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NGT: In defense of Antonio Brown

weaverpsu : 9/5/2019 2:51 pm
A lot of us, including me are coming down pretty hard on AB right now. I recently have realized, through introspection and having deep conversations with others, that everything we have experienced in life contributes to who we are as human beings.

Antonio Brown did not have his father in his life at a young age, he grew up in a rough neighborhood, and when his mother re-married, he essentially got thrown out of his house and was homeless for about 6 months as a teenager.

I would just like us, including me, to be more thoughtful when we are bashing another human being. AB has not had a wonderful upbringing and who he is today is certainly a result of this.

I'll just reiterate again. I'm including myself in this criticism. Because of my recent change or perspective and my experience as a teacher, I googled him and it definitely shed some light on his character and recent troubles.
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RE: Iím all for  
FranchiseQB : 9/5/2019 3:43 pm : link
In comment 14560018 Les in TO said:
Quote:
Understanding what a person has gone through in life to find out what makes them tick. That said, itís hard to draw a straight line between his tough teenage years to his current meltdown. Especially given all the success heís had along the way. I donít know if itís substance abuse or sulkiness about ending up in Oakland but heís being a jerk

By contrast, look at Warrick Dunn. He had to raise his siblings at the age of 18 after his mom was murdered. He has started a number of charities and by all accounts is a living saint.


Or maybe Brown has a serious brain injury. Remember Chris Henry?
RE: I'd buy that  
Kev in Cali : 9/5/2019 3:43 pm : link
In comment 14559931 Matt in SGS said:
Quote:
for him going to college and even coming into the NFL. He's a 31 year old man at this stage who is entering his 10th year in the NFL and has been in the spotlight (and paid accordingly) for a number of those years.

I'd expect someone in their 10th year in the NFL and beyond his 30th birthday to act like a professional.

I'd buy more into the fact that he might have mental illness or CTE that is causing this.


I'd lean this way too....irritable over pennies compared to what he makes annually?!?!
RE: RE: Iím all for  
Les in TO : 9/5/2019 3:51 pm : link
In comment 14560022 FranchiseQB said:
Quote:
In comment 14560018 Les in TO said:


Quote:


Understanding what a person has gone through in life to find out what makes them tick. That said, itís hard to draw a straight line between his tough teenage years to his current meltdown. Especially given all the success heís had along the way. I donít know if itís substance abuse or sulkiness about ending up in Oakland but heís being a jerk

By contrast, look at Warrick Dunn. He had to raise his siblings at the age of 18 after his mom was murdered. He has started a number of charities and by all accounts is a living saint.




Or maybe Brown has a serious brain injury. Remember Chris Henry?
could be a brain injury or CTE too. Either way his behaviour is bizarre and probably worthy of a proper professional exam
well, Mr. Weaver, congrats  
Bill in UT : 9/5/2019 4:02 pm : link
You have, in the course of 2 days, stolen my title for dumbest post ever. I'll be sending the trophy along as soon as it gets here from Jimmy
I saw some reddit post  
tbonfig : 9/5/2019 4:07 pm : link
a while ago that linked all of his ridiculous behavior dating back to that nasty hit by Vontaze Burfict.
This is the NFL, a game played by many people with rough upbringings  
BestFeature : 9/5/2019 4:07 pm : link
Brown isn't special.
RE: Are you serious?  
micky : 9/5/2019 4:08 pm : link
In comment 14559920 figgy2989 said:
Quote:
There are many other stories of professional athletes who had hard upbringings and don't act like assholes.


Everyone handles things differently. Whether good or bad.
You're Kidding Right?  
Bernie : 9/5/2019 4:11 pm : link
Another justification for not taking responsibility for one's own actions. The good 'ol blame game.

We all would agree that no child or human being should be treated the way he was growing up. But he overcame and made something of himself. That should be celebrated. To now go in reverse and then blame the behavior on his childhood is down right absurd and pathetic. I have no sympathy.
As Harry Carson would say  
Coach Red Beaulieu : 9/5/2019 4:14 pm : link
He's a grown ass man. Who cares.
RE: Nothing wrong  
DonQuixote : 9/5/2019 4:17 pm : link
In comment 14559990 FranchiseQB said:
Quote:
With having sympathy for someone. Everybody's hot take is to hate or laugh to the max. Something's up with this guy. He may not be well. It's ok to wonder about it and have an open mind without condoning his ludicrous conduct.


