NFT: Yankees trade deadline discussion

is the updated Yankees Top 30 prospect list
Link - ( New Window )

in saying that nothing is off limits. and nothing should be.

The only asset that should be off limits is Jasson Dominguez who can't be traded anyway as he was just signed in this J2 class.

Cashman is playing this cool. He will entertain all options letting people know he's ready to pull the trigger, but balking at Stroman's price shows that he won't make a knee jerk decision. Balking at Stroman also pumps up Frazier and tells the league that he would be the centerpiece for a front line starter, not like the level of prospects that were given up for Stroman.

Patience is key. I'd like to win a WS this year too but I'm fine with holding onto our big trade assets for next year as well.

In comment 14511365 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

Cashman is playing this cool. He will entertain all options letting people know he's ready to pull the trigger, but balking at Stroman's price shows that he won't make a knee jerk decision. Balking at Stroman also pumps up Frazier and tells the league that he would be the centerpiece for a front line starter, not like the level of prospects that were given up for Stroman. Patience is key. I'd like to win a WS this year too but I'm fine with holding onto our big trade assets for next year as well.

were there any reports that the Jays had interest in Frazier as the centerpiece? The story seems to be pretty consistently reported that they were insistent on Garcia and Cashman wasn't going there for Stroman.

not that I know of. Just using Frazier as an example though. I know they think highly of him and wouldn't use him or try using him for someone they don't consider a top line starter.

the rebuild (and expectations) have been accelerated (don't think 19 was the WS target) -- let's not panic and overpay. Plus pitching is a real wild card.

I don't want Bauer (not as a pitcher, as a Yankee in NYC).

In comment 14511365 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

Cashman is playing this cool. He will entertain all options letting people know he's ready to pull the trigger, but balking at Stroman's price shows that he won't make a knee jerk decision. Balking at Stroman also pumps up Frazier and tells the league that he would be the centerpiece for a front line starter, not like the level of prospects that were given up for Stroman. Patience is key. I'd like to win a WS this year too but I'm fine with holding onto our big trade assets for next year as well.

I agree with you. Who is out there that is going to really make a difference. Sherzer is not being traded. Baumgarner is not being traded. Anyone else is about the same level that is already mentioned n the roster. Funny thing is on the post game a couple of days ago 5hey showed that the first 2 weeks of July the Yankees starters had the 2nd best era in the league. With this bullpen rested and ready to go in the post season, I like our chances.i mean we do have the best record in the American League.

that it was a no on both Garcia and Frazier for Stroman. Cash seems pretty insistent on not giving up those two unless he's getting at least 2.5 seasons of control on the pitcher in return. Syndergaard fits the bill but the Mets are surely asking for an insane price with no intention to ever send him to the Yankees

This is the third season into this core's run and they don't look any closer to a title than they were in 2017.

I like Cashman and overall he does a terrific job, but it's hard to avoid the opinion that he really botched the pitching in the offseason. I defended passing on Corbin, but boy that looks like an enormous mistake right now.

He was the acquisition that was supposed to be leading the rotation, the reason they didn't go hard after any FA starters, and after his good start to the season he has been DREADFUL.

Yeah, I think at some point, you have to say "this team is good enough to win if we can just give it a couple more pieces" - and you have to be a little aggressive.

You don't want to keep sitting on what you've got and then realize you've missed the boat.

I don't think Cashman should empty the system and overpay or be desperate - but I do think being a bit more aggressive at this deadline than we are at last deadline is warranted.

This team is 9 up in the division and we're on the precipice of August. Our odds of winning the ALE are very good right now. We're almost certainly going to be in the postseason. I don't want to just hope for good breaks on Severino, Betances and that things just fall into place on their own... it's too risky and will probably just have us fall short again.

that I would not trade is Miguel Andujar.

If you look at the Yankees, the 2019 bat of DJ LeMahieu equals what the 2018 Miguel Andujar bat gave us.

Imagine a 2020 lineup with BOTH LeMahieu and Andujar.

We can all agree that Andujar could be a better fielder, but he has VERY rare bat skills that can't be ignored.

In 606 plate appearances last year, Andujar only struck out 97 times. LeMahieu is targeted to strike out a similar (and extremely low) 90 times this year. With the other high strike out batters in the long term Yankees lineup, the batting order needs LeMahieu and Andujar.

Paxton in the last month: 5 starts, 5.68 ERA, .336/.377/.635 allowed, 36 hits and 8 homers in 25.1 IP

Tanaka: 4 starts, 9.55 ERA, .302/.343/.615 allowed, 29 hits and 7 homers in 21.2 IP

Happ: 4 starts, 5.21 ERA, .293/.357/.480, 22 hits and 3 homers in 19 IP. I'm stunned it's only 3 homers.

Sabathia: 4 starts, 7.17 ERA, .299/.337/.655, 26 hits and 9 homers in 21.1 IP

None of their starters have actually pitched well in a month.

but if this is what Paxton is, it sets things back a lot.

other words, Happ is pitching better!!

it's weird for a team fueled by young position players and whose arms were all developed (if not drafted) by the Mets to be absolutely allergic to prospects.

Burnett flamed our after one year, Pineda was a bust, Gray was a bust, Paxton has gotten off to a rough start - maybe Cashman is tired of getting burned and will just take the uber-bullpen approach this October.

In comment 14511379 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

He was the acquisition that was supposed to be leading the rotation, the reason they didn't go hard after any FA starters, and after his good start to the season he has been DREADFUL.

Plus nobody predicted we’d get zilch from Sevy. Paxton was supposed to be 2 a or b with Tanaka

I am curious of your opinion of Trenton catcher Kellin Deglan.

Does he have the majors in his future? I know that he is one of the oldest players in AA at 27, but he seems to be having a very solid season.

Thoughts?

My best offer:

Clint Frazier
Deivi Garcia
Jonathan Loaisiga
Tyler Wade
Luis Medina

for

Thor
Zach Wheeler

Two position players you can plug and play immediately, two starters in AAA and a lottery ticket.

.

In comment 14511502 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

.

From Mets point of view or Yankees?

They aren't going to trade anyone to the Yankees, period. The Coupons would sooner burn Citi Field to the ground than make a deal that would help the Yankees.

Not sure I love it, but they are not going to win anything with the pitching as currently constructed

If he came cheap, maybe, but the Tigers have been making absurd demands.

In comment 14511377 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

This is the third season into this core's run and they don't look any closer to a title than they were in 2017. I like Cashman and overall he does a terrific job, but it's hard to avoid the opinion that he really botched the pitching in the offseason. I defended passing on Corbin, but boy that looks like an enormous mistake right now.

Not attacking you, but do you think if Corbin was in NY and Paxton in Washington that they'd both be pitching the same? I don't, and I think that's the blessing/curse the Yankees face with pitching. Its simply a different beast, and there's really no way to know. Its probably why Cashman is being frugal and only wants a proven ace that has the mental makeup he thinks has what it takes. The 2/3 rotation pitchers are just a big risk for what it takes to get them.

...forgot all about this guy. I just assumed we wouldn't hear from him until the 2020 Season, but according to the attached he may be back late this season. Whatever "late" really means!

Yankees Injury Report: Jordan Montgomery could return this season - ( New Window )

In comment 14511389 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

that I would not trade is Miguel Andujar. If you look at the Yankees, the 2019 bat of DJ LeMahieu equals what the 2018 Miguel Andujar bat gave us. Imagine a 2020 lineup with BOTH LeMahieu and Andujar. We can all agree that Andujar could be a better fielder, but he has VERY rare bat skills that can't be ignored. In 606 plate appearances last year, Andujar only struck out 97 times. LeMahieu is targeted to strike out a similar (and extremely low) 90 times this year. With the other high strike out batters in the long term Yankees lineup, the batting order needs LeMahieu and Andujar.

What about Urshella?? Both Urshella and DLM play a better 3b than Andujar. Id rather trade Miguel and get a SP and go with DLM and Urshella at 3rd.

In comment 14511389 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

that I would not trade is Miguel Andujar. If you look at the Yankees, the 2019 bat of DJ LeMahieu equals what the 2018 Miguel Andujar bat gave us. Imagine a 2020 lineup with BOTH LeMahieu and Andujar. We can all agree that Andujar could be a better fielder, but he has VERY rare bat skills that can't be ignored. In 606 plate appearances last year, Andujar only struck out 97 times. LeMahieu is targeted to strike out a similar (and extremely low) 90 times this year. With the other high strike out batters in the long term Yankees lineup, the batting order needs LeMahieu and Andujar.

I think Andujar is a great bat, but he's a future DH most likely. I'm completely fine with including him in a big package for an ace and paying DJLM instead. We've got too many DH's here.

for a pitcher with only this year of control. I want next year or more.

In comment 14511514 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

They aren't going to trade anyone to the Yankees, period. The Coupons would sooner burn Citi Field to the ground than make a deal that would help the Yankees.

lol, it does really seem that way.

The Yankees shouldn't trade anyone of significance for a mid-rotation type starter. Unfortunately the Mets have the only high end starter seemingly available. Hopefully we can make an outside the box move, like maybe German Marquez from Colorado.

Corbin was the better pitcher in 2018 by a fair bit, though, despite Paxton pitching in a very pitcher-friendly home park.

In comment 14511537 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Corbin was the better pitcher in 2018 by a fair bit, though, despite Paxton pitching in a very pitcher-friendly home park.

Paxton is turning into Pineda 2.0, it's frustrating.

My guess is that Cashman walks away with Robbie Ray and a reliever when it's all said and done. I just hope he doesn't trade Frazier for dogshit, there is value there in a package to deal him.

A Yankee scout was scouting him recently I believe and he’s been having a solid year down in Texas.

31 years old and very mediocre career stats as a starter before this season. Supposedly Texas will insist on Garcia for him....hell fuck no to that.

.

start becoming responsible for so many pitchers flopping as Yankees? The Astros keep making pitchers better, while solid pitchers come to the Yankees and turn into dumpster fires.

not shock me if Cashman tried to get Carlos Martinez from St. Louis.

He was previously a starter, but is now in the bullpen with the Jordan Hicks season ending injury.

Martinez is signed long term and is still only 27.

who can handle and excel in NYC.

In comment 14511563 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

not shock me if Cashman tried to get Carlos Martinez from St. Louis. He was previously a starter, but is now in the bullpen with the Jordan Hicks season ending injury. Martinez is signed long term and is still only 27.

Cards bats are getting hot and they just tied for the NL Central lead. I'd be rather surprised if they sold off a player like CarMart.

In comment 14511529 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

In comment 14511389 YANKEE28 said: Quote: that I would not trade is Miguel Andujar. If you look at the Yankees, the 2019 bat of DJ LeMahieu equals what the 2018 Miguel Andujar bat gave us. Imagine a 2020 lineup with BOTH LeMahieu and Andujar. We can all agree that Andujar could be a better fielder, but he has VERY rare bat skills that can't be ignored. In 606 plate appearances last year, Andujar only struck out 97 times. LeMahieu is targeted to strike out a similar (and extremely low) 90 times this year. With the other high strike out batters in the long term Yankees lineup, the batting order needs LeMahieu and Andujar. I think Andujar is a great bat, but he's a future DH most likely. I'm completely fine with including him in a big package for an ace and paying DJLM instead. We've got too many DH's here.

If it's for an Ace I'm ok with it too but only an Ace.

Next year I think EE isn't on the team and I see them playing Stanton in left as much as possible. I can see them making it work with Andujar as a DH part time 3B or wherever. If they don't trade him maybe they work with Andujar in the spring in the OF or even 1B to give them more flexibility.

I think this year has shown they like resting guys and having more than just a set 9 or 10 is important and can work.

I just have a feeling that Cashman is looking at pitching outside of the half dozen names we have been hearing for the past 2 months.

I am expecting a surprise acquisition.

to import starting pitching. CC, Tanaka, Kuroda, and a few guys they've tweaked (Eovaldi), otherwise every guy who has started for them at length this decade and pitched well has been someone they've developed in whole or in part.

did you see my Deglan question above?

He built a team with a healthy and close to peak years Severino, Betances and Montgomery in mind. That makes a lot of difference.

A lot of difference.

One of the true Aces in MLB.

A great 8th inning pitcher making the load easier on everyone.

And a guy who is probably better than late season CC/Happ if healthy.

Severino/Tanaka/Paxton/German/Montgomery with Betances added to the bullpen is a very good pitching staff??

In comment 14511461 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

I am curious of your opinion of Trenton catcher Kellin Deglan. Does he have the majors in his future? I know that he is one of the oldest players in AA at 27, but he seems to be having a very solid season. Thoughts?

Sorry, didn't see it initially. Unless the Yankees see some sort of offensive breakout, he seems to be on the organizational track. That is to say, he's a guy they'll move around to eat innings but who won't get in the way of a guy they think is a prospect. Jason Lopez and Donny Sands at Tampa are considerably younger and are prospects, though neither is beating down the door right now.

so forgive the potentially stupid question:

if Deivi Garcia is lighting up AAA, why don't they call him up?

In comment 14511367 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

In comment 14511365 UConn4523 said: Quote: Cashman is playing this cool. He will entertain all options letting people know he's ready to pull the trigger, but balking at Stroman's price shows that he won't make a knee jerk decision. Balking at Stroman also pumps up Frazier and tells the league that he would be the centerpiece for a front line starter, not like the level of prospects that were given up for Stroman. Patience is key. I'd like to win a WS this year too but I'm fine with holding onto our big trade assets for next year as well. were there any reports that the Jays had interest in Frazier as the centerpiece? The story seems to be pretty consistently reported that they were insistent on Garcia and Cashman wasn't going there for Stroman.

There was a report that Cash wouldn't include Deivi or Frazier for Stroman.

He was lighting it up in AA.

Not so much in his few appearances in AAA.

Garcia is only 20 and is not currently on the 40 man roster. If the Yankees add him to that roster, someone has to be released.

A ton of potential, but perhaps a risk to ask for so much so early in his career.

In comment 14511605 GruningsOnTheHill said:

Quote:

so forgive the potentially stupid question: if Deivi Garcia is lighting up AAA, why don't they call him up?

He's not lighting up AAA, he's struggling (somewhat) at AAA. He was lighting up AA. He's very young (20), he started the year at Tampa, he's on an innings limit (already past his official career high), there is no rush.

