Big Blue Interactive The Corner Forum  
Back to the Corner

Archived Thread

Phil Simms: 'Multiple' teams were set to take Jones before17

V.I.G. : 7/21/2019 8:25 pm
Phil Simms: 'Multiple' teams were set to take Daniel Jones before No. 17

My best guess is still DEN. Simms describes his confidence / sources in strong language.
Hope heís right - ( New Window )
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
I hope Jones is good  
LakeGeorgeGiant : 7/21/2019 8:26 pm : link
The rest doesn't matter.
I saw that and honesty it doesn't matter.  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2019 8:26 pm : link
All that matters is Jones works out for us.
Honestly  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2019 8:26 pm : link
.
Does this really matter?  
John In CO : 7/21/2019 8:28 pm : link
He is ours....we drafted him. Doesnt matter if 0 other teams wanted him or 30. He is gonna either sink or swim. The pick will either be justified....or it wont. Cant wait to watch.
I heard from  
TommyWiseau : 7/21/2019 8:32 pm : link
a source in the Agent industry that Cincy and Denver wanted Jones and would take him if he was there at 10 and 11. I said this on draft night and still believe it.
It may not matter in the big picture  
Beezer : 7/21/2019 8:32 pm : link
But on a smaller scale I like to read these things. It boosts confidence and it certainly helps make me feel better after everybodyís been saying good things about the kid. Bottom line is that he needs to prove it now but all the stuff matters to sports fans on some level because thatís what this is all about. Speculating and weighing in on whether we think somebody will be some thing or not. Thatís what makes it fun.
Daniel Jones agent was convinced he would be picked prior to 17  
George from PA : 7/21/2019 8:38 pm : link
And they usually know.
RE: I hope Jones is good  
Mad Mike : 7/21/2019 8:46 pm : link
In comment 14503394 LakeGeorgeGiant said:
Quote:
The rest doesn't matter.

QFT
_______  
I am Ninja : 7/21/2019 9:07 pm : link
if you were angry about it then, fine. if youre still angry about it, get a fuckin life.
Phil is correct.  
Giant John : 7/21/2019 9:11 pm : link
I liked the pick then and feel better about it now. Time will show as it does for all players.
If it wasnít obvious before  
Nine-Tails : 7/21/2019 9:13 pm : link
It is now, Jones was legitimate first round prospect and one or two on most teams boards. The media and fans didnít think much of him and just used the Cutcliffe connection. The backlash was the most Iíve seen in a long time, and teams distanced themselves from this to increase the criticism at the Giants.
Denver - Pitt Trade  
Samiam : 7/21/2019 9:34 pm : link
Didnít that trade come after the Jones pick? If yes, writer said Pitt would have passed. How does he know what Denver would have done? For that matter, he goes down the list of teams picking. How does he know who would trade up?
The dumbest thing in the article was the Miami statement  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2019 9:41 pm : link
Miami was interested but that was before they traded for Rosen.

Um, they didn't trade for Rosen until late in the second round, well before Jones was taken. WTF does them trading for Rosen have to do with them potentially being interested in Jones and possibly taking them. The Jets were interested in Dan Marino but that was before they selected Sam Darnold. That makes about the same sense as that Miami sentence.
Or should I saw Peyton Manning  
robbieballs2003 : 7/21/2019 9:41 pm : link
instead of Marino?
RE: Denver - Pitt Trade  
BigBlueShock : 7/21/2019 9:43 pm : link
In comment 14503420 Samiam said:
Quote:
Didnít that trade come after the Jones pick? If yes, writer said Pitt would have passed. How does he know what Denver would have done? For that matter, he goes down the list of teams picking. How does he know who would trade up?

Yes. That trade came immediately following the Jones pick. But the writer completely ignores Denver as a possibility in his analysis. Which is fine, it doesnít matter anyways. John Elway could come out tomorrow and tell the world that he was drafting Jones if he was available and the same posters that called Gettleman a liar would say that Elway is lying too.

Think about that. Giants fans that have absolutely no clue what was going down came out and blatantly called Gettleman a liar. Simply because they didnít like the pick. Great fans we have. Whatís next, we boo Jones while heís attending a Yankee game? Oh wait, we did that too...
RE: RE: Denver - Pitt Trade  
SJGiant : 7/21/2019 10:05 pm : link
In comment 14503424 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 14503420 Samiam said:


Quote:


Didnít that trade come after the Jones pick? If yes, writer said Pitt would have passed. How does he know what Denver would have done? For that matter, he goes down the list of teams picking. How does he know who would trade up?


Yes. That trade came immediately following the Jones pick. But the writer completely ignores Denver as a possibility in his analysis. Which is fine, it doesnít matter anyways. John Elway could come out tomorrow and tell the world that he was drafting Jones if he was available and the same posters that called Gettleman a liar would say that Elway is lying too.

