:12 am : link
starting 5: Klay, Durant, Anthony Davis, Kawaii, and Kemba.
GMAN, what's the rule about having to spend cap space?  
yatqb : 6/14/2019 12:20 am : link
I'm not familiar with that.
I think that I discovered it...teams have to spend 90% of the cap  
yatqb : 6/14/2019 12:25 am : link
by the end of each season?
You cant just  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 12:26 am : link
Not use your cap space, each team has a minimum amount of cap space that they have to use. Im Norbert sure he minimum but I am pretty sure it is 80-90 percent of the cap at a minimum.
The real injured Warrior/FA the NY FO should go after is Klay tbh  
adamg : 6/14/2019 12:35 am : link
Dude is a monster. Have to love his heart.

Quote:
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Steve Kerr said Klay Thompson told him on his way off the court: "Just a two minute rest and I'll be ready." Next thing Kerr heard Klay was done for the night, crutching out of the arena.
RE: adam, I was talking about the rest of the guys out there,  
adamg : 6/14/2019 12:37 am : link
In comment 14471667 yatqb said:
Quote:
like Harris or McCollum. Durant is a superstar...just coming with age and off an injury.


O I C

I thought the "And..." was a continuation of the Durant point. I'm with you there. No mediocre FAs please.
Klay Thompson torn ACL  
Stu11 : 6/14/2019 1:46 am : link
Unbelievable to lose 2 guys in the finals for next year as well. Woj just tweeted.
Kyrie Irving 'prepared to sign'...  
M.S. : 6/14/2019 8:22 am : link


...with Nets after agent switch.


Link - ( New Window )
apparently there were a handful of teams...  
Italianju : 6/14/2019 9:15 am : link
that were only interested in Kyrie with someone like KD. I wonder if the knicks were one of them. Im ok with this, i mean i like Kyrie more then most on here and if we signed him id be happy, but Kyrie by himself doesnt really do much for us. Makes us solid if the youth pans out, but not championship contender.
If they're committing to the youth movement  
Jan in DC : 6/14/2019 9:16 am : link
And the Nets do sign Irving, I would consider giving serious money to DAngelo Russell, if they renounce his rights.

He's young, he flashed last year. And if you're committed to keeping RJ, and using these draft picks to build from the ground up, he would fit the rebuild.
Windhorst says Warriors will offer KD 5 year max  
shyster : 6/14/2019 9:24 am : link
Take it KD, you've earned it.

And save the Knicks from themselves.
realgm - ( New Window )
RE: Windhorst says Warriors will offer KD 5 year max  
Big Rick in FL : 6/14/2019 9:28 am : link
In comment 14471876 shyster said:
Quote:
Take it KD, you've earned it.

And save the Knicks from themselves. realgm - ( New Window )


If a team as well run as the Warriors are willing to offer him the max that should show the Knicks exactly what they should do.
RE: If they're committing to the youth movement  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 9:31 am : link
In comment 14471865 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
And the Nets do sign Irving, I would consider giving serious money to DAngelo Russell, if they renounce his rights.

He's young, he flashed last year. And if you're committed to keeping RJ, and using these draft picks to build from the ground up, he would fit the rebuild.


The plans have really changed but I agree with this.

The best Knicks plan right now is to draft RJ and continue to build from the ground up.

Their FA interest should be Kawhi only (a total pipe dream anyway) and Russell if the Nets make him available. Either of those guys would fit nicely in the plan.
RE: Windhorst says Warriors will offer KD 5 year max  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 9:33 am : link
In comment 14471876 shyster said:
Quote:
Take it KD, you've earned it.

And save the Knicks from themselves. realgm - ( New Window )


this is not a surprise, they were always going to offer him the max
All the hype and we may just end up with RJ Barrett..  
Sean : 6/14/2019 9:42 am : link
Unreal. Just brutal.
How can they  
TommyWiseau : 6/14/2019 9:44 am : link
Afford a 300 mil payroll with the luxury tax? Crazy
I'd happily offer Thompson a max deal, even after the ACL.  
yatqb : 6/14/2019 9:44 am : link
He's special and a lot younger than KD.
RE: RE: Windhorst says Warriors will offer KD 5 year max  
shyster : 6/14/2019 9:45 am : link
In comment 14471882 Big Rick in FL said:
Quote:
In comment 14471876 shyster said:


Quote:


Take it KD, you've earned it.

And save the Knicks from themselves. realgm - ( New Window )



If a team as well run as the Warriors are willing to offer him the max that should show the Knicks exactly what they should do.


Maybe if the Knicks could get the rest of the Warriors to leave GSW and join NYK. Otherwise the decision is not the same at all. Even when KD was healthy, it only made sense to sign him at age 31 as part of a plan to win now.

