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Hereís what I think on Daniel Jonesóvery objective

NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 11:04 am
1. He had no support at Duke

2. The giants, despite recent years, are not idiots. They have talent evaluators and have a direct line to a very respected QB guru coach at Duke

3. The kid is smart and hard working and appears to not get sucked into media frenzy. He is grounded. Whether he processes quickly on the field remains to be seen.

4. His technique and throwing motion are superb, very repeatable but has some bad habits which remain to be seen if are correctable. For example, he did not pat the ball relentlessly before throwing thurs night which was great to see as that was an issue before. He did it some, but not a lot. He still locks onto wrs with his eyes and he MUST correct this or quality starting safeties will abuse him.

5. He throws a great touch ball with spin and great accuracy. We all saw that thurs night and he showed this at duke when he wasnít running for his life or wrs dropping balls constantly.

6. The arm strength is fine. What remains to be seen is if he can rifle it into a window 20-30 yds downfield. Few can do this, so if he canít he canít. His release time looks good due to his great mechanics but others might have better observations there. Also, arm strength will increase over the next 2-3 years. Brady had a very average arm coming out and he built it up tremendously over his first 4 years in the league.

7. He has all the QB tools, now the team has to build around them. I donít think he will ever be the ice cold assassin Eli was in the clutch, which was also Eliís greatest talent. In fact, maybe the best I had ever seen.
You sound Like Pat Kirwan.  
Big Blue '56 : 8/10/2019 11:12 am : link
Thatís a good thing.
Additional thought  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 11:15 am : link
Itís funny how we fall in love with raw arm strength. Would the jets have rather had browning nagel or a healthy Chad Pennington? And Jonesí arm is far stronger than Penningtonís.

The key will be is ability to process and execute quickly. The next 3 preseason games will be interesting as he gets a quarter or more to play each game and I expect him to play like a rookieóI want to see how he progresses, learns, and execute ďfasterĒ.
BB56  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 11:17 am : link
Lol, just a fan coming to grips with the Eli era ending and explaining to my kids the transition. I just got tix to the Bills and Skins games to take my 7yr old son to, who went for the first time last year and is a huge Barkley fan.
There was a lot of good things about his performance.  
SteelGiant : 8/10/2019 11:28 am : link
However if I dissected his touchdown pass like some dissect others, I think the WR on the top of the screen was even more open. Do not get my comment like I am down, I think the answer is the same for Eli when he plays too, If you want to make decisions quickly it is all about the preset read. It not always that he is locked on a receiver but his brain has already analyzed where the highest chance of success is going to be and if he thinks he can make the throw he makes the throw.
I think his touch  
Jay in Toronto : 8/10/2019 11:43 am : link
will help with his RBs as receivers and will get some first downs with his legs -- two areas where he is better than Eli.

Where he needs to be more Eli-like is between the ears -- adjustments and, as you point out, looking off Safeties.
RE: There was a lot of good things about his performance.  
Reale01 : 8/10/2019 11:47 am : link
In comment 14525890 SteelGiant said:
Quote:
However if I dissected his touchdown pass like some dissect others, I think the WR on the top of the screen was even more open. Do not get my comment like I am down, I think the answer is the same for Eli when he plays too, If you want to make decisions quickly it is all about the preset read. It not always that he is locked on a receiver but his brain has already analyzed where the highest chance of success is going to be and if he thinks he can make the throw he makes the throw.


I saw the same thing and said so on another thread. The receiver at the top ran an out with no coverage underneath. He stared down the right side of the field, was happy with what he saw, and made a good throw. He looked good. We certainly have someone to work with in DJ.

How Can You Tell if Your Own Opinion on Anything...  
Jim in Tampa : 8/10/2019 11:49 am : link
is "very objective"?
Sure, why not?  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 11:54 am : link
I donít lean either way and listen to other opinionsówhich was what I was looking for in this thread. For example, if you provided an opinion supported by facts instead of non-substantive sarcasm, I would have welcomed that and listened to it. But, alas, you provided nothing of substance to the thread. ;)
RE: How Can You Tell if Your Own Opinion on Anything...  
BlueLou'sBack : 8/10/2019 12:32 pm : link
In comment 14525932 Jim in Tampa said:
Quote:
is "very objective"?


If you are good at something, then your opinion about that thing is "very objective." Otherwise you wouldn't have been able to develop that skill!!!

