Now that Preseason is done predict our record

I see this as a gritty game with them edging us out.

.

that's based on Eli playing every game.

Trying to accurately guess if and when a switch happens and the results after are above my predictive powers

Our defense is still rebuilding and offense will be inconsistent

Bettcher has his guys, albeit young, to accomplish what he did in Az..

Playoffs.

.

or 6 - 10.

9-7 with a chance at a wildcard. The offense is going to be able to move the ball and put points on the board. The defense will have its ups and downs, but will be good enough to keep us in games.

Looking forward to this season and seeing how it all plays out.

but he's not reporting to Ariens - I wish he was our head coach.

8-8

Arrow is pointing up... we just don't have the personnel to win 10+ and compete for the division yet.

Everyone should expect this team to be a real contender as soon as 2020, though. We're close.

We need pass rush help and more help at the 2nd level of the defense. A little more line depth on both sides, a true #1 WR. But outside of that stuff, we're not far off.

.

The young D will improve as the season progresses, but we still can’t cover a TE or get to the QB. Still won’t be able to get off the field on third down.

By the second game. If Jones then a playoff run with tiny bit of growing pains

same as last year.

Week 1 @ Cowboys L
Week 2 vs Bills W
Week 3 @ Bucs L
Week 4 vs Skins W
Week 5 vs Vikes W
Week 6 @ Pats L
Week 7 vs Cards W
Week 8 @ Lions L
Week 9 vs Cowboys W
Week 10 @ Jets W
Week 11 BYE
Week 12 @ Chi L
Week 13 vs Packers W
Week 14 @ Eagles L
Week 15 vs Dolphins W
Week 16 @ Skins L
Week 17 vs Eagles W

9-7

.

It is all on the D IMO. I hope they don't let Eli down.

I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly...

How do you guys see no improvement here from last year?

We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2...

This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done.

thing is usually pointless but i will say, this schedule is quite favorable. No west coast trips, no 3-4 game stretches against all really good teams, and our travel is pretty awesome throughout.

.

Week 1 @ Cowboys W Eli opened Jerrah's World with a win and starts his final season with a win signing the same spot in the locker room.
Week 2 vs Bills W
Week 3 @ Bucs W Winston feeds our young defensive secondary with turnovers.
Week 4 vs Skins W Fowers vs. DLaw. Keenum barely lives.
Week 5 vs Vikes W Captain Kirk still sucks.
Week 6 @ Pats L Checkmate by the Chessmaster
Week 7 vs Cards W
Week 8 @ Lions W
Week 9 vs Cowboys L Payback from Week 1.
Week 10 @ Jets W We peel back the curtains after Woody's lame attempt to hide our past glory.
Week 11 BYE
Week 12 @ Chi L
Week 13 vs Packers W Rodgers overrated.
Week 14 @ Eagles W - Wentz has missed Week 14 the past 2 years. He is still a China Doll and we steal the win from McCown.
Week 15 vs Dolphins W Tua is in their sights. They won't complicate matters with a win.
Week 16 @ Skins W Gruden has been fired. Keenum is on IR. The Sweaty Statue Sux.
Week 17 vs Eagles L. We rest our starters and DJ gets his first start.

.

but I think we steal a game we should lose. 9-7.

In comment 14550690 Diver_Down said:

Quote:

Week 1 @ Cowboys W Eli opened Jerrah's World with a win and starts his final season with a win signing the same spot in the locker room. Week 2 vs Bills W Week 3 @ Bucs W Winston feeds our young defensive secondary with turnovers. Week 4 vs Skins W Fowers vs. DLaw. Keenum barely lives. Week 5 vs Vikes W Captain Kirk still sucks. Week 6 @ Pats L Checkmate by the Chessmaster Week 7 vs Cards W Week 8 @ Lions W Week 9 vs Cowboys L Payback from Week 1. Week 10 @ Jets W We peel back the curtains after Woody's lame attempt to hide our past glory. Week 11 BYE Week 12 @ Chi L Week 13 vs Packers W Rodgers overrated. Week 14 @ Eagles W - Wentz has missed Week 14 the past 2 years. He is still a China Doll and we steal the win from McCown. Week 15 vs Dolphins W Tua is in their sights. They won't complicate matters with a win. Week 16 @ Skins W Gruden has been fired. Keenum is on IR. The Sweaty Statue Sux. Week 17 vs Eagles L. We rest our starters and DJ gets his first start.

puff puff give Mother fucka!!! I want some of that shit!!!

In comment 14550657 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

.

explain how you got here!

Offensive line is improved.

I choose to believe they will be good and not miserable.

In comment 14550702 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

I choose to believe they will be good and not miserable.

I see 8-8 as good. Especially from where we were two years ago.

is going to exceed expectations. I think our offense is going to be explosive this year. If our defense can be just average, we're going to surprise, I think.

Shurmur took over a 3-13 team with a brutal locker room. 5-11 last year. Anything 8 wins or over would be awesome in my opinion, with the notion that we are building for sustained success and a serious playoff contending team in 2020 with our cap space and DJ.

