Daniel Jones signs

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Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet)
7/22/19, 9:26 PM
Source: The #Giants and 1st round QB Daniel Jones have an agreement in principle on his rookie contract

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Schefter - ( New Window )

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Now I do. It’s on the twittah

Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet)
7/22/19, 9:31 PM
The #Giants rookies will be on the field tomorrow and their rookie QB Daniel Jones will be with them. Right on time. Jones gets his entire signing bonus in Year 1, I’m told

It is called a signing bonus.

Preseason games will be must-see.

important thing is that he can now focus on football rather than divide is attention between football and contract negotiations.

Now let’s see what you’ve got, kid.

In comment 14504363 Defenderdawg said:

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Ian Rapoport (@RapSheet) 7/22/19, 9:31 PM The #Giants rookies will be on the field tomorrow and their rookie QB Daniel Jones will be with them. Right on time. Jones gets his entire signing bonus in Year 1, I’m told

Interesting that they would do that. I'm sure for cap purposes that helps all concerned. The time to win with a first round QB is when they are on their rookie deal before the real money comes in (assuming they prove they can do it). I still believe this team is marching towards building a new core and look to make noise in 2020 when they have lots of cap room and Jones has taken over as the lead dog. I would think this move helps the Giants across his deal to provide plenty of flexibility for the next 5 years.

!

purposes. This is a good faith move by the Giants due to the time value of money. It is actually costing them more money to do this in real world value.

In comment 14504378 Zeke's Alibi said:

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purposes. This is a good faith move by the Giants due to the time value of money. It is actually costing them more money to do this in real world value.

I thought that was done "for cap purposes" regardless of the signing bonus being paid right away (and accelerated if a guy is cut/traded). I just wasn't aware that the bonus was ever not paid fully ASAP.

Now we can focus on camp.

In comment 14504384 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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In comment 14504378 Zeke's Alibi said: Quote: purposes. This is a good faith move by the Giants due to the time value of money. It is actually costing them more money to do this in real world value. I thought that was done "for cap purposes" regardless of the signing bonus being paid right away (and accelerated if a guy is cut/traded). I just wasn't aware that the bonus was ever not paid fully ASAP.

I just think they screwed up the wording. As in he is getting it all as a signing bonus and not other types of bonuses used.

but I'm not sure.

In comment 14504366 bceagle05 said:

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Preseason games will be must-see.

Indeed. Even camp reports will carry much more sizzle this summer.

In comment 14504365 shockeyisthebest8056 said:

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It is called a signing bonus.

. Actually it is unusual. Signing bonus is fully guaranteed and is usually for rookies spread pretty equally over the life of the contract. By paying the entire bonus this year they are only on the hook for his salary going forward. That makes him very expendable financially if they ever wanted to release him. However, that isn't why they structured the deal this way. They like the players they have this year and they had room (which is amazing with the dead money they ate) to soak up the bonus this year.

Imagine if Jones is starting next year and all they are paying him is his base (which financially is exactly what will happen).

They have a ton of cap spac next year. It will be really interesting to see how they use it. Hopefully nthey start licking up their own good players like they did with Shep.

In comment 14504398 DavidinBMNY said:

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In comment 14504365 shockeyisthebest8056 said: Quote: It is called a signing bonus. . Actually it is unusual. Signing bonus is fully guaranteed and is usually for rookies spread pretty equally over the life of the contract. By paying the entire bonus this year they are only on the hook for his salary going forward. That makes him very expendable financially if they ever wanted to release him. However, that isn't why they structured the deal this way. They like the players they have this year and they had room (which is amazing with the dead money they ate) to soak up the bonus this year. Imagine if Jones is starting next year and all they are paying him is his base (which financially is exactly what will happen). They have a ton of cap spac next year. It will be really interesting to see how they use it. Hopefully nthey start licking up their own good players like they did with Shep.

This isn't it. The signing bonus is spread over the life of the contact for cap purposes. You can't have a signing bonus and have it all appear in year 1 for cap purposes.

What this refers to is that the team only has to pay the signing bonus the year it is due, unless he is released than they need to pay the rest in full. The Giants decided to give it all to him upfront which is a smart move with your future QB.

even know the full details yet? Too many people are talking as they know what they are talking about but really don't.

Starting. Didn't like Shurmur back-pedaling today about no open QB competition.

It's clear to me - and I am still unconvinced about Jones - that at least his athleticism is a much better fit for Shurmur's O than the Eli. Not taking advantage of his mobility right away, especially with SB parked in the backfield, is poor management.

it lowers the Giants overall cap hit because the present value of the bonus money could enable the Giants to give an overall smaller signing bonus in contract terms.

For example, if a player wants a $4 million bonus on a four year contract, it would have a cap hit of $1 million/year and likely paid out as $1 million/year.