I agree with this and the OP. You are not excusing someoneís behavior by seeking to understand it. Weeks ago I posted best wishes to AB because I saw signs of mental illness and wished him and his family the best. BBI raked me in get the coals. It is just what I saw, I wish him well.

It is totally appropriate to look at someoneís background, see complexities there, and hope they can sort it out. Itís not making excuses or normalizing their behavior.
RE: RE: RE: RE: He threatened to punch Mayock in the face yesterday  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/5/2019 4:18 pm : link
In comment 14560010 Motley Two said:
Quote:
In comment 14559994 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


In comment 14559988 Motley Two said:


Quote:


In comment 14559981 Dave in Hoboken said:


Quote:


in front of the team. It's funny how some are willing to make excuses for him yet still to this day whine about Beckham, who was never anywhere near as bad as this guy. Imagine if Odell threatened to punch someone in management's face?



Probably net him better results than punching a wall.



Definitely the same as threatening to punch a fellow employee in the face. Like, for sure.



Oh yes. Seriously. Seriously?


Like, for sure. Seriously, seriously.
Pittsburgh sportswriter-  
DanMetroMan : 9/5/2019 4:20 pm : link

Dejan Kovacevic
@Dejan_Kovacevic

18m
I'm thinking about that day in New Orleans. AB was brilliant. Unstoppable. Steelers would've won but for a blown call. That's why Mike Tomlin managed AB the way he did. Worth it? Debatable. But did Tomlin actually manage AB? Hell yes. Way better than anyone else ever will. 1/3
Dejan Kovacevic
@Dejan_Kovacevic
Afterward, the reputations of Tomlin, Ben Roethlisberger, even the Steelers as a collective institution were ripped apart by the national media. For what everyone here knew all along was the behavior of one completely berserk individual. They were wrong. All of them. 2/3
4:04 PM ∑ Sep 5, 2019∑Twitter Web App
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Retweets
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Likes
Dejan Kovacevic
@Dejan_Kovacevic

12m
Replying to
@Dejan_Kovacevic
And I might add, though it's unimportant to most, the local reporters who cover the Steelers in person and daily were dragged through the social mud as being out of touch or in denial over this alleged circus that was always just the one clown. Local had it right. As usual. 3/3
Steelers; Big Ben, Tomin: 1  
Dave in Hoboken : 9/5/2019 4:27 pm : link
Antonio Brown: 0
All the talent in the world  
uconngiant : 9/5/2019 4:39 pm : link
but he is not right mentally at all. He is wasting his chance to prove the Steelers wrong and is proving everyone who said he was a cancer correct
People raised similar to AB  
mrvax : 9/5/2019 4:40 pm : link
could have woken up one day, dropped to their knees and thanked God for the wonderful situation he is now in. It's time, IMO, for AB to give back to youths who are in a similar predicament to what he came from.
there is another guy  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 5:02 pm : link
who had all that happen to him at an even earlier age.

Lost his brother and sister and mother and fought with his father

as a result he had a total of one year of formal schooling in several different schools in several different places. All the rest was self taught.

Lost his first fiancť. Lost children. Had many different jobs.

Modern day would clearly diagnose him as PTSD and deep depression

His name was Abraham Lincoln.

yeah yeah Brown is not Lincoln. But he is not being asked to save a nation....just follow some rules to make millions.

Bad comparison but in there is two insights: 1) Brown has choices and 2) His is not the worse deal anyone ever got in life

.  
arcarsenal : 9/5/2019 5:02 pm : link
At some point, he needs to own his bullshit and grow up. This isn't how a man in his 30's should be acting.

He's an asshole.

I didn't have a "wonderful upbringing" either. I have no relationship with my own father. I don't use that as an excuse to be a bad person or spit in the face of people who have faith in me or invest in me like he's doing here.

I'm always sympathetic to people who come from broken homes, have tough childhoods, don't have great guidance growing up, etc. It's not easy for everyone. I get it. But I'm not just going to entirely absolve someone and just give them carte blanche to be a fucking jackass in all facets of life.