And, apart from that, I think there are evident reasons GSW had to do this, even if they are aware the cold calculation and evidence of history are that the next KD contract could very well turn out to be an albatross.

so which teams have bad contracts  
bigbluehoya : 6/14/2019 9:45 am : link
that they'll be motivated to move?
Rather have more draft picks  
ghost718 : 6/14/2019 9:54 am : link
Trade the whole team if you have too
RE: I'd happily offer Thompson a max deal, even after the ACL.  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 9:55 am : link
In comment 14471897 yatqb said:
Quote:
He's special and a lot younger than KD.

He's 30 in February, KD is 31 in September.
RE: so which teams have bad contracts  
The_Boss : 6/14/2019 9:57 am : link
In comment 14471899 bigbluehoya said:
Quote:
that they'll be motivated to move?


Wall in DC comes to mind.
Knicks  
TyreeHelmet : 6/14/2019 9:58 am : link
There are many bad takes out there, but fans preferring to use the Knicks cap space to take on bad contracts for picks instead of signing Kevin Durant may be the worst. Even if he loses a step, with his height and shooting, he will still be an all nba player. His overall defense, jumping and quickness may or may not be compromised. But his shooting and handle are staying the same.

My plan would be to sign Durant and sign Kemba if you can. If you can't get Kemba and it sounds like hes staying in CHA, roll the cap space over into next summer and hope Davis wants to make a move.

As for Davis, I could see a surprise team trade for him now. There are many teams out there that can beat the Lakers offer...
Thing is, I don't think anyone on earth believes Rich Paul  
Greg from LI : 6/14/2019 10:01 am : link
If the Lakers trade for Davis, he will absolutely sign an extension there. I'd be anything he would. So, what you have here is a situation where everyone else is bidding on a different return than the Lakers are, because Davis would be a straight rental for them.
Guys enough with taking in bad contracts  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 10:02 am : link
We have plenty of draft picks. Those contracts are 2-3 year deals and the draft picks are always protected and end up in the 20s. The Durant risk is well worth it. Sets you up nicely for 2020 season.
The question is  
TommyWiseau : 6/14/2019 10:05 am : link
can Dennis Smith Jr turn it on in year 3? Could he have a D'angelo Russell like trajectory?
RE: The question is  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14471922 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
can Dennis Smith Jr turn it on in year 3? Could he have a D'angelo Russell like trajectory?


He needs to work on his jumper, if he can get a consistent jumper he would be deadly offensively, he can turn the corner on anyone. He has really good vision and is an underrated passer..
RE: The question is  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 10:10 am : link
In comment 14471922 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
can Dennis Smith Jr turn it on in year 3? Could he have a D'angelo Russell like trajectory?


Anything is possible but I don't see it with DSJ (and I wanted him pre-draft).
RE: RE: I'd happily offer Thompson a max deal, even after the ACL.  
yatqb : 6/14/2019 10:11 am : link
In comment 14471910 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14471897 yatqb said:


Quote:


He's special and a lot younger than KD.


He's 30 in February, KD is 31 in September.


Didn't realize that, Dan. Nonetheless, an ACL is easier to come back from than an achilles, so I'd still think Thompson would be a better risk. I'd take both of them on a two-fer, though.
RE: RE: The question is  
Greg from LI : 6/14/2019 10:13 am : link
In comment 14471930 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14471922 TommyWiseau said:


Quote:


can Dennis Smith Jr turn it on in year 3? Could he have a D'angelo Russell like trajectory?



Anything is possible but I don't see it with DSJ (and I wanted him pre-draft).


Same. I was one of his biggest fans on BBI, but he just isn't panning out.
my comment was mostly  
bigbluehoya : 6/14/2019 10:15 am : link
tongue-in-cheek, with the pessimistic assumption that NYK fail to land Durant or Kawhi.

If Windhorst's speculation is correct that GS does offer KD a supermax, I think he'd be absolutely nuts not to take it. If I'm KD, that injury changes my mindset -- going to be a savior and do it myself somewhere else is no longer a priority. Collecting the maximum amount of $ and doing as much winning as I can, alpha dog or not, is now the MO. Just my opinion.

After those two players, using space to get more assets would be my next preferred course of action. (Not saying I'd take Wall specifically...that contract is simply too much for too long).
Lakers Luck  
TyreeHelmet : 6/14/2019 10:18 am : link
Is there a more charmed franchise in sports? They have a heavily protected pick that they never had to give up because they got the 2nd pick 3 years in a row.
- The best player in the world decides to sign with them mainly because they are in LA.
- They have a disastrous year yet jump all the way up to #4 in the lottery.
- Despite firing their coach, their president resigning, and reports rampant how poorly run they and how bad their culture is, the premier player on the trade market only wants to go there.

Once they get Anthony Davis, they may very well be the favorites next year due to the Durant and Klay injuries.

