Z, all due respect but I haven't seen a single person claim the Mets have a top 10-12 farm system right now. It's simply not good. They're nowhere near top 10. They're likely not even top 20.
How you can keep saying that spending isn't an issue is crazy to me... but we never agreed on that before and probably aren't going to now.
DJ LeMahieu was never "washed up"
If you want to talk about ludicrous bullshit, that's the biggest BS statement in this entire thread. The guy was just a batting champ like 2 years prior to NYY singing him.
Ok. Not a single person? Law had us at 14 AFTER the Kelenic trade and before we drafted 3 first round talents in the most recent draft. We are mid pack at absolute worst after the recent draft and every likely closer to 10-12 heading into next year. Will be happy to re-visit this offseason.
There's nothing to disagree with about the money. The Mets are at the luxury tax. Unless you are advocating them going over the luxury tax and getting penalized there's not a lot more they can do. Yeah Cespedes ( a guy you wanted) is hamstringing them a bit but they really arent being cheap anymore and they certainly spent this last offseason as well.
As for DJ? He had a injured, crappy year last year and was in the same camp as guys like Lowrie. In fact they both got almost identical contracts money wise, which was not a lot. Im not saying there was no way he would be good, but it's also the exact type of move that the Mets got applauded for at the time (Lowrie was coming off an excellent all star season) but it just didn't go our way. Not faulting the Yanks at all. Good for them.
In any event, not looking to argue... Just wanted to say my peace about this current team. Im happy for you. Link - ( New Window )
The problem with the payroll stuff is that you have to look at how it's allocated. If you look at total payroll, it'll tell you the Mets are top 10.
If you look at active roster payroll, they're closer to 20 and below league average.
They have more injured player payroll on the books than any other team in baseball outside of the Yankees.
The difference is that the Yankees 25-man payroll is still top 5 in the majors (4)
The Mets are/have been collecting insurance on guys like Wright and Cespedes I assume. So, they're recouping some money that way - but probably aren't reinvesting it in the team.
Maybe the recent draft crop will get them in near the top 10 - I know signing Allen was a big deal and it was a risk to take him because of that. But I'm assuming Law was including Alonso in his pre-season rank, too - so without Alonso in the system and now being graduated, that's going to offset things a bit.
Lowrie and Ramos were all stars in 2018 and Cano was the all star MVP in 2017. That's exactly my point.
Still doesn't mean LeMahieu was washed up before he turned 30 years old. A down year can happen, injuries can happen.
Cano is a different animal. He's already 36 years old, got nailed for PED's and is now 36 years old and still signed through age 40.
Lowrie is getting old, too. He's 35.
The Yankees didn't merely get lucky with LeMahieu. They did their homework - and while I'm sure they didn't expect him to be quite THIS good - I do think they had a pretty good idea that he'd succeed here.
The problem with the payroll stuff is that you have to look at how it's allocated. If you look at total payroll, it'll tell you the Mets are top 10.
If you look at active roster payroll, they're closer to 20 and below league average.
They have more injured player payroll on the books than any other team in baseball outside of the Yankees.
The difference is that the Yankees 25-man payroll is still top 5 in the majors (4)
The Mets are/have been collecting insurance on guys like Wright and Cespedes I assume. So, they're recouping some money that way - but probably aren't reinvesting it in the team.
Maybe the recent draft crop will get them in near the top 10 - I know signing Allen was a big deal and it was a risk to take him because of that. But I'm assuming Law was including Alonso in his pre-season rank, too - so without Alonso in the system and now being graduated, that's going to offset things a bit.
They settled with Wright so that's done and Cespedes's insurance likely doesnt get paid out in the year he's injured and it certainly wouldnt allow the Mets to go over the luxury tax. That's not how the system works so the Mets can only play within the rules whether they recoup money later or not. I agree the Mets have a lot of talent on the IL but what are they supposed to do? You wanted Cespedes as much as anyone. That's 30 million AAV sucking up the payroll. He had the calcium deposits removed from his ankles so he would finally be pain free and be healthy for the second half this year at least and the guy trips in hole on his farm and breaks both his ankles... You just cant make it up and its not ALL the Mets fault.
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
I'm just glad we ended up with DJ and not Lowrie. Â
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
When you call a guy washed up that's pretty much the same thing as guaranteeing he'll be bad.
Also their age difference alone puts him on a different tier than Lowrie IMO.
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
When you call a guy washed up that's pretty much the same thing as guaranteeing he'll be bad.
Also their age difference alone puts him on a different tier than Lowrie IMO.
Not really because one guy was coming off a bad season and one was coming off a terrific season. Recency bias usually wins out... But ok. Fair enough... Washed up might have been too harsh... I guess I meant potentially washed up... I actually think people were surprised he got as much as he did, and again it wasn't much.
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
he's a below league average offense player for his career also.
All I said was that he was an all star in 2017.. he was.
He was better in 2016.
Lowrie was an all star for the first time in his entire career last year at age 34. Almost the entire rest of his career was entirely non-descript prior to 2017. Half his seasons he was barely replacement level.