In comment 14511379 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

He was the acquisition that was supposed to be leading the rotation, the reason they didn't go hard after any FA starters, and after his good start to the season he has been DREADFUL.

This is not the Paxton they signed. Whether by happenstance or design, he is not throwing his curveball, which was a great pitch, nearly as much as he did with the Mariners, and he is throwing more cutters. Hopefully, Rothschild is telling him to ditch the cutter and start throwing the curve again.

I know we mock Sonny Gray, but he made that point after getting dealt. As Greg alluded to, the reason pitchers struggle here can't all be "New York pressure" - something has to be up with the pitching philosophy. Is Paxton really under that much pressure? This team's been cruising along all year and he was never asked to be the savior of any kind. I'm guessing his knee has something to do with it, too.

It's working for the the kids, and it's not like they're one size fits all. Paxton struggling in the 1st, Gray not being able to pitch at YS, those don't seem like pitch selection issues.

We need a post season ace. He's virtually the only available guy who is literally that.

In comment 14511526 superspynyg said:

Quote:

In comment 14511389 YANKEE28 said: Quote: that I would not trade is Miguel Andujar. If you look at the Yankees, the 2019 bat of DJ LeMahieu equals what the 2018 Miguel Andujar bat gave us. Imagine a 2020 lineup with BOTH LeMahieu and Andujar. We can all agree that Andujar could be a better fielder, but he has VERY rare bat skills that can't be ignored. In 606 plate appearances last year, Andujar only struck out 97 times. LeMahieu is targeted to strike out a similar (and extremely low) 90 times this year. With the other high strike out batters in the long term Yankees lineup, the batting order needs LeMahieu and Andujar. What about Urshella?? Both Urshella and DLM play a better 3b than Andujar. Id rather trade Miguel and get a SP and go with DLM and Urshella at 3rd.

I agree, Ursella has been super clutch too...

In comment 14511629 adamg said:

Quote:

We need a post season ace. He's virtually the only available guy who is literally that.

Was.

In comment 14511629 adamg said:

Quote:

We need a post season ace. He's virtually the only available guy who is literally that.

Wish MadBum was available,but it seems he's not.Now that they're back in the race & this being Bochy's last year,I'd be surprised if he's moved.

I think Bauer is Cash's target & the Indians will be looking to move him even though they're in the race. His contract is going to increase immensely so the feeling is they want to move him now.Yesterday's actions give the Indians the "excuse" to move him!

I haven't heard his name mentioned. Had a very good year last year and just came back from injury and pitched well. He's a FA after the season so he shouldn't cost much. You'd hope he's not the only deadline acquisition but they could do far worse if Bumgarner isn't available, the Mets won't trade with the Yankees and a deal can't be struck for Bauer
(if they're even interested).

Yankees team would include Urshela and Andujar.

And Stanton would be the everyday left fielder.

you can't count on anything from him. Maybe you catch lightning in a bottle ala McCarthy a few years back, but it's nothing more than that.

In comment 14511644 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

Yankees team would include Urshela and Andujar. And Stanton would be the everyday left fielder.

Here's the million dollar question as to whether they move Andujar or not. Are they resigning Didi? (They should try to do so right after the trade deadline-he's more than proven healthy) If so,you have the same situation you have now-4 infielders for 3 (3 1/2 if you count DJL at 1B) & unless Andujar becomes your DH/OF,there's a glut! Personally,I want to keep Andujar but if they need to use him for a SP that is truly a #1/2 (Damn if I know who that is but that's Cash's job!),then you'd have to move him!

In comment 14511657 TheMick7 said:

Quote:

In comment 14511644 YANKEE28 said: Quote: Yankees team would include Urshela and Andujar. And Stanton would be the everyday left fielder. Here's the million dollar question as to whether they move Andujar or not. Are they resigning Didi? (They should try to do so right after the trade deadline-he's more than proven healthy) If so,you have the same situation you have now-4 infielders for 3 (3 1/2 if you count DJL at 1B) & unless Andujar becomes your DH/OF,there's a glut! Personally,I want to keep Andujar but if they need to use him for a SP that is truly a #1/2 (Damn if I know who that is but that's Cash's job!),then you'd have to move him!

If think they'll resign Didi but I don't think it'll Impact Andujar. They'll make it work very similar to how they told DJ they'd get him his AB's. I see them rotating all those guys around the IF to get them AB's. They'll be room at DH too especially with Stanton playing a lot of LF, and I don't expect EE to be back.

They love resting guys and I think this year has proven it works, plus they'd be covering themselves for injury or if Gio is just having a one off type year. I don't think he is but they'll find room for talent and make it work.

In comment 14511629 adamg said:

Quote:

We need a post season ace. He's virtually the only available guy who is literally that.

Nods aggressively

other than MadBum and Bauer and it's unlikely either get traded

In comment 14511668 Nine-Tails said:

Quote:

In comment 14511629 adamg said: Quote: We need a post season ace. He's virtually the only available guy who is literally that. Nods aggressively

I'd love MadBum but I don't think he's getting dealt

but he's not an ace. And the fact that he pitched like an ace in the postseason five years ago, in fact that he was historically good, does not add MPH to his FB, spin to his breaking ball, etc etc. Injuries and mileage have taken their toll on his stuff. Grit and determination go a long way, but they aren't going to take him where his stuff cannot.

Any Red Sox offer for Edwin Diaz would presumably include minor-league slugger Bobby Dalbec, who is blocked at 3b by the younger Rafael Devers, or 2018 No. 1 pick Triston Casas, in case Mets view him as 3b option. Red Sox confident they will make impact bullpen move.

In comment 14511675 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

but he's not an ace. And the fact that he pitched like an ace in the postseason five years ago, in fact that he was historically good, does not add MPH to his FB, spin to his breaking ball, etc etc. Injuries and mileage have taken their toll on his stuff. Grit and determination go a long way, but they aren't going to take him where his stuff cannot.

This. People need to realize and accept that Bumgarner 2019 is not equivalent to Bumgarner 2012, recent hot streak notwithstanding.

In comment 14511695 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14511675 Dunedin81 said: Quote: but he's not an ace. And the fact that he pitched like an ace in the postseason five years ago, in fact that he was historically good, does not add MPH to his FB, spin to his breaking ball, etc etc. Injuries and mileage have taken their toll on his stuff. Grit and determination go a long way, but they aren't going to take him where his stuff cannot. This. People need to realize and accept that Bumgarner 2019 is not equivalent to Bumgarner 2012, recent hot streak notwithstanding.

I guess I disagree. Without literally giving up the farm he'd be worth the risk due to his post season pedigree and he's currently hot. Will take it that he can pitch on guile alone and can get people out in a big spot. But it's a mute point, SF's not moving him.

In comment 14511676 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

Any Red Sox offer for Edwin Diaz would presumably include minor-league slugger Bobby Dalbec, who is blocked at 3b by the younger Rafael Devers, or 2018 No. 1 pick Triston Casas, in case Mets view him as 3b option. Red Sox confident they will make impact bullpen move.

Why on earth did the Mets pick up Stroman then? Why would they trade their closer (the only good arm in an atrocious pen) in addition to either Syndergaard or Wheeler. In other terms, what on earth is Brodie van Wagenen doing

and driving Mets fans crazy.

In comment 14511755 dpinzow said:

Quote:

In comment 14511676 YANKEE28 said: Quote: Any Red Sox offer for Edwin Diaz would presumably include minor-league slugger Bobby Dalbec, who is blocked at 3b by the younger Rafael Devers, or 2018 No. 1 pick Triston Casas, in case Mets view him as 3b option. Red Sox confident they will make impact bullpen move. Why on earth did the Mets pick up Stroman then? Why would they trade their closer (the only good arm in an atrocious pen) in addition to either Syndergaard or Wheeler. In other terms, what on earth is Brodie van Wagenen doing

Plus from everything I've seen and heard it doesn't seem like the Mets need a 3B going forward. It sounds like they could use SS,CF and C help as far as position players go.

In comment 14511695 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14511675 Dunedin81 said: Quote: but he's not an ace. And the fact that he pitched like an ace in the postseason five years ago, in fact that he was historically good, does not add MPH to his FB, spin to his breaking ball, etc etc. Injuries and mileage have taken their toll on his stuff. Grit and determination go a long way, but they aren't going to take him where his stuff cannot. This. People need to realize and accept that Bumgarner 2019 is not equivalent to Bumgarner 2012, recent hot streak notwithstanding.

Okay he might no longer be the god he was in those playoff runs and I do think advanced stats have showed some decline in his stuff. But, he's no scrub. His performance has still been very good the past few years and this year, excluding April. Look at him now, with the giants winning, he's carrying them. I think he would have the same effect on the Yankees. He's a horse and still a top half of the rotation starter

Why would the Mets trade Diaz when they gave up a Kings ransom to get him wouldn’t they want something good back for Diaz and everything I hear is the Red Sox do not have a good farm why would a team just give up a good reliever to them and get nothing back.

In comment 14511767 nygnyy274 said:

Quote:

Why would the Mets trade Diaz when they gave up a Kings ransom to get him wouldn’t they want something good back for Diaz and everything I hear is the Red Sox do not have a good farm why would a team just give up a good reliever to them and get nothing back.

so that makes him almost impossible to trade for. You simply don't know what you are getting with him long term so you better win with him now. Just a massive amount of risk associated to him (that doesn't even include him moving into the AL East).

(win next year vs rebuild), trading Diaz would be a most awful "buy high, sell low" within 12 months.

His results haven't been good, but his FIP/xFIP are over a full run below his ERA for the season. He's still striking out a ton of guys and he's getting BABIP'd like crazy. Seems he's been hit hard AND had some pretty lousy luck, making it look completely abysmal.

He has definitely disappointed, but could easily be a 2-2.5 WAR/season guy for the next 5 years (with upside from there) and few would be surprised.

@JonHeyman
Teams, trying to take advantage of Yankees’ SP need, have asked for Gleyber Torres. Not shockingly, he seems to be off limits. NYY sees possible trade chips as Garcia (but probably only for Noah), Frazier, Andujar plus others at lower levels.

There isn't even a #1 starter/ace type guy on the market who could demand Torres in a deal. Even if there was I wouldn't do it and it's highly unlikely that the Yankees would either.

...don't trade Andujar!!!

47 doubles and 27 tatters in his rookie year, and now he's only 24!

Don't do it.

In comment 14511790 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

@JonHeyman Teams, trying to take advantage of Yankees’ SP need, have asked for Gleyber Torres. Not shockingly, he seems to be off limits. NYY sees possible trade chips as Garcia (but probably only for Noah), Frazier, Andujar plus others at lower levels. There isn't even a #1 starter/ace type guy on the market who could demand Torres in a deal. Even if there was I wouldn't do it and it's highly unlikely that the Yankees would either.

Its so stupid. Cash probably be like sure, Saul Torres, correct?

In comment 14511799 M.S. said:

Quote:

...don't trade Andujar!!! 47 doubles and 27 tatters in his rookie year, and now he's only 24! Don't do it.

It depends on the return. Hell no to guys like Boyd, Ray, Minor. Now if we're talking about an ace, by all means

This October could be a dream for the Yankees analytics department - they can script how to get 27 outs with 7 different pitchers. It's so crazy it might just work.

In comment 14511812 bceagle05 said:

Quote:

This October could be a dream for the Yankees analytics department - they can script how to get 27 outs with 7 different pitchers. It's so crazy it might just work.

I like Ray, but I see him more as an offseason type of move, as opposed to a move that puts us over the top.

but aren't all that great - it HAS to work at some point, doesn't it?

In comment 14511812 bceagle05 said:

Quote:

This October could be a dream for the Yankees analytics department - they can script how to get 27 outs with 7 different pitchers. It's so crazy it might just work.

Especially if Sevy makes it back as a short reliever, and/or Betances makes it back

Yanks may look for max 3-4 IP per start from any starter not named German, or Tanaka if he finds his good splitter

In comment 14511838 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

but aren't all that great - it HAS to work at some point, doesn't it?

At some point they're going to have to realize it's a coaching issue.

In comment 14511845 mfsd said:

Quote:

In comment 14511812 bceagle05 said: Quote: This October could be a dream for the Yankees analytics department - they can script how to get 27 outs with 7 different pitchers. It's so crazy it might just work. Especially if Sevy makes it back as a short reliever, and/or Betances makes it back Yanks may look for max 3-4 IP per start from any starter not named German, or Tanaka if he finds his good splitter

I think if they can't land an Ace or at worst a defininite #2 type pitcher, that plan is exactly how I see them going. Adding another reliever plus hoping to get something out of Sevy and Betances with Montgomery and Loaisiga as fallbacks.

We're probably going to see more opener type games the rest of the way. It wouldn't surprise me to see at least two a week, and maybe a 3rd depending on who makes it back and what the Yanks do before the trade deadline.

In comment 14511611 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

In comment 14511605 GruningsOnTheHill said: Quote: so forgive the potentially stupid question: if Deivi Garcia is lighting up AAA, why don't they call him up? He's not lighting up AAA, he's struggling (somewhat) at AAA. He was lighting up AA. He's very young (20), he started the year at Tampa, he's on an innings limit (already past his official career high), there is no rush.

Another related naive question.

I believe Higgy (sp) said he was having problems with the AAA ball (different seams etc)

So how many different balls are there in the system?

In comment 14511854 Eman11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14511845 mfsd said: Quote: In comment 14511812 bceagle05 said: Quote: This October could be a dream for the Yankees analytics department - they can script how to get 27 outs with 7 different pitchers. It's so crazy it might just work. Especially if Sevy makes it back as a short reliever, and/or Betances makes it back Yanks may look for max 3-4 IP per start from any starter not named German, or Tanaka if he finds his good splitter I think if they can't land an Ace or at worst a defininite #2 type pitcher, that plan is exactly how I see them going. Adding another reliever plus hoping to get something out of Sevy and Betances with Montgomery and Loaisiga as fallbacks. We're probably going to see more opener type games the rest of the way. It wouldn't surprise me to see at least two a week, and maybe a 3rd depending on who makes it back and what the Yanks do before the trade deadline.