Think about that. Giants fans that have absolutely no clue what was going down came out and blatantly called Gettleman a liar. Simply because they didnít like the pick. Great fans we have. Whatís next, we boo Jones while heís attending a Yankee game? Oh wait, we did that too...


I already wrote the writer the following

John

I think you left out the primary team with interest in Daniel Jones before pick number 17. That would be the Denver Broncos at 10. They traded out of that pick right after Jones was selected. While that doesnít convince people that they were disappointed in losing Jones after the giants pick, I think Elway really wanted Jones as his QB.

Of course there is no proof of this. I just really believe this.

The writers response to me

ďvery possibleĒ

There are those  
darren in pdx : 7/21/2019 10:08 pm : link
that still say the Eli Manning trade was poor, despite winning two Super Bowls. There will be those that will say the pick was bad value even if Jones is a very good QB. Itís all bull and hot air.
Yeah, but DG is out of his mind!  
Jim Bur(n)t : 7/21/2019 10:11 pm : link
(sarcasm off) . I wasn't a fan of the pick initially, but have warmed up, and think that DG had ANOTHER kick-ass draft.

We are young & talented at the skill positions, next few yrs drafts are in this order:

1) OL
2) OL
3) LB
I was disappointed at the time...  
Milton : 7/21/2019 10:30 pm : link
Because I wanted Josh Rosen, who was available at a much cheaper price. But I have no problem with the Giants selected the QB they believe in with the 6th overall pick regardless of what the rest of the league, the media, and myself thought about the guy. What the fuck do I know???

p.s.--I was disappointed last year when they took Barkley over Rosen. I'm no longer disappointed by that.
...  
HitSquad : 7/21/2019 10:54 pm : link
The Buffalo Bills were anticipating that the Bengals were going to trade up from 11 to 9 take Daniel Jones in front of the Broncos who were picking at 10.

So Phil might be on to something.


Inside the Bills Draft Room - ( New Window )
This doesnít matter  
WillVAB : 7/21/2019 10:57 pm : link
What matters is the quality of the player and the quality of the players they passed on.
This will be the dialog for Jones this . . . .  
TC : 7/21/2019 11:19 pm : link
and probably next season: one ugly rookie series and, "He's a bust!" A really good series and, "Bench Eli!" Does either make any sense? Since when!?
not a fan of grades based  
madgiantscow009 : 7/22/2019 12:33 am : link
on draft "value".

If Mayock was still an analyst then his draft would have had the highest grades because he was the expert people followed most.
At the time I really hated the Jones pick because I felt his arm  
BlueLou'sBack : 7/22/2019 12:53 am : link
was clearly inferior to Haskins and especially Drew Lock's arm.

But I don't, we don't, and vast majority of the TV draft pundits don't know shit about the players' characters and personality and what's in their mind and hearts, and that shit matters way more in the determination of an NFL player (given of course they pass the basic physical athletic requirements of their positions).

I still think Jones' arm does not rival Haskins' or Lock's... so what? From various reports, Jones is well ahead of the other two on getting his playbook down, and Shurmur supposedly has a larger and more complex playbook than average in the NFL.

He seems to be a fit, the best fit, for Shurmur. And as much as some here might not like it, you can bet that PS is here at least through 2020 unless things really fall apart like under MacAdoo.
RE: At the time I really hated the Jones pick because I felt his arm  
Nine-Tails : 7/22/2019 1:47 am : link
In comment 14503459 BlueLou'sBack said:
Quote:
was clearly inferior to Haskins and especially Drew Lock's arm.

But I don't, we don't, and vast majority of the TV draft pundits don't know shit about the players' characters and personality and what's in their mind and hearts, and that shit matters way more in the determination of an NFL player (given of course they pass the basic physical athletic requirements of their positions).

I still think Jones' arm does not rival Haskins' or Lock's... so what? From various reports, Jones is well ahead of the other two on getting his playbook down, and Shurmur supposedly has a larger and more complex playbook than average in the NFL.

He seems to be a fit, the best fit, for Shurmur. And as much as some here might not like it, you can bet that PS is here at least through 2020 unless things really fall apart like under MacAdoo.


Drew Lock is a very flawed prospect. Sure he has an eye-popping arm and is a good athlete, which makes some people see him as poor-mans Mahomes as a prospect, but he just has so many flaws. Also, he was definitely not Denver's top qb. Denver passed on the chance to draft him three times. You would think a team with no long-term answer wouldn't pass on their number one guy that many times.
I liked Drew Lock in the draft  
Milton : 7/22/2019 2:50 am : link
But I felt he had a salesman's personality from his interview at the combine. He was too smooth, the kind of guy who has an answer/excuse for everything.
RE: I liked Drew Lock in the draft  
BlueLou'sBack : 7/22/2019 2:58 am : link
In comment 14503468 Milton said:
Quote:
But I felt he had a salesman's personality from his interview at the combine. He was too smooth, the kind of guy who has an answer/excuse for everything.


