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Sy'56 and Gidiefor's reports from today's training camp!

Eric from BBI : Admin : 8/6/2019 7:28 pm
FYI...


August 6, 2019 BBI New York Giants Training Camp Report - ( New Window )
Thx  
MotownGIANTS : 8/6/2019 7:42 pm : link
.
thanks guys -  
Del Shofner : 8/6/2019 7:43 pm : link
always interesting to read.

Can't wait for real games to start, to see what we have.
How long is BJ Hill's wife in labor?  
Diver_Down : 8/6/2019 7:46 pm : link
Wasn't he excused yesterday for the birth of his child?
RE: How long is BJ Hill's wife in labor?  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/6/2019 7:51 pm : link
In comment 14520640 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
Wasn't he excused yesterday for the birth of his child?


Get off my lawn!!

Seriously though thanks guys for your work, always appreciated.
Thanks guys for all  
section125 : 8/6/2019 8:04 pm : link
the effort you do to put this out for us. Wish you had a full day of regular practice to report on.
Great  
AcidTest : 8/6/2019 8:05 pm : link
reports. Thanks.
RT  
XBRONX : 8/6/2019 8:12 pm : link
is a weakness? Based on what?
RE: RT  
gidiefor : Mod : 8/6/2019 8:20 pm : link
In comment 14520666 XBRONX said:
Quote:
is a weakness? Based on what?


XBronx

Sy maintains that Remmers is a flawed player. Let's face it he has been up and down in the past couple of years. It's fingers crossed with him. All in all we assessed him as an improvement over any of last year's RTs but a lot of folks think his ceiling is just average.
The only  
XBRONX : 8/6/2019 8:23 pm : link
reason Remmers has been up and down has been his forced play at guard, not his natural spot.
RE: The only  
gidiefor : Mod : 8/6/2019 8:24 pm : link
In comment 14520683 XBRONX said:
Quote:
reason Remmers has been up and down has been his forced play at guard, not his natural spot.


I hope that is the right assessment -- truly I do
Thanks guys  
George from PA : 8/6/2019 8:55 pm : link
I feel NFL teams are watered down, depth poor, and although, the Giants are flawed.....they are not playing against the 85 Bears either.

RE: How long is BJ Hill's wife in labor?  
Eric from BBI : Admin : 8/6/2019 8:55 pm : link
In comment 14520640 Diver_Down said:
Quote:
Wasn't he excused yesterday for the birth of his child?


Yes. Today was his second day. Same with Michael Thomas and Zak DeOssie with NFLPA.
didn't seem like  
Bill in UT : 8/6/2019 9:17 pm : link
Haley had a great day
I'll take Remmers average  
Larry in Pencilvania : 8/6/2019 10:07 pm : link
Over the garbage that's been trotted out there the last six years. That being said they still need to upgrade the position
Great report, Thanks guys  
RobCrossRiver56 : 8/6/2019 10:25 pm : link

The arrow is pointing up. Excited to watch this team develop this season..
Sy thinks Barkley needs to be more  
LS : 8/6/2019 11:08 pm : link
of a stick it in there and get the 1 to 2 yards. Personally, I don't mind him bouncing out for some of his long gainers every now and then.
RE: Sy thinks Barkley needs to be more  
BestFeature : 8/6/2019 11:39 pm : link
In comment 14520887 LS said:
Quote:
of a stick it in there and get the 1 to 2 yards. Personally, I don't mind him bouncing out for some of his long gainers every now and then.


Ideally, he would know when to do one vs. the other more consistently.
RE: RE: The only  
darren in pdx : 8/7/2019 1:01 am : link
In comment 14520686 gidiefor said:
Quote:
In comment 14520683 XBRONX said:


Quote:


reason Remmers has been up and down has been his forced play at guard, not his natural spot.



I hope that is the right assessment -- truly I do


I think Remmers is filling the role that Brown did mis-season last year. A stop-gap upgrade until something better comes along. He plays at his level of 2017 we’ll be pretty well off. His injury is a concern.
RE: Sy thinks Barkley needs to be more  
.McL. : 8/7/2019 2:13 am : link
In comment 14520887 LS said:
Quote:
of a stick it in there and get the 1 to 2 yards. Personally, I don't mind him bouncing out for some of his long gainers every now and then.