LeMahieu has been a better player for a longer period of time. Not even debatable - and you're completely dismissing the defensive side of it. DJ has a better glove and is a superior defensive player.
Lowrie has zero GG's in 11 years. LeMahieu has 3 in 9.
DJ - 1034 career games, 21.4 bWAR
Lowrie - 1109 career games, 17.6 bWAR
blew this lead, but the offense blew the game. Wheeler lights up the radar gun, but he's average at best. Needed to put up 4-5 runs tonight to win. Can't win them all but should have scored more runs tonight
RE: RE: RE: And Ill just disagree about LeMahieu Â
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
he's a below league average offense player for his career also.
Keep going. That and his batting title...so yeah, below average.
blew this lead, but the offense blew the game. Wheeler lights up the radar gun, but he's average at best. Needed to put up 4-5 runs tonight to win. Can't win them all but should have scored more runs tonight
Didn't look average tonight. 15-6 since last June? But Greg hates him, so there is that.
has gone one good one bad one good one bad for the last 4 years. He's an average pitcher. 4.51 era is average. I know people like his stuff, but he's 29 and probably is what he is at this point. Teases you, has some good years, some bad years.
I have seen more home umps getting hit by the ball this season than Â
All I said was that he was an all star in 2017.. he was.
He was better in 2016.
Lowrie was an all star for the first time in his entire career last year at age 34. Almost the entire rest of his career was entirely non-descript prior to 2017. Half his seasons he was barely replacement level.
LeMahieu has been a better player for a longer period of time. Not even debatable - and you're completely dismissing the defensive side of it. DJ has a better glove and is a superior defensive player.
Lowrie has zero GG's in 11 years. LeMahieu has 3 in 9.
DJ - 1034 career games, 21.4 bWAR
Lowrie - 1109 career games, 17.6 bWAR
LeMahieu > Lowrie
Yeah and DJ fWAR 14.5, Lowrie 20.1. So according to fWAR Lowrie > DJ. And my original point was that they were in the same tier... one worked out... one didn't. This is devolving into something totally different now so Ill just bow out.
did Alonso field that ball? Get to the bag and let Cano field it and its an easy out. Weird play. How that's a single is beyond me. Has to be an error on someone.
RE: I have seen more home umps getting hit by the ball this season than Â
In this case and in far too many I’ve seen this year - good
These people aren’t better than technology or bots - it’s time to take them out of the game. All other industries deal with automation and cost savings and they simply aren’t adding value.
has thrown some nasty pitches this inning but he just made his first mistake and got away with it. That was a cement mixer. He has too good of stuff to be as brutal as he's been so far this year
right there is why I hate replay. There's no excuse for blowing that. He was clearly out. Game should be over. Replay can't get things wrong and far too often replay does get things wrong
How you can keep saying that spending isn't an issue is crazy to me... but we never agreed on that before and probably aren't going to now.
DJ LeMahieu was never "washed up"
If you want to talk about ludicrous bullshit, that's the biggest BS statement in this entire thread. The guy was just a batting champ like 2 years prior to NYY singing him.
Ok. Not a single person? Law had us at 14 AFTER the Kelenic trade and before we drafted 3 first round talents in the most recent draft. We are mid pack at absolute worst after the recent draft and every likely closer to 10-12 heading into next year. Will be happy to re-visit this offseason.
There's nothing to disagree with about the money. The Mets are at the luxury tax. Unless you are advocating them going over the luxury tax and getting penalized there's not a lot more they can do. Yeah Cespedes ( a guy you wanted) is hamstringing them a bit but they really arent being cheap anymore and they certainly spent this last offseason as well.
As for DJ? He had a injured, crappy year last year and was in the same camp as guys like Lowrie. In fact they both got almost identical contracts money wise, which was not a lot. Im not saying there was no way he would be good, but it's also the exact type of move that the Mets got applauded for at the time (Lowrie was coming off an excellent all star season) but it just didn't go our way. Not faulting the Yanks at all. Good for them.
In any event, not looking to argue... Just wanted to say my peace about this current team. Im happy for you.
Link - ( New Window )
Washed up.. LOL.
Cmon. What a crock of shit.
Lowrie and Ramos were all stars in 2018 and Cano was the all star MVP in 2017. That's exactly my point.
If you look at active roster payroll, they're closer to 20 and below league average.
They have more injured player payroll on the books than any other team in baseball outside of the Yankees.
The difference is that the Yankees 25-man payroll is still top 5 in the majors (4)
The Mets are/have been collecting insurance on guys like Wright and Cespedes I assume. So, they're recouping some money that way - but probably aren't reinvesting it in the team.
Maybe the recent draft crop will get them in near the top 10 - I know signing Allen was a big deal and it was a risk to take him because of that. But I'm assuming Law was including Alonso in his pre-season rank, too - so without Alonso in the system and now being graduated, that's going to offset things a bit.
Quote:
DJ was even an all star in 2017.
Washed up.. LOL.
Cmon. What a crock of shit.
Lowrie and Ramos were all stars in 2018 and Cano was the all star MVP in 2017. That's exactly my point.