Yup. And Haskins' shtick with the video breakdown was too gussied up for my taste. Jones was more real, less trumped up. But still a wee bit nervous about his arm strength.
Iíll say it again  
Giant John : 7/22/2019 5:20 am : link
Jones by no means has a weak arm. People saying that are just wrong.
I don't think he has a weak arm either, but he doesn't have a strong  
Ira : 7/22/2019 5:31 am : link
arm.
My son is a big college football fan and he told me about Jones early  
idinkido : 7/22/2019 5:35 am : link
on the college season. We were talking college QBs and he came out with that he thought Jones could be the best of the lot. He told me that Jones was carrying one of the worse teams in college football on his back. If Haskins had played at Duke, he would have gotten killed behind that OL, and if he did manage to get off a pass, his receivers would have probably dropped it. Jones is mobile, his legs get him out of trouble and he can pass accurately on the move.
No longer  
Big Blue '56 : 7/22/2019 6:23 am : link
matters.
A large percentage of threads may not matter  
Jimmy Googs : 7/22/2019 6:27 am : link
but still attract conversation...
RE: I don't think he has a weak arm either, but he doesn't have a strong  
Jimmy Googs : 7/22/2019 6:29 am : link
In comment 14503474 Ira said:
Quote:
arm.


Just glad he has two...
RE: A large percentage of threads may not matter  
Big Blue '56 : 7/22/2019 6:48 am : link
In comment 14503483 Jimmy Googs said:
Quote:
but still attract conversation...


Agreed. To expand on my comment, thereís no way of proving whoís early radar he was on and heís here now. He either has it or he doesnít. The few media people I listen to, like him. We assume Shurmur does, which is most important. Still, doing it on a professional football field is all that matters obviously.
The topic is interesting to discuss because the Giants  
Jimmy Googs : 7/22/2019 6:54 am : link
had that second #1 pick
RE: RE: Denver - Pitt Trade  
mfsd : 7/22/2019 7:11 am : link
In comment 14503424 BigBlueShock said:
Quote:
In comment 14503420 Samiam said:


Quote:


Didnít that trade come after the Jones pick? If yes, writer said Pitt would have passed. How does he know what Denver would have done? For that matter, he goes down the list of teams picking. How does he know who would trade up?


Yes. That trade came immediately following the Jones pick. But the writer completely ignores Denver as a possibility in his analysis. Which is fine, it doesnít matter anyways. John Elway could come out tomorrow and tell the world that he was drafting Jones if he was available and the same posters that called Gettleman a liar would say that Elway is lying too.

Think about that. Giants fans that have absolutely no clue what was going down came out and blatantly called Gettleman a liar. Simply because they didnít like the pick. Great fans we have. Whatís next, we boo Jones while heís attending a Yankee game? Oh wait, we did that too...


Yuo. A good number of Giants fans did not distinguish themselves with their reaction to the Jones pick.

Having a different opinion, disagreeing with decisions the Giants make? All reasonable. But a bunch of fans acted like insufferable crybabies about it.
The rumors were Denver and the 'Skins. The Broncos had the 10th  
Ira : 7/22/2019 7:50 am : link
pick, but traded out after we drafted Jones. Since both teams ended up with qb's, neither will admit that they really wanted a different qb.
It's either sink or swim  
micky : 7/22/2019 7:52 am : link
Thats all that matters from here on out
I guess the guy writing the article  
cjac : 7/22/2019 8:01 am : link
completely forgot about Denver.

They traded back right after Jones was picked at 6.

it was actually a good play by them, sit tight and see if he falls, if not acquire more picks knowing Pittsburgh wants to trade up for a guy.

i'm 95% sure Denver would have taken Jones if he was there
Where there is smoke, there's fire  
Rong5611 : 7/22/2019 8:05 am : link
I doubt he would have made it to #17 based on the rumors. That said, I almost threw my remote when we passed on Josh Allen like many of us.

But, based on the reports from the various team activities/mini-camps, I've been impressed so far with Jones, especially handles himself well with the media and how he's approaching his opportunity. I really like his mobility. Has better arm strength that we thought.

I'm very interested in watching him in the preseason. Have to think he will start the first two. If not, I'm sure he will play alot. We'll learn a great deal about him in the next 45 days.

So far, so good.

Eh, you see it every year  
Cenotaph : 7/22/2019 8:23 am : link
When a pick differs from where the common perception of where a guy 'should' go happens, there's a backlash of "Well, they could have traded down and got him later". If you really believe that's your guy, you take him when you have the chance, especially at QB. If we had picked Haskins there wouldn't have been much drama because pundits had him 'rated' better. Well, DEN trading back indicates they weren't sold on Haskins either - and as mentioned the article ignores the DEN trade. CIN, DEN, WAS were all definite possibilities, as were dark horses like PIT (the 2004 draft QB teams all need to be thinking about the next guy).

