Okay so I'm in the process of closing on a house and we run the radon test and get back a result of 5.3 ppi/l from the unfinished basement, which according to the guy who ran the test, translates to a 2.6 on the main floor (kitchen, living room, dining room) and 1.3 on second floor (the bedrooms). The EPA recommends taking "action" if it's over 4.0 ppi/l, but the basement in its current state will only be used for laundry.
Which leaves me with several questions...
1. Is it really an issue at levels below 8 or is this mostly just a money-making politically-motivated scare tactic that has created a whole industry.
2. Will finishing the basement (and laying a new floor over the current floor) reduce the ppi/l level by enough to drop it below 4?
3. Is there a daily cost associated with running a "radon reduction mediation system" that goes beyond the installation cost?
I've read contrasting reports on radon, but it's hard to tell who is being honest with so much money at stake. The scare tactic is that "radon is the second leading cause of lung cancer after tobacco" but when you look inside the numbers you realize there is more (or less!) to it than that.
The anti-radon reducing crowd claims that the EPA based their recommendations on bad science and that the 4.0 level is overly conservative (and that low levels of radon can actually be benefical). Also, studies show that radon only increases the lung cancer risk for tobacco smokers (of which I am not) and that for non-smokers there is no demonstrated increased risk for those living with radon compared to those living without.
What say you, BBI?
I had borderline radon in a basement in a house I bought and because of that and the fact it was a finished basement we asked the sellers to put in a remediation system - they agreed to pay half - which I was fine with.
I'd do that for my own peace of mind.
For example, im building a house and its in a sandy area near the beach. Radon comes from igneous rock that deep down and trapped in pockets. Sandy areas shouldn't have much radon but the people who bid on the house before me had it tested and levels were slightly elevated. They backed out (for other reasons) and we got the house and just got a $1500 credit at closing to pay for radon.
Now my builder is also a licensed Radon remediation installer and said its up to us, he thinks its kinda BS but he will pipe it if we want, its simple since we are doing a knockdown/rebuild. We haven't gotten there yet but I'll probably just throw it in there since it will be hidden (piped through the house).
The biggest drawback is that they are ugly. Its a giant ugly pvc pipe that they strap to your nice siding and has to clear the top of the house by X feet, also really ugly.
Especially if the bedrooms are upstairs (2 flights!).
This. Especially if kids are in your future. The currently unfinished basement may be unused now, but might make an ideal playroom for them later on. I'm guessing their developing lungs/bodies would be more susceptible to any potential effects of radon.
2. Ongoing cost involves fan electricity which should be minimal, and sometimes a fan replacement which is a few hundred dollars.
3. Finishing the basement usually will have minimal effect.
4. In terms of the real danger, there is data out there that is concerning. However, you need to look at the level as well as what is being done in that space. For a laundry room I might hesitate unless the level is rather high or I plan on selling soon. If there is a bedroom down there it is a whole different story. 8+hours a day in that space and there should definitely be a system in there.
* Keep in mind that the official guidance is based on relatively long term exposure (years). Also, even after installing a system there will still be radon down there, just less (and hopefully below threshold)
I looked into it and growing up with two parents who smoked constantly (divorced) but still two smokers - at home - in the car - you name it I felt like any radon my kids get exposed to playing in the basement would be minimal.
But then for the price it fell into the category of how you can know and not do anything and live with yourself if something happened.
money and aesthetics are just not that important (to me).
As for cost, its just a tiny fan that constantly runs, draws next to no power, think of a tiny desk fan that can run on batteries. Its just enough to circulate and collect the air up and out.
Exactly. Or if you're really worried, drill a hole through the sill, mount a fan and run a switch. Turn it on periodically. No need to spend thousands.
The house is in the Berkshires, so it gets very cold in the winter and leaving windows open periodically may not be such a good idea in terms of heating costs. On top of that, I would like to finish the basement at some point, so its use will become much more common down the road than it is at first (i.e, as my office, which would mean spending half my day there; and/or as a rec room/gym, so I will be breathing heavier when I'm in it).
I think what I may do is ask for a $1,000-$1,500 price reduction on house and then run a radon test in the home for 90+ days (which will give a much more accurate reading than the two day test that is run during closing). I can then make a decision based on the more accurate number (and a better idea of what I want to do with the basement and the home in general). I may spend the rest of my life in the house or I may be selling it in three years, who knows?
As others have said, I'll probably install a mediation system just for the peace of mind, but my spider sense tells me...
...it's a ripoff - ( New Window )
If you remediate you'll never think about it again, neither will future buyers.
If you don't remediate you will likely not have any health issues but will probably think about it a lot. When you sell the house you'll have to give a $1,500 credit for install if levels are elevated and possibly lose some people (1st time buyers mostly) who are scared off by it.
There's no in-between and sellers won't react well to "just open the windows".
Our new house is being built now, energy efficient, tight and it has an radon remediation system built in as does every house in that development. Very modest cost for a new build.
In any case, we're seniors with grown children. I don't think its going to be radon that does us in.
Fuck taking chances. Get it fixed.
Moved from Boca Raton, FL 2003 - never heard about radon
Moved to Las Vegas, NV 2003 (still here) - never heard about radon
The chain of events...
1. We went to the open house and the following evening we offered them the list price, but asked that they include the furniture. They agreed, only asking to keep two lamps, a couple of framed photos, and one or two other minor pieces.
2. The inspection revealed a bunch of minor things, but nothing major. We asked them to take care of all safety issues (related to grounding some electric outlets),"repoint" the chimney, along with a couple of other minor things, but there were things (i.e, gutters needed work) in the inspection report that we did not ask them to repair. So we were reasonable and they were agreeable.
