From @gmfb: More on the breaking news that the NFL decided #Chiefs WR Tyreek Hill will not be suspended or fined, and as the NFL says, "he may attend Kansas City's training camp and participate in all club activities."
The way the NFL handles this stuff is just nauseating.
Hill is a tremendous POS with a history of domestic violence. It was an issue when he was drafted. It's pretty clearly still an issue now.
The way they haphazardly determine whether or not they have enough "evidence" feels completely arbitrary and directionless.
This guy has no right to continue to play football right now. He's a terrible person and a terrible parent.
I assume you have reviewed all the facts completely to come to this fully informed opinion?
Spare me the predictable Devil's Advocate act here.
This is the guy we're talking about here.
Quote:
Hill is the fifth-round pick who pleaded guilty last summer to domestic abuse by strangulation, stemming from an incident in 2014 when he punched his pregnant girlfriend in the stomach and choked her. He received three years of probation, technically a deferred sentence.
Again. He has a history. The audio is sickening.
I know enough.
If you want to defend a tremendous piece of shit like this, good luck.
I’m with you on this one Arc. “Saint” Andy Reid brought this clown into the league under the guise that he believes in second chances, blah blah blah. It’s more like this guy is fast enough to maybe give me a chance to win the SB in clutch situations. Guy shouldn’t even be in the league. Who kicks and chokes a pregnant woman, my God.
CiP could address anything Andy Reid better than I could, but I don’t see a long term extension as long as he’s the HC. I obviously could be wrong
There were talks of him getting a big deal right before the audio came out. He is a huge part of that offense so it is hard to imagine them letting him walk now that he is in the clear. Chiefs Still Interested In A Deal? - ( New Window )
Verbal threats are actionable criminally. They certainly are actionable for work discipline given the CBA language regarding domestic violence. To come up with a judgement of no punishment whatsoever is ludicrous.
Is the article likely homerism? Yes
Is there some truth in there? Probably Hill & the Espinals - ( New Window )
I do think there's something to consider with pleading guilty - it doesn't always mean it happened. I listened to the latest season of Serial where the Cleveland court system is discussed and its crazy how many people take guilty pleas just to not chance going to trial. This may or may not apply to Hill, but that audio is damning - some of this really stinks for him.
My stance is almost exclusively based on that audio. You can't say that. My wife and I have argued before and we will again in the future - but I can't imagine telling her that she and my daughter should be scared of me - that's fucking appalling.
Banks, Hill hasn't stayed out of the eye of suspicion though.
Banks was caught having sex with his girlfriend and has since not had any other issues. Hill is heard threatening his current girlfriend and accused of child abuse in a completely SEPARATE matter.
If the police didn't charge Hill, that's one matter. He either didn't do the things she alleged or there wasn't sufficient evidence.
That's a legal matter. The league matter is their employee who did in fact plead guilty to a domestic crime previously, told that same person, she should be terrified of him. If that's not violating the personal conduct policy, what's it there for?
Either Hill stops hurting or threatening people, or he gets these very bad people out of his life. The NFL has plenty to gain from pushing him to do that.
Is the article likely homerism? Yes
Is there some truth in there? Probably Hill & the Espinals - ( New Window )
Honestly, I am not surprised to read any of that. Her behavior has been fishy as fuck. These two sound like two peas in a pod though and the NFL should have suspended him for a couple games just to send a message.
FWIW, I don't think Espinal is innocent in this. It seems like she's gone back and forth between trying to protect Hill's abhorrent behavior and getting the blame passed off entirely on him.
She seems like a shitty parent. But they both do, and both are. I am comfortable saying that just based on what we know. This poor kid is just growing up in an absolutely toxic situation with these two and it's sad because the boy has no control over it and doesn't know any better.
But at the end of the day, Tyreek Hill has had enough bad DV press and stories around him since before he was even drafted to the point where it's simply indefensible to suspend other players for things seemingly far less egregious in the name of "insufficient evidence"
The NFL couldn't possibly be less consistent with this stuff if they tried.
All of this seems to have been manufactured from Espinoza since day 1, including to lying about birth control pills to get her pregnant, which he than promptly broke up with her and boom 6 weeks later domestic violence charges he couldn't fight.
is that the league appears to punish those who struggle with alcohol and drug abuse more severely than those who physically abuse women/children.