Brown needs to grow up. He signed a contract. If he wasn't going to be able to hold up his end of it, he shouldn't have agreed to it. He doesn't deserve all of the excuse making.
Speaking as one  
g56blue10 : 9/5/2019 5:05 pm : link
Who had less then a spectacular up bringing, you can only blame your childhood so long. Eventually you are an adult and you have to be held responsible for your choices. I will avoid getting on my soapbox and get into how this type of treatment of people is a problem with society today
RE: there is another guy  
DonQuixote : 9/5/2019 5:21 pm : link
In comment 14560156 Bill2 said:
Quote:
who had all that happen to him at an even earlier age.

Lost his brother and sister and mother and fought with his father

as a result he had a total of one year of formal schooling in several different schools in several different places. All the rest was self taught.

Lost his first fiancť. Lost children. Had many different jobs.

Modern day would clearly diagnose him as PTSD and deep depression

His name was Abraham Lincoln.

yeah yeah Brown is not Lincoln. But he is not being asked to save a nation....just follow some rules to make millions.

Bad comparison but in there is two insights: 1) Brown has choices and 2) His is not the worse deal anyone ever got in life


Seriously dude...there are a lot of us out here who are not Abraham f---ing Lincoln.
I am  
PaulN : 9/5/2019 5:22 pm : link
No rock thrower and will never pretend to be an expert in human behavior, but did he not attend a college, did he not already play pro ball, did he not sign a contract? The one thing I will add is my inability to have any sympathy for the Raiders, as a popular T-shirt says, Iwill refrase, hire a clown, expect a circus.
Don  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 6:22 pm : link
what in the world would annoy you about that post???

The point is not Lincoln ..Dude  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 6:24 pm : link
The point is the last sentence ...Dude
I think the point is  
gidiefor : Mod : 9/5/2019 6:28 pm : link
that no matter what your circumstances are growing up -- you have a choice as to how you handle yourself and the choices that you make
RE: RE: there is another guy  
arcarsenal : 9/5/2019 6:29 pm : link
In comment 14560180 DonQuixote said:
Quote:
In comment 14560156 Bill2 said:


Quote:


who had all that happen to him at an even earlier age.

Lost his brother and sister and mother and fought with his father

as a result he had a total of one year of formal schooling in several different schools in several different places. All the rest was self taught.

Lost his first fiancť. Lost children. Had many different jobs.

Modern day would clearly diagnose him as PTSD and deep depression

His name was Abraham Lincoln.

yeah yeah Brown is not Lincoln. But he is not being asked to save a nation....just follow some rules to make millions.

Bad comparison but in there is two insights: 1) Brown has choices and 2) His is not the worse deal anyone ever got in life




Seriously dude...there are a lot of us out here who are not Abraham f---ing Lincoln.


You don't need to be Abraham Lincoln to have self-awareness, be responsible for the shit you put out into the world, or act like an adult.
I did not have it easy growing up...  
.McL. : 9/5/2019 6:31 pm : link
And there was a time when days went by and I didn't have money for food. Nearly went homeless at 18.

Does that mean you guys are going to cut me some slack the next time I post about devaluing RBs?

No?

Didin't think so...
McL  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 6:34 pm : link
You always get slack from me because I know you are trying to add value and look behind the obvious.

So any grief you get is intended to be debate about the content

RE: McL  
crick n NC : 9/5/2019 6:44 pm : link
In comment 14560258 Bill2 said:
Quote:
You always get slack from me because I know you are trying to add value and look behind the obvious.

So any grief you get is intended to be debate about the content


Bill, in this situation the obvious is Browns bad attitude or even his mental state. The easiest and simplest thing to do is judge him as a bad human being and move on. But what about looking past the obvious in this situation?
RE: McL  
.McL. : 9/5/2019 6:47 pm : link
In comment 14560258 Bill2 said:
Quote:
You always get slack from me because I know you are trying to add value and look behind the obvious.

So any grief you get is intended to be debate about the content

Bill, you are may favorite poster to have a discussion with. You always make me think harder!
Brown gets paid Hundreds of Millions to play a game  
PatersonPlank : 9/5/2019 6:54 pm : link
and he's still being a moron. I would love to switch places with him. Talk about "Eliteism". Oh, even though I'm being paid $30M per year mu helmet doesn't fit, so I'm not playing. Or my boss yelled at me, so I'm not playing. He's 30 years old, grow up.
personal  
madgiantscow009 : 9/5/2019 6:56 pm : link
responsibility.
crick  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 6:57 pm : link
that's a point I agree with

I thought the OP did that and peeled the onion further. Good job generating thinking

Then when people thought about it...they bought up limits to the degree of sympathy due ( from what we can see....we have no idea if his personal life comines at this time to put him in very high stress reversion to worst tendencies he ( and we all have) has from the past.

