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NFT: Knicks Chat

DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 10:50 am
Tommy Beer
@TommyBeer
·
4m
Replying to
@TommyBeer
Mitchell Robinson started all five games and averaged:
13.8 points (on 85% shooting!!!)
10.6 rebounds and
3.4 blocks
in 25.2 minutes.

He finished summer league with more than three times as many blocks (17) as missed shots (5).

He was 29-of-34 from the floor over the five games


Tommy Beer
@TommyBeer
·
47m
Ignas Brazdeikis appeared in all five games and averaged:
15.4 points (on 51% shooting) and 5.2 rebounds, and was 11-of-22 (50%) from 3-point territory.

Brazdeikis was one of only five players in Vegas to average more than 15 points and 5 boards while shooting above 50%
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Tommy Beer
@TommyBeer
·
1h
RJ Barrett started all five of the Knicks summer league games and averaged:
15.4 points (on 34% shooting)
8.6 rebounds and
4.2 assists.

He is the first player in the history of the Las Vegas Summer League to average more than 15 points, more than 8 rebs and more than 4 assists.

Bondy says Morris turned down 3 for 41 earlier in FA
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RE: RE: I  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 2:32 pm : link
In comment 14499204 TyreeHelmet said:
Quote:
In comment 14499203 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


think Frank is traded for scraps within the next few months. Nothing they have said or done has suggested they still believe in him.



I hope they don't at this point. They won't get any value in return. I'd rather they hold onto him for his 3rd season and hopefully something clicks. I still see a chance he could become a good contributing NBA player and he's the only good perimeter defender on the roster.


Just reading the tea leaves and the way they handle him. Fiz has him as a 2 going forward.. Barrett at least for now is a 2. They have Bullock, Dotson Trier + added Payton to DSJ at the 1. Playing Mudiay extensively over Frank wasn't the best look either.
I hope I'm wrong about Knox  
GeofromNJ : 7/15/2019 3:13 pm : link
but I just don't see a lot to get excited about. I know he's young and still learning and his body is still developing, etc, but I'm not impressed with his shooting or his defense.

As an aside, it would have been nice if the Knicks had taken a flyer on Taco Fall. What's worse than not having him on the roster is that he's on the Celtics roster. Don't like that at all.
I think Randle  
ryanmkeane : 7/15/2019 3:15 pm : link
gets overlooked. Guy is barely in his prime yet and just averaged 21 and 10
RE: I hope I'm wrong about Knox  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 3:18 pm : link
In comment 14499251 GeofromNJ said:
Quote:
but I just don't see a lot to get excited about. I know he's young and still learning and his body is still developing, etc, but I'm not impressed with his shooting or his defense.

As an aside, it would have been nice if the Knicks had taken a flyer on Taco Fall. What's worse than not having him on the roster is that he's on the Celtics roster. Don't like that at all.


Fall was a steal. He's limited but will be a weapon if used correctly. Teams messed that one up, Bol round 2 another head scratcher, foot issue and all.
RE: I hope I'm wrong about Knox  
Pep22 : 7/15/2019 3:19 pm : link
In comment 14499251 GeofromNJ said:
Quote:
but I just don't see a lot to get excited about. I know he's young and still learning and his body is still developing, etc, but I'm not impressed with his shooting or his defense.

As an aside, it would have been nice if the Knicks had taken a flyer on Taco Fall. What's worse than not having him on the roster is that he's on the Celtics roster. Don't like that at all.


Knox's shot and physique looked like it had developed nicely in SL. He looked to me like a broader version of Brandon Ingram. A star? no. But likely a professional NBA wing that can score it in the mid to late teens.
Knox  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 3:23 pm : link
oddly takes a lot of poor shots for a player who doesn't come off as selfish.
RE: Knox  
Pep22 : 7/15/2019 3:27 pm : link
In comment 14499263 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
oddly takes a lot of poor shots for a player who doesn't come off as selfish.


He certainly did. Of course, he was the 2nd youngest player in the league on a team with minimal leadership and in a tank mode. I suspect that starts to change with maturity, his changed surroundings and a much improved handle that will allow him to not settle for bad shots so often
I  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 3:37 pm : link
think Fizdale deserves some "blame" for how little development we saw from Knox/Frank. It's not clear what the system and expectations were. Fiz's rep is in player development but did we really see that? I mean we have nothing to really compare Mitch to, but the other young player came in looking X and mostly looked the same to end the season. Didn't care for Trier having a green light vs. other players, strange.
RE: Typical  
NoGainDayne : 7/15/2019 3:58 pm : link
In comment 14499135 ryanmkeane said:
Quote:
Knick fashion everyone came out slamming Barrett after 2 games when he's 19 and hadn't played since March. Then all he does is go out and have one of the better all around summer leagues in history. The kid is taking the franchise on his shoulders so maybe give his career a second to breathe. He's gonna be an awesome, all star caliber player year over year in his prime.


