When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
He has changed the league, everything operates the way he envisioned now and the players have total control. The Decision set off this whole era. As a Knicks fan it’s frustrating to always be on the outside looking in and as a fan of the league it would be interesting to go into a season without a team that’s a ridiculously huge favorite. But I give LeBron and the players in general credit for making the league their own. He really has a handle on things I don’t think any other player has had in history.
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Who idiotically think “Rings” are what makes players great and shit on those who can’t get it done.
Jordan being 6/6 in the Finals is not why he’s the modern GOAT. He’s the GOAT because of his insane skill/athleticism/mindset combination. Bill Russell gets pigeonholed as a GOAT candidate because of his 11 rings, he’d be in my Top 5 with less than half his rings because what made him great was his transcendent athleticism/IQ combination.
Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing aren’t “losers” because they didn’t win rings. They had some flaws in their offensive games that kept them from being dominant against elite competition and they also ran into better teams led by better players (MJ/Hakeem).
At the very least the RINGGZZZ logic can stop and people will hopefully realize what makes a player truly great.
RE: RE: What’a worse about Kawhi is he HAS two rings. Â
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Then just go to the the Clippers instead of creating the MonStars
RE: RE: RE: What’a worse about Kawhi is he HAS two rings. Â
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Then just go to the the Clippers instead of creating the MonStars
Didn't he grow up a Lakers' fan? Who would go to their hometown rivals' team?
I hope he stays with Toronto. The whole nonesense that is the NBA offseason where players write the league narrative pisses me off. I`m also not excited to watch another mercenary team on the court. It`s bad enough having to watch Lebron out there.
Stuff like this makes it so hard for me to enjoy this league.
No one wants a challenge anymore... everyone just wants to play in the same city and build super teams.
I never quite looked at it like that. I don't think the players join forces and think, "Well this will be a cinch no... we'll face no challenge whatsoever!" I think it's more akin to great jazz legends collaborating on an album or live -- they're aware of the potential sum of the talented parts, and that's gotta be very appealing.
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Why would that make his decision worse? Wouldn't it diminish the criticism that he just wants rings, since he already has them?
I'm sure rings ARE a factor, but maybe he primarily wants to enjoy his career as much as poasible?
it all gets easier to understand when you realize Â
that fans and players have completely different needs and motivations.
To fans, the NBA is a sport and just entertainment. Some fans take it was more seriously than others, but it's a diversion from the obligations in our lives.
We root for our teams, but we also root for what we think is in the best interest of the league; as a result, we hate any moves that we think will jeopardize the narrative intrigue and competitive nature of the league.
But for players, NBA decisions are life decisions. Signing with a team requires them to decide where they will live (including location relative to their family), what their job role will be, if they want to work for a particular boss (coach), how they feel about the culture and colleagues (teammates, locker room), and how they feel about their boss's boss's vision (front office).
I guess I side with the players because I'm closing in on a position where I can start to call my career shots a bit more. At this rate, within a few years my family should have a few options to weigh and a lot of the factors you stated will shape how we do so.
I'd obviously not be mad if they all came to the Knicks. I just don't love the landscape of the league. Players just call all the shots and if they don't get their way, they hold their team hostage until they get traded or freed up to play with their buddies.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Were revisited for the lakers with shaquille and Kobe.....and now.....(drumroll) after many years in obscurity... james and Leonard? Can lightning strike again? Standby for lots of close ups of jack courtside....!
I hope he stays with Toronto. The whole nonesense that is the NBA offseason where players write the league narrative pisses me off. I`m also not excited to watch another mercenary team on the court. It`s bad enough having to watch Lebron out there.
Send all 3 to the Knicks please. I’ll happily watch them. Will even include Payton, Ellington and Bullock because today on BBI I learned these guys will be taking the Knicks to the playoffs. May even include Bobby Portis if it gets it done....
I hope he stays with Toronto. The whole nonesense that is the NBA offseason where players write the league narrative pisses me off. I`m also not excited to watch another mercenary team on the court. It`s bad enough having to watch Lebron out there.
Send all 3 to the Knicks please. I’ll happily watch them. Will even include Payton, Ellington and Bullock because today on BBI I learned these guys will be taking the Knicks to the playoffs. May even include Bobby Portis if it gets it done....
I don't know that I've ever seen someone play the same note so frequently since the John Jerry troll...