So second layer of the onion or layered conjecture was discussed by many...many thought Ok...sympathy...but limited because self responsibility still matters

So far pretty thoughtful discussion if you ask me.

But its easy to miss things on the internet so what am I missing?
Of course upbringing is important.  
eclipz928 : 9/5/2019 7:03 pm : link
That's why we should all strive to be good parents to our children, and a positive influence on others.

But as an adult, if you're not meeting the societal expectations of being responsible, respectful and law-abiding there is no excuse. You don't get to blame it on your circumstances.
FOR THE LOVE OF GOD...  
jonnyess : 9/5/2019 7:05 pm : link
AB acts like Omarosa is his agent!
RE: crick  
crick n NC : 9/5/2019 7:08 pm : link
In comment 14560286 Bill2 said:
Quote:
that's a point I agree with

I thought the OP did that and peeled the onion further. Good job generating thinking

Then when people thought about it...they bought up limits to the degree of sympathy due ( from what we can see....we have no idea if his personal life comines at this time to put him in very high stress reversion to worst tendencies he ( and we all have) has from the past.

So second layer of the onion or layered conjecture was discussed by many...many thought Ok...sympathy...but limited because self responsibility still matters

So far pretty thoughtful discussion if you ask me.

But its easy to miss things on the internet so what am I missing?


I interpret the majority of replies as saying "So what about how he was brought up?" Perhaps it wasn't meant how I read it, always a possibility.

There didn't seem to be much consideration to what a person endures in my view. Consequences for how he has acted should happen in any case.
AB  
Dragon : 9/5/2019 7:11 pm : link
Has forgotten the game is bigger than himself. No idea about his problems in life really donít care many NFL players are a few steps away from being problems in todayís society. I would just rather see AB on the football field where he excels and less time In the eyes of the media.
it's weird people still whine about  
FranchiseQB : 9/5/2019 7:14 pm : link
ABs actions. I think it is highly likely there is something wrong with him (ie, brain injury). Early in his career he was a solid citizen. ex-players with cte have threatened and abused family members and it is completely out of their control.
crick  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 7:18 pm : link
sorry, read into the thread differently.

I agree that his circumstances might make coping hard especially when a life lesson learned early is that defiance is a weapon when circumstances seem complex and being accommodating is associated with weakness. I get that. Could all just be seen as a giant "respect" issue.

with all apologies to Dylan: "just when you have lost everything, you find out you can always lose a little more" may be in his case it looks like: "just when you have lost something they try to take a lot more"

I dunno. tough to get into ones 30's before being able to see things clearly and craft compromises that work to your benefit.

Take care
pretty soon  
mdc1 : 9/5/2019 7:19 pm : link
we can add that he missed practice for a few days and was abducted by aliens. fucking nutcase.
Franchise  
Bill2 : 9/5/2019 7:19 pm : link
that's a possibility
RE: crick  
crick n NC : 9/5/2019 7:41 pm : link
In comment 14560310 Bill2 said:
Quote:
sorry, read into the thread differently.

I agree that his circumstances might make coping hard especially when a life lesson learned early is that defiance is a weapon when circumstances seem complex and being accommodating is associated with weakness. I get that. Could all just be seen as a giant "respect" issue.

with all apologies to Dylan: "just when you have lost everything, you find out you can always lose a little more" may be in his case it looks like: "just when you have lost something they try to take a lot more"

I dunno. tough to get into ones 30's before being able to see things clearly and craft compromises that work to your benefit.

Take care


Thanks Bill
You too
RE: .  
mrvax : 9/5/2019 9:54 pm : link
In comment 14560157 arcarsenal said:
Quote:
At some point, he needs to own his bullshit and grow up. This isn't how a man in his 30's should be acting.

He's an asshole.

I didn't have a "wonderful upbringing" either. I have no relationship with my own father. I don't use that as an excuse to be a bad person or spit in the face of people who have faith in me or invest in me like he's doing here.