Lol it's funny how you are seemingly talking about an overreaction here yet this being a huge overreaction in the other way after his last few games. He did not have one of the best all around summer leagues in history.
RE: RE: Typical  
Mike in NJ : 7/15/2019 4:03 pm : link
In comment 14499288 NoGainDayne said:
Quote:
In comment 14499135 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


Knick fashion everyone came out slamming Barrett after 2 games when he's 19 and hadn't played since March. Then all he does is go out and have one of the better all around summer leagues in history. The kid is taking the franchise on his shoulders so maybe give his career a second to breathe. He's gonna be an awesome, all star caliber player year over year in his prime.



Lol it's funny how you are seemingly talking about an overreaction here yet this being a huge overreaction in the other way after his last few games. He did not have one of the best all around summer leagues in history.


Probably referring to this.

"He is the first player in the history of the Las Vegas Summer League to average more than 15 points, more than 8 rebs and more than 4 assists"
don't think Houdini could develop  
xman : 7/15/2019 4:16 pm : link
Frank
RE: RE: RE: Typical  
NoGainDayne : 7/15/2019 4:28 pm : link
In comment 14499289 Mike in NJ said:
Quote:
In comment 14499288 NoGainDayne said:


Quote:


In comment 14499135 ryanmkeane said:


Quote:


Knick fashion everyone came out slamming Barrett after 2 games when he's 19 and hadn't played since March. Then all he does is go out and have one of the better all around summer leagues in history. The kid is taking the franchise on his shoulders so maybe give his career a second to breathe. He's gonna be an awesome, all star caliber player year over year in his prime.



Lol it's funny how you are seemingly talking about an overreaction here yet this being a huge overreaction in the other way after his last few games. He did not have one of the best all around summer leagues in history.



Probably referring to this.

"He is the first player in the history of the Las Vegas Summer League to average more than 15 points, more than 8 rebs and more than 4 assists"


Yeah well FG % matters too...
RE: I  
Pep22 : 7/15/2019 4:52 pm : link
In comment 14499278 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
think Fizdale deserves some "blame" for how little development we saw from Knox/Frank. It's not clear what the system and expectations were. Fiz's rep is in player development but did we really see that? I mean we have nothing to really compare Mitch to, but the other young player came in looking X and mostly looked the same to end the season. Didn't care for Trier having a green light vs. other players, strange.


Actually, Knox did improve. Increased in FG %, 3p%, points, rebounds in the 2nd half. And again, the 2nd youngest guy in the league on a tanking team with no point guard and nobody that you would consider a good passer for his position.

I don't personally think Ntilikina will ever be a viable NBA player. It has less to do with development and more to do with the way he is wired. In short, I think he remains scared of this environment. He is afraid to take shots. Nice kid, but probably doesn't belong playing on this side of the ocean.
RE: RE: I  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 4:59 pm : link
In comment 14499317 Pep22 said:
Quote:
In comment 14499278 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


think Fizdale deserves some "blame" for how little development we saw from Knox/Frank. It's not clear what the system and expectations were. Fiz's rep is in player development but did we really see that? I mean we have nothing to really compare Mitch to, but the other young player came in looking X and mostly looked the same to end the season. Didn't care for Trier having a green light vs. other players, strange.



Actually, Knox did improve. Increased in FG %, 3p%, points, rebounds in the 2nd half. And again, the 2nd youngest guy in the league on a tanking team with no point guard and nobody that you would consider a good passer for his position.

I don't personally think Ntilikina will ever be a viable NBA player. It has less to do with development and more to do with the way he is wired. In short, I think he remains scared of this environment. He is afraid to take shots. Nice kid, but probably doesn't belong playing on this side of the ocean.


You can't honestly tell me you saw a tangible developmental difference in Knox's game. He had some solid games a long the way. You really think shooting 38% vs. 36% (second half vs. first) is something to give Fizdale credit for? or .6 rebounds more? .5 rebounds? I'm not giving up on Knox but he was disappointing and I don't recall many (if any) people were really impressed with what he did second half vs. first. Looked like the same player to me.
Another thing regarding Mitch - I saw him setting some very good picks  
Ira : 7/15/2019 5:15 pm : link
during this recent Summer League. It's a little thing, but it adds to his value.
Curious  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 5:17 pm : link
is there anyone on BBI who would take Knox over Mitch if you could only have one? If you could only have Knox/Mitch/Frank/Barrett... who do you take?
Barrett  
Canton : 7/15/2019 5:30 pm : link
until Knox proves otherwise, Mitch.
Interesting  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 5:38 pm : link
Begley says they may not have an intro presser for the FA's. I don't personally care but that's interesting.
RE: Interesting  
nygiants16 : 7/15/2019 5:47 pm : link
In comment 14499358 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
Begley says they may not have an intro presser for the FA's. I don't personally care but that's interesting.


Probably because they dont want to have a press cknference where the media just asks about kd and kyrie..
RE: Curious  
Jon in NYC : 7/15/2019 6:03 pm : link
In comment 14499342 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
is there anyone on BBI who would take Knox over Mitch if you could only have one? If you could only have Knox/Mitch/Frank/Barrett... who do you take?