3-3 in NFC East, split with each team

7-3 against the rest, losses to Pats, Bears and one other of Bucs, Lions, Vikes (probably Vikes)

I think Giants are one of the teams that sneaks up on people this year

In comment 14550687 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly... How do you guys see no improvement here from last year? We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2... This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done.

OL depth is paper thin, plus people overrate the starters. Solder, if he plays like last year, is a liability and OC is even for the optimists, largely unknown.

WR depth is paper thin, and not very good

Pass rush is suspect

S position is questionable going from Collins to 36 year old Bethea

LB is still a weak unit

And Eli. Not going into this one, but I don't consider him a positive at this point.

the team improved, but I don't think they're a contender this year, and in the NFL it's a game of inches, 8 - 8 can be 5 - 11 with a few bad bounces and my prediction is the Giants will get those bad bounces.

I'd love to be proven wrong, but even optimistically I think 8 - 8 is best case

The Defense looks bad.

8-8

2nd year in the system for a bunch of guys and a sturdy o-line from the get go. The offense is much closer to the unit the back half of the season last year, not the first. The secondary isn't a joke this year -- that alone is worth an extra win. I expect Love and Ballentine to notch 10+ starts each.

The passing game is going to struggle. Shepard has never had to be the guy over 16 games, a lot rides on his and Engram's ability to draw out the extra defenders from the box.

I expect to see a defenses spy Barkley like a QB with a safety and force the Giants to beat them deeper.

The linebackers need to help out much more in coverage. The safeties last year were picking up a lot of slack. Peppers can't patrol the tight end area of the field on his own. I expect to see that as a big vulnerability.

predicting W/Ls by game.
We all should know by now that the NFL is a week by week affair. Injuries have major impacts on the games each week. No one has any idea what the situation will be 9 weeks from now.

In comment 14550716 pjcas18 said:

Quote:

In comment 14550687 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly... How do you guys see no improvement here from last year? We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2... This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done. OL depth is paper thin, plus people overrate the starters. Solder, if he plays like last year, is a liability and OC is even for the optimists, largely unknown. WR depth is paper thin, and not very good Pass rush is suspect S position is questionable going from Collins to 36 year old Bethea LB is still a weak unit And Eli. Not going into this one, but I don't consider him a positive at this point. the team improved, but I don't think they're a contender this year, and in the NFL it's a game of inches, 8 - 8 can be 5 - 11 with a few bad bounces and my prediction is the Giants will get those bad bounces. I'd love to be proven wrong, but even optimistically I think 8 - 8 is best case

We didn't even have 5 good offensive line starters last year, though. the secondary this year has a lot more than it had a year ago. I don't believe we've taken much of a step back @ either safety spot either (if any).

Eli might not be a 'positive' but is he a negative? He actually played fairly well last year. He didn't carry the team or win us games, but he certainly wasn't bad. And unlike last year, we actually have what appears to be a viable alternative should he falter.

LB is still weak - but it's certainly no worse than last year. I'd like to think we could see at least slight improvement there.

If we are no better this year than last year, I'll be very surprised - something will have to have gone fairly awry - like losing Barkley for me to see only 5 wins here.

I said very clearly that I don't think this is a contender. But 5 wins seems low and very pessimistic to me.

I think the Giants have a 9 win ceiling this year (this is like... minimal injuries, a few lucky bounces and things generally going our way)

So, I think 8 is realistic.

7 wouldn't surprise me.

But 6 wins or fewer, that would... I think this team is and should be better than that. We do not have a difficult schedule. No reason we shouldn't be better this year.

Next year is our year, but we'll play competitive football this year.

and the idea he’s for real, 10-6.

With Eli, 7-9.

But it could go either way a positive 7-9 or a disaster 3-13. Hard to get a true read..but Defense likely to be a major let down as season goes on

But would bet 6-10
7-9 maybe

Linebackers lead concerns about defense
Lots of hopes
But Hope is not a strategy

In comment 14550687 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly... How do you guys see no improvement here from last year? We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2... This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done.

Even if they were all complete assholes, a lot of talent walked out the door.

And jones isn't going to help us win games this year.

Predicting a poor year this year doesn't necessarily equate with the sentiment that the team isn't building towards something better.

Fuck it. Shoving the chips into the middle of the table.

* Barkley is going to be unstoppable
* The receivers, let by Engram, are going to do enough
* The defense will give up points but also create enough turnovers
* Cream puff schedule
* Eli will be fine, one last time

...Unless Bettcher is leaving a lot of tools in the bag, I see our DBs getting carved up and no pass rush. Really concerning.

So I see 6-10 with the Giants 3-6 before the Jets game. I can see Jones starting for that one, let him play against a lousy team for his first win.

In comment 14550762 ron mexico said:

Quote:

In comment 14550687 arcarsenal said: Quote: I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly... How do you guys see no improvement here from last year? We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2... This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done. Even if they were all complete assholes, a lot of talent walked out the door. And jones isn't going to help us win games this year. Predicting a poor year this year doesn't necessarily equate with the sentiment that the team isn't building towards something better.

Eh.. how much talent really walked out the door?