Picked that up from an Oscar Peterson interview.
It's very difficult to.......  
BroDox : 8/10/2019 1:06 pm : link

....learn to "eat" the ball for a rookie NFL QB. If Daniel Jones quickly learns not to try to force the ball on busted plays and simply eat the ball it will add to his skill set.
Very objective and insightful  
5BowlsSoon : 8/10/2019 1:12 pm : link
Thank you for this, Tuna!
Well your 6th point is definitely not objective.  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:16 pm : link
His arm strength will develop over the next 2-3 years? Why?
Plenty of QBs come into the league and don't develop arm strength.  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:17 pm : link
.
Jonesí release time?  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 1:19 pm : link
Anyone with a scouts eye, or at least moreso than me, have a take on how quickly Jones get rid of the ball purely from a mechanics perspective? I know his mechanics are highly regarded, smooth repeatable delivery, but the release time and ability to process will make up for any velocity short comings.

Again, I think his arm is fine, itís just not an elite farve, Elway, Mahomes type of arm. Marino didnít have a cannon, but yet had the quickest delivery the NFL has ever seen from a mechanics perspective.
People love talking about Brady, but he played at Michigan  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:20 pm : link
at 195 lbs at 6 4! Daniel Jones doesn't look like he is going to be adding any weight to his frame unless he goes on the PEDs.
I already knew he can throw and is incredibly accurate  
eli4life : 8/10/2019 1:21 pm : link
I think a lot of his mistakes at duke was trying to do too much with far inferior talent around him.

What Iím waiting to see is his athleticism he hasnít even run yet. Has he learned to not take unnecessary punishment yet or are we going to be holding our breath every time the play breaks down and he takes off. I think or hope at least heís already figured that out in the heat of battle but some never seem to do
Zekes alibi  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 1:47 pm : link
What you typed is very concerning bc it means he has shrunk 1 inch and lost 26# since the combine. Has the team disclosed the cause for this? Maybe it has to do with loss of arm strength and general malaise?
Lol  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 1:49 pm : link
And if I read your post more closely I what have see. You were talking about Brady. If you think an athletic qb needs PEDs to add to a 6í5Ē 225# frame I donít have a comeback for that one.
RE: People love talking about Brady, but he played at Michigan  
ron mexico : 8/10/2019 1:50 pm : link
In comment 14526030 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
at 195 lbs at 6 4! Daniel Jones doesn't look like he is going to be adding any weight to his frame unless he goes on the PEDs.


huh? why cant he bulk up?

Apparently he is actually a bit of a beast in the weight room and deceptively strong. At least thats what Coach Cut said.
RE: Zekes alibi  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:54 pm : link
In comment 14526055 NJBlueTuna said:
Quote:
What you typed is very concerning bc it means he has shrunk 1 inch and lost 26# since the combine. Has the team disclosed the cause for this? Maybe it has to do with loss of arm strength and general malaise?


Because the arm strength people were evaluating was when he played at Michigan at under 200 lbs. Not when he was at the combine.
RE: RE: People love talking about Brady, but he played at Michigan  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:56 pm : link
In comment 14526064 ron mexico said:
Quote:
In comment 14526030 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


at 195 lbs at 6 4! Daniel Jones doesn't look like he is going to be adding any weight to his frame unless he goes on the PEDs.



huh? why cant he bulk up?

Apparently he is actually a bit of a beast in the weight room and deceptively strong. At least thats what Coach Cut said.


He can absolutely "bulk up" and yes he I'm sure he is strong because he is a good athlete. You need good shoulder mobility to throw a football though, and bulking up may impede that.
RE: Lol  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 1:57 pm : link
In comment 14526061 NJBlueTuna said:
Quote:
And if I read your post more closely I what have see. You were talking about Brady. If you think an athletic qb needs PEDs to add to a 6í5Ē 225# frame I donít have a comeback for that one.


How do you know you are literally throwing out his height and weight, really doesn't have anything to do with how much more weight his frame can handle. I wish they would do wrist and ankle measurements at the combine, but they don't .
RE: RE: RE: People love talking about Brady, but he played at Michigan  
ron mexico : 8/10/2019 1:59 pm : link
In comment 14526068 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
In comment 14526064 ron mexico said:


Quote:


In comment 14526030 Zeke's Alibi said:


Quote:


at 195 lbs at 6 4! Daniel Jones doesn't look like he is going to be adding any weight to his frame unless he goes on the PEDs.



huh? why cant he bulk up?