I just don't see relying on the pen day in and day out for 5 innings or more as recipe for success. If we had a solid rotation, by all means. The only guy I trust in the playoffs is Tanaka

Cashman must have fun with those calls

are definite postseason "opener" possibilities. Tanaka's postseason track record earns him a start. German's making a case for one. They may gamble on Paxton's upside - he's certainly capable of a dominant performance. I don't trust Happ or CC at all right now.

Green + Sevy could get them to the fifth inning of a playoff game, then you turn it over to the one-inning specialists at the back end. It'll be like an All-Star Game - different closers from the fifth inning on.

In comment 14511654 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

you can't count on anything from him. Maybe you catch lightning in a bottle ala McCarthy a few years back, but it's nothing more than that.

I’m a Reds fan and I can tell you he looked very good yesterday. Needs to build up the pitch count, but his stuff was very good. That said, the Reds still think they can compete in the division or for the wild-card. I don’t think so. I would trade Wood and Puig. Both are going to be free agents.

I don't want him starting unless he ends the season on an absolute tear.

....Stroman was less than pleased about going to the Mets.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 14511930 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

....Stroman was less than pleased about going to the Mets. Link - ( New Window )

Hm..

Whom to believe, a beat writer or Marcus Stroman himself..

Quote:

NEW YORK! Where I was born. Where my heart lies. Where my family resides. Crazy excited for this part of my journey. Some things were meant to be! @Mets #HDMH

Doesn't sound like a guy nor happy to be going to the Mets. Lastly, he grew up a Met fan too.


Link - ( New Window )

to help Tanaka find his splitter!!

In comment 14511957 Canton said:

Quote:

In comment 14511930 Greg from LI said: Quote: ....Stroman was less than pleased about going to the Mets. Link - ( New Window ) Hm.. Whom to believe, a beat writer or Marcus Stroman himself.. Quote: NEW YORK! Where I was born. Where my heart lies. Where my family resides. Crazy excited for this part of my journey. Some things were meant to be! @Mets #HDMH Doesn't sound like a guy nor happy to be going to the Mets. Lastly, he grew up a Met fan too. Link - ( New Window )

He just got traded to a team where he's going to spend the next 1.5 years. Do you think he's going to tweet anything negative? He's not that kind of guy. He also didn't grow up a Mets fan. That's a baby picture, he wasn't dressing himself lol. This is a direct quote:

MiLB.com: You grew up on Long Island, so I'm guessing you were a Mets fan?

Stroman: I was a Yankees fan growing up. I wasn't a diehard, but I just enjoyed going to games. I was a Derek Jeter fan -- I'm a huge Robinson Cano fan. But I have to get out of that mindset, I have to get these guys out in the near future, maybe this year. But I'm a Blue Jays fan now and that's all I care about, getting up there and producing.

In comment 14511957 Canton said:

Quote:

Doesn't sound like a guy nor happy to be going to the Mets. Lastly, he grew up a Met fan too. Link - ( New Window )

His own father said that he wanted to go to the Yankees.

Stroman's trying to put a happy face on it, but are you seriously suggesting he's glad to be headed to the suckass Mets than the Yankees?

Also, Stroman was a Yankees fan growing up, not a Mets fan. From an interview when he was in the minors:

Quote:

MiLB.com: You grew up on Long Island, so I'm guessing you were a Mets fan? Stroman: I was a Yankees fan growing up. I wasn't a diehard, but I just enjoyed going to games. I was a Derek Jeter fan -- I'm a huge Robinson Cano fan. But I have to get out of that mindset, I have to get these guys out in the near future, maybe this year. But I'm a Blue Jays fan now and that's all I care about, getting up there and producing.

Link - ( New Window )

In comment 14511514 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

They aren't going to trade anyone to the Yankees, period. The Coupons would sooner burn Citi Field to the ground than make a deal that would help the Yankees.

I also doubt they're enthusiastic about Clint Frazier. He looks to me like another good hitting/so-so fielding corner outfielder. The Mets need a toolsy, legitimate centerfielder. I don't think Frazier is that guy, and if he's got to play left or right he's just adding to an already severe logjam.

In comment 14511965 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

That's a baby picture, he wasn't dressing himself

Seriously. There are pictures of me at ages 2-3-4 wearing Mets and Jets stuff because many of my relatives are Mets and Jets fans, and they'd give them to me as gifts.

In comment 14511967 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14511957 Canton said: Quote: Doesn't sound like a guy nor happy to be going to the Mets. Lastly, he grew up a Met fan too. Link - ( New Window ) His own father said that he wanted to go to the Yankees. Stroman's trying to put a happy face on it, but are you seriously suggesting he's glad to be headed to the suckass Mets than the Yankees? Also, Stroman was a Yankees fan growing up, not a Mets fan. From an interview when he was in the minors: Quote: MiLB.com: You grew up on Long Island, so I'm guessing you were a Mets fan? Stroman: I was a Yankees fan growing up. I wasn't a diehard, but I just enjoyed going to games. I was a Derek Jeter fan -- I'm a huge Robinson Cano fan. But I have to get out of that mindset, I have to get these guys out in the near future, maybe this year. But I'm a Blue Jays fan now and that's all I care about, getting up there and producing. Link - ( New Window )

Ooooooh, got'em. So you were saying Canton

In comment 14511755 dpinzow said:

Quote:

In comment 14511676 YANKEE28 said: Quote: Any Red Sox offer for Edwin Diaz would presumably include minor-league slugger Bobby Dalbec, who is blocked at 3b by the younger Rafael Devers, or 2018 No. 1 pick Triston Casas, in case Mets view him as 3b option. Red Sox confident they will make impact bullpen move. Why on earth did the Mets pick up Stroman then? Why would they trade their closer (the only good arm in an atrocious pen) in addition to either Syndergaard or Wheeler. In other terms, what on earth is Brodie van Wagenen doing

We'll see in a few days, but I think he's trying to reapportion resources on a roster that makes no sense. They have no centerfielder other than Lagares, who's not a major leaguer anymore. They have three infielders playing outfield (Davis, Smith, McNeill). They have Todd Frazier blocking Davis and McNeill at 3rd, and Frazier's not part of their future.

Their shortstop has been bad in the field, their 2nd baseman has limited range, but they are leaning on their pitching as a strength of the team. A lot of pitching = defense.

They want their rotation to be their foundation but starting pitching is increasingly devalued and their bullpen is a train wreck.

In short, they have a lot of resources stacked up in the wrong place (Starting Pitcher, Corner Outfielder, 3rd base) and are short of resources in essential places (Catcher, Shortstop, Centerfield). It makes sense to trade surplus resources to rebalances those resources.

But are they a "seller" or a "buyer"? Are they trying to compete now, or acquire prospects for the future? Hard to do both at once.

"Mets Trade For Stroman For Some Reason"

Looks like he's not starting because he had surgery, is that right? Can he start or is he purely a bullpen arm? And would he be a fit for the Yankees?

He's signed for 2 more years and then has two team option years, so he might be expensive since that's four prime years in addition to this year. And, he's still young (27) and he may not have hit his peak. Although, he's not super cheap, he's still making less than market price over these years. But the Cards might not want to part with him...

Thoughts on if he'd be a rotation or bullpen solution? Would the cost be too high? Any interest? Is he even available?

MIGHT be available, but that's it as far as I've seen. I think it's almost all just speculation.

of a Yankee rumor at this point? Cashman is either staying stealth or he just refuses to get porked.

I brought up Martinez last week.

Sounds like the Brewers just got Lyles. Not that I think he was ever really on our radar - but that's another SP off the board.

In comment 14511995 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

MIGHT be available, but that's it as far as I've seen. I think it's almost all just speculation.

Eh, probably like Boyd where it'd be a huge cost to move him. At least he's a legit pitcher (unlike Boyd), but probably not worth what it'd cost us.

Thanks.

Why not Greinke? If the DBacks are going to be sellers, then make them an offer. There really isn't anyone better than Greinke available out there, including Syndergaard. He's pitched for a big market team, and pitched well, since all the hubbub that his anxiety issues made him a bad fit for the Yankees. I don't know why they wouldn't at least give it a shot. I'd sure as hell rather have him than Boyd or Minor.

In comment 14512004 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Why not Greinke? If the DBacks are going to be sellers, then make them an offer. There really isn't anyone better than Greinke available out there, including Syndergaard. He's pitched for a big market team, and pitched well, since all the hubbub that his anxiety issues made him a bad fit for the Yankees. I don't know why they wouldn't at least give it a shot. I'd sure as hell rather have him than Boyd or Minor.

I would love this but I don't think he'll waive his ntc for the Yankees. They may already know that he wouldn't which is why you don't hear his name come up with the Yankees. Plus the money he's owed over the next few years doesn't seem to really fit the recent Yankees MO.

In comment 14512004 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Why not Greinke? If the DBacks are going to be sellers, then make them an offer. There really isn't anyone better than Greinke available out there, including Syndergaard. He's pitched for a big market team, and pitched well, since all the hubbub that his anxiety issues made him a bad fit for the Yankees. I don't know why they wouldn't at least give it a shot. I'd sure as hell rather have him than Boyd or Minor.

would you rather have the contract, too? 2 more years @ $32M each. Also has a no trade to NYY, not to say he wouldn't waive but you might even need to throw a few bucks more.

Not my money, but safe bet that Hal isn't just going $32M higher than what he would have otherwise.

For fuck's sake, they need to stop behaving like they're the goddamned Royals.

puts him off the table, unfortunately.

and I think Mike Mussina. Both cerebral guys, understated, like avoiding the limelight. I don't know that Greinke would struggle here as much as is thought, especially now that he's older and he wouldn't have the pressure of living up to a record deal. And he's certainly never said that he wouldn't approve a trade to NYY.

Don't just settle for the 2019 equivalent of Lance Lynn from last year, or more damned relievers.

The moneyball attitude is kind of lame.

In comment 14512013 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

and I think Mike Mussina. Both cerebral guys, understated, like avoiding the limelight. I don't know that Greinke would struggle here as much as is thought, especially now that he's older and he wouldn't have the pressure of living up to a record deal. And he's certainly never said that he wouldn't approve a trade to NYY.

Plus Greinke is now 35 and has never won a ring. The opportunity to do so with the Yankees could make them much more attractive to him now than they would have been 7 or 8 years ago.

but they're also here because of what they developed and were able to trade to acquire. Doesn't mean they can't complement it with free agents and big-$ trade targets, but it's hard to complain that they're too cautious when that caution is the recent they're in a position to be a player or two away.

In comment 14512012 adamg said:

Quote:

puts him off the table, unfortunately.

That and the fact he's said several times he doesn't want to pitch in NYC and with his anxiety issues he would have problems under the bright lights IMO.

But at a certain point, they have to seize the moment. This team is ready to win now if they have the starting pitching to do so. The '90s Yankees needed a David Cone. These Yankees need that kind of pitcher too.

In comment 14512028 Eman11 said:

Quote:

That and the fact he's said several times he doesn't want to pitch in NYC and with his anxiety issues he would have problems under the bright lights IMO.

Pretty sure he never actually said that, and he did just fine in three seasons in LA.

In comment 14512032 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

But at a certain point, they have to seize the moment. This team is ready to win now if they have the starting pitching to do so. The '90s Yankees needed a David Cone. These Yankees need that kind of pitcher too.

This is where I'm at too. Especially with SP. Enough half measures.

In comment 14512042 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

In comment 14512032 Greg from LI said: Quote: But at a certain point, they have to seize the moment. This team is ready to win now if they have the starting pitching to do so. The '90s Yankees needed a David Cone. These Yankees need that kind of pitcher too. This is where I'm at too. Especially with SP. Enough half measures.

I really hope there's some urgency in the FO to address SP. It seems odd that we didn't outbid the Mets for Stroman if we really were in on him. Of course, it's possible the Yankee tax was just too high. But, I really hope the FO is moving heaven and earth to land a good starter. And not another Happ/Lynn.

just for Francesa's head to explode.

In comment 14512037 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14512028 Eman11 said: Quote: That and the fact he's said several times he doesn't want to pitch in NYC and with his anxiety issues he would have problems under the bright lights IMO. Pretty sure he never actually said that, and he did just fine in three seasons in LA.

Playing in LA is nowhere near as intense as playing in NYC for the Yanks. Hell, everyday living there is a lot more laid back than here. Granted they're both big cities with a lot of people but the similarities end there IMO.

Should the Yankees make a trade for a starting pitcher, when all that is out there that is attainable is not much better than what we already have. Plus having to give up prospects.

Has been great, but he went out and made that trade to land Stanton and tie up all that money on a player they did not need at all. So why be relunctant to trade Frazier? He spent the money to add Encarnacion, yet would not pony up for Keuchel, and that was less money. Then he does not sign Corbin this off season, he signs Haap. If they come up short again, after the putrid display by the starters last post season and the bold off season statement that they need to upgrade the starters, he must be held accountable. Lets not pretend Severino has ever stepped up in the post season either. If it is Rothchild that pays for it, so be it. The problem is the player evaluation or the development, but there is an issue.

In comment 14512093 PaulN said:

Quote:

Has been great, but he went out and made that trade to land Stanton and tie up all that money on a player they did not need at all. So why be relunctant to trade Frazier? He spent the money to add Encarnacion, yet would not pony up for Keuchel, and that was less money. Then he does not sign Corbin this off season, he signs Haap. If they come up short again, after the putrid display by the starters last post season and the bold off season statement that they need to upgrade the starters, he must be held accountable. Lets not pretend Severino has ever stepped up in the post season either. If it is Rothchild that pays for it, so be it. The problem is the player evaluation or the development, but there is an issue.

The Yankees are paying EE less than what they offered Keuchel. I'm also fairly sure they're not reluctant to trade Frazier.

Is there some Dutch pitcher I'm unaware of?