The Giants have been really bad for the majority of the last 6-7 years... did we really have a whole lot of talent to let walk away in the first place?

Beckham is gone... our WR group no longer has that top flight WR1 - but it's not like Tate and Shepard are bad players. Maybe Slayton can help.

I really don't think we're any weaker @ safety without Collins. I'd much rather have Peppers and Bethea than Collins and Riley.

BW Webb started 13 games opposite Jenkins last year. Don't you think the CB depth is markedly better now and restocked with young talent?

Isn't the OL better now?

Isn't the defensive line better now with the addition of Lawrence?

Where are we notably weaker now because of talent that left? I don't really see many arguments for that other than WR - and Beckham might just be addition by subtraction at this point. It's been nice to have this entire summer be about football and nothing else.

.

Get the legit start to take the helm. Could be a good transition or a nightmare..the main theme of 2019

In comment 14550687 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

I'm baffled by the 5 win predictions, quite honestly... How do you guys see no improvement here from last year? We also don't have a difficult schedule. There are a lot of winnable games. We play Miami, Arizona, Detroit, Washington x2... This probably isn't a playoff team, but I'm just not understanding how people who follow this team can feel like this team won't be any better than last years' when you consider that we've upgraded the OL, have a lot of young talent working in, and also have what looks to be a very viable solution @ QB should Eli struggle or not be able to get the job done.

38 year old Eli behind a line that I think some people are overrating here, with no legit number one receiver (and barring injury Eli will play until the Giants are out of playoff contention). A new secondary that will take time to gel. Questions about the pass rush. A head coach who has not exceeded 6-10 in three seasons. We traded away our best receiving threat. Will Barkley leap forward or have a sophomore slump? I would love to see this team exceed expectations but I don’t see it happening.

Defense will improve as the year goes on, but they're at least a year away from being good. Pass rush and linebacker coverage over the middle is lacking.

In comment 14550778 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

.

They went 1-3 with the one win coming against mark sanchez

O might have played better but the def was atrocious.

All that matters is how the offense performed without Beckham. Him being gone had no bearing on the defense... we already knew they were below average.

They didn't seem to miss him that much.... they looked like a more cohesive unit down the stretch and they put points on the board for the most part.

I really don't think we'll miss Beckham all that much, and I don't feel like a whole lot of talent left here. More entered than departed if you ask me...

Culture also matters. And there seems to be a very major difference in that department. All of these guys keep stressing the "team" aspect and you can even see in preseason that they all have eachother's backs.

It was cool to see Tate run out there and try to get Simonson the ball he caught for the TD when he was getting carted off.

It just seems like a much more cohesive team with the common goal of "TEAM" which I hadn't seen from these guys in recent years.

Jones plays sometime in November.

Eli I love you, but if you don't pull off a miracle playoff season including a post season win it's time to turn the page.

Skins 2x
Lions
Miami
Buffalo
Arizona
TB
Jets

These are probably the 8 easiest games on schedule. If the Giants want to be contenders for the playoffs, they need to win 5 of them.

Eagles 2x
Dallas 2x

Obviously the two best teams in the division. A split has to happen, because the next 4 can be rough.

NE
Minny
GB
Chicago

At NE, at Chicago are going to be absolutely brutal. Minny is more talented than us and GB has Rodgers who can pick us apart.

I dont see many wins there, so its tough to see us getting to 10. 8-8 is probably the best course.

In comment 14550808 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

All that matters is how the offense performed without Beckham. Him being gone had no bearing on the defense... we already knew they were below average. .

It’s not all about obj.
We have to play defense as well
Snacks, Collins and Vernon are talented guys.

Hey, I hope we can overcome a talent deficit with team work as well. But it seems like few teams other than the patriots pull that off.

In comment 14550821 ron mexico said:

Quote:

In comment 14550808 arcarsenal said: Quote: All that matters is how the offense performed without Beckham. Him being gone had no bearing on the defense... we already knew they were below average. . It’s not all about obj. We have to play defense as well Snacks, Collins and Vernon are talented guys. Hey, I hope we can overcome a talent deficit with team work as well. But it seems like few teams other than the patriots pull that off.

I understand that - but when it comes to Beckham, he only impacts one side of the ball one way or another. Regardless of him being here or not - the defense is totally independent of that.

I feel we've replaced Snacks with a younger, more versatile player in Lawrence who can play both NT and DE. Snacks is strictly a 2-down run stuffer. Our front now is cheaper and has more upside.

And yes, Collins is gone - but again - wouldn't you prefer Bethea/Peppers to Collins/Riley? I would. Peppers can actually cover. He's more versatile than Collins and Bethea is a pro's pro. Similar to what Deon Grant was when he was here.

I think the secondary as a whole is certainly better this year - or should be.

Vernon... yeah, we lost him, but the tradeoff was a massive upgrade @ RG. So, it wasn't just a one-sided scenario where a good player left and nothing good came back. It's not like he was great here anyway. He was overpaid and not worth the cap space when all was said and done. Good player who was being paid like a great one.

I agree we don't have the collective talent to win 10+ games or compete for a championship quite well - but I'm not sure we lost more talent than we brought in. In fact, I think the inverse is true.

