I want to preface my comments with the following:
Daniel Jones is not going to replicate what he did last night for the rest of the preseason. And his detractors will come out of the woodwork with the first incompletion and especially first interception.
This thread is not meant to be an Eli Manning bash-fest.
Now with that out of the way:
Eli is in an unenviable position right now. The only way last night could have gone worse for him is if he threw a pick-6 before Jones came onto the field and did what he did. Expectations for Jones went from the outhouse to the penthouse in just one drive (it's actually a bit comical).
But on a rebuilding ball club, there will be calls for Jones with every Manning misfire and three-and-out. I wish it didn't come down to this, but it is what it is.
It's going to be very interesting to see how the Giants handle this.
After last night, I'm expecting the clamor for Jones to be QB 1 to grow & grow.
Not so sure. Some of us are old enough to remember Phil Simms vs. Jeff Hostetler. It's not just W-L.
If Mara stays the hell out of it (????) then I believe there is.
But the leash should be very short.
If we get into a 1-3 hole or start 0-2, I really think that's where you have to make the switch. Not once the midway point has passed and we're already out of contention and playing meaningless games.
If Jones plays this year - and I have a feeling he will. I want it to be in games that still matter when the team is still alive.
Part of me still kind of believes that Eli is going to be better than people think, though. He no longer is a de-facto starter here. There's a kid with the talent to usurp him on the sidelines now. This isn't Ryan Nassib, Davis Webb or Geno Smith anymore. This is the guy fans are going to be clamoring for the second the offense sputters.
If there's a guy I'll never count out, it's Eli Manning.. but he's going to have a hell of a time keeping Jones on the sidelines and the fans from calling for him. The only path Eli has to retaining his job is to win games and win them early.
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and not a repeat of the McAdoo/Mara fiasco.
If Mara stays the hell out of it (????) then I believe there is.
I think it's clear both handled it poorly.
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In comment 14524277 JonC said:
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and not a repeat of the McAdoo/Mara fiasco.
If Mara stays the hell out of it (????) then I believe there is.
I think it's clear both handled it poorly.
Oh sure, but McAdoo's long gone. Mara is the one to worry about today.
"It’s a Pat decision. Pat and I talk all the time. We talk a lot, every day. And we talk about the whole schmear. The ganze megillah. We talk about every position, we go through it. Listen, I really believe this, it doesn’t make a difference who you’re talking about, at the end of the day, it’s going to be clear. When anything happens, you’ve got to, don’t lock your knees and just go."
The operative word is "clear". Staff Leadership, Coaches, teammates, fans and even Eli will know if it gets to that. I think it will be smooth when/if it happens.
Based on the events that have taken place since then, the only thing I can believe is that the Giants wanted to completely move on from Eli both on the field and financially.
I think Eli taking him to the low post meant that the Giants were going to honor the last year of his contract financially and give him one more opportunity to fight for his job, but with no guarantee that another QB wouldn't be selected or play over him sooner than later if it worked out that way.
And by the way, we may be headed that way.
Rollout pass for a 3 yard gain, then a false start. Then a stuffed run with a holding penalty that's declined. Then a draw.
Jones, Tanney and Lauletta all looked good (and the receivers all caught the ball well).
Rollout pass for a 3 yard gain, then a false start. Then a stuffed run with a holding penalty that's declined. Then a draw.
And what the heck was it with that draw?
he had a half hearted clap when Jones hit the TD agter
watching the stadium and his team mates explode with
exuberance something he is quite familiar with it had
to affect him thinking back to the good bye Allie cheers
fans can be brutal .
i wonder just how much leeway eli will get. because to me, as soon as jones is ready, you play him and don't look back. again, for me, it comes to two questions - do you think you can win a championship with eli and is jones ready? to me, the only ways eli starts are if the answer to the first question is yes or the answer to the second question is no. all other scenarios, you start jones.
and after last night, it certainly looks like the answer to the second question is yes. that said, i saw jones scan the field on only one throw - the rest he was kind of telegraphing - but his ball placement was excellent. the slant to tate was what a slant should look like (not this high ankle-breaking crap we're used to seeing). jones also holds the ball a little low in his set up, but that's easily correctable. to me, the biggest takeway was what you posted earlier, eric, about how the first-teamers thought about him...
but yes, the calls for jones to start will only get louder and louder if he continues to play like he did last night. i still think eli will (and probably should) absolutely start week 1, but it won't be for long if he keeps leading this offense like a turtle in a slog.
You are going to have to make a leap of faith to make the switch, and when you do, Jones probably wont give them a better chance to win at that very moment.
If you wait till its clear, you are either waiting for mathematical elimination or next year
Jones hasn't even mastered the offense yet. People are getting way ahead of themselves
he had a half hearted clap when Jones hit the TD agter
watching the stadium and his team mates explode with
exuberance something he is quite familiar with it had
to affect him thinking back to the good bye Allie cheers
fans can be brutal .
I doubt Eli remember Allie Sherman
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basically gets an incomplete for last night. He wasn't terrible - the drive imploded.
Rollout pass for a 3 yard gain, then a false start. Then a stuffed run with a holding penalty that's declined. Then a draw.
And what the heck was it with that draw?
3rd and long draw plays are a Giants staple going back decades! Its tradition at this point
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basically gets an incomplete for last night. He wasn't terrible - the drive imploded.
Rollout pass for a 3 yard gain, then a false start. Then a stuffed run with a holding penalty that's declined. Then a draw.
And what the heck was it with that draw?
My brother shouted "What the hell's he doing? I thought we weren't going to show them the secret playbook during the preseason?"