Meanwhile the Knicks cannot catch a break.
- Never moved up in the lottery once since 1985.
- Have the lottery odds change the year they are by far the worst team and end up with the 3rd pick in a 2 player draft.
- Finally are the favorites to land a true franchise superstar and the guy ruptures his Achilles in game 5 of the finals.
No way in hell  
TommyWiseau : 6/14/2019 10:18 am : link
would I take on John Wall's contract, not even for 5 first round picks.
The reality is the only way the Knicks  
Dave on the UWS : 6/14/2019 10:18 am : link
get better is through drafting: get lucky and develop players. Have to hope guys like Knox and Barrett will become stars. Its likely the only way they are getting any.
RE: RE: so which teams have bad contracts  
TyreeHelmet : 6/14/2019 10:33 am : link
In comment 14471912 The_Boss said:
Quote:
In comment 14471899 bigbluehoya said:


Quote:


that they'll be motivated to move?



Wall in DC comes to mind.


You're joking right? I wouldn't take that contract for any amount of picks.
Odds  
TyreeHelmet : 6/14/2019 10:36 am : link
Lakers are now title favorites in Vegas. Unbelievable...
When the Lakers inevitably get Anthony Davis  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 10:39 am : link
for a piece of shit trade package, it will really piss me off.

Barrett vs. Zion via Begley  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 10:42 am : link
NBA scout
"If his shot comes around, if his feel improves, if he starts defending, if he improves his finishing around the rim, improves efficiency, and if he starts passing moresure, but the odds are very heavily against him. He will have to be an outlier in multiple categories to overtake what Zion can / will be. Defense can be improved, shooting (at least catch and shoot) can improve, passing can improvebut off-dribble jumpers are immensely important to reach that "next level" for guards in the NBA, and I don't think his form translates well to that. Though the added space could help his finishing a little bit, his average touch and vertical pop/burst hurt him here; this means his efficiency likely stays around league average, unless he starts getting to the FT line at a very high rate (or his 3-point shot really comes around). Basically, there is a route, but it includes him improving heavily in multiple areas and Zion staying stagnant."

NBA scout
"Williamson and Barrett have consensus on their side, Barrett is definitely a higher risk but also maybe higher reward than Williamson. Zion is rare and unorthodox but still very "what you see is what you get" with the added upside of a likely improved shot. Given that 19-year -olds usually fill out, Williamson either needs to be extremely careful with his weight or the probable alternative is that he has physically peaked - a damn good peak but again "what you see is what you get." Barrett has room to grow. He needs a lot of things to go right for him but if they do, it's possible he could be a better pro. His shot isn't broken. The foundation is there and it doesn't worry me too much. It should improve. What worries me is his shot selection and finishing. He makes some really poor choices when he drives and usually gets in trouble. His best attribute is his vision on the perimeter. At 6'7, if he can clean up his decision making in traffic, improve his shot and then add in his already excellent passing and vision, you're looking at a very dangerous combo guard. That sounds like a lot to happen but with the added space and the way the game is called, it is not as far-fetched as it may sound. Personally, at 3, he is a bit risky for me and too much has to happen in the right situation. Given the market value of Barrett and the 3 pick, if there's no one else they love, I would look at moving down or packaging it (never exciting in a big market city but sometimes the right thing). If Duke really had 3 top 10 picks and yet had so many close games, either a couple of them are a little overrated in a mediocre draft class or there are some hard questions to be answered at Duke. I'm inclined to think it's the former."

Scout
"I think that is very possible. RJ is a beast. Zion is just so polarizing. He's definitely a talented player. But I think a lot of the hype has a lot to do with the time we live in. The question to ask yourself is, 'Would Vince Carter be getting this type of hype is he was coming into the league now? Or any dynamic dunker/athlete like Zion? RJ's shot really came along throughout the year last year. Zion has a bit of a slow setup on his perimeter shot. That's my only concern with him really. But Barrett is no doubt a franchise player."
Knicks  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 10:43 am : link
meeting with Morant today
RE: Knicks  
Giantz_comeback : 6/14/2019 10:45 am : link
In comment 14471983 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
meeting with Morant today


Due diligence in case the unexpected happens.
what do those guys know..  
Italianju : 6/14/2019 10:46 am : link
i read right here that Barrett is an awful basketball player
RE: When the Lakers inevitably get Anthony Davis  
Giantz_comeback : 6/14/2019 10:48 am : link
In comment 14471975 Chris684 said:
Quote:
for a piece of shit trade package, it will really piss me off.


Kuzma will be included. It's a dog and pony show. They put out they love Kuzma, Lakers finally acquiesce and'reluctantly' agree to include him. And it looks like the Lakers had to really stretch out to meet the Pels demands.