But if you could convince him to take a 3 million bonus but that he would get it all up front because it's the same value as $4 over 4 years, then he would be getting the same amount of money in real terms, but it would only have a $750K cap hit per year... unless I have cap rules wrong.

Since there is no chance Jones doesn't last his entire rookie contract, there isn't a risk that they will have paid him the bonus too early.

I really just think this is a good faith gesture to your future QB.

In comment 14504409 bw in dc said:

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Starting. Didn't like Shurmur back-pedaling today about no open QB competition. It's clear to me - and I am still unconvinced about Jones - that at least his athleticism is a much better fit for Shurmur's O than the Eli. Not taking advantage of his mobility right away, especially with SB parked in the backfield, is poor management.

If we replaced Jones with the names..... Lorenzen, Woodson, Nasib, Webb, Bomar....

Would the rest of the post be the same from the past?

Jones was picked at 6.

With Jones?

them practically nothing. Starting a relationship off on the best of terms is smart business.

I see a thread like this it seems to make me think of "Hall Signs".

In comment 14504430 dep026 said:

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If we replaced Jones with the names..... Lorenzen, Woodson, Nasib, Webb, Bomar.... Would the rest of the post be the same from the past?

Of course not. Taking Jones at #6 is a major investment. And an unequivocal statement - Jones is THE QB of the future. The only question marks are - can he actually play and how soon can we find out?

Those names of the past are cross-your-fingers-and hope projects...

In comment 14504378 Zeke's Alibi said:

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purposes. This is a good faith move by the Giants due to the time value of money. It is actually costing them more money to do this in real world value.

I don't think this is necessarily true. You can spread the signing bonus over the life of the contract up to 5 years to reduce the cap hit. You can also pay it off entirely in a year or two which raises the cap hit for those first two years but significantly lowers the cap hit towards the end of the contract. It's a smart move by the giants to free up more room when they are trying to add pieces around a cheap QB.

This is from over the cap:

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For the most part prorated money is what is referred to as a signing bonus in the press. It is essentially a lump sum bonus that is considered paid out when a contract is signed or an option invoked, though in reality the payout occurs over a period of time.

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Lets assume the sides decide he has to earn $21 million in the first 3 years of a 5 year deal worth $33 million total. Now the team could simply pay him $7 million a year in P5 salary, which would leave the team with cap charges of $7 million per year, but what if team is really strapped for cap space. Their other option is to pay him $15 million in a signing bonus, prorated at $3 million per year, and then pay the rest of the $21 million as base salary. Pretend its $1 million in 2013, $2 million in 2014, and $3 million in 2015. Our new cap charges are $4 million, $5 million, and $6 million a huge savings on our team salary cap.

link - ( New Window )

You can't have a 20 million signing bonus paid out all in year 1 for cap purposes. You can have a roster bonus, but I think there are limits to that. The bonus, which is guranteed is paid out by the year usually, and than paid the balance if a player is cut. The Giants seemed to have decided to just give it all up to him upfront. Was this a good faith gesture by them or a shrewd negotiating move by his agent (the team is going to want their first round QB there on day 1 with money they have to pay him anyway)? Who knows and I only care from an intellectually curious standpoint. He is signed and here ready to go day 1.

Ralph Vacchiano
@RVacchianoSNY
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2h
QB Daniel Jones, the sixth overall pick, has agreed to terms on his rookie contract and will be at the Giants' rookies first practice tomorrow (per @RapSheet
). He's due to get a four-year, $25.6 million deal with a $16.7M signing bonus.

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Either today our franchise signed our next starting qb for a (quasi) generation, or we set ourselves back a long time.

I think Daniel is a capable qb and should at least have a mediocre career - at least. At most, much more. If he goes bust I am most likely going to blame the organization for mishandling his development.

Excited stuff though. I'm looking forward to positive DJ news during camp. Especially his disproving reported draft prep weaknesses.

I do maintain a preference for him red-shirting this year, for multiple reasons. It just seems sitting at first (don't have time to flesh out all reasons this instance, but happy to later) leads to higher likelihood of a more successful career with the team that drafted them. For the fan, delayed gratification, if you will.

In comment 14504457 Zeke's Alibi said:

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You can't have a 20 million signing bonus paid out all in year 1 for cap purposes. You can have a roster bonus, but I think there are limits to that. The bonus, which is guranteed is paid out by the year usually, and than paid the balance if a player is cut. The Giants seemed to have decided to just give it all up to him upfront. Was this a good faith gesture by them or a shrewd negotiating move by his agent (the team is going to want their first round QB there on day 1 with money they have to pay him anyway)? Who knows and I only care from an intellectually curious standpoint. He is signed and here ready to go day 1.