After the whole Ray Rice incident the league claimed they were no longer going to tolerate domestic abuse but once again they have proven that they were full of shit.
Don't worry - I'm sure we'll get a whole new rollout of "NO MORE!" commercials from them this year...
In this year's version they should end it with a close up of Tyreek Hill's face as he smiles and winks.
Does anyone doubt if this was some second string guard for Minnesota that he would be suspended for half the season?
The NFL does not take domestic violence seriously if you are a star player. That stance is lead by Roger Goodell. Stand up and own it Roger!
but include a large grain of salt. It's written by the editor of the Chiefs fan board. And do you really think this guy would get a forensics examiner to look at a piece of an arm in a picture? Though I do agree it's got some pretty interesting other tidbits.
I'm inclined to believe this article as so much of it tracks. Â
The NFL clearly sees it the same way. However, they probably should have just suspended his ass two games for being dumb enough to stick around and getting caught on camera saying shit like that to your extortioner.
All of this seems to have been manufactured from Espinoza since day 1, including to lying about birth control pills to get her pregnant, which he than promptly broke up with her and boom 6 weeks later domestic violence charges he couldn't fight.
Yeah, I'm not buying that it's all her and that he has nothing to do with any of this.
He's on tape telling her to be terrified of him and calling her a bitch.
I buy that she's a shitty parent and probably has had a hand in some of the bad things happening to their child whether it's directly or indirectly by allowing Hill to do it - but I'm absolutely not accepting that this is all her and has nothing to do with him.
I'm quite certain he's a shitty guy just based on what we know now.
Espinoza put in a seal on the paternity test, any Â
Idiots are those with a mob mentality. No, I don't think words in a fight with your spouse/partner is cause for suspension at your job, short of overt threats on someone.
Idiots are those with a mob mentality. No, I don't think words in a fight with your spouse/partner is cause for suspension at your job, short of overt threats on someone.
Just because people disagree with you doesn't mean its "mob mentality". I wouldn't be friends with someone who said what Hill said to their wife - its disgusting. And he did threaten her, are you debating that too?
Actually I believe the legal system doesn't see what he said Â
We should all be able to agree that the NFL doesn’t care about child abuse. Jeeze, a broken arm? Punching a pregnant woman in the stomach? I don’t know how Andy Reid would have this POS on his team in the first place. But, then again, Big Red isn’t winning any father of the year awards himself.
But, what’s the NFLs excuse here? Didn’t AP get suspended for using a switch on his boy? Idk, the league really is a ship of fools. Sad here though, b/c Hill and his baby mama may be shitty but their boy doesn’t deserve to be abused.
I love the NFL, but this is too much for me.
Trueblu....the police and medical examiner cleared him Â
immediately from the broken arm and there are serious doubts about whether he punched her in the stomach at all. Tyreek's biggest problem is he seems to be a mental midget, guy probably scored like a 6 on his wonderlic.
That is the problem with a lot of this shit, it just becomes gospel. Â
Up until I read that article I was always under the impression that Hill was a total piece of shit that hits pregnant women. Now I just think he's a colossal fucking idiot from the investigative piece put out there that was posted on this thread.
RE: Trueblu....the police and medical examiner cleared him Â
immediately from the broken arm and there are serious doubts about whether he punched her in the stomach at all. Tyreek's biggest problem is he seems to be a mental midget, guy probably scored like a 6 on his wonderlic.
I listened to a podcast last night, Pick Six CBS Sports and they reported that the DAs office wrote that they believed a crime occurred, they just didn’t have sufficient evidence to change. There’s a link below to WaPo w/ quotes, etc. How do you explain this away? How do you explain away the tape recording of Hill’s threats?
This isn’t a criminal court, it the conduct policy and the standard of evidence is lower and the bar for application is higher. This was an easy call for the NFL and they got it wrong. Hill WaPo article - ( New Window )
Trueblu they couldn't figure out who commited the crime Â
and Espinosa is on Twitter admitting she beats her kids. And I addressed the threat, guy is up to his wits end from a woman who has been exporting him since day 1. Made a pithy remark in return of what she said. Why he is still around i have no idea, but lots of people stick to toxic relationships when there are kids involved.