Meanwhile we likely get KD. Who else is the big question.
RE: what do those guys know..  
Giantz_comeback : 6/14/2019 10:49 am : link
In comment 14471988 Italianju said:
Quote:
i read right here that Barrett is an awful basketball player


Lol Barrett is a heck of a prospect. He will be the highest upside guy on the team the moment his name is called next Thursday.
RE: what do those guys know..  
Greg from LI : 6/14/2019 10:51 am : link
In comment 14471988 Italianju said:
Quote:
i read right here that Barrett is an awful basketball player


Uh huh....no one said he's awful. What I said is that he's not going to be a franchise player, that his game has significant hole despite his prowess as a volume scorer.

And gee, where have I heard this before? "His shot isn't broken. The foundation is there and it doesn't worry me too much. It should improve.".....exact same stuff people kept telling us about Shumpert and Frenchie, neither of whom ever developed a reliable jump shot (yeah, Frenchie still could, but anyone want to take that bet?).

Maybe  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 10:53 am : link
it's the leftiness but Barrett reminds me of a poor man's Harden
Woj  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 10:58 am : link
reporting the Wizards will offer Masai Ujiri 10 million per year and an ownership stake.
I'll mention this again  
Greg from LI : 6/14/2019 11:00 am : link
With Zion in the lineup, Duke was 29-3. Without him, with Barrett as the lead dog, they were 3-3, and they struggled like hell to beat a terrible Wake team at home for one of those wins.
RE: I'll mention this again  
Giantz_comeback : 6/14/2019 11:11 am : link
In comment 14472016 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
With Zion in the lineup, Duke was 29-3. Without him, with Barrett as the lead dog, they were 3-3, and they struggled like hell to beat a terrible Wake team at home for one of those wins.


Dukes team was pretty bad apart from Zion and Barrett
I know! Poor Duke  
Greg from LI : 6/14/2019 11:28 am : link
They were down to six or seven McD All Americans when Zion was out! Hard times to be sure.
RE: Woj  
TyreeHelmet : 6/14/2019 11:32 am : link
In comment 14472012 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
reporting the Wizards will offer Masai Ujiri 10 million per year and an ownership stake.


Never understood why the Knicks didnt do this. Putting aside the ownership deal, why wouldnt Dolan offer him 15-20 mill a year? Its a drop in the bucket for MSG and doesnt effect the cap...
RE: I'll mention this again  
TommyWiseau : 6/14/2019 11:32 am : link
In comment 14472016 Greg from LI said:
Quote:
With Zion in the lineup, Duke was 29-3. Without him, with Barrett as the lead dog, they were 3-3, and they struggled like hell to beat a terrible Wake team at home for one of those wins.


Okay, and when Zion was 29-3 as the lead dog, he had Barrett helping him out. Wow Duke wonj a higher % of games with both Zion and RJ on the court then they did with just one on the court!!!! Who would have thought?!?
How long before we start hearing  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 11:34 am : link
More concrete rumors? When can teams start talking to agents and players officially? I guess I am wondering how soon before we start getting some Woj bombs
Givony has Barrett > Morant fwiw  
Strahan91 : 6/14/2019 11:35 am : link
here's what he said:

Quote:
I'm a little surprised by how quickly everyone seems to have settled on the fact that Barrett is clearly an inferior prospect to Morant -- a statement you widely hear among NBA folks. It's not something I actually agree with, personally. If I were making the pick for Memphis, I would be all over Barrett at No. 2, not just because of his positional fit on the roster alongside Mike Conley (although that helps), but also because of Barrett's overall talent level and modern NBA qualities.

These NBA playoff games have been eye-opening. The league's best teams have a big guard/wing in Barrett's mold who is asked to carry a huge amount of playmaking responsibility, both in the half-court and in the open floor. Having more size on the floor gives you clear advantages defensively with the amount of switching every team does. It also leads to numerous cross-matching situations in which the opposing team is forced to decide between giving up a good look early in the clock -- death in today's NBA game -- or having the wrong defender matched up with a team's best player, which is often just as bad.

Barrett is ideally suited for that big wing role with his ability to bust out in transition and make reads out of pick-and-rolls, as he's a much better athlete than he gets credit for. According to P3 sports science data from last year, Barrett tested very well relative to NBA athletes in acceleration and posted elite deceleration metrics, on par with James Harden.

He's a freight train once he gets downhill. He brings elite body control, and he's as aggressive as they come seeking out contact in the paint. He's going to continue to improve his pull-up jumper as his career moves along due to his outstanding work ethic, as he has already made huge strides in that area over the past few years. Combine that with his court vision, scoring instincts, competitiveness and the fact that he still hasn't turned 19 years old, and you have everything you look for in a modern NBA prospect.