In comment 14511663 Eman11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14511657 TheMick7 said: Quote: In comment 14511644 YANKEE28 said: Quote: Yankees team would include Urshela and Andujar. And Stanton would be the everyday left fielder. Here's the million dollar question as to whether they move Andujar or not. Are they resigning Didi? (They should try to do so right after the trade deadline-he's more than proven healthy) If so,you have the same situation you have now-4 infielders for 3 (3 1/2 if you count DJL at 1B) & unless Andujar becomes your DH/OF,there's a glut! Personally,I want to keep Andujar but if they need to use him for a SP that is truly a #1/2 (Damn if I know who that is but that's Cash's job!),then you'd have to move him! If think they'll resign Didi but I don't think it'll Impact Andujar. They'll make it work very similar to how they told DJ they'd get him his AB's. I see them rotating all those guys around the IF to get them AB's. They'll be room at DH too especially with Stanton playing a lot of LF, and I don't expect EE to be back. They love resting guys and I think this year has proven it works, plus they'd be covering themselves for injury or if Gio is just having a one off type year. I don't think he is but they'll find room for talent and make it work.

Thought Didi signed a 2 year deal???

he's a free agent after this seasons

sec... Didi is a FA after this season.

He'll be back, though. He's tailor made for the Bronx. They love him, he loves being here. They'll extend him.

Cash doesn't re-sign Didi. And doing so keeps us flexible in the IF when it comes to trading players in future seasons.

In comment 14512103 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

sec... Didi is a FA after this season. He'll be back, though. He's tailor made for the Bronx. They love him, he loves being here. They'll extend him.

Couldn't agree more. A perfect fit in every way.

He's everything the Yanks could ask for or want in a player both on the field and off. Smart, great character, teammates love him, lefty hitter with some power, excellent glove and arm, and a clutch player too who can handle and actually thrives in NYC.

In comment 14512037 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14512028 Eman11 said: Quote: That and the fact he's said several times he doesn't want to pitch in NYC and with his anxiety issues he would have problems under the bright lights IMO. Pretty sure he never actually said that, and he did just fine in three seasons in LA.

Yeah, I'm pretty certain he did turn down the Yanks and said he did not want to pitch for them.

after the arm surgery last October.

There is no way in God's green Earth he is not signed by the Yanks. He'll be the 1st guy they sign.

In comment 14512114 section125 said:

Quote:

Yeah, I'm pretty certain he did turn down the Yanks and said he did not want to pitch for them.

That's not how it happened. Greinke never said publicly he wouldn't play for the Yankees, nor did he tell the Yankees that directly. In fact, he actually told Cashman during the 2010-11 offseason that he wanted to win and would be fine with coming to the Yankees. However, the rumor was that Greinke told other people he didn't want to pitch in NY, and Cashman ultimately decided there was too much risk and they never pursued him.

can't pitch in the big city. Wasn't he on meds for anxiety specifically for this reason?

In comment 14512148 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14512114 section125 said: Quote: Yeah, I'm pretty certain he did turn down the Yanks and said he did not want to pitch for them. That's not how it happened. Greinke never said publicly he wouldn't play for the Yankees, nor did he tell the Yankees that directly. In fact, he actually told Cashman during the 2010-11 offseason that he wanted to win and would be fine with coming to the Yankees. However, the rumor was that Greinke told other people he didn't want to pitch in NY, and Cashman ultimately decided there was too much risk and they never pursued him.

He's also been quoted saying he'd play for the worst team in the game if they offered him the most money.

I guess he's being honest and what most of us would do if it was significantly more, but most fans and I'd think management doesnt want to hear that kind of talk.

They want to hear guys put winning first.

Greinke was the one who asked to meet with Cashman.

There is no reason not to at least look into it, not when the alternative is guys like Boyd and Minor.

In comment 14512155 xman said:

Quote:

can't pitch in the big city. Wasn't he on meds for anxiety specifically for this reason?

Yea I mean it took pitching in that small hick town LOS ANGELES for him to succeed. I'm with Greg here. We are the Yankees. Going to SD in a few weeks and want to take the family to Petco. I looked up the tickets, $30 or so to sit 6 rows off the field down the 1b line. Those same seats at YS go for $300. I love the kids but how about we start spending like we're the fucking Yankees. You don't go to the super market and pay for Filet Minot so you can take home beef chuck. Is 2 years at 32 mill/per a risk? sure it is, but I agree with Greg that he's the best most atainable on the market. Can he handle NY? Well if he pitches well then they'll be no pressure. If he pitches like shit? then I don't give a fuck how he handles it. Its no help to have a guy handle pitching like shit well because they're still pitching like shit no matter what.

and that the Pirates will consider trading Felipe Vazquez, then lets hope the Yankees get involved with a strong offer. (article attached)

Clearly one of the top closers in baseball. Only 28, and under a long term reasonable contract.

As a said in a thread last week, if ANY contender can trade for Felipe Vazquez, it makes a significant difference in the 2019 playoffs. Probably more than any other player trade.

With the Yankees solid chances of bringing a WS back to NY this year, the chances of Chapman opting out at the end of the year, and Betances not signed long term, this is a move that should be strongly considered. The price will be high, but the Yankees have the assets to do it.
Link - ( New Window )

and planned on being the manager for the next 3-5 years who would you rather have on the team based on your core players.

Gleyber Torres or Amir Garrett and Luis Castillo?

keep Gleyber Torres.

In comment 14512168 Stu11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14512155 xman said: Quote: can't pitch in the big city. Wasn't he on meds for anxiety specifically for this reason? Yea I mean it took pitching in that small hick town LOS ANGELES for him to succeed. I'm with Greg here. We are the Yankees. Going to SD in a few weeks and want to take the family to Petco. I looked up the tickets, $30 or so to sit 6 rows off the field down the 1b line. Those same seats at YS go for $300. I love the kids but how about we start spending like we're the fucking Yankees. You don't go to the super market and pay for Filet Minot so you can take home beef chuck. Is 2 years at 32 mill/per a risk? sure it is, but I agree with Greg that he's the best most atainable on the market. Can he handle NY? Well if he pitches well then they'll be no pressure. If he pitches like shit? then I don't give a fuck how he handles it. Its no help to have a guy handle pitching like shit well because they're still pitching like shit no matter what.

Sherman just wrote this in an article about Yankees’ pessimism about getting a deal done for an impact starter:
“He is owed $64 million for 2020-21 and has a no-trade clause and someone who knows him said, “no shot he would accept the Yankees.” It is uncertain if there is a sweet spot where he would go and the team would be able to afford him. My only guess is the Cardinals if they are able to, say, include the two years at $29 million owed Dexter Fowler to mitigate some of Greinke’s pact.”
Link - ( New Window )

So will the Yankees. I wouldn't. He's redundant. They would miss him as much as they Andujar and Stanton this year.

In comment 14512324 arniefez said:

Quote:

So will the Yankees. I wouldn't. He's redundant. They would miss him as much as they Andujar and Stanton this year.

That’s just stupid. Though I’m not surprised. Gleyber Torres has been one of the main reasons they’ve been able to withstand losing those guys. On the other hand, the Reds still suck WITH those guys you mentioned.

In comment 14512324 arniefez said:

Quote:

So will the Yankees. I wouldn't. He's redundant. They would miss him as much as they Andujar and Stanton this year.

Riiiight, haha. And no mention of his age and future upside either, huh?

We don’t miss Andujar much because DJLM is a better player. We don’t miss Stanton much because guy like Tauchman are playing well above their talent level right now.

I think you are way, way off.

To check out RP Ken Giles (1.54 ERA this year) and CF Billy Hamilton (bench piece).

Vasquez might be the prize of the available RPs but Giles wouldn't be a bad add either.

with the other 22 year old all star/MVP potential middle infielders we have...

In comment 14512324 arniefez said:

Quote:

So will the Yankees. I wouldn't. He's redundant. They would miss him as much as they Andujar and Stanton this year.

Congratulations on the stupidest comment of the day

It's just a rumor at this stage though.

as currently constituted will win nothing in the post season with this starting pitching. The comments on that thought were about the same as the comments on trading Torres tonight.

I'm not interested in dumping him. I'm interested in trading him for an elite starter and an elite reliever only because they have the replacement pieces not to miss him.

No one is trading you pitchers like Garrett and Castillo for a few prospects.

I wouldn't trade Torres for Syndergaard. Certainly not for Stroman or Minor or Boyd. But I'd trade him for an ace and potential closer.

There is nothing coming in the system that's going to help anytime soon. They have a championship core with no ace and no plan to get an ace. If it takes Torres to do it so be it.

I'm lucky enough to have seen the Yankees win 7 times. But for most of you you're the Red Sox bitches.

You're literally the only one on BBI who wants the Yankees to win. You're the only one who wants an ace. Thank god you're around to enlighten us, bad fans.

In comment 14512354 arniefez said:

Quote:

as currently constituted will win nothing in the post season with this starting pitching. The comments on that thought were about the same as the comments on trading Torres tonight. I'm not interested in dumping him. I'm interested in trading him for an elite starter and an elite reliever only because they have the replacement pieces not to miss him. No one is trading you pitchers like Garrett and Castillo for a few prospects. I wouldn't trade Torres for Syndergaard. Certainly not for Stroman or Minor or Boyd. But I'd trade him for an ace and potential closer. There is nothing coming in the system that's going to help anytime soon. They have a championship core with no ace and no plan to get an ace. If it takes Torres to do it so be it. I'm lucky enough to have seen the Yankees win 7 times. But for most of you you're the Red Sox bitches.

And if Castillo’s season thus far is a fluke or he can’t handle NY? Then what? Not to mention, no plan to get an ace? You realize Cole is a FA and Strasburg likely will be as well. Ryu too. There’s three ways.

I know they shy away from these types of contracts, but there is a big need for a starter of his caliber. CC/Gardy/Chapman money (if Chappy opts out) could be put toward Cole. Obviously Didi needs a contract, too. If they come up short this year they're going to have to aim higher than the Paxtons and Grays of the world.

Hope that lying sack of shit never wins anything.

There is a point to be made:

The Yankees do not have a #2 or a #1 coming up in the system in the next 3 year window.

Before we say Garcia, there is less than a 50% chance he is a #1 inside 3 years.

There is a 50% chance Chapman is not elite in 3 years.

Pure conjecture...but that's allowed for decisions get made on conjecture ( anything with over a 30% chance of being right or wrong is considered conjecture in real business strategy and real war gaming).

Who do the Yankees have to trade now or offseason? the right answer is not our least favorite player its where do we have acceptable redundancy? Acceptable redundancy is not an equal player...its above MLB replacement level options

Stanton? ( id say yes)
Hicks ( nope)
Judge ( nope)
Didi ( Yes)
Torres ( yes
Andujar ( yes)
Frazier ( yes)
Gardner ( yes)
Voit ( eh...not hard to get 1B so id say yes)
Sanchez ( nope, not because he is not flawed but because the market for catchers is zilch)

Any pitchers redundant? Nope
Any relief pitchers redundant? Nope

Maybin? Obviously
Tauchman? Obviously
Encarcion? Obviously

Its not a fun thing to consider and its not advocacy but there is an old line that a great trade leaves both teams good and hopeful but in regret and concern for what they lost.

A great SP and a great RP are the hardest things to get in baseball

Lastly, looking over that list, Torres is one of the last possible redundant's id trade...imo

Before they came to NYY. Gray finished 3rd one year and Paxton when healthy was a top 10 arm in the AL.

It's not a given that someone with a pedigree is going to come here and pitch well.

In comment 14512374 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

Before they came to NYY. Gray finished 3rd one year and Paxton when healthy was a top 10 arm in the AL. It's not a given that someone with a pedigree is going to come here and pitch well.

That is absolutely true. I was going to add that Cole better remember whatever the Houston coaches told him to do, because I don't want the Pittsburgh version.

They have brought in several solid to good pitchers in recent years who have completely fallen apart. At some point the pitching coach needs to be held responsible.

We'd have to package Andujar, Frazier, Florial and Garcia at this point to get a true front line starter, but I don't know if they are even available.

Of course we'd all love Cashman to package Adams, Wade, Acevedo and a bag of balls for some stud, but that ain't happening.

At this point, I'd rather just sit tight and hope Severino and Betances come back healthy at some point. If that doesn't happen, we are screwed anyway. Adding a Minor or Ray won't make any difference.

.

In comment 14512380 nygmen84 said:

Quote:

.

If HOU gets Wheeler he'll only throw perfect games the rest of the season.

However, if Houston is willing to give up Whitley and another pitcher for a rental, I can't really blame BVW.

But MLB arms have often struggled as starters for NYY. It predates Rothschild, though he doesn't seem to be helping. It's weird, IDK if it's park or pressure but the list of failed SP acquisitions is remarkably long.

Houston's pitching coach, and, I don't know which, but definitely some other team's training staff.

in a deal with the Yanks for a SP.

In comment 14512380 nygmen84 said:

Quote:

.

At some point Houston is going to fail at turning chicken shit into chicken salad. Might as well be with Wheeler.

about German telling the coaches he doesn't want to feature his slider as much, and would rather throw his curve and change-up. Sonny Gray made similar comments about being forced to throw certain pitches he didn't want to throw. I think it's reasonable to think pitchers aren't fully buying into what Rothschild - and more importantly, the analytics guys above him - are commanding them to do on the mound. David Cone is a proponent of analytics but emphasizes that players needs to buy in. Just a theory.

Really, since the dynasty teams, there aren't many starting pitcher acquisition success stories. Javier Vazquez, Jeff Weaver, Kevin Brown, Carl Pavano, Randy Johnson, AJ Burnett, Nathan Eovaldi, Michael Pineda, Sonny Gray....Paxton is just another in a long line.

The best MLB veteran stafter they've acquired since 2000, after Sabathia and Mussina, is Hiroki Kuroda, believe it or not.

are much better than the starting pitcher analytics. (I don't know if that's a thing.)

It might just be bad luck, but it does seem systemic now that Paxton is fucking up. Especially since Sonny fucking Gray looks like a stud again and we're left with a prospect who didn't make the top 30 as a result of that experiment.

In comment 14512401 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

Really, since the dynasty teams, there aren't many starting pitcher acquisition success stories. Javier Vazquez, Jeff Weaver, Kevin Brown, Carl Pavano, Randy Johnson, AJ Burnett, Nathan Eovaldi, Michael Pineda, Sonny Gray....Paxton is just another in a long line. The best MLB veteran stafter they've acquired since 2000, after Sabathia and Mussina, is Hiroki Kuroda, believe it or not.

And many of those guys went on to success elsewhere, suggesting it's not a matter of talent. Is the ball park really that big of difference maker? I don't think so.

And be impressed enough in one day to waive his no trade...