Apparently he is actually a bit of a beast in the weight room and deceptively strong. At least thats what Coach Cut said.



He can absolutely "bulk up" and yes he I'm sure he is strong because he is a good athlete. You need good shoulder mobility to throw a football though, and bulking up may impede that.


not if you do it right. I'm not talking about NJ Guido type of bulking. I'm talking about mainly adding core strength.
If you look at DJ now his core is very strong, I'm not sure how he is  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 2:01 pm : link
going to add more strength without adding mass.
RE: If you look at DJ now his core is very strong, I'm not sure how he is  
ron mexico : 8/10/2019 2:05 pm : link
In comment 14526074 Zeke's Alibi said:
Quote:
going to add more strength without adding mass.


whats wrong with adding some mass? He is not going to turn onto one of those guys who cant touch their back


The only reason I bothered to comment was because this thread  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 2:06 pm : link
was labeled "objective" than made a definitive statement about arm strength improving in the next 2-3 years. We just don't know that.
It s been a while since Eli has  
joeinpa : 8/10/2019 2:09 pm : link
Been an assassin.

Jones wonít be replacing that Eli.
I thought the throw to Lattimore was good evidence on arm strength  
mattlawson : 8/10/2019 2:30 pm : link
Got it into a window on a tight rope. Yes was an easy read but the throw was great
RE: Sure, why not?  
Jim in Tampa : 8/10/2019 2:56 pm : link
In comment 14525938 NJBlueTuna said:
Quote:
I donít lean either way and listen to other opinionsówhich was what I was looking for in this thread. For example, if you provided an opinion supported by facts instead of non-substantive sarcasm, I would have welcomed that and listened to it. But, alas, you provided nothing of substance to the thread. ;)

My point was that no one can state that their OWN opinion is "very objective" as we all bring our own biases to any issue.

The fact that you "don't lean either way and listen to other opinions" still doesn't make YOUR opinion an objective one.

Common Biases - ( New Window )
RE: Jonesí release time?  
hazydave : 8/10/2019 2:59 pm : link
In comment 14526029 NJBlueTuna said:
Quote:
Anyone with a scouts eye, or at least moreso than me, have a take on how quickly Jones get rid of the ball purely from a mechanics perspective? I know his mechanics are highly regarded, smooth repeatable delivery, but the release time and ability to process will make up for any velocity short comings.

Again, I think his arm is fine, itís just not an elite farve, Elway, Mahomes type of arm. Marino didnít have a cannon, but yet had the quickest delivery the NFL has ever seen from a mechanics perspective.


All good points. But let's be clear, Dan Marino absolutely did have a cannon for an arm (AND a quick release).
I recently  
Gman11 : 8/10/2019 5:05 pm : link
ran into a guy I know that has season tickets to Duke games. He asked me what I thought of Jones (this was prior to the game). I said that I had never seen him play so I don't have an opinion. He said, well a lot of the fans hated the pick. I replied that I trust the GM and coach with their analysis of the player a heck of a lot more than fans. He agreed.
Marino  
NJBlueTuna : 8/10/2019 8:32 pm : link
Lol, he did not have a ďcanonĒ for an arm. Arched every game of his starting at Pittsburgh and it as literally the fastest arm I ever saw and was ďbetter than averageĒ and not a cannon. Donít let the lore impact your opinion.



RE: I recently  
Zeke's Alibi : 8/10/2019 8:38 pm : link
In comment 14526225 Gman11 said:
Quote:
ran into a guy I know that has season tickets to Duke games. He asked me what I thought of Jones (this was prior to the game). I said that I had never seen him play so I don't have an opinion. He said, well a lot of the fans hated the pick. I replied that I trust the GM and coach with their analysis of the player a heck of a lot more than fans. He agreed.


Someone has Duke football season tickets? Do they pay him for this privilege?
Jones had a great first series ..  
Bluesbreaker : 8/11/2019 9:18 pm : link
I think that eased some of the speculation hopefully he
continues to grow , listening to some of his detractors
saying the TD pas should have been picked is just nonsense
it's pretty sad that who was it Carter saying it was a
racist pick my God that word has totally lost its meaning
so sick of hearing this crap .
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