Mike, like you pointed out, this Duke team was poorly constructed, which made it much easier for opposing defenses to pack the paint and force Barrett to navigate tight spaces while not possessing elite shooting ability himself. He's going to look much better with the ball in his hands surrounded by NBA shooters, especially as his feel for how to play to his strengths evolves into his 20s.

Link - ( New Window )
RE: How long before we start hearing  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 11:45 am : link
In comment 14472057 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
More concrete rumors? When can teams start talking to agents and players officially? I guess I am wondering how soon before we start getting some Woj bombs


I woiodnt be surprised to hear an AD trade soon, but i dont think you will hear about any signings
Not  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 11:45 am : link
his fault but the Knicks were one of the worst shooting teams in the NBA so the last line... likely doesn't change his rookie season.
RE: How long before we start hearing  
Enzo : 6/14/2019 11:49 am : link
In comment 14472057 GMEN46 said:
Quote:
More concrete rumors? When can teams start talking to agents and players officially? I guess I am wondering how soon before we start getting some Woj bombs

it's all gonna be speculation until free agency officially opens. Some guys usually sign right away. Some guys take meetings.

I'm curious which group Ron Baker will fall into this year...
Bondy  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 1:20 pm : link
argues against a Durant (only) move
Link - ( New Window )
Knicks exercised Trier's option  
Strahan91 : 6/14/2019 1:38 pm : link
according to Shams
RE: Knicks exercised Trier's option  
TommyWiseau : 6/14/2019 1:58 pm : link
In comment 14472189 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
according to Shams


Good
RE: Knicks exercised Trier's option  
Jan in DC : 6/14/2019 2:01 pm : link
In comment 14472189 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
according to Shams


Might as well at this point.
RE: Knicks exercised Trier's option  
Enzo : 6/14/2019 2:13 pm : link
In comment 14472189 Strahan91 said:
Quote:
according to Shams

weird example of a guy that did better financially by going undrafted.
RE: RE: Knicks exercised Trier's option  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 2:13 pm : link
In comment 14472221 Jan in DC said:
Quote:
In comment 14472189 Strahan91 said:


Quote:


according to Shams



Might as well at this point.


it effects nothing regarding free agency
For those who dont want to sign Durant  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 2:51 pm : link
Then you would have to wait until 2021 free agency to hope to get some stars because 2020 is awful besides Anthony Davis.
Klay's  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 2:59 pm : link
dad says he's staying with GS and Durant has hinting he might be as well.
RE: Klay's  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 3:01 pm : link
In comment 14472258 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
dad says he's staying with GS and Durant has hinting he might be as well.


Strike the Durant part, misleading headline from Berman.
LANCE THOMAS Update:  
LawrenceTaylor56 : 6/14/2019 3:21 pm : link
Quote:
The Knicks have a few other team options to decide on and also have until June 30 to decide on guaranteeing $1 million of veteran leader Lance Thomas' $7.6 million salary.

The Knicks currently plan to waive Thomas ahead of the guarantee date, per SNY sources.

But the club has interest in bringing the veteran back as a free agent, sources say. Thomas' leadership and professionalism is held in high regard in the organization and he is respected for his mentorship to younger players.
RE: RE: Klay's  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 3:31 pm : link
In comment 14472259 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14472258 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


dad says he's staying with GS and Durant has hinting he might be as well.



Strike the Durant part, misleading headline from Berman.


berman reading into them telling each other they have unfinished business
I agree with the poster who wrote that  
GiantsUA : 6/14/2019 3:32 pm : link
Boogie Cousins and Kyrie would be more of the same for the Knicks, some nice moments but no deep playoff runs.
Just listened to Simmons & he'd be floored if KD return to GS.  
SFGFNCGiantsFan : 6/14/2019 3:46 pm : link
Apparently Jay Williams was on ESPN the other day & lit into the Dubs for how they handled the injury situation/misdiagnosed it. Why does that matter? Jay is close with KD & has been on KD's 'The Boardroom'.
Man imagine signing KD and Klay, drafting Barrett and us and Mavs  
Zeke's Alibi : 6/14/2019 3:50 pm : link
sucking in 2020 year. We could potentially be awesome for years.
I hate to say it  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 3:53 pm : link
but nothing with Durant really matters much anymore.

I wouldn't sign him, but even if they do it will be the most underwhelming acquisition of a superstar for any of the teams I root for.

A max contract for a guy who won't be able to play in year one, and who will be 31-32 years old before he steps back on the court with a surgically repaired achilles tendon.

Listening to the doctor from HSS with Francesa yesterday totally convinced me to just stay away.

I'm actually sad as a Knicks fan. I think if Durant didn't get hurt we were looking at either:

Durant and Davis or Kemba, Durant and Barrett.

Now they should just keep tabs on Kawhi and Russell and move forward with the longer rebuild.