People can say what they want, but the NFL wants to do anything they can to avoid this outcome for the very outrage that has been expressed here. They pretty much suspended Zeke for being an asshole for six games. Makes me think they came to the same conclusion I did.
The woman exploited him in college by beating herself up and now again she’s exploited him by breaking her son’s arm and being the object of a recorded threat? Sure, it all makes sense now.
The woman exploited him in college by beating herself up and now again she’s exploited him by breaking her son’s arm and being the object of a recorded threat? Sure, it all makes sense now.
If you read the investigative piece he broke up with her two weeks before the "incident" because she lied to him about taking birth control. Her family has been having severe financial problems that he has been paying for. He took a plea deal that included no jail time so he could play in his last college season before booting to the pros.
And did you read the threat or did you actually listen to it. Â
Test for her two younger children sealed. Me thinks the only reason she does that is because the results may not be so flattering.
Maybe he’s a good guy but I think it’s extremely unlikely.
He plead guilty to punching a pregnant woman in the stomach. And you’re suggesting he did so in order to play in his last college football game? Um kay. Good guy, just wants to be there for his team.
Then a few years later, good guy Hill remains ensnared by his bad baby mama. Unable to break free from her trap, even with essentially unlimited money and perhaps, the fatherly wisdom of Big Andy and the guidance of the Chief Kingdom, Hill once again is the victim of the evil baby mama who has now broken the arm of their son. Hill then offers a kindly threat to his baby mama and clams up when the department of child protection and police get involved. The DA issues a written statement saying they’re sure a crime took place (the breaking of the child’s arm I assume) but they can’t prove who dun it. It’s a mystery! Or, could it be the man with a previous conviction for punching and choking a pregnant woman? Gosh, I just don’t know.
He called the cops on her first and she went off the deep Â
end when he broke up with her. 8 weeks later he was facing DV charges and he accepted a plea deal to literally save his football career. He would have missed the entire year in jail, not one game. You really need to read that article GiantsLaw posted.
I mean the investigators cleared the broken arm of any abuse. Â
The bruises are what they are concerned with and it is known this chick uses a belt to discipline. The 11 minute video tape she doesn't even bother to deny when he said she made the 2014 incident up. This is reported by Rapport who heard the whole tape.
This chick is clearly a manipulative cunt. Everyone thinks he beat a pregnant woman because of her.
Even that little pussy Schefter was like I'm not condoning what he Â
said, but there is a ton of context in that tape that had the league come to the decision it did. The media isn't want to dig too hard because they realize they've been unfairly marking this guy as a dude that beat his pregnant wife when it is starting to become clear that didn't happen.
Dude, that’s a blog post on Medium which was typed by the “Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board”. One the “sources” cited in the “article” is an anonymous worker at the hospital where Hill’s baby mama sought treatment for her injuries. This unnamed anonymous source, who won’t go on the record, insinuated that Espinal may have self inflicted her wounds to her face and may not have been punched in the stomach at all. This anonymous source didn’t come forward during the course of the criminal investigation, which resulted in Hill’s admission of guilt in a court of law, because, well, that’s not exactly made clear in the blog post. Not to be outdone, the Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board goes on to posit that Espinal might like rough sex with multiple partners.
To the surprise of no one (with an IQ above, say, 90) the Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board has lighter touch when describing the conduct of Hill. They begin with the race card, which apparently explains away his guilty plea for choking and assaulting Espinal. Young black man can’t get justice so he might as well plead guilty. When Hill traveled to San Diego, with his baby mama, years after Hill’s guilty plea, he apparently had sex with other women; like, while he was on vacay with his baby mama. Something the fact finding sleuths at the Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board dismiss as an unfortunate aside.
That “article” is a sleazy hit piece that runs all the usual plays to defend against domestic and sexual assault. Harlet, gold digger, slut, it’s all her fault. It’s shameful and, even by today’s pathetic standards for critical thinking, shouldn’t pass muster of even the least curious mind.
And by the way, who broke the arm of the boy?
The boy's arm was broken from a rambunctious fall....the cops Â
And medical examiner concluded. They actually cleared them of the broken arm right away. The abuse they are referring to isn't the broken arm.