Competitive and meaningful games late.

In comment 14550808 arcarsenal said:

Quote:

All that matters is how the offense performed without Beckham. Him being gone had no bearing on the defense... we already knew they were below average. They didn't seem to miss him that much.... they looked like a more cohesive unit down the stretch and they put points on the board for the most part. I really don't think we'll miss Beckham all that much, and I don't feel like a whole lot of talent left here. More entered than departed if you ask me... Culture also matters. And there seems to be a very major difference in that department. All of these guys keep stressing the "team" aspect and you can even see in preseason that they all have eachother's backs. It was cool to see Tate run out there and try to get Simonson the ball he caught for the TD when he was getting carted off. It just seems like a much more cohesive team with the common goal of "TEAM" which I hadn't seen from these guys in recent years.

they beat up on a redskins team that led the league in players on IR led by mr butt fumble. They were then shut out by the Titans. Following that the offense played decently against the colts and cowboys but could not take advantage of chances to win with the ball down one point at the end. Flash back to 2016, Odell would be the guy to pull off an insane catch and run late in the game to seal a number of wins. He’s a difference maker. We will see how this plays out but I think people are minimizing his loss. Most teams need to double cover him which opens things up for the rest of the offense.

Shit on scoring 40 points in 3 quarters on the road.

It’s just sad at this point.

probably worse.

Honestly don't care about the record, they aren't making the playoffs, just want Jones to get some experience.

With us coming on in '20.

;)

In comment 14550857 Les in TO said:

Quote:

In comment 14550808 arcarsenal said: Quote: All that matters is how the offense performed without Beckham. Him being gone had no bearing on the defense... we already knew they were below average. They didn't seem to miss him that much.... they looked like a more cohesive unit down the stretch and they put points on the board for the most part. I really don't think we'll miss Beckham all that much, and I don't feel like a whole lot of talent left here. More entered than departed if you ask me... Culture also matters. And there seems to be a very major difference in that department. All of these guys keep stressing the "team" aspect and you can even see in preseason that they all have eachother's backs. It was cool to see Tate run out there and try to get Simonson the ball he caught for the TD when he was getting carted off. It just seems like a much more cohesive team with the common goal of "TEAM" which I hadn't seen from these guys in recent years. they beat up on a redskins team that led the league in players on IR led by mr butt fumble. They were then shut out by the Titans. Following that the offense played decently against the colts and cowboys but could not take advantage of chances to win with the ball down one point at the end. Flash back to 2016, Odell would be the guy to pull off an insane catch and run late in the game to seal a number of wins. He’s a difference maker. We will see how this plays out but I think people are minimizing his loss. Most teams need to double cover him which opens things up for the rest of the offense.

Odell was not the same guy in 2018 that he was in 2016. Whether he ever is that guy again remains to be seen. He's still really good, but that explosion and burst we saw in 2016 where he was taking quick slants to the house just was not there.

And if he's such a difference maker, why did we get off to a 1-7 start? Obviously he wasn't moving the needle in terms of wins and losses.

I like big dex but it’s a stretch to think that as a rookie he will be more impactful than a multiple time all pro, and I doubt he plays more snaps than snacks this year barring injury

I don’t want to become know as that guy who hates peppers but my prediction for him this year is he will appear often in the highlight reels, occasionally doing something good for the giants.

The pass rush is non existent, the LBs are at best JAGs and there is a lot of inexperience in the secondary. Remember it only takes one guy making a mistake to give up a big play.

To me this all spells disaster on the def side of the ball

On O, is Zeiter a huge upgrade over the guard we picked up mid year? He played pretty well.

They should be able to play efficient mistake free ball, but Eli doesn’t have the ability or weapons to win a bunch of shoot outs.

Anywhere from 4-12 through 6-10

In comment 14550886 The_Boss said:

Quote:

Anywhere from 4-12 through 6-10

Nothing has changed? That's a joke right?

In comment 14550850 Sean said:

Quote:

Competitive and meaningful games late.

+1...that would set us up for some added confidence in 2020

Don’t think this team is very good, don’t believe in Shurmur. I think it was a mistake to not just go to Jones immediately but the Giants are completely unwilling to just rip the band-aid off with Eli.

I think our offense will put up points but our defense will give up more. Secondary hasn't had any time together with the injuries to Beal and Baker, Ballentine missing the start of camp; we may be able to clog up running lanes, but without a great pass rush, we'll need to blitz which will expose the young secondary.

In comment 14550886 The_Boss said:

Quote:

Anywhere from 4-12 through 6-10

I want to party with you, cowboy.

In comment 14550884 ron mexico said:

Quote:

I like big dex but it’s a stretch to think that as a rookie he will be more impactful than a multiple time all pro, and I doubt he plays more snaps than snacks this year barring injury I don’t want to become know as that guy who hates peppers but my prediction for him this year is he will appear often in the highlight reels, occasionally doing something good for the giants. The pass rush is non existent, the LBs are at best JAGs and there is a lot of inexperience in the secondary. Remember it only takes one guy making a mistake to give up a big play. To me this all spells disaster on the def side of the ball On O, is Zeiter a huge upgrade over the guard we picked up mid year? He played pretty well. They should be able to play efficient mistake free ball, but Eli doesn’t have the ability or weapons to win a bunch of shoot outs.