The good news is all is not lost unless the Knicks get fucking stupid with money.
RE: LANCE THOMAS Update:  
Anakim : 6/14/2019 3:55 pm : link
In comment 14472276 LawrenceTaylor56 said:
Quote:


Quote:


The Knicks have a few other team options to decide on and also have until June 30 to decide on guaranteeing $1 million of veteran leader Lance Thomas' $7.6 million salary.

The Knicks currently plan to waive Thomas ahead of the guarantee date, per SNY sources.

But the club has interest in bringing the veteran back as a free agent, sources say. Thomas' leadership and professionalism is held in high regard in the organization and he is respected for his mentorship to younger players.




HOLIDAY! CELEBRATE!
RE: RE: LANCE THOMAS Update:  
Anakim : 6/14/2019 3:56 pm : link
In comment 14472296 Anakim said:
Quote:
In comment 14472276 LawrenceTaylor56 said:


Quote:




Quote:


The Knicks have a few other team options to decide on and also have until June 30 to decide on guaranteeing $1 million of veteran leader Lance Thomas' $7.6 million salary.

The Knicks currently plan to waive Thomas ahead of the guarantee date, per SNY sources.

But the club has interest in bringing the veteran back as a free agent, sources say. Thomas' leadership and professionalism is held in high regard in the organization and he is respected for his mentorship to younger players.






HOLIDAY! CELEBRATE!



Annnnnnnd I just read the next paragraph
Lance Thomas mentor and all around good guy.  
GiantsUA : 6/14/2019 4:18 pm : link
That and 2.53 cents will get you a cup of coffee.
Lance thomas actually could be a good asset  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 4:19 pm : link
if traded before june 30th
RE: I agree with the poster who wrote that  
Stu11 : 6/14/2019 4:40 pm : link
In comment 14472281 GiantsUA said:
Quote:
Boogie Cousins and Kyrie would be more of the same for the Knicks, some nice moments but no deep playoff runs.

You guys are suffering from battered Knicks fan syndrome. When have we ever had 2 players of that caliber, the 3rd overall pick in the draft along with 3 players on our roster who've been top 10 picks the past 3 seasons not to mention Mitch, and multiple #1 picks 2 of the next 4 seasons??? Signing those 2 would not be the end of the road for the next 5 years. Not by a long shot.
Awfully quiet around the anthony davis market  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 4:51 pm : link
..
Guy  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 4:54 pm : link
I know who writes NBA articles says he's heard the Celtics are the internal favorites for Davis.
Knicks  
DanMetroMan : 6/14/2019 5:07 pm : link
updated cap situation
Link - ( New Window )
RE: Guy  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 5:07 pm : link
In comment 14472349 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
I know who writes NBA articles says he's heard the Celtics are the internal favorites for Davis.


This would be positive as there would most likely be chance to get him next year.

If its LA I dont see any possibility he doesnt stay there.
Crazy knicks odds to win the championship  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 5:21 pm : link
Were 16-1 a few weeks ago and I just read that ceasers now has them at 2,200 - 1.
MY BAD  
GMEN46 : 6/14/2019 5:28 pm : link
They are 22-1
RE: RE: I agree with the poster who wrote that  
Ten Ton Hammer : 6/14/2019 5:29 pm : link
In comment 14472333 Stu11 said:
Quote:
In comment 14472281 GiantsUA said:


Quote:


Boogie Cousins and Kyrie would be more of the same for the Knicks, some nice moments but no deep playoff runs.


You guys are suffering from battered Knicks fan syndrome. When have we ever had 2 players of that caliber, the 3rd overall pick in the draft along with 3 players on our roster who've been top 10 picks the past 3 seasons not to mention Mitch, and multiple #1 picks 2 of the next 4 seasons??? Signing those 2 would not be the end of the road for the next 5 years. Not by a long shot.


Boogie cousins is damaged goods now, but even when he was at his best isnt the kind of player that leads a team anywhere. Neither is Kyrie.
Cousins is a head case  
Enzo : 6/14/2019 5:46 pm : link
Might be even more talented then Davis, but you can't rely on him. No way I pay that guy huge money. Kyrie has his issues but if he's your #2 guy I think he can be managed. But if he's your lead guy...good luck.
Boogie Cousins was a malcontent when he was in SAC  
GiantsUA : 6/14/2019 5:49 pm : link
Kyrie's basketball body is on the back 9 so to speak
RE: No way in hell  
JustaDiscussion : 6/14/2019 9:00 pm : link
In comment 14471945 TommyWiseau said:
Quote:
would I take on John Wall's contract, not even for 5 first round picks.


If the Knicks were offered 5 first round picks to take Wall I personally would say yes immediately. I'd actually consider it for 2 first round picks if they could get one of them unprotected. If the Knicks are going to be lucky in the draft they need as many opportunities as possible. Also, even though he hasn't been great, when Wall comes back he still might be the best PG the Knicks have had since... I can't think of a good Knicks PG.