Last night was the equivalent of Jones' Shockey HOF game.
The hype isn't going to go away.
The first 3 and out in the home opener Eli will be booed out of the building.
Cutting Eli will give Jones the reps, allow Eli to avoid the boos, and to move on somewhere else where he can play.
just making a joke. I know that play gets called all the time across the league
The plan is we have a first round QB who looks competent. Apples to oranges here.
I think Daniel Jones is going to eventually win the starting job by mid season despite the teams record. if you think last night got everyone geeked up, wait till he displays what he can do with his legs. At some point they are going to realize that DJ gives them a better chance to win.
Last night was the equivalent of Jones' Shockey HOF game.
The hype isn't going to go away.
The first 3 and out in the home opener Eli will be booed out of the building.
Cutting Eli will give Jones the reps, allow Eli to avoid the boos, and to move on somewhere else where he can play.
Give Eli more credit than that. The Giants committed to him verbally and emotionally, and are compensating him accordingly.
Jones is not Geno 2.0. I believe that if the coaches call for it, Eli will hold the clipboard and coach up the franchise in good faith. It's not a benching- it's a rebuilding.
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and not a repeat of the McAdoo/Mara fiasco.
The plan is we have a first round QB who looks competent. Apples to oranges here.
If there was a hint of urge to give another QB a look, it should've been planned out well in advance, regardless. That fiasco was a reactionary shot from the hip that shouldn't happen.
If Eli makes a poor showing it will be because of his PHYSICAL limitations only, not because of how well the other QBs are playing. He's a Manning for Christ sake!
I think Daniel Jones is going to eventually win the starting job by mid season despite the teams record. if you think last night got everyone geeked up, wait till he displays what he can do with his legs. At some point they are going to realize that DJ gives them a better chance to win.
As far as Eli goes once the DJ era gets underway I am not that upset that we kept Eli at 20MM and change as there wasnt much out there I wanted in FA anyway for the cap savings we would have had. Eli could very well be the Eli of Old with this improved OL and DJ can sit and learn which is also fine...but to me once the season is lost (3 & 6 or worse at about the mid point) its time to hook Eli and see what the kid has.
It might be different if the roster were in better shape, but this team is going to lose a whole bunch of games even if he plays OK. And once we're 5-6 games into it and not looking like a real contender, everyone is going to (rightly, IMO) want to see Jones get the ball to get his development underway.
Yeah, Eli's final seasons have become an awkward mess. I know the Phil Simms exit haunts the Giants, but at least Phil ended on a high note. Eli's slow death march has been painful.
It might be different if the roster were in better shape, but this team is going to lose a whole bunch of games even if he plays OK. And once we're 5-6 games into it and not looking like a real contender, everyone is going to (rightly, IMO) want to see Jones get the ball to get his development underway.
yup - Mara took the cowards way out.
The best thing for Eli's legacy would have been to move on after 17.
That said, 5 years from now (probably even sooner) all everyone will remember are the SB wins and 4th quarter comebacks
Last night, we watched a guy with zero pass rush against him throw to the first man in his progression five times. That was nice. I root for everyone in a blue uniform.
Eli has been here 16 years. He is the only starting QB that a huge number of Giants fans have ever seen. The past few years have been tough and like all QBs Eli is given much of the blame. So, he is stale. Doesn't matter that the Tom Brady would probably be dead playing behind the line that Reese gave Eli. No one can throw from the seat of their pants
So -psychologically- last night was very exciting for many fans. That doesn't change the fact it was a sugar high.
Remember RG3? That was a sugar high that lasted a season. As a Giants fan that remembers Charlie Conerly, I say enjoy the moment. It was fun to watch. But please, relax he will get his chance. There is no rush. And there is certainly no sure thing thing.
On the other hand, there may be no way to do this graciously, so why bother trying to guide the fan market.
Eli dropping his weekly spot was a big indicator for me that the front office support was luke warm.
Last night, we watched a guy with zero pass rush against him throw to the first man in his progression five times. That was nice. I root for everyone in a blue uniform.
There was more to it than that have a look at this
There was no bigger detractor of Jones than Mark Schofield who called him a 4th or 5th round talent.
Link - ( New Window )
Quote: Last night, we watched a guy with zero pass rush against him throw to the first man in his progression five times. That was nice. I root for everyone in a blue uniform.
There was more to it than that have a look at this
There was no bigger detractor of Jones than Mark Schofield who called him a 4th or 5th round talent. Link - ( New Window )
Watch the film in the article you posted. Jones is never under any duress in the pocket. And on every single throw, he looks at one guy and then throws to that guy. Exactly as I stated.
It's okay to be excited. But a person can be excited and still accept reality. The film is the film.
Someone (maybe Papa) said last night that the Giants lead the league since around '15 in losing games after leading with less than 2 minutes in the game.
How many more wins would Eli and the Giants have if the defense didn't BLOW SO MANY F*ING GAMES the last 5 years!
I feel good about DJ and the future, but still hope Eli goes out on a high.
The film is the film.
Assuming you know what your looking at
So count me in on last night not being a good one for Eli.
Eli had one bland drive, with a very odd roll-out pass play, that basically gave Anderson a chance to quickly show off his punting. But then Jones comes in and moves the team down the field efficiently and hangs a TD on the scoreboard, courtesy of his arm.
The fans get fired up and Jones is the talk of a lot of opinion shows this morning. He built up a lot of equity last night.
So this is now a QB controversy. Game on. Eli is now officially on the clock. And he's going to need to do something very positive to eclipse what Jones did last night.