I'm always sympathetic to people who come from broken homes, have tough childhoods, don't have great guidance growing up, etc. It's not easy for everyone. I get it. But I'm not just going to entirely absolve someone and just give them carte blanche to be a fucking jackass in all facets of life.

Brown needs to grow up. He signed a contract. If he wasn't going to be able to hold up his end of it, he shouldn't have agreed to it. He doesn't deserve all of the excuse making.


Quite a few NFL WRs were/are known for being assholes. Quite a few.
RE: I did not have it easy growing up...  
mrvax : 9/5/2019 9:55 pm : link
In comment 14560250 .McL. said:
Quote:
And there was a time when days went by and I didn't have money for food. Nearly went homeless at 18.

Does that mean you guys are going to cut me some slack the next time I post about devaluing RBs?

No?

Didin't think so...


I think you have to start up all sorts of crazy shit first.
RE: well, Mr. Weaver, congrats  
weaverpsu : 9/5/2019 11:12 pm : link
In comment 14560054 Bill in UT said:
Quote:
You have, in the course of 2 days, stolen my title for dumbest post ever. I'll be sending the trophy along as soon as it gets here from Jimmy


87 replies. I disagree.
RE: I think the point is  
weaverpsu : 9/5/2019 11:18 pm : link
In comment 14560246 gidiefor said:
Quote:
that no matter what your circumstances are growing up -- you have a choice as to how you handle yourself and the choices that you make


There's a great YouTube video about how there's no such thing as free will. Interesting and worth a watch.
RE: RE: I think the point is  
PatersonPlank : 9/5/2019 11:24 pm : link
In comment 14560736 weaverpsu said:
Quote:
In comment 14560246 gidiefor said:


Quote:


that no matter what your circumstances are growing up -- you have a choice as to how you handle yourself and the choices that you make



There's a great YouTube video about how there's no such thing as free will. Interesting and worth a watch.


So in your philosophy, when do your own decision and responsibility come into play? Or is it always never your fault?

Also this is a superstar WR making $20M+ per year we are talking about. Its not some crack dealer on the corner who never had a chance. I get upset when guys like this, who are given all kinds of talent and opportunities, and used to reference people who "really" have had a hard go of it.
RE: RE: RE: I think the point is  
weaverpsu : 9/5/2019 11:29 pm : link
In comment 14560749 PatersonPlank said:
Quote:
In comment 14560736 weaverpsu said:


Quote:


In comment 14560246 gidiefor said:


Quote:


that no matter what your circumstances are growing up -- you have a choice as to how you handle yourself and the choices that you make



There's a great YouTube video about how there's no such thing as free will. Interesting and worth a watch.



So in your philosophy, when do your own decision and responsibility come into play? Or is it always never your fault?

Also this is a superstar WR making $20M+ per year we are talking about. Its not some crack dealer on the corner who never had a chance. I get upset when guys like this, who are given all kinds of talent and opportunities, and used to reference people who "really" have had a hard go of it.


My ex wife's brother was adopted. His mother was a crack addict and she was in and out of jail and he would bounce back between her as guardian and my ex's parents. He has been in and out of jail his entire adult life. His fault? Time to grow up? I'm not so sure and that's my point. It's not black and white like most things. I'm just asking people to give it some thought before saying AB is a total POS.
And since when does  
weaverpsu : 9/5/2019 11:31 pm : link
Money solve all problems?
Ever see the documentary on lottery winners?
I wonder what position Abraham Lincoln would have played  
fame56 : 9/5/2019 11:53 pm : link
had he been, say, a 3rd round pick of the NY Giants in a supplemental draft?
Yeah, his upbringing sucks for him.  
Knineteen : 9/6/2019 12:01 am : link
In exchange, God has given him the talent to earn millions of dollars.

Some would take this deal in heartbeat.
RE: RE: RE: Iím all for  
Knineteen : 9/6/2019 12:04 am : link
In comment 14560033 Les in TO said:
Quote:
could be a brain injury or CTE too. Either way his behaviour is bizarre and probably worthy of a proper professional exam

"professional exam", that's rich.
No "professional" is going to tell you what's wrong with him. Medical science has no way of diagnosing CTE in living individuals, let alone how to solve the problem. Even treating metal illness is more of an art than a science.
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