I'm taking Barrett, Mitch 2nd, then Knox.
Mitchell Robinson entered the NBA as a rookie  
Ten Ton Hammer : 7/15/2019 6:24 pm : link
who didn't play college basketball and had sat out for a full calendar year. Any way you slice his rookie year it's a testament to player development to not only get him ready to play, but be excellent.

You don't have to like Allonzo Trier's game, but he was clearly prepared to play last season. I don't know that we have to really hold someone's feet to the fire regarding player development.
RE: Mitchell Robinson entered the NBA as a rookie  
DanMetroMan : 7/15/2019 6:26 pm : link
In comment 14499385 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
who didn't play college basketball and had sat out for a full calendar year. Any way you slice his rookie year it's a testament to player development to not only get him ready to play, but be excellent.

You don't have to like Allonzo Trier's game, but he was clearly prepared to play last season. I don't know that we have to really hold someone's feet to the fire regarding player development.


You misunderstood the Trier point. Fizdale oddly allowed him to have a green light and even joked about the iso ball he played. Strange to give a role player a different set of “rules”
RE: RE: Curious  
Ira : 7/15/2019 6:26 pm : link
In comment 14499378 Jon in NYC said:
Quote:
In comment 14499342 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


is there anyone on BBI who would take Knox over Mitch if you could only have one? If you could only have Knox/Mitch/Frank/Barrett... who do you take?



I'm taking Barrett, Mitch 2nd, then Knox.


It's a little early, but I'm wondering where Iggy is going to fit in on that company.
We'll see about the development  
bceagle05 : 7/15/2019 6:43 pm : link
but there's been a pretty solid infusion of young talent these past two drafts - Knox, Mitch, Trier, Barrett, Iggy. If there's no progress with these guys, Fiz will have to be shown the door - there's enough talent to cultivate into something substantial, but we can't waste too much time.
RE: RE: Mitchell Robinson entered the NBA as a rookie  
Ten Ton Hammer : 7/15/2019 7:38 pm : link
In comment 14499386 DanMetroMan said:
Quote:
In comment 14499385 Ten Ton Hammer said:


Quote:


who didn't play college basketball and had sat out for a full calendar year. Any way you slice his rookie year it's a testament to player development to not only get him ready to play, but be excellent.

You don't have to like Allonzo Trier's game, but he was clearly prepared to play last season. I don't know that we have to really hold someone's feet to the fire regarding player development.



You misunderstood the Trier point. Fizdale oddly allowed him to have a green light and even joked about the iso ball he played. Strange to give a role player a different set of “rules”


When you look at last year's roster, they didn't really have a clear cut pecking order for a 'go to' scorer. In a year where the front office seemed to be on the same page about tanking, I don't think it's so strange. After the all star break they were just trying to play out the rest of the season and see who had the talent to play in the league or not.
RE: RE: I  
TyreeHelmet : 7/15/2019 9:42 pm : link
In comment 14499317 Pep22 said:
Quote:
In comment 14499278 DanMetroMan said:


Quote:


think Fizdale deserves some "blame" for how little development we saw from Knox/Frank. It's not clear what the system and expectations were. Fiz's rep is in player development but did we really see that? I mean we have nothing to really compare Mitch to, but the other young player came in looking X and mostly looked the same to end the season. Didn't care for Trier having a green light vs. other players, strange.



Actually, Knox did improve. Increased in FG %, 3p%, points, rebounds in the 2nd half. And again, the 2nd youngest guy in the league on a tanking team with no point guard and nobody that you would consider a good passer for his position.

I don't personally think Ntilikina will ever be a viable NBA player. It has less to do with development and more to do with the way he is wired. In short, I think he remains scared of this environment. He is afraid to take shots. Nice kid, but probably doesn't belong playing on this side of the ocean.


Knox did not improve last season. If anything he got worse. Let’s hope he has a big 2nd year but he had a really bad rookie year. There’s no denying that and it’s a mark on Fizdale’s player development record.
Knox did something other than getting worse.  
manh george : 7/16/2019 12:20 am : link
He hit a rookie wall, after having a really good December, Eastern Conference Rookie of the Month. Not a shock in the world that a 19 year old who was under-muscled and still growing hit a rookie wall. Btw, in his 16 final games, Knox was clearly turning back around, averaging 15.25 points.

Some people get so much joy out of minimizing Knox's potential.
Especially 'uninformed' people  
Canton : 7/16/2019 5:56 am : link
'oh, he got worse, not better. So it has to be an indictment on Fizdale and player development.. "
I actually think that when Barrett is fully developed  
Chris L. : 7/16/2019 7:17 am : link
He will end up being our point guard. He has some Ben Simmons in him only he will be much better offensively. Coach K was right. He and Zion were totally out of shape...only attended a few pre draft workouts. It helps explain why he got better each game. I love what I have seen so far. He scores like a 2/3. Rebounds like a 4 and has the handle passing of a one. Of course he needs to work on his J...they all do...he is 19. The best part is he is ours...get ready for a fun, fun ride!!!
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