I don't think Dex having immediate impact is even close to a stretch. He's coming from a college team with championship pedigree. He's NFL-ready and will be a factor in Game 1. What Snacks has done in the past is irrelevant. All that matters is what each guy is going to do going forward - and if you gave me the choice, I am taking Lawrence. He's younger, he's cheaper, and he can play 3 downs.

I am willing to go out on a limb and say that Dexter Lawrence will have more of an impact than Damon Harrison does this season and be a better player. I believe that.

Also, you don't think Zeitler is a sizable upgrade over Jamon Brown? Brown did an admirable job for us last year, but Zeitler is the better player and by a decent margin.

Maybe the pass rush will be nonexistent, maybe it won't be. How do we know what Carter, Golden or Ximines will do?

Lastly, I doubt Peppers will be in highlights for bad reasons when it comes to coverage any more than Collins.

I find it strange that we seem to be looking at Collins as someone who wasn't flawed suddenly... he was poor in coverage. He had one really excellent year here. Otherwise, he was good. Not great. Near the box SS with a bad shoulder?

I'm confident saying that Collins will never replicate his 2016.

For all the talent we let walk out the door, Beckham is the only guy I don't feel we have a better player in place of now. And WR is the last position I am concerned with when it comes to offense.

I'm an optimist (and pretty much always predict 10-6).

.

I agree with that - he was not the same player last year compared to pre injury at least towards the beginning of the year. The entire offense struggled. That said, he started to come on before the quad injury, threw two touchdown passes that were partially available because of the attention defenses provided. Made some big catches in the games the Giants did win.

I understand the logic of trading him but it’s a loss and I think he’s going to have a huge year in Cleveland even if it’s like a gulag for him :)

But blocking largely has a binary outcome, either you do your job good enough or you don't. The fact that zeiter will be able to do his job slightly better in a slightly more consistent basis is not going to be transformative.

I'm not saying peppers was a perfect player and I agree he won't replicate 2016, but peppers needs to cover the run as well as the pass and I'm not as convinced as you guys that he will be a plus cover guy. If you want to prepare yourself for the downside, watch the the KC Cle highlights from last year. Some really really bad play there.

But I agree I rather have dex than snacks at this point and he could match his impact this year and will certainly pass him going forward. so I'll give you that point.

In comment 14550778 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

.

I get that feeling, but Beckham was also a huge part of 4 of the 5 wins the Giants had.

They might have been more balanced, but he and Barkley were the only difference makers.

I take a step back and think, if Barkley is bottled up, now what.

In comment 14550965 christian said:

Quote:

In comment 14550778 Britt in VA said: Quote: . I get that feeling, but Beckham was also a huge part of 4 of the 5 wins the Giants had. They might have been more balanced, but he and Barkley were the only difference makers. I take a step back and think, if Barkley is bottled up, now what.

Then I think Eli will do what Eli does best, find the open guy, regardless of the name on the jersey.

In comment 14550890 ryanmkeane said:

Quote:

In comment 14550886 The_Boss said: Quote: Anywhere from 4-12 through 6-10 Nothing has changed? That's a joke right?

No not a joke. I’ve maintained all spring and summer that this is still one of the 5-10 worst teams in the league. Nothing I’ve seen in preseason has changed my opinion. They’ll play hard, no doubt. But that alone won’t overcome the talent shortages at WR, LB, and rushing the passer. I saw our starting DL get run on a bunch this preseason too, and by 2nd stringers (Chicago). I’m also not expecting a 38 year old QB to start playing well again after years of poor play. Now can I be wrong? Sure. Of course I can. But I’ve been right every year I’ve participated in this yearly exercise of predicting the team’s record on BBI.

.

Is our defense that much, or any better then the same time last year? Poor depth on the defensive line, one of the worst linebacking corps in the league and some very inexperience in the secondary. Will they ever get off the field?

I think our defense while porous will be better for the addition of our new DBs, but without a pass rush or athletic LBs we will be exploited once again. One more draft anf FA period and we'll be competitive in the division.

In comment 14550968 Britt in VA said:

Quote:

In comment 14550965 christian said: Quote: In comment 14550778 Britt in VA said: Quote: . I get that feeling, but Beckham was also a huge part of 4 of the 5 wins the Giants had. They might have been more balanced, but he and Barkley were the only difference makers. I take a step back and think, if Barkley is bottled up, now what. Then I think Eli will do what Eli does best, find the open guy, regardless of the name on the jersey.

I unfortunately think he isn't seeing the field like he used to.

I'm no expert. It to my untrained eye, instances where he doesn't go to the best option keep popping up more and more.

6 wins at worst
9 with luck.

I honestly don't care, just no 1-7, 0-6 starts please. With this schedule that would be a disaster and trigger another coaching change

(or 7-9 if we get fooked by the officials more than average)

Eliminated from wild card by Eagles in week 17. I get in a fist fight in the parking lot no the way out of that game and go to jail.