3. Two things we didn't ask of them: a) the roof over the screened in back porch was working fine, but the inspector felt it would need to be replaced sooner than later; b) there were some pipes that may or may not have been insulated with asbestos and they might need to be "encapsulated" (which is not such a big expenses, probably in the hundreds of dollars, not thousands).
4. After the 5.3 radon test, I think it's fair to ask for a $1,500 sale price reduction based on the radon situation, the porch roof needing replacement "soon", and the possible asbestos on pipes (which would require encapsulation, but would not represent a big, costly job).
p.s.--As for the porch roof, I plan on converting the screened in porch into a three-season sun room with a hot tub, so the roof is marked for early replacement anyway.
Advice like this is reckless and ignorant. Just don't respond if this is going to be your advice.
The EPA suggests that radon levels can return to previous levels in as little as 12 hours of closing windows.
Radon and it's link to lung cancer IS one of those items that science is still in debate over but opening your windows monthly as remediation is potentially dangerous and bad advice.
Remediate because you don't want to bear the risk or don't remediate because science is split (though mostly not - especially the CDC, EPA, etc.), but opening windows monthly is not a solution.
Otherwise, unless your basement is Chernobyl x2, you'll be fine.
We had the previous owner pay for it and it ran them 1500 bucks. Many others charged around 2000.
Don’t fuck around with this. Especially since you can usually get the owners to pay. You’re letting them off easy if you don’t act.
$1,500 is nothing for the seller to get a deal done. Take it, install or don’t install, and that’s really it.
p.s.-- We asked for a loan that gives us a $10K cushion beyond the cost of the house minus the downpayment. This is to cover closing costs, agent's fee, etc. With the sale price now lower, I assume that means the $1,500 difference is added to the cushion and will leave us with more excess dollars when closing is completed. Am I wrong? This is new to me and I'm not sure how all the money gets divided up.
I good way to look at it is for any "extra" just punch that dollar amount into a amortization calculator with your rate of interest and years and then see how much it will actually cost you.
Also to the original topic. I would recommend you get the radon taken care of sooner than later. I wouldn't listen to those that say to simply ignore it, or occasional open a window.
I good way to look at it is for any "extra" just punch that dollar amount into a amortization calculator with your rate of interest and years and then see how much it will actually cost you.
Also to the original topic. I would recommend you get the radon taken care of sooner than later. I wouldn't listen to those that say to simply ignore it, or occasional open a window.
Depends on your personal finance situation (e.g. do you have an 'emergency' fund, additional investments, etc?) as well as interest rates. If your interest rate is 6+% (maybe even 5+%), then the shorter term mortgage and paying extra makes financial sense. But with rates down <4%, you're better off getting a 30 year mortgage and investing the couple hundred dollars saved each month (vs a 15 year) in something like the Vanguard 500. Over the length of the mortgage, the investment portfolio is likely (obviously not guaranteed) to earn substantially more than the interest you pay on the mortgage.
Its called a fan.
And this nicce 72 yo woman has been living in this radon infested houe for 59 years, and now someone is saying there's a health hazard? LOL
The reason I like radiobiology in general is because almost nobody understands it, and the absurd level of public misunderstanding leads to extremely silly situations and outcomes.
If it's a case of spending the seller's money, then yeah, what the heck, go for it. When it comes to my own money, though, I'm not going to install with the cavalier attitude of being a sheeple. A good point was made that the next buyer is likely to make you pay for it when you sell.
A stup
If it's a case of spending the seller's money, then yeah, what the heck, go for it. When it comes to my own money, though, I'm not going to install with the cavalier attitude of being a sheeple, but do a lot more research on it. A good point was made that the next buyer is likely to make you pay for it when you sell.
A stupid question: if all a remediation system entails is blowing it outside, can't you just install a dryer vent and small fan (or something similar)?
Radon is the second leading cause of lung cancer, with an estimated 20,000 people dying annually of lung cancer due to radon.
Science is not split on that.
The exposure or levels at which it's harmful is the only thing really in debate.
So citing a 72 year old woman who has lived in a house and doesn't have lung cancer is silly. My father smoked 2 packs of cigarettes a day for 30 years, drank like it was an olympic sport and ate red meat at every meal, he just turned 84 and is in good healt. Does that mean none of those things are harmful?
You can probably do nothing to remediate the radon levels and fine, but as mentioned a) it will help when you sell the home and b) it can't hurt. without children it's less compelling, but with kids it's a no-brainer as much as wearing a seat belt or a bike helmet.
A stupid question: if all a remediation system entails is blowing it outside, can't you just install a dryer vent and small fan (or something similar)?
one way of dealing with it is installing an air exchanger in the basement.
If it’s something you are concerned about (can’t tell you whether you should be or not) then you should do it right.
This seriously has to be about the dumbest take I have seen on BBI
NJ's Department of Environmental Protection says there are over 500 deaths per year in the state that are attributable to radon. The state produces maps that show the relative danger in different parts of the state. They're not hard to find online.
Ideally, a remediation system should be installed and tested before you purchase. More realistically, have a specialist come in and do a write up of what is needed and how much it will cost. Deduct that from the sale price of the house.
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It's overhyped scare tactics to make you buy and pay for things you really don't need.
This seriously has to be about the dumbest take I have seen on BBI
He outdoes himself with every post.
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In comment 14501466 Coach Red Beaulieu said:
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It's overhyped scare tactics to make you buy and pay for things you really don't need.
This seriously has to be about the dumbest take I have seen on BBI
He outdoes himself with every post.
Yes indeed..
You are clueless.
You live in your own little world where you make up your own truth, and dismiss anything that contradicts your ill-informed opinion as fake or a conspiracy.
That's not conducive to learning or becoming a well-rounded infividual. I guess that explains your posts.