I'm saying that as a Nets fan. Tired of these super teams. Its just super boring when all of these guys play on the same team.
how do the nets have a super team? they swapped out an AS point guard for an All NBA point guard, and used cap space to sign a SF with a torn achilles.
they kept all of their young talent (ex the swap)- and have picks moving forward (phillys next year and acquired a GS one further out).
I don't like the lakers but kudos to them for maneuvering cap space to make all of this happen.
Come to think of it, the “preferred destinations” recently have Â
if he can pull this off, but the NBA should take a long, hard look at how LAL and LeBron are subverting the cap. AD foregoes his trade kicker, but gets a role in LeBron's Space Jam? Just a coincidence, I'm sure. We'll see if Kawhi gets a part in it as well. I guarantee he won't if he's not a Laker.
if he can pull this off, but the NBA should take a long, hard look at how LAL and LeBron are subverting the cap. AD foregoes his trade kicker, but gets a role in LeBron's Space Jam? Just a coincidence, I'm sure. We'll see if Kawhi gets a part in it as well. I guarantee he won't if he's not a Laker.
I'm sure the NBA has taken a long look at this.
He got a role in Space Jam because he's a top 5 player, is represented by the same agency and the same footwear brand. Even if he didn't go to the Lakers he'd be in this movie.
RE: The frustrating thing is, the casual fans around the league want this. Â
And the players around the league generally don't rail against this, at least judging by their social media responses.
This is a different generation, I guess we shouldn't be surprised. This is how society in general is going. When things get tough, take the easy way out.
Haha, maybe an over generalization, but this fucking blows as a Knicks fan.
These lazy hot takes hurt the brain. May as well whine about Millennials and Reddit like you were someone's grandpa.
if he can pull this off, but the NBA should take a long, hard look at how LAL and LeBron are subverting the cap. AD foregoes his trade kicker, but gets a role in LeBron's Space Jam? Just a coincidence, I'm sure. We'll see if Kawhi gets a part in it as well. I guarantee he won't if he's not a Laker.
you're probably not wrong but other players have waived trade kickers. Kyrie did it 2 years ago and so did Melo (albeit for different reasons). IMO, some of the late career contracts for guys like Duncan and Dirk were a little questionable in terms of potentially subverting the cap.
From 1970 to 1987, there were no repeat champions in the NBA. Nine different teams won those eighteen titles. Starting in 1988, ten teams have won 32 titles.
RE: at least different teams made the finals then Â
We just saw four straight Warriors-Cavs finals before this year. Even the Lakers and Celtics of the '80s didn't do that.
There was a lot of luck in that. OKC had GS down 3-1, HOU had a 3-2 lead (going off the top of my head). I don't think the league is as 'pre-ordained' as it seems with hindsight.
RE: and now that I'm actually looking at it..... Â
From 1970 to 1987, there were no repeat champions in the NBA. Nine different teams won those eighteen titles. Starting in 1988, ten teams have won 32 titles.
I'd obviously not be mad if they all came to the Knicks. I just don't love the landscape of the league. Players just call all the shots and if they don't get their way, they hold their team hostage until they get traded or freed up to play with their buddies.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Your grandmother is not a Nets fan, I suppose?
Another random weirdo who follows my baseball fandom that I cannot recall having a single exchange with here.
I'll humor you, though!
She's not a hoops fan. My grandfather was a C's fan, actually. So, that's a no-go for me.
But again... people keep trying this joke with the Nets, Jets and Islanders. It doesn't work and isn't analogous. Find a new angle. At least make me laugh or impress me with something clever.
I'd obviously not be mad if they all came to the Knicks. I just don't love the landscape of the league. Players just call all the shots and if they don't get their way, they hold their team hostage until they get traded or freed up to play with their buddies.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Your grandmother is not a Nets fan, I suppose?
Another random weirdo who follows my baseball fandom that I cannot recall having a single exchange with here.
I'll humor you, though!
She's not a hoops fan. My grandfather was a C's fan, actually. So, that's a no-go for me.
But again... people keep trying this joke with the Nets, Jets and Islanders. It doesn't work and isn't analogous. Find a new angle. At least make me laugh or impress me with something clever.
Just for the record.
It doesn't take a stalker to know you are now #1 Yankee fan.
I mean did you or did you not start a new thread about it at the time? Accusing people of stalking you about it is just your defense mechanism.
The thread I started was over a year ago, and it was supposed to be humorous. I can't believe how much some of you guys care about this - it's really not a big deal.