Still not sold on beating the Cowgirls or Filthy at all though.

Week 1 @ Cowboys L
Week 2 vs Bills W
Week 3 @ Bucs W
Week 4 vs Skins W
Week 5 vs Vikes L
Week 6 @ Pats L
Week 7 vs Cards W
Week 8 @ Lions W
Week 9 vs Cowboys L
Week 10 @ Jets W
Week 11 BYE
Week 12 @ Chi L
Week 13 vs Packers W
Week 14 @ Eagles L
Week 15 vs Dolphins W
Week 16 @ Skins W
Week 17 vs Eagles L

agree that 8-8 seems likely. We're still a year away.

2nd worst team in the league? MY ASS.

In comment 14551046 ron mexico said:

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In comment 14550968 Britt in VA said: Then I think Eli will do what Eli does best, find the open guy, regardless of the name on the jersey. I unfortunately think he isn't seeing the field like he used to. I'm no expert. It to my untrained eye, instances where he doesn't go to the best option keep popping up more and more.

This assumes and involves what I believe will make or break this season; over 16 games do the Giants have a group that can consistently get open in the pass game and consistently make make plays?

WR 3-6 on this team are either low pick rookies or career bottom-of-the-roster. Will these guys become something they've never been in their careers; consistent reliable targets. One those guys will be a starter until Tate comes back. One of those guys will be on the field a lot as the #3 WR.

A lot has been made of the 3/4 of the games Beckham missed last year, and how well the offense played. We don't need to re-litigate each of those games -- the real question is among that group are they more likely to be who a few were over 3 games or their whole career.

In comment 14550702 Britt in VA said:

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I choose to believe they will be good and not miserable.

+1!

In comment 14550956 Anakim said:

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.

Don't you mean 23-0?

but our schedule really looks like a cake-walk this season, so 7-9 or even 8-8 is not really out of the question. Wouldn't be at all shocked to see us go 4-12 either though.

I think a lot of people here are just counting on the best case scenario across the board. A perfect example is Remmers. Everyone's assuming he's going to be this great upgrade at RT. He might be, but he's been truly awful the past two years. Plus he's coming off a back injury. We're all just assuming he becomes the player he was 3 years ago at RT. What if he sucks? Or gets hurt? Would put a major dent in our offense.

Also, our defense has the potential to be one of the worst in the league. We might very well have the worst pass rush in the league. That's kind of a big deal. We also have one of the worst groups of LBer's in the league, which is kind of a problem when you're running a 3-4 defense. Do we even have a single pro-bower on defense?

Having said that I'm honestly very excited for the season....I do think the arrow is pointed in the right direction....lots of good young talent....but we've got a ways to go yet in my opinion.

Eli's last game will come week 6 vs the Pats....that's my prediction.

In comment 14551107 christian said:

Quote:

In comment 14551046 ron mexico said: Quote: In comment 14550968 Britt in VA said: Then I think Eli will do what Eli does best, find the open guy, regardless of the name on the jersey. I unfortunately think he isn't seeing the field like he used to. I'm no expert. It to my untrained eye, instances where he doesn't go to the best option keep popping up more and more. This assumes and involves what I believe will make or break this season; over 16 games do the Giants have a group that can consistently get open in the pass game and consistently make make plays? WR 3-6 on this team are either low pick rookies or career bottom-of-the-roster. Will these guys become something they've never been in their careers; consistent reliable targets. One those guys will be a starter until Tate comes back. One of those guys will be on the field a lot as the #3 WR. A lot has been made of the 3/4 of the games Beckham missed last year, and how well the offense played. We don't need to re-litigate each of those games -- the real question is among that group are they more likely to be who a few were over 3 games or their whole career.

yup. This and the fact that some people think the Giants offensive line will look like the cowboys are why I’m also not expecting a return to a winning season.

The 49ers got rid of TO in part because of his diva ways and his desire to leave. They went from 7-9 in his last season to 2-14. Meanwhile he took the Eagles yo the brink of winning the Super Bowl. Not saying that the situations are identical; this Giants team does have talent on paper and the Niners also let Garcia go that offseason. But I won’t be surprised if our record is in the same ballpark as last season. Culture is important but so are elite playmakers

To the folks who are the polyannas on this thread...
(and I use the term polyanna as it was on here back in the 90s when we had the polyanna vs. realist debates, and the polyannas wore the label proudly! :) So don't be offended by the term)

Every year is different. Comparing to last year is a bit of a fools errand. Our record may not be much better and yet the Giants may be a significantly better team. Here's why.

1) Lets not forget that the Giants were more or less gifted 4 wins last year play against backup QBs and teams that were severely hurting in general (moreso than the Giants were when they played them, the Giant's injuries came after those wins). So personally I don't view last year's team as a 5 - 11 team. I think it was more like a 2 or 3 win team.

2) There is a lot of young talent on the Giants, that's a good thing - the needle is moving in the right direction. However the downside of that, is there are going to be lots of mistakes as these players transition to young vets. The Secondary is littered with rookies (I am including Beal in that). Expect rookie mistakes. The only pass rushers are Zo and X. Again I think they will improve over time, but they need that time. It's going to be a very bad combination of a poor pass rush, and rookie coverage mistakes.