I understand why some of the hospital staff wouldn't come forward in this case. They didn't know. They expressed doubts, but nothing was conclusive. Remember, Hill was the first one to call the cops here because she was acting crazy when he broke up with her because she lied about taking birth control. She didn't even bother denying when Hill said she made up the incident on a recording she was making. This chick is clearly an opportunistic jersey chaser. The problem with someone like Hill is he is fucking stupid. Like you can blame the chick all you want, but you believed she was on the pill when your arrow is clearly pointing upward. Pull out dummy.
And so what who cares where this is coming from? The KC Star dropped the ball and just doubled down on their narrative in an editorial. It's fucking sad that investigative journalism needs to come from a God damn fan board when it doesn't fit the narrative they want to push. The comments under the article are pointing out all their hypocrisy.
And if you don't understand why a guy would accept a plea deal that didn't involve prison I don't know what to tell you. Most lawyers want to avoid Juries at all cost because they are unpredictable. Cops love charging people with whatever they can get away so they can scare the shit out of people with trumped up charges to plea you down. This isn't a white/black issue it is a poor/rich one. Public defenders don't have time to give cases the attention they need to auccesully fight them.
And you are really being disengenous about this affair he Â
Was supposedly having. Guy was in the process of breaking up with her and called off the engagement and they went on a trip to see if they could reconcile because she was pregnant. He clearly couldn't.
Partner is trying to get him to take some bait by berating him and he makes a pithy remark back to her. This isn't a guy that that is screaming at his wife and has her up against the wall.
Investigators have months of text messages and he had never threatened her or even been deragatory. They even have text messages between the two that Hill said you know I never did that hit our kids, you did. She says I know I was hurt and angry and just wanted to blame you. This was reported two months ago by the Washington Post. I am just reading this now. I bet no one on this thread knows about this. This guy is getting completely railroaded.
passing. Like I'm sick of this bitch. When someone is questioning you and recording to you what do you think they are trying to do? Illicit a certain response.
They have text messages between the two where she admits that she was the one who beats the kids and she was setting him up. The texts have also showed he has never been threatening or even derogatory towards her. This was reported by the Washington Post two months ago. Yet nobody knows about this. I literally just found out about it today. The media as a whole clearly has a certain narrative they want to push and as more facts come out it hasn't fit what we thought we knew at all. There is a reason she wants the upcoming custody battle sealed. Two days ago I thought Tyreek Hill was a piece of shit. Now I am convinced that he has done a lot of what he has because he doesn't want his children raised by this pyschopath alone.
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In comment 14502199 arcarsenal said:
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The way the NFL handles this stuff is just nauseating.
Hill is a tremendous POS with a history of domestic violence. It was an issue when he was drafted. It's pretty clearly still an issue now.
The way they haphazardly determine whether or not they have enough "evidence" feels completely arbitrary and directionless.
This guy has no right to continue to play football right now. He's a terrible person and a terrible parent.
I assume you have reviewed all the facts completely to come to this fully informed opinion?
Spare me the predictable Devil's Advocate act here.
This is the guy we're talking about here.
Quote:
Hill is the fifth-round pick who pleaded guilty last summer to domestic abuse by strangulation, stemming from an incident in 2014 when he punched his pregnant girlfriend in the stomach and choked her. He received three years of probation, technically a deferred sentence.
Again. He has a history. The audio is sickening.
I know enough.
If you want to defend a tremendous piece of shit like this, good luck.
I’m with you on this one Arc. “Saint” Andy Reid brought this clown into the league under the guise that he believes in second chances, blah blah blah. It’s more like this guy is fast enough to maybe give me a chance to win the SB in clutch situations. Guy shouldn’t even be in the league. Who kicks and chokes a pregnant woman, my God.
CiP could address anything Andy Reid better than I could, but I don’t see a long term extension as long as he’s the HC. I obviously could be wrong
Quote:
sign him to a long term deal?
CiP could address anything Andy Reid better than I could, but I don’t see a long term extension as long as he’s the HC. I obviously could be wrong
There were talks of him getting a big deal right before the audio came out. He is a huge part of that offense so it is hard to imagine them letting him walk now that he is in the clear.
Chiefs Still Interested In A Deal? - ( New Window )
Goodell is a total failure.