One can dream

In comment 14512407 adamg said:

Quote:

are much better than the starting pitcher analytics. (I don't know if that's a thing.) It might just be bad luck, but it does seem systemic now that Paxton is fucking up. Especially since Sonny fucking Gray looks like a stud again and we're left with a prospect who didn't make the top 30 as a result of that experiment.

It's quite the conundrum. Obviously, the pressure of NY is real, and something some guys aren't made for. The other is probably buying into the analytics and Rothschild, this might be more of the issue

“I've heard some executives question whether the Mets will actually move Syndergaard by Wednesday, and the same for the Indians and Bauer. One GM I spoke with expects both to be traded and -- here's the fun part -- he tabs the Yankees and Astros as frontrunners to land Bauer.”

.

In comment 14512383 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

But MLB arms have often struggled as starters for NYY. It predates Rothschild, though he doesn't seem to be helping. It's weird, IDK if it's park or pressure but the list of failed SP acquisitions is remarkably long.

Really ? The Yankees are among the worst teams in baseball at developing starting pitching. Since the ascension of George Steinbrenner , the Yankees have developed a total of seven good or great starting pitchers that pitched primarily for the Yankees. Seven pitchers in over four decades. Those pitchers are: Ron Guidry, Scott Kamienieki, Andy Pettite, Chien Ming Wang, Phil Hughs , Ivan Nova and Luis Severino. The jury is still out on Domingo German and Jordan Montgomery.

In comment 14512425 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

“I've heard some executives question whether the Mets will actually move Syndergaard by Wednesday, and the same for the Indians and Bauer. One GM I spoke with expects both to be traded and -- here's the fun part -- he tabs the Yankees and Astros as frontrunners to land Bauer.”

Remember when Bauer accused the stros of cheating and got into it with Mccullers about pine tar. Then the next start it showed mccullers with pine tar on his cleats.

In comment 14512428 Ron from Ninerland said:

Quote:

In comment 14512383 Dunedin81 said: Quote: But MLB arms have often struggled as starters for NYY. It predates Rothschild, though he doesn't seem to be helping. It's weird, IDK if it's park or pressure but the list of failed SP acquisitions is remarkably long. Really ? The Yankees are among the worst teams in baseball at developing starting pitching. Since the ascension of George Steinbrenner , the Yankees have developed a total of seven good or great starting pitchers that pitched primarily for the Yankees. Seven pitchers in over four decades. Those pitchers are: Ron Guidry, Scott Kamienieki, Andy Pettite, Chien Ming Wang, Phil Hughs , Ivan Nova and Luis Severino. The jury is still out on Domingo German and Jordan Montgomery.

How about the pitchers they traded and did well for their next team?

an interesting article that had an interesting trade.

Sending Hicks plus to the Mets for Syndergaard...Mets need a legit CF. I suspect it would cost Garcia and maybe another SP prospect or IF prospect.

I would do that. Yanks have enough firepower to live without Hicks. Gardy, Tauchman or Maybin can cover CF without too big a defensive drop. They would lose Hicks pop.

Going back 3-4 years. That's industry opinion. For fixing or improving big leaguers, Houston and Pittsburgh before that. For developing pitching, TB and NYY.

.
Link - ( New Window )

In comment 14512490 section125 said:

Quote:

an interesting article that had an interesting trade. Sending Hicks plus to the Mets for Syndergaard...Mets need a legit CF. I suspect it would cost Garcia and maybe another SP prospect or IF prospect. I would do that. Yanks have enough firepower to live without Hicks. Gardy, Tauchman or Maybin can cover CF without too big a defensive drop. They would lose Hicks pop.

That would be a great trade but don’t think it would ever happen. The Mets will not trade with the Yankees only hope I have of it happing tho is mike Francesa he said yesterday syndergard has no shot at becoming a yankee so anything mike says something like that the opposite happens so there is hope

In comment 14512324 arniefez said:

Quote:

So will the Yankees. I wouldn't. He's redundant. They would miss him as much as they Andujar and Stanton this year.

Please explain how they miss Andujar? Gio Urshela is doing fine and is a much better fielder in his sleep then Andujar.

try to quantify such things disagree with you:

Quote:

Really ? The Yankees are among the worst teams in baseball at developing starting pitching

The opposite is true recently. The Yankees are among the best at developing starting pitching. Some of those guys have been moved to get other players, but in terms of making pitchers better and getting the most out of the expectations of prospects, the Yankees are among the best.

Peter Gammons
@pgammo
Keep hearing Clint Frazier to Arizona for Ray or Bradley, or multi players_not Garcia-for both
8:36 AM · Jul 30, 2019

In comment 14512567 Ryan in Albany said:

Quote:

Peter Gammons @pgammo Keep hearing Clint Frazier to Arizona for Ray or Bradley, or multi players_not Garcia-for both 8:36 AM · Jul 30, 2019

If it's Ray for Frazier straight up, let me know if they need someone to drive Clint to the airport. I'll make time.

I've been saying Robbie Ray for a bit now...

Robbie is only good and he only has one more year of control. He hasn't pitched more than 170 innings in his career and he's at 126 right now. We need someone who offers more length or better quality.

If we we're going to include Frazier for 1.5 years of a pitcher, I would've liked to go after Stroman. I don't hate Ray, but I think it's a hefty price to pay for him.

they clearly think Ray is better than Stroman. I have no idea to be honest, don't know enough and haven't watch enough on either player.

I'm guessing they like Ray's size and being a lefty over the smaller framed righty in Stroman. NL to AL scares me, probably the biggest factor.

I don't necessarily think it means they think Ray > Stroman - I think they preferred not to trade Frazier within the division.

In comment 14512579 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

they clearly think Ray is better than Stroman. I have no idea to be honest, don't know enough and haven't watch enough on either player. I'm guessing they like Ray's size and being a lefty over the smaller framed righty in Stroman. NL to AL scares me, probably the biggest factor.

They could've also overplayed their hand and underestimated the cost to get a pitcher this year.

Ray has more red flags imo. Velocity has dipped by 2.4 mph since 2016, hasn't pitched more than 176 innings, and coming from a different league/into the AL.

I hope it works out and obviously the Yankees know more than I do, but as a fan I wouldn't be for a Frazier for Ray swap.

In comment 14512582 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I don't necessarily think it means they think Ray > Stroman - I think they preferred not to trade Frazier within the division.

I don't think that should be a focus to a team with championship aspirations the next two years. Get the best players we can and try and compete.

In comment 14512579 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

they clearly think Ray is better than Stroman. I have no idea to be honest, don't know enough and haven't watch enough on either player. I'm guessing they like Ray's size and being a lefty over the smaller framed righty in Stroman. NL to AL scares me, probably the biggest factor.

I don't know enough about Ray either. RAB twitter guy doesn't seem to approve though...

We Like Clint Frazier
@RiverAveBlues
·
12m
Ray has a bottom five walk rate and a bottom five home run rate which is, uh, a bad combination.
Quote Tweet

Peter Gammons
@pgammo
· 46m
Keep hearing Clint Frazier to Arizona for Ray or Bradley, or multi players_not Garcia-for both

In comment 14512582 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I don't necessarily think it means they think Ray > Stroman - I think they preferred not to trade Frazier within the division.

Certainly possible, but i'm not sure that would be the #1 reason. They've made it a point to get bigger pitchers in here, hard throwers, and guys who force ground balls. They must see something with Ray's game (if they are indeed interested) that they think they can exploit.

Looking briefly at stats Storman's k% is below the league average and Ray's is way above the league average. Sounds like they like his slider/sinker potential.

we are talking about a 2/3 starter. Just thinking of reasons why they might think they can tweak his game and make him more effective.

but I think there are a lot of posters on this board who value Frazier significantly higher than non-NYY fans and baseball people do.

Just the impression that I get. Which is not to say that the opinions are invalid.

really wants to offload Frazier before having to put him fulltime or close to fulltime in the field next year. His statements about Frazier being a focal point for the OF next year, IMO, is him talking up the asset he's most comfortable trading.

The 2020 OF will be Judge/Stanton/Hicks and then Tauchman (he won't have options so he will be here), and I can see them resigning Maybin whom apparently the clubhouse is infatuated with.

They don't need Frazier and certainly don't need the bad fielding.

Robbie Ray will be alright. He walked FIVE per 9 innings last year (atrocious). He’s lowered that to 4 BB/9 IP this year. Still bad but you can live with it given his 12 K/9 rate.

major Yankee assets are going to be moved, I would prefer a lights out reliever over a middle of the road starter.

We all know the Yankees need another starter. But there just doesn't seem to be a starter available that is a hands down absolute starter once the playoffs begin.

Obviously that's something the Yankees value highly. But the walk/home run rates are alarming and I just worry about bringing in another lefty when our main rivals are stocked with right handed bats. And I just worry about our ability to correct those flaws he does have. Our track record has been spotty in that area lately.

I think Frazier for Ray sounds about right. I wouldn't put much more in the deal though given the 1.5 years of control on Ray. Getting Ray is better than doing nothing, but I have my concerns.

It's actually gotten to the point where I'm beginning to talk myself into Trevor Bauer. We're getting desperate!

We need a starter and a reliever; and I fully expect Cashman to acquire both.

The importance of the bullpen is still tied to the starting pitching. Even if you go out and add a reliever, we're still having too much trouble getting length out of the starters and need them to get a little deeper into games.

Otherwise, we're going to be really roasting our bullpen over the next 2 months and won't have them fresh when we really need it.

Bauer is the pitcher I really want - but not the person.

I'm really stuck on that one. He's a douchebag but I kind of like the fire and competitiveness and feel like it might play well here given where we're at in the season and that it's getting close to the time to turn on the jets and get serious about a championship run.

For a short-term thing, he might be fine here. Long-term, that's where we'd probably undoubtedly run into problems - and as we know with Bauer, long-term isn't in his vocabulary so it's a non-issue.

would be hilarious. One of those “it’s so crazy it just might work” moves.

If he'd promise to deactivate his twitter account, I'd pay the price to bring in Bauer

Lol, if he'd agree to that - sign me up!

In comment 14512634 Kyle in NY said:

Quote:

Obviously that's something the Yankees value highly. But the walk/home run rates are alarming and I just worry about bringing in another lefty when our main rivals are stocked with right handed bats. And I just worry about our ability to correct those flaws he does have. Our track record has been spotty in that area lately. I think Frazier for Ray sounds about right. I wouldn't put much more in the deal though given the 1.5 years of control on Ray. Getting Ray is better than doing nothing, but I have my concerns. It's actually gotten to the point where I'm beginning to talk myself into Trevor Bauer. We're getting desperate!

.

That's the appeal to the Yanks with what's left out there.
His strikeout percentage is what they like about him.
We all know they love power arms, although his control can be shaky.

“Indians are increasingly unlikely to trade Trevor Bauer. Word is, ownership is reluctant to part with a big star with team in position to make playoffs and possibly even win division again.”

I guess it’s Robbie Ray or bust?

It just seems like they love to go for the guy with the big arm, or the great spin rate, but with a few corrections that need to be made. And then they just can't seem to fix those flaws, and we chalk it up to the pressure of pitching in New York. They've proven much better at fixing hitters than they have at fixing pitchers.

Ray is better than nothing. But it feels like we're trying to thread the needle again after missing out on more proven options either due to money or prospect demands.

In comment 14512712 Kyle in NY said:

Quote:

It just seems like they love to go for the guy with the big arm, or the great spin rate, but with a few corrections that need to be made. And then they just can't seem to fix those flaws, and we chalk it up to the pressure of pitching in New York. They've proven much better at fixing hitters than they have at fixing pitchers. Ray is better than nothing. But it feels like we're trying to thread the needle again after missing out on more proven options either due to money or prospect demands.

Well if Bauer and MadBum aren't on the market, Greinke won't come to NY then what exactly is better on the market? Stroman? Him and Ray are pretty comparable.

It's a tough market for the Yankees to navigate. If the Mets continue to refuse to deal with them, there aren't many places to turn. Like I said, Ray is better than coming away empty handed. But past misses are coming back to bite us here.

In comment 14512741 Stu11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14512712 Kyle in NY said: Quote: It just seems like they love to go for the guy with the big arm, or the great spin rate, but with a few corrections that need to be made. And then they just can't seem to fix those flaws, and we chalk it up to the pressure of pitching in New York. They've proven much better at fixing hitters than they have at fixing pitchers. Ray is better than nothing. But it feels like we're trying to thread the needle again after missing out on more proven options either due to money or prospect demands. Well if Bauer and MadBum aren't on the market, Greinke won't come to NY then what exactly is better on the market? Stroman? Him and Ray are pretty comparable.

The difference between Stroman and Ray is profile, right? My understanding of Stroman is he was a groundball machine.

Ray is a BB/K/Fly-ball pitcher (only 38% groundballs, compared to Stroman's 56%.)

Ray's BB/K thing also seems like a recipe for high-pitch-counts. Do the Yanks need another 100-pitches in the 5th inning type of guy?

career numbers for Ray and Stroman are pretty similar. But they go about it in very different ways. Reports indicate the Yankees weren't as high on Stroman as we may have thought, likely because of that profile. I don't necessarily agree. I think he's the exact type of pitcher we should be going after in today's homer happy environment, along with the improvements to infield defense we've made.

But that ship has obviously sailed.

In comment 14512753 wigs in nyc said:

Quote:

In comment 14512741 Stu11 said: Quote: In comment 14512712 Kyle in NY said: Quote: It just seems like they love to go for the guy with the big arm, or the great spin rate, but with a few corrections that need to be made. And then they just can't seem to fix those flaws, and we chalk it up to the pressure of pitching in New York. They've proven much better at fixing hitters than they have at fixing pitchers. Ray is better than nothing. But it feels like we're trying to thread the needle again after missing out on more proven options either due to money or prospect demands. Well if Bauer and MadBum aren't on the market, Greinke won't come to NY then what exactly is better on the market? Stroman? Him and Ray are pretty comparable. The difference between Stroman and Ray is profile, right? My understanding of Stroman is he was a groundball machine. Ray is a BB/K/Fly-ball pitcher (only 38% groundballs, compared to Stroman's 56%.) Ray's BB/K thing also seems like a recipe for high-pitch-counts. Do the Yanks need another 100-pitches in the 5th inning type of guy?