No. Bonus money is paid up front and for cap purposes it is prorated over the length of the contract, 5 years max. The payment may be subject to payment terms as in multiple payment dates in the first year, but it is not paid to the player each year of the contract like salary. http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000001021617/printable/2019-nfl-free-agency-glossary-all-the-terms-you-need-to-know

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Singing bonus: Money earned by a player for signing his contract. Typically paid out within the first 12-18 months. Prorated against the salary cap for the life of the contract (five-season maximum). This is how the Lions could afford to give Matthew Stafford a $50 million signing bonus in 2017. For cap purposes, Stafford's signing bonus counted for $10 million against the Lions' salary cap for each of the next five seasons.

What you suggest is more like guaranteed salary which is paid and is set against the cap in the year it is contracted to be paid, regardless if the player is on the team or not.

The delay with Jones may be due to the terms of payment of the signing bonus(in 6 or 18 months).

Another possinility is offset language in the contract which may allow the team to recoup guaranteed salary if a 1st round pick is cut before the 4th year. Link with explanation below.

Not saying this was the case with DJ, but it is possible. This was the reason Joey Bosa and others have held out or were late in signing.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/09000d5d82a72b56/article/whats-the-holdup-for-top-picks-getting-signed-offset-language

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But in the fourth year comes the debate over offset language. If there is offset language, it allows the team to save money when releasing a player. Let's say a first-rounder is due $2 million in his fourth year. If he's released, and then agrees to a $2 million deal with a new team, the original team is completely off the hook. He receives $2 million from his new club, and the team that drafted him washes its hands of the situation. If there is no offset language, the discarded player receives the guaranteed money from his original team and the full salary from his new team. The original team can't merely allow the new team to pay the remaining guaranteed money as part of the new deal.

of other sources say that it isn't, but I'll take NFLs official page as gospel.

Gonna get the MOST money figuring time value factors as well.

Didn't I say that before?


He's probably buying a neighborhood near FatMan, or a county in West Virginia, or a condo right next door to Eli in Jersey...

Suck

be there for camp. They don't need what happened with Darnold and the media circus with him not being signed.

But don't cry in year 4 that you are only making 2.5 million.......

In comment 14504378 Zeke's Alibi said:

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purposes. This is a good faith move by the Giants due to the time value of money. It is actually costing them more money to do this in real world value.

Time value of money... yes. But at 2-3% interest rates, not that big a sacrifice for Giants. When I was in B-school way back when, and money market interest rates were running between 10 - 14%, THAT was some serious time value of money!

I do not believe the Giants dropped any big bonus bucks this year.

The new guys from Cleveland were trades....they did convert some salary to bonus for the LG...but outside that...there were light on signing over checks.

Or it could be a shot of Jones signing his confession to a series of grisly murders.

I hope it's the first one.

In comment 14504516 George from PA said:

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I do not believe the Giants dropped any big bonus bucks this year. The new guys from Cleveland were trades....they did convert some salary to bonus for the LG...but outside that...there were light on signing over checks.

Golden Tate was this biggest at $10 million, and only one we gave any real money too. Lot's of dead money on the books this season from prorated signing bonus for OBJ, Vernon etc, but looking like at least $40-$45 million of cap space for next season (Eli coming off books being biggest savings)

In comment 14504493 ZogZerg said:

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But don't cry in year 4 that you are only making 2.5 million.......

Does Daniel Jones honestly look like someone who is going to cry about money? What a dumb thing to say.

In comment 14504539 Big Rick in FL said:

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In comment 14504493 ZogZerg said: Quote: But don't cry in year 4 that you are only making 2.5 million....... Does Daniel Jones honestly look like someone who is going to cry about money? What a dumb thing to say.

This comment is for all players. Players do this all the time. "I am only make X millions this year... I'm way under paid....." They conveniently leave off the bonus they received a couple of years earlier that would reflect the real salary.

I don't see Jones complaining, but who knows about his agent.

Probably closer to 60+ million in space for next year. Right now OvertheCap has us at 60 million with 52 players under contract. That doesn't include the Daniel Jones deal yet. The cap hit won't be very big though.

If they cut Ellison, Kareem Martin & Jackrabbit that puts them at 80 million. Even if we say a 7 million dollar cap hit for Jones that puts them a tad over 73 million in cap space with 49 players under contract.

Ogletree is a potential cap casualty which would save another 8 million. They could restructure Solder's 17 million dollar hit. We are in very good shape for the future.

With the total comp already set to their great advantage, GMs have a great opportunity to not erode relationships with players and agents, and let the players dictate the terms.

If you're the Chargers, why risk the bad taste with Bosa and his team, over rounding error type money?

Seems petty and weird. Really glad the Giants didn't do that.

Who cares though if they do it? If they are outperforming their contract they should ask for more. The team will ask players to take a paycut or cut them if they are underperforming.