What Sy said was that analytics shows just how important those those 1 or 2 yards are to scoring.

A 1st down run on a possession that nets less than 2 yards decreases the likelihood of a score by approximately 60%.

A 1st down run that nets 10+ yards on the possession only increases the possibility of a score by about 7 to 9%.

In other words the negative affect of a bad run is far worse for scoring potential, than the positive affect of a good run is.

You only get so many possessions per game. Failing on a possession because of a bad 1st down run is not a path to winning.
Nice job, gentlemen.  
Crispino : 8/7/2019 6:54 am : link
Great observations. Keep it coming!
Anyone who reads these camp reports  
Frank in Silver Spring : 8/7/2019 7:00 am : link
And doesn't contribute to Eric's annual appeal should do some thinkin'.
RE: Sy thinks Barkley needs to be more  
ZogZerg : 8/7/2019 7:40 am : link
In comment 14520887 LS said:
Quote:
of a stick it in there and get the 1 to 2 yards. Personally, I don't mind him bouncing out for some of his long gainers every now and then.


Hard to do that last year when the D would be on him as soon as he was handed the ball. I would expect him to be able to do that more this year with better OL play.
Thanks fellas  
ATL_Giants : 8/7/2019 8:56 am : link
It may not seem like much, but first-hand accounts like this are very much appreciated.
Having Remmers at RT is Exciting  
Capt. Don : 8/7/2019 9:04 am : link
Bc of how terrible the position has been for us the last several years.

But Remmers is far from a sure thing. He peaked 2 years ago when he was slightly above average and has had back problems since then. There is a reason he was a 1 year, $3M rental and it's not just bc of his back.

I'm excited to have a true professional over there but RT this year isnt as settled as some would like to believe.
RE: The only  
Ten Ton Hammer : 8/7/2019 9:07 am : link
In comment 14520683 XBRONX said:
Quote:
reason Remmers has been up and down has been his forced play at guard, not his natural spot.


That can't be the only reason. The guy has played on 6 different NFL teams. He might be a solid NFL starter or he might not.
Truer words were never spoken...err...written.  
Klaatu : 8/7/2019 9:10 am : link
Quote:
The OL has held this team back more than anything you can think of and even though the RT spot is a weaknesses, if these guys can be as dominant as I think they can be, the entire outlook of the offense changes.


What's angered me the most (besides the virtually non-existent pass-protection) is the inability to convert a 3rd & short on the ground. I don't care if it's Barkley running the ball or someone else, I just want to feel confident on 3rd & 1 that they'll be able to pick up two yards.
RE: RE: The only  
Klaatu : 8/7/2019 9:30 am : link
In comment 14521078 Ten Ton Hammer said:
Quote:
In comment 14520683 XBRONX said:


Quote:


reason Remmers has been up and down has been his forced play at guard, not his natural spot.



That can't be the only reason. The guy has played on 6 different NFL teams. He might be a solid NFL starter or he might not.


That's a little misleading, though. His first two years in the league he bounced around five different teams, on and off their practice squads, and only played in a handful of games. When he hooked up with Carolina, he got a chance to start and did so for 37 straight games (plus playoffs). He played well enough that the Vikings (who had him and released him in 2013 without playing him), signed him in 2017 to a five-year, $30 million deal. He started eleven games for them at RT before he got hurt, then 16 games at RG in 2018, where he struggled with a new position in addition to his recurring back troubles.

I'm not a huge Remmers fan. I really wanted the Giants to draft a plug-and-play RT this year. But he's better than anyone the Giants have had at that position since K-Mac retired - which isn't saying much, I know, but still...he's an upgrade.
At the very least Remmers is beating out Wheeler  
Rudy5757 : 8/7/2019 10:56 am : link
for the RT spot so its an upgrade. How much remains to be seen but 2nd year of Hernandez, Pio hopefully healthy at Center beating out Pulley, Zeitler and Remmers is an upgrade.
Just cause Remmers  
RollBlue : 8/7/2019 11:17 am : link
is starting doesn't make him better than Wheeler. Did he beat him out playing in shorts? The GM signed him to be the starting RT, so he's starting. The same GM signed Omameh to start at RG last year, how did that work out???