I stopped following a baseball team after about 2 decades because it's clear to me they aren't trying to win and I no longer want to give them my money or attention.
Deal with it. The only place I post about the Yankees is in Yankees threads. I know you read them all; but that's not my problem.
I'm happy with my decision. Sorry it bugs y'all and sorry you're having such a bad season.
Lebron did this to the Cavs his last few years there when he was there the first time.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Jordan being 6/6 in the Finals is not why he’s the modern GOAT. He’s the GOAT because of his insane skill/athleticism/mindset combination. Bill Russell gets pigeonholed as a GOAT candidate because of his 11 rings, he’d be in my Top 5 with less than half his rings because what made him great was his transcendent athleticism/IQ combination.
Karl Malone and Patrick Ewing aren’t “losers” because they didn’t win rings. They had some flaws in their offensive games that kept them from being dominant against elite competition and they also ran into better teams led by better players (MJ/Hakeem).
At the very least the RINGGZZZ logic can stop and people will hopefully realize what makes a player truly great.
Quote:
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Then just go to the the Clippers instead of creating the MonStars
Quote:
In comment 14489143 bceagle05 said:
Quote:
When Lebron left Cleveland the first time, and KD left OKC, neither had any rings. They were getting nervous about a ringless legacy. Kawhi has no such concerns.
Idk. I think that's actually to Kawhi's credit. He's from LA. He's not ring chasing. I have more respect for a hometown kid coming back to his hometown team than KD's gutless move.
Then just go to the the Clippers instead of creating the MonStars
Didn't he grow up a Lakers' fan? Who would go to their hometown rivals' team?
Barkley, Ewing, Malone, Stockton, Miller, Dominique etc. all get their legacies questioned because they never won titles.
The narrow parameters of what is a great legacy in the NBA is absurd.
You've got to basically win with the team that drafted you, and preferably with little help.
New thread:
"Can someone help me understand the appeal of pro wrestling the NBA?"
That’s almost always been the case going back to the dominant Celtics teams in the 60s.
No one wants a challenge anymore... everyone just wants to play in the same city and build super teams.
I never quite looked at it like that. I don't think the players join forces and think, "Well this will be a cinch no... we'll face no challenge whatsoever!" I think it's more akin to great jazz legends collaborating on an album or live -- they're aware of the potential sum of the talented parts, and that's gotta be very appealing.
Go Utah.
Why would that make his decision worse? Wouldn't it diminish the criticism that he just wants rings, since he already has them?
I'm sure rings ARE a factor, but maybe he primarily wants to enjoy his career as much as poasible?
To fans, the NBA is a sport and just entertainment. Some fans take it was more seriously than others, but it's a diversion from the obligations in our lives.
We root for our teams, but we also root for what we think is in the best interest of the league; as a result, we hate any moves that we think will jeopardize the narrative intrigue and competitive nature of the league.
But for players, NBA decisions are life decisions. Signing with a team requires them to decide where they will live (including location relative to their family), what their job role will be, if they want to work for a particular boss (coach), how they feel about the culture and colleagues (teammates, locker room), and how they feel about their boss's boss's vision (front office).
Twitter randos: “I have another update from inside the Lakers with new information since my last update 5 minutes ago”
This. This multiplied by infinity divided by accurate as fuck.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Your grandmother is not a Nets fan, I suppose?
Send all 3 to the Knicks please. I’ll happily watch them. Will even include Payton, Ellington and Bullock because today on BBI I learned these guys will be taking the Knicks to the playoffs. May even include Bobby Portis if it gets it done....
Quote:
I hope he stays with Toronto. The whole nonesense that is the NBA offseason where players write the league narrative pisses me off. I`m also not excited to watch another mercenary team on the court. It`s bad enough having to watch Lebron out there.
Send all 3 to the Knicks please. I’ll happily watch them. Will even include Payton, Ellington and Bullock because today on BBI I learned these guys will be taking the Knicks to the playoffs. May even include Bobby Portis if it gets it done....
I don't know that I've ever seen someone play the same note so frequently since the John Jerry troll...
I don't know that I've ever seen someone play the same note so frequently since the John Jerry troll...
Frequently with such repeated failure and stupidity.
Quote:
I don't know that I've ever seen someone play the same note so frequently since the John Jerry troll...
Frequently with such repeated failure and stupidity.