End of the day, Giants got criticized for passing on a QB one year (never mind for a player that was rated as best in the draft and certainly looks like it), then slammed for taking the 'wrong' QB or by not getting enough value through a trade down. I personally think Murray is a big risk at QB also, but no one questions that one (even though they had just drafter a QB in the top-10 last year) because it was widely known before hand that ARI was going for Murray. It lined up with the pundits expectations so was a 'good' pick. If Jones works out, he and SB could be the core of a very good team hopefully for years. If not, well then the criticism is deserved - but we won't know for years which is why these snap 'draft grade' exercises are dumb - it's really more a grade on how close realty was to the mock drafts, except the mocks are used as the basis to compare.
RE: I don't think he has a weak arm either, but he doesn't have a strong  
PatersonPlank : 7/22/2019 8:31 am : link
In comment 14503474 Ira said:
Quote:
arm.


He actually does have a pretty good arm
The Denver..  
FatMan in Charlotte : 7/22/2019 8:33 am : link
trade with Pitt was made for a couple of reasons if you believe the chatter.

Both Denver and Cincy liked Jones. Once he was off the board, Pitt knew that Cincy had their eye set on Bush. Denver just lost their chance to get Jones, so they were fine trading back with Pittsburgh. Pitt jumped up and snatched Bush

The Cincy beat writers have been brutal on the Bengals for telegraphing wanting Jones and Bush. Reminds me a lot of the Ross days!!
I listened to the Cufcliffe interview  
johnnyb : 7/22/2019 8:41 am : link
On WFAN I believe a week after the draft. He insisted there were at least two teams that would have taken Jones before the Giants picked again at 17. I guess he has motivation to not tell the whole truth but he was rather convincing. Does it matter now? Nope. Jones is our QB of the future, like it or not, and as a fan I will route for him to succeed.

I do remember some backlash when Simms was taken. Imagine what BBI would have been like if this site existed in 1978!
...  
christian : 7/22/2019 8:53 am : link
The draft is so dynamic, any number of things could have played out if the Giants hadn't picked Jones.

Who knows what trades or surprises could have gone down. Nothing is certain between picks 7-17 in the NFL draft.

Piling on a first round where the Giants drafted a top rated corner, defensive tackle, and quarterback, comes off as either hate for hate's sake on Gettleman or disappointment the draft didn't align with a mock draft.
FWIW  
V.I.G. : 7/22/2019 9:12 am : link
I'm sold on Jones for the '19 QB Class.

The question will come down to whether we should have taken any QB at all or waited til '20 to take one of those QBs. Hypothetically, if Eli plays well enough in '19 that we draft too high or we can't take or trade up for one of the 20 QBs, then Eli would have been extended anyway in '20. If he doesn't we get one of those '20 QBs. We won't know the correct answer to that until '22/3.

Anyway, I hope DJ is the goods.

/Kirk out/
I don't know how Jones will turn out but it would have been  
Blue21 : 7/22/2019 9:48 am : link
a high risk to wait to 2020. First of all they probably would n't have been in position to get a QB or one better than Jones risk.
RE: I listened to the Cufcliffe interview  
M.S. : 7/22/2019 9:58 am : link
In comment 14503520 johnnyb said:
Quote:
I do remember some backlash when Simms was taken. Imagine what BBI would have been like if this site existed in 1978!


Wait... wasn't I posting on BBI in 1978? (:-)
RE: I don't know how Jones will turn out but it would have been  
Jay on the Island : 7/22/2019 10:06 am : link
In comment 14503592 Blue21 said:
Quote:
a high risk to wait to 2020. First of all they probably would n't have been in position to get a QB or one better than Jones risk.

This, for some reason we kept seeing posters say "just wait until 2020 to get a QB." They acted as if it would easy to obtain one of the QB's without knowing where the Giants would finish this season. They are very unlikely to be in a position to draft Tua or Fromm. They would not only need to trade a kings ransom to trade up for them, they would also need the teams to be willing to trade the picks. It is more than likely that those teams will also need a long term answer at QB and will not be willing to make a trade.
I don't know if Jones is any good  
NoPeanutz : 7/22/2019 10:20 am : link
But I am 100% convinced that Jones would have been gone by 17. Denver, Cincinnati and Miami all were public about their need for QBs, and nobody picked one after Jones went off the board. Chances are good that the Washington coaches also had Jones above Haskins, if those other 4 teams (NYG, DEN, MIA, CIN) did.
Pages: 1 2 | Show All |  Next>>
Back to the Corner