Yep, they’re basically complete opposites. Ray is usually good for 6 innings. In his last 11 starts he’s gone less than 6 innings only once. He’s walked only 4 batters in his last 4 starts which is encouraging since that’s been his Achilles heel.

And to me, the advantage to Stroman is that he has pitched his entire career in the AL East, and done well. This division chews pitchers up and spits them out, and as Kyle noted the Yankees have shown no ability to iron out the flaws in these big arm/high K projects they so love.

I like him, but he seems like the guy you get in the off-season, where then you can work with him before the season. Seems to be a huge gamble at the deadline, thinking you could fix some of his flaws on the run.

at best a second starter. Whatever.

are the quintessential project pitchers that pitching coaches and analytics departments are convinced they can fix. Maybe they can, and as-is they'd be fine (Bradley as a middle innings guy who, when he's on, can handle leverage; Ray as a guy who gives you 5-6 IP of 3-4 run ball), but I wouldn't give up the cream of the prospect crop in the hope that you can make them something better than that

Trevor Baur - 6.51
Mike Minor - 6.43
Zack Greinke - 6.41
Lance Lynn - 6.41
Noah Syndergaard - 6.31
Zack Wheeler - 6.21
Matt Boyd - 6.00
Marcus Stroman - 5.91
Caleb Smith - 5.71
Robbie Ray - 5.61
Tanner Roark - 5.35

in comparison:
James Paxton - 4.96
JA Happ - 5.16
CC Sabathia - 5.30
Domingo German - 5.58
Masahiro Tanaka - 5.71


We need someone who will give us more innings.

In comment Heisenberg said:

Quote:

at best a second starter. Whatever.

Happ's days as a potential number 2 starter seem to be far gone at this point.

Robbie Ray has gone 6 or more IP in 10 of his last 11 starts, stretching back to June 3rd. Interestingly, he's allowed 1 or more HRs in all 11 of those games (18 total), after allowing just 5 in his first 12 starts

put it in a bottle, and then open it up and sniff it if you're ever inclined to complain about the potential of what years 5-6 could look like in a FA deal for a pitcher like Patrick Corbin.

In comment 14512807 Blue Ninja said:

Quote:

Trevor Baur - 6.51 Mike Minor - 6.43 Zack Greinke - 6.41 Lance Lynn - 6.41 Noah Syndergaard - 6.31 Zack Wheeler - 6.21 Matt Boyd - 6.00 Marcus Stroman - 5.91 Caleb Smith - 5.71 Robbie Ray - 5.61 Tanner Roark - 5.35 in comparison: James Paxton - 4.96 JA Happ - 5.16 CC Sabathia - 5.30 Domingo German - 5.58 Masahiro Tanaka - 5.71 We need someone who will give us more innings.

Caleb Smith and Lynn, what the hell rothschild

while Lynn pitched about as well in the regular season for NYY last year as he's pitching now.

between MLB insiders and NBA insiders, never more clear than the past couple of months. Rosenthal and Passan have great track records, and guys like Olney, Sherman and Heyman are very solid for the most part. The NBA guys are garbage, except for Woj.

In comment 14512813 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

Robbie Ray has gone 6 or more IP in 10 of his last 11 starts, stretching back to June 3rd. Interestingly, he's allowed 1 or more HRs in all 11 of those games (18 total), after allowing just 5 in his first 12 starts

He's allowed under 5 ER in all of his starts except for two this year (and in those two he allowed exactly 5 ER). Not an impressive stat until you consider how the Yankees starters have fared recently.

/

but he's not a Chris Broussard-level fool. Definitely some duds - including Nightengale and Bowden - but overall the MLB guys are more professional. Can't stand the basketball guys, or the football guys outside of Glazer.

to Heyman on the radio.

He was asked if he was the Yankees, would he be willing to give up Hicks, Frazier, and Garcia for Syndergaard. He thought about it and then said YES, though he said he would be concerned about the Yankees centerfield position.

You have got to be kidding. Glad he is not running the Yankees. These guys are more about clicks, then reality.

That doesn't mean he isn't a good pitcher, but people talk about him like he's up there with Scherzer or something. He's not, and he hasn't been the same since his injury. I'd give up a ton for deGrom, but not Syndergaard.

In comment 14512857 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

That doesn't mean he isn't a good pitcher, but people talk about him like he's up there with Scherzer or something. He's not, and he hasn't been the same since his injury. I'd give up a ton for deGrom, but not Syndergaard.

Guys somehow become better pitchers with more years of control, at least that's how much of the media seems to see it. See Boyd, Matthew.

Boras remains his biggest "source", especially during contract negotiation time. He's not as plugged in to FOs. Sherman ebbs and flows, at times he is the most plugged in and at times he's better at following behind (how and why something happened) than he is at breaking things.

In comment 14512816 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

put it in a bottle, and then open it up and sniff it if you're ever inclined to complain about the potential of what years 5-6 could look like in a FA deal for a pitcher like Patrick Corbin.

Yup. We were in lock step on this one over the winter. Don't get it.

but he's nowhere near what he was a few years ago. As always, pitching coaches (and now analytics guys) think that they can get a 27 year old back to what he once was, but it's still a gamble.

I even echoed it. Still....given how a good pitcher like Paxton has collapsed here, who knows if Corbin would have been the same as he's been?

In comment 14512871 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

I even echoed it. Still....given how a good pitcher like Paxton has collapsed here, who knows if Corbin would have been the same as he's been?

This is how I feel too. Imagine if Corbin signed for 6 years and pitched like Gray or Paxton in year 1? Yikes...

In comment 14512857 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

That doesn't mean he isn't a good pitcher, but people talk about him like he's up there with Scherzer or something. He's not, and he hasn't been the same since his injury. I'd give up a ton for deGrom, but not Syndergaard.

oddly enough, Scherzer compiled just over 10 WAR through his age 27 season. Syndergaard is currently over 17.

Means nothing other than to highlight that age 26-27 is in many cases the time when pitchers really put it all together and hit their prime.

Part of the allure with NS is that we've seen some pretty protracted stretches of elite stuff, and yet it somehow feels like he hasn't peaked and is only turning 27 in a month.

.

I think it's easy to feel like Cashman might have screwed the pooch on the pitching - but we have to remember that Severino's injury was completely unexpected. He was slated to pitch in ST as usual and felt something and that was that - he hasn't pitched since.

On top of that, Paxton's knee is either not right or he's just having a year that doesn't match up with the pitcher he's been before it.

If Severino isn't injured and Paxton is pitching to his career numbers - are we even worried about acquiring a starter at all?

We're probably talking about a reliever and that's that.

In retrospect, now missing on Corbin seems magnified - but he may well not have pitched the same way here; and really who the heck knows. He could have wound up just as disappointing as Paxton's been so far. No way to know.

Bottom line is that we are where we are now and we need a starter.

If it's Robbie Ray - so be it. We could do worse.

If guys like Tanaka and Paxton don't pitch better, none of it will matter anyway.

Requires evaluating if his effectiveness wanes rapidly after 6 innings.

Means taking him requires another bullpen arm.

I dunno guys. How many teams lose their ace for the season and then post a winning percentage over .600?

Add their #2 from the bullpen.

At the end of the day, those two injuries are the ones that hurt us the most

does not include Deivi Garcia. I've been high on a few of our pitching prospects in the past that have not panned out but Garcia is fun. I'd like to see him fully develop in a Yankees uniform.

I think pitchers struggling 3rd time through the order is just very, very widespread now - it's hard to find guys who don't become exponentially less effective once they get into that 3rd turn.

You're going to have that issue with most anyone right now, which is precisely why the bullpens are as important as they've become.

#Dodgers likely to add a reliever by tomorrow afternoon, as they continue discussions on #Pirates closer Felipe Vazquez and #Tigers closer Shane Greene, among others.

Which is why I assume the analytics department has figured out if his walks and HR rate falls off a cliff after 2x through or ( an ok problem with a full bullpen) so his season totals are because the Diamond Backs don't have bullpen depth and therefore require him to go longer than the point of diminishing returns.

I have no idea. All I know is that the Yankees will have scrubbed the data before they pull the trigger

The #Indians, an AL-best 17-5 this month, have played well enough that they're exploring short-term offensive upgrades. One name they've considered, according to a source: Nicholas Castellanos of the division rival #Tigers.

If true, I can't see them moving Bauer.

6th best ERA, 2nd best FIP since his debut in 2015.

He's definitely the guy you give up a lot for.

Rosenthal suggesting Thor may be on the move

notes:

Scranton is playing this afternoon. Clint Frazier is in the line up. Just robbed of a sure double.

The Yankees game tomorrow is at the Stadium and is an afternoon game that will likely be ending at the same time as the trade deadline hits.

The scheduled pitcher for Arizona in tomorrow's afternoon game is Zack Greinke.

This Saturday the Yankees have a day/night doubleheader against the Red Sox at the Stadium. With Michael Kay still out, the YES Network is having Bob Costas do the play by play for one of those games.

Tim Brown
@TBrownYahoo
·
2m
Source says Giants and Astros "engaged" on Bumgarner. Amount of traction unclear.

Park and Holder are both languishing at AA, not building any additional value. Either they need to be dealt or some of the middle IF blocking them at AAA (Valeric, Katoh, Wade) need to. They basically losing value the longer they sit at AA.

In comment 14512852 YANKEE28 said:

Quote:

to Heyman on the radio. He was asked if he was the Yankees, would he be willing to give up Hicks, Frazier, and Garcia for Syndergaard. He thought about it and then said YES, though he said he would be concerned about the Yankees centerfield position. You have got to be kidding. Glad he is not running the Yankees. These guys are more about clicks, then reality.

A pipedream, but YES.

In comment 14512906 Blue Ninja said:

Quote:

6th best ERA, 2nd best FIP since his debut in 2015. He's definitely the guy you give up a lot for.

That's swell. What is it since he missed most of 2017 with an injury?

In comment 14512954 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

Tim Brown @TBrownYahoo · 2m Source says Giants and Astros "engaged" on Bumgarner. Amount of traction unclear.

you gotta fucking be kidding me.

He's still scheduled to pitch.

just hope it happens before the Yankees make a move. That pretty much guarantees them a WS birth and if that’s the case, save our assets for the offseason.

Per Sherman

In comment 14512957 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14512906 Blue Ninja said: Quote: 6th best ERA, 2nd best FIP since his debut in 2015. He's definitely the guy you give up a lot for. That's swell. What is it since he missed most of 2017 with an injury?

Off the injury in 2017, so in 2018: 3.03 ERA and 2.81 FIP, which is good for 20th best and 8th best respectively.

This year: 4.33 ERA and 3.65 FIP

He's not having a great year this year, but whatever. He has the age, stuff and track record to go right back to what he normally is. The injury hasn't hampered him. Just an off year; an anomaly based on his track record.

Houston would return MadBum to Cy Young-level? They turned Charlie Morton into a stud.

I still think Cashman is going to settle for Ray.

In comment 14512979 Matt in SGS said:

Quote:

I still think Cashman is going to settle for Ray.

I think he gets Ray + one of Wheeler/Roark.

but he's a fly ball pitcher used to cavernous parks, he's not what he was a few years ago, and his NTC list includes NYY. Before you stage the guillotine for Brian Cashman, keep in mind that no matter what he does MadBum can still say no.

In comment 14512983 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

but he's a fly ball pitcher used to cavernous parks, he's not what he was a few years ago, and his NTC list includes NYY. Before you stage the guillotine for Brian Cashman, keep in mind that no matter what he does MadBum can still say no.

No not killing Cash, he can't make him come to NY but I'm sorry if Houston picks him up he probably doesn't give up an earned run the rest of the season lol...

In comment 14512976 bceagle05 said:

Quote:

Houston would return MadBum to Cy Young-level? They turned Charlie Morton into a stud.

Look what they've done to Wade Fucking Miley

but as far as the whole Houston thing goes, I'd say he probably gets less of a Houston bump than the average guy because I don't see him diving head-first into the machines and analytics and all that jazz. By most counts hes just an old school hoss who wants the ball every 5th day and not a whole lot more than that.

if the Astros get Madison, Yanks just chill it this year and do the best they can with what they have and load up this offseason.

...there's no longer any such thing as "loading up" for the Yankees. An offseason like 2008-09 will never happen again.

In comment 14512988 CromartiesKid21 said:

Quote:

In comment 14512976 bceagle05 said: Quote: Houston would return MadBum to Cy Young-level? They turned Charlie Morton into a stud. Look what they've done to Wade Fucking Miley

Wade Miley last year with the brewers 2.57 era, 3.59 FIP, Astros are amazing at what they do but no credit from me for Miley.

The Astros aren't trading Kyle Tucker for a rental.

No way Cashman just sits on this roster and doesn't do anything.

Wheeler to Houston was reportedly close this morning - maybe Houston is trying to gain a little leverage in negotiations. Not that you need much with BVW.

Andy Martino
@martinonyc
·
9m
Hearing Astros more on Bauer than Bumgarner

to HOU doesn't bother me, Bauer to the Astros REALLY would suck. a) he's the perfect analytics/trackman rat for what they do. Match made in heaven. b) under control for next year, too.

Bauer to HOU would be brutal.

I have major worries about beating them in a series as it is now... them with Bauer and we just can't match up with their pitching.

In comment 14512994 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

...there's no longer any such thing as "loading up" for the Yankees. An offseason like 2008-09 will never happen again.

Agreed, that was a confluence of opening a new Stadium and George was still alive (though severely limited after his series of strokes) and they wanted to have the Yankees win one more title with him alive.

But the Yankees will always consider a salary dump if some costs are defrayed (ie- Stanton). As was joked at the time of his signing, I look forward to Manny Machado getting traded to the Yankees from San Diego in 2 more years.

So that makes sense with a guy like Tucker as a starting point.

In comment 14513009 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

to HOU doesn't bother me, Bauer to the Astros REALLY would suck. a) he's the perfect analytics/trackman rat for what they do. Match made in heaven. b) under control for next year, too.

He is but there's also not going to be the same steep curve because he's already headlong into analytics, and while the Stros' proprietary stuff is great Bauer has the Indians stuff (which is solid) and I'm sure he has proprietary stuff of his own that he either pays for or gets for repping Driveline.