This was clearly a joke but I’m curious what you view as stupidity and failure?
how do the nets have a super team? they swapped out an AS point guard for an All NBA point guard, and used cap space to sign a SF with a torn achilles.
they kept all of their young talent (ex the swap)- and have picks moving forward (phillys next year and acquired a GS one further out).
I don't like the lakers but kudos to them for maneuvering cap space to make all of this happen.
Can’t wait. Talented, yes, probably most ever. GOAT? Not even close.
I'm sure the NBA has taken a long look at this.
He got a role in Space Jam because he's a top 5 player, is represented by the same agency and the same footwear brand. Even if he didn't go to the Lakers he'd be in this movie.
This is a different generation, I guess we shouldn't be surprised. This is how society in general is going. When things get tough, take the easy way out.
Haha, maybe an over generalization, but this fucking blows as a Knicks fan.
These lazy hot takes hurt the brain. May as well whine about Millennials and Reddit like you were someone's grandpa.
Quote:
2/3 of the league shouldn't even bother showing up.
New thread:
"Can someone help me understand the appeal of pro wrestling the NBA?"
Well, sometimes I do wonder why anyone is a fan of any teams but a tiny handful.
You deserve a Matt Cooke elbow for that one
you're probably not wrong but other players have waived trade kickers. Kyrie did it 2 years ago and so did Melo (albeit for different reasons). IMO, some of the late career contracts for guys like Duncan and Dirk were a little questionable in terms of potentially subverting the cap.
There was a lot of luck in that. OKC had GS down 3-1, HOU had a 3-2 lead (going off the top of my head). I don't think the league is as 'pre-ordained' as it seems with hindsight.
I blame John Starks.
Even during that period, you had a handful of teams that were dominating their conferences for several-year stretches at a time.
Quote:
I'd obviously not be mad if they all came to the Knicks. I just don't love the landscape of the league. Players just call all the shots and if they don't get their way, they hold their team hostage until they get traded or freed up to play with their buddies.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Your grandmother is not a Nets fan, I suppose?
Another random weirdo who follows my baseball fandom that I cannot recall having a single exchange with here.
I'll humor you, though!
She's not a hoops fan. My grandfather was a C's fan, actually. So, that's a no-go for me.
But again... people keep trying this joke with the Nets, Jets and Islanders. It doesn't work and isn't analogous. Find a new angle. At least make me laugh or impress me with something clever.
Quote:
In comment 14489092 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
I'd obviously not be mad if they all came to the Knicks. I just don't love the landscape of the league. Players just call all the shots and if they don't get their way, they hold their team hostage until they get traded or freed up to play with their buddies.
It's just not that enjoyable to me - but the ratings and everything else say this is what people like now, so I guess I'm just old and grumpy. Just seems like most of these guys want the path of least resistance.
I don't expect anyone to deliberately take the hard road; it just feels weak and cheap to keep seeing teams form like this.
The Lakers were being talked about like the biggest circus in the league mere weeks ago - now they're potentially looking at a killer Big 3 that will plow through the West (and the league) if those guys stay healthy.
God forbid they ever have to deal with actual adversity there.
Your grandmother is not a Nets fan, I suppose?
Another random weirdo who follows my baseball fandom that I cannot recall having a single exchange with here.
I'll humor you, though!
She's not a hoops fan. My grandfather was a C's fan, actually. So, that's a no-go for me.
But again... people keep trying this joke with the Nets, Jets and Islanders. It doesn't work and isn't analogous. Find a new angle. At least make me laugh or impress me with something clever.
Just for the record.
It doesn't take a stalker to know you are now #1 Yankee fan.
I mean did you or did you not start a new thread about it at the time? Accusing people of stalking you about it is just your defense mechanism.
Yet another response on a completely off-topic subject - totally not stalker behavior!
The thread I started was over a year ago, and it was supposed to be humorous. I can't believe how much some of you guys care about this - it's really not a big deal.
I stopped following a baseball team after about 2 decades because it's clear to me they aren't trying to win and I no longer want to give them my money or attention.
Deal with it. The only place I post about the Yankees is in Yankees threads. I know you read them all; but that's not my problem.
I'm happy with my decision. Sorry it bugs y'all and sorry you're having such a bad season.
Quote:
I mean did you or did you not start a new thread about it at the time? Accusing people of stalking you about it is just your defense mechanism.
Yet another response on a completely off-topic subject - totally not stalker behavior!
No matter how many times I tell this dude I barely even read his posts or notice his existence here, he just can't stop himself.
I'm in his head, I guess. Not my problem.