As I mentioned before, I'm with the group who would not want to offer KD a 4 year max contract. It's been said that he'll still be tall and will still be able to shoot, but how many others have said that a tall frame is more prone to foot and leg injuries. I wouldn't be surprised if KD is always tweaking this or hurting that after he come back.

I agree that the Knicks should only be targeting Kawhi and Russell at this point. The Boogie talk seems ridiculous to me long term, but if nobody offers him the max, I wouldn't mind if the Knicks gave him a max 1 year deal. Then throw a ton of money at someone like Redick for 1 year to open up the floor for the rookies. After that I bet it would be easy to reach the cap floor. I have reverted back to my hopes that the Knicks play the long game. Quick fixes haven't worked for 20 years.
according to begely  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 9:54 pm : link
Nets expected to let russell walk if they sign irving, the second that happens if i am the knicks i am calling him...

I am also calling julius randle and building a nice young squad..

Russell/smith jr
Barrett/trier
Knox
Randle
Robinson

maybe bring back vonleh as well
RE: according to begely  
Chris684 : 6/14/2019 10:15 pm : link
In comment 14472565 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
Nets expected to let russell walk if they sign irving, the second that happens if i am the knicks i am calling him...

I am also calling julius randle and building a nice young squad..

Russell/smith jr
Barrett/trier
Knox
Randle
Robinson

maybe bring back vonleh as well


Given the circumstances, Russell and Barrett would be a productive little offseason, with still more cap space and all of our picks/Dallas picks.

RE: according to begely  
Mike in NJ : 6/14/2019 10:16 pm : link
In comment 14472565 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
Nets expected to let russell walk if they sign irving, the second that happens if i am the knicks i am calling him...

I am also calling julius randle and building a nice young squad..

Russell/smith jr
Barrett/trier
Knox
Randle
Robinson

maybe bring back vonleh as well


Agreed. The Knicks better be all over Russell if Brooklyn is going to let him go, and I like Randle as well. Hes underrated and would probably come at a pretty reasonable price.
Plus Russell's max is only 23 million  
nygiants16 : 6/14/2019 10:47 pm : link
knicks would have 46 million left to fillnout roster
RE: according to begely  
bigbluehoya : 6/14/2019 11:25 pm : link
In comment 14472565 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
Nets expected to let russell walk if they sign irving, the second that happens if i am the knicks i am calling him...

I am also calling julius randle and building a nice young squad..

Russell/smith jr
Barrett/trier
Knox
Randle
Robinson

maybe bring back vonleh as well


I actually like this. It isnt winning a damn thing next season, but its not a bad table setting at all, going into 2020 with 3 first rounders and a fist full of money.

Would also be very fun to watch that group grow/struggle night in and night out.

What do you think randle costs to sign?
The irving to nets thing still doesnt make sense  
nygiants16 : 6/15/2019 7:56 am : link
It just doesnt seem like a nets move, current regime..This seems like an old nets move...

Say they get kyrie and do not get KD, they get Butler or Harris, yes they are good but are they a championship contender? jist doesnt make sense
overthinking it  
hitdog42 : 6/15/2019 8:08 am : link
if they dont get irving they resign dlo. The only reason they can get a guy like irving is because of the new nets regime... system, culture, performance team, handling of players behind the scenes.
the new regime is also player development within a system. the nets think Levert can be an All Star player, same with Jaret Allen. So if they believe that, and pair them with Irving and a Tobias or something... its within the vision of the team. you are just swapping Irving for Dlo... 1 making more but both making a lot... one being a for sure All NBA guy, the other an all star.
the old nets and the new nets literally have zero in common.
like this years nets team  
hitdog42 : 6/15/2019 8:12 am : link
with Dlo playing bad in the playoffs, was beating the sixers in several games. the sixers took the raptors to 7 games. the raptors won the title.
insert Kyrie for Dlo... insert Tobias or Jimmy for Kurucs... insert player development on levert and Allen....its not a reach to say that team can compete with anyone.... yes a lot of assumptions... but in the end with tobias and kyrie you would still have one of the youngest starting lineups for playoff teams in the NBA.
Hitdog i get what yiu are saying  
nygiants16 : 6/15/2019 8:20 am : link
but it is not just simply swapping irving for russell, and then play the same style, your style will completely change with irving. Go ask Brad Stevens if they played the way they wanted to play.