In comment 14513023 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513009 bigbluehoya said: Quote: to HOU doesn't bother me, Bauer to the Astros REALLY would suck. a) he's the perfect analytics/trackman rat for what they do. Match made in heaven. b) under control for next year, too. He is but there's also not going to be the same steep curve because he's already headlong into analytics, and while the Stros' proprietary stuff is great Bauer has the Indians stuff (which is solid) and I'm sure he has proprietary stuff of his own that he either pays for or gets for repping Driveline.

Are you sure about that? When we played them Bauer seems to not be following the stats on which pitches are most effective. Thjs is probably his worst season to date. He is all over the place this year. His attitide also suggests that he does things his own way. I don't have any inside information or anything but that is what I see out of him.

In comment 14513023 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513009 bigbluehoya said: Quote: to HOU doesn't bother me, Bauer to the Astros REALLY would suck. a) he's the perfect analytics/trackman rat for what they do. Match made in heaven. b) under control for next year, too. He is but there's also not going to be the same steep curve because he's already headlong into analytics, and while the Stros' proprietary stuff is great Bauer has the Indians stuff (which is solid) and I'm sure he has proprietary stuff of his own that he either pays for or gets for repping Driveline.

Multiple ways to look at it I guess.

Thoughtful and innovative player + thoughtful and innovate coaching staff

scares me more than

potentially change-resistant player + thoughtful and innovative coaching staff

at the end of the day, baseless speculation on my part.

In comment 14513024 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513023 Dunedin81 said: Quote: In comment 14513009 bigbluehoya said: Quote: to HOU doesn't bother me, Bauer to the Astros REALLY would suck. a) he's the perfect analytics/trackman rat for what they do. Match made in heaven. b) under control for next year, too. He is but there's also not going to be the same steep curve because he's already headlong into analytics, and while the Stros' proprietary stuff is great Bauer has the Indians stuff (which is solid) and I'm sure he has proprietary stuff of his own that he either pays for or gets for repping Driveline. Are you sure about that? When we played them Bauer seems to not be following the stats on which pitches are most effective. Thjs is probably his worst season to date. He is all over the place this year. His attitide also suggests that he does things his own way. I don't have any inside information or anything but that is what I see out of him.

Bauer has always been one of the most progressive starters in baseball when it comes to analytics. He has been the biggest ambassador for Driveline for years. And this is his 2nd best season to date, certainly a step back from last year and inconsistent but still with sustained stretches of ace or ace-like pitching

Basically what I am saying is that he is doing his own thing with it as opposed to what the team may want or his info is focusing on different info. It was weird to see him throwing pitches more often that he had less success with. I also saw a statistic the other day that he has great numbers outside the AL Central thks year but within the division he has been brutal.

In comment 14513059 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

Basically what I am saying is that he is doing his own thing with it as opposed to what the team may want or his info is focusing on different info. It was weird to see him throwing pitches more often that he had less success with. I also saw a statistic the other day that he has great numbers outside the AL Central thks year but within the division he has been brutal.

It's possible, and it's also possible he trusts his own understanding of the data more than the Indians FO. If that's the case, he may not be any more receptive to Houston coaching than he was to Cleveland's.

Braves and A’s join Yankees with interest in Tanner Roark


Yuck.

Roark is roughly a league average starter. He's going to give you 5-6 IP a start and keep you competitive most nights. He's probably not a postseason pitcher, but he would help for the next two months.

In comment 14513083 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

Roark is roughly a league average starter. He's going to give you 5-6 IP a start and keep you competitive most nights. He's probably not a postseason pitcher, but he would help for the next two months.

you're right, good innings eater. Was just hoping for higher end names. Let's see what Cash does.

In comment 14513083 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

Roark is roughly a league average starter. He's going to give you 5-6 IP a start and keep you competitive most nights. He's probably not a postseason pitcher, but he would help for the next two months.

I think Roark in the AL East would be a complete disaster. He’s no better than what they already have and he’s a FA after this season. He really makes no sense. He’s the complete opposite of what the Yankees need. He probably wouldn’t cost much but I’d rather do nothing than give up pieces for Roark

In comment 14513113 BigBlueShock said:

Quote:

In comment 14513083 Dunedin81 said: Quote: Roark is roughly a league average starter. He's going to give you 5-6 IP a start and keep you competitive most nights. He's probably not a postseason pitcher, but he would help for the next two months. I think Roark in the AL East would be a complete disaster. He’s no better than what they already have and he’s a FA after this season. He really makes no sense. He’s the complete opposite of what the Yankees need. He probably wouldn’t cost much but I’d rather do nothing than give up pieces for Roark

This would be doubling down on the same strategy as last year which clearly paid off.../s Insanity is...

there was a report than Ken Giles is suffering from elbow soreness, got a cortisone shot, is unlikely to pitch before the deadline, and that moving him is also unlikely.

In comment 14513118 adamg said:

Quote:

In comment 14513113 BigBlueShock said: Quote: In comment 14513083 Dunedin81 said: Quote: Roark is roughly a league average starter. He's going to give you 5-6 IP a start and keep you competitive most nights. He's probably not a postseason pitcher, but he would help for the next two months. I think Roark in the AL East would be a complete disaster. He’s no better than what they already have and he’s a FA after this season. He really makes no sense. He’s the complete opposite of what the Yankees need. He probably wouldn’t cost much but I’d rather do nothing than give up pieces for Roark This would be doubling down on the same strategy as last year which clearly paid off.../s Insanity is...

We still need to get to the playoffs in one piece, and preferably with the ability to give CC and probably Paxton some rest. Bauer, Bumgarner, even Ray would all be preferable, but if the choice is Roark for a song (and that's what it would be - look at the return for Jason Vargas) and nothing I'll take Roark.

(Don't agree with BBS there.) But, it would be among the least inspiring moves they could make. Especially seeing how last year's equivalent moves didn't work out.

Gardner said he thinks he'll be ready by Friday when he's eligible to come off of the DL.

DJLM said he tried to talk his way into the lineup today. Didn't work but sounds like he's just a day or two away.

The Yankees can only make moves that are available to them.

I'm seriously doubting Bumgarner being available at this point - and if he's not available, he's not available.

CLE is reportedly tempted to deal Bauer and are surely at least taking calls to get a temp check, but there's no guarantee they decide to deal him - and if they do, there are fit issues which could potentially surface. We've been through all of that already.

The Mets may or may not move Syndergaard and/or Wheeler; but what we do know is that they are extremely averse to dealing with NYY and actually are more worried about seeing one of their guys in a WS in the Bronx than take the best offer out there to make their own team better. There's nothing the Yankees can do about that.

It leaves Cashman with very limited options.

Avila's ask on Boyd was absolutely absurd the first time. So, for us to deal with them at all, that price is going to have to come down quite a bit.

That leaves you with guys like Robbie Ray and Tanner Roark. They're not on the same tier - I'd prefer Ray (who will also cost more), but it also wouldn't be horrible to add Roark.

Acquiring a starter is almost as much for the bullpen as it is for the rotation.

I think the hard deadline hurts us this year because so many teams are still undecided. The benefit to the old structure was that as teams fell out of it, they could then make players available post-deadline. Which is how HOU got Verlander to begin with.

Anyway, I just get the impression that fans are growing frustrated with Cashman when it's not necessarily warranted or fair. The deadline is tomorrow - we're going to do something. But we can't just make moves to make moves. They've got to make sense.

We'll see what the move(s) are soon enough.

no more half measures.

In comment 14513156 Heisenberg said:

Quote:

no more half measures.

Who among the available pitchers is an ace though? Bauer on his best day. Bumgarner at this point? Not really. Boyd? Nope. Ray? Nope.

the only thing negative to ever say about Cash is that he has bungled chances to acquire an ace or even a #2 type starter, whether through free agency or trade.

In comment 14513156 Heisenberg said:

Quote:

no more half measures.

This is what I mean.

Brian Cashman can't just make someone appear out of thin air at a reasonable price.

Who is this ace you want?

he had some bad luck with Sonny Gray and now seemingly so with Paxton.

Paxton was expected to be at least a #2 type starter and until spring training they didn't know they'd be without Severino for most of (if not all) of the season. If things had worked out as they should have, those are your 1-2 guys right there. Happ was a bit of a risk but had pitched well last year, so there were reasons to think he'd be solid this year.

It's just that nothing, NOTHING went according to plan with the rotation, not that it was necessarily a terrible plan. I suppose you can ding them for not really pursuing Keuchel, but I honestly question just how effective Keuchel would have been in the ALE.

In comment 14513158 Dunedin81 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513156 Heisenberg said: Quote: no more half measures. Who among the available pitchers is an ace though? Bauer on his best day. Bumgarner at this point? Not really. Boyd? Nope. Ray? Nope.

I would think that only Bauer MadBum, and Syndergaard would be huge upgrades and would be worth trading for at this point.

Lindsey Adler
@lindseyadler
·
22m
Aaron Boone: "Sevy's getting close to being on a mound."

In comment 14513165 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14513156 Heisenberg said: Quote: no more half measures. This is what I mean. Brian Cashman can't just make someone appear out of thin air at a reasonable price. Who is this ace you want?

Exactly. What ace is available? Every available guy is either not really available or has warts. The Mets have guys who might be worth it, but no way they risk losing a trade to the Yanks

And every seller starts the conversation with Gleyber Torres...and why wouldn’t they, it’s a sellers market

We all want our version of Verlander to magically appear...but sometimes the best deal is the one you don’t do

because the Wilpons are terrified he'll headline a Yankee championship run and they'll have to deal with bad press. Because if we know anything about the Mets, it's that they're unaccustomed to bad press.

In comment 14513174 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

Lindsey Adler @lindseyadler · 22m Aaron Boone: "Sevy's getting close to being on a mound."

He won't be in a position to go very deep into games, though.

than they do the Mets winning. Sad state of affairs over there.

four innings of shutout ball is better than four innings of shellacking.

In comment 14513184 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14513174 Strahan91 said: Quote: Lindsey Adler @lindseyadler · 22m Aaron Boone: "Sevy's getting close to being on a mound." He won't be in a position to go very deep into games, though.

Either are our current crop of starters. Although for a different reason :).

Just saw this. Surprised they wouldn't deal Deivi for Bauer.

Jon Heyman
@JonHeyman
·
49s
Everyone wants top pitching prospect Deivi García in talks with the Yankees. Reality: Only available in the 1 out of 1,000 chance the Mets consent to trade Syndergaard to them. Not available for lesser than Noah.

But I keep reminding myself that the starters, other than Happ, all had stellar moments earlier in the season. It IS possible that they get their shit together. I can't imagine Paxton and Tanaka keep pitching this badly for long.

In comment 14513186 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

than they do the Mets winning. Sad state of affairs over there.

The Wilpons didn't like the sting of watching Gooden, Strawberry, and Cone win titles with the Yankees. Even the Robin Ventura for David Justice deal, which seemed like a typical "wash" deal ended up with Ventura turning back into an All Star. Not surprised they will freeze the Yankees out.

In comment 14513184 Greg from LI said:

Quote:

In comment 14513174 Strahan91 said: Quote: Lindsey Adler @lindseyadler · 22m Aaron Boone: "Sevy's getting close to being on a mound." He won't be in a position to go very deep into games, though.

I thought Boone said he be coming in from the pen. They could open with Green, then bring in Sevy instead of Nestor.

brought that up as a possibility and also brought up the possibility of him being an "abbreviated starter" (term he used). He said he didn't know though and it depended on how quickly he came back and such.

it seems like his plan is to join the bullpen and build up his pitch count while on the team hoping to be ready to be a starter by the time the playoffs start.

will pitch well in October. Beyond that, who knows? Hopefully they're willing to be creative with openers and Severino as a 2-3 inning weapon (assuming he can't be a workhorse). They may gamble on Paxton because he has the arsenal to shut down good lineups. I have no faith in CC or Happ against good lineups - there are better alternatives to cover their mediocre (or worse) four-inning appearances.

side-arming and quick-pitching his way through a few innings than some of these starters.

In comment 14513213 robbieballs2003 said:

Quote:

it seems like his plan is to join the bullpen and build up his pitch count while on the team hoping to be ready to be a starter by the time the playoffs start.

If he can't get his pitch count up by the beginning to middle of September, then there is something wrong.

Yeah, the way I understand it is that Severino would be used out of the bullpen just to stretch him out rather than have him do all of it down in Scranton. Ultimately, barring setbacks, I believe they want him to be stretched back out to start by the middle of Sept. into the Postseason.

Joel Sherman
@Joelsherman1
Have spoken to multiple execs who say the believe it is now much more likely than not that #Indians trade Bauer

How long before another insider tweets that it's unlikely the Indians move Bauer? Feels like a seesaw that's been going up and down for weeks.

In comment 14513294 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

Joel Sherman @Joelsherman1 Have spoken to multiple execs who say the believe it is now much more likely than not that #Indians trade Bauer How long before another insider tweets that it's unlikely the Indians move Bauer? Feels like a seesaw that's been going up and down for weeks.

If it's to Houston, I don't see how they could lose.

Ken Rosenthal
@Ken_Rosenthal
·
2m
#Reds among teams talking to #Indians about Trevor Bauer, sources tell The Athletic. Outfielder Taylor Trammell, one of CIN’s top prospects, among names under discussion. Trammell has regressed this season, batting .236 with a .688 OPS at Double A.
@TheAthleticMLB
.

In comment 14513298 Strahan91 said:

Quote:

Ken Rosenthal @Ken_Rosenthal · 2m #Reds among teams talking to #Indians about Trevor Bauer, sources tell The Athletic. Outfielder Taylor Trammell, one of CIN’s top prospects, among names under discussion. Trammell has regressed this season, batting .236 with a .688 OPS at Double A. @TheAthleticMLB .

The Reds? Wtf?

Matt Ehalt
@MattEhalt
--Mets are not willing to do a deal centered around Clint Frazier or Miguel Andujar from the Yanks.

In comment 14513307 DanMetroMan said:

Quote:

Matt Ehalt @MattEhalt --Mets are not willing to do a deal centered around Clint Frazier or Miguel Andujar from the Yanks.

It feels like they're less willing to deal with NYY than teams actually in their own division.

Sad.

why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah.