3) Exacerbating 2, Jenkins and Bethea are on the downsides of their careers. They may still be good players, but they won't be the players they were in the past.

4) The OL on paper is far superior to last years version. Even the improved version that ended the season. Doing nothing but replacing Wheeler with a player that belongs in the NFL is a huge upgrade, not to mention Zeitler. However, they still need to play together and gel. Only Solder and Hernandez spent significant time together last year. It will take time before this line comes together. Also, Solder and Remmers are on the wrong side of 30, they can break down without notice, and there is very little backing them up. If either goes down, this offense is in big trouble.

5) Special teams were significantly better than league average last year (Football outsiders had us ranked 3rd). Our punter is meh, and we lost some of the special teams aces, and going into the year the players we were counting on for ST are banged up. Expect Special Team play to revert to somewhere near average (although Rohas is awesome, so maybe a bit above)

So I don't see 6 - 10 as showing no improvement. In fact, I see 6 - 10 as proof that the team is moving in the right direction. I see going from what I believe was really a 2 or 3 win team with very little talent, to a 9 or 10 win team as unrealistic. Going to a 6 win team this year and 9 or 10 wins next year is perfectly within reason.

WRs are mediocre at best, line is better but not actually good, I suspect the defense will be trash again.

than several of our opponents'.

10-6 if all goes right and we are in the playoffs
6-10 if all goes wrong

i know, not very in depth analysis, but this would be the standard deviation. any other record would be freaky. :)

Defense is very young and inexperienced, struggles early but is better in the second half of the season.

As the secondary firms up, the pass rush will seem to improve. In reality, the pass rush will be the same but there will be more coverage sacks.

From the start of the season, the offense will be better than most people think, mostly because of upgraded line and Barkley. They will miss OBJ's big-play ability but not as much as some think.

There's going to be a point in the first half of the season where the team's record says it's time to play Jones, but Eli's playing too well to sit him down. They will stick with Eli.

A lot like 2018, 2019 will feature a slow start and a faster finish. Media will overreact to the slow start.

The team sticks together throughout and never quits on Shurmur.

In comment 14550794 rnargi said:

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Defense will improve as the year goes on, but they're at least a year away from being good. Pass rush and linebacker coverage over the middle is lacking.

Spot on.
6-10 to 8-8.

And I actually think a quantum leap ala 2016 to 10-6 and a wild card would be WORSE long term.
I don’t want this franchise getting ahead of itself and thinking they’re one step away too soon.

is about right.

9-7 I was thinking more on the line of 6-10
but with Eli looking sharp behind a revamped line
influx of youth and talent good mix of veterans .
If we stay healthy BIG IF especially the O-line
I think were gonna surprise a few teams looking
for a breakout MVP season from Barkley young
and second season with the new system and better culture.
With a little luck we could secure a wildcard .

Week 1 @ Cowboys - Prescott W
Week 2 vs Bills - Allen W
Week 3 @ Bucs - Winston W
Week 4 vs Skins - Keenum W
Week 5 vs Vikes - Cousins W
Week 6 @ Pats - Brady L
Week 7 vs Cards - Murray W
Week 8 @ Lions - Stafford W
Week 9 vs Cowboys - Prescott W
Week 10 @ Jets - Darnold W
Week 11 BYE - W
Week 12 @ Bears - Trubisky W
Week 13 vs Packers - Rodgers L
Week 14 @ Eagles - Wentz W
Week 15 vs Dolphins - Rosen W
Week 16 @ Skins - Haskins W
Week 17 vs Eagles - McCown W

15-2 record and an NFC wild card berth. 🤓 #TGIF

Giants start hot but fizzle. Jones steering week 14. If Zeke doesn't sign by habe 1 I think we win that and go 8-8 with a possibility of 9-7. In that case Jones starts the final game.

Don't see much better than that at this point.

In comment 14551729 Q v2.0 said:

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Week 1 @ Cowboys - Prescott W Week 2 vs Bills - Allen W Week 3 @ Bucs - Winston W Week 4 vs Skins - Keenum W Week 5 vs Vikes - Cousins W Week 6 @ Pats - Brady L Week 7 vs Cards - Murray W Week 8 @ Lions - Stafford W Week 9 vs Cowboys - Prescott W Week 10 @ Jets - Darnold W Week 11 BYE - W Week 12 @ Bears - Trubisky W Week 13 vs Packers - Rodgers L Week 14 @ Eagles - Wentz W Week 15 vs Dolphins - Rosen W Week 16 @ Skins - Haskins W Week 17 vs Eagles - McCown W 15-2 record and an NFC wild card berth. 🤓 #TGIF

15-2? Counting the Bye is a bit over-the-top optimism. Even still I would be shocked that 14-2 is only good for a Wildcard.

...if I'm being pessimistic.

I'm liking the team and think they will get better throughout the season.
10-6 seems good to me.