In regard to height and weight - big deal! Flowers was bigger than all of them. Last years line had the same 3 guys - Solder, Hernandez and Hallipio through games 1 and 2 - how did they look??? Zeigler is an upgrade, that's all we really know for sure, but they no longer have an elite WR that teams need to focus on, so I think the offense is not going to be better - hope I'm wrong.
RE: Just cause Remmers  
Klaatu : 8/7/2019 11:53 am : link
In comment 14521230 RollBlue said:
Quote:
is starting doesn't make him better than Wheeler. Did he beat him out playing in shorts? The GM signed him to be the starting RT, so he's starting. The same GM signed Omameh to start at RG last year, how did that work out???


Do you honestly think that Remmers is starting just because Gettleman signed him to start? That he's not a significant upgrade from Chad Wheeler? If Wheeler was good enough, why bother to spend money on Remmers in the first place? As for Omameh (who's still in the league, now with New Orleans), yeah, he was less-than-stellar, to put it mildly. Would you have preferred the Giants stick with D.J. Fluker?

Quote:
In regard to height and weight - big deal! Flowers was bigger than all of them. Last years line had the same 3 guys - Solder, Hernandez and Hallipio through games 1 and 2 - how did they look??? Zeigler is an upgrade, that's all we really know for sure, but they no longer have an elite WR that teams need to focus on, so I think the offense is not going to be better - hope I'm wrong.


The right side of last year's line was pretty bad, hence the trade for Zeitler and the signing of Remmers. Zeitler is more than just an upgrade - he's a HUGE upgrade. He's the best RG we've had since Chris Snee.

Solder and Hernandez both got better as the season progressed. Solder is what he his, an average-to-above average LT with a ton of experience. Hernandez, going into his second year, has drawn a ton of praise from Brian Baldinger, who is hardly a Giants "homer" (far from it) and knows a thing or two about playing offensive line in the NFL.

Halapio is still a question mark. He was not a good RG. He may turn out to be a good Center. Pulley is average-to-below average at the position, so if Halapio is good enough to beat him out, he'll be well worth the relative pittance he's making.

As long as the O-Line does its job, it doesn't matter if we have an "elite WR" or not. We may not have a ton of weapons, but we have enough to be efficient, if not explosive, and I'd consider that a big step in the right direction for this team.
Remmers was signed  
giants#1 : 8/7/2019 12:19 pm : link
for significantly less than Omameh and of the $2.5M Remmers can earn this year, $875k of it (~33%) is only earned if he's active. That's not a contract you give to a "starter", that's a depth/competition signing.

Let's get one thing straight re: Wheeler v Remmer  
gidiefor : Mod : 8/7/2019 12:35 pm : link
technique wise -- Remmers is superior to Wheeler

Wheeler is injured right now and Remmers has been playing

Remmers looks much more the part than Wheeler does - can that change? Maybe -- but all things being equal right now Remmers is a better choice than Wheeler
IMO, anyone who thinks  
RollBlue : 8/7/2019 2:02 pm : link
Wheeler had any chance of starting once Remmers was signed is kidding themselves. Now, Remmers may end up playing better than Wheeler, but that remains to be seen. That fact that the team has "confidence" in Pulley speaks volumes to me - hope I'm wrong...
RE: IMO, anyone who thinks  
Klaatu : 8/7/2019 2:23 pm : link
In comment 14521435 RollBlue said:
Quote:
Wheeler had any chance of starting once Remmers was signed is kidding themselves.


Well, naturally, because Wheeler sucked and needed to be replaced, which is why Remmers was signed in the first place. He's simply a better player. He was brought in the replace Wheeler in the starting lineup. Why is that difficult for you to understand? Does Wheeler owe you money or something? Do you think Gettleman just wanted to do something nice for his old buddy Mike so he gave him a job?
The very fact that Wheeler is still on the roster  
ChicagoMarty : 8/7/2019 9:46 pm : link
and may end up one of the 53 is very discouraging.

Wheeler is terrible.

There is no glossing over that fact.

When Wheeler is gone then the OL may actually have improved
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