Jon Heyman
@JonHeyman
·
39s
Yankees are still in touch on Bauer and MadBum. They are obviously motivated to land an ace. The Astros already have 2 aces (Verlander and Cole), and are thought to be in mix as well for the top starters.

In comment 14513310 UConn4523 said:

Quote:

why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah.

It's been said that NYY would include Garcia in a deal for Syndergaard. He's the one guy they'd be willing to move Deivi for.

It's not really about Frazier/Andujar - there's just nothing to defend. An unnamed exec basically came out and said that they can't stomach the idea of one of their guys coming here and winning a WS.

If you ask me, that's a pretty crappy way to run a franchise and it's obvious they don't want to help the Yankees even if it means improving their own outlook.

make a move with atlanta...makes no sense.

Take the best return regardless of what team it comes from.

In comment 14513313 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

In comment 14513310 UConn4523 said: Quote: why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah. It's been said that NYY would include Garcia in a deal for Syndergaard. He's the one guy they'd be willing to move Deivi for. It's not really about Frazier/Andujar - there's just nothing to defend. An unnamed exec basically came out and said that they can't stomach the idea of one of their guys coming here and winning a WS. If you ask me, that's a pretty crappy way to run a franchise and it's obvious they don't want to help the Yankees even if it means improving their own outlook.

Right, I’m sure the Yankees would be willing and fair trade partners with the Red Sox as long as it “helped the team”.

Never mind that Frazier/Andujar don’t fit with what the Mets need.

Never mind that I’m sure there are many teams across MLB that prefer not to trade with cross town or divisional rivals.

Except the Yanks. They are totally fine with it.

In comment 14513328 PhiPsi125 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513313 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14513310 UConn4523 said: Quote: why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah. It's been said that NYY would include Garcia in a deal for Syndergaard. He's the one guy they'd be willing to move Deivi for. It's not really about Frazier/Andujar - there's just nothing to defend. An unnamed exec basically came out and said that they can't stomach the idea of one of their guys coming here and winning a WS. If you ask me, that's a pretty crappy way to run a franchise and it's obvious they don't want to help the Yankees even if it means improving their own outlook. Right, I’m sure the Yankees would be willing and fair trade partners with the Red Sox as long as it “helped the team”. Never mind that Frazier/Andujar don’t fit with what the Mets need. Never mind that I’m sure there are many teams across MLB that prefer not to trade with cross town or divisional rivals. Except the Yanks. They are totally fine with it.

Why is the yankees making a deal with boston the same as them dealing with the mets?

They are in the same division. The mets and yankees aren't in the same league.

I better analogy to the yankees trading with boston is the mets trading with the phillies and braves. They seem to have no problem doing that.

It's well-documented that the Mets don't want to help the Yankees because they're concerned about seeing their own players win in the Bronx.

If the Mets offered the Yankees the best package for a player, I'm quite certain the Yankees would take it.

It's fine if you want to ignore the facts here. But the Yankees aren't a rival team - and if the Mets are fine making deals with the Braves and Phillies - I'm not really sure why they won't do business across town with a team that isn't even in the same league.

And again - it's not about Frazier/Andujar. They're apparently willing to include Garcia as well for Syndergaard and would probably put together a pretty damn good package for him. They're not asking the Mets to give him away for nothing.

This isn't a smart way to run a baseball team.

Quote:

“We’d be crazy to put ourselves in the position of having them win with one of our guys,’’ a member of the Mets front office told Yahoo Sports this week when asked about the possibility of Wheeler going to the Yankees.

Defend it if you want, it's petty.

You have Mets fans equating Yankees-Sox with Yankees-Mets. It’s not every fan, by a long shot, but there’s a visible stream of “you see, they just don’t get it”.

As for Frazier and Andujar, they need to get creative with a three team trade that moves those two elsewhere. Could Florial be a CF prospect that would interest Mets?

He can't be a starter here any longer

In comment 14513381 nygmen84 said:

Quote:

He can't be a starter here any longer

I will give the lineup a little slack and have patience with them. They starting pitching hasn't done much lately so I will stick to worrying about them.

my bad

In comment 14513328 PhiPsi125 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513313 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14513310 UConn4523 said: Quote: why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah. It's been said that NYY would include Garcia in a deal for Syndergaard. He's the one guy they'd be willing to move Deivi for. It's not really about Frazier/Andujar - there's just nothing to defend. An unnamed exec basically came out and said that they can't stomach the idea of one of their guys coming here and winning a WS. If you ask me, that's a pretty crappy way to run a franchise and it's obvious they don't want to help the Yankees even if it means improving their own outlook. Right, I’m sure the Yankees would be willing and fair trade partners with the Red Sox as long as it “helped the team”. Never mind that Frazier/Andujar don’t fit with what the Mets need. Never mind that I’m sure there are many teams across MLB that prefer not to trade with cross town or divisional rivals. Except the Yanks. They are totally fine with it.

Wait. Fuck this. You’re the same lunatic that goes absolutely ape shit every time a Yankee fan dare show up on a thread that may be Mets related. Yet here you are. Again. You hypocritical piece of shit. I NEVER want to see you comment on Yankees fans being on Mets threads again.

The Yankees dealing with a divisional rival is the exact same as the Mets dealing with a team not even in the same league. Unbelievable

In comment 14512488 section125 said:

Quote:

In comment 14512428 Ron from Ninerland said: Quote: In comment 14512383 Dunedin81 said: Quote: But MLB arms have often struggled as starters for NYY. It predates Rothschild, though he doesn't seem to be helping. It's weird, IDK if it's park or pressure but the list of failed SP acquisitions is remarkably long. Really ? The Yankees are among the worst teams in baseball at developing starting pitching. Since the ascension of George Steinbrenner , the Yankees have developed a total of seven good or great starting pitchers that pitched primarily for the Yankees. Seven pitchers in over four decades. Those pitchers are: Ron Guidry, Scott Kamienieki, Andy Pettite, Chien Ming Wang, Phil Hughs , Ivan Nova and Luis Severino. The jury is still out on Domingo German and Jordan Montgomery. How about the pitchers they traded and did well for their next team?

The Yankees developed 7 other starting pitchers that pitched well primarily for other teams. Those pitchers are: Doc Medich, Scott McGregor , Jim Beattie, Jim Deshalies, Doug Drabek, Al Lieter and Brian Boehringer. Thats 14 pitchers in four decades, still a woeful number. Even out of those, Guidry, Pettite , McGregor and Lieter. are the only ones I'd consider stars. Whats also depressing is what we got for those pitchers. We got Willie Randolph for Doc Medich. For the others I don't think we got jack shit.

In comment 14513343 bigbluehoya said:

Quote:

You have Mets fans equating Yankees-Sox with Yankees-Mets. It’s not every fan, by a long shot, but there’s a visible stream of “you see, they just don’t get it”.

Not every fan but definitely a lot.

I know countless Mets fans who rooted for the Braves in the 96 and 99 WS and the Phils in 09. I could never understand rooting for a Divison rival to win anything but yet to them the Yanks winning was worse. I'll never get that.

Me, I was pulling for the Mets in 86 as no way in hell I wanted the damn Sox to win anything. Ever!

to the Reds. Wtf

I also think I would rather call up Garcia and take my chances than trade for most of the guys out there. One exception would be Thor. I'd take him in a heartbeat.

I'd give them Frazier, Florial, Loaisiga, and Garcia for Thor.

In comment 14513436 BigBlueShock said:

Quote:

In comment 14513328 PhiPsi125 said: Quote: In comment 14513313 arcarsenal said: Quote: In comment 14513310 UConn4523 said: Quote: why would they want Andujar and they kind of don’t need Frazier. Certainly not for Noah. It's been said that NYY would include Garcia in a deal for Syndergaard. He's the one guy they'd be willing to move Deivi for. It's not really about Frazier/Andujar - there's just nothing to defend. An unnamed exec basically came out and said that they can't stomach the idea of one of their guys coming here and winning a WS. If you ask me, that's a pretty crappy way to run a franchise and it's obvious they don't want to help the Yankees even if it means improving their own outlook. Right, I’m sure the Yankees would be willing and fair trade partners with the Red Sox as long as it “helped the team”. Never mind that Frazier/Andujar don’t fit with what the Mets need. Never mind that I’m sure there are many teams across MLB that prefer not to trade with cross town or divisional rivals. Except the Yanks. They are totally fine with it. Wait. Fuck this. You’re the same lunatic that goes absolutely ape shit every time a Yankee fan dare show up on a thread that may be Mets related. Yet here you are. Again. You hypocritical piece of shit. I NEVER want to see you comment on Yankees fans being on Mets threads again.

Lol, boo hoo you lunatic. Get a fucking helmet. You guys have shown up plenty in Mets threads this season and I’ve said absolutely nothing. So yeah, you really got me there.

Guess how many fucks I give about what you think.

In comment 14513337 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

It's well-documented that the Mets don't want to help the Yankees because they're concerned about seeing their own players win in the Bronx. If the Mets offered the Yankees the best package for a player, I'm quite certain the Yankees would take it. It's fine if you want to ignore the facts here. But the Yankees aren't a rival team - and if the Mets are fine making deals with the Braves and Phillies - I'm not really sure why they won't do business across town with a team that isn't even in the same league. And again - it's not about Frazier/Andujar. They're apparently willing to include Garcia as well for Syndergaard and would probably put together a pretty damn good package for him. They're not asking the Mets to give him away for nothing.

Arc, I’m hardly a Wilpon apologist and I agree that they won’t deal with the Yankees for all the wrong reasons. However, pointing out that we are willing to deal with the Phillies/Braves while not the Yankees as a big deal isn’t really telling the full story. Mets deal with the Phillies/Braves to swap each other’s garbage. That’s it. When’s the last time the Mets made any trade of significance with those teams?

How many big trades happen between cross town rivals that share the back page of the newspaper? Even if they are not in the same division? Never? Owners have big egos. This isn’t unique to the Wilpons.

In comment 14513668 PhiPsi125 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513337 arcarsenal said: Quote: It's well-documented that the Mets don't want to help the Yankees because they're concerned about seeing their own players win in the Bronx. If the Mets offered the Yankees the best package for a player, I'm quite certain the Yankees would take it. It's fine if you want to ignore the facts here. But the Yankees aren't a rival team - and if the Mets are fine making deals with the Braves and Phillies - I'm not really sure why they won't do business across town with a team that isn't even in the same league. And again - it's not about Frazier/Andujar. They're apparently willing to include Garcia as well for Syndergaard and would probably put together a pretty damn good package for him. They're not asking the Mets to give him away for nothing. Arc, I’m hardly a Wilpon apologist and I agree that they won’t deal with the Yankees for all the wrong reasons. However, pointing out that we are willing to deal with the Phillies/Braves while not the Yankees as a big deal isn’t really telling the full story. Mets deal with the Phillies/Braves to swap each other’s garbage. That’s it. When’s the last time the Mets made any trade of significance with those teams? How many big trades happen between cross town rivals that share the back page of the newspaper? Even if they are not in the same division? Never? Owners have big egos. This isn’t unique to the Wilpons.

White Sox/Cubs??

from the Bauer trade?

In comment 14513731 Jints in Carolina said:

Quote:

from the Bauer trade?

They must be very high on Trammell as I’m sure many teams are despite his down year. Reyes is more of a DH so isn’t so useful to them and Allen projects as a back end starter by most. Pretty good deal for them imo. It makes the least sense for Cincinnati imo.

.

In comment 14513668 PhiPsi125 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513337 arcarsenal said: Quote: It's well-documented that the Mets don't want to help the Yankees because they're concerned about seeing their own players win in the Bronx. If the Mets offered the Yankees the best package for a player, I'm quite certain the Yankees would take it. It's fine if you want to ignore the facts here. But the Yankees aren't a rival team - and if the Mets are fine making deals with the Braves and Phillies - I'm not really sure why they won't do business across town with a team that isn't even in the same league. And again - it's not about Frazier/Andujar. They're apparently willing to include Garcia as well for Syndergaard and would probably put together a pretty damn good package for him. They're not asking the Mets to give him away for nothing. Arc, I’m hardly a Wilpon apologist and I agree that they won’t deal with the Yankees for all the wrong reasons. However, pointing out that we are willing to deal with the Phillies/Braves while not the Yankees as a big deal isn’t really telling the full story. Mets deal with the Phillies/Braves to swap each other’s garbage. That’s it. When’s the last time the Mets made any trade of significance with those teams? How many big trades happen between cross town rivals that share the back page of the newspaper? Even if they are not in the same division? Never? Owners have big egos. This isn’t unique to the Wilpons.

umm the Cubs/Whitesox hooked up on the Jose Quintana trade a few years ago, so yeah its pretty unique to the Wilpons...

In comment 14513742 Stu11 said:

Quote:

In comment 14513668 PhiPsi125 said: Quote: In comment 14513337 arcarsenal said: Quote: It's well-documented that the Mets don't want to help the Yankees because they're concerned about seeing their own players win in the Bronx. If the Mets offered the Yankees the best package for a player, I'm quite certain the Yankees would take it. It's fine if you want to ignore the facts here. But the Yankees aren't a rival team - and if the Mets are fine making deals with the Braves and Phillies - I'm not really sure why they won't do business across town with a team that isn't even in the same league. And again - it's not about Frazier/Andujar. They're apparently willing to include Garcia as well for Syndergaard and would probably put together a pretty damn good package for him. They're not asking the Mets to give him away for nothing. Arc, I’m hardly a Wilpon apologist and I agree that they won’t deal with the Yankees for all the wrong reasons. However, pointing out that we are willing to deal with the Phillies/Braves while not the Yankees as a big deal isn’t really telling the full story. Mets deal with the Phillies/Braves to swap each other’s garbage. That’s it. When’s the last time the Mets made any trade of significance with those teams? How many big trades happen between cross town rivals that share the back page of the newspaper? Even if they are not in the same division? Never? Owners have big egos. This isn’t unique to the Wilpons. umm the Cubs/Whitesox hooked up on the Jose Quintana trade a few years ago, so yeah its pretty unique to the Wilpons...

Great job! You found ONE(ish) from a few years ago. Golf clap?

Hate on the Wilpons all you want, it doesn’t mean you are right. It’s hardly common or unique to the Mets ownership.