With the D being the thing that could swing us a little under that if they dont gel quickly enough

Sure hope I’m wrong. My wife and kids would say that I probably am.

seems possible with a good bounce or two. Our offense will be much better (more versatile sans OBJ) with a strong OL, and Barkley. Of course, a key injury or two will limit our chances.

Same answer as last time. Let's Go Giants!

Wildcard, Super Bowl, Eli signs 5 year extension, BBI hamster explodes.

6-10

.

I love Eli and hope he goes out with a big season like #11 did, but I would bet that DJ is playing by week 7 and Shurmurs job will depend on how well he progresses.

Maybe just maybe 7-9 if they get some breaks that they didn’t get last year. 8-8 if they far exceed the collective talent on the team

Take that number and add 2-3 wins...

No pass rush & a spotty secondary will hurt the most.
7-9,8-8 makes sense.It was a bad move to go to a 3-4 from
a 4-3 and then trade away your best defense personnel.
D.Jones will start by game 9 or sooner.

Not a real contender yet, but a much better team overall than last year's garbage, and with an easier schedule, too.

They will manage to lose a couple of games that they should have won, but they just might steal a game or two that they should have lost.

I'd say 7 to 9 wins is about right.

4 and 7 under Eli and 2 and 3 under Jones

at Dallas - Loss
Buffalo - Win
at Tampa Bay - Win
Washington - Win
Minnesota - Loss
at New England - Loss
Arizona - Win
@ Detroit - Loss
Dallas - Loss
@ Jets - Loss
@ Chicago - Loss
Green Bay - Loss
@ Philly - Loss
Miami - Win
@ Washington - Win
Philly - Loss

Detroit game is kind of a toss up, I can see you winning that one and getting to 7-9

In comment 14556809 fanofthejets said:

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@ Jets - Loss

Shocked that you would pick this.

In comment 14552145 Jimmy Googs said:

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Take that number and add 2-3 wins...

You also have to look into the almanac to see how much it will be raining and or snowing in East Rutherford on those dates.

In comment 14556817 figgy2989 said:

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In comment 14556809 fanofthejets said: Quote: @ Jets - Loss Shocked that you would pick this.

Most unbiased people would. The Jets are no great shakes but have more talent then the Giants and are better coached

I'm not sure how this defense is going to stop anyone. There's just not enough talent there. The offense will have its moments (especially with Barkley), but Eli is another year older and our best WR was traded away. Overall, this just doesn't look like a winning team to me. Ideally, they'll prove me wrong and we'll see the recent draftees excel.

Hopefully, we at least get a real look at Jones this year if the team doesn't surprise and contend for the playoffs.

An optimistic 7-9, could be 4-12 too.

It will be interesting to see when they pull the plug on Eli. Cards game is the first chance we could see DJ, barring a total September disaster. He would have 10 days to prep. Tough call, I have them .500 at that point. I'm being optimistic though, the Bills and Bucs are decent teams who could beat us (possibly easily). We are "W's" on their projections.

We'll see. Rooting for one more magical run from #10...

Week 1 @ Cowboys L
Week 2 vs Bills W
Week 3 @ Bucs W
Week 4 vs Skins W
Week 5 vs Vikes L
Week 6 @ Pats L
Week 7 vs Cards W (Its possible DJ starts at this point or any game thereafter)
Week 8 @ Lions L
Week 9 vs Cowboys L
Week 10 @ Jets W
Week 11 BYE
Week 12 @ Chi L
Week 13 vs Packers L
Week 14 @ Eagles L
Week 15 vs Dolphins W (DJ absolutely starts by this game, unless Eli is leading them on an unbelievable run, which is unlikely.)
Week 16 @ Skins W
Week 17 vs Eagles L

I am hopeful of one surprise win vs either the Cowboys or the Eagles to push us to 9-7.

In comment 14556841 fanofthejets said:

Quote:

In comment 14556817 figgy2989 said: Quote: In comment 14556809 fanofthejets said: Quote: @ Jets - Loss Shocked that you would pick this. Most unbiased people would. The Jets are no great shakes but have more talent then the Giants and are better coached

You refer to yourself as unbiased and then try to claim that the Jets have more talent? Lol, you continue to embarrass yourself with each post. For the 100th time why are you on a Giants message board to praise the Jets?

In comment 14556841 fanofthejets said:

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In comment 14556817 figgy2989 said: Quote: In comment 14556809 fanofthejets said: Quote: @ Jets - Loss Shocked that you would pick this. Most unbiased people would. The Jets are no great shakes but have more talent then the Giants and are better coached

Better coached?

that is hysterical

I don't see the defense being any good, mostly because I think they'll struggle to generate a pass rush. The secondary seems to have been improved, but it's unproven and they're going to have to hold longer than it's reasonable to expect from them.

On O, maybe a slight improvement from last year with an improved OL. The WR position needs improvement, and defenses are going to key in on Barkley.

Anything more than that is gravy I guess. It will be an interesting experiment to see if culture trumps talent. I think the implication was we had some good players who weren't focused on winning, and that the right attitudes are in the door now. Let's see how much attitude buys them. I'm guessing some, but not a lot.

Schedule looks friendly. I dont think they are ready to play with the big boys yet, that's next year.

....