Still doesn't mean LeMahieu was washed up before he turned 30 years old. A down year can happen, injuries can happen.
Cano is a different animal. He's already 36 years old, got nailed for PED's and is now 36 years old and still signed through age 40.
Lowrie is getting old, too. He's 35.
The Yankees didn't merely get lucky with LeMahieu. They did their homework - and while I'm sure they didn't expect him to be quite THIS good - I do think they had a pretty good idea that he'd succeed here.
If you look at active roster payroll, they're closer to 20 and below league average.
They have more injured player payroll on the books than any other team in baseball outside of the Yankees.
The difference is that the Yankees 25-man payroll is still top 5 in the majors (4)
The Mets are/have been collecting insurance on guys like Wright and Cespedes I assume. So, they're recouping some money that way - but probably aren't reinvesting it in the team.
Maybe the recent draft crop will get them in near the top 10 - I know signing Allen was a big deal and it was a risk to take him because of that. But I'm assuming Law was including Alonso in his pre-season rank, too - so without Alonso in the system and now being graduated, that's going to offset things a bit.
They settled with Wright so that's done and Cespedes's insurance likely doesnt get paid out in the year he's injured and it certainly wouldnt allow the Mets to go over the luxury tax. That's not how the system works so the Mets can only play within the rules whether they recoup money later or not. I agree the Mets have a lot of talent on the IL but what are they supposed to do? You wanted Cespedes as much as anyone. That's 30 million AAV sucking up the payroll. He had the calcium deposits removed from his ankles so he would finally be pain free and be healthy for the second half this year at least and the guy trips in hole on his farm and breaks both his ankles... You just cant make it up and its not ALL the Mets fault.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
When you call a guy washed up that's pretty much the same thing as guaranteeing he'll be bad.
Also their age difference alone puts him on a different tier than Lowrie IMO.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
Quote:
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
When you call a guy washed up that's pretty much the same thing as guaranteeing he'll be bad.
Also their age difference alone puts him on a different tier than Lowrie IMO.
Not really because one guy was coming off a bad season and one was coming off a terrific season. Recency bias usually wins out... But ok. Fair enough... Washed up might have been too harsh... I guess I meant potentially washed up... I actually think people were surprised he got as much as he did, and again it wasn't much.
Well his name does mean eight glasses of wine or maybe eight bottles
Quote:
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
he's a below league average offense player for his career also.
He was better in 2016.
Lowrie was an all star for the first time in his entire career last year at age 34. Almost the entire rest of his career was entirely non-descript prior to 2017. Half his seasons he was barely replacement level.
LeMahieu has been a better player for a longer period of time. Not even debatable - and you're completely dismissing the defensive side of it. DJ has a better glove and is a superior defensive player.
Lowrie has zero GG's in 11 years. LeMahieu has 3 in 9.
DJ - 1034 career games, 21.4 bWAR
Lowrie - 1109 career games, 17.6 bWAR
LeMahieu > Lowrie
Hope jints is back tomorrow.
Quote:
In comment 14490299 ZGiants98 said:
Quote:
His great season was 2016 btw not 2017. And coming into this season as a 30 year old it was basically his only good season ever with a bunch of REALLY bad seasons surrounding it. He's a career 94 wRC+ bat today even with his all star 2019 year.
He definitely had warts this offseason. Again, not saying he was guaranteed to be bad or good but he was absolutely in the same tier as guys like Lowrie, etc.
Have you looked at LeMahieu's numbers? he's a lifetime .304 BA. So, yeah he's had a bunch of really bad seasons..
he's a below league average offense player for his career also.
Keep going. That and his batting title...so yeah, below average.
Mickey, the gift that keeps on giving
Didn't look average tonight. 15-6 since last June? But Greg hates him, so there is that.
Go kiss your mom goodnight. Call your girlfriend. Cook some pasta. No reason to watch. You are done. It’s over
He was better in 2016.
Lowrie was an all star for the first time in his entire career last year at age 34. Almost the entire rest of his career was entirely non-descript prior to 2017. Half his seasons he was barely replacement level.
LeMahieu has been a better player for a longer period of time. Not even debatable - and you're completely dismissing the defensive side of it. DJ has a better glove and is a superior defensive player.
Lowrie has zero GG's in 11 years. LeMahieu has 3 in 9.
DJ - 1034 career games, 21.4 bWAR
Lowrie - 1109 career games, 17.6 bWAR
LeMahieu > Lowrie
Yeah and DJ fWAR 14.5, Lowrie 20.1. So according to fWAR Lowrie > DJ. And my original point was that they were in the same tier... one worked out... one didn't. This is devolving into something totally different now so Ill just bow out.
In this case and in far too many I’ve seen this year - good
These people aren’t better than technology or bots - it’s time to take them out of the game. All other industries deal with automation and cost savings and they simply aren’t adding value.
It's a 2 run game.
Fucking stupid.
Regardless of the outcome of this review that’s some fucking bad baseball by Didi
Lucky to get that call. Probably won't matter.
But how the fuck was that pitch called a strike?
Umpiring just keeps getting worse and worse.