Is there some truth in there? Probably
Hill & the Espinals - ( New Window )
Is there some truth in there? Probably Hill & the Espinals - ( New Window )
I do think there's something to consider with pleading guilty - it doesn't always mean it happened. I listened to the latest season of Serial where the Cleveland court system is discussed and its crazy how many people take guilty pleas just to not chance going to trial. This may or may not apply to Hill, but that audio is damning - some of this really stinks for him.
My stance is almost exclusively based on that audio. You can't say that. My wife and I have argued before and we will again in the future - but I can't imagine telling her that she and my daughter should be scared of me - that's fucking appalling.
Banks was caught having sex with his girlfriend and has since not had any other issues. Hill is heard threatening his current girlfriend and accused of child abuse in a completely SEPARATE matter.
That's a legal matter. The league matter is their employee who did in fact plead guilty to a domestic crime previously, told that same person, she should be terrified of him. If that's not violating the personal conduct policy, what's it there for?
Either Hill stops hurting or threatening people, or he gets these very bad people out of his life. The NFL has plenty to gain from pushing him to do that.
Is there some truth in there? Probably Hill & the Espinals - ( New Window )
Honestly, I am not surprised to read any of that. Her behavior has been fishy as fuck. These two sound like two peas in a pod though and the NFL should have suspended him for a couple games just to send a message.
She seems like a shitty parent. But they both do, and both are. I am comfortable saying that just based on what we know. This poor kid is just growing up in an absolutely toxic situation with these two and it's sad because the boy has no control over it and doesn't know any better.
But at the end of the day, Tyreek Hill has had enough bad DV press and stories around him since before he was even drafted to the point where it's simply indefensible to suspend other players for things seemingly far less egregious in the name of "insufficient evidence"
The NFL couldn't possibly be less consistent with this stuff if they tried.
Quote:
is that the league appears to punish those who struggle with alcohol and drug abuse more severely than those who physically abuse women/children.
After the whole Ray Rice incident the league claimed they were no longer going to tolerate domestic abuse but once again they have proven that they were full of shit.
Don't worry - I'm sure we'll get a whole new rollout of "NO MORE!" commercials from them this year...
In this year's version they should end it with a close up of Tyreek Hill's face as he smiles and winks.
Does anyone doubt if this was some second string guard for Minnesota that he would be suspended for half the season?
The NFL does not take domestic violence seriously if you are a star player. That stance is lead by Roger Goodell. Stand up and own it Roger!
"No more...from marginal talents!"
Yeah, I'm not buying that it's all her and that he has nothing to do with any of this.
He's on tape telling her to be terrified of him and calling her a bitch.
I buy that she's a shitty parent and probably has had a hand in some of the bad things happening to their child whether it's directly or indirectly by allowing Hill to do it - but I'm absolutely not accepting that this is all her and has nothing to do with him.
I'm quite certain he's a shitty guy just based on what we know now.
I'd get out of a relationship like that long before it ever got to the point of being concerned with extortion or anything like this.
To each their own, though.
Idiots.
Idiots are those with a mob mentality. No, I don't think words in a fight with your spouse/partner is cause for suspension at your job, short of overt threats on someone.
Jesus.
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We DoNt KnOw AlL tHe FaCtS tHoUgH
Idiots.
Idiots are those with a mob mentality. No, I don't think words in a fight with your spouse/partner is cause for suspension at your job, short of overt threats on someone.
Just because people disagree with you doesn't mean its "mob mentality". I wouldn't be friends with someone who said what Hill said to their wife - its disgusting. And he did threaten her, are you debating that too?
Perhaps, but if so, my cynical guess is they didn't apply nearly the same burden of proof to the accuser as they did to Hill.
he wasn't given some type of suspension.
But, what’s the NFLs excuse here? Didn’t AP get suspended for using a switch on his boy? Idk, the league really is a ship of fools. Sad here though, b/c Hill and his baby mama may be shitty but their boy doesn’t deserve to be abused.
I love the NFL, but this is too much for me.
I listened to a podcast last night, Pick Six CBS Sports and they reported that the DAs office wrote that they believed a crime occurred, they just didn’t have sufficient evidence to change. There’s a link below to WaPo w/ quotes, etc. How do you explain this away? How do you explain away the tape recording of Hill’s threats?
This isn’t a criminal court, it the conduct policy and the standard of evidence is lower and the bar for application is higher. This was an easy call for the NFL and they got it wrong.