Signing irving you immediately go to iso ball..
I will go back and forth 10 more times BUT  
nygiants16 : 6/15/2019 8:31 am : link
If the Nets really are signing irving, i am offering Russell a contract at 601, you can build a really nice young team with a all the cap space the Knicks have
usage rate and system  
hitdog42 : 6/15/2019 8:31 am : link
Nets run pick and roll up top all day. Dlo was like top 5-6 in the NBA in usage (well ahead of Kyrie) with a much worse TS%. Kyrie in the nets system is using a lot of high pick and roll with a lot of off ball movement. And then its playing off ball with Levert or Dinwiddie handling.
It is not like Dlo is some PG who is not overdribbling himself.
So Irving actually does fit the system they ran last year.
RE: I will go back and forth 10 more times BUT  
hitdog42 : 6/15/2019 8:32 am : link
In comment 14472634 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
If the Nets really are signing irving, i am offering Russell a contract at 601, you can build a really nice young team with a all the cap space the Knicks have


makes sense to me and he likes/fits the NY vibe. and he can play off ball if you draft a point/forward type like barrett-
RE: usage rate and system  
nygiants16 : 6/15/2019 8:37 am : link
In comment 14472635 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
Nets run pick and roll up top all day. Dlo was like top 5-6 in the NBA in usage (well ahead of Kyrie) with a much worse TS%. Kyrie in the nets system is using a lot of high pick and roll with a lot of off ball movement. And then its playing off ball with Levert or Dinwiddie handling.
It is not like Dlo is some PG who is not overdribbling himself.
So Irving actually does fit the system they ran last year.


you know a lot more about the nets than me so if you think it makes sense no reason for me to question
Knicks don't have the luxury of Durant.  
FStubbs : 6/15/2019 10:02 am : link
They've seen this show before. They know how it ends up. He comes back for 2020-2021 a shell of himself and then the Knicks are stuck with a bad guaranteed max contract that makes them losers for a few more years.

Building around young players is the right move, and one they've never been patient with.
Id hate to let DLo walk for nothing and Ill believe it when I see it  
Eric on Li : 6/15/2019 10:16 am : link
I see no reason to not at minimum give him and Kyrie a year to see if they can play together. Id sooner resign DLo than any other FA (other than Leonard) with Kyrie and then just sign a stop gap PF with the remaining cap room. Or trade Dinwiddie for a lotto pick if someone like Clarke falls.
RE: overthinking it  
djm : 6/15/2019 2:58 pm : link
In comment 14472627 hitdog42 said:
Quote:
if they dont get irving they resign dlo. The only reason they can get a guy like irving is because of the new nets regime... system, culture, performance team, handling of players behind the scenes.
the new regime is also player development within a system. the nets think Levert can be an All Star player, same with Jaret Allen. So if they believe that, and pair them with Irving and a Tobias or something... its within the vision of the team. you are just swapping Irving for Dlo... 1 making more but both making a lot... one being a for sure All NBA guy, the other an all star.
the old nets and the new nets literally have zero in common.


Literally?

God I hate what that word has morphed into. What happened to the word literally? Seriously... why?
RE: RE: overthinking it  
81_Great_Dane : 6/16/2019 2:11 pm : link
In comment 14472825 djm said:
Quote:
Literally?

God I hate what that word has morphed into. What happened to the word literally? Seriously... why?
"Literally" has become a contronym a word that means itself and its opposite. There are others: dust -- to take remove dust, or to sprinkle dust over. Cleave -- to separate, or to adhere closely.

I hate that.

My even bigger pet peeve is "disinterested." It is not the same as "uninterested." Disinterested means impartial, neutral, as in "having no stake/interest in the outcome." You want the judge in your lawsuit to be disinterested. You don't want him to be uninterested. It's a very useful word. But because people get them confused all the time, "disinterested" is losing its meaning. And that's a damn shame.
RE: I will go back and forth 10 more times BUT  
Heisenberg : 6/17/2019 7:42 am : link
In comment 14472634 nygiants16 said:
Quote:
If the Nets really are signing irving, i am offering Russell a contract at 601, you can build a really nice young team with a all the cap space the Knicks have


I agree with this.
If you sign  
nygiants16 : 6/17/2019 8:00 am : link
Russell and Randle, trade smith and frank you could get close to have money to add a max, whether it is this free agency or roll it over..
is this appealling?  
nygiants16 : 6/17/2019 8:04 am : link
russell/vet point
Barrett/trier
Harris/knox
randle/vet big
Robinson/vet center

obviously the hope would be russell and barrett grow into a dynamic back court and robinson continues to grow into being an anchor defensively..

Team is young enough with a ton of room to grow
I'm hoping that they pass on Durant and Klay - fool's gold for reasons  
Ira : 6/17/2019 8:29 am : link
already explained in this thread. There are other free agents that they can be difference makers. They should look for younger two way players. We're not a player or two away from being a competitor, but we can add young players to build around.
I would be wary of Russell  
Greg from LI : 6/17/2019 8:59 am : link
Guy who was a draft bust has one good year.....not sure that's a player I want to give a huge contract to.
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