Hill WaPo article - ( New Window )
People can say what they want, but the NFL wants to do anything they can to avoid this outcome for the very outrage that has been expressed here. They pretty much suspended Zeke for being an asshole for six games. Makes me think they came to the same conclusion I did.
If you read the investigative piece he broke up with her two weeks before the "incident" because she lied to him about taking birth control. Her family has been having severe financial problems that he has been paying for. He took a plea deal that included no jail time so he could play in his last college season before booting to the pros.
Maybe he’s a good guy but I think it’s extremely unlikely.
He plead guilty to punching a pregnant woman in the stomach. And you’re suggesting he did so in order to play in his last college football game? Um kay. Good guy, just wants to be there for his team.
Then a few years later, good guy Hill remains ensnared by his bad baby mama. Unable to break free from her trap, even with essentially unlimited money and perhaps, the fatherly wisdom of Big Andy and the guidance of the Chief Kingdom, Hill once again is the victim of the evil baby mama who has now broken the arm of their son. Hill then offers a kindly threat to his baby mama and clams up when the department of child protection and police get involved. The DA issues a written statement saying they’re sure a crime took place (the breaking of the child’s arm I assume) but they can’t prove who dun it. It’s a mystery! Or, could it be the man with a previous conviction for punching and choking a pregnant woman? Gosh, I just don’t know.
This chick is clearly a manipulative cunt. Everyone thinks he beat a pregnant woman because of her.
To the surprise of no one (with an IQ above, say, 90) the Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board has lighter touch when describing the conduct of Hill. They begin with the race card, which apparently explains away his guilty plea for choking and assaulting Espinal. Young black man can’t get justice so he might as well plead guilty. When Hill traveled to San Diego, with his baby mama, years after Hill’s guilty plea, he apparently had sex with other women; like, while he was on vacay with his baby mama. Something the fact finding sleuths at the Chiefs Kingdom Editorial Board dismiss as an unfortunate aside.
That “article” is a sleazy hit piece that runs all the usual plays to defend against domestic and sexual assault. Harlet, gold digger, slut, it’s all her fault. It’s shameful and, even by today’s pathetic standards for critical thinking, shouldn’t pass muster of even the least curious mind.
And by the way, who broke the arm of the boy?
I understand why some of the hospital staff wouldn't come forward in this case. They didn't know. They expressed doubts, but nothing was conclusive. Remember, Hill was the first one to call the cops here because she was acting crazy when he broke up with her because she lied about taking birth control. She didn't even bother denying when Hill said she made up the incident on a recording she was making. This chick is clearly an opportunistic jersey chaser. The problem with someone like Hill is he is fucking stupid. Like you can blame the chick all you want, but you believed she was on the pill when your arrow is clearly pointing upward. Pull out dummy.
And so what who cares where this is coming from? The KC Star dropped the ball and just doubled down on their narrative in an editorial. It's fucking sad that investigative journalism needs to come from a God damn fan board when it doesn't fit the narrative they want to push. The comments under the article are pointing out all their hypocrisy.
And if you don't understand why a guy would accept a plea deal that didn't involve prison I don't know what to tell you. Most lawyers want to avoid Juries at all cost because they are unpredictable. Cops love charging people with whatever they can get away so they can scare the shit out of people with trumped up charges to plea you down. This isn't a white/black issue it is a poor/rich one. Public defenders don't have time to give cases the attention they need to auccesully fight them.
Investigators have months of text messages and he had never threatened her or even been deragatory. They even have text messages between the two that Hill said you know I never did that hit our kids, you did. She says I know I was hurt and angry and just wanted to blame you. This was reported two months ago by the Washington Post. I am just reading this now. I bet no one on this thread knows about this. This guy is getting completely railroaded.
If this was tomorrow I would be offended
They have text messages between the two where she admits that she was the one who beats the kids and she was setting him up. The texts have also showed he has never been threatening or even derogatory towards her. This was reported by the Washington Post two months ago. Yet nobody knows about this. I literally just found out about it today. The media as a whole clearly has a certain narrative they want to push and as more facts come out it hasn't fit what we thought we knew at all. There is a reason she wants the upcoming custody battle sealed. Two days ago I thought Tyreek Hill was a piece of shit. Now I am convinced that he has done a lot of what he has because he doesn't want his children raised by this pyschopath alone.